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Marketing Secrets 101 Interview with MaryEllen Tribby
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Interview with MaryEllen Tribby
MS. JOYCE BONE: Hello. This is Joyce Bone, and I’m excited to share with you all
today a conversation with MaryEllen Tribby who wrote Changing the Channel: 12
Easy Ways to Make Millions for Your Business. She co-authored it with Michael
Masterson, and she is a master marketer. So, I’d like to welcome MaryEllen to the
call today. Hello, how are you?
MS. MARYELLEN TRIBBY: Great. How are you doing, Joyce?
MS. BONE: I ’m doing wonderful. And I’m really excited to talk to you today because
marketing is one of my favorite subjects. And I think it ’s such a crit ical skill to
have when you’re trying to run a business. I ’m so glad that we got the best of the
best to be on our call. Thank you, MaryEllen. And we’re just going to jump right
into it if you don’t mind. And I’m going to have you explain to the listeners the
difference. What is marketing exactly? Can you explain that in laymen terms?
MS. TRIBBY: Sure can. It ’s really simple. Marketing essentially is the process that’s
associated with promoting the sale of goods or services in exchange for money.
But this is the thing. There are two different kinds of marketing or two main
different kinds of marketing. There’s a real big difference between direct response
and branding. And today hopefully what we’re really going to go into is direct
response marketing because that’s the form of marketing that’s designed to solicit
an immediate response. And that response is specific and it’s quantifiable. And
direct response marketing essentially is dollar out, dollar in. It ’s all about the
ROY, where branding is much more about the image bui lding, or the customer
remembers you next time they may need to buy a pair of sneakers. It ’s a much
broader reach. Direct response marketing has a much more targeted audience.
MS. BONE: Well, that is good to know. Because it seems like most of the time people
just talk in generalit ies. I ’m excited that we’re going to get into the nuts and bolts
of how to turn one dollar into two dollars. Because I think that’s what everybody
who is listening to this call is really all about. We’re trying to grow our businesses.
Trying to add revenue to the bottom line. And I know I recently read a survey from
E Women Network where they interviewed over 3,300 women, and that was their
number one priority was doing an extra great job at marketing and sales.
MS. TRIBBY: Right.
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MS. BONE: To the tune of almost 70 percent. That was their number one concern. This
is a topic that is definitely on top of everybody’s mind given the economy. You
talked about branding in marketing. But marketing and selling is often times
confused as well. Do you have any points on that?
MS. TRIBBY: I do. It ’s really funny because if you actually look up the definition of
selling, it would say virtually the same thing. It would say that it ’s the process
associated with promoting the sale or goods of a service in exchange for money.
But here’s what you need to know. Just think about it. Nobody likes to be sold to,
right? And everybody knows when they’re being sold to. However, everyone likes
to have an authentic conversation about their wants, their needs, their desires,
their problems and how to fix those problems, how to meet those needs, how to
meet those wants, and how to meet those desires. So, good marketing actually
eliminates the need to sell.
MS. BONE: That’s an interesting point, MaryEllen. Because it’s true. You kind of bow
up a litt le bit when you’re feeling like you’re being sold. But when you’re having a
conversation, I think that’s why referral marketing is such a strong tool because
you are having a conversation rather than feeling like somebody’s trying to shove
something down your throat.
MS. TRIBBY: Exactly.
MS. BONE: I ’m glad that you pointed that out. Let me ask you, what advice do you have
for people who aren’t a master marketer like you are? What’s a good way to build
your skills?
MS. TRIBBY: I mean, you really have to dig into it. First of all, you need to
acknowledge the fact that everyone—if you’re running this business and it’s pretty
much only you, then you have got to be a marketer. And everyone in your
organization has to be a marketer. They have to buy into what you’re doing.
Because if they do not, it is total sabotage. The best thing that anybody can do is
learn. Learn the craft of direct response marketing. Go out there, and start
reading al l the great books there are to read on the subject. Direct response
marketing has been around for 100 years. And there are books that were written
80 years ago, 60 years ago from the masters that are essential and still hold true
today. And it doesn’t matter if it ’s online or offline. Direct response marketing is
what you have to learn, and you can apply that anywhere you need to.
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MS. BONE: You think that somebody who doesn’t intuitively get how to market or feel
comfortable in that space can learn enough to be effective, or do you think that
people should outsource that and hire an expert?
MS. TRIBBY: Well, f irst of all even if you’re going to go and outsource, you still need to
understand the value and understand the concepts and what it takes to accomplish
those strategies. You still have to understand that. But it really depends on
where you are and what stage your business is in. New businesses today have a
huge advantage over 20 years ago. If you want to start a publishing company
online today compared to 20 years ago, you can do that. You don’t have to have
the expense of 20 years ago or the expertise or the time. You can go out there
today and test your ideas online for virtually nothing. First, before you go out and
hire anything, understand what your goals are. I mean, you really need to
understand what your goals are. Become semi-competent on it, and give it a try.
And as your business grows, go out and talk to people. Start masterminding with
people. This is the biggest key. And a lot of people don’t do that. They don’t
have a network of people they mastermind with or an accountability partner or
colleagues who they real ly talk about this with.
MS. BONE: I agree. It makes a huge difference to have somebody to bounce ideas off
of. One friend of mine, and she’s in the same field as what I’ve been doing for
quite awhile, and it’s so refreshing to be able to go to her and see the advances
that she’s making knowing that if I do A, B, and C it should work out this way. I
think that’s a good point that you make is to really just have conversations with
people that can help you grow. You talk about the Internet. What are some good
first steps that people can take if they want to test?
MS. TRIBBY: The first thing people really need to do is make sure they understand their
market. Do your competitive intelligence. Do you know what’s going on in the
market that you want to go into? Do you know if there is a demand for that
market? And today we’ve got such easy ways to do this. Go to Google. Go to
Yahoo, and do some keyword searches so you can see how many people are
actually searching for what you have to offer. And the sweet spot there is between
10,000 to 50,000 a month. If it ’s below 10,000 probably not a great market to be
in. If it ’s way over 50,000, well, it may be too saturated already. If it falls
somewhere in between 10,000 to 50,000 a month, that’s probably a good niche.
First of all, make sure the niche is viable. Secondly, then start looking at the
competitors, your competitors, and see what they’re doing. It ’s crazy. People
always want to go into and start reinventing the wheel. Reality, subscribe to one
of your competitors. Subscribe to them. Track everything they do, and then just
start testing off of that.
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MS. BONE: Good points. Is there a website where people can do a keyword search that
you’re aware of? I know there used to be like Overture.
MS. TRIBBY: Right, right. You can just go to Key Compete. You can go to Word
Tracker. Those are the two that come to the top of my head.
MS. BONE: I hadn’t heard of that one. Keycompete.com?
MS. TRIBBY: Yes.
MS. BONE: Learned something new. Love it. What are your top three marketing tips? I
read your book, and there is just so much valuable insight in there that we couldn’t
possibly absorb. It ’s like a book versus a movie. You’re always going to get so
much more out of the book. Are there three marketing tips that you have found
have been really, really helpful in growing your businesses?
MS. TRIBBY: Absolutely. The first thing is, and this is a rule and put this on your wall,
which is ABT. And that stands for always be testing. Every single time you do a
marketing campaign you don’t send one offer out the door or one copy out the
door or use one list. You’re always testing so that you can get data back in of
things that worked better. Never just send a campaign out in one form. At least
two an AB split, and when you test, you test one thing at a time. You don’t test
more than one variable. If you wanted to test price, for example, you’d have the
exact same sales letter. If you were going to go out to 100 people, 50 would get
one price, 50 would get another price. And then you can see the difference that
you have some data now so that when you roll out, which means going out to a
larger audience, you go out with the better responding price. That’s one. Then
while we’re talking about testing, you test things that scream, not whisper, and this
is huge. Let’s use price again as an example. If you’re testing a price point of
$49, you’re not going to test the price $49 versus $50. You’re going to test the
price point of $49 versus $79 and see what happens. You test things that scream,
not whisper. Just remember every time you test you want to get at least a 25 to 50
percent increase in response. So, if you test whispers, you’re never going to make
it. You’re going to test things that scream. And then the third you cut your losses
back. Numbers do not lie. And I say this to everybody. I say this to myself. I say
this when I speak is that you have to assume that you don’t know what the
answer’s going to be. Only the marketplace does. You’re going to test. When
you get your numbers in, you’re not going to make excuses about them and say,
“Well, maybe I sent this out to - - in the day.” The numbers are the numbers. If
there is a loss, you cut it back. Too many people hold onto those losses, and they
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keep going with it thinking they’re going to get a different result, and you don’t.
So, cut the losses back.
MS. BONE: Good to know. You mentioned timing. In marketing is there a better day of
the week to send out emails or marketing a direct mail piece? Is there any rhyme
or reason to that?
MS. TRIBBY: You know what, it ’s really funny. Because it really depends on your
industry and seasonality and what’s going on in the world. But in general from
email, there is no better time. Years ago we heard Sundays were the best day.
Then everybody started mailing on Sundays, and then Sundays were saturated.
You know what the most important thing is is that your customers are bonded with
you and looking forward to your emails. That’s the most important thing is the
content within the emails. And if you have a record of sending useful, actionable
emails, then your customer’s going to open them. It ’s not the day of the week.
We mail on holidays all the time, and people open them because they’re looking
forward to those emails - - involved within those emails. And direct mail is a litt le
different because there’s so many different formats and because there’s so many
different times of year. Christmastime, a holiday season your mail’s going to take
much longer to get to your prospect. That’s a litt le different. If during the year if
you’re going mail a number ten envelope, we always wanted to mail it on a Friday
because it would get there Monday or Tuesday. And we found that in the mail
people tend to open that mail Monday and Tuesday faster. But that, I think, is all
in the book too. There’s a lot. It really depends on your format there. But email,
just start testing. Just start getting it out, and then you wil l f ind it ’s the content
that matters not so much the day.
MS. BONE: I like that. Having a responsive list and then screaming and not whispering
in what you’re testing.
MS. TRIBBY: Yes, always.
MS. BONE: Interesting. And your book, Changing the Channel, is on my bookshelf all
the time so I can go refer to it.
MS. TRIBBY: Good.
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MS. BONE: As a resource. It ’s like one of those books from the library you’re not really
allowed to check out, but it ’s full of contents. A solopreneur when they’re focusing
on marketing you just kind of touched on it. Great copy is important. I personally
feel like it ’s what you said having emails that the people feel like they have a
relationship with you, and they want to see what you’re saying. They want to
open. At the same time there’s such a thing as great copy that we’ve all heard
about. Like make sure you have a certain headline that grabs attention. Do you
feel like that’s really important, or do you think it ’s important to establish joint
ventures with people where they will push your stuff on their list. What do you see
as being helpful in building your list?
MS. TRIBBY: The first thing that everyone needs to know is there’s three components
that make up any successful marketing campaign. To have a successful marketing
campaign is to get your desired your ROY or your desired number of subscribers
or customers in the door. You have to have three things. You have to have a list.
You have to have copy, and you have to have an offer. The list basically means
either your in-house list or the list you’re going out. The copy which is the
message you’re sending them. And then the offer that you’re making them. It ’s
really funny because a lot of people will always say, “Copy is the most important
thing,” which is not true at all. The list is the most important thing. So, the
audience that you’re going to is the most important thing. You could have great,
great copy best copy in the world. If you’re going to the wrong audience, it ’s
useless. Your list is the most important. After that it ’s actually the offer. And this
is why the thing about direct response marketing is so wonderful because two-
thirds of direct response marketing is scient if ic. Your list and your offer is all
scientif ic. There’s a wonderful book called Scientif ic Advertising by Claude
Hopkins. Everybody should read this book. First the list, then offer, then the
copy. The reason great copywriters are in such demand is because it’s more
creative. And the whole idea with copy is to come away with a big idea, and that
can make a huge difference in your campaign. But you can have mediocre copy
go to great list, and get a very good response. You could have great copy go into
the wrong list and get no response. Does that make sense, Joyce?
MS. BONE: Absolutely. It ’s kind of like don’t try to sell f ish to dog lovers.
MS. TRIBBY: Exactly.
MS. BONE: In the dog lover’s club, don’t try to sell them fish.
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MS. TRIBBY: Exactly. I always say birds of a feather flock together. We wil l talk a litt le
bit about joint ventures. When you go out there to make joint ventures, make it’s
sure the right joint venture. Again, you don’t want to waste that opportunity cost
and the person who is in this business. If you’re sel ling dog food, and I’m selling
exotic fish, then I’m not going to run your product to my list - - where it makes
sense.
MS. BONE: With joint ventures when you approach somebody that let’s say you’re in the
dog lovers club and they’re sel ling dog bowls that would make a good fit together,
how is the best way to approach someone if you’ve never done that before?
MS. TRIBBY: The first thing that you have to remember is that the only thing about a
joint venture that has to be consistent and constant is that it ’s a win-win for both
parties. You could have a very win-win situation with somebody with no list and a
product versus somebody with a huge list and all products as well. As long as you
go into this with a win-win attitude for both parties as well as striving for a long
term relationship. I don’t want to do joint ventures. I don’t want to do onesies with
anybody. I want to strive for long term relat ionships every single time I do this.
So, make sure that you’re going into this with a win-win. Are we going to talk with
the scenario that you have no list, but you have a product. What did I just say?
The most important thing for you to do is build your list. You may go to this other
person that has a wonderful list and say, “I’ve got this product, and I’d like to run it
through your list, and I don’t have a list.” You need to be really upfront right away
and say but you take 80 to 100 percent of the revenue. For me, I want to build my
list and collect names. If you’re will ing to do that right off the bat, that’s going to
open a lot of doors.
Say they have an e-letter, and you are very competent about their subject. Well,
offer to write contents for their e-letter. Then you could say, “How about if I write
content.” And I go to your list and now maybe you’ll keep 25 percent of your
revenue but still give them 75 percent. What you’re working for is a lifetime value
of that name. Once you get that name in, then you can go to that name yourself
and keep 100 percent of the money. Too many people think they should get 50
percent of the revenue when they really don’t have anything else to offer. Always
give more than you get. Think of that going out there. If you’re starting out you
need to give more than you get. And the other thing you really need to do is if
you’re going to that list, you need to sell them on why. Why do they want to send
your product to their list. Their list is their most valuable asset. Make sure you
understand the benefits of your product. Why is your dog food better than anyone
else’s dog food? Make sure you have testimonials that you can back this up.
Somebody who said, “My dog was sick until they started eating this, and now he’s
thriving.” Really understand the benefits of your products, and be ready to go
there and tell that to somebody. Also if you have any results, if you’ve mailed this
copy because you’re going to be bringing your copy with you. If you’ve mailed the
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copy before to someone else’s list, go with the results of that and say, “This other
list, their subscribers loved it.” It did this, this, and this is because they want to
make money. It ’s an opportunity cost for them to let you go to their list because
they want to make money. Make sure you are equipped with all that information
before you even make the phone call or send the e-mail.
MS. BONE: Good points. I think those percentages are probably going to shock people.
I thought 50/50 was going to be awesome.
MS. TRIBBY: No. I mean, if I ’ve got a list of 500,000 and you’ve got a list of 500,000,
sure we can do a 50/50 split because we’re both marketing the same thing. Again,
it has to win. What is the benefit to me? If you do not have a list for you to get 50
percent of the revenue plus the name, and I’m getting just 50 percent of the
revenue plus I’ve lost an opportunity cost for my list. You really have to think it
through. Why would I do that?
MS. BONE: Because you’re a nice guy.
MS. TRIBBY: Well, you are. And as you get into a business you will make friends and
partners and people who know you. But in the beginning you’ve got to out there,
and you’ve got to say, “I’m going to give you whatever you want because I know
the value of building my list.”
MS. BONE: I ’ve always heard the gold is in the list.
MS. TRIBBY: Absolutely. I tell this story often. It ’s the story of two jewelers in New
York City side-by-side in the diamond distric t. And one night one jeweler always
put his diamonds in the safe. Jeweler B always put his Rolodex in the safe. One
night they’re both robbed. They come in the next day, and jeweler A has his
diamonds, but he doesn’t have any of his customers. Jeweler B doesn’t have his
diamonds, but he’s got his customers. And guess what? His insurance money
pays for all the diamonds he lost. So, he’s got a business. Jeweler A has lost his
business because his customer list is gone.
MS. BONE: Good point. You have to hear that about self-made millionaires, “Well, you
could take away all my money, and within a year I’ll be back on top.” Because
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they have the knowledge and the list of things it takes to be successful in their
mind.
MS. TRIBBY: And that’s when we were talk ing earlier about what people need to do.
They need to learn this. You need to invest in yourself every single day. Every
single day after doing marketing for 25 years. I ’ve been doing this for 25 years. I
read a marketing or a business book every single day. So, I’ll go through one to
two books a week, but there’s not a single day that goes by that I don’t read
something about marketing and/or business.
MS. BONE: That’s right. You’ve got to keep your saw sharpened.
MS. TRIBBY: You invest in yourself.
MS. BONE: And I do believe you have to give to get. It may sound kind of counter-
intuitive, but it truly is just one of those fundamental things that you have to do.
That means you’re reaching out helping as many people as you can.
MS. TRIBBY: That’s right. I mean, business to me is karma. Everything that goes
around comes around. And you’ll also find whatever niche you’re in it ’s a very
incestuous niche. Everybody knows everybody. You don’t want to be known as
the jerk who tries to get every litt le penny from someone else. You want to be
known as a giver because people are going to want to work with you.
MS. BONE: That’s the truth. Do you typically put a JV relationship in writing, or how do
you handle that end of it?
MS. TRIBBY: I don’t do contracts because what I do is I will. I ’ll outline the deal in
email, say these are the terms. It ’s a - - , but it ’s professional. It ’s concise. The
reason I don’t like to spend time on contacts with these things is because if you
say the word contract, and it usually means lawyers. And lawyers usually means
time and money, and it takes longer to get it done. Literal ly I have done JV deals
where it just worked that we both had a slot. Like in two days from now. If you
were doing contracts you’d still be tied up in legally.
MS. BONE: Yes, real ly.
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MS. TRIBBY: Just put it in email. Like I said, it ’s a very incestuous business, your
niches. You screw over somebody once and probably you’re not going to be in
business for a long time.
MS. BONE: That’s right. Word will get out.
MS. TRIBBY: Absolutely.
MS. BONE: We talked about doing some kind of due diligence. Do some research in
your field. Do you have any other suggestions on how to grow a business
especial ly if you are on a really tight budget?
MS. TRIBBY: Oh, gosh, sure, of course. I mean, if you’re on a really tight budget what
you need to do is you need to put together your marketing plan and your timeline.
A lot of people just have an idea and they through it out there. Like I said, it ’s
good to get your ideas out there quick because you can test them so quickly. But
put together your marketing plan. Put together a timeline. Include assumptions in
there. You’re spending X amount of dollars. What does this need to yield you?
And so you start. You go through your plan. You put out your campaign, and then
you adjust as you go along. Like I said before, people don’t cut their losses. They
think because they put together a marketing plan they have to see it through
fruition. You don’t. It ’s evolving. It ’s a living, breathing thing. It evolves. It
constantly changes. Your plan is there as a guidel ine. So, put together marketing
plan, timeline, assumptions, and then adjust as you go along.
MS. BONE: It ’s that old airplane story that you always hear about how the airplane’s off
track 90 percent of the time. But at the last ten percent they come in.
MS. TRIBBY: Right.
MS. BONE: And that’s the important ten percent. The rest of the time is just feedback.
MS. TRIBBY: Right.
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MS. BONE: That’s great. Are you a bigger believer in organic growth, or do you believe
in doing the pay per click growth on the Internet?
MS. TRIBBY: I think they’re both great ways to build your list. What’s going to happen
with organic, generally it ’s going to take longer, but your names will probably be
more valuable in the end. However, you can get started so quickly, and you can
test constantly, and you can adjust constantly. And you can build a list very
quickly. So, what I’ve generally done in the past is I’ve always done. I’ve never
used one or the other. A couple years ago I built a list from zero to 200,000 in 15
months. That yielded 13 million dollars in 15 months. Probably 60 percent of
those names were formed from PPC. But it ’s really important. People think that if
you just get a name in the door again that you’re done. But you’ve got to follow
through with PPC. You’ve got to understand not just how much that name costs
you to get in the door. What is your break even point? At what point do you make
up the money that you’ve spent to get that name in the door? And at what point
does it start yielding you profit? Generally with a PPC name you want to make
sure you have a break even point within 90 days. If you’re spending a $1.80 or
$1.95 to get the name, 90 days later that name better be worth to you that amount
of money. And then right after that they’ve got to be profitable. You have to keep
an eye on it. But PPC campaigns are great because you can start them right
away. We touch upon PPC in Changing the Channel. But a great book again,
Howie Jacobson’s book, AdWords for Dummies. Great, great book. Highly
recommend it.
MS. BONE: I don’t have that one.
MS. TRIBBY: It ’s great.
MS. BONE: I ’ll have to check that one out for sure.
MS. TRIBBY: And then, of course, Perry Marshall too on both subjects there. Perry
Marshall is a wonderful person to follow.
MS. BONE: I ’m writing all this down. I don’t want to lose any of it. You talked about 12
marketing channels. Do you want to touch briefly on what those are?
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MS. TRIBBY: Sure, let’s do that. Because it’s really fun. The first one that I talk about
is direct response online marketing. So, direct response e-marketing or online
marketing which includes things like dedicated emails either to your list or to a
rented list or to a swap. It also includes things like banner ads or polls or
sponsorships. I ’m going to go through these kind of quickly because there’s 12 of
them. The next one, of course, is social media. And a lot of times people think of
social media as only Facebook or Twitter which, of course, it is. But don’t forget
about things like blogs and videos when you’re using social media and how
effective they are. The next one is SEM or search engine marketing which, of
course, includes PPC campaigns, organic search. Also things like RSS feeds.
Channel number four is the telephone, inbound/outbound. Wonderful channel of
marketing. Teleconferences, of course, what we’re doing right now. A great way
to bond with your clients, bond with your customers, your subscribers. Give them
extreme value. And it’s a wonderful thing to do because you can do it anywhere.
That’s one of my reasons I love teleconferences. You can reach so many people
and do it anywhere. Direct mail, one of my very, very, very favorite channels in
marketing because I’ve been doing this the longest. And I really do believe that
when people understand direct mail, they can do any channel of business
because, of course, direct response marketing all the factors go in there. And
then things like direct print which includes space ads in magazines, newspapers,
catalogues. Number eight is direct response TV. With that you’ve got short
commercials, you’ve got longer commercials, you’ve got infomercials. And you
even have shows like Home Shopping Network and QVC. We’ve got direct
response radio. With the websites today it’s even better because people can
remember web addresses. Radio is even stronger today. A lot of people think
radio is dead. But it ’s funny. Radio is really the one thing that you can never
escape. You could say, “I’m not going to work today. I’m going to the beach.”
But somebody may have a radio there. Or, “I’m going hiking.” Somebody may
have a radio.
MS. BONE: That’s true.
MS. TRIBBY: You can leave your computer at home. You can leave your TV at home.
You can leave all your mail at home. But somebody’s always got a radio
somewhere. It ’s a great source of marketing still. Joint ventures that we talked
about, and one we haven’t talked about yet which is event marketing which I love.
There’s all different kinds of events to do. And, of course, public relations. That’s
the 12 that we cover in the book, and each chapter really goes into detai l on each
one of these.
MS. BONE: And you feel like direct mail is the basis of everything else?
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MS. TRIBBY: Everything.
MS. BONE: You can really become an expert at direct mail. I have done direct mail
before. Not always for myself but in my overall scope of a career have done it. I
know what goes into that. Maybe that might be a good place for people to start so
they don’t feel so overwhelmed. Because there are 12 marketing channels. Do
you have any advice on how to pick the focus for your business?
MS. TRIBBY: Sure.
MS. BONE: And how not to get overwhelmed.
MS. TRIBBY: First, we’ll talk a litt le bit about direct mail. Because the reason that
people who have done direct mail are such great online marketers is because
when you mail to customers, it ’s expensive. It costs you a lot of money. If you
have a list of 100,000 people, and you want to send them your newsletter, it ’s
going to cost you 57 cents. If you want to sell them your product, it ’s going to cost
you 60 cents. Multiply that times your 100,000. That’s why people who have done
direct mail, and these are the people you really need to learn from, are so good
online because they don’t cut corners. They make sure their copy is good. They
make sure they know who their audience is. They make
sure - - that offer. It ’s not somewhere you want to start because it is much more
expensive. Where do you want to start? You want to start with things that are
fast, easy, and cheap. That’s why the Internet is so wonderful. And I call that
kind of starting with your low hanging fruit. That’s why the Internet is so great
because it’s going to virtually cost you nothing to go out there and cast your idea.
Once you’ve done your research it’s not going to cost you anything to start writing
copy. With copy it’s much better to start testing writing copy online than paying 60
cents apiece to talk to 1,000 or 10,000 or 100,000 people. Do everything online
first and take it into another channel. And add those channels incrementally.
MS. BONE: I was going to ask you if you had $1,000 to spend how would you spend it?
I think you kind of just answered that.
MS. TRIBBY: Right.
MS. BONE: I think you’d be on the Internet.
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MS. TRIBBY: Absolutely. If I had $1,000 to spend I would real ly start with a PPC
campaign. I would spend it on PPC. I would spend it on three great, great books,
and I would spend it on having my copy looked at by an expert copywriter. You’re
not having somebody write your copy. It ’s only going to cost you a couple hundred
bucks for somebody to look at that copy. A lot of expert copywriters won’t even
charge you. Get a book on copywriting and the anatomy because that’s a formula.
Again, it ’s a formula. Get a book on the anatomy of copywriting. Get a book on
lists. Get a book on direct response marketing. Spend your money learning those
things. Then spend your money on PPC campaigns testing your idea. And then
everything else will f low from there.
MS. BONE: Good point. You just mentioned direct response marketing. There’s
another acronym, MCM, that are the two most important acronyms in advertising
today. Can you explain what that is to the listeners in case they’ve never heard
that term before?
MS. TRIBBY: Sure. MCM is multi-channel marketing which just means that you were
talking to your customers in different ways. And the beauty about multi-channel
marketing or talking through different channels is that you’re talking to customers
the way they want to be talked to. In the old days it was all about the advertiser.
Today it’s all about the customer. You’re communicating with them how they like
to be communicated with. And also the other thing about multi-channel marketing
is that you’ve got to be consistent, and you’ve got to be repetitive. And people in
direct response marketing people need to see something three and a half t imes
before they buy it. In the old days you - - sent a direct mail piece three times
before they bought it. Today you might hear an advertisement on the radio. You
might see a TV commercial. Then you might get that same piece online. And
you’ll respond online. But you’ve seen it in all these different channels. So, the
compound effect has made it so much better. Your response rates are so much
better. Because what I said before is there’s three main components. Your list,
your copy, and your offer. You’ve already done the hard work. You’ve already
cracked your message, your copy. You already identified who is your target
audience. You’ve already crafted that offer. So, all you’re doing now is kind of
slicing and dicing. If you have a long email that you’ve sent out, now that email
can go into a PPC campaign. You’re going to pull out your best 140 characters
into a PPC campaign. You’re going to pul l out the best headline for an envelope.
If you’re going to go in the mail for your number ten. You really only do the actual
creative work once. And you just put it into other channels. It ’s a wonderful thing
for people to do. People leave so much money on the table by only marketing
through one channel.
MS. BONE: I mean, you’ve already done the work. Why not slice and dice like you said
and know how to plug it into different areas.
15
MS. TRIBBY: Absolutely. I mean, I’ve done campaigns where we’ve written the copy.
And I’ve used that same copy in an e-mail. I ’ve used the same copy in a direct
mail campaign. And I’ve used the same copy calling people on the phone. I’ve
used all the same benefits.
MS. BONE: Well, it makes sense. And there are so many different approaches that you
can deploy this on.
MS. TRIBBY: You can put out your banner ads. You’ve got the work done. Leverage
the work that you’ve done. It ’s all about the leverage.
MS. BONE: And then in the book you talk about letting your brand develop while you
make money. That’s kind of playing into that, don’t you think?
MS. TRIBBY: And it’s funny because I’m not about branding. That’s not what I’m about.
So many people make the mistake I’m starting a business. Let me get my
business cards done. Wrong, wrong, wrong. Spend all your time and effort writing
that sales letter and bringing in a dollar, right?
MS. BONE: Right.
MS. TRIBBY: Constantly good content going out the door. Your brand develops. You
get known for what you do. That’s how your brand develops. Not by designing a
logo. Your logo is not your brand.
MS. BONE: I hear you. It ’s all about selling and making the cash register ring. I know
I’ve had businesses where I didn’t even consider myself in business until after I
had a contract.
MS. TRIBBY: Absolutely. You don’t have anything until you’ve made that first sale. You
are not in business, as a matter of fact.
MS. BONE: People get caught up in I have to set my office up. I need to get a printer.
16
MS. TRIBBY: Yes.
MS. BONE: They’re just hiding behind busy work. And as all business people know to
be successful, you have to do the important work first.
MS. TRIBBY: That’s - - .
MS. BONE: And getting customers in the door so that you have money to do all the
other stuff.
MS. TRIBBY: Absolutely.
MS. BONE: Just a couple more questions. Telemarketing. Do you have a whole lot of
experience with hir ing people to telemarket for you? What do you think about
that? That is like one area I’ve never really kind of dove into. It ’s just seems like
curiosity to me.
MS. TRIBBY: I have. And telemarketing is a wonderful, wonderful channel. Whether it ’s
inbound or outbound. There’s so many reasons to do telemarketing whether it ’s a
bonding tool. To call somebody up and say, “Thank you for your order.” Or,
“Welcome, welcome to our new club or membership.” It ’s also great for high
priced items. And it’s great for when people have questions. You know, I worked
for PBS very early in my career in New York City. And every year when we did our
huge fund raising campaign I would go out to our vendors, to our telemarketing
centers out in actually Salt Lake City. I ’d fly from New York City out to Salt Lake
and spend two weeks out there with real ly training them on what PDS was about.
What this fundraising campaign meant to the organization. What it meant to public
television. The one thing about telemarketing is is it ’s such an easy thing to
outsource. Right?
MS. BONE: Right.
MS. TRIBBY: You’re starting your business. This is not something you’re going to out
and hire five telemarketers. You don’t if you’re going to have a business. So, it ’s
such an easy thing to outsource, and there’s so many people who do it well.
Again, in the book we really talk about how you outsource this. What your
17
concerns need to be. The questions to ask and how you set up those campaigns.
You’re still in charge, but you’re outsourcing it. And nobody wants to hear your
husband walking in in the middle of the call. Outsource says be professional
about it. At Early to Rise I brought everybody in-house because it was more
effective for me at that point, more cost effective. We knew our products better,
etc., etc., that’s fine. But in the beginning I outsourced telemarketing most of my
career.
MS. BONE: That’s definitely something that I’m going to read more on. Thank you so
much for a part of our call today. You were just such a wealth of information. And
seriously, everybody has to go out and get this book, Changing the Channel, by
MaryEllen Tribby and Michael Masterson because it is just like a litt le marketing
bible for you to follow. And I know I got so much out of reading it. And I refer to it
constantly. But I also want to talk to MaryEllen’s new venture,
workingmomsonly.com. It ’s a site that I think everybody should check out. Do you
want to talk a litt le bit about it, MaryEllen?
MS. TRIBBY: Sure. It ’s called workingmomsonly.com, and it really is for the
empowerment of the working mother so that the working mother can lead a
healthier, a wealthier, more balanced blended lifestyle. So, anyone who fits into
that category or I’m sure most of you at least know people, send them over
because it is probably the best working mom site there is.
MS. BONE: It think this is a good point that you and I are in the same type of field
together, and that we’re working together with our marketing. We are living,
breathing examples of what can happen when motivated, interested, dynamic
people come together to help other people grow. Because both of our business
models are about helping other women grow. I hope that just by listening to the
two of us that everybody has gotten something to take away and realize that the
power is giving to get and that marketing is something that ever single person can
learn about even if it doesn’t come naturally. I know a lot of people don’t really
like to do numbers. And, of course, marketing a lot of it ’s about tracking. But I
think that if you just give it some time and a litt le bit of effort and you see those
numbers going up, all of the sudden you will like tracking the numbers. Right,
MaryEllen?
MS. TRIBBY: Absolutely. The response that you’ve been assuming and beating the
response you’ve been assuming, there’s just not a better feeling.
18
MS. BONE: Absolutely. I ’m going to sign off by mentioning your book tit le again,
Changing the Channel, MaryEllen Tribby. I ’m going to let everybody know they
can get my book at joycebonebook.com which is to help entrepreneurial women as
well. And visit our websites at workingmomsonly.com and mill ionairemoms.com.
A thank you all for being a part of our call today, and we wish you the best of luck.
Good-bye.
MS. TRIBBY: Bye-bye.
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