Queensland

Parliamentary Debates [Hansard]

Legislative Assembly

FRIDAY, 16 SEPTEMBER 1921

Electronic reproduction of original hardcopy

Supply. [lG SEP'J'E~IBI·:R.] 771

1-l'rnn.\. Y, 16 SEPTJDJBER, 1921.

The Srr.u::t~:t {Ilm1. \Y. Bt:rtrain, 111aree) took tlH: dwir at b;df-pa~t 3 o'cluck p.rn.

QCESTIO:\'S. E~J.\L\ OIL BORE.

}lr. TA -YLOH. {li'indsr;r) asked ihe I-Ion1o Secretur:y, \or the bccn:·tary for 1-Jines-

" 1. \Yhat anwunt of 1nouc has been splHt ou the Hon1a oil bore fOr the _years ending 3Gth .j u11e, 1915-1916, 1916-1917, 1917-1818, lS18-1919. 1919-1920, 1920-1921, 1·'-- -rn:c:ti Yely ·:

"2 . ..c\.rc opcr_tLions at tltu l{orna oil bore ~ti U be lEg co11tinu2.l '?

.~ 3. Cinplo2- ...:•:s ai'.J at prc-scllt '' ~ t l{oma oil bore?''

The HO~.JE SECHETAI~ Y (Hon. W. :.IcGori.ruck, Cuirn;J) replied-

" 1. 191:J-19l6, £13,671 19s. 1Ud.; 1916-191'7, £6.172 u•. 8ci. : 191 i-19li3. £tl,l01 13s. 5cl. 1918-1919, £3,602 2s. lcl.; J 919-18C:d. h. 10d. ; l82J-l821, £3,694 Cl.s. Del .

.. 2. )_' "3. 0ix.~'

I{ IL\\.\.Y COKS'JH1TT10K ~IX~£ leT J CLY, 1815.

(\ 1. been since

ask:ecl the Secretary for

1nilc;; of rnii-way havo hi' department

is the smn expended in the con~trnction of that n1ileagc ?"

The SECRETARY FOB RAIL\YAYS (Hon. J. Lan:ornbe, f{cppcl) replied-

" 1. This infornwtion is contained in Table 17 of the Commisisoner's annual report for the yca,r ended 30th June, 1920.

" 2. The cost of the construction of the

772 Question8. [ASSEMBLY.]

lines menti<med in :\ o. 1 is contained in Talllc 7 of the same report. Additional information for 1920-1921 will be con­rained lu the Con11ni:-:sioner's annual report.''

ALTEPHIO:;s JX RAILWAY FREIGHTS OX AGRICCLTCRAL PRODLCE.

Mr. WAHREN (Jlurrumba). in the absence of Mr. ::Vlorg-an (Jiurillu), asked the Secre· tarv for RaihYa\ ,,_

• " '\Yil! he. inform the Honse in w.hat direction frci O:.:·'hL3-" To Portsn and "Up Conntry"-on- agricultural produce, flour, aml butter, now operating-. differ from the rttcs opctating- in 1920?"

The SECRET.JRY FOE RAILWAYS repllcd-·

:-)nnl!cr quatltlties tbun trucklotH1..; sent to ports (or \YallangalTa) haYe been redncc{l frorn 'A' cla~J to 'J\!1' class, plus 20 per cent. l\1ixed consignn1ents of Jlrodncc (not including buttcr)-i.e., dif­ferent kinds of produce from one con~ signor-arc 110\Y allo\Yecl to be loaded in on~:._• truck to get the lJeucfit of tho 'tnu~k~

which is lmwr than charging of lH'odnce separately."

Bl'TTEH F.\CTORL'.s' APPLTC'.T'lo~-s Fon ExE1tPnoxs rx n• 0\'ER-m-x.

:\lr. \\'ARREX, in the absence of .Jlr. Mor~nll, a•kecl the Secretary fat Agricul­ture-

" 1. \Ylmt lluttcr factories, if any, applied for exernption £rolL' clause 16, Dairy Produce Act, wl1ich provide·; for pn.y.rue11t of the over-run in n1nnufacture?

" 2. On wbat grounds was cxo11ption aplJ]icd for'?

.. 3. \Y Ll'e any cxe1nption.3 grantca? " 4. Is it intcJHled to grant fllrther

pxernptions to con1pauie;:; that 1nay apply'?"

The SECRETARY FOB. AGlUC:UL'lTRE (Hon. \\'. X. Ui!lies, Euclwm) replied-

" 1 to 3. Xo snch applic·1tion iJaYo lwPn rccciYcd.

"4. :\o; tho hon. member will, if he re ,c]:, the Act, see that clause 16 rs i1lll1C'l'UtiYl'.~'

ST,\TE ARSEXIC :\In-:E. Mr. EDWAHDS (,Yu,u<!lyo) asked the

:Minister repruenting the Secretary for Mines-

" 1. How n~an:.~ men have been dis­nli~scd fron1 the State arsenic rniuc since 3Jlh J uiy, 1921 ?

" 2. Is it the GoYcrnrucnt's intention to dose the 1nine?

" 3. \Yhat quantity of arsenic is now a vailn ble for the purpose of clearing· priddy-pcrrr?

" L~. IIavc all orders for arsenic re~ quircd for thr pul'llOSO of poi:~oning p;·ickly-pcar bcc·n fulfilled; if not, how nl:"lly lu1ve not?"

The HOME SECHETAH.Y replied-­'· 1. 35. "2. ?\o. "3. ,\11 that in stock-approximately

90 tons. '' 4. All orders for arsenic for poison­

ing prickly-pear ha\'O been or are being fulfilled."

GovEHX1IE:;T SILE OF Bl LLOCKS u ExooGERA !·:L\LEY,\H D~.

Mr. KEHH. (Enoyrt< ru) asked the :\Iinister m Charge of Stat.•c Enterprises-

" 1. Ho,v n1any bullocks, if any, were offr-rccl for sale at the Enoggcra sale­Yard:-; ou \Y 0dnesda y, 14rh iustant~ on behalf of the Gon,rnrncnt?

" 2. \Vhat profit or loss \Ya• made on the tran-' nction?

" 3. \V ere th0 bnllocks. frmn State stations, or othC'nYi;-;c, purchased; and if the lattor, \dwn \Y~1·e they purcha~cd ?"

Ho~. W. FOHGAX SMITH (Jiackuy) re­plied-

" 1. 2. ami Tl1is f1Ucstion has not be '11 a, ked in [Jnllbc irJtc•rcot, and I do not propc'c to anc-:''"1' it. It ha'3 rcfert'llf'e to one an1o1J@:'st thousands of transactions llH1t take place fl.llllll<tlly in such a larg(~ lrnc.iHe'- a~ the State butchery, ancl as such will be SlllJjc,ct to n?vim-,· by t.he £\uditor~Gcneral. 1Yho pre­sents n. rCport on State entt~qlri:--es to this Jiouse OYl'l',Y year."

S,\Lr.s oF CATTLE FHOJI ST.\.TE ST:~nox:=::.

J\Ir. FL1~TCHEH (l'ort ('urti.'") askod the ~Iinistcr in Ch.-.rgc of State Enterprises-

" Re the 14.867 cattle. for YYhich a sale note YI,J pt~t through i ho books in :\'ovemkr la·t, to takt' cfiect as at the [Jrrviom 30th ,Junc-

1. How nw11y of the,;;•') cattl(~ \YCre­u--cd ill the Sta'tc bntrhl'r :--hopR?

2. IIosv JYlan: \YCrc sold, aud to whom, aud at ·what price?

3. \Yhat elate did the cattle lcaYe the stntions. and \Vhich stations?

4. How manv nf the-e cattlP still n~Inttin on th~' ~trrtions. a11d \Yhich stations':~'

Hox. W. FORGe\:\ S"'IITH rc'plied-" 1 to 4. I tlo not consider it advisable

in the public interest to supply this information. Details of our activities arc contained in the reports of the Auditor-Geucrd and Trade Commis­sioner. I would also n dviso the hon. member not to lo\\·er the dignity of Parliament by asking· qncstions obviol~sly jn::~pired h·orn oubidc sonrccs."

p UP('!L\SES OF FHOZEX BEEF.

Mr. FLE'l'CHER asketl the ::\Tinistcr in charge of State enterprises-

" 1. IIo'w manv ton~ of frozen beef haYe becu pure:h-~sed sincn 1st January last?

"2. \Vhat qnaJJtit:, of such beef, if an~;;, is si ill in (old ."torn g. '?

'; 3. \Yhat ,·:as d10 origiua1 cf,·"t per lb.?

·' 4. \Vhat has the st·1rag·o per lb, ::unount{'d to) if ~1ny. to date?

"5. \Yhat is the difference bet· ern the total eo t p r lb. to date of such frozen bed. if anv. and the price to-clay of fresh hr:d pi't' lb.-~··

Ilox. W. FORGAN S:\IITH rcplicd-''1. to 5. This question has not been

asked in the public iutere>t. but, is desigucd to embarrass the nu1nage1nent of State cnh'rprise;:, b~: conveying infor­n1ation to their con1petitors in business. The hon. member should realise that State enterprise is a busine,; jllst th&

[16 SEr:rE~IBEI:.] Pri''ilue. 773

ns nn,Y trading bllsincss, and, as th0rc i"' 110 goocl rcn~,on why th~._~

of it,, hLisine,S,, ehould be divulge<l 1Jy 1lH'1HlS of quc:-.tion~ through this I-Iou"~,

hif'h th~ JnoJnbcr, of tho Opposition arc c-ontinuall,\~ c11dC'L~Yourjng· to do for no other pm·rDc0 than the detriment and jnjury of Stnte cn~~rpri~{~~. The \\·hole of the tronsactions of the State 'l'ra.dc Department are subject to revic.Y Ly the Auditor-General. 1 might acltl that MaY in hi., 'Parliamcnt<:r;· Practi~:c' lav~s down tbat a :\llnistP~' rnay refu2c to an~wcr ~~- qth ~-tion which in· hi~ 011inion i' not asked in the p.:blie interc•t."

(Opp<"ition lauzhtc•r.)

Hox. \Y. II. B.\RNES: ::\h ,·orcl. what :.a Jot ~-ou ha1 P to (·on•r up. ~

RELIEf' H.\TlOXS.

Mt·. T. H. ROBERTS (Eu,,·! Too; onJdUtt) a::::ked the II OP1P Sc,_'l'<::t J n:-

" \Yill lw lay on the table of this IIousc, {lnd c1bo furni;.;h to ( ach n10111bt:r, a cop:v of ilw form that i' fillet! in Ly eaeh applicant for roliuf ration:-<, also particn­]nl'." <!..., to the vahw of the weeklY ration aJ!o\\ ~lllC(' pc1· ad1dt H1Hl child ~~nd par­ticular" of articles allovYablo l:tnclcr such rl.'l i('f sen !l' ':'·

The Tl 0:\H: SECRET_ \RY replied-

'· Ye'; I l11y the paper-, on th<• table.''

"' HET1U.:~;r·H-, EST OF Et.ri'fOYEF 1 .\T ~\IEXT.\L

I fosFITALS.

:1-lr. T. R. nomm.Ts as keel th · Home Sccretnry-

'·1. \fr.!.., it on tl10 n·cornn1cndation of tlw it•~pc•ctor of asvlmn~ that the recent dcflntion or di~·wi:-:~al of attc,nda.nts and :r~nr· llJPutal ho~pitals, Goodna and T<HnYonJn1Jl' "-tl n1 acle '?

'· 2. If not. will he. in the iutrn ·t·- c junwtcs nnd staff. obhtin a 1·c:Jort f~nth­\\ itb £ron1 the in~per-::or of w vlun1s as to adpr~n ·.t 0 stnfiin,e: of thPsc• in~~'titution-. nucl tl;u;:; allay tho ff'(·Jjng of in~ccurity an~ong·:.:t th(' staff a .. to their p0rsonal "fc·t:· ..

ThP llO::\fE SEC:RET.\RY repcicd-

'·1. and 2. Tlw nwttor "·ill be· cliecu"ed nn th EstinHttr·~."

l'HIY ILEC 1~.

The TTO:\IE SEC'RE1'.\HY (!Ton. IY. 11cConnn('k ('-lii'l!s): T ri;;:;p to a qnr·stion of ,. ll"iYilrgr!.n 1 dr:~ire t) refer to the rri "' :·r·port.:: of the ]H'OCf•eriing..:; Parlia-lllent. wllicl! I conf'idr'r l:aYt' 11<1t nccu-J.ail'.

GOYEIC\)lF~~T ~Tt:~mrms: IIearJ h(•ar!

The HO:\IE SECHE'LIRY: Occasion is taken b57 Prc..::s roportPr .... to in ,l'rf interjec­tions <Jnd ~h1tcn1C'JJ!S t1w_t IY<'l'l' nPvcr n1~1ele in thi~ If uu~c.

GOYE!G}!l'ST ::\IE\lBEP.S: Hear. h2ar!

The I!O::\IE SECRE'L\RY: YesterdaY the paper.;;; rL'ported a f}ll("'"·tlnn tlw.t a~ adch:cs-ed

1o the Sr>c-rc•taJ'v for Vublic \"\Tork~ <1:-- having bPPtt nddrc.:.~C'cl.to mL'. In rho ordinar:· conrs~ of C'Yrnts I can quite undt'l'~tnnd that a mis­btk<' like that might happen; but. wlwn you t~.kc thr C]Ur><;;tion addr~~;:o:Pcl lJ:· the Lon. n18m­bcr for Burnutt tlw previous (1ay to n1y~elf and ~aY that I gnYC' an answer to both those (jllf:_>~:tio.lls. it i:'i -uoth1ug but prot!D?"rtncin.

CoY~RX~IEXT ::\IE:\IBERS: Hear, hear\

::\Ir. "\-.-OWLES: You 8.11"'1Y"l'r:l one of the que :·1ions.

The 110:\J.F: SECRETXHY: Both n·plieg alJPC'ar in the papers a~ if the·.\- camr' fro1n 1110. Yr{ kHo\\- that thr~ Pru-"~ l't'p01'tt'rf, haYe accrss to the bu..,iues --pap0r th<: IIDuse, aucl the .: proof'' copy of tlH:> nlain\y ~rts out to w1Hnn thL' qnc,tion::: nro ;ddn'~'rcl.

::\Ir. Yo• ·us: Yott n•J•liul to one· of thPm.

The 1-TO~.JE REC'RE'l'ARY: The r~rlies an• giYfin in the Prt's::. wv; if l .""\1!:'-i\n•r~..'d both que tioll:., ·

The THL\srnrn: ThPy 1n; t'po,·; ;1 t1te lT·nlt of the diYi:-)ion the 1:ighi Lc,fnr.: last.

Tb0 HOc,n: SECHETARY: Oll Wednc,day the ho11. Jllcmber for Bur110tt addr' ;;:;;;;{ .. cl a qU('~tion to nlC' in 11hich lh' _asked if _local ::nlthoritit's' dDn<Jt.iou,..: to bos1Ht.al:o:. carnGd a :-uh;;.i(h· hv the Govennncnt. I g tve tho ans\\-c'i· "'Yes: tlwv arc sub~idised, if they are g'('1llliiH' donat{on~." .\nother CJUe:"·tiou \Ya:.--: n-.,k<~d of tht' Sccr('t;_u·c.· for Public \Yorks, allrl I an1 1nado to rcp}v to the question with tlJC' an:;:~,.yer that in C'C'ri-<:Jill cases they are not mlHidi,Pd. ,\s n Juttt> r Df fuct, thB Pub]i~· \York::- Dcparhnf'nt und I-Ion1C Depa.rt­lECnt nre two scpanlt,· {lPpartnH.,nts alto­g ·thcr. The Publie \Yorks DepurtnlC'nt "'lb­~i<11 ~ :-:: th' hnilJing fun(1 and tho l-f~)me Dt'nnttmf'nt l1as onlv to {lo with quc~~tiOns of 'JJtnint e1wncc•. \Yht'll t.ht''-C' two f1U< ~tions n ppc-ar ln- ~idc iu th(' Gn:yndah pa.per, \dH·rt' 81'(~ r;oiH.Q' to b0 placed, tht• l\Iin-l~tf'r r"-ln·e,('nti~g the IIolne Departn1ent i..; going to b0 placed i11 <' Y('l'Y UllfHYOlU­abll' lig-ht indeed. As a matter of fact, it i:-; lll~)st iu1~·df'adin~·. ancl, if it •scre onl~ a mi~takc. I IYOlll(l tukf' no 11oticP o·f it: l;ut it is ap11arcntl~.- a coutinuation of. a J)ol1cy which 1 af:k -..on, a:::; Sp:'akc l' of tlu:-; 1Iouse, to take · of and sec that proper L'}lort9-rll't' in tbc TlrP'·.,. 1 1ni.~rht pnint out to th(' Tim1·"f' thnt ia the Fl.'(h'rfll ParlianH?nt rec{'ntlv lt as fonlld ncf·cs~::tl'5·T to exclude the PJ'.('~,'"- ft'om i hf' ga1Jcry u_nUl they ga_ve con·ct·t rcpo1 t of tL. pro '-'ethng:s llt r~ahn­lllr>nt.

Con:nxm::.T :\IE)tnEH.": IIeae. hear:

Tlw 1J(J:\iE SECRET.\HY: That j, wbat ::;.hon1c1 llc dnnP hnrc if \Yf' arf' not goinr:t to have ;:Jtc-urntc.· rt'ports of th(' prfWl'Pt1in!.t,....

:.\Ir. YoY.-r.-:--~: Don't gd r·n).:;:;:.

Tllo nn~tF. RECHET"\RY: I am llot get-tiug- C!'0~". T1011. fllC'mlJC'l'S OppositP do not nndt'rst 11H1 \Yh;H 1" i11voln•d i11 fDi::-.

}lr. Yrnn.r::s: It La np..:l't :--our dif{Hity, t.hat j, all.

The HO::\I.F: SECHETARY: It i' not my cligtJit~· at n11. Again, jntcrjcctions that \H~re m'n•r ntl<'n•d in this House haYc been put in the· 1' C''1Yspapers by reporters for pro­naiTrrru.Ia t)lHTlO:;es. r:rhis is a breach of lnf~·ilc'ge ~f this IlousC'. and any reporter

Hon. W. ilfcCormack.]

774 QueM ions. [ASSEMBL Y.f Sup pi!]

doing so should be fmbidden the premises. You have that authority, Mr. Speaker, and I hope you will exercise it.

GoVER?;:lJEXT "!\IE:l!BERS: Hear, hear:

The SPEAKER: lVl" attention has been drawn to the mattl'r referred to by the Home Secretary, and I regret to say that there is son10 cause for complaint in this re~ard. A.~ hon. memLcrs knol\7

j adn1ission to the gallery is Pntiroly in the hands of the Spcnker: and. "·hilc I have no desire to take the dra:;:.tie action of refusing pcr111ission for the Press to Lo present, I shall not hesitate tr1 do so if nC('f> snry. I hope 111e1nbcrs of the Prt-"'-:s 1vill not givC' a sin1iiar canse for ro1nplaint in the future.

Q1'ESTIONS.

SrTHETAHY~IJJll OF LICENSED \ 1ICTl:JALLERS'

As~ociATiox.

:\[r. ELPlTI:\TSTONE (Ox/cy), 1>ithout noticf'. r• 0kC'd :he Treasurer-

" lTa<J lH" anv infonnation to conYev in ('OJ~nen1on with 1n:v alleged applica'tion for the secrc•aryship of the Licensed \Tictn:tJlci'.,: A~sociation ?"

Tlw TREASl:RRR (Hon. J. A. Fihelly, Puddin(!fon) l'C'plicd-

.. \Yitltont rising, I have. Y-.. ou were an np11licant."

ClPPOSITIO:\ }IE:lrBERS (to the Trea'm·er): Pay up ~-our tnonf'y.

:'.Ir. ELPJli:t\S'J'ONE thc11 gave notice of the• follm,-ing question to be addressed to the 'I1

t'("f1Sln'er on Tuesday next-" \Yill he lay on the table of the

Tlouu.• m,· alk;cd application for the po·.ition of cccretary to the Licensed Vi(·uulllt'rs' _},s~oriat'iloJI or anv other cviclcncc lw may haYc in suppo1:t of his contention:·'

Th<• TRE.ISrRER: Don't he foolish.

CHEESE PooL.

:\.1r. KIRWAX (Brisbane), without notice, uslced the Secretary for Agriculture-

" n as his attention been called to a parag1·aph in the J?ress containing a stato!llcnt alleged to have' been made bv }lr. Bcbhington, at T'oDwoomba. ol1 Tucsda,·. reg·arding the proposed Cheese Pool Bill and the want of confttlcnee n1otion."

TheSECRET.\HY FOH AGRICCL1TRE n•plied-

·' Thr JJOn. HH'Illbcr for llri:-;hanc 1vns good C'tlmuth to notifv llle t/Jat he int01Jd('d to a..:;k tllis quc~tion. and I find in the · Da iJy Tell'graph' of Tncsda~.7 last a t.:J('gra 111 H])l)t'Hl't·d. dated Toowoo1nba the ~anw dcty, in IYhi~h ~lr. Bebbington '>Yn.;; ~aid io hnYt"' n1nd0 the st~Jtcmcnt that rho Pr<'mit'r and ~he Mini,lcr for Agri­"ulturr had promised t!nt if ?llr. Yowles 1:ould po J por!t) ]Jjs '·'··ant of confid0nro motion tlF'.\~ would introdnre the c110Psa pool n:-< OlH' of the first ll1C'H'3Uros."

I '>Yant to '-a:, Pnqdwtic .Jh· that- such n stntc·­l!iCllt has no fonndation in fact. It is onlv ]Hll't of th0 pn1itica] prOJlDf!.'<ll!da ·whicl! rs

[Hou. Jr . .1/cCr;nJI!lck.

used to discredit tho lwnesi efforts of thi& GoYcrnmcnt in its desires to protect the primary prod!.H'Cr:) against n1iddlcmcn and SJlCculators.

:'vir. VowLES: }Ir. William Purceil made that statement.

'I'he PREMIER: Yon nHtde a charge against nlf' Dl1C0 before.

Seyoral !-IONOtJR \BLE ~IE::.\InERS inb;rj ecting,

The SPEAKER: Order! Order!

The SE:CRETc\RY FOR AGRICULTURE: I ('halJpngc the hon. member for Drayton or tho leader of the Opposition, who inter­jected, to furnich llroof. It is only part of the propn.ganda to injure the Government with the primary producer. It is known, of L JllrSC', t.hat n1en1bers of the Oppo.·,ition are aga in~t a cheese pool, hut this is not an ltmlc't WilY of killing the Bill.

.TCDGES' RETIRE:Vm~T BILL.

IXITIATION.

The ~\ TTORXEY-GE:\TERAL (Hqn. J. }[nllan. Flindus) moved-

" That the House will, at its next sitting, resoln> itself into a Committee of the YYholc to consider Df th.; desir" n blew hs of introducing a Bill to rrmend tlw Constitution of Queensland by fixin~r an age limit for the retirement of judge5 oi the Supron1o Court, ~nd to fix an age­limit for the retirement of other ,judges, and for other purpos0s."

Qne>tion pul and pas·,ec1.

IXITIATIOX.

T.b,, XfTORl\EY-GEl\IERAL moved-" That the Homo will, at its next

~iding. resDlve itself into a Committee of the \Vholc to consider of the desir­ableno-s of introducing a Bill to mako better JWOYision for the trial of civil and crirninal cases."

C:t'ne::.:tion put and pas'3cd.

:\L\GII:'.TRATES' COCRTS BILL.

INITL\TIOX.

T.llc' XITOHNEY-GE:'-;ERAL moved-" That the House will, at its next

~ittiu~. resolve itself into a Committee­of the \Yholc to consi·clcr of the desir" ablen0ss of introducing a. Bill to amend lw laws relating to the jurisdiction Df

n1ng-istratcs and jnstic,_. of the peace in C"iYil n1atter~."

0ucstioll put and rlasscd.

ST:PPLY.

Fr:-;_\:\"Cnr. STATE::.\IF.~T-HESC::.\l.PTIOX OF

C'mnrrTTEE.

(.llr. llinran. Hris/J(Inr, in the clr'tir.) Qnf'' tlon ~'a tcd-That there be granted to

1-Ii~ ~_laj0~~ .. for the .sen·ief' of J-he year 1S2l-l922, a sun1 not cxrr•eding £300 to defray tho '~larv of the Aitle-ck-Camp to His Execl10r.::·:.: thP GoYcrnor.

Supply. [16 S:E:PTE!VIBER.] Supply.

Mr. BEBBI:"JGTOJ\ (Drayton): Before I proceed with my speech op the Financial Statement, I want to say, 111 regard to the question asked by the hon. n1m11bcr for Brisba11o with rofm·c'nco to the Cheese Pool, that I merely stated \Vhat occurred at a public n1oeting, or at a 1noeting of citizens invited to be present.

}fr. D-ISH: \Vhy do ~-ou not say it was propaganda work?

Mr. BEBBI::\GTO:'\: It was not. If 1\·:Tini~b.•rs IYant to nsc one of their own party for propagmH]a. 1vork, they arc not going to mako fools of us. I gave the report of 1natters as they occnrr0d at tbo Jncoting, nothing n1ore and nothing less. I did not <ov that the .Minister said snch a thing. ·

Mr. Jh'iii: Yes o"OU did.

Mr. BEBBJ:'\GTO);": I said the loader of the Opposition asked \Yhether the l\Iinistor I;ludo tbe pron1isc y;,:hich he did-and there arc other nJcmbcrs 1vho ran b( J.l' n_1e on .. that he clid~and the anrcwer in the 111eeting was "Yes." I c:-u1not t;ay who saiJ it. rrhc leader of the Opposition ha· told you \\~ha sad it.

Mr. D.ISH: You said the Premier said it. Mr. BEBBI:.<GTO::\: I did not. Conw

and road it if yon have any eyes at all. The TRK\ScRER: Yon told the tntth or you

did not. \Yhich was it' Mr. BEBGI:;GTO:\: 'l'h>3 leader of th,,

Opposit!on has tol<1 hon. members who answered the qnc>otioll. Surely he can tell the truth. lf yon doubt me, surely you \vill not doubt the l<'aclcr of the Opposition! He js 1nore reliable tl1an you are.

The TnE,\SURER: \Yha t, on \Vando Vale?

:1-Tr. BEBBIC\iGTO:\: In general character. I did not say the ::\linister said it. I said it 1.-vas s~:~id in the 1necting.

Mr. FERRTCKS: You ha<l no right to make such a statement on snch fliin~,,~ evidcnc0.

GovER)DJEXT ME~!DERS: Ilea;·, hear l

Mr. BEBBE\GTOX: All you have to do is to contrarlict it and say that the person was vaong.

The TnEA.•CRER: \Yrre you correct or m­@!'rcct?

Mr. BEBIH::\GTO);": I was correct. I said the stat0ment wus n1adr~ at the nJceting. and it was made.

Tho TnEASCRER: "'ho made it?

:\fr. BEBBII\GTO:\: Tlw lcadN of the Opposition has told :on ·,•:ho made it.

The THEAS1'RER: Do not put it on to him. Jt, is -·our ba1Jy.

Mr. BEBBIXI;TO:\: l do not \Y.lllt h ', rl::;tc n 'Y tinlC in thls DHllH1cr. I want to g1-·t o~l to bnsinc~,,, .. ::-\ __ ;;:: a fanners' rcprC'­scut•atlYL, I do not approyc of son1c of tht' ~r>J!tillll'Hts in the Trc<u.;urt'r's StatcnH:nt. I ~ay thr~t snch l'(~lll8 J-.:s nrc brlow the Trea­~;1;rrr; h(~ sl10nld haY(' highc•l' id0rds than th,_d_ TLC'y are Inorcly the l't']JC'titions of a schoolboy. He says-

" I 'rould like. 'rhilc· on this topie. to nfl\:1 <l 'Yord of t~ncnnra genicllt to g-cnni11c flna1wia] ~tuJ0ut~ in thi::; and d1'0 other Chan1ber. The prevailing practjer of tht>O OJlp':lscd to tho GoYC'l'HnlP11t i~ to condemn our Iinancial adruinistra~ion."

Al\"·a::s a ~:1fc cour'Sc to take~ It r!'!ninds me of the story of a gcntlcm.11\ \Yho 'aid, " If

YOU 1ncet a -bo~r on the road. giYe hilll a ~,·hack hecanse he is either just going into mischi~f OJ' just coming out." (Laughter.! \Ye~ know that is a ch1·onic 'tate of affairs ;~·ith the Goyr.rnrnent, a;~~ we arc r,uit? safe 11: condc'llnJ;ig thcn1. _ihe haiL g'<'ntJeu1nn WC'1Jt on-

" It has <1eve1oper1 into a \'.nrt of u:tt('h­cry; :cet hardly ono nwmhcr of the Opl)osition can, in n enrnmon-·cn.se '':a~,-~ analyse, di~sect. or criticl:;r> onr revennP. Joan_, and trust expenditul'P. 'J1l1is pr;lt lice of the nntutor~cl oppc.sitr hn; bc'' ome aln1ost a \-ice. The nJort~ i~'!10l'A rt, t ht,_ lllOi'l~ J. grnatic! The 1norc stupid. the nwrc a:::scl'tiYn ~"

T'hat de :.;cribcs the Trea3urer's character y~_~ry JiiC•('j '\.

· "It is \vel! known that the mosi eminent bnukc~· "' onld not bo Ji;;tpnetl to <A1

fiJHll1C'0 b,\· e ,pert:; 1Yl1o t~rriYc·d in Par-1 iarncnt frmn the farm. or b:· tho··· fmancinl puuli(·, v.·ho sit in c, back room in Qneu1 :-3trec~ \V .:iting l0acling ~ rtidr<::. :'

If that IS IJ01. an 1nsult to the fnrn11ng cotn­Jnunitv. I do nnt kno\Y what i~. Let rne t-... Jl rh{' Trca~Ul'Pl' that t:w farming crHn­l1lUTli1v i-.: OIH· of the nwst inte11igont coJn­

Einnltlos in Qucen~land, .and tlw-.:· arG a?le tq c~trn rhc,ir JiYing without loafing- on the rouJJtrY. I can \York in lll, position to-­ncCilTO~Y and f'nrn as 111uch a:-:, or n1orc than. I arn ranoing lH'l'C. I cn·nr>d it bl3frne I u;Ino hcrt?.

Then_ ... j:) one thing I c-d:tiuJy ol.Jjc··~t to, and that i-. the mode in whi"h Jl.finistcrs n-t onh: n_n3i.Ye.· f)tWstions bore bt;t try to throY{ n~p-el_·:--ions on hem. rncmberA on t_his side of the llonsC-IllL'll ·who han~ spent nln1ost a lifetime bore Rn<l whose \Yore! is their bond. I \vill gin~ tLn instance of what 1-:linister~ have bc2n trying- to do with the hon. member for Albert. EYcry opportnuity has bee!l i:.>ken tn ca~-t aspP-r·ions on him in connection "ith !Jis c-.:pnlJ(liture in the lTon~o Oflirl'. Here is n ease. In 1914 the <"cpen.,eo wore audited and sig-nc·d by a GoYPrllnlent auditor· aud ha\<' b~en rrdmittcd b:· the ,Homo Sccro­turv to amnnnt to £988. but in 1920, l.hrou;rh pol~tical infllH'ilC'(' anJ for political puqlo~.e-~. tho"o e-.:pl'nsc' had grown to £2,343. Is that an hone~t thing to do? Is lt a right ,vay tn deal \Yith hon. members on this side of th<' House·: Talk about repudiation! In 1914 the hon. member fm· Albcrt, at the reqnc.-t of the Labour members in the North, In a de rt 1 rip to tbo N ort}H'rn ports a.nd CloJl..,­ClnTy. H c cr:ulfl not get up there without takipo· the GoYcrntnont steamer. Thrrt :-;tPat~~'l' wa' a \Yay 'Sornething like ~cventy-five davs. and everyone knows pprfectly well that. if \ou take a stean1C'r awa·. for scYentv-flve da,;·~. anLl ern out G-oYc~·nnwnt dnties at the "Xonlwrn lJorts, jt eaiinot Le done o,:1 £100. Hi-. said that the iota! cost,,,. £2.343. inclt~ding the rrciY·s wages, pro­Yision.~, flnd a spec-ial tndn to Cloneurry. I-Io,,- {'Qu]d tl10 cost of a spPf'ial train bc­chnrgnd as part of the expr>n--;(':-;? For D1Rn~-­yc·'tl'~ t}H~ ,; Ln(:inda" had be· n placed at the di~pond of mn· !'Chools for f'XCHl'sions in the Smnh of QuC'('n~lancl. Th0 1wn. r11ernber for .-\!h•li v·hpn \YC•nt up )i"orth thought that rh' ,:;;;tn1c f;hnul<l be giYcn to the ~(Ft~lCrn \Yhilo hr ·as 1111 there.

Thr TRr_·~·r·n~-ll: IIc dil1 not L1ko the ;. l .. ncindJ. t}F'l't' ..

\L· Jll<:BB1:\CTO::\: u,, to•tk the "Otter.'' TlH' Gon'l''Hl1Cllt arc tr~·inu: to inc1nde in th\.' <'~.,_pc.·n:--;·-., ~Jf ~hC lwn. mP!nlJPl' for Albcrt

Jf r. Bebbington.]

'776 SUJlpl!J. [ASSEl\IBL Y.] Supply.

thr co·t o£ giving the :'\orthcrn children a trip in the "Otter," while the sftme thing had been going on down here all along in t.he '· LucindR." If I 'verc a North(~rn mcn1~ bcr. I would he ashamed to mention such a thing. The hon. gentleman tried to give

to the Northern children the [4 p.m.] privileges which were bcine>;

given to those in the South, and 1'\m·thern members condemn him. At the request of two Labour members, the hon. gentleman visited Cloncurry-a very right thing to do. I do not believe in Ministers always hanging ronnel the city. Because he visited Cloncurry it wa.s put down to his OIVH pcnonal cxpem• s. lf that is not a little over the odds, I do not know what is. The hon. member for Albert made a trip <:!own South the same year, and his hotel cxpCJb('S came to le"s than he was allowed to dnn,-, There was nothing said about that. In the hon. memlwr for Albrrt's time ]\Iinistcrs "·ere allowed £2 2s. per day expense:; inside the State and £3 3s. per day ontside the· State. Those amounts cDverecl tlw whole• of their cxpen·c'-. The Homo Sec­rPhll'y yesteJ·day admitted that the pn·,cnt l\1ln1~tf'rs w0re Gra\\-ing those expenses in a.ddit1on to tbc orclinarv expenses which "\YCre pal-cl. ~

The TREASuRER: :'\o.

Mr. BJ~BBINGTO?\: The hon. member fcli' }dbert asked-

" J s it Not a fact that since the Labour GoYc1·nrnr .:.1t c:une into po,vcr the old tl'aclition of the Home Department-Yiz., ihat the 11inister should draw no permnal cash nllowanc•'-has been broken, and that, in acldit'on to the pa vment of all tra.velling expenses, a cash "fdlo,Yance of £2 2s. ~ clay within the Rtate and £3 3s. a day '"'lthont 1hr- State hrs bcon clnin1ed and "p.1id to the :Ylinist~r b:- the dcpart-111C'nt? ''

I am not co:nplainin,~· t1Jat it i::; too 1nuch. 1 do not bclien• in }Jinistns having- to go cap in hand to anybody. I believe Mini,tcrs should alwD",·s keep np tlw dignity of their po~it!on. But ·'"yhcn thP:'<' dra h' £3 3~. a day outside the St, iP in adclition to the other expenses. and then tr" to inflate the Pxpon3es of the hon. n10n1ber for Albc1't fron1 £988 to £2.343, their action is contemptible. l bcli<'ve tlw Quecmland Parliament will ~t·u1d cornparlson IYith rtnv Parliament in thn world. (Hear, h< ar !) It "·culd be difft­

·cult to find a 111ore ~ober bodv of 1nrn than there is in this Honse. I do "not bclieYe in aRpH':"ions being rast on.num1bcrs on oithor ~ide. I am sor1·y to sco such asp£'rsions cast on nu hnn. p-0nt!0mnn who serycd 1vith credit a..:; tt ~Iini~tCr in two or three GoYernJncnts.

TLc TrraHn'f'l' cannot go an; fnrthPr in rq,·,nd to taxation. I believe the lifllit has bc.·n reached. because the taxation in Aus­tralia fo-dav__:__Fcdf'ral and Sta~e-alnount'3 in some ''"'' to 10,, 3d. in the £1. One, gc!!lle­JJJ.dl 111 Toowomnba, a fairly '\Yea:::hy nwn, told me~~

Th•• TnEASl'HER: \Vhat is his n"'m ? :\[l'. RTOPFORD: How much of that IS

Fe;], ral t~xation'

)fr. DEBBJ?\GTO:'i': Th,:ct is Federal and State taxation. lion. gcntlc1ncn oppo~ite took a great deal of plea«ure in saying thev woulci Ina!-;:e the capitalist :;:queal. The~ lHne Iw!de the capitalict squeal. but he alway- hcts had plenty of food \\'hen the capitalist equcals, that squeal rewunds in

[Llf:r. Bebbington.

the homes of tlw workers and th(•ir hungry wiyes an<! familic' The GnYernment talk about taxing the rich man. They c~nnot do ,.o without the effect falling upon 'the worker. If a business 1nan in Queen F,trret js taxed, he puts it on to the goods and tho purchaser pays it. There is no other way of doing it. The only man the Government can make squeal is tho man who exports his produce and cannot put his taxes on to the goods he produces. In their desire to make the rich man :;:quea!, th0 Govern1nent have squeeze-d the rich man out of hn-inces. and the worke1· has had to go hungry.

:;\Ir. BREXKAX: "-.-hy are you sqqcaling?

Mr. BEBBINGTON, I am not squealing for 1nysclf; I an1 .sqtH_1ling for the hnngry people in Bri,hane.

The TRK\SCRER: The Opposition·;

Mr. BEBB1:\"GTON; ?\o; we arc not hungry. There is another pha~c of bol'rowing and taxctinn. I did not think the interest bill would reach £3,300,0JO a year until other loan.- had been floated to repay these vvhich arc falling due. I-f '"~'0 are responsible now for the pa:·mcnt of £3,300,000 in intcro>t per annum, 'vhat is the amount going to be ,vhen thoJe loans which cost 3 per cent. to 4 per cent. arc rcfloatcd at 6 per cent.? That £3.300.000 is a first charge on industry in Queensland. Every working man. I do not care who he is, has to foot that bill; it has to be paid before an:v working n1an can be paid. It bas to be takon i11to ron!':=i-dcration in connection with Vi hat he i>:, going to get for his work. If I mortgn.gc Ill'' farm. then I hr.v-e to meet the interest before I have nnything for 1uysclf. It is the sun10 thing· witll the 8'nt,-~_ \YP have Jnortgated the State, nnc1 \\"0 have to r lV intcr0..,t anlount­in)~· to £3,300.000 eycr.: 'yc'ar. God help our .\~o-ung- ncopJc growing· up to-da_.-, an·d God bolp il1e vi·nrkc rs nf Queen:-:Iancl for the next h,n ~·eaes. bcrunse, 110 P1~tttcr what Govcrn­n:cnt- g-Pb into pOWC'i', that GovC'rnmcnt :is bouud to pay the• interest catHcd b,'' the P\.Jra ,-n gancc; of HlC present GoYPrnril· nt. The prc• cnt Governmt: nt ha YC' hc~rl a hi3'h ti1ne for thr- L -;t six :~:cars; but f:OHlf'body has ioWt to foot !he bill: aliCl it is not fDl' onr- ;.Par or hvo vcar::.:. bu-t for rvrrr year. That' amonnt of· £3.300.000 mmt bo . pro· YidQd c:Ycry yccu· br>forc \\'0 ea n gc•t anything else for dcn•loping the Stnh•. Talk about 1naking thP rich ~qural: \Yhy. it is the \ crkcr who h" s .-ot to squeal owing to the c•xtnl\-ar.;arlce of this Governn1ent. I have always l-H ·q1 again~t boiTL\Ying n1oney in tho Stat0. I knovv that it ha8 alwavs bc0n the policy of the Labour party to bo,now in the State'. and some of om· nwn people have the ·"a!nn idea; but thcv arc vrrv ll(llTo"·~nJindc-d in that iden. The' only thi,ng they can seB is a. little hit of interc .t going out which thcv think should bo kept in the State. They c 1n'not sc·c that, if we borrow in the S'tate, then all that L.oncy is taken out of indmtry. and thereby f'auscs n1orr unen1plo~vmcnt. If '"o haYc a £3.000,000 loan rais<•d in Quce>Js­] and, you are g·oins to 11rr-vent the 11coplo from pntting those £3.000.000 into Yarcous indu~trics in Quc'C'Ilsland. YCJn arc only robbing our industries when you do that, 'vherea -, if ·we borro"· the n1oncy· from out­side, the capital already in the State i.: used for development and the whole of the money borrovF cl out ide is put into our industries. The intcre~t ,,"{:hich goes out on n1oney borro\.Ycd ovcrsras j;::o u n1cre trifle co1npared

[16 SEI'TE)!BEH.] Supply. 777

i.o the adv0.nta;-;c we obtain by going outside fOr our loaYls.

The rrRE:\S"CHfU: Suppo:--e ev~,ry State adoptc:1 that Pl'inciple an(l decided .to borrovt a!! their money outsicle of Australw?

Mr. BEBJ3IXG'l'OX: It '"ould he all the better for the Statr '· They could borrow n1oncy o11:side at 5 rcr cent. 1 and, as they could mnkc 15 per cent. on it, they \Yould be 10 per cent. to tho good. \Ye un deYelo11 the State better by borrowing money frow outside ne thuo is more moncv left for wageA and for ernploy1ncnt. B.v Continu~lly borrov:ing in the State you are onl> robb1ng· your own industries. It really cripple> the industries wo haYo and prevents others from starting. At the prc · cnt time "·c send our ra\v nutterials ho1no to be n1anufucturcd) and 1vc ii:IfWl't the n1anufac·tnn:d article at a much incrc~sod price. If we borrowed money frmn overseas, we could start nc1v industrie":l, 1nauufactnre all our own 1natcrial.s into the finisbcd article, g·i,-e more employment to our o'vu people, and rccQive three tin:c.;:; n10re wealth than we clo at the present time. It is a '."Cl'Y narl'O,Y-rninded 1)QlicJ, tu borrow iHOl10"'' ju tho State. \Vhen hon. lDPrnber ''d:V ti~at we irnpoverish the Statu by bringi!1g· ,;a.pital in fron1 outside, th~ :: do not know whP_t the", arc talkinG about. Our party Lcli4_ n~ in l~ncouragi11g the ;:;r-:::onUary iudu~~ tries ,~; lllnt h as pus~ibl('. \Ye ,,·hould cnconr~ age both lnanufachtrC'l3 and vrir!1ary vru­rluction. and in that "a\ \\t' can iind the inten· t to pay for tlw 1-JlO!lcy '•'C l"~OlTov;. rrhe (:ajryillg Jndustry in (_JLlC,:l\ }g:Lld brinp::s in <'rtpital umoun(ing to £~.000.000 or £5,000,r-l0 n·0r:· .1·car. Thut is taken from the ~oil, nnd that rnoncy is brought t~:tck ancl expended here again. It has al '."a:.,') proved to be a good inY( ··tn1c11t. If ""', :e ,yant increasc~d production, VYt~ n1ust ht,ve legisla­tion. to enable PS to incrC'aBe our productioll. At the present ti1ne thc1·e is a scarcity of :tnoney, r.nd all our legislation acts aclvcr;:,el~' to iner<")~.scd production. VYc: should rnconr~ a.::-~·c n1ore procluctim1. At the present tln1e, owing to the way labour is re ;tricted, the worke1·1- (·atmot get enough lL•onoy to pay their \Y.;\ ·.". Look at tlw jncrc~a~0d cost of n1anufad~nP PYl'rvwhcrc ~ At onr: ti1ne '"e us··d tn rt llo,y lLi. p'}r lL. for the rnanu· fhc: urr, of cheCSl\ but it cost:;; ihrc~ tin1es tha,, snn1 now. If the GoYcrurnent paid their ''~'UJ' the s8 n1c as e,·ery one cl~c, it Yrould he all right, hut the,,· do not do that. At the pl'CsPnt tin1c our lc~giflation is a burden on the taxpayr r. Tako the State ProdU°C ... L\"goncv for cxan1plc. That Agency is living on the ,:'s ow11 busines·-,. It Pxi:::t:, on the hu:-l111-~, it does ''"ith Go,·crnnlPtlt institutions Eke 1)un,yich, St. IIdcna, Uoodna. ancl other place 1 fJJ'f'~lln1o that thc~e instjtutiou~ cannot go outsitlc of th" Agency for an:> thing th 'Y '"'mt to lJLt0·. If tlH"' get goods frorn the Agency Rllllplies an~ :-·Qnt down at the Agcncv's own pricc~prostunably the market pnce. \Yl:at hu ,;l!C''S \Yonld not flourid1 on such 1inrs as that·: T'hc Agr-ncy ;::::irnpl," 1iYf'S on our own ilJdu-..trif'3. Another objr•ction I haYe to the State' Produce Ag·cncy is that it brings goods he. re from other States. If thrrt is <'Ol'l'ect, then what is the good of the State Produce Agency to the prodncrrs or anyone r;Lc9" \Y c "·ould be better without it. It \conld be better to allow th~ Go,·crnment institutions to cflll for tenders and get their goocls at the cheapest n1arket. I kno;v that private agents also get g·oods from other States. I do not say that the agenL do 'vrong bPcause tbey

do husinc ., with the other States. But the State Produce Agency is merely another agonL and does its business in the sa n.~e way a:-; any other agent.

The SECRETARY FOR PcDLIC LAKDS: Will any other agent giYe a bonus to the sellers?

l\Ir. BEBBI~GTO:!'\: The other ,gents get better prices. You can afford to give a bonus the ".1y you run the State Produce Agc•nc;. Anyone in this A'sembly and any husincos man knows that the Government arc receivi!1g considerably less t:o-day from St Lte stations, under State n1anage1nent, than the amount thev received from those stations by '"ay of tax"es "·hen private people had those stations. That is only one phase of it. Hero is another. \Yhen the Govern­ment took oyer one station outside Charle­Yille they resumed eight selections aronnd that station. The Secretary for Lands will admit that that is correct.

:'.Ir. PAYXE: HmY did thL'Y rerumc them?

l\Ir. BEBBING'l'ON: Thev tuol~ them from · mnoone else. The" resumed the selections around the station and ejected the tenants.

:\Ir. J'.\YXF.: Y on arp wrong-. You clo not k11o'y what you are talking· about.

l\Ir. BEBBINGTCJX: The Gm·ermmnt re­~~umcd eight selcctious around that station, aud the t1~nnnt~ had to go. Is it e~1conraging land settl0rnont "·hen the Goy.: rr~:nent take o\·er uch lal'Ge area-s a that and then I'esuino <'ight selc•ctiou in order to protect themselves f:'ullt cattl<.1 stralers '( 'l'hat ls tho excuse they gave. In1mediately the Countr~' party gets on the Trea:::urv be11ches-and that will f'"" before V(~l'.Y JoJ!~~,ye "·ill make F<hort work of thi~ RCC'Ulnulution of ]and. rrhcrc Dl'B hunclrccls of P' oplc to·dav who wccnt land, c:tnd yet the GoYcrn1n0nt ar~ re .un1ing :3Lt t:ions and centrali ,.-ing a !I the settlement on Go,-orn· n:ent stations. If 1hero are pl-:..)plc then• who w tnt the land, the,· shall ha Ye it. and have i!- un t:_nns ,\·hich \rill DJ!nble thrn1 to 1],~c.

=\Jr. I'AYXE: Sr•ll it. }1r. BEBBI:';GTOX: Xo; ''c will not sell

it 1H bic arra~; but, if a Hl8n ''ants to rnake a hDllH' for hi1nself, 'Ye 'vill s?ll the land to hin1. \Yr fll'C not goin;_· to vsk a n1an to nut hi., itnpro,'Clnents <nl a piet ., of ]ease~ hol!J. \Ye nr0 go}ng to g-ivt~ hiit1 a freehold tenure, so that ·hi·. iiHl)l'Ovc•rnent..:; 'rill belong to him.,clf. and so that he will have some :t•curity.

~Ir. J.'AYXS: Do vou think any 1nan will pay 1r.,. an acrL' fen: a grazing fa{'ln to-day?

~lr. DT~RDIXGTOJ\": Xo. Yon cmmot get men to·dav to buY land at 10;. an acre, ht•t lUSP of Yonr co,;lfi~c. >~torv ~crtinns in thB Land Tax :\et. Ilon. me; tbors know that to-clay there arc largr' c·t.atcs of 100,000 acres that ho.vc been conftscated. Tlw hon. member knmvs pPrfcctl··· ''"!! that the land tax is thn" time'.- n·:c rental n.luc of the land, ,md then he talks about people not buying l.nh~. Is jt a11:v 'Yonder people will not buy land·: I will giYC' an instance of a pTopcrty of OY('l' 100,000 acres. That land ma"lY S'Cars

acre.

\\·as boug-ht foolishly at from £1 to all nc'l'c>. To-{1ay it is taxed at £1 an

:llr. l\Ioom:: At more.

I\Ir. BEBRI:"\GTOJ':: The hon. mcmlJer 1s qnito ri.::ht.

l\h. P.n XE: Does the State tax it?

:\lr. BEBBI.i';GTO?\f: Of comse it is the State. The tax on that land is up to 6d.

1111·. Bebbington.]

778 Supply. [ASSE:.\IBLY.] Supply.

au. acre, with 2d. super tax, and 2d. for an unlmprov{'nicnt tax. 'rhat is IOU. an acre on a value of £1 an acre. Then you have the Common\n•alth land tax of about 3d. or 4d. an acre. 'l"hu two land taxes together come to DYer Is. an a:::rc, and sin1ilar land to-day can be lea"od from the State at 2d. an acre. 'I'hat is a case-and the Secretary for Public Lands knmYs it perfectly well-where the land l;"x is i'n-c times the rental value. and then the Govcrn1ncnt say there is no confisca­tion. Is that not confisc-ation enough? 'What is confiscation? Immediate!, the tax gets above tho rental value vou have confiscation. You cam10t l'et anv ot'ber definition. That is one of the rea; onus wln~ thoro is no enrour­agcmcnt to pruduce. P"eoplc are fur better off in the cities. It is far better for tho people to iu,-est their money in Common­''"ealth loans and State loans, whore they can g-et fl'O<ll 6 per cent. to 7 per cent. and have every comfort. Who ic going opt in tho \Vest, put up 1Yith all the discomforts. allcl ha.Ye the tax-t:·athcrcr on their hcPL;;; eYPry moment? Yen cannot do a single thing without baYing the ta.x gatherer chas­ing you all the time. Notwithstanding the statements mrcle on the other side, the' real positio11 in Queensland to-day is production or bankruptcy. \Ve ,,-ant a certain amount of money tJ keep us going every day and cYery year. ...:\re \Ye going to produc0 that ll10llCY? .An' we going to producG it from the land? You ran ha vc a fine snrcc on taxation, and you ran have prospCrity b7 t<lxation for a few years like the Government have had. The~- lui.ve taxed the profits made by better Gon•rnment, in years past, and they have had a great spree, but to-day they arc faced with the position that they have to produce the amount of money they require. because their credit is gone, or they must face bankruptcy, Thcso nto11ian ideas are no good.

::VIr. CoLLI:\S: Mention a few of them.

Mr. BEBRINGTON: L\s the hon. member for B<Jwen has askPd u1c i.o 1nention a few. I will be fair and will gi,-c him the questions that are to be submitted to the Brisbane Labour Conference on the 8th October. That is a fair thing. Thi;:-; one has been passed already in ::VIelbonrnc-

" That the objectiYe of the party should bo socia!isation of industry, production, distributiou, ancl c"change, and for the purpose of achieving the objective indus­trial and pal'liamoHtary machinery should be u<:>,ed.''

11r. PEASE: You sec they are not worrying about dividends.

Mr. BEBBIXGTON: You arc not ,,-ol'l'y· ing about your debts either. That proposal must be endorsed bv every member on the other side or he mu~t clear out.

Mr. CoLI.ES: Is that not a recommenda­tion to the conference on 8th October?

Mr. BEBDINGTO:\i: It has been passed already :n Melbourno by the largest Labour conference over held in Australia.

1\:Ir .. c~oLLl:\~: GiYC' U:" ~C>J1H.1 lnorc• utopian idc.as.

Mr. DEDDE\GTOX: Here is a.nothcr one-

"The Shop Assistants' Union will end,•'lvour to exclude all employers from the Labour pccrty. A motion will be moved to the effect that the Go.-ernor-

[.LY! r. Bebbington.

Goner~] <hould be elected bv member& of the I.ogislatin, A"emblles m the YaJ'ious States."

The follc,win[!' proposal also appears in the nnn1c of the E,hop _A:"sistants' Union-

,, That the aL,l1itirm of the wagee s,ystern he obtained b:; ma.king it illegal to pay \rages."

They hnc YCl'Y nearly done it. (Opposition laughter.) Here is a proposal to g-et them out of ilwir difikultics-making- it illegal to pay what they c ,nnot pay. They have got

into a lJ;cnkrupt sbtc. They [4.30 lUlL] eannot pay wa.ges to their

cn1ployc•es, and, 1n order to relio.-c them,clv<'s of the difficult,v of paying "agc:1, fhe~: arr goinG t) rnakc it illegal to pay t,hcm. The~,- 1Yant to get hold of all tha n1onoy t.hr~v C'ttll. ull the surr•c. fiero is anothf'r n npos.ition-

" That the abolition of the wage& system ll<' obtained by making it illcg:tl to pa;,- wag0:· or rereiYc 'WEt!?,'E'S, s1x n1onths' gTa.co to be allowrd to arrange n1att::rs, find in the n1eant.imc the Federal GoYernn-~('nt, through its F( deral bank. shall loan sufficient n1oncv to the em­ploycP:.; in an industry, 'Ut reasonable interest, to enable th<~ employees to nc--tnire their propriet.ors.hip sharo in the inchT~tr . .- th0y are en1ploycd in."

:\Ir. CoU.I:\S: Complete it; thei·e is another st~tten1cnt

Ml'. DEB13Ii\'ta'OX: Yes. I 11·ill complete it: t hero i.- anothPr one, a,nd this is worse fo~· the prin1ary producer-

" The GoYcrnmcnt shall establish a system of selling prices for home con­~nmption, and shall only pcrn1it surplus prodnct,, OYer home needs to bo export0d."

The agcncla-paper also includes the follow­ing motion-

" That the CommomYcalt.h GoYern­mrnt ehould a'Stune control of wheat, meat. butter, and wool at the point of production. and ma,rket the same, and that it shoulcl lix the home priee for such commoditiPs at the mean of the foreign market ratrs quoted therefor, less all charg-es in.-oh·ed by export."

I '"ant that to go into "Hansard," so that the farmers will be able to read it. What does that mean to the primary Jlroducer' The party orpositc seem to be out for cheap food; they want something cheap that they do not earn. It seems that this great Labour conference, which is to be held in Brisbane on 8th October, is going to mitkc a recom­mendation to the Federal Goycrnment that it shall '<'izc· a.ll produce, meat. and food­sttt!fs, nncl all that kind of thing.

Mr. CoLLIXS: It is not g-oing to do any­thing of the l<ind.

;\Ir. BEBBE\GTOX: Remember th"t you do not count, un]c::s YOU arc a n1on1bcr of that confc';·.:nce: neither do lYlinisters count; yon ha .-e to do .imt as yon arc told. H lDOal1S that t]F' farll10l'S' rn·oduce is going to bo srized bpr0 in Queensland.

)Jr. CaLLI:\": That is not true. :\Jr. BEBHI:\'GTOX: Why is it put dmm

there thrn? The farmers' produce is to be seizcJ in Queensland, and only after the, pcoplo of Queo:Jclancl liD.YC eaten all they can nrc the farmers to be allowed to export the surplus. And ut wl1at price? .U the London

Supply. [16 SEPTEMBER.] Supply. 779

price, less all expenses of export. London is the world's market for the products of col­oured bbour. Ther·e you have prorluce eoming fro1n RuPsi a, in~ which there is a smni-slavc -systcnl in operation. In Russia you will sec the Labour platform in opcra­tirm without anv control whateYer. The people tlwrc arc·· practically dying. ami at th(· same time their produce is being seized. come of it bein;>; .<Cllt to London in order to get IllOJH'.,-. You l1aYC a smni-slnvc systrn1 in operation in South Africa and ether Stntr<;, Y'lws prodnc0 goes to London. ..:\nd we are to be mt•rcifully <•llowed to have the .amr· pri, r that is being tllowccl for these Jtrc_dnC't..; in London~ Then the pzil'ry oppo.sitt' ha,~c tho infernal cheek to tell us t.hat tit. nJcn ,rho propo'e that are the fl'i( ud,; of tl1c worker.

~\Ir. ( 'OSTELLO: rJ'lL·y arc highway robb,?n.

Mr. COLLIXS (Ro,:rn): I rise to a point of otdcr. Is the hon. J11CJnbcr for Carnnryon 1n ordC't' I!l l'l'fctTing to ns as high·way .toLbt:f~ ·:

Th0 ( 'l·L\IR:1L\:'\: If the boll. momb• 1·

fol' Cnrunl'\Oll 1nade tbat reflection on 1llL'lll­!J, r:-: uf 1 he { 'umrnittee, he is uot in order, ;tiJd l a :.:: ititti tu \\-jthtlraw the statenH:>nt.

;..Il'. ( '0:->TH.LO: I did nu1.kc that ruuark <tnc ' till' ( 'hrunl"'l", uud I withdraw it.

:\Ir. BEBBE\GTOX: Such a reference as that ·,youid be a disgrace to the robb0r. Leuuoe the hiQ']n av robber took from the ~·!d1 uud F,a t' 'rn tlle pnor, but the prcsc•nt Cn\·cr:1nil'llt tak0~1 fron1 t11C poor nnd giYl'll to t1H_1 rich.

Tlw ('!L\IR~L\.X: Onlcr! Order The ]lUlL ltlc'HllH'l' ll1U'-t llOt diS('U S that H}[J.ti('l'

-tny f\lnh0r.

:\Ir, BEBBT:'\GTOA": I will obey ,,our ruli11g~ )Ir. l\:_irwan. That party will propo~e thar- tht• fanners' produce sl1~ll be- Sf'izcd hnc, awl. after the people of Quef'nsland hn Ye Lct1 1l ·~upp1icd at the price ruling in Londou f(Jl' nigger produce. the l'('St. 1nay bo cxportPd. I say that there is any amount of product~ arri,~ing in London \Ylii~h js tJrod!l~Pll ulldcr se",ni,slave conditions.

'\Ir: llAHTLEY : Last session n,ere You not a.eking- for London parity for butter f

:\Ir, BEBBIXGTON: :'-lo. A GoYERX)IEXT :iYlE:liBER: It was for cheese.

l\Ir. BEBBI)iGTOK: \Ve ha Ye to pay a cluty of from 30 per cent. to 40 per cent. on the agricultural jniplelll(1 nts "·e use. \Ve h·ve to )la"' hig·h duties on oYcrythin~·- \\·,, pay them chrcdully in order that '"e ma:v pay the wages of Qnccnslancl and Australian workers. But the Government want to put the product~rs on the sanrc leYel as tho coloured '.liens working in other countric~.

llh. BREXX,\X: Ha ye you any money in tho hnnk?

'\Ir. BEDDIXGTOA": will ncnr have any JHOlll\:'<' ln the bank :30 long as the hon. nl(\lnlwr i:-; abo1tt. (Laugl1tcr.)

]\Ir. T.A Y"LOH (fri ifL~or): Yestercb.\' 1110~t n1cmbn·s listened with a goorJ deal of ~-ltis­L- ·ticn tn u .-ncccb tle]iycrcd l1Y the hc:J. IJ10 :ibC'l' fell' rl~rbC'rt. ,

.:"Ir. ( ·ou.I~~: 1'hcrc \Ya~ good ~tuff iu ir.

T,\ YLOR: There was Letter stuff tL. n -·on ;"~re nwdc of. The hon. n1crr1b{_•r (~!: ·c o~ :1 a Jot of ground, and \VOnt to a con-

siucrablo amount of trouble in getting infor­matiDn to place before members. Com­prn·i,ons are at all tin1cs useful, but I take it that, if they arc to be really valuable and :c:n1dc• ou to a correct conclusion, vou 1nust Jind o{lt. if the conditions in the "countries which an' beinr; brought forward for pur­po.;:~' 11£ rninpayj'.on an: a·, si!nilar as it is i"''sihk for them to lJe to those of the c mntry you cn·c considt'ring. I hold that,

:.ibt tLe hon. n1LillLPr 1 in introducing those z,thcr coantrics~ gavc- us a Jot of information. "''"' c·:·thelrcs the points of difft•rence and di Yera.·l'llC't: bl't\Yi'C'll tho LTnitcd States and Cn•nt lhitain on th..., one hnntl and ..:\u~tralia 0n the other arc .so nwrkcd thnt the con1-twri~on 1osr~ a consi<1crablc a1nount of ~ts Yalne. "rake C:rcat Btitain, with all Its li1<Jnnfa.-tul·ing industries. Is it not trne that. whPn depression C{'curs, it hits a. lJighly ckvc·loncd uHc~try like that n1uch 1nore "'Y~l'< f,. than a countn· liko Queensland. wh01·P ·.;:o ntuch of it is' nndcveloped? "\Ve kL>> that. the workers in Great Dritaln are (·:Jtil'0iy d0p01Hl~'nt on the indnfltries of Gr0at Bri:-·ajll for t1H·ir daily wage, and that the Hlar.t~rial mnnnfoci.ured in 1H:>r factories goes i•; (·y,, rv part of the \rorld in return for t!\(;H\·v ~'. l1i('h r·onJ<'~ baf'k and nw,intains tho ha!ntl< '.' ()f trade·. So. I think. a cou1parison <>f Gn·at Brit.tin with Queemland is he.rclly a L<ir ~"mparison at all. 2:\ow, if I nnder­:-tood ihc hon. 1n01nber aright last nir~ht. he

:irl thw the taxation of the lF'Oplc in EDg­In nd Fa~ abont 8:-:. in the £L \Yhi1st hP re in I};H·(·r~sland it 1~ 5s. '"\rr. Pr,sE: I tlitl not >.a\' ir ,, as 5s. The

]:; 1. nH~IHlwr for To,v:nsville sa id it \Vas 5s. L~ ;·e. T ~aid it ''as Bs. in tl1e £1 in Eng]and.

"\fr. L\ YLOH: If >Y0 pa:v 5c. her••-I do n»t know •vhPth<'l' '' c llo or not-nud they HI<' ;)<n-iug: only 8:-:. in Gn~nt Bt'itain, th~, ~rnt<~· r;f (;lu 1'11~anres j~ not nluch credit .to u.;: ...... hc·n \'i'{) considPr tile- imrn0nse financ1a1 r,•,pcm,ibilitie' Circat Bt'itain ha,~ had to (-;;rry during the last six: ol' seven years.

\fr. HARTLH: \Yhnt is the difference in ·pu!atlon '? :-.Jr. TA YLOH: I am very much disap­

poiid~'cl ,.,,ith the figtn:e" whicJ: have been Fnpplirtl to the Cmmmttc•e. \\ <' have l~ad vt•an: of record revenur. \Vc .nro pass1ng 'rhrmwh meh a bounteous season that I do nnt Sl~Pll'lJRe a11yone in Qucenflland has recc:l­ltetions of a hctter. The Treasurer says w hi.s Statement that Providence has ;zmiled on us. YC~t nohYithstandi11g tbcse facts v·e have to o~vn np to n1ore une1nployincnt and finm~­cial trouble 1 han the State has cycr expen­f•JJf'('d in its history.

At 4.45 p.m .. :\[r. F. c\. CooPER (!in, 1 r r). one of the

Temporar·:v Chairmen. rclicYe<l tho C'hairman j:·~ t.h-e chair.

}1L 'L\YLOR: '.'le fiHt! in tlw Statement i hr' r~\TllllO for 1920,21 exceeded tht'

t>d H'CC'i ptR nnrh_'r fonr hcn.dings to tho nct,•nt nf £694.087, lmr fell shon o' the ;' n~icipatr-d re'< -:~jpts ll~Hler two headings. ( 'rl}H;nml\Yi.. alth and ll ~111 W8. \"3-, to the 0-~~tcnt r,{ £275,056, so that thc llvct cx;;r;~s of tho w r:1. 1·c•\·c:nue rn~cr thC' c·~··irnatcd l'C'Ycnue

Tho e figure ... how a. healthy in (\ncPnslnnt! so br as tho and rc-svur._'PS of the people

Lnt jf thosr~ '·ho [i t·o re ~pan­on r he busi'!.tes-, and

Sta tt-~ ha cl nc,t in

Jfr. To_;;1or,]

7SO [ASSE:.\IBL Y.] Supply.

:, r ars gone by 1nade provision in some way for the future, they \\ould not haYe been able during last y('nr to find such a trenu:ndous revenue for the Tre:tsurer. It was not made during the past ycal'. The Treasurer esti­mates the roYenue for 1921-22 at £12.270.689. Those are Yory big figures, as 1 ;.hall show la~'-'r on by a con1parison with prcn·i.._nls ,-ear.; but, -...\·iti1 an L'stin1atcJ eXlJC'l' Jinn~e of £12.735.727, they mean a deficit for Qncens­laucl of £405.038. That dciicit ha, to be proyidocl for. Personally. I think it '"ill lw YL'l'Y n1u('h IuoJ·e than that; I 011ly 1l0p(" that the 1

1

rcasu1·er' '" estin1ate will be realised; but, if 111y judgu::.E'nt goc::; for an~·thing at all, I ontainly think that the ,.,_ ,-orwc· "-ili be less than he expc{'ts. Tbr> Jebit balance. a p_r the ...-\udil"or-Gen('ral's f:tat'_ilJent of ac-:·ounb for the year omli>d ::50th J \lJ:l'. 1920 '·d. £426,609, so that on 30th J nnc next we shall be faced with a dcfrcit of £891,647. That is not too bad frolll l'<·opl<' who talk about Ludding financiers, and people butting into the iinancial arena 'rbo k"ow almost 11 ,:l1ing about finance. I thiuk tLat n1ost won ,-ho are in receipt of £4 a ,,-eek and

srwnding £5 know that it will not be before t h<: ba li IT ID k( ~ 1 '"·'""'"ion. It

dot:s not require 1nuch financial kno·\Yledgc foe anyo11c to know that; aud that _is exactly ,, hat will take 11Jac~' iu QuC'mi:;:;lnnd .. unless "Yf' can uwke our f-inaLccs :.,-Juare iH the future betb:_r than in the pa.:,t, A good d~~al ha~ b"Pn said during thir· (hba1c as to the ereJit duo i:o the Go\'Cl'Illll0lh for fin:n1cing (lnPFn~land. It i-> rHnarkabk -that tlu_• :\[l'tro­politan \VatLr Supply and SL \\"c_•rage Board haYc been ~ucec~~ful in pL_!('i!lg' £1.(''0

1000

' orth of ddJcntnres. GO\'EHX-'IEX'l' ~VIE:\IBER: It sho~.tYs 1 he con­A~e· th'·.· ha \-e in Queen'?land.

:tit·. T_.:\-YLOR: Yes, I ~cy that oyrn- titnG --: :_1e confidence they h 'Ye in the 11Ptro-1Jolrt 1.n \Vatc'r S11ppl_v and Se\\ c r.:1gc Board aucl the '"'Ult of con!idcnce they haye in tbe Uoverninenr; lH'causc, if the" (i-oyenllnl'nt had bcc'u al.Jle to ru~sc that n1oney in London, :·ou can bet Your hfc thev \vould haye done :<o, The boai·d Jwye bccrl able to raise that ll:lOl1t'"'' iu Lm1don 011lv bceausr thC' Govf'rn­n:C>nt ~ \1·c-rc v:illing to" forgo all their ri~rhts and privilf'ge:-: o;·cr the a':~ets of the b;ard ill Ltnmt· of the· debenture holders. and to c~Jmc iu as '-'c·c·otH.1 n1ortgagecs.

},f_r. BnE:\X.\X: Do yon object to their gt tt1ng that lTIOl1C2'?

~·fr. T\ YLOR: I do not object. ~1r. BHEXX.1X: ThPn. what al'; You gro\Yl-

ing- n_l-'rut? ~

:\1r. T \ YLOH: Y1m go to one of those foundries in 'roo ,-oon~ba a.nd get :·our head recast; tbPn ~·ou nug.ht con1o back with .sornc intelligence in it. Tbcre is llonc in it now, nt all cq•nts. It is ju,t as ,,-ell that the )JCople of QuocmlanJ should know exactly the position the_,, occupy to-clav. On 30th ,J,,nc, 1g21. the total clcbt of QncPnsland was £80.744,559. I am not afraid of a dr•bt like that in a State like this, ]lrOYidcd the monev 1'3 v r:ll spPrJt. .A S1a.tc like thi~ h~s nothing to be rrhaid of. But ,-bat I clo want to poinr out is that on 1Jth J LUl('. l0.iO, thP public debt '""s £69.6::0.763. \Ye increased tl,o public debt in that short period of twelv-e n1cmths by no less a Sll1ll than £11.063.ono. That is, we llrc acldin~· h our public debt at the present time at ~the rate of about £1,000,000 a month, \Vhat are we getting for that £1,000,000 per month? Ca,n

[Ll-Ir. Ta,ylor.

anYone· llu!Lfn!ly and honest!.' S[W that in Qt;ecn~L1nd to cLty things arc inlproying? Cn.n the (joycrn~ncnt or Govcrnrncnt sup­porter~ truthfilily and honest!~· tell the people of Qnconsland that thing-s in this g-reat State of onr·s arc in the condition tlwv onght to b· in 011 arconnt of thi~ tTe~ncndo~r~ expendi­turE"' of rnnn \-? 1 t?kc it no cne c1n lloncstly ,md tntthfnlf·: sa•: so. l!nfortuna.telv, we all kr~ow too "'t··ll thnt thing·s arc in nOt nearly flS good :1 ('ondition :1;;::. wv 1 vould lik0 to see tlH'lll. ln en1L;id0rlug nwttcr . .;:. of flnance, it is rt>Hl1v tir,le tbnt a h:1Jt \Yas called so far as th( c t eo t .xing- ant:writies of the Cc)nlnlonv:enlrh t!nd tbc: :State arc (·oncerncd. \YC' lHIYe ihr :D\>clernl GovcJ·nn1ent in 11eJ­b(;urnc-al_l]Hll'('lltly without YL'r;.- mttr'h l'l'gard to the t1hi!it:,· of th(" propl<' in this far ~~onhent Stat(• to 11ay-pi!in:.; on their taxa­t;o 1 ',Ylii(h j., fol!o'n'd 1111 b~- this Gc:YC'rn­n.H -;~- nilitJu· ~n riH'ir tw:,..-'ntio,n. Thn result l" · · thL' crippling of tlv' induo:trics of thi< There i, not the healthy expanf3ion that oi}e \Yould like to sec in Ol~T Sta.tc to-JaY. EYC'l'Y rnan who is n, patriot1o and lo:·al C,luccnslarldcr is delighted to _sec and to know that tbo State is progrcssmg and ach·ancing: but \"' J cannoi- S8Y to-day that ow· State is progrC'"',illJ and adYanc~ng in the wa:~ it ought to bf) doing, eonsider1ng thP in11ll('l-:.sr ;:uuount that is going lnto the eo.f-Ic:::.~ of 1ho UoYPl'llrtll'nt. It 1-:; jnst a.s -well ut n tin1c like thi" to go hnek and look at a little ancient historv \\·ith ,.cr,·arcl to the finance of this State.,

l\fr. RY.\X: (;o baek to the 1o ·,-_,\·age days.

2\Ir. ~L\ YLC.•.it: I hil\C ,,-urb•d for low v.-ages. I 11HL!Tiec1 en £2 lOs . .a \reek. r1nd sin: t' I ha.\Te ncYer lookf'd back. Th:-, is r.ll tinpDt t;\ addle ab'lut lovv wages anJ •· 1;ag~ s1aYPS." I c.Juld -do 11l•Jl'e on £2 1Qs. H I "k than any man Call do to-day 'n h 1 wct'D £4 and £5. ,.,,t hon. members oppc -iir toll '" of the splendid t!rings they ha\-c dnrF f(H th;: \nH'kcrs of tln:'; country. Th('\' haYC' not donC' nnvthing at all. By thci~· lC'l!;i.-dation and thCir aLln1inistration, and by the ''tripe'· they dcld out wed;:_ after week: aJHl yca.r after year. thL'Y nrP s1n1ply imJlnn·ri,·hinr:· the whole of the people of this State.

~Ir. BRL\-:\.'X: Thrrc \YCl'e no cash regis­h'J'S in those da:. J.

:\Ir. 'l'A YU'R: :'\o; hey 'nmlrl want one if You \YPrr in charge.

~Jr. \Ynn: \Yho " pinclwcl'' the farmers' produce'?

:\Ir. RYA:\: You ,,-ould like the 'nn·kcrs to go b tck to 15s. a week.

2\Ir. TA YLOU : I ne,· er 'nn·kPrl for 15s. a \YC't1 k C'X{'ept whf'n I wa~ a young:-;tf'r. and \Yhcn I did I (1 llrned it. ThP }lUll. lllClnber could not enrn 5s. at anY time. Lrt n1P ouote the IC'YCT1UC and es.pc;Hliturc fur SC\-cral ,~ears b.~ck-.., Rc\·cnnC'. Exppnditnrc.

1911-12 1912-13 1913-14 1915-16 1916-17 1917-18 1918-19 1919-20 1920-21

:£ £ 5,839.347 6.378.2]2 6,973,258 7.706,365 7,8S0,893 8.491.481 9.415.5 13

11.293,743 12.601.031

5.965,692 6,372 097 6.962.515 7.671,573 8.134.3 )6 8.900,933 9.5c7.531

11,266,909 12.591,201

In the y<'rrr 1914-15. ,-hi eh ,,-as the last ~·car of t.hc Liberal A-dministration, the reycnue

Supply. [16 SEPTE}lBER.] Supply. 781

wr,s £7.202.658. and in 1920-21, the last year oi the prcccnt Administration, the revenue 1vns £12,601.031. ~ho,Ying an i11crca-sc over 1914-15 of £5.398,373. \Vhat have we to sho"· for that inrrcaS!?d revenue?

l\1r. ERE:\::\ x: lt shows progress.

TIIr. T XVT~Cm.: It shov·s State stations, the fbh 1J<' inc".::. and State cntcrnrises from one end of tlw State to the otht•i·, in which thev !IaYc simply been losing- hnuclrecls of thonf:lallf1j of pounds of taxai ion which has been t"ken out of tho hard work of the p0opJr. of tbis ~.t-dc. rrhat is \Yhat VV8 have to ~ho, for that jncl'Casc,-1 revenue, and \VG hn.Yt' i-he hnn. lllC'nh.::r for rrooY\'OO!l1La in ac:dition. \Ye haYc had rr>~pnn~iblc Govern~ nteltt i 1~ Qt,PC'IF land for < bor~t sixty ycars1 and the tout! r],•ficits during that time have amonnte,] to £5,054,641, nnd dnring- this Uo\··=·rnm;.r1~'s six vcars of office thev haYc lwd Jc:icib anwLn"itJg to £034,932, ,:hich is nrv one-fifth of the total dcticitA 1na~lc a period c.f sixty years.

:J.lr. FcT:r The Tory Govcrnn1ent of \Ye~t\'l'n A11stra-lia hnvc V an accnn1ulated t!dil·it of £3.000,000.

}[!-. 'L\YLOH: I am talking about Qu .. •:"'nsland, aud I arn sorry that the hon. n1cmLt r thclll .. f.ht I ,Yas talki11g about VVc9tcrn An~tralia. r:rh(_~ total surpluses in Quccnsl 'nd during th t pr•riod of f3ixty ~vcars have au01u1lt J to £2,675,557, while the present Cion•rnn1C'llt h.--ye got to-;cthrr a little over £71,000 in curplcN' ', The Treasm·cr antici­]Jat•s n Yf'rY ronsidcra blc falling off in reYC'lHlC' fr(n~1 various forn1s of taxation.

\Ye all regTet that. I haYe in [5 p.m.] rn.v poC'kct a letter :-;ent b;,~ one

of the leading Brisbane softgood.-. hnu~c~ to one of it3 g}wrcholder:i-I preo...umo lr '~'as Cil 1 to all of their shareholders. rrhey t :ll bin1 that, 0'' ]ng to the slump in prices and the· depression in trade, they find it .,, ill be quite impossible for them to declare a dividPnd for the half-year ended 31st ,Tuly !act. Their experience is not going to be peculiar; it is going to be the experi-­ence throughont the leng-th and breadth of ihio Srato. I han been told to-dav that the CollllllOil",(><_dth Bank is goin;; vto nego~ tiatc the propo"'cl loan on behalf of the f-lL·'''· I ho]JC it is true.

J\Ir. Gn.Dw: They know this ic the best State in the Connnon,\ealth.

:C.Ir. TA YLClR: Tf that trcmcndouo anwunt c£ moncv '"ere taken frorr1 tho industries and the iH'O),Je of Queemlancl, it would CL'eat~ Ycry rnuch 1norc nnemploy1nent than cxist'3 to-day.

A good Lh·al has been said in this Chamber in cotmt·d1rm \Yith t11•J raihv tvs. I a.rn satis~ liPd th .t, if our railwnvs had. been free from political colikol and 1nfluenco, they 'vould !F'! 1-' in the parions condition the·. aro jn tn-chv. If hol!. members on both sicfcs "'ould Olll,Y O"\Yl1 up to t b(~ truth, thev would ar'knovv~ lcdp;c that to lJc the case. 'In the Railway Dcpart:IIL'l!t t.o-J -'Y tl10 hcaJ.s cannot di;:chnrg~c anyolH' ''nthout con:::nlting the l\1inister.

l\1r. \YEn{: That is absolute nonse:1sc.

:\Ir. rJ~A.YL~)~: It i~ 1~ot non:,cns.e; it is an ab:"J1Ut·-. faCL·, aud 1 can prove It. But it dor not do to say the thing'' you would hkc to say bc,"ausc down would come the axe on the poor nnfortuna tc man for ·whon1 you were tr"·ing to do a good turn. \V o hav'" the evidence which JYlr. Steer gave in the Arbitration Comt the other day. Can

.van und~·r~tanLl, at a ti!IH' lik( tl1is, \vlh~n tht:rc i;:; so tnnc:h. unPPlplo,vmcut and n1cn aru ]1, ing dic·charged from the Raihvay Depart­ment, the men in the department a'king the Arhi!J",tion Court for a fresh mYard '? This I.absur Gove1'nn1ent arc their 0\V..'l Govcrn­TYH:nt. It i'3 the n1cn \Yho are pushing the GoYC'rnmL nt frm:1 behind and doiug whatever they c-an to prcn'nt the ,1 follo·, ing their O"\Yn dlctah'''·, y,·ho are canslng- all the trouble to Quc-~_•ns1nnd.

Hun. \Y 1-L BARXES: The raihv,c•· men do 11:1t thenl as their GoY(Tlllllcllt no,Y.

::\Ir. TXYLOR: ~.Ir. Steer tell' l>' that in 1920-21 the dcp"rtrnc11t carneLl £5,279,000, \Yhilt thf: workin3· exr··:nH" ~·,·rre £5,043,000, lc•_t\·ing a net rc··cnUl' o£ ouly £231,000, equal to 10". 7,\<1. )1cr cPnt. on the c ,pit. 1 invccted in th(~ railv>a'.'S. \Yo haYe Lccn accuston1c{-l to looking- up~Hl Oltr raihYa=·, ns our greatest os::-L't. Thc'y arc, brrau::e l110l'C than half of the nnblic cldJt o£ this St>Jt~-ver, nearlv £50,000:000-has be' 1 expended in the cmi~ str_lCtion of our railv a_ys ancl rn·oYidiEg the n1atcl'i _,l 11( ·'c.~ ary to run thrrn. \Vlwi1 we consider that tho-c £50,000.000 are e".rning· ouly 10;.;. 7~l1. ]JC'J~ rent., and t1w interest on the n1onev expended i 3~ llPl' cont. to 4 peT c0nt.--,··l1il'h ,.,·ill b(~ inrreascd verv consider­ably in +-he near {uhtr,~-ho-;-· arc l'>:e going to cDntinne? That is not the \~·c,rst bf it.

At 5.5 p.HL, The C'HAIIDIAN resumed the cha.lr.

J\Ir, TAYLOR: Add £1.!:00,000 to the J.cficit on our raihYay<, anJ. we flud that dLJring the ;-ix vears of Labour administra­tion th, v hnvc gone to the bad to the extent of about £6,500.000. Could you have a grPatc1· indichuent of the COlllllC'tcEc of any GoYcrinncnt to C.llTV on tho .affairs {Jf the• State than sueh figufcs, ·whieh arc absolutely cnrrect nnd regarding "·h-ich an:~ nwn ca.n satisfy hin1&?lf of from tho variotB reports that we get here fron1 ti1nc to tirnc. 1-:Iow long arc we going· to continue in that way? \Ye cannot go on fDrcyer. It is au ah·olute fact tlut lfYCr_l penrr~· lo .t in any industry has to be n1ade gooJ. from sorr10 other indu~­try. \\'hat industries have we to make this good '? The Sf)tuce3 of taxation ha vc been drained to the lowest depth>. It is quite in1po:.~iblc to g<2t any great a1nount of addi­tional ta_,,ation out of the people' of Queens­land or of Auetralia. They haYo b'cn bled white in order to bolcter up el!t.erpriecs and the financial ma.ladministration of the Govern­Inent) who h~,vc bt \•n running,· this f'ountry on a fitJancial jazz. for :\~cars past, aJthDugh hon, mc.mhers on this side repeated!.~- pointed out what the Government mig·ht e :poet if they cont inncd on the r~1urse the.~,7 were pur­t:uing. Thc-y did not take any notice. 'l_lhcv broaght in legiJation which created a trc­rnonclou an.onnt of difli,_ultv. and the sooner that. lf',r:-jsLhon is remoYc 1 ·fron1 the statute~ book 1 ho lwttcr it wi 1i be for the State. }lon. n1ernbers OPlJosite tell us \VC nre intcr­fc·ring with doaH_ ,tic legislation. Th(-'Y kno\v it is not un int~rfPl'enc,.~ with doine.;;tic lPgis­lation. Ali that the men who have money to lend this country ask is that the Queens­land Go,-crnmcnt shall play the g-alJ\e, Thm· know .r_s well as f'Ycrvone here ktHJWs that the a,,scts of Queensland haYe not •'eprcciatccl onn ponm·. "'!o man can gBt up and truthfully decrY or defame the State. To criticise the GoYernwent and point out the effects of their financial maladministration is a differ­ent thing from defaming tho fair name and

Mr. Taylor.]

Supply. [ASSE'YIBL Y.] Supply.

honour of tlw Stat-e•, Nir. St\'l r g0c>-" on t·) ~ay-

The i1:t0rest clwrgc \Vas £1,812,000, ~o there was a los~ of £1,581,001l for the· year; nohvith8tanding thi,,:) rates and fares had not been in,rcased for nearlv three years.' 1 ~

Yet \YC find that Lusi!Wh h'"' rcccmtly ishcd considerably. The fidurc:; I refe1· to 30th June. :\Ir. tltecr tPlts drift is sii!l cu"1tinuiug. llc• :-'a~·~~

Jimin­qnotccl u..; the

'· Durino: tlw six 111011tho 30th J Lm· lasLL 900.000 fc•wer train were run than ill the pn'viou:' hnlf yc·ar, and the cash takiug~ had been £406 10JO l·>'!s. In the Jnst tvvo HYHlths (,,JnJy and the receipts 11 ere £88,000 L":pcnclitut·c• £39.000 grc:ttnr sa.nlC' Jnouths of last yPnr.''

Thc.t :-)in1ply :nH•ans a catastropho to this c-Juutry if thr rail !,','ays do not g·ct any betterJ and >H' shaH he in for a r: oil v bad t.ime. \Ve nckno,vlcclge tlw fact that the railways have done a good dual in the past for Queens­land! but tiw~· urt' not doing it at the prcsc:nt tinlL'. I f(.'el satisfied that if tho 1ne-n IYho are jn C'olltrol of tht.: raihvavs "\VCr8 given the C'pporiuuity thPy :::honld l~·ave, y,·C'

wuu1d nut. be drifting' in the way \VC are at he present t iu1r-. During· this disoussicn "vo

have he[nd f1 little about oconomv. You "' ou1d put nc:u 1~T ever: Jrtl' out of' V\.ol'k if yon practi.":>eLl the t ouomy ~orno P' ople aclvot t.tf'. 'That would bo which would IHJrk out 111c-::t injuriously this. Statr: and to Australia. 'Th·~ irn ports for the t,,,,_,l-t:o Hli:.!llths end·_d ou 30th ,June last antountcd to £163,330,000 fur tlw wholr~ of tho C~nltllU1IH. ~~nlth: ~9 per ce_nt. rrwro tna11 tnc prcnou.;; recorJ, \Yhu:;h

i~1 1:,18-19. That is the f1t:Jrl. The 1 op1r'

Quecn-hnd a11d the Au]tralia out 1nlpcn 1 c;

of ln,-c rnuch wor:-:2 than for the Ce,rnn1o1nvc .:.Gth June ]r: t "· cro Yalucd o..--l onl"'.~ one occasion \\'LiS.

u cded,' an cl that v:as in va1nc of the oxports r-;c11t frcn1 traJiu ww- £149,823,509. ln report o£ the trade return:; of tho Conuuon·~. ealth appears tbe fDllowing paragraph rolating· to cxf'r·~~ of ox pe-rt~ :-

"EXCESS OF EXPORTS.

" Taking th0:;e figures, it " ·ill be seen that thoro has been an aggregate excess of export" amounting to £65,085,807 in the seven years. Previously to the war an excess of exports of at least £14,000,0,00

[Mr. Taylor.

a year was r<'quired to pay interest on public debts and di,-ic!c>nds on private inn''tmente in Australia. During the war, and sine('; the States, o1nitting the Con1n1onvv:: alth. increased their obliga­tions to Great Britain b:, £205.000,000,

J that nolr an annnal ('XC:C35 of expc~rt::~ of at lcn't £24.000..000 is required."

\Y(' find that dming the year 1919-20 the import;; into (~EC'C'Y!sland 1Yl'l'f' \·aluc--d at £7.218.694. while in the year 1920.21 they incrcawd to £11.828,872. Oltl' exports for the :·ea1· 1919·20 amonntecl to £14,403,922, and in the vear 1920-21 the: increased to £15.21 1 .. ~49. ~~ th- t ollr figureS ~how np "-Ql!. \Yt· had (ln f xce~ . ...: of exports last v-_"ar. If \\·e ta!~·::.- the whble of the Conunon\YCdth, hu-·, PYc·r. ~.:c· find that the i1nports have uro\Yn to such an enonnous extent thnt it is .~in1ply f'ripplillg' our eoFntry. and rnonoy \d1ich ."hould Le spent in Luiltling np our l)·,yn iudlt::,trics is being sent alJroad. \Vith n:'gar~~ to uncr11ployn1e:nt, any hon. n1c1nbcr < Ul take the figurf'i fron1 "KnibLs,'' and he 11 ill Jltlcl that Que<>nsland has more nrcmploy· rnent than any other State in i.ho Con1mOll­,. calth. In the tal.Jlo showing the percentage nf unt'11lployJYlC'Ht, ·we iind that ihe pcrccnt­<lf:S''-'~ for last year of the clifft·l·cnf, States ''.l'L' :-:\'n,· South \Yule'. 6.9: Victoria. 7.3; l,'m'''"'land. 16.3: Sollth c\wtralia. 5.1; \Y( -tl'l'll Au::;tralia. 4.8; and Tr -:11anin, 3.0; n·hile che a\·e1·agc for the IYhole Cornrnon­Wf'ahh 1yas 7.8. Those arc _figure, which no one \'111 dispute. During the debate it. ha,s lJC'-n stat0d that thero is a larg-e number of nnPtnployed in Queensland. Tlll~ P1'61nicr put'5 the whvlc ntlmbcr at 5.000, Uut, if .<J.ny­onc lookF through t,h. fignrcs for the various to1Yns frmn 1vhich returns are given~ h~ 1vill iind that thcv onlv re:fcr to one or two trndca ;1ud occupation , The fl~HUP'i are also giYen onl: for a {e.,y toiVll'-; quite a nnrn1wr of

11ot b0ing Inentionr:d at all. Th ~t not gi\-e a true indiration of the number

nnCL!.lploycd in QnefnJand. lf we tako p!aee.: like lp~-wich, Toov1omnL J, and other t ;\nJS. -there a.rc. porhn11~) four or fi,·e indus-

. trades thc._t Hr · not nwntionod at t is qui,e possible that the number

uf unenq-lJoycc1 in (!uccnslancl is not far off or 15.000. '\Yo kno1;; Yen; y;cll that

hns br~n do!lC t.o try to Give employ­the J1COlllo. 'The Covcrnu1ent say

not got the money. l do not that they ha Ye gut the rnone.-, and

cJ.nnot \vages if ,YDU ha.ve not got is to b! amo fer that. and

for the unmnplo~,7n1ent? for the fart that tho

not rrot n1onc~Y to-d~1y to acti.-itics? · ·

The IIO:\IE SECRE'L~RY: Do you know nnv Gon::orn1ncnt that could n1ce't. the cucunl­~tcJncc'- of a drDp in Inct-.I prices thro~.ying 6,000 1ncd out o{ ,-,ork O'<Ying to a slnn1p in rnlning?

:\h. T:\ YLOE: The mon0v which the Co\·t:rnnH nt ha' e r0ceiycd \\'"h~lc' they ha.ve

would ha.-e been sufficient. if c"pcnded, to ub,,orL the whole

1tr1e~1ployed in nueensland at the present time. The unfortunate position is that the mor,oy has not Lcon judiciously L'xpendcd. If the Homo Secretary could r,nly get rid of the Chillagoe Yonture and a lot cl other ventures at the price they c;Jst tho Govornn1ent, I an1 sure he vvould gladly do it.

Supply. [lG SEPTE~fBER.] Supply 783

The HmrE SrxmET\1.\_Y · Explain how any Govcu1ment could n1PC't tho r1rrurustanccs I have rncnt10;1ed \11th the slnn>p in the price of mctale.

Mr. TA YLCR: It i' ra.thcr a sorry posi­tion whn1 the ;\llinistcr has to stand up in this Honsc and ask the Opposition how to carry on the Government. Tho Gove~·nmcnt were told long ago what was gomg to happen. It "·as pointed out to them time and tinte again, and no\V tbcy have got 1nto a l10sition that thcv cannot extrie~tc them­selves from. They ·know pc•rfectly \cell they cannot out of the difficulty they ha.ve gDt in~l. tlwy arc tJ~y rv·ople largely responsible for the po~ition to-day. Thi ~. is 'vhat tbe Sy·chH'Y .. Bu1k n1' sa.ys about tho pcsition-

can1c into grown Ui)

tltaSS(-; had a ern ring for CioYd'Hrncnt c\vnership. In tha.t faith .flu~~nt rnd an1bitious young 1ncn rnet p<.."riodi~ully 1 at ,Lab~ur /'01~~- rc:nct_ls ar,td denlarKtc•d tne natwnailsatwu of this, thni. ancl the other thing. :\Iany of them got into "i 'n rlianH'nt a rH l ·\, ur<:' rnm1orous t'nough t\) forn1 I\linistrics. rrhey began the of 'n!J tioHali:-;ingl HH '..t shops a.nd :-Lop.:. pul;, and sawtnill.s 1 bricll> works. fllHl jrnplcm.rnt factoril'f'. and a

of otlwr tinpot cnt.~rprises, in to raihYa \'S, I.YatenYork~. and

;.Jt.hcr puLlic utillti('s~ which are lcgitin1ato 0xun1plcs of public o\,·nership; and the

carrit_d to rioto;:'i lengths. has a {'21 i;·.m irons rr .. ·ult. 'i 'ia; Labour

!.Huty'i had not. a 1_nonopol:y of ,th~; craze for StntP c:tpl1:ah...:nJ. LibCl'dl \...roYern­mcnt.s practis,·d it ~ ·; well as Labour t~o1:ernnH'1Jts, though 11ot t·J tho smne 0xtcnt. They, too, v;,·l'r(~ under the imp)~ .-;ion tbn_t the yea.rnctl for the wn1ti1)licatioJJ Uo\·.;_~rnluE:mt inutilitiP_-in CLllT<'llt jargou

1 • the cxL~n­

"ion of tlv' economic functiot" of the Statc'-nnd ha~tcu-cd to jH'o\·idc the ;!rticle, nc-tuatcd b\' 1 he~ sanH' Ull\Yorthv dc,ire of Yotcs. fu rho ha.nc1'"l of these rnob-flattoring Go\~f'nuncnts, eYen rail-

t1 y.-; and \\·a:tennn·ks v,- ..:re ·degraded to lcYl'l considerations o11'crcd to pur-lDlC' in ·exchar:~:e for their

Thc.:.e c:'lpcrimcnb ~-Jaii Jn~li~n-b:C'H · a quarter

<.t~·c plain adckl Thcv

ccntndisc~l of The·~~ have

c;ca t<:d hngc en:] l!oyocs. 1n:1s~-Yotc is a constant n1cnacc.

been ~ ft•rtilo sonrc(l of strikes forn1s of discontent. for in

tlw nrrtur(' of thing:-::. son1t' of the 01 ergro\Yn and Ul11Yiddly

Glil extort better ~crtio~B. nnd in

and drTn:1 nd is11.t enoug-h ruont".Y to go

The t]J

T ~\ \:~LCHt: ha n' not d, neratQd; :it Jny fri{·nd who ha::; degenerated. l-lo 18 getti11g a good C-on:;;crYative. I-Io Ul'cd to ha.vc the ·· Builctin ,. under hie pillmv, but now lw ,,-ill have it und<Jr his foot. The fa~-t re1nains that thr ,; Bulleiin" is still a champion for the rig-hts of the people of

Australia, and when the hon. member for Bowen can bring; along a b"ttcr Ol' more clcvpr writer on economic subjects than those who control the Sydney "I3u!lctin," he will ha.ve accomplished something·. Up till the present tin1c thaT writer has 11ot put in an a-ppearance.

The finance, of thP State vru uot malt<·rs to be trifled with, and, if tl1c Government only carriNl out what tl1cy bdievcd to be rjght anJ took no notice of those Y\·ho are trying to rnake the:m d.u certain things I fcPl balidbd that a good many State cnt<·r· prises would bC' cut out 1Yitlliu n n1on1·h. 'J'hc failure of State tntcl'prises larf,<:.'h arises h·o:.n the fac thJ.t there i::; no ro>,tinnitv in the rnannge11_wi~t ,?f thc~c affu ir~. Go"~/eru­nH 'its {;0111(' and \ ~~n~E'rllments go. nnd vd1cu a nPw admini~tration into po\ver th-ere i:::. pr·~JLabl:, 1;ot JH•a tho intPrf'~t t,lkPtt in an <~ntf•rpr!."'e tho;;,e who \Yere previou~ly and as long· as e\"er the·.E~ trollod in .he wa1r the,­th,3 SU~tP Contintle to vlOSP

sands of pound~. Jf actual tabulated sho\\ iL~' nc•:t1on \vith la r--and the other li;d_dl~ lJ,· octi,·+.~· ·,· ouid ·be

Mr. \Y"\ RRE~·; (Jlw'l'l tinw t ho GovclT!ll1eHt -uggP.;tio:ns. not 01dy D,

Lut of hon. in l he govcrnn~eut I-Iouse u1ct. much of round tl"' credit aud \\'C had R

~- hjmilar lt3hll'c If I \Ye re tu o -k other side "·hcther

on an Joss0:3 Ios~f'S been

homr to the old (•11 (~nc~ew·Jrn;_d, that w.:ts

1nembe1· "·ould ~ ~v Bnt

tt·uth in th<:tt weut hnrne for tlw erihe

the ·e is a!J,olutC:]y no tlwt the deteg.1tion

n sponsiblcc in at tho

.how in clclega~ pr-c:;::,f'Jlt \Ye f!nd

ill Olll' C·O\'Cl'llllH'llt

fuhtr('. It i--; con1~ that vnr variou.g

stock:; arc not in ono instance, on the. London Stock Exchong;c, quoted below those of oth~r S+.-~te,"! a.nd different is"'uf-~S arc E·tc.d higher than three of uny State. That s <rs a deal for our credit."

This is a. deliberate statenwnt in cold blood bv the Treasurer. and most of it is the most u'tter rubbish that could be dealt out to ,p,.11y thinking people. If there were a union of

Zvir. Warren.]

784 Supply. [ASSE;iiBL Y.] Supply.

boot-blacks, tlwy would prcpar~ a. better Statement than this. You could not find a 1nenial o1nployec ·who hus a rceognised union who wonld procluco su~h u stupid StatenH~nt as the ono 'iYC haYe before us. 1'he Statement is only a \Vilfnl 1nis1·epresen­tation of fads, Le' wsc th·l Treasur,'r ha" told us in cold blood that our ci·edit is better than that or any of the other Stnt<' of Austra Jia. I wunt to di"cuss this question fro1n a Ji~pa~sionate point of Yiew, so that -..,ye may make some sngg-::tions that will help to ~et (luecllshuld out of the preMcnt dC'plor­abl() pos.ition. I quite recognio c the diHicu!t!t" ·with \Yhich hon. nicnlLH:r.:; opvc 'jit~_, arc frtcL·cl. 'l'hrre is no donLt thJt thf ir own fo11o\\-crs, or those \Yho \Ycrc their O\Yll follo·wers, haYc not h eatud them well; end up till r, ·:cntl_ my sy:aJpathiL''3 '' Cl'D \Yith thmn, a!ltl particu­larly \Yith :~vlin]stcrf'. I sa\; cYen hon. llH?Ll­

bcrs let do\Yll ~Iinistcrs in the }lous(\ and outside the :House the g1·o:._•dy \n_n·ker h"is condantly be( n a-,~;;:ing for _.ornething that no bu- in cf-. Govcrnnlf'nt could grant. J\' o Govern­ltlC·:lt that ~avo in.to ih~·sc pt~;:ple. could. have COl118 ont 011 thG nght Slfle. J_ho flglue~ C{)ll­taincJ in the Stat:Eement aru ab,olutciy \Yorth­lo·,s bee lll:":C -..--e haye not the .\udit n·-Generfll'~ rC'y){Jrt.

:Mr. C'OLLIXS: Blame the Auclitor-Gencral.

Mr. WARRE~: I , ill not bl >me thu Auditor-General; but if I had a sccrotar_, and he di cl nCit ha Yo his l'('l10l't out ;.:. t the right tiJ lC I would pay him off. If it h<Ls boon the practice in tllo past that the _.'_\uditor­G{_nera]'s r..__,pori has not. been plac ;d before this IImue pn.:\ iou~ to the di~;l'tw:ion un the Financial Statontent, it is a disgracP.

Hon. \\·. DERTR.DI: The Auditor-GclHlral's Teport has rJ\Jt been placed on the ta.ble hcforc October for many y'_.U's.

Mr. WARREN: If that has been the prac­tice in the past-and I accept the hon. gcntlc­n1an's statcm.,nt that it is so--it is a di~grace to the Government who have control!cd the bnsincsP.

Hon. \\-. BEHTR\1I: The Government have nothing to do with it.

Mr. \V A RREN: The Go-- 2mmcnt should ha vc somethin;; to do with it. The Auditor­Gcneral is the servant of the Government, and he should do his duty; he should have his report here for our guidance so that we ma-, be able to )lllt the acid test on the figt;res submitted to this House. I will deal

, __ ith the figures as little as [5.30 p.m.] possible, because I think they are

unreliable unless wo have the authoritv of the _iuditor-Gencral for them. The total figures \\'ith regard to income and expC'nditure represent an onor1nous an1ount. \Y 2 finrl that Queensland, like the prodigal Fan of old, has b~,(ln spending its inheritanu~ ('xtr,~~ Ya.c_;antly. \"\,. e do not expect auy Govt>rnn1ent to Lo perfect, but the prc' t:nt Gon>rnmecnt have not been fair to the people o£ Queensland. \Yo hear about the lmt;c deficit on the railwa\ s, and we believe that the Stato ont.crprisesu are going to reveal a shocking state of things. \\'e find that the 'Treasurer is preparing the Conunittee for son1ething of a Yory serious nature. The hon. gentieu1an, in estitnating tho revenue fo1· . the year, allows for a shrinkage in revenue ; but, if the shrinkage continues. as there appears to be eYery appearance of its doing, the estimate he gives is ridiculous. \V e ha vc to face the position, and it is the duty of every hon. member to investigate the

[Mr. Warren.

.accounts of rhc GoYC'rnment. It se(·n1S to 1118'

that we ~~ant so1nc destructive criticis111, and not n1crely the con~tructive crit'ieisnl whieh j-; tnlked about. 'rhc Uon~rnrncnt haye got into a bnngl<'-" Fatt~-~' ..._-\rbuckle is nothing to it~-and [HO \vaiting for son1ething to tul'n u~>. Can :,~nu L1Ye a \Yorso spectuc:e than that' \Ye hcord from a previous speakct that the lean clif!iculti<'s are brushed octt of the wa \' fn1· a tillH'. I adrnit tha+ '''e lTIUst Jwye ~rlnllL'Y to 6'0 D:J -with, oven if \YO have to ack!JO\Yl('dge that the GovcrtHnent only spt_•nd 50 pt>~· c·ent. of jt in a righ,, \vay. The best way o£ gntiJJg n1oney woulcl ho from nu~ ,1c1r: ::·nurct•:o. but th ls. impos'-'iblP undc1·

hon. 1ncrnh::.r fo1~ we r:1ight expect

and a t·c•turn to pro:::-1, :To us State. I he!iDvc he an I think it

a~ long for the tide io turn n~ it took iu going out. \V e

fncc tl1c: cliffic,Il.Lies of our position. t;.,1 soon1'l' '"C do it in a bnsinc.s way

jt. ~.:jll Llo for Qucen·.1and. The iu One, nsLu1d has ab:c: v' been the to pltt eft scttlr:n10nt of these diffi-

11rc1bkm". rrhe GoYf'l'nll1Cnt put off notification of t1w plague; and we snrr~· 'twdac-lc the other dr.· of a

nwdc about thL pla-;nc~ in this It i, c ·entia! that c.mfidcncn

restored in the Stat-·, and it is cur dut:· to help ~:he GoYornincnt to bring that about. \Ye \vill not back up men who <a~· bankruvt iu rcsourccfnlncss. hnr. jf the Go-.t•mnwnl- ill chow us that t!Jc·:: are going· 1'l) do :-nnlclhinv. \Yt.1 will brrrk them up. \Yhcn I ~r,'; that the Treasurer had the d;t Jllt(•r:Y '>) p-et. up and read the li']nanclal Statf'm.cnt hi,::h ho put beforf' us, I felt ;,shnucd to think that ,ye had a GoycrnnH~nt W~tich ~~,ould tolerate it. \V 8 vi-ant to see a rcviYnl o£ tr.u1r: <lnd goocl go~:erninent.; but pne of our ·:Tcatf'"t tronl)lc'! is that tho Goyornmcnt are not honc_u.:.t. That is shown by the attitude they take np in regard to questions which aro a,,kcd in the IIouse. ::\:Iinjstt,rs rC'fusC> to give iuforrnation "Yhich i-' '"ked for b}- l'CJHC'-cntatives of the pcopk. If lh•• dir er-tors of a comjlany rcfuood t<:> rlintlgc information to the shareholders, such action \Yould not ht; tolerated, and thov would be promptly brought to account. \Ye can se'J that affair. in the State are drifting, and ir \\oulcl not hllrt the GoYemment to let us know the t.rne position at once, be8au::::e "re mu.,;t eventually fin cl it out. \\' e shall only br· able to sunnoud.our troubles in Quet'ns­lanrl 1-o-Jay by the wise and united effort of all concern< 1. If we arc going to Le o£ u· n to onr State. which we all think so nruch of-~, nd I think that feoljug is coH1iTIOn lu ,.11 members of the Chambcr--

~1r. FEn:ITCKt:): Is that wl1::;·, you art~ ahrays ~-JnndGring it·:

~1-fr. \VARRE:\": That interjection is not in accorda,1ce with the traditions of thic-; C~1an1bcr. Sorno hon. n1cn1bers cppoRite do not know :h0 difference behyr~·n slander and J1onr~~t criti('isn1.

}!r. F-· RRJCKS: Defamation.

:Hr. WARRE:"J: Thev do not know the difference b8tween the c'ffccts of th<' delega­tion and their O\'Vll stupid extraYagance.

:'1-Ir. FERR!CKS intcrj ec-ted.

::\h. WARREN: \Ve haYc no need to tear any labels off on this side, but there is no doubt that. labels are coming off hon.

r· on the oth0r side. ~e~.ortbl']f'~,,L,J thC\"' Gn en•rything cl,o <.ml trie.Q to govern

at tho ~a.nw tin1('. TherG i~ no doubt that th• lahr,J ,,·ill be iorn dov:n and trampled unci cl~ the fee~", as v;lll Pverything that i::; unholy. 'Vhy aro th~··,e unrea~onable objGc-tiow:; L t acro tho Chan1bcr '?

hlr. Fn:RICK"3: Bocau.~e you gi,·c us the opportunities; you are ahvays ~d ',ndering us.

Mr. \VARRE!\: BeccUSL' when anyonG is toll in:-: the trnt~1 thoy ''ant to prc,~cnt the peuplc llp in th0 ga.llcry frmn being able to taka it do\m. "' c had an oxh ihition a l ittlo while ab·o of dn attcn1pt to ttu·n this Cha1nber into >1 little Hnsoia, and to pole:1xo the press­Inrn.. (GoY> rnrncn+ di::;.·~''di.) The PrPSS iR a great blcc·-ing to Qt;orndand-lhc only saf0 thin..:- In\ have in Q,UC'C'llsland to-day is :10t the i"-',1 l'tit l't'fH'C~CLtcd ill this J-louse, but tJ,c Press.

Hon. J. G. "\I'FEL: .\n-d they want to gag the l'rrs-

Mr. WARRE:\": Yeo. they want to gag th._• Prco,, r_ 't U·· bn honest with ourselves and not----to u:sc a Ytllgari~nn-pull our o'vn 1£\gs. There is a reason why this propa­ganda w•.s introduced in this Chamber to-day --because there was ncYer such a wuYe of feeling going through the Sh t0 as there is at prr·,~:nt againRt this so-callrd Labour Government--a Government that never Jaboun:d. and v;hose only 1.vork is to ·~\·ork point'. (Laughter.) It 'io tillle wo hnd a Pn "' that put a -top to this eort of thing. It is tinw dece11t melJ on that oide of the Hous~. iJhtt'(hl o£ trying· to dr,,troy the only voice that }:._. crying to the pcoplo of Qur-en::;­lnnd, .stood ilP on their feet and protected it.

\V hat do -· <' find ;, the remedy of this wondertul Gon-_l·nmC>Ht for this state of things? ScienUfu taxation! It is like. an old !fi.dy 1vith gall stones going to a doctor for tre.:hnc -t a.nd t~'c""ting· so1ue ton1ato sauce. (LaughLr.) That i-; the rpmcd_v they give us-thf~ tonutto saure of scientific taxation. The workers thought that these pooplo were little tin. gGds. be~ause they were attacking the otnpH! <·aprtah•\s, but the WO!'kers have fornd out more quickly than these great fin:tnl'irrs that tlwy were wroi1g. I do not mind taxation of the man 1vho can afford it, nor do l mind paying my taxes, so long as there is an hone•-t attempt to govern. The hon. mcrnber f VI' Buw0n said years ago that the workers had to pay it all, and, nnfor­tun Jic<ly, that is the truth.

Ivlr. CoLLTN.S: This GoYernn1rnt neyer put on a p•oll tax.

:\ir. W ARRE:\': There is not a man on that side v:ho doGs not pa:v a poll tax. If he did nCJt, he wotdd not 'be th0re. Th•:ro is not on0 gentlen1a:n on this side who pays ono at all.

1\Ir. B ULcoo:: Be a bit clear.

3\lr. 'YARR.EJ\1: The! hon. n!ember knows that he has to pa v his union dues in order to p;ct into thio Cl1amber.

3Jr. CoLLlXS: J-Ia~,Te you not to be men1bcrs cf the Fanners' llniou?

Mr. W.\HREN: W" have not. The fact is tha,t the -.e g·cnf kmcD opposite ha Ye dis­cov•crcd toJ late thrrt thcv h;cve taxed tho State t..Jo h,, tvil_v. Peopl'O opposed to the Government lw \·r· afl-irmed, as son1e p('rsons fol1owing th0 Uon•nnnent have a .. drnitted, that thoro wa'· " limit to taxation; but hon. me m bc-rs on the other side ha'"" actually

1921- 3 c

7ui5

JnadC> a b0a-·t of their ~cil'lltilic taxation. Th(' f\\ 0 grC>a t J ( asoHs \'by \\'(' n re in 1 ho pl'-. ·:-liraJh.·Ht in l"hich we find oUrf'el-..-es to-da.v an•. fir~t of all. thnt. tL"• Uovc· nn1cnt Jnccldlt ·a ln f'-tutn entcrpri~p;;;·-~tiH•y h;•can1e t ·e·k'-

~'I e. COLLI:\~1: Do you -.,, a.ur u.:. to cut ont th,;:~; ~t:ttl' C:llll1C'l'J'?

::\Ir. V\' A R.REN: I wa11t 1 ht11n to C'nt it out; lhlt I ani thmu to hand it oYt\r to­<:l ('0-op ~·ntin~ cmnpa.ny, which cill haudl~ tiw fruit Lettt•r th<ln the ;:.:;iat; hun; do<Ju. LPt lllU in fairnc-.s--becauh_' l am nen~r guiJty of the nKJ.nnrss of tl'ying in thi0 Charnbe1~

,J destroy !3071H:thi:n:-.t i11 an Ullft:lf:lonabl\l,f

rnanncr-fet nH: in r'U.irnP;c,;.: to the muna£S,·­T1ll'llt. particuiarly to the C:on1Jnissione!' o£ 'Iradl', ;.,ay that, had it not been for that LJctoJ'V. the fruit incin,tJ"· v;"nld haYC b~en in a ·n1od critical conditjon.

·'\-fr. BuLC'OCK: Then. \Yhy C'ttt it out·:

:\h. \VARREN: A Y<'rV r< -• -•onablc qucs­rloll, vdli{'h cle~f'rYCS an an~,Y~l'. The answer i that, under a board of <lirector.s of a c·o-npcrati,·e corr1prtny, it l'nJtdd be 25 per c·cnt. nlt)fl' U:-:P to the cou11tr.v th::1n it i:-J.

1tr. 131T!A'OCK: \Y!Jy drop tlw mbi'tancc' f,,,. thP Ehado\Y?

}[r. WAHR!i::\i: Tbo hun. nwmht•r dot' not C-XQctlv understand what he is sa-ying. 'ThC'n"' i-, ·I!o ntch thing t•~ :shado1.-v about co-opPration. (lle~tr, ht!flr !) Co-operation i,; thP only thjng that is goiltg' to ~~:.tvc us fnnn dc·~truction. Th0~e gtmtlc1nrn OPl)CFite du not hc•lif Ye in co-operation.

:\h. CoLLINH: Point to ,y)wrc ll'l' han• 'LHH3

f!!lyth1Hg ngain~t it.

::\lr. \YAHREX: \\' c nwy,•d a rc·'O!uti, 1

hr•rc. :.nd hon. membl•rs opposite voted n.!.;ain.:·t it. If the GovPrnuH'llt ha·d g·onc in fl~r fq-opPration, insh~ad of the stupid rnove of trading, thPr would han~ been ,in the 1na'!nilicent position to-day of lHtYlng

1 ae

great n following as c-n'r ibcy had, ana of !icing· th.• '"vi ours of QuccH>land.

}Ir. Dr:LrOC'K: A lUOinent ago you said that the Statn cannery wa:;; the sah-ation of tho fruit industry.

Mr. \.YAitlU~N: Sonw people arc as small as tho ~hank~ on n)y gl[I_?'3PS. I wuntcd to give credit w.lwro it was dnc, but I said that it would have been 25 p('J' rent. better if it ha·d beGn under ro-operatiYe manage­ment. But the hon. rnomher "ill (]nibble oYer 'vords. \\'hy this, anrl \vhy that?­that is the old gag that has l>eon use•! in this Chamber; instead of ri>;ing to the posi­tion in which the people have pnt him, the hon. n1 "n1be.l· reverts to tho old soup-box interjection. \Ve wonld not bo here to-clay if it wr eo not for the desire to do some­t-hing for Qnecnslaucl. and for the workn as welL bt.'caus~. after all, the \Yorkcr is in tho grcai 111ajcrit:T, ancl an:v 111an with a.ny

- heart in his body and any brains in his hr:td \'.ants to bPncfit tile \Yorker. J,ut ure the GoY1:>rnmnnt benefiting the ·worker? I

ant. to dr:-t:~' tho attention of thG IIou::;<? to the fact that even the Premier. to bolsf•.r up his ca.se n little bit, S<\)"S thnt Knibbs's figures a-re all wrong_ Most likely they are wrong, but that they an' wrong on the 1>rong side. Jt, "·as not po~sible for lV1r. Knibbs to get all the rotnrns in connection "vith nnernploymc~nt. I will wager £50 with the Treasurer that there are not m a liJ'

Mr, Warren.]

786 Supply. [ASSEMBLY.] Su.pply.

fJI-nitted fror1 ~Ir. l{nibbs's figlll't~''· One hon. rnr ~nht_~r this u ftcrnoon sn id thtire were 600 in tho Cloncuny rli .hid.

~Jr. Vowr.~.d: Thoro ]:-; not that nu;nhcr of people in tht• t'locto::ate.

Mr. \VARRE:'\: 1t i" not the number of ·unen1ployed that 1 irot1bie about so n1uch, '" tho fact that they are iucroasinr: all the tinL. That i<-> •.··hy 1 have r1~.cn -to-night. I did not gr:t np to-night even to aJtaC'\: tho l~ovm·n111ent. l ~~cat-,e 1 knoV/ that it is only ~L matter of being strangloll b:; tht ir own misL'kC3---I ,,111 p11t 1: iu the most charit­able wa: pc.•,;ble. ·while this strangulation is goi1:1g on nnC'nlploywciJt i.~ spreading. It is .J ll vcr" -..vell 1·~J fer cl starYi, g rnr,n. The~· must be fed. Bnt this may grow to such an ~1xtcnt that no Go .-crnnlPnt in the world can fr{!·d t1H"_n. \\-c have got to face the posi~ tion of 't.anat·on for a big portion of the people. I want to point out to the Govern-1¥F"'nt, 11 ho arc responPiblo, that it is a ver.'f cerious position, and tho only way in which they arc goinG to alter it is by facing it u.nd not by putting it behiPd their bck. This problem seems to be a disease of the olimr~to. I would a:_:k hon. mernbers opposite who have sufficient busine3s capacity to face tho problcn1, to endt~rtYour to realise their r(•,ponsibilitios and the consertuonccs thrtt will have to be fac.,d. The first wrty in wl1ich it could bo frtcell is by the Govern­ment goinv. out of office-not that I rtm par­ilicularly a.nxion:·J to s:-::e hon. members on this si,de on thP. Treasury benches, because J do not think it is much of a job.

Mr. \VINSTANLEY: Why not set an c·xample and go out yourself?

Mr. Wj.RREN: I have been out. I think that the only honest solution of the problem jg for the Government to g·o out of office.

Mr. Bt:LCOCIC: \Vhy do you not got the Liberal Governments in the Southern States to soh·e the unemployment problem?

Mr. W ARREJ'<: They aro solving it to " better extent than the Government are wlving it here. I was in Sydney recently, and I am of the opinion that there is not nearly as much trouble thero as there is here.

Mr. BcLCOCK: I was in Sydney, too. I gel to phccs whore you connot go. (Laugh­<er.)

Mr. \YARREN: That is so; I am a l'OflLJ( ~ :_b}o nwn. There are sonw streets I H>ou]ci not go into. (Laughter.) In New South \\'alu they have a greater train mileage !han we have, and the rolling-stock there is be! tor than ever it \Vas. You do not hear of rails rusting in New South \Vales. The traffic manager there told mo that the;c could not find sufficient trucks, and they had no old engines spurting out \Vater and e:2rttn. rrhoy havo to keep all their engines in the Lost possible repair, berauso thoy want thern all for their haulage. rrhoy require :ell their carrying capacity.

Yir. GLEDSO};: Why prais~ the New South vYales Labour Government and run this Government .down?

r.I1·. \VAHRI~N: That shov .. 's how reason­able I am I want to show that the causG of tho trouble on the Quoensla.nd railways is bad management. I am only telling what I saw myself in New South ·wales. It would be a wise and respectable thing for the Government to go to the country. The redistribution of seats was supposed to be

[Mr. WaTren.

for the purpo·-<' of putting the electorates on a pro;wr footing. Tl:e reason whv the Go­,·crnn1-C'nt are sticking to offif'o to-clay is not bee :,use they loYe the position they arc in. bnt, because tbey bc-liove tha.t ev<>n with the rollistribution that has been made, if they wcnt to tho country at tho present time, the•.' >~onld go ont ard go out ''cry badly.

!~lr. GLED~ol-;: l'\o. The Govern1nont believe that they can do good work for the workers of Queensland.

Mr. '.V ARR EJ\' : The workers have repn­diatcll tho Government. It is .a pitiable thing to be ropntliated by your own class, though hon. members opposite are not of the 'Yorh:>-T cla:~;~ notv. The greateBt aristo­cra.ts in 0u~cnshnd are on the other side of the House.

Ivl:r. COLLI::.:S: 'rhe aristocrats are over there. The workers are on this sidP.

Mr. WAD BEN: 1 do not acm1se the hon. nten1ber for Bo\\-on of being an aristocrat. All the work0rs arc on tliis side of the House. This Hou-,o .honld govern Queens­laud, and not one section of it. I have another )IU66c.sticn to make~I do not know whether nm·bollv on this side of the House will s11pp::n·t me "in it or not. Hon. members shonld hko this House into their confidence and '' aclc the Ministr:-. an cl put t'w best men in this Hous8 on the Treasury bc•whes, which would bring about a change in tho con· ditions of Queensland.

Jliir. CoLLn;s: You woulll ha Ye to take them all from this side.

Mr. \V_\RREN: That is the bc,,t joke that h>ts b~en propounded in this Ch:.,mber to­night, anll yet the party opposite are •lip­pin<r, slipping, slipping all tho time. The Govern1ncnt first slip over one question and then they slip over another, and at the same time they are a diminishing quantity. '_rhis Govcrn:ment c·an1o into power vvith a groat followiug, and I dace say that, if th<>re v. as a diYision taken in this Chamber to-night, they could be turned out of office.

i\f r. F. A. CooPER: Try it on.

1\fr. \VARRE:\': We are not going to ait-::-,mpt it.

l\1r. BuLCOCIC: Because you recognise that you coulll do nothing.

Mr. \Y.\RREN: I think it is about time thnt party politics and party corruption were done c:P;ray 1Yith. I do not care ,,,h -t. party beconH's all-poY.erful there 'vill b~ corrup­tion. Prrrty politics haYc oxtendc~l as far back a~; the stone age~ and it is about tin1e 1ve cvoln~d a be-'-ter sy:::ten1 of goyernrnont. It is ab0ut ti1n0 that 1 instead of being sur­vant5 Df a political tnachino, we evolved a

difFerent method of go1·orning the [7 p.m.] country. \Ye hear a gooll rncmy

interjections in regard to the palLIC in this l:Iouse. I do not care a rap for rarties.

A Co\-ER};11EXT :\ID!DER: Hear, hear!

:Mr. \YARREN: I would like to see the party sy ,tem rut out altogether, and 1 would like to sec the hon. gentleman who says "l-Iear. hcnr !" 1nake son1e 1nove in that dirqction. I will at all times do my hr-st to cnt out that stupid system.

Mr. BRENXAN interjected.

Mr. WARREN: If I had to say what the hon. gentleman wac, I woul-d have t.o get the '' Eneyclopaodia Britannica" to find a name

for hirn. At rlw same tin10 hr is not a:; bad a-s ho thinks h0 is, nor is ho as bnd as other people think he ie. (0prw·,.ition laug·hter.) But, if l\'0- do not ~'"•)p hin1, we do nr,::: kno\V vvhcrD he ~~l:iil go. I want to rt'fer to 'on1o bles··ir16·s ~<vhidl haYe come with the Conntr~T p:-u·ty. The· GoYetTrrucnt ~ ty they nro going to do a>Nay lvith tho Cpprr House•. and th(y :trt' goinq' to ::top erirrtinal~ LeiDg hangt?cL

PEASE : Arc you goi11g to yot0 for the of the rpper F!c:Jse'l

lVIt. \VARHE~~: CP·tainly I a1.1. I \vill \0~ .' to gc':•t rid nf anythj.:Jg which L'3

cbnoxloui:i. 3\lr. RREA:;;:'l_x: Cnrn0 oYrr .her.:·.

WARlUC:\: I v ill wlv •1 there is compHiJY o· rr th(rr. 1:·n+ I \·:ill not

now. Xl:any of the ntcasnrrs fnrr.:a:;;;t thi:::; S( .-:;ion woulfl not ha L~ been Inr-ntioned in tho Co\rcrnor's Spc0ch hnd iG not b0cn for the :uh·~nt of the Country p·u·t:·. (Government disBPnt.) ).J any ho11. .g-cntlenlf'n opposite Y ouid like to be in tho Country party to-day.

~,fr. HREN'~'X: You h.1vc one rat ulr\ ;Hlv -over there; you won't g('t any more. ~

1\!lr. \\'ARHE~: 'l,hat was a nw~t unholv thing· to so;:. \Vhen the hon. memb•'T fo~· Norrmmb took his R• at on this side !.he f)r>t thi·l:C( that was said by Government mcn1lwr,c, wac:, "Hat.n Tiw hon. rnendJrr for Normanby retorted, "Yes, I left an infected ship." The hon. member for Kormanby nevC'r said a. truer word.

A Gov•:nN~tE:\T J\fLMnER: All rats do.

Mr. V\' 1\RREK: 'l'he hon. gentleman can go int,J tho sc\ver and use scwa.gc expressions. Any hon. member who does that is not fit to be in th0 Farmers' party. I object to that sort of tl:ing. \Vh.v should th>'c unsavoury things be thrown acros, this Chamber? It is b,ennse Government members know that a party comroscd of roa.·onable, right-thinking men, arC' goirw to gPt Queensland out of tho rut ·he is in.

Mr. PEASE: Did he get £2,000 to no over· thr>re; that is what \"tTC want to know.

1dr. WARREN: Th'· hon. gentleman 1:1ught to go back to his mother if he thinks that; l1o is not fit to mix with decent men.

Nlr. D:-E:\N.Ix: He got more than a pound <'If tea.

Mr. \Y ARRIQ\: It would not take a pound of t+ a to get the hon. n1entbcr, any­·wav. Th0 fact of the 1nattPr is thn.t, if wo wa~t.ccl t-o giYe n1o11cy a'\V~~y, \•'e could get In any 1r )r:_ Uo\-c\rnlneul 1ncn1hcrs; but thoy arc no+- worth it.

J\1r. PE.\SE: 1~ ou n.dt'Jit he did g!~t. rnonPy.

Ivlr. \Y~\RREN: \Ye fi:lT' going to get another frorn that side, and gt·t l1iln for nothing, and lt will not be the one the. Trcac;urcr said it \\'US.

Mr. PEASE: Another £2,000?

Mr. \V ARRE::\ : I do not blame tho,e hulL g0nt.1L'n1cn for ac·ting ns the~' did iu the pa:::t. With thu achcnt of the Country party, I do not blame them for joining that decent, l'-''•peetabln party. and !PaYing· the infected ~hjp. \Yhy is thorn no end to thP'3c inter­jeeti<Jns '! There is no ne~d for them. It is thf· parallel of the drowning man who clutches at anything to s,t', ( himself.

Mr. PE \SE: £2.000 is a pretty good solid 'ubstancc to clutch at.

787

:.\ll'. \\"'"ARP:fi~:\-: 'I'hc 11011. ~-t:'nt.lPnLL.n is a prolit· and. if tf1NP ;s .... ythmrr m tho £2.000. wlH takt' jt.

l\1r. BI~Ex;-..~AN: Did th{'\'" not try t.n buv you ow· o[ .\'< \U' Scat l..,~t timt; ·[ . ~

:\Jr. \V:\RRR~: T}w !n! tlH• ll')IL DlC, lF•J' 1

hi, , t. I ha>. o c fol.lowiJ 3' hjs lndin~ttion, oi~jr .ion to a boclv o£ 1ncn :1 "'"" hr:has h'd

·would not trv to '~' t:,(y CUll "t ~.ke

ion to~ anv n1an Lnt I hil .. I'C an trvi1 .-: to dc:;trov Lr.~ins F'JOugh tO

ehangn nl_1nd. !I::. PE,F':-:: .f-Ie <( troyr:l hin(.-c1f. 'Jr. CoLLTXS: \Y}nt .lu~ppened to a 1nan

<al::'d ,Jarnc'1 '.rho \H:>nt OYf'l' to that r.;ido of ·' 11. U.Ol1S8?

Mr. \Vr'\RRF;)[; Probablv h<' is in as goorl a po-·ition a, he was in~ ht re.

?.lr. l'E.,SE: flow much did he get? 1Ir. BREN~.\!\ · Y'ou evc11tu::!.l1y l~:iJied hirn. ~lr. \1/A .. RHF.:I\: At the sa1ne time, if wo

du not ri.~c to a. hiqhcr tone in debate-. wo :,haH not be \Yorthy- of the rp::,pect an-d' con­fidence of the p ''Jp1c of Queensland. We are going through critical tin1es, and nothing i~ being- done to bring bnut better con~ rlitions. \Ve arc simply drifting and drift­ing, and the GovernnL'nt will continue to drift. as long as they rcre al!O\wcl to. or until another ho11. 1nen1ber opp·~,')ite shows his independence.

Mr. BRENNAN: Wh~n is that going to h~ppen 'I

Mr. \VARRRN: 'We arc not quite pre­pared. (Govcrnnwnt laughter.) I am speak­in~· for n1,yst~lf in :-aying that, 'vhen v,e are propared, he will come over.

Mr. PEASE: How much will he get? :Mr. WARRf•~N: He will get nothing-no

more than the last hon. gr:ntlrman got. The SECRETAHY FOil AGRICTLTem;: \Vhn is

he?

Mr. W .-\RREN: It may be the' Secretary for Agriculture. I will not giYe him away, at any rate.

l\fr. BRENNAN: Why are you not ready?

Mr. \V .. \RRR''IJ: It is up to us, as repre­sentatiYes of the people of Queensland, to face f10se problems in a different spirit to that in v>hich this Chamber has faced them in the pa.)t. E,·('ry hem. n1e1nbor on tho Govern1non.t 3ido has acquired a certain amount of kn01dcdge a' to what the nee-dii of Qneon·-la.ncl <He, and it is .1.b2olutdy ncccc­~·ary to h.tYe the n· i:~tancE-: of the~:,,) gentle-­nlCn and of the kno",dedp-;e that they havo ucqnircd when ou the T\Fasury benches to help Qnc'n"Innc1 out of t 1ll qvful l'nt sho ha:.; got in ~O.

:i\:L·. CILD .Y: You will nutkQ vo t1'se1f believo :~Tour ~taten \,'lli-.; di1·ectly. "

;)Ir. \Y ,\RUE::\: I c m1J no,·oe believe the l10n. gcntil:n:'ln.

~dr. GILDAY: I , _ \¥\'l' profitee-r,~cl ju farms, :m;vho•·,. You o.1·e a fairly good lwncl "t that.

1\Ir. BREX);AX: \Yh2n do you think you will t.ake OYL'l' that other 1nenrber?

l\lr. \YARl~l(.\: It .;:;eems ro 111e that it is up to cYeryone to alter the condlt~ons of affail\-J in Qut ~·n~1ancl. OuoensJand should never b,; in the positio:l she is in to-·day, be-eau~,, "c ha Ye an expan-;.:0 of -Fondcrful a.:;cl r~·Io1·jous country.

Mr. GILD.\Y: The best S'tatc 1n the Commonwealth.

Jfr. Warren.]

'i88 [~\SSE:\l BLY.]

:Vlr. iY,\RHE:\:: The bP-t c:mut; in the \HJrlcl.

}.Jr. BRE~X' x : \_.,.. c:::, U!!l1c·t Labour. ).Jr. G1LD\Y: -Yon lJa\·c r~utclc more uwnc:y

chu·j11~ ln ! t\YO or t1!l't:C year thau eycr

you dld Mr. iY.\RREN: I will 'how the hon.

lHPinbl :__' m~: bank ~·c·couitt if he will pay 1ny

dQf[cit. \Ye haYc uo ri{dtt to be in our pl'( rni: coud~tiutt \Yjth ~uch a ·- ondcrful and n·lt;J'j~ q_,~ C0ll1Jb',·, but. \.Yith the assistance of ~~·,pry.JJUn. lncn1bf'l'. if WP Ltc{:- OlH' diffirulti(' as nlP11, tJH·n \YC wi1l rnake good in thnc.

Ho:--:.· J. G. \.l'PEL (A/orrt): 'l'he member for Altw.t lws been referre-d to so much lately ln this lior.;:;c, that it is hard to decide~ ·.,·hr ther he is tlw most hn.ted or the mo,t f"'l''dar man in the Cha.mlwr.

l\1r. BRE::'O\X: l'opnlar? _I ID~,- . . J. U. A Fl)EL: 1£ an hon. llJ,~lnbcr

did not' ·Jko part in th;s debate the public out3idE" wonld rcg-anl hi1n a~ .a. 1nyt~1, er would ,,av tbat tbflrr was son1,·,thn1g· ~U'lGH Iy wrong with him. 'Cnder those c,mditions, I propos to :-a~-.- a fpw T'i"OJ·ds on the Financial ~tatr:nH•nt.

1Y1l'. BRE;:.;X\X: \\;hat about Canungra '? Hox. J. G. APPE.L: I do not know what

tho hon. gC'ntlr:1nan is referring t0. I-Io Blight be cn,.ting a ~lur 01.1 a n1ember of this 1-[ow;:e, and I ::~.1n not. gmn~~ to countt·na.nee anvtbing of that kind.

~1r. B:cENX.\X: You ,hould expose him. 1\h. FoRm:: Don't forg·et the Common­

wealth spent £500,000 in bnying 11p the tin1bPr areas in Canungra.

HoF. ,J. G .. ~PPEL: T, n- a nwmber of the Qt1<'('11oland Country p:uty, initiated the ,-isit of Captain \Yicnholt. a rnc1nbcr of th0 FedPrnl Country pa.rty) to Canungra, and l nw de hint acquainted with all the facts on accouut of the wickt~cl scandal ·which cxi:::-ts there. iY e believe in Ycntilating the matter, hf'cau:::f', 8S a Country party. we arc opposed to thP State engaging in State enterprises, rrhctht'r thev arL:.. carri8d on bv a National GovC'rnn1ent ~ or a Labour · Gon:'rnmrnt. (Hear. bear!) Th(•re has been a wicked and .scandalous \Ya:-;tc in ('onnertion with tha acquin·nlC'nt of tlH~ l"'.ntnngra :-3a ~~~n1il1P, and J ('onsidcred it n1v dut-v. as a 111Pn1ber of the Conr~tl'.v' part,\'.~ to gE~t Captain \Vienholt to iHqulre into the tnartf'r and gl)t fir_,__t-h ;nd 'f'(1UaiEtn nee of tlh· Y',·idrod extravagance, the Vi'irkrd expPlHliturt'. a11d tho wicked waRto that have tak<'n place ,,t Canungra. \Ye have ah·.·ays objected to the Labour Govcrn­mc:.t 11nd0rtak1ng State cnterpri;,cs, bc:-<nFo in. n1a11y in~tancr~ the rP . .-,ult has been equal to dutt of Cunn!lgra. (l1f'al'~ hear~)

:\ir. l'ORIJ[: You kllow that Captain \Yit llholt i~ kcPping the Ff'dC'l'a1 :\ational GoYcrnincnt in po1vcr.

1-Io:-\. ,J. lL )d)PI~L: I h;n-c son1c regar~.l fnr thr hiJll, t"entlt'~.utn, hut I haYe alrrad5· <l Il'::v;cri'd one inb rjeet1on. anrl I llO\V intend to lll'OC('CJ IYith the Financial Statc1ncnt.

'J'l1<•rn arc only two pha:.;cs frorn which the Budgt~t ~r(lc..-~h of the rrrca~·:rcr can be rcganlt'd. aud only two intrrpret<ltion::; can bn put on it. ll.lnlely, that the financial po,ition of the Stato is ab,ol~ttcly 'ound, and that C'Ycrything i'3 in good conditiou and flotll'i~hing, \\·hile th·.: ;:~dn1i11i.~trabon b,''3 11l'OYud an a b6o1u tc succc'~·' .

GoYERX~IEeiT ME~!nERS: Hear. hear! Hox. J. G. APPEL: From the Statement

>vc arc led to believe that the Treasury is

[Mr. Warren,

in a pe1·fe(·t finaucial position, and t'hat th.~ Btate i.') pro._ ec{Ji::1g a 1 ong the road to pros­pcri••.c. i\ o find on page 11 of tho State· JilOJlt that the r_rl't"R~lll'Cl' ll1akcs l'Bf2l'C11Ce to­thcS( nw.ttcrs in tho follo"~iug words :-

•· The Reason..:; han! bec11 n1ost boun­teous; crops pvrrywberc arc flourishing; and onr prin-;ar.~ indu:3trie:: 2 v.rith the < gccpt.io:n of 111ining, arc thr1Ying."

ThL·n he gu . .;; 011 to say tl· lt the fLnanee:> of tho State are J>ropcl·ou" und that the admini~trabon has be.:"n r·ficctiYc und ~.~u ahs0luie SUC('(-'"'3.

Co\CEH:\jlE~'.'l' ~IE~·~EERS: ll0ar, hear!

Ilox. J. G. Al'PF:L: Hon mcmberc oppo~ ~it" :vrrcc with that. If that is the case, ho1-v ('ntnesn it thnt it i.;;;; lH'ccssnr:v to cngar;c in thr policy of '' dt~Hation," to n!"P. tho pet \i urd of the Prt•1nic•r.

:;\Ir. iYErn: Who is inflated to~night?

Hox .. J. G. APPEL: Mt•n who have been ('ngagul in the ruilwa~~ ~un:icP for yenrs, n1cn who haY:) done good work in the son~ice of the State, haYO b0cn cast upon the str·ePts ahnn:-;t without 11otiee. \\T c kncn\' to our ~orrow that thc--.c unfortunate 1ncn, with their \vivcs and families. are {':Jill]lPllcd-although we an• told that the Stlta j., pro"'pcrons­to siuk all that S• lf~estet•rn and prid" which they justly held herdoforc, aud are com­pelled to go and get rations hom the State.

::\Tr. { (OSTLLLO: Sh)111t'!

Ho~. J. G. Al'l'EL: ITov' comes it to bo so~ llpn. lllCmbcr'"l opposik' adn1it that ever.Y-1'l1ing io properous and that lho finances arG wund. Then how is it ne<'('ssary to do that? IIo\V i~ }t, tha.t the railwa·,~ ~-- l"·;ic.~ haa been ,t:Jned, ant! that the roiling·-~tock is unfit for th.> purpose for whieb it is U'ccl7 If " private firn1 had tho.~e railv~"ay engine~, 75 per cent. of them would bo condemned. How (·omeB it. \Yhcn the St1te is so pro:.;pcrous, that our rail'i.Yav service::; are hcillg reduced, and reduced. al1d reduced? How comes it that the raihva.:vs "Jervice which we had twenty-five or thirty ~~curs ago i:3 no;\' r;·duccd althm;gh the State ie absolutely prosperous? how eonws it that the raih,·ay buildings and r1ll the rail was property is in a most disgrace­ful condition of disrepair 9 Buildings and other property ha ,~e not bee.'~ pa.inted f~r years. II(nV corncs that? liOW con1es 1t t·hat the primary pro due r, who de dres that th-e d('narh~1ont should proYide a siding or loading yard to karl cattle, is told there is no n1onr-y available?

1\fr. C'OLL!XS: That is not true. The cane· growers in rny di~,trict han~ got sldi11gs.

Ilox. ,J. G .. \P PEL: I Ht,Y that it i::; true "-O far a:-; t1Jr nrimarv produce-rs in the Southc'rn ~],:ti~t of the St tl-~' arc concernc<l. _.._-'\ fc~'i\. nwnth_ ag0. 1·hp t~IXlJa)·C'r.;;; o: the CDoniCra had to l:uild thc~r OVd1 1oading yar J be( -.. u~e the depurbnent had no rnoney for the nu~·rosc. IIo\v comt: . ., it, 1vhen the StatE-! i::; in' this prosnorou~ fina~:cia1 conditio-n. tl~~t th!:::; is :-:o '( \Yhut ]:; the reason'! I-Io~v 1s it tl1at we eannot g('~ school accon1m< dation in Qu(~.('r.s1and '? Jlov,r ('Oll1CR. it ihat the dPpartn1e11t has no mo1H'Y ay:11lable for the erection of new schoola in di~·trict that are b('coming settled?

Mr. CoLLIYS: That i, not true.

Hox~. J. G. APPEL: At one time I did haY(' a certain amount of respect for tho

hon. mc,mber for Bov en, but not when h<' denies the unfortun;cto facts which I am stat­ing. In the electorate whieh I reprec.cnt. these matte1·s han, been put a .idc on the ground that no nlOl1f'~,~ ifS available. It is impc:··si blu to obtain sholtc r hecb for tlw children. and jt is ia1po~r:,ib1P to obtain the cxpC'ndlnnc of •· few pounth:) while it ]3 :l(hnitt0d b:- hou. IUc'mfJcrs snpportin'"l: the Govcnnnf'tlt that t!Jc State i~ iJl a Hourishi11g and Jli'O: PL)rons c~ondition nnd is finaneialh· sound. liow conlL'S it that t 1 w~e nc•t(:···ar~­lVork for the rornfurt of the peoplP of tl1~· StaJr ;~n·l for J1P scttlf~LJE'nr gnd develop1nent of the State are 11ot crr1Tic>d out :' I-Iow f·onH'' lt tbat hJ many -of the -0 old u11d valued scrv>.nL '-· bo ha.\·e blo.zrd the tratk -0 ,) fur as the dcYPlopnlcllt of our railw;lv s' ~h_•Jn is conc0l'tl0d. hare b:'C'!l turn0d l~lloiJ tbc streets and practically, \\·irl1 thc·jJ' wiYcs a11d famili< '· ldt to .'tan<•? Jt i· all Yen, \YPll for the hon. lll( :ubcr for B-o,, '!n, who S1tf:. jn .con1fort to-clay, to l'('gard ''-·ith equanimity these unfortunate nH'U, nnfortunate wmtH·ll. :1-nd uufortunat(' f'bildr('ll.

!VIr. Cor.Ll~S: T "·ill jJrodu('e wv hauking account if yOu will produf' yours.·

Ho~. J, G. APPRL: Look at the "pceehe' of bon. nH n1ber::; who h;_n·r practiC'al exprri­.encc, and who, in their cliffcrcnt lines 88

prin1ar_: produc;T:-:. have s~:nnc:d fron1 th~..: lowest rung of the ladder an cl ha vc succerclecl in m~king- a SlH'ccs~ of their l in:-~ by thrir indu;:;·, and b·: their thrift. 'Ye June' heard thc1n in thi . ...: ·Cmnn1ittco voicing thP com­plaints 1 hi< h thcv ha ne been compelled to make o~.\ ing to the inaction an'l incptitndP of th<' ]ll'l "·<'Ill Adrnini,.tro tion. \\' p l':t "'' had two Ilotablc epcechr delin•>·ecl in thi' r~Iousn~one b,· tb,_--, hon. rnernh{·r for Bulin1ha. an hon.~ gent1C'nJnn I hnn• klJ0\\11 fron1 hi" earliest _youth-n ~rentlc!nan \Yho i the archj­tect ot bis own fothtt'·:! (lnd of hi_.; own po . ..;i­tion in life; ;1. g'f'lJt.ie.uan \Y~lo \Ya." Tr -,.~urt•r. and a HC<'t'..;::Jul Trl'a~uror, in tltc Admini-<tl'n­tion of whlch I was n llH'mbf:'r.

A Gon:n~:IIEXT ..\JnrBI:n: Anrl frum 11hich )'OU rt -: gn ccl.

IIox. J. G . .APPEL: rr--igll'·rl lJ(•t·an"c I had a ddfc•l'<'ncc 1rirJ1 thr 1?1'enlicr cf thf~ day, bec:-1n~c T \\'H:-J of opinion h0 v, a' JJot doing· tf_qt. cluty to tlH' priman- produce-L­vf the ;-)~-utc whicb I con ldc~rcd h(' sh<)nld ha Ye doJJP ·. b!!T: 1 Ycnturc io say t.hat, wjth t.hu except1on of the .F-lon. :,fr. Ada:nf:on. there i:--: on-• lllt'tub,~r nf t 1J" L- bon{·

1d1o 1 :•r:l hi ofric0 P' <;,.llo ar(~ t.!c

J. :~. YCCt.:'iYi:n~ Bnltrnb:', ,\.'lw

1nnn Hnd ~~ m·tn fJwtn1··--' h1nh from tlw corl­

J:dpoint a1 3 ~1s Tl·'~l rn·pr_ h 'S ~"nr' <u~d ]w-~ an

at J(;n

we h t1· .. d- nln'- 1

hon. l1~<'1nber frJ.,

in charadcr, OlJ('

it~clf to 1ncmbe!' UlH Commi1-7<?{' wha:c'".'Cr polih(:tl opil!~on n1. b-e. and -one that \VC nlig·ht 1n·ll pon(Jc~, o,;~r and c-onsltk~r. If "\YC l!Onc;flv co1Hirl01' 1vhat tha.t hon. rncn1bcY c .::_f. fort1i in th 1 t tenlperatt' addrr~s and follm\' it. I venture to sav it will n~ake for t.l1e adntnc<:m;-.nt and prosp'Crity of the Stat·<'.

I propose to say a \Yord or bru iu connoc~ tion "·ith the loans. eompulsory or serni­conlpulsory, rais£'d within the boundaries of our own State.

Tho 8Er'R':T.\P.Y FOR ~'I.GP.IClJL1THE: \Ylnt do you call scn1i-cmupnlsory ~

Ho';. J. C. 1\P Pl:L: I call a scmi-com­pul ;ory l0.111 :1 ioan jn rt'~{ard tq wh1(h the Trca::'lur<.•r. '-'· bn rc]H'CSC'Jlt'j thn ...:_\.drnlni~tra­tion, st:-th's, ''If this loan is not raisPd volunturiiy, then the nccessaey steps will bo taken to enable' the Administration to search the pn('kets of t!li __ taxpayers .. ,

~lr. l'E.\:;E: That is C\acdy whe..t tho Con_rrJlonwc~d. l1 Uoycrnnl cnt ha'"' said abont ('Y(•ry 1oan thry hJY0 float,ed ill Australia..

Ho:-:. J. G. A Pl'EL: The loans which thP ConnnonwPtllth h:tYe obtained within th(• boundaei(•::;; of the Comn1o:,\vealth are of an abeoir<t'IY diffcront dwr.:C'tcr. T!wv aro loans to, whld1 cycrv mcn1Ler of thl~- conl­Hlunit.\'. arcordjng to' hl.s n1eans, should con­tl·jUnte, brcau.;;e tb'Y a.rc undL'r oblTgations to thocc mc•u \Yho ,n:ur forth and chcd their blood and fought for us o that to,day we may enjoy the fececlorn '"hich stiil exists in the Commonweo lth. It i"' our duty to con­tribute to such loans. :But loan·.> for d1c pur­pose of speculating- jn Ti·ild-cat cnterpriseR do ndt come with1n that c 'lt~gory. Thn pl'incilJlf of raising loans withh1 tho boun­dtnic3 of the State' is one \\hi eh ohould lw Yery carr•fulJy cntl'r<'d upon. L(_\causu it is one \Yhieh tc11ds to crNJtc tlw nnemplr)yn1ent y;biC'h exi,ts to,clnL I woLcl<·r that hoJL nwn1bcrs ~nvporting· the Govcrnn1ent do nor, rai.c.:e th0ir Yoic0s in protC'c;t against that policy. The rni"ing of loam. cowpulsorily or nihCl'iYi ... e, withln th0 RtatC' h•nds to lower was;F~ and to ert fi.T(• U1H?-mplo~nllcnt. _.:\b~o]ut{), : ilL~J('(' ~ 'J'hi:-; j,;;; not rny O\\ 11 proposition4 I HSf'd to hPar hon. rrwrnL r~~ sitting behind t·l~~· Uo\~P, ntll<'-'t nt n111' tinH' t 1110te mJtho1·iti0:-i on the Cu.·stitution aPcl on p(ditiL·ai ('Cnr;orny.

The hon. rnernber for Bo~-·cn was /7.30 11.nJ.] (JilP: ln1t, ::-tran; ~-~ to ~a;~, fo1·

,onH~ con ,idcraL1(' tirne th0 hon. ttlCtL:brr hn~ CL. (__-'d to quote the~<· anthoritiC'·· l think that it >>ill be admitted that John Stua1t. }fill is rcr _)f~u!~C'd. 1JOl o1li.~· ju Great Brit.lin Lut ill other C'ountrie~. as being in th0 for0fro1d: P a political pconoini:·:t. I do r:ot \Yi-.....h to inqH.>St> 1ny O\YH opinion oH rhe

bn! l y ill m rote \\"hat .John .'-a\' on the (,llH~f:.tion cJf loan~.

On page 526 c~ ·· Prin(·jn]ns of PoliUeal Eoo11onr~·-" h.· :-l,-:. "- •

qnc .t-io-n has alrr Hly bf'Pll 1:pon irt rhe fir~t book. \Vo

th;Jt if tlH' capital taken in 1-< nb~,tnt<, ud frmn fullds oither

('11:_~':-lJ..'.- n i~1 l'.rudtH 'ion or destincrl to rmplo-:f·d ·in lt, thf'il' diYer~ion from

purpo~n is PqlliYah1 nt to taking the from the an·es of the

ee. Borrowi~~g. in this ca?-.f', is not n snb~ tltutc for raj~ing tho npplics r ]thin th~ ye~: f. _A GoYf'rn­

lllC'nt 1·:hirh borro1vs dof's <~etnnllv 1-.a.ko the P.!1l0ll?lt" )yj(l:1n th0 YI.'El.l', <HJ~l that too Lv a tax f'xdus1Yelv 'on thf' labr)Ul'­ing <:LlsS( ~: tln1n whid1 it con1d ha.vo clone nothing ''Torsc if it had supplied its. want::-: bY avowcJ taxation: and in that ease tlic transaction, and its eviL-, would baYc ended with the f'mcrgonc:;T; while bv thl) cironitous modo adopted, thc vah;e exacted from tho labourers is gained. not 1:ry the State, but by t,he prnploycrs of labour. the State reiY..•am-

·Hon. J. G. Appel.]

790 Supply, [ASSEMBLY.] Supply._

ing charged with tho debt besides, and with its interest in perpetuity. The system of puhlic loans, in .'·Ech cir-cunl­st:lncc··,, n1a} be llrononnecd the ycry wor t which, ln the IH'PSf'nt tate of civilisrrtion, 1s still included in the catalogue of fina~ll:ial expedient.-:."

\.Ye find this eminent political economist lc"­ing down the principleS which hon. mNnl:or' on this ddo lnvc aLh-ocatod in objL''·11ng ~ 1

the 1nctsures ndopted by the present Ar1rninis­tra tion. rrhe Govern1nent have thrcrrtou- :1 to squecz'1 1vhat the-y c:-1ll the wealthy ducers-~the v;(q1thy p:•f:hl' 1i·-,,, --:'1:J rrianufucturrr, ~:1d the result ·will be what Mill states >rill inevitably fol!m a pclicy of that kind-

" Vl e, ho 1.\-cYc-r, rc.:.na ~kt_·j that t~J.)r-~ are Gthel' circnn1sL<u1cc·J in whjch loans :ne not d:ar:;0ablc ith these p.r-nirions ccnseqnenccs: 1lcrnel1.', firs~, when Trh· t is LornJ'. (:1 is foreign ca•n­ta1, the oYerflowlngs of the general eccn­rnulation of tl- ,:- -.~,or]d; or, f ·c ,~,dly. when it i:=3 cap it Ll Fhich oitber '' ould not haxt Lean F 1 -rLl nt all unlc.:::..;. this 1nodJ of in ye; ~l1lllt h:: d 1Je\ '.1 op.•n '/"() it, Ol" ~tfil:.· b~iug t.aY<·d wo11kl hav'-' b<..'l..'ll 1vnst<..'d Ul uuprnductiye cntor­}Jri.sC>s, or PiJnt to seok t\lnploynlt'nt iu foreign conntrie~. \Vhen ~Jw prugn>·: of accun.nlation has rodnccd profits either to the ultimate or to tho pra.cti­r J n1inirnnn1-to the, rat{~) le~:; tha11 which would 0ithcr put a stop to thP i rJ(TU1 "t' of ( _tpital or send the ,,,bolt' of 1-~~l' lH'\Y -accumulations abroad-­l~oyr-nu1H .. •nt n1ay annually inter.·c"pt the u lH_nv accu1nulatiron ··, \Vithout trcnching on the 0mplo: mcnt or ,,-ag~, of H10 labo,n·­ing class{ in the cou11try i1 uJL or r .·r­llf;ps in any other C'Ountr}-. ''

~rhat appli0s to-day. \Ye sec \Yhat },ts h tp­pcned in Quconsla.nrl owing to the finrmcial methods adopted by the present Admiuistra­tion. P0rhap·.; the Governm(~nt, and ho11. rnernber~~ f;Hpporting then1. df'H'- that then~ is auy unemployment: but I ~a:v thct the unemployment which exists to-day is oaused by conditions likP thoS<• outlinPcl in l\Iill.

Mr. COLLrX~: Is that tlu• re:.son whv there arc- so n:an.'- H!Jl'nlp]oyPd in Grc·at B'ritain ~

}low. J. G. APPEL: P(.•rhaps hon. mem­bers oppoRitt~ art"" prC'parcd to argue that there has l>cf'll no hea\ y taxation iu Queens­land; but. in nt'dcr that thi. matter ma.v h" considered b,-.,- the general lh xpayer who" has not the opportunity of he a ring the dcbateo ln this Chamb01', lt is just as wC'1l to einHllt'r­at('· what the increase of tn.xation has b_cn, .so that it nwy appC"ar in '• IIansar\-1," and he' disseminated by the l'res". the Hwmb·, rs of which have this ·,,ftornocm 'bePn threatened with <'X[mlsion from tlw House null.-,; thev >u·e prepared to resign tlutt freedom which 1.ve ha ,-c al\va~ s prided oursdYes upon thl' Press having cnj oycrl.

QppQ~ITIOX 2YJEMBER8: llear, }H'Hl' ~

HoN .• J. U .. \l'PEL: From 1915-1916 to the veqr -1920-1921 ther0 .has b •en an increase }u thf\ rPYC'nlH' re-ccivf'd by the State Y\'hich is double \Vhat it was in th~P vc>~u· fron1 v.,:hich it colnUll)ncc•d to incru1;,·. Tht'' taxation h:1. increased from £2 pet· hC'ad in 1915-1916 to £4 18s. p0r !wad at th0 prc,r•nt time-en increase of 133 pPr ce11t. lf that increas~: had been causPd by development and produc­tion, WC' would lm able to pride ourselves upou it: hi1t. unfortunately, it has been

Lllon. J. G. Appel.

brought about Ly ~Hl1Pl'·taxation and rack­renting t1w nuitwtnn;\ ,e tnXJJa~- crF: of tho 8::aiC', wh1~·h l:-; aJ~o the call..<;.:e of the nnem-

of nlanv thousauJs of the ·at tho time.

LtYs doYvll b· ~folloY:Ad

d1·a ,-s attcn­tt po!ir.- (;f snvcr~

1 axtttion. ( Jn pagt• E=2 of tl1e w~)l"k alrC>aJy refL·rrcd [1), h·-.:: '"tat~_,~,--

ov_ ~a:xatiou ('Yil. is

CCOl.!.Onl·l '} vart o·-1ytj:_':.~ J~~ncl~

a!nounL ',·hit h <·itbcr

JJ:' UoYU'lHuc !t 1

n~· t. cmnJ?~I~a.b1(• of Jt'3 nu ,_nich

n,od rato in tho eontri­

of Go-as to ttt a

bu:tor to 1 b(' (tl bitl'a.r\­"(\rnuH~!Jt cdfit-'.'r~. ~ plac·~ ~kiil, indu cJisad\·hu(.a g;c~. 111 OlU" O\Yll cou.nh·"~ 1s YCl'~' great} yot .<Js c v .. T-yol c know; ih lin1lt) and is sel(lvrfl !.Il.,LL:~ to pay· lL1orc tha-.1 lw expects aud calcu1ah_ , on, and as the n10df . of taxatiou ·are IJot of such a kind as Jnnch to in1p:<~r the xnotivPs t:11!'> ind.u:·:ry and economy, thr sc,~1rc0s of prosperity are little di?niHishu:l by t.h pre,·-sure of taxa­tion; t.hny rnay even, as ;;;onle think, bo increased, bv the extra cxe-rtio113 111adc to con1pon ate V for the pressure of the taxes.''

Such ta:-c,-tiou 1.vould C-1tHe a lurge an1oLUh of capit,,l whieh othnnvi,c \vould havo been <'lnplo"'"d in the development of this State to lY~ withdra\-YY.l. There can bo 110 dispute thnt that has been the n•sult of this rnlicy of ovcr.taxa.tion.

lVlr. Bn~~KNA~: JJriYing capital out vf Quccn.,lcnd-th0 old cry!

llcr~T. J. U. APPEL: "J3ut in the lJ,trbarons Je:-.lloti,.,ln~ of

nw11r L'Ountries of the East, tYlJcrf' taxa­riun ·consists in fa::-tcning upon those who havt- succeeded in acqltiring t-ornething, in ordf'l' to confiscate it, ualPss tho po~­sPs3or buys it; release b,y sub111 itting· to gin~ ~,crr.•e largo stun as compron1i.so, -...ro cannot expect to find voluntary iudustry, or \Yealtb derived frorn anv ... ource but plunder. And evon in cOrn para ti vcly dvilised countrieR, bad modes of raising a ren•nuc have had effects similar ia kind, though in an inferior degree."

Here we find the policy of the hon. memb(}l' for Bo\Vml and son1c of his coller~gucs-" V{ e will make tLPm squPal; we'll squeeze thom," That is th"' policy whieh has alway, hee,. adoptt-d b:v Ea~trrH d0spot~, \Yhich haR cau,_ed sulllc of tlte mo't fertile lands in tho universe to lie bare a11d waste. 'rhich has abwlutcly strangled individual Hffort and the dcv0lopnwnt of the Statp. Then. on page 533. Mill says-

·• Yet n1erc ex.c ;g of taxation, even ,, hem .not aggra\atod Ly uncertainty, i~, independently of its injustice! a F0rious Pconoinical PYil. It mnv be carried RO f ,u· as to disconragn i11d~u.;try by iusuffi­cicnC'y of l'C\,·ard. ·vt'r:v long br:forc it JT.~elws this point, it, prevents or greatly dwcks accun1ulatioll, or cnn·p .. ihP capi­tal aecnmc;latcd to be >cnt for invest­UH•nt to foreign countric ~. Taxe-s which fall on profit's, C'VI\h thoug-h that· kiJ_Jd r)f incon:,_ may not pay morn than Jt.~ ju~r shar<~. J1(~t'('SsarH,y di1nilli!':h the inotivc• t0 nn.v ~aYing, PXrf'pr for invest­rnont in fon•lg-n conntrie .... IYhPrc profits a re higher."

Supp 1y. [16 SEP1'EMBER.] Supply. 791

We kno "' that hLts been the effc·ct iu Que• n'-1ancl-thnt it has heen a great fuctor in causint~- tho nuclnployment in this P:aL: to-d:..y.

fvlr-. J~J;.EX:-J"A' : Ai Cal~Hliffl'i.L l--Io:'i. J. G. ArJ~ EL: It is iuc\ 1t tbly the

pffe(·t ot P~ pol1cy su('h as that winch ha' tbe pn~scmt \cbn:uistra­

thc critics on thi:-; an1pl:y sho,,n ih.at

~;·r .1 pontH d L :·u _Ckd' t

ULl a(S()­

tbc _UoYer;;m.t l~ e~_t-cring ('llil'flit'J.iC. fJ:lH·lr hi:lfLdS ·"l'•_

\:ith ~the affalrs of gOYf-?rH­

nJt the ti<no nor hr~vo t:r './ abilltv to cc:n·T.· a bn:_ine:-,:,

lw; h< c-11 ' bv

a]r, a eh )1' alH.l fhon.;:_alJds o[

pou1Hls hnse Lecn .~pent rn·ihcrn, which haYc b?Gn Ld{~ll .Jrou1 lt'git1n11te purposes.~ L1.1-._: alrc"d.. uHhc::vlcJ) ::uch a.s {he provif.lOn of r::;hod:1 for the acconnuodation of c:,ildrL'l1 in the country tllHl other pur]_)O' of vital

ncP, non-nthindancL· to \Vhich has very L1det-~rious L·licct .on !:1 _ gro\v­

ing youth in cur country district-. _:_\~ill ha3 like · i dcvoh'Ll an ;- rticlc to State aE;<ncie:--. In Book 5, chaptc:r xi., ~-r:r' ion 4

1 par,c 570,

he sa~·-".:\ ihird h, lll'rnl objecr-io·t to (~oYern­

m, u_t agen::y re t on the prindple of the dh-ision of labonr. Every ndditioJJal ~unction Ulldcrtakcn bv the (.iovcr llL'Cllt,

i a fresh oecupat_ion~ irnposed npon H.

hod.~· already -JYerch1.rgcd with duties. A nutnral con ,f q nPncn is that 111( ,t tlting:3 arc ill do1:e: nnwh not d 1ne at alJ, hcc tu . ._c the Govcrnrnont is not able to do it without delaYs >Yhich aro fatrtl to its purpoec; that the more trouble­Eomc, and k showy, at thL· fn11cticns U'·tlertak:>n U:l'(' lJO~tllOl!f:d 01' 11\' ·:lcctcd, a11d an excuqe i~ alwa-~·s re_ P.dv for the neglect; >Yhilc the head~ of the, Adminis­t.ra t!on ha Ye thc'i1· n1i.nds so fully takeu !Jp with official de+ails, in ho\~;c-\·C'r per­functory a nHUll1er sup~_\rintended, that thny ban' no timP or thought to spare for the great intercs7.} of the State and t~1e prPparation of 0nlargcd :nu,n:--~urc-s of Bociul irnprOY('Tllelli·. ''

] !Jen, on page 571, he ··nys~ "But though a better organisation of

Governments would greatly dirniuish the fore, of the objection to tho mere multi­plication of thPir dutieo, it ould still ron1ain iruo that in nll the Inoro advanced con1n._.unities, tho great nta­jority of things aro wor'c done by the i ntcrvcntion of GoYern1nent. than -tho individuals most interested in the matter would rlo them, or ra use , them to be r!unc, if loft to thcm:-e!yes. The g-rounds of this truth are expressed with toler­a blc- cx:cdncss in the popn1ar Uictum, !.hat peop'lc nnder<Lnd their own busi­ne\:''3 anU th0ir ov:n intcrt_•sts better, and car'.~ for the1n rnorr-. t.han the Gov,~·rn­nl0nt. does, or ( tll be P"Xpcch•d to do. This J.wxim hold~ trne throug-hout the greatest prtrt of the busine's of life, and wherever it is trl;,c wo ought to con­dcnnl ever1. kiucl of GoYPrnnJc•Ht intcr­H'nt·inn tl~at conflids with it-. The infe:iority of GoYernmcnt ageney, for

ex~l·' llJlc, in any of thu t ioll:::i c/' i ndu ·ay or bv t 11c f:1ct, that tC} ntnin.t:J.itl jt:;0lf '>· ith irH 1 ~v!d:wJ Yidu•.l·

COll1nlO!l OllPta­i:, pl'OYed ever ab~

"Jt 1l1Lc'-'f ;)(' l't'Illl'it_•bcrL'd, 1•\"('ll if fl Uni't'. lil\('Lt

;; f kW)\'/} Jll t~f' n·

H ll tlJ,-::.

l:o a~1y

Thn 1"' 110t dnr:.e ill < S!:lil' etlhJ.:p!·i··:·''· :.rjJl

c·onJ!tr.v (on-

:·'.·(·.\ i£ }r. 1 i ~~ ·eft_ . 11 ,-.e

'' '':1 (

·' :'io", the.~o t1l,.',e \ '-,'-.lf'. ,,l_',,.....'!t· .. ::::t,:!,\-,,i_.',',t," ..

hasP han(b, in " . _ (:( 'lll l'C1 llC.'. iJ

natur, 11, ie )l of lnd:Yitl ·nl ;.£~1 ~'•

to th!'(•'.v the lwcnns dJ( y ;np capn lJk nf d'Jii;g L.·tter ur 011 {'}!t~;qwr 1hau .n:nY

other ''· An f r a j:-< the, o:._·-"iSf;,

it ~, 0 th:1t CovPrr.. lt J~ • t,v t· c1nd-jlJg or nven bv supt;l.st·d11Jg i;·_di -.·1dual agrnr,v. c~lth(~l' :-,ubstituh . ..; a ]ps:; gur.li­!i(~d in.-:.t.runlPIJt.di!:· for rJuf' h•rtt•c qnnli­iiPd. ur :J.t. ally rate sul)::titttL·'- ih O\Vll nwde of w·~..·oulpll,.bing the \\ork, for all the vari4_·tJ of nJ·'Jdt \\. hi('h --.,vnuld lJe t··i(•d h.~· a lllH11b(T of t 1nnlly qualifjett )H_'J'-.OUS ain1ing nt tht' :-;CUll() PHd; a CO'.l· petition ;.)y r1an,y du;;n DS D1dl'f' propltiou~ to the progrr .-; ()f irnpro,·t~ .. lf_'llt, than any nllifonnity of sy:-:-.tcrn. ''

:\lr. Bnl'OC'K: What alnnt quoting l\Iill on •· Land Tenure'' ?

~lr. Br:nHL'\C l'O;.;: I-: C' llC'\'er 1H.td a fa. nu.

Ho};. J. G. APl'J"L: vY~ find that. all th<> ,.,.itici,m -., hid1 !u's beeu 1' veiled by hon. nwmbers ··:.ho h.,vo critieisod the pre·\ent .. ~\ druiuistra tio.'~ is founded 1111on the standa!·d laid down b:· Mill, and what he stated will inevitably and inevocably follow. That i• what actuallv ,,-ill o~cur in this State> ,,f Qneo11slanrL ·\Ye knew that t!1o papc•rs whic·h ha vo uniformly sup pori eel tlw prescmt Adn1ini£itrntirm realise that that is so. I propose' to quote an artic1e uppearing in the "Trnth" of 4ih Sr'ptembcr. 1921. Thi· paper has consiste-ntly >upporterl the present Administrn tion, "hetlwr t.br',V >Ye re right or 1Yhetlwr t.lwy were >nong. The paragraph tries to iinU son.·r pxcu.s0 for t.hc rc:t.son" it giYes in ,howing that State trading i,s rloomed. r am quite willing that th"'" l'XCtl·-es should he given.

The Ho:>rE S;:CRET,\RY: \Vho wrote it?

Ho;;. J. C. APPEL: Perhaps the lwn, /I('Utlem~tn did. Tt is hoadt'fl. "Rtate Trnding n(l()EJC'd." rrlli~ ].., what it f-l-ald-

" Dr-pit" tlw parlml' eondition of LalJour politic,'3 in Australia to-da:.,·, due

Hon. J. G. Appel.]

purtly to ln·eath of tru:~t Clll the part of i '" accepted kaders ~nd confidential

·heads, and partly to the "hocking laxity nnd indiffcl'>>nce in ]i,-) rtt!lk and file in lc<eving tht' conduct of affairs to more handfuls of nnc.r-rnpnlou":l cxplo:itcr.s."

I aru quite sati~f1eJ. that the ho11. gentlcn1rrn did not ·write that. It gocf! on to state~

" Tlwro is ample proof that the motu>­rain is in labour, and ·will bring forth t:'le rnonse of regeneration and l'Porgan­jsation whiC'h eventuallY \vill be th0 Aush :1lian political party:_the only party thnt will be ~llowed to c··ci-·t in this fair land, now lying prostrate with the heel of King 1\ioneybags ·well fitted into its lJPck. That State ent€'rprisc id domned. there is no chadow of doubt. \Vc> in Clueensland n'a lisc that more fullv than in any other ;,;tate. It io doom-ed for three reasons. Firstj boeansc Moneybags has decreed it, and cv('n that leonine personagr" .I\1r. Hughc·,,, is svYallo.,wing tho pill: aud, E'"Condly, because our adn1i11istraiiun of the Statp undertakings has bc'<'l1 '.cickc-dly and di,grac~fully incmnpt~tcnt. ·•

rrhat i~ what \\"C hn\'e LlllclPl' the lH'f'SC'llt ~~dn1ini~t1·ation.

I want to '"·." one word upon the i'ubjeet 0f dnficito, and ckal with sorno of the views r-xpn·:~?c-d fron1 tintt' to tin1e bv son1e hon. 1-':H?lnbers OfllJOsito. L

r_fhe IIo::HE f-!.n l;El \.I:Y: (_~in~ us S0111e of your own YlC\YB.

Hox. ,J. G. ,\l'l'EL: I would prefer to give BOrne of tlw hon. TilL'lllbcr's fin•t. Hon. gentl";rrwn sittint;' on the Trcasurv benches have intorj0ctpd frorn tinlO t.o tii11e~, "\~re are s~dicring frorn your party's dt>ficits.'' reft't'nng to cldif'lts incurreJ bY the jl;~cllwraitf! )Jarty or by the squatter· party. \\c on thr~ s1ck arc supposed by hon. mcm­ben oppos1te to r~prcsent all the Adminis­n·ations who :.u!rllinist.cred the afi'ajrs of State b<-forP nearlv every m~mber on this side of the I-lonse, was horn. I cannot ;;:.a\. tlwt of mysPIL be, ausp I "as born the sam'C Y·"ar in ''hi eh the first Parliament wa" opened in Qn"cmland !Jy His Exccllencv Sir C~u.n·gc Bow<.'n. Prl'_~umably, although f ·v;us

-"qppurtcr of the• L:ib(·ral or l~riffith party, sup110sc I um Htddled "'il ith all the t:,ins

which nrc . .::aid to have been con1n1itted bv Sir Thom 'S Mcflw,·aith. I sav this of Si~· Thom 's ~-lcilwraith, howe,-cr:__although I belonged to and 'npportcd the Liberc.l party aud \HIS known as a G-riffithite-that Sir Thon1as J\.1clhrraith w_as a st atcsman, and had a knowkd:,., of finance · . .-hich enabled hitn to briug t!li~ State ont of the finallcial difficnltie., it was in at the particular lH'Yiod "\"then he took O\ C'r its clostinih. as ]each l' of th!! CoYcrnntPllt. J do not profl'ss to be an '"'xprrt in fina.nl·t~. I sin1plv kno\v it fro:Jt the home 'idP. r know tl1at if I ha,-e a pound. and spend 30s. I a1n goi11g to bcc0-1H~ hankrnpt. The Trca.surcr and th(~ I:IonH' Socrc•tar~7 collabol'atcd in 'vlwt I understc1nd they call pnndit·ship, and wrote certain art.ic]t -: upon political cconmnv in so1ne back roorrt. They n1u::-:t recognise u ntnv, perhaps. that thoro v f'l'P oth01· pundit'· and avpar­entl.v there is a spirit of enY;.7 'exi~ting no'v as to whetbt r 1·he pundH~ \vho ha Ye -~,1(·­<!{'t'JPd tlwn1 Hl'(' Hlpcrior to v,'hnt t~PV "':,er(', At that. tiu.-e the Home Serrdal'v ,\·as ono (,f 1 he J:t•ndit:-; 'n-ho a:;;sistecl the~ T\·0asurer 111 tc1c compilr,tion of this little treati-~ 011

LI:lon . .!. G. Appel.

8uppl~·.

politjeal ecoEon1:>. ,~ hich is \·cry i11teresting. My only ~orro"· is that, having "-ritten such an 0xcollent treatise-a treatise which is abolutoly correct-he did not. follow his own preccpte. I V·'nhnc to sa:,- that, if those }J~)n. gentlen1 "}n had convert0d their col­league • 'tho had not tH'at expel't knowledgP aud .,·ho wen not financial pundito, I would not be eriticising them to-day: rather would

I be SHllportlng t.hPm. Every [8 p.m.] memlwr of the Country party

wonld be snpportin;r them if thPy hrrcl l11>'11R''cd tho fln~enc0s of tlw State on ihc Ftl11C' JnJf':"i a:-; tllf~"'" 'Yrote this a;:; pundits in a ba.nk room. It IS just as "·ell that the g-eneral body of the electors of the State, through "Hansard" and through the Press­'vhich the Home Secretary desirls to sup· press-should l0arn the excellent pr<?cepts whiPh they laid down in thi, trcatis<'. The?

"A DEPLOR\BLE Fn:AXC:IAL STORY.

"DEFICfTS, S'GRPL"CSI~S) AXJ) OTHER APPE­~l'JSIXG ITE'l~.

"The Dcnham GovPrnmcnt is fond of talking of its surpluces. The word sur­plus sounds pretty and im-iting. It argue-> ~ound awl c·ai·oful go-rPrnnwnt. And. generally speaking, the ordinary elector does not analvso finance suffi­ciently to sec the imposition of it all.

" vY m1ld you be nuprised to know that the dcfieits of Liberal Governments since Queensland wa:;:. tnadc a r;;:0paratc colony­that is, from 1859 to 1914-have amonnted to £4,219,708; and that the much-talked­of surplus'' have only amounkd to £2,600,843' Of this surplus the M organ­Labour Governn1ent ·was rrsnonslbl(' fo1 one-halL ·

" That. mcam a total deficit cf £1,618,865.''

That is a tit-bit about the l\lor<;an-Labour Government. Sometimes thev disown Str Arthur l\1organ, but, when it 'suits them, it is "The1 1ior1gan-LaholU' Government." Those arc deficits covering a. period of fifcy­f>vo y<•,trs, from the inception of the State. In 1866 Gurney's Dank failed, and every· tl1ing fell with a smash. I\o money was available. As p, little boy I remember ',he rrrilw11y m~n walking in batche> to Brisbane. "·Lich was then only a sma.ll town, without any n1o1wy--n~cn vdiJ had Leen in _compara~ tivolv aHincnt circurnstancPs reduced to povr~·ty. ThPrc \Yas a shm1p in the revenue. Those ddiciL tlny rcfc'r to wore c:mscd by a falliug revenue, not by a rcvenuf' Ruch. as thu present .li.d:n1ini ... t~·ntion havp lHvtl. whiCh has incre \ "d by a.lmost lOO ]Wr cent. from the time they lock pc'··c-sion of the Trca· snrv bcnclY'"'. Let us for one n1o1nent [ll'dlyfJe th1~. .._-1,ccor-ding to the hon. gentle­man' ow·1 treatise on the subject. the total ddl< its for fifty-fiye Y"[trs ~ u1onnted to £1,618,865. I cnp\looe boiL gentlemen opposite oftpn L 1 \-e a littlP langh togC'thrr about the way they fonled the people ,,-!Jen they talked about deficits. Deducting from the accumu­lated deficits thP rcn"'-m0nt of £145,000 \Ybich ibe Tr1 1surer h~s ~rr1ado. in five years thev have an accumulated deficit of £415,000. ThC Tro·l.,urcr has told n3 in his Financial St,ilemcnt that he anticinatc·, for the current YC~t· a dcfir·it of £465 000. Th<'ir adminis­tration will by then h;Ye cm·cre-d a period of a little over six years. They aro the pnetv of. "no doficita," who 'varned the elect"ors of the danger of deficits. You can

Suppl!J.

realise. ~lr. I(inYan, lHlW it ':trract0d the­electm:s on that pn rti< ulm occa'·ion. Their revenue has he0n ll}( ca~rd lJ\ ahnost 100 nor cf'nt .. and \'Ct their ar·< mnulated deficit ~s £870,COO. I' l.ase aln ady indicated the t•J1oublc~ which "·e,' pasc;cd through by diJfer· nt ),dministration in the early history of Qncdlsl nd. \Ye find thai the average cL'lc!t '"' · that pcrioJ \\·ns £29,000 ·per RHllr.rn. Thr pr, -;ent Administration are ahvays r:!sting np tho,-J~ f1pf'lrits as a r_c~ec­tirm again.<t mcmlJers of the Opposition. These. gcntlrnJen, "·ho claim. that th_eir fi11anc€'s l'C' in such a sonfld position, dunng their terrn of office haye h:<d deficits an1ount­ing to avcl'age of £145,0~0 per a1_1num. Yet they '"''nclcr that we nnnot credit the asRcrtiot~s th('Y 1nake as to thP ~onnrlnr.;s of the positio], :

l\lr. Krxo: To say nothing of the increased taxation.

Ho:-:. ,). G. APPEL: I ahead· havo imli­c-atcd thctt. If they had not in1posed thrit additional taxation, which has bled the econon1ic Jifo out of the State, thoi1· accnmn­latcd deficit would have amounti-d to £8,000,000. These hon. g<'ntlcnwn claim the rcnewod eor•fidencc of the electors of the Sbtc. and blame hon. members of t.he Opposition-th,. g-reat majority of whom ,., ere not born for vea.rs after these dci-1cHs oceuned-·for th<' deficits of all previous Achnini·~trations. and which avC'rage, a.s I :,ay, 01,Jy £29,000 per annum. Yet their acc.:unHdatcd deiif'it.s f(Jr six \ears \rill an1onnt to an avpragc of £145.000 'pcl' avrnun!

Tho HmlE Sl.:CHET.\RY: Yon are absolutely \\Tong.

Ho.!-1. J. 0. APPEL: It is vcn easv to sav we a.re wrong-. but l have tak~n tl;P Trca­surC'r's o1vn figures. I kno-w tlleir o\:·n figur0~1 arc wrong. I knOv1 the '""ay in which hon. p·cnt!emon on that side of the Housr, can 1na ni pnln t0 fig-nrc s. T'hcy gi ye us figures. I w:>nt it pnf in black and "hi le tlwt tlw hon. gcntlt'nwn's figures arc wrong. 'rhey arc bis flgur0s, nnd, \Yh01 lH: is confronted "·ith hie: O\Yll figure.:. he secs the dangn that xna.y rc~uh h, n those figures , re rnade publi~, and when tl1e gcnc,;al body of elec­b;rs reaJi~e the position th<d. his fignres an" wrong.

Thr' BO.\lE Sr::CHETAHY 1 ~·aid thnt liors can figure.

Hm·:. :J. C. APPi~L: I quite J'<'alise that. (Laughter.) The Lon. gcntlC'ttlan ~ays th(tt the hgnrc· nru \Y~ ong. l quite reall~o that. He j ~ q_uit-• c~J,Tect. ft ,,_·ill be simply a ,..,-:.uning to tB 1 o wci.{:h any llgurcs tha.t 7ntmbc't' of 1h_ ,'\dminJstra1·ion rnay present with t~o ob_iC'ct npp.~n·ni !y of d(~erlYing th dc:::tor;.; of tlw Stn.te.

11r. JlALT=",LY: -You c,·;qnot coUJJ[· an nntici­pat,;c1 dt:>fie. 't ii'l \vith ·n actual dPfieit.

Iiog. J. G. AP1>EL: Ca11 nrn realise the vu ition, ~,Ir. KlnYan? ~

The Rr ''·ET.\Rr FOR Pc m. re 1.-\XO~: Cheer up.

ilo~:. ,J. \~ . ..::\FPEL: ] <·<Ul as-:ul'f) tlw hon. geadr'J~.an if he C'Ul!J(' into ront-v-·t 1'\"lth a P.'~rnbcT of unforrun-ttC's tl1at l baye. h~~ 1vonld re li~o the seriou~ur~R of the posi­tion. It i~ n position ,._·hich cannot l' • di~­Jnir- -cd Eg1Jtly L~, wry of a"' joke. It is no joke. I mn an old s<'hola1· ~,f th, Xonnal SchocJ, <.1nd lust \Y\ ~k I n1r: rnany olcl sf:hool­:rna.tes of n1inc \Yhn \VC're f·,irl~ prosperous, and who 'had their little homes, and I found them pnt<ctically in tlw guttPr. Yc·t these

7()3

1r·~·n~ t ~tl' lll('ll V· ho a hYtlY: ad \·an1 :,d thr it tcr<''h of the State.

Tht- bell indiratr(1 the hrm_ tncn1bcr'~ tinw lH d expired.

TJw l!O::\JE SFCTUZT-\RY: )'on cut nfl' your life ·,tery at a 1!1\ -···T interPsting p~int. (L;;ug·l>t0r.)

:\Ir. D.\Sll (Jiu r~· .(JI!Urm): con-grrtulate the Tt ca:-<urcr on the eilicic~nt rnan~ Jn•t· jn 1' hidt he lws prP:3Cntecl the Financull Stah•m< "t. I int<•Jl<l to de' J "·itl1 some of tlJt~ ,~trttcuwnt~ of lwu. lllC:lnUer~ opposite ,, hen t),cy rn to tdl the "·orkers o£ Qaccns-1. nd rhnt the',- cere thl'ir hie' d,;. 1 will deal "·ir!J the inrh~stri"J ituntion for a few Sf a~·s back an cl lJoiut out 1 o the 1vorkers \V hilt tlns Lab~ur nloYuutcnt and .also the indu.stria1 H!OYC'tnl'llt had to go through tv briug about ~Oll!l' of the refonn~ that \YC lta\'C' to-day. \\'{' kuow tlu.1' it "" a.s the• iuclu.,Lrial l\·orkcrs of this State '".d1o pLlt up a fight solnG years ago fur the purpose of kccpiug _-\n~tralia for the white 1·ac~. \YQ kuo1v that serious ..attc1npts 1\.C'rc n1al1e b~, the cn1ployers in the err]·,- drr s to iutl'odu<·P ('Olonred Jabour into a1m;)St c\,cr:· indu"trc\-. \Vc know that. prior t{j the rnaritnnc ;;trlke. wh,_::n the .Au.-.tralian Steamship :\aYigation Co1npany pnt China~ H!en into their f.hlps to work, that the sea-1JJ'H Hltd "·att~r::'icle \Vorkcrs l'C'flh-ed to \vork while tho.-:e ChinanH n re1naincd in thos(' ships. That strike Ja,tccl for a few weeks. Out the SC'an1rn 1\ Prc surce:'_:-;Jul in getting rid of the L'binan1cn fron1 the boats. Lai·e•:. ·whC'H the industrial ·workt)rs realised t1~at an n ttPtnpt was being n1adc bv the pa~toralists of (Jueenslnnd to increasP't.•the nun1bf'-r of l'hinnnH:n and colonrL'rl aliens 1vhu wer:t~ "·orking in the )Ja,toral industry, they decided at one of their conforences that th8 Chinamen a.ncl tliP coloured aliens had to go, o30 far a~ they were concerned, frotn the pastoral iudusny. They knell that this <·ould not be done without a great dea[ of hardship on somo of the workers, and t};qt thr• workers would .haYe to suffer. Immedr­atelv the workers stnrtul out on their cam­J>aiglL we lmmv that t.ho U·w<'rnment of the da.,1· stood behind the pa,-torali.'to and assistcJ th0111 jn C'Yel'~7 \V~ty to try to defeat the 1,-orkt·r, in that inclnstt·~v· The dis}Jut<~ Px.: c:1eled. O\T0l' tho whole Conunon-.; t'alth. A good d(~al hw-; been s~ticl up 1-o the prp-,ent tinJP a.bont tLP LUH'Inploye(l aud the amount oi tnonr \' vpen1~ b~r thr~ UoY01'1111H'nt on the nneu>ployccl. \Vo kuow that in the early d . ~ \Yhen the indu2rri al up he 'l val 1vas on. tlH' a(~·euts the GoY('rlln1Clli. [ldvertised 1.: the Prc -·- th1_t au:;one 1Yho was prepa.refl

sea b on his fellow-workers would 1rith r. iiotl:<. It n'~-tv bt~ nf~\\'J to

ou tl!l.-:~ siclc. a;., ,yr_)ll a's hon. xnenJ­.o; on tile other ~icL that the Governn1Pnt

uf i h0 c;ay ~pent £J71 COO of the public TnonL:,v tq dcf ~tt the "'·orktr,; in the :Gght the~- ;,·ecP

up for a wbitP .::\llstralia. \Vc kno·,, \V' rkcrs got blnmcrl f(n· a good clca! crimes that 1..'l'f' coJun1ittcd when

VYf'i'- Lurnr do.,cn b~, tho en1ployers th<'•n:-wl C". Snm:_; of the \Yorkers in tbof.:e tiaJe< had to suffer the penaltv, a.nd wo know llll ,1bcrs ''~re f-.ontcnccd io V long tern1s of impriso~uncnt. Howeyer, the Labour moYe­ntent ha r:trriod on. \Ye hear a good deal n bout ronnel-table ronff'n'llC( ~- Hon. Ineln­l)crs oppo-sitE' :,ay ,. Lf't us scrap the .Arbitra~ rion Act ancl back to the old days when th0 0mploy<'l' used to med tho employee ronnrl a table." \Ye know that another .-ery

ilfr. Dash.]

794 Supp'J. [AS;~E:\JI3LY.J Svpply.

Lig uphcnal t< ok p]a,:e in 1911, whQn the ·workers in thu ~ugar industry \vero \vorking for a very t-:nlall wage a1.1d uncler bad con­ditions. \Ve lmo1 the present Home Sec­retary at that tin1o v, as s1;cretnry of the An1:tl;'tttlHti....;J \Yo ker'-'' _\·-.3ociation of Quet~lJ ·::la1•d. n ntl lH• ~ot" to tlu::: ( mployen~ and to the Coj )nial Refining Cunqmuy as W''l1, L~ki:.g thcnt n1C('t rcpn•.-,cJJtati'. '-:i

of the Anw 1 .s-:-u:nntt~d \Yorkcr~/ .. -\ssor1ation in co1Jkrcnc0 for th:=- lf\UJlD ~c of t·r:·-illg to c nnu t8 v ··1 arnu. ·f'ut to r~H~ w ancl tions c~ 'n·",Jng in th') su -ar try. got the '-tmc old sterc•otyped reply-

,, y·our lt ttu_· a: so~~~nd-so to hand, and we :re of tho opinion that no good

ean bt'- SC'l'\"C'll L,\' nH~!:ting yuu in

...:\~ you kno,Y, 1\Ir. l(i;" ltl!, when that strlko took place tho GoYcrnJnr~nt of the day set up ww __ cs botnds a ncl E'tH1cavourcd to try and bludgeon the \York rs ba<'k to work under th _ SG' per.alti''' th, t could poP ,ibly bl irnpos' on thorn. \'\-~e know that e\-cl at that tiruo tllo GoYer: 111ent '' ero hohind the cn1ployors. They aLso c",tablidll)d '' r-::r:ah" bureaux in C'\'erv State in the Conlnlon1:calth for th-2 purposO of l'Ccruitillg '· ~~cJbs'' and sending tbcn1 to work in the sn·sar industry. Tho strikn \Vns carried on for smnc t.in1e. It would b0 intrrc-;ti--5 to know '\'-'hat those worl;:e1 :c 'W0rc striking· for in 1911; and it is just as ''"ell for the ',;orkcrs in the ~11~'-'lX jndll~try f-J-Cla-,- to the eonclitions tlmt IYi'!·(~ < :~C't'atillg. \YhPn i ~)ublo took placP. \Y(' hr_vn hl'tu_l~ c10al fron1 hou. mrm-hcrs opposite n bout- tlJc• \York that tho a!:itators put in iu ronnPdion '"ith i·hc worker- in the en'" nr i11du·~tn'. The run­clition _in tlw sug~r industry~ "at that tirne wr·re mi~ything but good. The waq:es paid were about the worst that were paid in anv part of tlw Commomvealth. -\Vlwn th~ workpr.s ~ot out to fight, they were fighbng for nn Pight-hour day in the 1nill and field, nloclifi:':-·.tion of a[.!,'l'l·f'lncnts, ancl thr abolition of the eln.u-J~ reLttiug to b,n1np;e~. Th0 n1illi­mtun wap;e that thf'y were asking for at tho time WJ.R 42s. per wc:•k, without kc0p, for mill ha.nds, 42s. JWr \Ycek, "-ithout keep, for field hands, aud lOs. )l-'l' day, "•ithout keep, for canPcuttt'l'~. In those days in eyery sugar <iislrid in Quc•.nsland the mills worked con­tinuouHly fr01n ~Jonday rnorning till Satur­day nir~ht; ,,; or king two ~hifts of twf'lvo hours. In sornP mills the men had to tak<' turn about with an hour off for lunch, so that tltoy Wdrked clen'n hours actually, In the fields t·hc gaugs worked ten hour..: a day, anrl in smn<\ inst !IlCP~-\ the '' ork wa~ limit,,d to the hrJUr' o£ Llaylig'ht. The wugPs 1'a1d at that tinte ,,-r:•rc--

"1\Iill hnnd::;, 22, 6d. pL·r v,'pek io 27""· 6r 1• pr·r Wt- k aJJcl fuuntl for ~ixtv­:::-lx hours lJL'J' '' ek. GoYPr;nncnt mi 1 i~. 3d. to 6d. p<'l' huu aurl kerp. In tlw llc•ld, 22i. 6<1. to 27.'. 6r1. per week and kc,np. anrl a pro pod innate rcclnctioiJ in ,,;ngrs fur t1uH., 11 not wor~~\·d.''

To-da:y, thrcng-h the advoc~.cy of the I'cpre­scnt,ltiH-' of the workers, and through the assistance that has Leon rendered hv this Government, the workers in this in'dustrv <ll'e in rcc,ipt of Ycry Inuch higher \VagBs tlwn tlwv were reeei,·ing at that time. The wages to-da.v arc•: -Mill labourers' In No. 1 district, £5 12s. per week and keep; in No. 2 district, £5 Ss. per week and keep; in "'o. 3 district, £5 Os. 6d. per \\"eek and keep, The otlH'l" ratcp WPl'C' inetea~··..:d in accordance

with the scL·cclulc. Field worker,: No. 1 dis_ trict, £5 fo, per \\cck for week of forty-eight hours; No. 2 district, £5 per week for week of forty-eight hour'; Xo, 3 .district, £4 12s. per w- ek for we. k Df forty-eight hours, {:T,:der th:' old sv;;ten1 if a. v orkcr lo;,t anv ti!r~C: that tin10 '.cas deducted, but to-daY these woi'kc:·s rccci ve the full weekly wage uu]t-,,, there is a bre,kdown in the mill or thL)rc i.s an;y other accident c.1uscd through no fault of tho m-illo;o'i·ncr. The nwst objoc­tionab],, thing in the "·hole matter was the qncstioa -of tlw clgrcmnc·nL E;rcry person Y.'ho -,, cnt to wud.;: I or -Youn3 Brothers, of Fairyi11CaU) h_;rl to cign a£1 .agrc 'rnont on thcoc lin('s-

" Tho fullo,Ying _,re- the eon·Jitions nndcl· -,",hi rh ('YCl'V 1Yeeklv ~er\-a.nt is ('11' nv.~·d on 1Yfc3sr~. ~ ... \. I-I. ~rld E. Yonnz-'s ';_~dation:-

1. An labonrers sball '?rvc the crn­ployrr as n1ill or field labourrr3 0:1. !1:13~ of the s.'lid plantations ~., hrn? rl'qurrect fron1 tirnc to time by tho t·.ntpl(>,'lCf, ~h

f~-'kly s·_:rvant3,

2. 'Vhen \Yorking in fic·ld the huurs of 1ork shall l.Jl' ten (10) hourJ each \Yorking dny. except Sat,urda._'7, when tho of work sLall be eight (8), bni ~.\ \\·orking in the 1nill Ecleven ill) lwms r .'r dcl,y, and Pight (8) on .'-'at'-tl'dhy.

,~. L ,)Jf tn•rs. ~hall obc\~ all la-wful n ,sun~tblt• cmnnHtnd~ of the oni­

c·r. or auy ovt1 l':)C't2l' appointed by '"" ploy0r, and shall conduct thom­

.,,1\. _, 1n .a proper 1nanner.

Lctb(JUl'Pr.'3 are to be provided '\ ;th born·d nnd a.cconunodatio!l luring· rlw cDlctinwuicc of their employment. anrl charg-ed thercfor at the rate of ]2.;. IYeekly.

5. La.bonrf'r:-< are to be paid wages at th0 ra"' o£ 36s. w<'ckly (less 12s, for L.urd). but a peoportionato part of -=;ndt w.:~-C'" ~hall b ~ dcduet·~d in rc:Jpect nf an.v da.y or port~on of a day 011 Vi hi eh, fTonl c.n::~ c.>lbC whatever, thoJ cl,, not work.

6, The' cmplo,·er may trenninato the hiring at any time, in which _caso the lauonn'l' shall only bo ent1tlod to rtcP.ivc a JJroportion of that current wr-L•k'R \Yagcs, calculated frorn thn beginning of the week up to the term­i!la1 ion of the hiring.

J. t.lt<' undL·rsi gncd. acknow lad go tha& I. ha vP bPc•n cnga.gcd un-der the above eonJ1tlons.~'

.-\ lot ha:-: L•~rn saill during this Ulscu_,sion in COllilL'Ction with in1rr1igration. 'Vhon this dispute was on in 1811, the employers were : uc('r~ fu1 thro1u2;h their "scab" bureaux jn g0ttjn~ hold of-a nurnber of irnmigrants to "'O Hp to the canefiL'lds; but on a1~rival at tlw c·n n('tields these ,_, orkcrs realised that it was not right to go to work and they refused t(J do so. T.b0y were in1mecliately summoned b.v thr Colonial Suga.r Hefining Company. This ocr·urred both at Cairns and Childers,_ and '"hC'n the cas<-' Wf'l'C bronght on the­r()nditin':,·;; \Y('l~C rn·oyrcl in C'ourt to be a~tonllcllr.g. 1 will road a Aurnrnarised report of tl1l' Childcr_; c1 c, so that hrm. members '"ill nndt•r'-tand how the oYod~t'l'S \H'l'C dealt -H:ith. and 11oYv tlH'Y \Yore bei11g trC'atcrl. The r0port reads-

" The poljr'l' court ease', invulving

[16 SEPTEMBER.] Supply. /M

sixty-th:-e.c n1cnj including in1migrants engaged 1n ::1:·dncy for the crushing soa.­~on at the Colonjal Sugar Refining mill, who join0rl tlw strike camp and worf' snnHllOl'l!'d b~v the gc'lt1 ral manager vf th' C'nlnnj;d Sn.~;:n· Hcfin-in;.- n1il1 to a:n .. ,wc·l' a (·1w.rge ~-nf l1nla;yf-:_d1y l'(•fusing to .~uLll the agL ''n1cnt under the I\fastcrs

..:\c '-, ·Vaf. concludod to-Jay. hr·ll·ing. The 0a~c of

t·~l \c·n :-;: a tr~t ca'.·P. in sun mjng up, co:m­

of g-nidn.Ec~ in plain­tonchitH~· the cu tom.Lr5·

1uentioncd in HL Colonial agrccJYwnt \\'ith the

<1i1•l \ .. f~·', ernphatic \vi'_h reference '"''" r;·or·s (!>Ir. H. Helm's) refusal

•: ilw stn..tl'l11C'nt of a rn lU doputccl I_n,~~t·•;;; to la:: a c :nplaint against

fc.oct: Tln:;;: ~lu.u;n j·~ :-(tid t·h(' ;,,.,--, l'' ): n·d [;I

a.lJ tin; 11 JW.•l' c _,nlpJ<iiJ]t.~ 'fl.CU~ .1+2 !lH'll lD"'t~'rtd uf ..., nd1ng :do11g' agJtator , a they ('allod 1h tl. fl'ont tb0 nmon. ! }Jave no o~Jje(·:.ion to the tN'JJl ·• agita.to ... "

::\Ir. ro~nLLO: "\ pl''tfc -iolwl a~:it.1· Ji'.

'\Ir. ]).\SH 1 do not object to th~t either, bCf'R11SC' 1\C 1\.l:l<JW, ·whnn ll1('1l arr· cioi11g the wor:~ of their c mlraclPs, they are hurting the bo::sc.:, .;:-_nd that is rlw· epithet thro11n at the ·workers· rcprt'S('ntativc·s: but it doE' 2> not tlo us an:· JJamL The loackr of the Opposition is a prof0:-:.sion.-J l agitator, so far as that is ('OJJC't1rtlPd. To-day hr~- ls the professional agitiltor of tht' Country party, although he is not a f~nn1rr. ThC' reprcsontatiyes of the worL 1·s have br·cn selrcioJ from the inJustry in \Yhich thr y arA emplo:; cJ, and I fail to sec how thr loaJer of the Oppooition C.J.Il

be a tl'tH' re 1 n··:~- ntati.;c of the men employed in t!w farming inchu-.tr;~. The. rrport con­tinues-

'' Tlw polic~ magistrate found that the man worked U} hours a shift. With rdcrence to the Roman Catholic.' under the a q:recnwnt, he said that if they declined nwat on Fridavs there was nothing to take its place i!1 the fare."

Evidcntl~v. when these men ,.·ore not a.ble to have meat on Friday, they were not given anything olsf> in its place-

" He found fault with the bathroom, which, he said, was in a filthy state when lw inspected it."

Those were ~omo of the ec>nditionE the workers had to put np with in some of tho mills, anrl we heard the hon. member for Bm·rum the otlwr uight say the Colonial Sugar Hofining Company was the best com­pany in Anstralia. 'l'hat is the way they trC'ntcd their \Vorkcrs before the agitators got amongst them_, and I am veJ"Y pleased the agit<tms did get amongst them. The report f'.ontinucs- ~

"The sleeping accommodation, with ''hi eh defendant found fault, the police ntagistrate thought was good, but the sink for washing plates. knivc,, etc., he thoug11t, was not equal to t.hc requil·e­Hleuts of so n1any m0n at meal ti1nes."

l n tho ·<' days you got a knife, fork, spoon, and plate, and when you had finished your meal y.m bad to roll them up in your hlank' t. so t.hnt they would be there when ;·on wanted tlH:m next time . . ~1!'. C\.J~n'F,LLO: You ·were never in a shear­ing .sh,·d in yonr life when you say that.

~fr. DASH: will take vou on at stock-riding <>t tin1". You iio not like this.

·n.w you arc n:pn\.;,cmting the [8.30 p.:.1 I cla.ss th;t is :dways np against

- rlw work('r, aL.l it is jw:;t as ·well rliat· rlw ' or>.•r c:lfoulrl kno•:; it-

J1(J'

fonnJ no lie ht was quarter~- pnor to

when the the ntf'n strnr·k Ju.:;tico in sup­

found that the agrf·cn:;~; \va:-;

;·n 'f.!.l'C( 1{: nnd('r rh 2\.1~:·-tc•·:'i n<l _Lt, jn that rho 1ncn ,-l:r~ Luund,

c;;:--v uf thi 1 • Ii re .i.rnrnigrants ., ork -·he~ rcrp1ired durL.·~

but. on tlH' od- '1' hand, the dif-,:ni~;'C'd hy the Colonial

.1o· C\!lJJlHtll\'" • rnnnE>.nfs Tht' ~a· j • 1vith

:\obee

1'1( state tha~ the""~7 are ,-iHull;Jion::; 1\-orker. bra f1ev ·have

~~-'\'l'l' ]~:-(:·~1 tfw Inpions of nw ,,-Orken, ,,~1-d I <l.:-,n! ' ]11'1"\H:r thr'.Y h.1n_· 0\·rr 1-rorkod \f1·.y hnrd Jht•.l:.;(•ln..,s. \Vf' aL:··o t good (k·;J Ln r h0 "\Yhite l1'J]ioy. Tht~- .1 lr'11lPIJt l ~r 1de thr nt~ll?.J' night that thr· nf hnn, nu..,rllhor;=; npposjte were ·_j,·i11[ l n<~·rt'll'i"' to roLnn-:.."d ;·l1rn"l j" qulte t ru:.-. \Vlif'll thc.::.e et\Yards 1\·~·n, rnadf·, we f(•unfl i lun LriL~..; ·were· ht>ld {)nt h.v ('olrn1red <! J1c·~J:-. to the t''wployers in orde-r to defeat t111: ,,, nhL, \Y(• ·c1~e Pll('(,•.,-.;fnl jll obtaining ollP h:tt~r dlil·h w:1 1·.-rittrn, and wer0 able ~o pr·•Yt.., to the l ourt thai th0 colonre-d a_liens were b'•iug glYell preference in the industry. Thi~ i" <' cop:- of t.hc le,trr in q1w,tion-

" Innisfail, 17th FdJruar,l', 1915. ··I hercln· agr(~e to C'Ut all f'Rne on thn

farm of F'. ~E. M. Annstrong at Goondi and on th• furm of F. J\1. .-\rmstrong, 11 Bo.cio. Goondi, 111 n :--atisfaetory 1nannc:-r r'or t-he ;.unl of 5". 6d. per ton all round, and hrreLy tl'ncl~..'l' tho stun of £25 b;.' IYay of depo::-<it j such an10~1nt to hr reiaiEcrl lw F. :\I. Armstrong m the ('V('tlt of llly not starting the cutting.

·• (Sgd.) 'l'A"NA SINGH. ·· ~'ituc.s,;-(Sgd.) F. l\I. Armstrong."

At 8.35 p.m., ~Ir. P. A. CoOPER !)/,·(mu·), o1to of the

•rernporar::. Chairrnen, rclir-vPd ihe Chairm.an. in the du_ir.

Mr. DASH : Tlwc;o rnon who profess to ha.-e n Jot of '·' mpatby with the unrlllployed wt•ro roeeiviug brib(_..,S fron1 colouroJ aliens t<J )m ye thri r crops tn k~n off. Tho'C\ are dw ta('tiC-J of hon. ruf'tnbers oppo~ite, aucl the.y do not like to hear that statement.

I rmnen1be:r anothC'r in ~ancc \vherc the workers asked for a confcrC'nec with their <'mployers in the mining indnstry. Before we had any Induotrial .. \rhitration Court, we eud('ayoun~d at one tirnf' to get a c:onferenc·e "-ith tho Cloncurry n1ine rnanagcrs and own('rs in that di~trlct, and the conference 1\-~ls ·agreed to. \YhPn 1vc n1et round the tn lJJe y (' found that the 1nincowner8 were not prcnarcd to give 1>ay in anything. V'\le Rat for~ two or thrPc clays in conference, but rrcrin:~d no con8ideration 1-dwtov0r. '.rhe 1ninco1vners n~alisC'tl that th<' 11nion 1\-'a~, 1naking prog-I'C'SS in the Clnncnrr,v district rtbout that time. Shortly a ft••n.-a rds they happfmed to get ho1tl ~,f ;1 fe,~{ ~impletons, nnd they thoug-ht they \l·ould lw able to ddC'at the union. TllC'y tolcl !he'e men rhot

Jfr. Dash.]

796 Supply. [ASS.KilBL Y.]

tlu~y W(l'C going to give theru good conditions and splendid \Yagcs, and the meu believed then1. They itnnwdiatdy set about getting tickets printPd for a new union, and sent literatut'c round to different parts of the district. \Vhile that y, .cs going on the othN workers in tl~e ir;_du~try ccased"\Yor!~,,as tl;cy \YCnJ dctf'l'ln1nrd to pnt ilw scau · u1uort under. 'l'hc Hampcleu-Clo11curry Copper Conq1an~,' told tile mcu that thf'Y wcro going to bring about bf'ttcr conditlons. nnc1 that the new union I'YuulJ Le a ·• (lillktun"' miner;-; -Hnd smclt('r,..,' uniou. Th(' uu•s:::.enger fron1 rhc llampdcn-ClonculT;-; 1\lilh _ Lirnitcd. after paying n, cheque for an accL1unt) was unfor­tunate in droppiug th€' receipt and duplicate (Jll his \\'ay Lad{ io the n1i110'-", nnd I haYP

a ccnv of the t1ocunlcnt hen'. Tb '-lC' tll'f' tho tuctj~~ which s-ollH' of the brrckrr:-3 of scnne ltoll. n1ernlH:r:-; opposite ado1lt ill order to trv t-o dc>f(•Ht tlr(' I'C'al nnlon. ThP doeumPnt l'f'~td~-

[COPY.]

"THE ILI~il'DE:\-CLo:-;ccRRY CoPPER }lr:-;Es. LDIITED.

'' Friezland, Yia Cloncnrr,v, K.Q. "Dt·. to IY. Lcighton, Friezlnnd.

'' Cheqnc :"-ro. 2085. Date. Particulars. :'\et.

1913. Jtme 20-To c-ost of adY<·rtisiug and

prelin1inar,\7 cxpcn:5c.s of IY c-\orn \Yorkcrs' Tn-dn-trial A"u<·iation £50

·· Pa:-:-::ed for payment. Chairma u £SO

" \Y c. certifv that th<· a bon• ,um wa, cxpc'nded fUl' the benefit of the Hampden­Cloncnrry Copper Mines. Ltd.

"ERLE HL:NTLFY. Gcm'ral l\Iaoager. "vY .. J. Drummond. AceoHntant. ~

"'RerciYf'd tbc sun1 ()f flfty pouucb stg. in full settlement of th" aboYe account. '"FnTEZL.\XD & SELWY~< Pc-RLISHr~.;G Co ..

'· 21•t .June, 1915." LTD .. pPl' H.1\.

Th~se are some of tho thing:c. the \Yorkcrs had to contend ,-ith in tho,;c <iUYS when thcv were tryillg to gt't jushre. rr1l~~ f;dnic pra~­lico 1\·ould haYe been in operation to-dal' it hon. n1Pmlwrs opposit-e could have got l;at"k on the Tn:n:'itLr. lH~nchP~. TlH'y \Yould hayn in V rfc•rt l \\ ith tlH ind11; j riftl legislation pa ... .;c·d lJ_v the CoYerun~c_,llt. antl brong-ht !he ,., orkct·s beck to tlw old law of suppl,, anJ ch.:l!l£Ll~c1. lcuYing thc1n to rush ahtHl<t for work wlwreYer ~hey c·ould get it. )~et they statu tha! tncv an~ out to ~nu That the' \Vorkcrs get hiih wagef'. If the HampdcnTloncnny Com]Hlll,V were out to ~ec thut the rn0u got high wages, whv did >hey SJH'IH1 £50 for the Jllll'tJOsc of foster, inU" a ·' !' orga11isation, jn order to defeat. gt nnlon \Yorkel', ? \'I,Thcn thj,~ nu1tter Y a.,;; bronght before tho Arhitcltion Court on a r·o:r!lpubory confrrf'llt'._', the in(lg-P, aft1~r hc~lring the rnattel', n1alle an ord0r tfwt tla: propos~d nuion ehould he abolished, ns it was a bogn;::; organisation dcsi~·1wd for thf• purpose of defeating tlw 1York.,rs in t1H mining incJu,(ry. '['he leader of the Oppo i, tion, in his jndictm·'nt ag-ainst the G-overn­ment, baid that the,!' failed to eall Par1i, -mcnt together to deal \Yith tho ?v1ount l\lor­gan qur-stion. ProYision is !.nadc undu· the­Industrial Arbitration Act for a comuulsory oonfcrence. When I made the statome~1t th;t the Secretary for Public vYorks could su•-

[Mr. Dash.

p('nd cu1.Y a \Yard in opel'ation in Quccusfand1

the kaccr uf tlw Oppo,ition said that he pre:Stunod it \Ya3 uudpr spction 92 of the .L\_ct. I 1nav tell the hou. l11C'lL'ber tlwt it is not ,,,ctio!J L2 which gin's the JIIinister that

tht' Lou. 1llC'n1her, ·who i::-. a lawyer, I arlYise hjrn To ]ook lliJ tlP1

~L'(· if hl' can f:nd the~ i_,_,ht section.

A Y1:r.Y illlportant ~t-atPl1iC'll1 '•nts 1nado ,y}n_ t i.ht> big indu ~..:.'ial lljJht.'HYHl took ]llaC'H 1n tlH· l'arly da:·"', LJy ~~ 11!<111 \Yt•ll-kno\Vll in Ch:11'tt r-. To\\ I'!"~. and. in fact, all over

.L \'\'. \YanL Ti! thr"') da_vs \Yil nl was ~ f'C'rriarv of tliP nujon, a11d

rc;_di-.ed thr1t tbc.• {'~tusc · OJ tlw \Yurkcr:s \Va~ just. but, llk<• t'oruc l1on. mr>1nlwrs opposite, h hn~ left thP LaLmur rrJO .ccnwut aiJd gone oYt'l" UJ tht; ot h0r ·-ide. l-lL• ','.'HR a frequent cori'L:'-Jii)rHlPn! of thP .. \Yorkcr" in thoS£• da_y:,, ar~d it ~, ,-r·I'Y iutc·rc· tillg to kno\\ hi~ OlJini(lll (lf rb1· Uurc-rnnH:>llt of that day. He -.vut do\vtt J-hi.-. suggc.•f:-tion--

.. It is to <ollect one thou .. ,md bnshmen j nto a (__ 'llllp. let the GorcrnnHnt pro­el:linl them nncl force it to take the \\ holp t hou~u nd vrisoner;-:..

·· Iu_·nH•c1iatelv t-heY take u1w t 1Jou:-;and \, '' put a uothe;. thoil'n nd into the field fol' thc·tn to take al~o aud :-o OIL unti1

e Fit <'YC'l'Y gaol or pri~on they huvo or u:Jril tla' (;ovcrntnPut lw;:; <1b~or1Jf'd ot';" i'\·dt"l'J.tiull.

·· l-L· th111ks about fin: thousand Jlri· 'J!lt•rs ,\ou]d rnakt> tlw capitalistic L;o ,prnmf'l:t ll'l'l like the "wkc that ~·- uPo,Y<'d tlH: packt:t of pill~ .. ,

rl'lutt \\l::t!d al~o Le tht> opilliOll of tho \YOl'kt·r if Ilti'tuLH'J"S oppo . .-il(.' p-nt on to these 1>< ilciH·, I <lu no~ thiuk thev Y>'ilL because tilt' \-\ork(:i'-: arc~ 1,\idea"\\ake r;ud t~1cre is no c_·hanl't' nf }:oiL n1f'JHlJer.-; uppo3itc hood· 'illkille! th<'m i11 that waY. Aft0r the 1911 ~ugar ~ti"iLu• <1nd thr> 1912 'tratnwH,\" ::>trikC'- in Jhi~lwnt·, the Ton· Con•rnmt·ut thought they '' :Hlld du :--(llil<'th{u~· to trY to deft•at unlon~

Labou~· nwvcinl'nt. f believe it t to look np tho history of tho HluYC'Il1C~:t, lJ>:>C '.HSC I e ought to

kno\\' 1 1_!a tla:" lh•lpt_•d to bring about the

t·nndiri(Jll uf Uitioni~ln that \YC' h1YC' to-day. \Ylw.l tl •' indu:~trial Pc•ace Hill wt~.'i intro­du Td. rh·.· ho11. l!H'mbr>r for :iv1nri11a, aa

·don p,'c;e 657 uf '· Ilan~ardn of 1912,

·· .\.1 nn\· 1'<\ 0, it "ill do 110

ft• ·l :--ut·~· 1t will do a iLe IH'OJlk'

tbi." G .. y ·rnn10nt (Hl' •.r. hun !). "

Ir i'"' qllit·_' dfL·rcPt to-e: bcc·nH:-,C' they Ji(·\. r r.___•;_di~t·d t!Jat th(' ]Hirt~" '.vould _!.!·a in ccmtl'ol of the 'l'na .nr. bC'nchcs, and

en dw , Ad ,,-hich would of dJHL' c·olrlmnuity. The

};on. ·Hdh :· sp ·king on 21st Jul_\', 1812. on tht• same Hj\J. as J"Pported on r ~-~~ G06 of · JJun:Sarcl." ~aid~

t1JC' appointn10111, l}i the ~ mutters will

'•'l\ t ntcn ldOlC ;::;nti.;:;-nctor\- to th0so rncJ thnn if the po:-;-i:.ion' "\Vcre left.

U.:, n 1.;:; t pn'-..enr. ') _ \;ld ou (' ::1·.:}7, he i~ n·portt J to hay,-.. :~a1n 01_1 S'pten!LLr of lhu EWinP ycar-

Tll,~' tr·,1n1np; of a judg0 was such ti.at hl' knr\Y how to inquirP into such 1nattn·~~. and thnt he would do the right thing. 1

'

Suppl,;.

Yet /;c ha "·c· lwn. IrlCtnbers opposite .. telling ug that the judt:r" of illc ./u·bitration Contt is not abk to iw1ui1'C: into the condition o£ tho v;ork0rf'. n .d £.ljYf~ un uward. Snn:('. hem. n1crnbL,;.s \dJo '}w!ieYed in arbitrt-~tion ,y}wn th y the ught jt \VOtdJ rc··'"'t ag·ainst the l'i.'Otkei·", ar:d \Yhcn thc:y ~vc:.;ltccl to get into PatlianJC!Jt, \, '- j'(' rHcpnrcd to try to hood­wink t!w ' orkr·rs by telling -then1 t~:nt they bdie·.·ed ln it. ThC','·· ·<·cl'O nwcc:.;.;;;fnl during the la~t Fcd(•ral l_']cctiou vvith tJwir Cl\- of n. Royal Co~n-lJi-.,:-.ion to ilHJUin• juto tli,~· Lrt . .:.Ic \Vfi~'(', rrhc PrinH' )1iJlistcr of ~·\nstralia. '.,hi•nd('Jiyc•ring his policy ·"Pf'tC'h at Bcndigo, ~nid-

" 1£ ,~.c at12 to lntYc indu,.tri;d Jh'a•·c 1.d; n1n~t b0 pt'(•]nn·ed to pc:y tht• Jlriee. and that is jn:iticc to tlw ·-\orkc·r:-;. Nothin~· will su·,~c. \re huyc· long ag-o adopter! in Australia the prin(·iples of comJ>uborv arbitration for tl1~ el'ttle­ment o.f incli.JStrial dispntcs and of tlw 1ninirnurn wage. The cause of nnu·h of the industrial nnrc,t whieh is lik<' hwl to th· tires of BolsheYism and din:d actiou. arises with the renl wage of the "·orhr­that is to say, the thing·s he eau huy with the n1oncy he receives. Now. 0ne:~ it is ndmitt('d L that it is in tln• intcrc·;.:ts of rhe community that such a wage "hould be pnld as 1\:i]j cnaLlc a nwn to Jnarry t ncl bring up children in dtccnr, wholc­~ornc conditions--:-and that point has been twttlcd ]nng ago--it sccn1s obviouc:; that Y c Ill liSt dc,·jsp bettl'I' JnarhiJH'r:_- for in~u1-ing the pa~\ rncnt of snC'h a , wage than nt prc:::;ent 0~{ist'~. .:\.Jean:-. n1n.:;t be found that will iusuro tbat the mininmm wage ~hall be adjusted autoJnatie<tlly. or almost aLtonutticall~v, \Yith thn (O<..t· of !iYing. :~) that within t}u~ lin1its of ·~he 1ninim.Lt1u ~;,:age aL l0as.t the soYercign ~hall alw~~ys plU'(·~a~e the -:-.a.rrH~ cnnount oi tht1 ne, C'Ssaries of lifP. The (j(,,·.;_•rn­nwnt i~, therefore, nppoinbug a Royal Corumis!'ion to inquir0 into tlw (·o~-.t of living in relation to thn mininntm o1· basic wagQ. The Co1111nission will be fully dothPd with powe-r to as(·urtain \v1wt 1s a fair basTe wag0 and ho\v n1uch tho pur-ch.:-~,.,ing pov.er of thl' :'30Yereign, and tlw bc-;t tneans whPn o11c0 so adjustrd of automati~ally adjusting itself to i.-he ri~e a.nd fall of the sovC'ruign. The Gon~rn1lwnt ·wilJ at the t•arlj( . ..,t date possiblt? ere ~tP effective maf'b1nc·ry to J..~];·c ( lfeet to these principles. Labour is <'Htit.led to a fair share of th0 wealth it prorlncPs. The fundaJnPntal question of thC' baf:ic \YD,.o,'C haYiJJg' bcrD tJJU~ sat:~­f:.-L toriJy-bceawn~ pcrmancntly-so-t.tlf'd there l"P'nains other Cill.JSC:-; of il(dustri;! 1 llDi'f'~t \\'hich JllH~,t be, d.ralr \Yil h .if \\"P

arc to h8YC iullu<;'trial p<'aCt>."

That- is. a r;tatcmPnt b~v tlH' P1·im0 :\lirJi:--ter ,,·hc:n he \\';nreJ to r:-ct batk to tlw Fl'dt'nd Tr.=oasury bcnchr5'. In1m0diatt.'ly l: gdt lu.ek he i:lP1)oi·nted a Hoyal Connnis .im1. but !w did not gi\-c it thr full po--wer it. :-:hovld hnY1' had. Th0 l1on. rnPmbcr for ~t1n1rn,:C,o th~· other niQ·ht said that the in.Ju,tri(·.> nf Qur·C'n ,la.I;-rl could not pay tlw ·v·n~.rc· prC'­:-;crihr,l b\' indn~tl'ial U\Yards. and, v>llfl.~J T ;y·k.'cl hin"l w.hat inducJry he rcfcrre<l to. he c- 'id fl;c pastoral industr.'·· The postoral in,:1n::try rase ha.-; been r,~yeral tin1f's bc-foJ'e· thr~ t ourt. and the wage wns n0n~r f!"'l:cd on t.h0 prOSJKl'ity of the lndn~try·. but on what \VUS a rL asonab1e thing for a n1an, hlB wife. and thrc·c children to liYe upon in d~eent

-o~ I v l

t·r,.,lfui, .\L th Lt·' h• nri!lg' o," tl'e ea'~ tlh· aid----and t!Je G,·az1cr:-:.' ... :\.~soci.:t-1 io:1 r~.._,fcr.s to js the oue that js n1aking; l. "Jll. UH'Illbcrs op110' ito sqnc·al against the .\rLitration Court, bocau~c if they do not de• >} th('y k1L w dwy \YiJl :uot. get its backlng-

'· lla,·ing· heard the argument.:. of 2\J:r. D1111bl n o11 behalf of the A.uotralian "\Yorker~' 1Juion. and .1Jr. Edkins on behalf of the l ~nitod Grazier'' A"socia­tinn, i atll ~ati:·fied that the il\1 ard I wrHlP 1<1~ 1 yc-l.lr, \Yhen tlH~ amno rcprc­:-,t'llt -·.ti ,-e appeared for the union and :'vir. Franr·is appc~.rccl for the l-nited Cra:-.:L'l':/ _\-:~of'iation. b1wuld stand, with 110 altt•rations t~s to ,,·agC's, anJ. certain :u1n H altrrutions as to conc1ii iou

'· :1h judgmo11t ('l.iazott,•' of the 14th of .JtUH', 1920) ~how~ that in fixing wages. I was guidru by i!w fact that in 1907 (J'ComtOr, .T., }Jc,cl fixed the wages of ,du:al'l'!'.'3 at 24~. ver hnndrcd. The sun1 of 40s. per hundn d which I a '"arded in 1920 Lad no greater purchasing povre-r than 24s. had in 1907. Knibbs's statistic• ..... ho\\ that the pUl'('ha . ..:;ing po\Yer of IllO!H'J' for the lRtcst aYailable period­the qncrtcr ending March. 1921-is sub­Ua ntia lly tho same as for 1920.

"I-lacl T. Jn fixiug tlw ~hearers' wage~ iu .Jnue last, awanled a higher wage nwiiJg to tbe prosperity of the indusb·y, thl? e:'-iRting eoucJitions of the industry Hlight ju·-ctify rccon~ideration; Gut the I 1 re;;011t trouhl(·s ~,ye re Jo,,Huing iu Juno last and I oxpresslv 'tatcd then that the prospt'rity of the indn~tr~~ w-as not a f<t<'tol' whic·h n-ci·dlf•d wjth 1110.

·· }Ir. EdkjuR a::.ked llH' to t·cduce the \Yag(·S pn-~,cl'iLcd by tJw 1920 a W8 rd, rL1 "fol<ng tho:;o of tbe Federal a\vanl of 1917: iu otlwr \\·ords, to reduce the e1Iec­ri,·0 1rag-c of the shrat'l'l' lH•Io,Y the 1907 >innclard.

·• High pt'i(·Cs for \Yonl preva11Pd during I'er·(•nt years. bnt the oD.Jployeriil, far from offering the f'Illployees a share in profits, made every C'ffort to J>reyent and delay the employe0s roceiying tbosa j ncr0a:ws in wages which the increased co:-t of li ,-ing ea !led for; .n·t now. be foro ,lhr·re is any apprecia \Jk drop in the cost of liYing. thr-v seek a 25 per (·.,nt. reduc­tion in wagPs wh0thPr, when the- cost. of li, ing fn lls. the wages paid in tl1i> inclnsrrv , honlcl be reduced, will be detcr­Ininc{l .hv the eourt when the orcaslon ari:;:( ,, ; l;ut thP a.:;·,.ociatjon should undPr., :-:tand th:~t [ll1.V l't1quc~t that tlw f'ourt ,honlc1 n•clnrc lli<'ill b<'forc that eYent :--lHntld h--. :-ll11ll\ll'tec1 lnv ff'<:l.Sonrrb]~\.y full and 1 -_liable ~ra.ri:'::tic,~ of the averag-e cost (lf ;'rodu tinn. pr.)\-lng 1"11 ':t the i1~d·1gtry i.-:- unable to 1. •:n· t-he prr::;crib<'d \vagcs ..

·· -.\fa11y of 1hL) faPt~ ur:)n 'rhirh )Ir. Edk! 1H J l1r _! a!T n1:Hirts (;f comn1on kno,-.·l( <.illd fol'/ll; l proof ()£ thcn1 is JJo1 iJJstnlJte. ~he djfficult:ies in tiH) marketing of wool and the low· pri( , obtn in-~ blc for p". -d:oral products. But I <'H11llnt t~cccpt ~Ir. Edkins's state~ ml'ut tlH~t tlH' [!YL'rage cost of pro-cJnr''ion of \\"()Ol-not including illh::J'c::;t on capital ~-is l.s. JWl' lb. :'\or can I accept hio :-tatement. or cst1niutc. that the wa~e$ cr<t of production is 8d. per lb. The wool pru.lndion of QLiocnsland is in the Yieinit:· of 120.000,000 lb. ; at 8t!. per lb.

J.lfr. Dash.]

[ASSEMBLY.]

tcfl(

cott1't of th1?- It 'iUl'­

~·. l ll~Y~ ohi~inod a. tal-/(• of wng, 3 11aid in dl'al l)uL·~.tit-. l1c i.-, ahil' tu ::;.upply 'lf' figurPS sine~~ ~n~urc llCP iu respc_.t. of ·wor1.;:Pr::i' corn-

Jl'.)'. Hnd is ba:o ll 'Yagc~ paid and upon thl' cmplo,\-('t'S) v.~lO::so

que tioncd.

·· :\Ir. Yates f1)r -t~-:: Craziers' l'o-Oll<·ratiYc CmnlHHly) puts t ~w cnutnH turfi' co~t of "hen !'ing at ls. per sheep) about l". 5;7d. per lb. In the face of tht -" tigurt ..;, I think I ant 11vt rLtillg m1n ~sona~ll,"' in 1'1_fusi~ g to aceopt ~d.r. F:dl·in;.;'~ cstiuwtu of 1~. per lb. a:;; the c. ·)t of production in Queensland. DLducting hi~ ex1 o :; cst-inutte of wagf''-5, the tc,t:l l ('o;.;;;t o£ prn Jurtlon would b(~ about 8d. per lh.~,-;11 UllliJUnt ,.,·hieh cvidcnc<' gi\-Cli in the Land Court by gTazi""rs tend, to ~nppod. Now vvhat is t1w Ya lue of wool pet· lb.'? A return put jn bv ::,Ir. Edkins ~h(n';s that he· considers the an:rage price' 12.1. ])<T lb. In hiR adc!r' •· he qualified this by 'aying that 12d. wa., a genProu::; vaiuation. by \Yhich I nrf'snnH' HHit h0 llH'Hlls it i~\. if an<-­tbiJJg. ~uJut•wlwt on_·r tho l'eal valut•. The export ya}nc of gTt~asy wool in 1912 w s 9.50d. per lb. ; 1913, 9. 70d. ; 1914.15, 9.45d.; 1915-16. 11.86d. A•suming Mr. F.dkins'::; Iigur~-...: a~ to yaJno arc rcason­tl hl7 :wen rat('. \\"'OP] i:;; Vi"'ort·h 1nnch nlOTf' now than in the pre-IYa.r p('riod~ and a!i >·meh as in 1916. lf. a·, Mr. Edkins assortR, the value of wool is 12d. per lb. it is worth much more th;m the C•>st of production.

" Price of prime beef, 1920, was from 42s. to 4-3.'. por hundrC'dweight."

We find to-clay that the Pa toralists' A~socia­tion, tog·cthcr with othor org:-tnisations, are out to trv to abolish the Arbitration Court. and will" Pndt'avour to givo ~on1e reasons why thev want it abolished. In the "Dailv M,:il " ~f 20th .] uly, 1921, the Hon. A. J-f. WhittiT'gham, M.L.C .. who is a large pastoral holder and also president of tho United Grazier::~' A "·-;ocintion, said-

" He took it that the idea behind the !le\Y league v;ns to bring out i·mn1jgrants of n dcsirab1l' natun•, chiefly from tho mothC'rland. There must. he thought, be a judicious systom of selection on the other side, and this side it mu 't be ensured tbnt in1migrants wcr{' cared for and taken tro their d··stination. It was not fuir, for 1n~tancP. to a,k in1migTant~ to pay their far{) to Cairns and otht r Northern port:; after their arrival at BrisbanC'. lnnni. gn/_nts should not be e1,conraged m-cr.e]y bJ go into fnctc:rici'!. rrhcy wcrp, neod~ ~ tn take up agr-;cultural or grazing !and Oi' to go in for son1c oilH~r fonn of f:1rrning. That typn of inlln}grant 1vould CDrtain1y inC'r.Pase einp1oynlent.

n If wo hnd no Arbitratio~l Uourts, wn \Vould not bave so rnuch uncmployn1ent. Certainly, a wards governing the pastoral industry in the Central district havo caused much unemployment. 'Vhen a man gets old or handicapped. so that he is unable to work properly, he is willing to work for £- a week. But he is not ,c!lowccl to do so, and so

[Mr. Dash.

J'i''Llain:" out of work. \Y.1g l oards or )1p,• ('thel' equitabl") ~." .2'.-"'In ··ouid proh-

<1l."'ll_y r0Lh·cc uncmploynlti1t co11 .idcr. bly." \\~·, find th;<t the ngit~·-tion Pguinst the Arbi­tration Cnurt is np{ onlv locaL but thr'ro is ~ guwral mo\TC lheoug·hDut tho wcr1{:l to try and dcfr_~ t tho 1\-orll.:ers; and re· 211th. ;,vo fin.d ~Ir. \\~,'ltt, who at one tin1c wo thoUght was going L:; play up with the Prin10 I\Iinio::ter .of .-\u.lealia for interfe1·inc;· with hin1 vvhon he w.1 o\Tcn::0as, lw· joi1wd in ti' · runni:1g 1.vith l'PS!'tl rd to the strrtmncnt;:; that ha.·,-e been JnadP against thf~ ~\rhitration Court. This i~ the ~~tat0n1cnt that a~1pcar c1 in the ··Daily .Ia1l" nf 2nd S.-::·ptembcr, 1921-

.. ~J:r. Yr att, :Y.l. TT.H .. ~Jclbvi.Iruc, pre­::;iding at the <ll11~lwl nleetinr.' of th: Bar­net Glass and Rubber Compnny, 1nade the sug/c_,;tiou that n1anufactnrrr~ hould Illakc a nlovt' toward~ Sf'curiug a PiUS­pr.:>nsion of thC' .. Arbitration Court a wards."

Guing a bit further abroad, I have n report fro1n CnlJOtown "'~,-hiC'h appeared in thP Ptc~.\'3 of 2nd September, 1921-

'· Capetown, 2nd fkplt'mber. 19Jl.

''The pre.,ident of tho Railwaymen'~ l~nion states that during a conf.orcncG hciwren the rcnrosrntativt _.; of thP union and the J\Iini'•ter for Hailways (Mr. .T ugg0r} on the subjc"t of \Yorking hours, pi-:-., th0 l\Iinisb r :tatC'd that the eight hour clay had gone by tl1C' board . . th0 hours HO\Y proposed wCf(' fron1 nino to ton a day."

~'\s the S0crc~tarv for Hailvvav;:;.. n•n1ind~ HIC 1

it i' ·a breach of the pC'HCC in'aty that WitS

Pntcrr;d into in cnnnedion with the srttle­UV'llt of the war. rrhcrc ap[Jcar~ in tho Prcs:l

,·eport from London of 9th SPpt mbcr, 1921-

" Mr. \Y. L. Hitchcm, pre .. id,·nt of the economic section of the Britisln. Asso­ciation~ at tho annudl n1coting of thai; bndy, disrns~.;cd thP principl~ -of wage dr·t{'rJnination, and cond'-'llll!Ptl rornpul­scry arbitration."

\Vhilst on the question of rompnl~or.v arbi­tNtion, I want to point out that, if we had not co:rnpulsor~v arbitration, tlwre \voulrl bo no hope at the pr·e·.r-nt ti1n0 of gr tting the employers to m8ct us in co11frrcncc because they wonld simply ~ao' that no good v. nnld cmnc of it. nnd they would :,ilnp}y (10 as they hr1.vP done in the p~st-tr.v to forro tho workers to hang· around thl'ir rninf''i. HF~ir factorie,~, and their ;,vork~hons da~' rft.'r rla_v for tht.' l1llrposC' of vv:-tihn;r t~ ~·nat-]h rr job from smnc cn1ployce T'.-orking in the f" :t~l·li<::h­Inl'nt. I hav0 hf'rc anoth( r stah;T~cirt which w.,·s mad.f' at: th0 nn1n1a,l n1ecting of tho .:\~.~·'1ciatcd Cba.mbcrs of Comrnerec <:~f _t\us­tnlia in Perth on tb 14th April h.t-

"At th.~ anr.ual moctiuzr of thr> Asso­ci,,1ted Chr.t'1lb~r..:; of Co;11m ~rce of . \.us­tra lia, held in Perth. 14th April, o· Sul­livan (Brisbane) moved and Mycrs King, pnsident. Brisbane Chamber of Com­r- er< e, seconded th ") following r :solu­tion:-

That, in view of the fa.c; that illegal strikes continue without punish1nent, bringing the law into cont?mpt, this conference is of or-,inion that it would tf nd to restore respect for the law and put all parties oli the same footing, if otrikes and locknuh were no longer illegal.

[J () SEPTEMBER.] Supply 799

;, ?Ylr. TceC"c (Syrlnoy), in ~upp";_·1·ting-, said that thP .J11]•: lTlTPJ.r for indu··.trial unrc~t wa~ d1t:~ · :~olitio,, <~;f all ind1.1strial lr .::{i.datiDJL 'l

Thny 1ncntion tho flUOqtion of strikes and [oekont :;. \Ye know th'-ii it \rotlld not be a q_us·· tion of a ~trjko. rfhL' unployers l.Yonld F~ n1 pl~> lock the t::EJ ployee out the . <ln1e as the.·· lnvc dune "t ::\Iount 1.2Jrgan to-day. It is no nso bon. n1cmbers opp0jte :;aying

tlw n~en arc on st.rikl' at )·fount [9 p.n~.] Ivforgan. It i~ nothing o{ the

kind, lJccan~c tho o1nployers say, n If you arc not prcpnrcc1 to iH '·~~pt a 20 pc'r cent. reduction in your wage", v,-e -~rill lock :·ou Dut ur:til vou r<I·e prep red." It conld oasily bo proved to bo a lockout under the provisions of the IPdu.trial Arbitration Act. The ban. member for Ode> w:tntcd to bJ _pop1:Jo_t and nJade this statc1:D,c:nt -

t t t~sere is o:w C'lu· o [or the con­dition of aff-liL wo ftml in Queensland to-day ]t li"---, in the Arbitration Court."

Jn the "D:~ily ::vr"il" of 23rJ August. 1921. n1e same hon. gentleman said- ~ '

"I contend that the Ar0itration Court has been otJe of th•' 1nain oau·,cs of the st::g.:lation that exists to-dav. rrhc w!ifice of arbitr<>tion rnu't he pullecl do\\·n.''

\V-e find the hon. J.!rrnbey for Eno,;gera also w>nted to be r-opdar In t ho eves of the 1rorit;~-i£ t'w7 do not n1ake thc>sn" statements them will ho no moLey forthcoming to moot tl~r,ir r.t'xt election nxpcnsrs. lie said-

" They (the Gon rnm<'nt) did not hase the courage to wipo out the Arbjtration Court, as th§,Y srt:;· ccrtaln things must b • done by th,; Arbitration Court."

'l'he hon. member for Pittsworth v.anted to Lo'popnlH, too, and he said-

,, I say unhc-.it~ttingly that th·~ present Arbitration Court is not only 11 menacr•. tf) the '\ orking- class but a n1r-nace to thr: whole r'Olnrnuni cY."

l m i;~·ht mention that. tho " l'astoralist's R~>iow" led off before thhe hon. gentlemen ma_do their stat< mcnts, and gave them the duo "' to what thoy had to say. There is no doubt that. if they hcd not said it, they wonld have l1een called to book bv Jl.1r. Rdkin·. who is a p&irl agitator, on "£3,000 tlr £3,500 a yea1· .. Before they att<:mpt to <i~ o,nythmg in the way of legislation they ,,,-J]l ha vo to consult him. ben use lw is paid to sco that thoy do consult him in all matters t.h" t thr7 bring for~vard in this Chamber. No one knoT;·s: that better than the Ieador o[ t 1<c Opposition.

_,,..~_r. -·vo~.\:·L:~s: You bave no right to sa.y that.

1\fr. DASH: I hn·e cvory right to sa. it, bec.·"us-.-- it is true.

JVIr. V'o-v-..·LE~: It is absolutely untrue.

·.'\lr. DASII: The "Pa toralists' H.evic-w'' <'LJ the 1Jnitcd Graziers' Association are behind this J1 .rty, bee, use the~: find the

d::. The "Pa.stor1-hsts' Rcyir,··:" n1ade f;tah~ment in its August is·~ufl-

" To in~tih:te sncc~,~sful irnmigraticn we must fiut burn our Arbitration Acts, a.bolio'h the besic y;age and price·fixing."

We see that the objcr', behind the whole thing is to defeat the _\rbitration Court 1w;crdr', and in the end the workerc,. '\Vhy <~o these gentlemen want h abolish the Arbi­iration Court and wipe out its awards?

They compLincd bitterly the other -clay lJcf'aH<::t t,hc GoYFfllnH~nt h:1vc so n1anv n1otor~ cars to enable th" ins;wctor- to get' around. I ha•·,, h.,re a t 1ble which has been prepared b.'· 1 '10 L-,bonr nepartmollt, and when I hJn} iini~hcd re'lding it li ·wiJl readily be nndc· tood \\h;· hon. g·r ·1tlcn1cn opposite :1nd iheir· lnpr:..rt-c~·s \Y.-1 nt the Arbitration Cr;urt a boli"hr'.L ThC'Y tr_ 1l Yon tho -· arc out ( 1 do a fair thin; for· tho ,.,:orkcrs, and they bcljf'\'(\ thc- \\"01'1·. 0rs shonld get omploy1nr•nt nnd evc __ ·_ything tiwy are (>ltitled to. VVe will !ind out ,,-ho were responsible for the greatc,ot number o{ brcwhes of the industrial :-:r~Jitra.tion legislation. The sun1marv of pro,ecations nndcrtakcn by the department dming the year, from lst July, 1920, to 30th J\me, 1921, is~-Successfnl prosecutions, 345; nn~uc.Jessfnl prosecutions) 10; prosecutions withdra;vn, 33. The fines inflicted amounted to £611 1 9c. 6rl .. and the amount of costs \'.a.~ £189 5.~ .. n-utkiug- a t'·Utl of £801 4~"· 6J. The costs against the department totalled £45 16s. The number of prosecu~ tions undortah::cn unrler t.ho Industrial Arbi­t,,,tion Act \n\ -~-Bti lcano, 66; country, 221, rrlw rnrmbe1· of pro~('{·utions under the Fac­tories and Shops ~\et was-Bri•bane, 41; country, 39. rrbr total nurnher of prosf'Cll­t]ons under tho ""~"vYorker.3' Accom1nodation Act was 21: making a total of 388. 'rhe total amonut of wa:;cs collected by the department during the twelve months goes t.J sho11· ho-... nu;~ h tho en1ployer-;, have been pl't'P :red to rob the '.-orkers of, even in tha last twehe months, although the ma,(ter had bePn n1t:·nticnrd iu n return of the lhwtories and Shops Department, tho previous year of a similar amouni. Tho amount collected \\"as--

" Reported up to--31st July. 1920 31st Au:sust, 1920 ... 30th September, 1920 31ft Octobc,·. 1920 3uth November, 1920 31st December, 1920 31st January, .1921 28th Februarv. 1921 31st March, lB21 30th April, 1921 31st May. 1921 30th June, 1921

£ "· d. 492 9 4

1,408 13 2 1,588 12 9,1, 1,159 7 6~ 1,700 0 0

751 15 !i 947 5 4 883 4 6

1,168 19 5 1,478 10 10

929 8 11~ 920 18-11"

Jnaking a grand total of monev of which. the workers wonld ha Ye been robbed had it not been for the Factories and Shops Depa.rt­mcnt, and collected on behalf of the workers ol Queensland. of £13,428 12s. 2~d. Those fi~s-tn·es are astoni:-rhing. Cnn you not under­shnd the reason wh:· employers of labour nncl hen. members opposite, want the Arbi­teation Court nn<l its rt\Ynrds abolishe·d? That i;; not tlw whole of thP monpv, ns soma of the cmplr" o'·" arc: afraid to put' their case into the }, •.nds o' tho insn.:ctors lr0cause they thiTJk t 1 w~ ,yjJ1 get the tsnrk. Hon. gentle­men toll us the;.~ are out to cJo the right thing- ~y the \'i·orki.'l';·, w-hen the;' are prc­pnr('d "!.U tweJ~;p rnc.1ths to flcerc the ·workers of £13.<i 0 S 12•. 2~J. Thcv also accuse thiB Uo:·ernnwnt of not doing a fai1· thing by then employees. \Ve know the kind of treahnfmt nJE•teJ ont to public servants in 1902 and 1904. They tell ns they are pre­pared to .meat their 'mployees round the t 1ble to d1scuss their wages and conditions. I ask ~ny publi~ ~en·ant of this State, if vithcr t<>e CommLsioners, the Undor Secre­taries, or the Ministers of tho various depart~ ments CYcr asked them to meet them in

ilfr. Dash.]

soo [ASSErofBLY.] Supply.

em!fu·encc• fnl· the j)l!JTJOBC of discussing their "i ag. and CDnJitiuus '? That ncYcr hap­pened. 1f hon. LH·mbcrs oppo~itc were sue­er sful in getting Oll to the rrecasnry bcn('hes again. the c•n1ployoes of thf-:: State would haYc: no hope of di~-:n:~sing their wages anJ. conditions al'l :nd tho L•bk with Ministers o,, an:,- of the hc-~arls of dcp rtrnf'nh. VVhcn t.hc TorlC's. were ]n Dffief' and a depression Y•:;:-; un, tb0~' in~tituted a Ycry dra::.tic fDrn1 of retrenchment. They seem to be very much alarmed at the putting off of men by this lJoY"rmnc11t. What. did thcv do F.hen they were in offir(_ and clPprC'ssiori occurred? Any ctnp:oyL·c \rho had £351 and under, lllJdcr the 1902 ~'-et. ''os docknd 15 per cent. of his ''11ar:,·; :.nd under the 1904 Act he l,-;as docked 7~ prr cent. rrhe crnployees who received from £301 to £350. were reduced 12~ per c<•nt. umkr the 1902 Act and 6;\ per cent. under the 1904 Act. The employees getting £151 to £300, >>ere reduced 10 per c 'nt. under the 1902 Act and 5 per cent. under the 1904 Act. Those w.ho received £101 to £150 were reduvd 7 per cent. undc1• rho 1902 Act a,nd 3~ per cent. under the 19~ Act. The number of <'mployocs affected totalled approximdelv 3,800. In addition to docking their wagu without the consent of the onplnyccs, they 'imply robbed them af that nlOJH';' wit.hovt giving thmn any say "·hat<•ver; and at the same time they put a poll tax on the "orkPrs of thig State. Fancy pt>tting a poll iax after a.ll that rednetion for the JlLll'J><"c of impro\ing the Hnancial posjtion of this State l

The SEl'R<:TARY FOR lLuLWAY:i: That was their financial genius.

:\fr. DASH : I remember the case of " wi.do-..v who earned her living by sewing, and, because she conld not pay the poll tax, they ~old h(·r :seY'.,ing 1naehinc. That is the way the Tories financed the ·countrv "·hen thcv had coutrol of the Trcaenry ·benches. Il1 1914·1915 the,· also dcpriq•d the public ser~ vants of thio Rtatp of their automatic incrcast '• Yet they ha Ye the check to get np in this House and t('ll this GO\·crnm~nt that thev h:we ]act the confidence of the peoplo aiHl the workers of this State.

The bell indicate<! that the hon. geut]e. 1nan's tinw had expired.

The TREASURER: I beg to mo\'e-That the hon. membl'r fur J'dundingburra be granted an ('X.tcnsion of tirne.

The TEJHl'ORARY CHAIRiHA::\: It is not cornpet-:nt to gra11t an extensiou of ti1ne in Con1n1ittee.

?,Ir. S\YAY:q~ (.llimni): The first thing that strikes onP in this Financial Staten1ent is the largo cx.p0nditur0. In speaking ou this qu( ~tion, [ y·onld like to rnake a coiL•pari::.on bchreC'_l the rCYP11U0 and C'XfJendituro for the cnrn,nt Y('Hl' ~, ith the n•ypnuo and -cxpC'lldi~ tu re of six: 'r'ars ag'O, The.~ actual revenue for the IHtPtL fiHancial year W8.; £12.601,000. and in 1915 it ammmtcd to £7.2~2.000. 1 notice that the e,;1wntliture has increased 0YPn ::1 t rt g-rP.n h·r ratio. La:;:;t ye.1 r it was £12.591.201. as against £7,199,099 in 1915. \Yith this excessive l'PT2nue, amounting to something likr £5,000,000 OY~l· what we re· reiYrcl six years ago, 'Ye finJ. that Queensland hRs JH'Yer bcrn in so parlous a condition as it is at the )ll'es~nt time. Although they got practically double the reYonuc, they nnnot make any progress in the Strrto. It is rather interesting to note somo of the utterances made by hon. gentlemen opposite in years

[Jlr. Dash

gone L."· The hun. ruemb,;r fur AIL>ort to· n i[!ht qnut d ,John Stuart ~-I ill. the cconor1li;:;t, E!nd .r HlU _ning to quote anothor gentlmnan 1rh01n ~uprc ·~(~ al--o profc~sC's to bo au c'XJH'rt in c-: 'H!, lll~\ although I do not. think, in Y~P'·\- of his ,,·ork, that nnyonc ·will tlc.:3crih!l hin1 a"' t L·iHL ,Jt. ] ·will quote frmn a ~-pecch Lade L_y ~1r. E. G. TlH_,odure, OlH present

. in l~~lZ. In spc,-cking on tho Finan­in that year, we find that

in alluding to the lcadn· ~.nid-

" The Pre1nicr has on diff, rent occa­:-;ions appealed 1nost pathetlcaJl;v to n1cm­hL·J·::;; uJ i.:.~fonu hi1n just how tlu' Ltx.&.tion of tiw Stctc mi,_;·ht he udjusted in uch a 1;-a \~ H~ \YonJd T prod nee rnore revenue. I ~IJOtdd like tu give hin1 a hint or two in th;:t connr•ction. I think that by i1n pc."i!l;,-! a stiff ;;,nccc:-:"3lon duty \Ve wight J'clit:Ye the general taxpayers of a, part. of the interest burden they llOY'r

haYc> to carry. Then I would, without auy h::sitation, advocate an increase in thC incon1e tax, a heavy dividend tax, and thu impo~.;ition of a land tax. By these n1u.1n~j the Prcn1ier C'ould snpplu, n ·ent his revenue very considerably, and by th<>'c means ho might be able to carry out ~he policy hinted at be· tho hon. member for H erbert-the policy of spend· i11g pocsibly not more than £1,000.000 of loan ffiOll<'Y on rajl·ways each year, and, if n1orp ra,llways arc required, building the1n out of rt>venne; and I would sug­ge't to the hon. gellll<'man that he reYiee his taxaJic,n on tho:-.l' liu('s.''

,\t 9.15 p.m., Tl1e Cn.\IIUL\::\ n·c:nrncJ. the chair.

:\lr. SW.\YNE: '\ow that he has both place aud powo1· he has carried out. to. a large exi.'ilt. what he suggested, a11d what is the result·: Hn has got nearly double tlw money in one vear that the l<1st UoYC'rnn1011t rP­ceiYPd '·':hl·n he told them th~:v cnuld build the railways out of re,·cnue, and yet "\\·e are not "~ble to built! a mile of railways this Year. It shows these hon. gentlcmPn how ~'a:)V it is to cl'iticise and ho-..v difficult to ear~·v out. thc."3e things. lvioreoY('r, not only an• ;vo unable to carry out a Llihvay policy to open up this countr:', but the hon. gentle~ 1nan's policy has brou}rlit us thG excessive taxation which he then advocated and through which he has brought about unem~ ployrncnt. The unerL•p1oyrnc·rt ·which is so rife in Qucnnsland to-J:1y-n1ore so than 1,VB

ha ye ever sC>en it br.fore for a _gcn;._ ration, at any rate -is caused by the policy of this CoYC'rnnlt>nt, and the PrPn1ier eannot carry on his pHhlir work:;:.. Is it any \Vondce when \VP ]oc•k to ihe ineidr;ncp oi the taxa~ tion a~Hl flnd that ju 1915 tLe rcYcnlte fron1 hnation amount•!d to £L4,c5.000, '~\hi le last nnr it amounted to £3.r'~2.000 '! "\ithough JHnninall': that ta:xatim1 is Jistributed over· a JlOpubtion of 700 000, in realiiv it is c.on. crntrnterl on a emall ecdion of about 30.000, -rrho. b.- their init1atiYC'; P!ltf'T{Jr1,-r, industry, and cih·rgy, haYP thC'm·'lrcs in the 11nsition to }WO\ ide \\ ork others by opC'n-in~ tlp ar~ricnlhlrnl lnd~Ftries ard mining and indu,ti·ial ,,nterprisc'. \Vhen we find that the (;ovennlH'nt have n·, ci\'"eJ. such a huge sun1 as £3,000.000 froin to.xation, is it any wonder thn.t tlliNnplo~'nlPHt is so preYalent at the pres(~11t tln1e? The taxation has incre-aaed from £1 6,. lld. in 1915 to £4 18s. ]Wr head of the whole commnnitv in 1921. But, when '' e reu-.•etnber that u)~. increased taxation is

[l6 SEPTEMBER.] Supply. SOl

oonccnt.<·ah•d upon 30,000 people, it comprise• those people who. b7 their entNpl'ise and energy saved tho rnoncy whieh -hould ha...-e given '-'ll1fJlo,yrnent to a large nu:mbc-r of people. ls it any "\Yonder that un_cmJ;loyment '" .·o pn•\·alent at the present tune? Cam· pnrn the position of Quc;cnsland with that of the other States 111 this respect. In 1919· 1920, Victorin. South Au"tralia, and Tas­mania with a combined population of 2,000.o'oo. paid in land nnd income tax £2,296,802, while Queensland alone, with a population of onlv 700,000. was taxed to the extent of £2,225,586. Under the present regime, Queensland, with a population, of only 700,000. has to nny Rs heavy a burden as is c uriod bv a population of 2,000,000 in the other Statc•s. Js it any wonder that we find stagnation in our industrial }jfc? Go down to Victoria or New South v\'alGs and look at the new enterprises ~pringing up in those place.s. Look at the new enter· prise, springing up at [\'c"ccastle round tho Broken Hill stcd worke. Then come back to Queensland and 0·ou sec nothing being done. When yon seck the cause you wonder how it. is that our State, with its great natural re,.ource-.s i:::; so stagnant and that no one can !!Cl a job? Everything is at a dead end. Trw'·e who have any money to invest arc afraid to put it into cntcrprisc>. \Vhcn you remember that, can you wonder that we are suffering so much in comparison with the other States? The Governmt>nt have killed enterprises of all descriptions.

Could anything be more deplorable than tlw positiou as regards the railw.1ys? \Vhen tlw present Government took ofiice in 1915, the n1oncy invested in our railways 'vas earning £3 13s. 9d. per cent., while now it has go no clown to about lls. pm cont., and '"" find cthat, whereaS each CI!lp]OVPC in 1914-15 v;as earning £102 per annum for thC' department. to-day each employee earns only. about £17. OnG of the reasons given for this falling off in railway revc_~nup i~ that so rnany new 1 irws have been opc'lWd. So far as the pr•eviom Administration arc concerned, they did open up new lines, but the pre<ent Admini,tration havB done very little in the way of building new railways. During the :::ix ~-cars they havo been in office they lw c only opened 700 rni1£'. of rail ways, f3o they eannot put that forward a:-~ an excuH' for the wretched posi tion :in whiC'h DUl' railway~ arc to-day. l'\ow the clin1ax huR- con1P, and they arc rctrerclt­ing all round. It has been said, "\\~Pll, what olsQ c1n 've do? Is it our fault?"

At 9.24 p.m.,

Mr. VOWLES ca1led att<•ntion to the• stat· of thr· CommittN•.

I\1r. D.-'!sa: Tlw { 'ountry party h:l goue horDe.

Quorum fonned.

1\!Tr. ~\YAY~'Jl;· I'\.;~ di- !:!.''S!~:g !-h~, ('~'.!:::~· t.ion u • to the number of omplovces "ho ha,,, be-en -di:-churged fron1 our LtilT'7ays n11d the Tca:.Dn for it. It simply bE -trs out what ha::-; boon pointc•d <mt during' the last three or four years-that tho railiVays have been filled up unduly for politieal purposr's; that political support has been bought by hon. member., opposite by giving jobs in the railways to their friends. \Ye haYo an admissi<Jn from the Prcmi€r himself in this rogard. ln receiving a deputation in Brisbane in April of this year, the hon. gentleman mid that there had been no retrenchment, but the departments had been reducing th€ir exce: .. ,ive staffs. How

1921-3 D

did the staffs become excessive nnless, as I ha ;•e •aid, their friends hnd ber•n given position; vdH'n t hz ro was roalh- no '\York fnr thcn1 l o do: \YP got an iul~ling of the pc it ion a ronple of ;·e;u·., ago. when the hon. memb€e for J\Inrllla, by n1ean:-; of a que2tion, elicited th information that, 'vhi1(' the nu:nber of cn1ployecs i11 the Rail-y•.;a:_v Dq1artrnrnt had b! L'll increased by oYrr 30 pt>r ceut. 1 the Inilcagn run had d('crca.,ed by l,r.uo)OOO n1ile.:; per arnnun .... ::\uyonc can ~re that the n1ilwa.ys " ere ovcnnanned, and that sup1•ort ha.~ bccu l:ouc:ht b.; giYiiJg' political -upportors job,; in the raihvaYs. The timP- ha roHlc "'·hen they J,aye rC>E~d·},!d an impas r~. Sonwthl11g has to be done. and now th~y arc turrir1g 111011 oJf. \\7"hrthct it is. the ~r fticucJ- thev nrc 1 utting off or not I < tllll()t ,-:;a.y; but W~' haYP the ndn1i;:::lon of the Pn 111ier himself th:Jt the rail-~ av.-; lulYO. Lct'n o\·crnlanned. \Yhu brought ·al,out this oYrl'l!lanT!illg- but thrn1::: •.}ye;.:. ·~ And lJO'<Y tlw day of reckoning has con1c nud they hen c had to turn n1cn oft" If it •sere not f(;r thi~ Lad nHiwge.nlent on their part, the se men, who were under the in1prc,·3iou that they had p0nnanent jobs, \\tm1d not han; had to be sent ont into tlw wol'ld at o:1c of the wor;:;t ti111c3 possible, vvhen uncrnp1oynH.llt if'. more aeuh::- than \ve have known it to bt• for man.v yca1 ''·

\YP arc told thnt a loan of something over £2.000,000 i~ to be raised locally, and I notice thut the Treasui·er t >kes credit to him,,;lf in connection with the last loan. He nys-

" ThE> Jov n "E :-; ... ~ rowp1et.:~ succc--:s, and the re~nlt ~how<'cl tlut the cit1zcm of thG State had eYrry c·,;,;fidcnce in the Govern­rnent."

If he really b. lic,·e.- that, he is nndGr a delusion. 'fh<' t•i'cizens of the State contri­buted thut monev simply beramr tlwy had t-o sPe Queensland throu~th. The da,s that haH been pPI'Sl'cutcd by this Govcrnnwnt is the cl a" that · .1\Y that loan through. ThosP people could not S'"t' QucPll:--.la nd go down. It is certainly a tl'i11lltc to their patriotism, and not hccau:--c of anv confidconcP thcv have in the Gon"nmwnt. ·\Yhile on the ~ubjcct of loans, it is just as "·c1l to coPsider what the effect "'ill be of withdra "·ing, for StatP purposes. £2.GC 1.000 that otlwrwise "·ould have gone into circulation thl'<lugh the usual chamwls for the pm·po'" of cstablishing­variou:':- cutE·rpri,cs and opening up the f'onntry and therebY affording C'>1•Plovmont.. I ha ye al\YaY~ llcJ(i: the onln,iDn th .t·. in a ~Toung COUlJtr.~- like Qnccn~lai1d, \Yith va t natu-ra.l to dcYdop, it i~ u g;o:_'d thing to ro to old~'r couJJtrir..., \vlth nccumnlatrd <'flplta.l~·io CPlllltrie:'i that haYC' 110 vP:;turc-; in \dJich lo )llll tllrlr ovo1 say, ''\Yt.' haYC ; w~...~ 0 Olll'· a .. stna!i n gr.-.tt c<Juntry. linJ, if you tl!at 'nlOJH:y. WL' ~ar: ... ,~~(.~ ; ... T.-;-jth lu \ \'Li. ...i.lliLT

is th.c · pur:-'uctl in a young eou11tr)· Jike In tht> past tbat policy has 1Jtone\ w:n; lL-·Cd to (;Pl'lt up lmilding railwa: s. A' a result of the t:X]Wnditure of ovPr £40.000,000 in building railways by past

Adn1inistration~-:::. 'i'L' WPI'e able to [9.30 p.1n.] gi\-e th people of Qul~cusland

a bigg{:r J!1i !Page per hP ad of population than any other country jn thf' world. Through thP actions of this ~\dminis­tration ou1· ererlit is losL ant1 the only way we can no\V carry on otn· public v, orks is by borrowing from tlw fe,y among,t us who

Mr. Swa,yne.]

802 Supply. [ASSE}ITILY.]

have been thrifty money that wuuld otherc. i•o have bPcn used for the lHll'PJ'-'ns of dc~·clop~ rncnt in tlh~ Stat1'.

It is ra.the1· opportune t1t the pre:<· 1t tiint•, although th0 suhj ('C't has bee-n discussed again and again, to refer to the Phi1p delegation. Scarcely an hon. tll('rnbC'l' oppo_.ltc has got up without athibuting our loss of credit to that dclPga.tion. llon. nY•mbcrs opposite were warne·d long lx•forc the dQlcgatlon went home cf the ineyitable reKult which their repudiHtory legislation would have. I quote· the following extracts from financial news­paper•· referriug to the Tramways Bills:-

"The ' Timeo' (8th J annary, 1918) described the Bill as ' a mo,,t inequitable' attack on the property of the eompan:" by the Queensland GoYernment, now a Labour Administration,' and added that it \vas • a s('rious rcfl('('tion on the credit of one of the British colonic , and is calculated to be .-ery disquietu1ing to the in n:stor2. in Quei.."n~land securities.'

"The 'Financial ~ew~' (9th January, 1918) dPscribed the hvo Bills as ' a care­fully calculated act of eon{i.scatiou and bad faith, and. much as it will damage the company, it will injure still more seriously the ereuit and rc·pLitation of Queensland.'

"The '\Yestminster Gazette' (9th January, 1918) Fa id that the eompauy was justified in protesting against such a Bill, and added, ' No \Yonuer there is perturbation among the holders of the securities of the company.'

" 'The Financier' (lOth January, 1918) described the legislation as 'nothing 1norc or less than flBgrant repudiation, w.hieh can hardly fail to be injurious to Queensland's credit.'

" ' The Financial \Y orld' (12th J a nu­ary, 1918) said-' There can be no two opinions that this deliberate attempt to restrict profits, and, consequently, to reduce the value of the property "" a going concern ie, to put it bluntly, a mi!J form of eonfi,;cation.'

"The 'British Australasian' (lOth ,T anuary, 1918) said th"t the Go.-ernment. ' if it persists with those Bills, will do \'cry serious harm to the credit of the State on the London money market.'

" The ' Investors' ReYiew' (12th J anu­ary, 1918) said tbat the legislation was obviouslv introduced 'bee:mse the Labour ~ GoYcrnn1cnt thinks it Fees a chance to buy the property at its own valuation. It is a sweeping rneasure of confiscation, and we hope the GovPrn. mcut will pause bcforo it rushes into a piPcc of short-sighted folly of this dL~wription.'

"The 'Journal of the Rledrical In­dnstri es' (16th January, 1918) remarked that. if the UoYcrnment 'carrles ont its prec;cnt intentions it nwv sayc a ff:W

thou ,and pountls at the ~xpense of the invPstors, but it will assuredlY lose the pricolr:ss asset of credit. an~l will be marked in tlw finaneial world as a Go­Yernrnent which hold~ sacred l1D bargain which can be overridden or undermined by legislation.'

"' The Investors' Guardian' (12th January. 1918) said that the attempt, if persisted in, 'must inevitablv deteriorate the security in capital 'invested in Queensland.' "

[Mr Swayne.

In YiU\Y of the:-.e warnings, seeing ho\v depen­,J~·T!t "V\'C \vrrc on the inY(·;.~+ors on the other ;-.iJP of the wo.-ld, \Yould it not have been \visc for the Gc}\·c·l·nn1cnt to have he]d their handY Bnt, uo; the t~overnnwnt rushed in, and ,,,ould not take warning. The result j" t]Jat '' e f'anlk·t get the~ Jnone~r ·we could otlwr 1,'·ise haYP got and ~ttilisc·J for the bendlt uf the co11ununitv, and ·which would ha'"'' Cll dblcd m to a Yoid the uncmpl oyment difliculty in Quceuslrtud. U1Hler \Yise govern­nwut, (~11ceuslaud, "·ith its great natural r0 -ource-, and good clin1atc. is the last <'Ountr\· in the world \Yhich •lwuld suffer front ~rncmployn1ont. If we have a (J-overn­,,_,.!Jt '' hid1 is uapable of administering the affairs of the country, capital will be readily fmth<·oming. 'l'he subject of repudiation lllay have b(•con1o so1newhat hackneyed, but lion. nJolnLrr:; opposite are constantly intro~ duciug it. I would remind thmn that a distinct promise was made to tho pastoral lessees in 1905, after we had one of the hifYgt·st droughts Australia has seen, that they would not ha,·o their rents increase-d by more than 50 per cent. \Yhen the periods of reappra.itJen1cnt can1c round. 'l'he land was lying upon our hands and was of uo uso to anyone. It \Vas nccc~sary, in the interests. of Qtwcnsland, that that country should be put to its proper use. The Sccrdary for l'nblic Lands of that day pointed out at Yarious stages of the Bill in its passage throug-h the House that it waq necessary to giYe the pastora list an rrssurance that h<> \\·oulcl not he victimisL'd but \\"onld get fair play, in orcler tD induce him to put his mo1wy into the country. The promise was gi-n•n. So1neone at that titne, perhap::~, fore_ saw the nthent to power of a party like the pre,t>nt Government. which oulLl keep no rn·o1nis0. and raised the question as to whc•ther thero would be any possibility of repudiation. The Minister at the time said, '·No, the l,,,,;oe may try to get out of th<> Pngagt>ment. hut the State will stand to the >Jgroemcnt." The investors on the other side of the world were told that there was no chance of Queensland ever going back on its word. and so thev lent our na ,,(oral l<'ssoes the money for p;tting down 'bores, f<e•ncing. and so on.

J\Tr. FnY: It was thought to be impoosibl& at thnt time.

~Ir. SW AYNR: I do not want to labour tlte rnat~·or, but, seeing its ilnportance, and thn distress which has been caused by the refusal of people who ha1·e money in nthnr parts of the world to lend it to Queensland, too much light cannot be thrown on t\0 sub­juct. ln view of the false statemcnf.; which hrrn; been made, it is only right that the true posi' ion ohould be put before the people. Tho_,e who put their 1noncy into p:::t.stora1 holrling~ undrr the conditions ]aid do\Yn by th£' then C!ovcrnn1ent arc justly cntit1ed to complain of the broach of rrg-rcemellt by the pres,:nt GoYCTlnncnt, \Yhoso attion has iun>lY£'d u;:; in g1·cat cli~trc~ . lJnder our s.\·f=.torn of perpetnal lra;;;e ln' d tr mu nt tb0 prc;.::.,•nt tinH~ proviRion is n1adc for reappraiso­nlcnt of rrnt rYcrv ten years. Ho1v do \VC know that the ~tna·ll rncu· ·q ho haYf' takPn up thcir l:tntl on tl10-e conc1itions under an Act of ParlimllPlit mav not also be Yictimised? Once the right t~ break an ngTc,,mrnt is adn1ittcd. how are thosp lY"'l'll to know that the fiarne thing 1nay not take place in con­nection with thc·ir holding~ in fnture when their rPnts arr reappraisc(l, if there is a.

pa1tv 111 pl\\r't' plcpallrl to set aside the ,urnlJ..:ff.llPllt :' I thnlk 110 nwr('o danHLging doctrirw for the fnture of Queensland could po<•ihly Le COllCl'i ved. It alto et uot onlr the people who put their n10noy i11to ou~ wr ,f,·rn country a ftcr the 1902 drou<rht ~tnd h10 p oplo ·who lent th~·ln L-Jlley to put do'.vn bore;; and felJce the c 1nntry and n1ake it productive; it affects the wholo StatQ.

I would like to refer to one or two spenchei3 n1ade on the otlH'l' sjJ.c. I was very surprised to hear :-,orne staten•Emts mad€' b7· the hon. 1110mbor for narcoo in a previou~ debate, but I am not permitted bv the StandiLg Orders to re-fer to th_,t. La-t night, ho\Yevei·, I think I heard the ban. member for Herbert teil us that \VC were oYorproducing, and yet in the p:uue ''Jleech he was urging that higher wages should be paid. \Vhero doe3 the money eornc fron1 to pay wages? Does it not co1ne from produdion '! I ha vo here an extract which appeared in the New eouth \Vales Press when the basic wage was first dis­eussed, and which applies to the doctrine advanced by hon. members opposite that pro­<:luction is not necessary to the payment of wages-

" The basie wage per family of four at £4 Ss. per week is £221 per year; 2,000,000 divided by four gives SOO,OOO groups of four in New South \Vales. If SOO,OOO is multiplied by 221 we have £110,SOO,OOO as the basic wage per annum for New South Wales. The 'Statistical Bulletin' of June, 1920, on page 40, gives the value of production of the principal ~ndustries of New South \Vales (includ­~ng past?ral, agricultural, n1ining, dairy­mg, mmor-poultrv, bees rabbits­forests, aud fisheries: n1annf~f'turing) as: In the yc1u· 1917-18. £99,202,000; in the y<'ar 1918-19, £98,101,000; or £12,399,000 too little to pay a uniform basic wage of £4 Ss. JWr week to each group of four persons :V1orc·over, according to the official ye m· book of l'\ ew South \Vales in 1918 tho interest charge on the Nm~ South Wales debt was £S,220,307. That is, the tob.l production of New South Wales is £17,619,000 too little to pay our basic "age and our intere-;t charge. Of course, if an industry cannot afford to pay a basic wage it should bo shut down."

Tha.t is the point-that without sufficient pr~duction. the basic wage cannot be paid. I~ IS a log1cal soquence that without produc­tion you cannot pay any waq-e, .and con­versely that to pay a wage yon n•ust have productwn. Yd the hon. members opposite say, " Raise wa,gos and reduce production.''

J\h. \VmHI.IO<LEY: :\'"obody ever said any­thing of the kind.

1\Ir. SWA YNE: Both the membor for Bm·coo and the member for Herbert have asked. "If an employee do<:s not produce enough to pay !;1s wages. how arc yo.u going to p>ty th<'m? Of course, I thmk the trouble is that hon. members opposite do not pay ,,,ages, nor do I think that many of them e;vcr ,!Jd, and therefore they aro nn":blc to 11.Jlj'll"CCiate the position. Amongst thmr supporters thc'y can say what they like, but they cannot get away from such facts as thcso. In e·pitc of what has been said, I think that a.nyono poss<'._ sed of comn1on sense recorr­nises that what is wanted in Queensland ~t the prcseat time is encouragement to pro· <lucc and c>ncouragemcnt to save. Unless you

have people ''ho '"tl\C. you rannot n.rry on through times of stre,s, ,dwthcr of w:tr or drought. The policy of this Government all through has been the discouragement of the rnan -..v::1o saves, the discourag-en1ent of the JL•an -..vho has qqalltic-s ~uch as self-denial, of determination, aml ability to put by a little for the Lad days to come, and of iho man who i:~ not ',<atisfie{l to be paid onl.; his, dailc- wage bnt who \vauts to got out and nwko a start on his o1vn. That is the class \Vhich comes to the l'c•<cue of the country in tirrH's of difficulty. But the Government have done everything to discourage them, -even out of existence, and, if that policy is con­tinued and the discouragement of these worthy sections is carried on to the bitter end, as it will b" if this Government remain in power, we shall all starve together. (G<wernmont laughter.) Hon. members oppo­site know that production is not going ..thEad. You ran print as many bank notes as you like; but, if there is no production of food, no flour for instance, what use are they? In Russia to-dav I think that thousands of roubles arc "given for a bag of flour or a pair of boots. That is the result of non­production, and yet the hon. member for Hurbert and the hon, member for Barooo say, " Do not produce the wherewithal to pay \Yages." I do not think anything further than such utterances as we have just heard is rr fjuired to convince the people of Queens­land that they have a wrong Administration for Queensland's needs.

'The hon. n•ombcr who has just resumed hi,, seat had a good deal to say on industrial matters. It seemed to me that it would haYe been a more suitable speech on tho votG for the Industrial Court, and it also sug­gested to mo that there was a certain amount of narrowness in confining the whole of an hour's discourse to wages. Vv e aU know that it is noces>ary that every worker in the community should have a fair wage, but. after ail there aro other sections-the sections who provide the wages. The hon. member also made an attack on the Indus­trial Peace Act. Lot me say that the Indus­trial Peace Act was one of the best piece~ of industrial legislation ever placed upon the statute-book, and we know that during th0 currency of that legislation the workers, their wives, and children were kept to a large extent free from the ill-efiects of strikes. And, remember, that Act did not deny the right to strike. It merely said that certain formalities must be complied with before neon could strike. ~\nd that is a principle that hon. members opposite have incorporated in their Iudustri al Arbitration Act-that those who strike ilkgaliy should be punished. The trouble is that they have not got the backbone to carry out thci r own Act. If :, ou had no Arbitration Act, I Ljnit0 admit that there is nothing ~J 1 'lO for the \Yo:rke-r to do th:1n E!Tike if he is tr1 ated unfairly. But with all tho ach·antages pl~'Cod at the disposal of the worker in the "ay of industrial tribunals, and as past expcrir :1ce has given hi1n no re;1son to com­plain in a country like thi,, with all the facilities at his disposal, there should be no strikes. I shall l>ave an opportu:nitv later on in the session of again dealing w1th this matter, as there is an amendment to the Arbitration Act proposed, and there will also be an opportunity on the Estimates when dealing with the Arbitration Court vote. One of tho best things in the Industrial Peace Act was the provision for a secret

Mr. Swayne.J

[ASSK\fBLY.]

ballot. The men in deciding '"hethcr they would ce>ase work or not could vote without hind1·ancc. V.' e know very well how an open ballot is taken. The question is put something like this : "All h-- sea bs stand on one side, and all good unionists stand {lll the other side." under such coercion and terrorism the ballot is t"ken. Under the Industrial Peace ~'l.rt a secret ballot could be taken under the supervision of a Govcrnm0nt olficiftl. I thiuk that was a fair and just provision, and, nwreoYl'r, I think that: \Yhen those ballots a re taken, tlw wi,·cs of the n1e11 shonJd 1tasc.. a votP.

1 \vant to sa- a fe\v "ords now about the sugar indu;:;try.' I hope that an opportunity will he given i11 this Hm• .e to dc"J with the 1notlon, JJutice of Y:·hich has been giYen by the leader of this partv, in fovonr of the continuance of the Con!monwcalth Sugar Agreement. While de 1ling wi:h the sugar industry 1 an' reminded of somethiE6 that was ·-aid by the hen. m em bcr for M Lmding­burra. This is not the first occasion on which he has spoken of the lar;;e number of cJlourcd cmployc~s in the industry. I do not think he is correct in that regard. I come from one of the larg< c,t sugar di~tricts in Queensland, and I know that coloured aliens are non-existent there. If thcv a1·c so prcYalcnt elsewhere, it is a reflection upon this Government wbo haYe had the reins of office for six yen rs.

:Mr. DASH : It is a reflection on the Den· ham GoYernnwnt.

Mr. S\VAYNE: [ am a canegrower. and the hon. memb<•r is not. Everything I have is in the industry, and I represent a largo nurnber of canegrowers; and what concerns me at the present time is that we are com­ing to the end of our present agreement with the Commonwealth Governn.'ent. and we know that a set has been marle in some quarters in the South against the continu­ance of that agreement.

Mr. Cor.LINR: \Vhich of vonr friends arc rn aking the set ? ·

11r. S\YAYNE: No rnore dangq·ou~ and iujuriou3 utterance~ rould be made than those made bv the hon. member that there are a large n1~mbor of coloured aliens in the indus­try. \V c know that there are m allY in the SOuthern Sta.te!i who are on1v too a~xious to pick some point to justify th~ir opposition to the agreement. vVc know very well that the big j am-makcrc., through their mouthpiece', ha,·o howl"d down the Queensland sugar indu try. \Vo know very "·oil how they v.-i!l coizc on such a point. It. is without foundation, and should never, in the inter­ests of the industry, have been mentioned. Information has been sought on more than ono occasion by questions by hon, members nn this sidn of the I-{ouse as to the num­ber of coloured aliens employed m t'hc industry. anrl, speaking fr0m 1nemory, I do not think that infon11a-tion has hE'E'l1 forthcon1inr,-. \Ve kDo\~.t' that t}wrn is legis­lation r('g a n1ing coloured ali c!ls 011 thr~ statute-book. and I take advantage of this opportunity to ask the Home S crctary or tiw Scc:rctary br Agriculture or who ever is administering that leg·islation to place on the hblo of the Hou-.•o, the police returns show­ing tlw number of coloured aliens that are now employed in the sugar industry. I mako the suggestion becans0 I recognise. as the hon. member for JV1undingburra does not recognise, the harm that might possibly result

[Mr. Swayne.

fro:n .'<Uch utterance::. as hi5. 1 huvc .::Cf'H

1'0ln<.lrk'l in the Soutl11~rn papPi'S and I h l,.Vt'

been down there In) splf on deputation", and I quite realise -...vhat a handle the ban. :rnember ha!3) giv0n to the enen1ics of the sugar industry.

:1\Ir. COLLIXS: \\'ho arc they? Mr. SWAY~E: The Australian Workers'

Union, amongst others. I£, as the hon. mem­ber says, he is a SUJ1p0l'ter of the Govern­ment, I a.ssume he has some inflnence with the Government, and he could go to them quietly :tnd see if his information is correct.

Tv.fr. COLLIKS: There are coloured a1ien~ cn1ployed in thv Inkcrman and Pioneer 1nills in my electorate.

Mr. S\YAYNE: To show •.hat the position is I ha.n:: hQre a cutting fro1n the "CDnrirr." of 14th September, 1921-

" Colonel Oldcrsha" stat.:cl that th., inch1'try W'l:-, in a ;ood po~Iri:-m thLre at prc~ent. '"'Hd tlu_•t·c wns a dema.nd front ?TOWCl· ·La· th? agrP'·: wnt with the FcdPral GovrenrrlPr;t \YhiC'h lronld end ou 30th Jm c. 1G23. ·.hould be continued for a further tcnn."

The contirmation until 1923 is there t{l enable sugar ID llc sold which is got from the cane harvested in 1922. So far as the growers are corwer11ed. it terminates in 1922; but it should hC' continued for anothc•r term. The t x:tract goes on-

,, Tbi' matter has not vet been con· 'irlered bv the FPdcral Ministry, and there is likely to bC' considerahlB opposi­tion to the proposal should it be brought forward.,

The lnclrr of the Country party in this Houee has g1ven notice of motion in favour of the continuance of the agrccm >nt, which mea.ns everything to the mdustry. The sugar crop this season is going to lw worth £7,500,000 to Queens­land; and I hope that. the leader of the Country party· 'vi!l bt' giYrn an opportunity of nwYing that y;.-..olntirnJ. Th<'rn ea~ be ~ .. o di -agr('P!ncnt or <11:-;.conl ern the qur~bon. lt is simply inknded to sho\\· people down South that . 11 partin' in the Cuccns!and Pnr1ianlt•ut ar(~ unanin1ous on the ,"ubject. The sugar indu.~tr~· is t1F' gT· atc'st onploying­in.Ju'll'V in this Strttc. \Ye kno>·· that unem­p1oynw' it i~ rife throup-hont thi) State. D:nd otk•r StatL,•. TllP only busy and thl'lvmg distriet:._{ in QLH'f'D!:dat1d at tho }H'C'scnt tirne an· the sugar di~trict-. Seejng· tbat so much

deJwnds on a (•cmtintutnce of the [10 p.m.] ugJ;cemcllt, I think there should

be no diffPrClH'{~ of opinian in th1s Ilon· '' "' to the need for ih contil1uance. ,,nd 1 hope the opportnllity will be given to c(nd!rr, h,· re ·o1uti._)n that it j..; n0CC''-.sa.ry for Quc:•nslanrl',; "-elfarc that it should bt' can·i;·d on. I have n recent papet· con­taining C'xtrac:t:; fro1n the Snnthern Pres.~ Dn thi_ matte~·. The le ad er c f th•e Country ]Hilt_v in th~ F{•(1r-ral IloU""B lu·s bcc.1_ {L.sked to u-.:r• hi~ infhL nc0 a<:;·a1n t the tarryll1g on of the int!ustrY. I\lt·. J)o. rclma~ th-~ h.011.

F<'<'rt'h:rv of Uw Au ... tt::\1la'-! Conference of Frnlt Grower.;, atta( ked the illdu:<try, n.nd said·--

,, rrhe nnnual loss on the Qupensland ~u~ar industry is estin1atod at about £5.000,000. This shmlld hr borne by tho people as a whole. The burd'n should J'ot fall unfairly on the fruit producers. Australian suga~l' is ffi{H'C than doub1e the price at which it ean be purch'ls<'d else­where.''·

Supply. [20 SEPTEMBER.] .:.Haunt JJu/ligan Dis(Uiter.

I do not think that is quite correct. No matter how bacllv off the Australian fruit­grower n111v be, bee would be out of existence no\v if it W"f'f0 not for the Qut~C':Jsland sugar industry. I am quoting this as a sample of t.he tactics that are being pursued aga,inst us in tl,e South at the present time. I find that Mr. Fors tor complains that in 1918 J av"' sugar could have been landed at £18 per ton. That is one of the fallacies which are comtantly brought fm·\\·ard in the South, where the people know no better, to preju­dice us. During the war there were times when sut;a.r could havo been brought from Java at R very lo\V price--I very rnuch doubt \vhethf'r it ,,·a~ thi-.: 1Hi(<P---but at that tinw no shipping \\ l-5 <:Ya~1all!c, a11d if they had g-iv·~'ll lt to you _in Javn you could not llavt:• got• it U\\ay from -JnnJ.

The TnE.\SrRER: If you sit do"·n 1Ye will a<ljourn.

.Mr. SWAYl\E: The jam manufacturer is under no handiup whatcn·r. For export purposes h~: is supplied with sngar a-, cheaply as he can got it nny1\'lwre else in the world. They will tell yen, "\Ve are quite satisfied as lo·1g as we are not hampered in any way rer;a.rding the export of our product. So far Hs Australian con:-umption is conc0rned, we are (\nil o prcprned to pay Australian pri(_ 2s." But there scen1s to he a gang Df

· Jnanufactul'crs who are detcrn1ined. if pos­sible, to take away tlw small amount of pro­tection we have, a.nJ IH1ve three grades of sugar. This opposition to the indmh-y is prmninent in YictDria, "·hich poses as n. protectionist State. The manufacturer, with the price at £46 pet· ton, gets sugar at some­thing less than 5J. per lb. I ascertained what "''as tho charge made by the manufacturer tu the retailer. I found that a big firm in Brisbane \Ya~ paying 7~d. f.o.b. Tasinania, fo!· this sug·ar. So the manufacturer gets a profit of something like 2~d. per lb. on our ~ugar. J~un cm1tains ~ ll.J. of sngur to evnry 1 lb. of fmiL liP In~''' that ~ lb. for !res t-han 5cL. aurl rhc•n he ,,.lis it for 7bd. Yet hu complain~ ahont tll:. .. · amonnt (;f p;·(\­tcctioll 'n~ !.!.'l'L ~1..11 1,\ e get ]~ £6 a tcu-­about two-thirds of ld. per lb. \Yhon the jam maker puts it in hi,; jampot, he receives a protect-ion of 3d. on it.

\Vhile on the subject I \1·ould like to draw hon. members' attention to the debt they a.re under to t·ho Queemland sugar industry. According to the ''Commonwealth Year Book," the output of jam in Australia in 1914 was worth £1,444,000. In 1918-the last figures g-iven-it "·as mJrt.h £2,930,000. But for our sncar industry, not only would the public of Australia have• been without jam to put on their breacl. but they would have h.en without sugar to put in their tea. \Ye know in GrPat Britain duri1Jg the war they ;w•ro rationing- out sugar at 1s. per lb., and tho Go\'ornmont lost money in supplying it at that price. In Australia during that time the people could buy sugar first at 3~d., then <>t 4d., and la.tlcl'l_y at 6d. per lb. Let us see the money that has been brought into Aus­tralia bccatl:'P nf the ('Xj:-:h'llCL' ·of our su~~;ar ir~dustry. which would not haYo been circu­late-d anwngst the worln'rs othenvi-.e. The tlxpol'ts of jam in 1914 were £90,000. In 1918 they had goncJ up to £4,000,000. In other "'"·ord~. in four ~'ears, owing to the existence "four sugar industry, a.n a dJitional £3,900,000 of outside mruAy wa' brought into ~-\ustralia. 'While tho><' Pngagecl in- the sug-ar industry are ahyay:-3 being l'PJninded of the a1nount

of protection afforded them. and what they co~t the pcoplr foe sugar on account of the import duty-if that can he reckoned as a co-t to the people-I might just rerr•ind the Committee that t-he rnannfactl!rers of prt'­serYes in the ~outh f>Jt a protC"ction of 4d. per lb. on pl'llllc.; as agai1lst the t\\o-thirds of a penny per lb. "hicb theY soy 11·c hin·c got on our sugar <Jncl 3d. JH'i' HL (J1~ nth"1· driecl frnjt:-;, I trll~t tL ·r the• (}(JYt'nl­

nJent. will :::c•C' that th(• rp~olnt~ou, notice of \Yllich has lh_'C'11 .Q i\'Oll Lr tlH• ll'adt•l' of this pnrtv, is earri('d ·-in ordl~l' to ,.;:L'C'Ure th0 con­tinnflllce of the agrec··r •nt. and in doing that it· \Yill bP ncct'~·~arY to rljsabn':'lc the 1ninc~:-; of the Southern peOple on this n1attPr. This is nn important indmtr)' to Queensland. '" full;• 100.000 people dt'JW!l(l on it, <>nd thP Hl\10UJ1t of H10llC'V illYC':..;tl'd in it i~ FOffif\­

tlJing lik._ £9.000.000. That is th0 estimaie gi n?n hy },Ir. E.n~tcrh,· . tho GoYt•rmnent official iu dwrve of tlw indur'ry. ~e\1:othcr polut is th- t tl1c lndnstry is nn in1portnnt 0110 frmn tbn 11oint of yje"· (Jf national defenct_·, a~ the people 0ngage>d in th0 sugar iudtl·"tr.v <Hl' H('1ing cp; a g-nrri nn _::·a!n~t iuvasion lu ()J1(' of t_.hl' lllO~t n:'J;('!'ilh1t• r ·tl't'l of 1 ilt' ( ir)JtJH10ilW£'i.dth.

Th0 1-Iun-::l' rc-,uuH·(l. Tlw ( 'H \J TO!\'.,- 1'0· ported pro:!;'rc -s.

rrh(~ Con1n1ittie nl,tlillcd 1j·<J\-(' i{) :-it again on Tuesday ne'•t.

Tht• 1Ton'P adjonni'.'d <tt lC.l: p.:t:.