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Tietoa taloudesta ja yhteiskunnasta simuloinnilla 25.2.2011 Aalto -yliopiston

perustieteiden korkeakoulu, Tietojenksittelytieteen laitos

ConnectIrmeli posted to #seminaarikannu 25.02.2011 (fi) 53 comments

ToolsConnectIrmeli said

ku | #seminaarikannu | Tietoa taloudesta ja yhteiskunnasta simuloinnil... http://www.qaiku.com/channels/show/seminaarikannu/view/3767434a4...

8 14.10.2012 14:15


2/18

53 comments Bottom

Faktat ja arvot ovat jatkuvassa vuoropuhelussa kaikessa toiminnassamme,

ptksenteossamme ja valinnoissamme

ConnectIrmeli commented on posted to #seminaarikannu 25.02.2011 (fi)

13.15 Timo Honkela: Sosiaalisen simuloinnin mahdollisuudet

rimmisen kompleksinen ilmi

vaikeasti kvantitatiiviseti tutkittavia / mitattavia ilmiit lhdetn mallintamaankvalitatiivisesti


Ohjelma: http://research.ics.tkk.fi/cog/simula...

@personaleu striimaa http://www.personaleu.eu/


Your chat is offline


8 14.10.2012 14:15


3/18

Emergenssi = kehkeytyminen -> miten esim. rahan olemassaolo kehkeytyy jossakin

yhteisss tai yhteiskuntamallissa. Nkkulma on uusi - aiemmin on lhdetty simuloimaan

olettaen, ett raha on havainnoitavassa lopputilanteessa olemassa.

Kuva: 13.30 Risto Linturi: Verkostoituneen talouden simulointi


Faktat vs. arvot -vuoropuhelu perustuu erilaisiin maailmankuviimme. -Vuoropuhelun

rakentamisen oppiminen eri maailmankuvia edustavien vlille on uusi prjmistaito.




8 14.10.2012 14:15


4/18

Mit tapahtuu, kun metsstj-kerilij alkaa varastoida vaihdantaa varten?


"Raha on sopimuksia ja viivstetyn vaihdannan kirjanpito (ellei se ole sidottu esim. kullan tai

hopean arvoon)."


Metsstj-kerilij hankki ja varastoi vain, mit tarvitsi




8 14.10.2012 14:15


5/18

Lpinkyvyys lis eriarvoisuutta - esimerkkin Madonnan musiikki (vrt. ansiot

tuntemattomana)

Yleiskommentissa nostetaan esille oppiminen - oppiminen varastoon, vaihdannasta koettava

hyty, "tutut", kehkeytyminen...


metsstj-kerilij -lauman koko on n. 150 ihmist - "tuttujen" mr

vaihdantaa syntyy, kun molemmat kokevat saavanta hyty




8 14.10.2012 14:15


6/18

14.00 Mikko Jskelinen: Maineen vaikutuksen simulointi

Risto Linturi: "Social Simulation of Networked Barter Economy with Emergent Money":

http://www.cis.hut.fi/research/cog/TK...


Verkostoitumisen vaikutus utiliteettihydyn jakautumiseenoppimisessa? Oppimisen avulla?

Oppimisesta huolimatta?





8 14.10.2012 14:15


7/18

ConnectIrmeli - glad to participate, and glad Kurt has his phone to stream the event.

International Conference on Artificial Neural Networks, June 14-17th, 2011, Espoo, Finland

http://www.cis.hut.fi/icann11/worksho...

ConnectIrmeli commented on posted to #seminaarikannu 25.02.2011 (en)

@paulswansen Thanks for your comments in bambuser :). There's some development work to

do to create a mashup of translation & commenting through different media.


14.15 Mika Pantzar: Talouden ymmrtmisen haasteita - kommentti edellisiin, havaintoja

kehittjnuran varrelta

"maailmanmallit" 1970 -luvulla "artificial society" - alkoivat 1950 -luvulla smalleista ->Forresterin kaupunkimallit

1980 -luvun talouden mallinnuksessa ei hydynnetty edellisi; taloustieteilijt eivtarvostaneet, koska hintamekanismit puuttuivat

endogeeniset preferenssit - rakenteeksi muuttuva, rakenteita muuttava taloussubjekti,

Anthony Giddens"professorien aika ohi"

Rooman klubin kokous Finlandia -talossa 1986 - kompleksisuusteoriaa esiteltiin 1. kerransuomalaisille

talousevoluutioteoreettinen vitskirja 1990 -luvulla - ilman matematiikkaa, replikatiivinenmalli

rytmianalyysi, dataa kuluttajan ajankytn rytmeist

"kun tekee sosiologien kanssa tye, ei saa puhua malleista"

"Growing Artificial Societies" - Stanford 1990 -luvun puolivliss; Pantzar vertasi lastensaleikkej omaan "oman yhteiskunnan rakentamiseensa". Lapset kasvattivat kiinalaisiavirtuaalielimi - saako ne integroitua "omaan yhteiskuntaan". Onko addiktio peleihin aikuistenkuvitelmaa - onko lasten suhtautuminen enemmnkin ironiaa... Tulevaisuudessa kompetenssiei en ole sidoksissa ikn. Simulaatioleikkien kautta kehittyy tapa hahmottaa dynaamisiatiloja ja ...kehittyy reflektiivinen ja kontrolliva min?

Pantzar summaa, ett nyt on kulunut 15 vuotta ja molemmat lapset ovat kauppakorkekoulussaja tynn triviatietoa. Spatiaalisuus ei vaihtunut dynaamisuuteen mitenkn automaattisesti.Kyse on huomattavasti vahvemmasta kulttuurisesta ilmist / muutoksesta.


"Simuloinnissa parasta on ksitekuri." Kun ajatuksensa pakottaa sarjaan laatikoita,

kokonaisuus muuttuu robustimmaksi ja konkreettisia tutkimuskysymyksi kehkeytyy.

ksitteiden vliset suhteet mrittyvt simulaation avulla

simulointiprosessi tuottaa mritelmi, joista ei alussa oltu tietoisia - ajatuksellinenkehkeytyminen

prosessi tuottaa onnekasta kehkeytymist

simulaatiolla psee kehkey tyviin piirteisiin ksiksi - mitk ovat kehkeytymisenrakenteet




8 14.10.2012 14:15


8/18

Jatkoaskeleita

Mahdollistaminen (organisationaaliset ratkaisut)

Menetelmien kehittminen

Yhteiskunnallinen keskustelu ja vaikuttaminen

Paneelin aikana nousi puheeksi, voisiko kansanedustajat valita virtuaalisten pelitaitojenperusteella... Strateginen ajattelu paljastuu paljon selvemmin kuin mielipiteitn latelemalla.-Taito lukea toisen virtuaalista kyttytymist on opittavissa - liittyy suljetusta maailmastaavoimeen sirrtymiseen. Valitsisin itse niin paljon mieluummin ehdokkaani tarkastelemallahnen monivuotista kurinalaista sosiaalisten verkostojen rakentamistaan (syvyys, laveus jatervyys tasapainossa), kuin lukemalla mielipiteit jonossa. Viel nihin lhimpn tuleviinvaaleihin liittyen en ole pongannut yhtn ehdokasta, jonka kyttytymist ja kyttytymisen

Thanks for the link for Collaborative Consumption. I've book marked it.

paulswansen commented on posted to #seminaarikannu Westminster 25.02.2011 (en)

How is this Translation from Google.

"A multidisciplinary interaction is the future of core skills - attitudes and skills to be in place."

"Moniammatiilinen vuorovaikutus on tulevaisuuden perustytaito - asenteet ja taidot oltava

kohdallaan."


Collaborative Consumption http://www.collaborativeconsumption.c...


@paulswansen :)


@ConnectIrmeli I hadn't realized it was you sitting next to Kurt.


"Moniammatiilinen vuorovaikutus on tulevaisuuden perustytaito - asenteet ja taidot oltava

kohdallaan."

Kauanko me odotetaan viel sit tulevaisuuttahuoh



Paneelista:

Mallin rakentaminen opettaa / muuttaa enemmn kuin mallin kyttminen.

Yritykset ovat kasa paperia. Yritys ei tee mitn - ihmiset tekevt. Mallinnetaan "klaaneja".

Varaston keksiminen on talouden kehittymisen merkittvimpi vaikuttajia.

Tutkimuksen ongelma on tn pivn se, ett kaikkia asioita ja ongelmia tutkitaanerikseen ja yksittisin ilmiin. Tutkittavan suhteet kaikkeen muuhun jvt huomioimatta.

Akateeemisessa hierarkiassa kysymykset valikoituvat, siiloutuvat ja asettuvat jo valmiiksi

hyvksyttyjen tutkimusaiheiden ymprille -> tnn esiteltyjen tutkimusten tarkoituksena onmuodostaa monitieteinen ryhm uudenlaisten kysymysten ja lhestymistavan ymprille.

Yleiskommentissa pyydetn omaishoitajan tyn simulointia - kuka tekisi?




8 14.10.2012 14:15


9/18

Valokuvia t ilaisuudesta Picasa Teams -albumissani

Mika Pantzar. Keskustelu.

personaleu commented on posted to #seminaarikannu Niittymaantie 13, Espoo 25.02.2011 (fi)

Mikko Jskelinen


Risto Linturi (2)


Risto Linturi (1)


And now one more time: Live!Timo Honkela


Pivn haastavimmaksi jatkoajatukseksi ji mieleen, ett lpinkyvyys lis eriarvoisuutta.

Tarvitaan totutusta poikkeavia luku- ja tulkintataitoja ja ymmrryst. Pienelt ja turvalliselta

lhiyksiklt saatava tuki on trke. Pienten ja globaalien verkostojen rakentamistaito on ehk

se isoin lhiopeteltava avaintaito motivointi, tukeminen ja auttaminen


@ConnectIrmeli Thanks. Yes, the international social interaction is a growth area that needs

more activity and attention. We can't continue to live in our local only fishbowl worlds.


@paulswansen Re. the google translation - it may give the core context, yes ok. But still the

'engines' mix things up a bit. I was writing that multidisciplinary communication / interaction is

something we must put effort to in the future. The translator turned it the way that it's the

future of core skills... But this is great already though. The next versions will sure be much

more accurate.

@personaleu says that you are a model citizen for global social interaction. We've got a

mission to grow our tribe!


systemaattista ja tietoista muuttumista pystyisi nin tarkastelemaan.

Toisen sosiaalinen lukeminen liittyy edell mainittuun tulevaisuuden osaamiseenvuorovaikuttaa moniammatillisesti.




8 14.10.2012 14:15


10/18

@connectIrmeli ja @personaleu ja kaikki. Kiitos eteln metialle hienosta raportoinnista, jota

voi seurata olematta paikan pll; epsymmetrisesti.

Olin tn Oulussa ja juttelimme hetken @AjatusVesa kanssa mm 5T:st. Pohjoisessa kaikki

on kaukana. Mittariin tuli neljsataa kilsaa.

https://picasaweb.google.com/personal...




18 14.10.2012 14:15


11/18

@paulswansen During the streaming I can see written on the screen how many watchers are

online. And I can read your comments from there. But I can NOT write back to you because

I'm streaming. That's why @ConnectIrmeli ping toed you through Qaiku.

I've asked Nokia and Bambuser to tell if the new N7 is able to send Bambuser text feedback

during streaming.


@personaleu It's great to see your equipment set up. Also thanks for sharing your time at

these events.


@paulswansen Simulating all day what already happened - with this equipment.


Tapaamiset terva- ja bittiporvareiden kanssa vaatii tehokkuutta, koska KOHTAAMISET

pakottavat pitkiin siirtymiin.

Tss suhteessa maailma ei ole muuttunut lainkaan elinikini kuluessa: puheet telluksen

supistumisesta ovat potaskaa.

Mutta somea kyttvt pohjoisen toimijat voivat sst aikaa, rahaa ja polttoaineita. Harva

yrittj tajuaa somekosmologiaa.

visualradio commented on posted to #seminaarikannu Oulu 25.02.2011 (fi)



18 14.10.2012 14:15


12/18

@paulswansen I remeber seeing a tv documentary about the dramatic changes in Detroit after

the huge layoffs in the car industry. It struck me that the Digital Villages "toolbox" could be

used to mobilize local forces at a community level to start working towards a new destiny. The

distress of the Detroit area is however so huge with all the problems of gangs and cultural

breakdown that it would be easier to start with something smaller: a town, city or a community.

@personaleu @visualradio @ConnectIrmeli I'm all for it. Let me know how I can assist.


@personaleu @ConnectIrmeli @paulswansen Count on me. I work with a Digital Villages

#digitalvillages ecosystem that grows from the digital to buildings and services on a

community level. Hope to be able to "stream and tell" about the evolution during this spring.

visualradio commented on posted to #seminaarikannu Sotkamo 26.02.2011 (fi)

@paulswansen How about collecting together a global "network animal team", participating in

eachothers' broadcastings whenever possible. And joining same network places, eg. Qaiku,

Google Docs, Bambuser. LI, FB, Twitter, YouTube... and promising brand new places as

Quora, TouchGraph...

There are a lot of great international channels in Qaiku. And everyone can create new ones if

needed.

I think @ConnectIrmeli @visualradio and more Finnish inspirers are interested in such an

experiment, too.


@personaleu Well being able to see the chat is a step forward. For the moment, yes, having aback channel like we did yesterday afternoon is a great help for the conversation. Given the

progress in technology, I'd bet we'll have much more interactive devices in the very near

future.


...and that's how.




18 14.10.2012 14:15


13/18

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jiajia commented on posted to #seminaarikannu 4 days ago (zh)

The idea is to mobilize and motivate people to take responsibility of their own destiny, cultural,

economical, and social development. It's not a quick fix. Digital Villages helps to create

alternative evolutionary models for distance work, microjobs, small is beutiful, etc.

The first project 2000 - 2005 was very limited in scope. We've a group of companies working

with the concept since the end of the project and are now seeing that the digital infrastructure

and devices are ready for a new "open and learning society" where the networks are used to

improve productivity of the process and to add more people from "inside" and "outside" into

the development.

Changes don't happen over night. DV is not a product or not even a software package. It's a

mental toolbox, including ways for collaboration, learning, innovation, trade, distance work,community development, real estate, renovation of buildings and infrastructure, improving the

ecology and energy effectiviness of the village.

It might sound like "big and complex" but the elements have been tested for years in narrow

development segments and we'd now like to move from testing details to taking it to villages in

need for change and ready to step forward and say, "Let's do it!"

We've a core group that can easily be expanded with Qaiku- and Some-people in Finland. But

I know that there are intellectual resources available around the globe if and when we get this

thing moving.

It could be applied to change a distressed shopping center in need for a modernization, but I

think it's important to take a look at the whole community and build towards an ecocity model.

Digital networks are important in the process, ensuring that the evolution goes faster and that

multiple learning by doing processes are more effective.

We can source (not outsource) in specialists from a global pool of experts. The model

community can use the skills to help the neighboring communit to improve itself. A domino

theory can be applied to move from town to town.

visualradio commented on posted to #seminaarikannu Sotkamo 26.02.2011 (en)



18 14.10.2012 14:15


14/18

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Geraldine1203 commented on posted to #seminaarikannu 4 days ago (zh)



18 14.10.2012 14:15


15/18

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could vary from what was shown on the website. When ordering online, you need to be

prepared not to know exactly what you are getting (no matter how good the pictures may

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not even have a return policy. Another drawback could be having a hard time tracking down

the correct person to speak with when emailing or calling about a problem or questions

regarding your order.

The cons of working with a specialty store can be that your choices may be more limited. If

you have creative and discerning taste, you might not like being restrained to what that

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Adalgiso commented on posted to #seminaarikannu 4 days ago (zh)

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Geraldine1203commented on posted to #seminaarikannu 4 days ago (zh)



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Love My Dress Wedding blog - Photography Copyright (c) 2012,

Rebecca Norris of says...

One of the hardest things about blogging is that its often a totally solo labour of love. You

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Lots of love and luck with your new venture ladies! :)

Weekend love folks,

Annabel

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