so you dont believe jesus is god

7/31/2019 So You Dont Believe Jesus is God

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SO YOU DON'T

BELIEVE JESUS ISGODA LETTER FROM ONE OF MY SUBSCRIBERS

BY WATCHMAN DEAN

JULY 21, 2012

I received a letter from one of my subscribers at Scribd.comback in 2011. I did not know the message was there becauseScribd does not have a "message alerting" system in place. (Ihonestly did not know that so I never check my messagebox). When I tried to answer the letter today (almost a yearlater) the CAPTCHA system would not work. I made ten

different attempts and every time I failed and was given anew message. I then tried to use the "AUDIO" challengeinstead and what a challenge it was. It was several minutesof incoherent nonsensical sounds from a computer voice, youcouldn't make out one single word. So, I shall insteadanswer this letter as a published article, because MUCH ofthe questions sent to me by this individual are commonquestions that trinitarians have for someone who preacheswhat I preach.

THE LETTER AS IT WAS RECEIVED

Hi Jeffrey. So, you don't believe Jesus is God? Are you aMormon or a Jehovah's Witness?


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What about Isaiah's proclamation Unto us a child is born...and His name shall be called the Everlasting Father, etc.?what about all the other scriptures that proclaim that He IS

God?

Hebrews 1:88 But unto the Son he saith, Thy throne, O God, is for everand ever: a sceptre of righteousness is the sceptre of thykingdom.

John 1:1-14

1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was withGod, and the Word was God.

2 The same was in the beginning with God.

3 All things were made by him; and without him was not anything made that was made.

10 He was in the world, and the world was made by him, and

the world knew him not.

14 And the Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us, (andwe beheld his glory, the glory as of the only begotten of theFather,) full of grace and truth.

Col 1:15-17

15 Who is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn ofevery creature:

16 For by him were all things created, that are in heaven, andthat are in earth, visible and invisible, whether they bethrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers: all things


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were created by him, and for him:

17 And he is before all things, and by him all things consist.

John 10:30-33

30 I and my Father are one.

31 Then the Jews took up stones again to stone him.

32 Jesus answered them, Many good works have I shewedyou from my Father; for which of those works do ye stone

me?

33 The Jews answered him, saying, For a good work we stonethee not; but for blasphemy; and because that thou, being aman, makest thyself God.

John 12:45

45 And he that seeth me seeth him that sent me.

John 14:7-9

7 If ye had known me, ye should have known my Father also:and from henceforth ye know him, and have seen him.

8 Philip saith unto him, Lord, shew us the Father, and itsufficeth us.

9 Jesus saith unto him, Have I been so long time with you,and yet hast thou not known me, Philip? he that hath seenme hath seen the Father; and how sayest thou then, Shew usthe Father?


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Romans 9:5

Whose are the fathers, and of whom as concerning the fleshChrist came, who is over all, God blessed for ever. Amen.

Colossians 2:9

For in him dwelleth all the fulness of the Godhead bodily.

1 Tim 3:16And without controversy great is the mystery of godliness:God was manifest in the flesh, justified in the Spirit, seen of

angels, preached unto the Gentiles, believed on in the world,received up into glory.

Titus 2:13

Looking for that blessed hope, and the glorious appearing ofthe great God and our Saviour Jesus Christ;

MY RESPONSE TO THIS LETTER

(IN IT'S ENTIRETY)

Good morning (name withheld) and thank you for yourletter.

To answer your first question, it's not that I do not believeJesus is God. (I am sure after reading some of my articlesthis statement must puzzle and amaze you). I do not say thatI don't believe Jesus is God because I believe it is a "non-issue." Could Jesus be God? Of course he could for with Godall things are possible! I believe (and can adequately provethat the SCRIPTURES do not say that Jesus is God)! I canalso easily prove that Jesus did not claim to be God.


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I can show that the Apostles called Jesus "a man" (numeroustimes). The scriptures concerning the Messiah, Yeshuaspeak of him as a man (and call him a man). When Christspoke of himself he spoke of himself as "the SON of God"

(not God) and he spoke of God the Father as someone else.When Jesus spoke of his own words and his own ministry hestated that they were NOT his own, but were the Father's. IfJesus IS the Father, he could not say this without lying, for ifhis words and works are his Father's in Heaven and He ISthe Father come down FROM Heaven in the form of a man,he would be a liar, bearing false witness that his own wordsand works he performed while on the Earth were "not his

own" when in reality THEY WERE his own!

I say it's a "non-issue" because if Christ is actually God comedown to earth wearing a HUMAN costume, or if he's asecond member of a triune GOD, the scriptures did not thinkit was important enough to tell us that plainly and insteadthe Apostles spoke of his MANHOOD! They said that he was"not unfamiliar with our trials" for he was "tempted in allways as we are." The Apostles clearly thought that the

important aspect of Christ was his HUMANITY (not hissupposed Godhood). Christ himself (who is supposed toACTUALLY BE GOD and THE FATHER according to you)did not think it was important to make this clear and insteadspoke of himself as SOMEONE ELSE OTHER than theFather saying "my Father" over and over again, saying thatHIS words were not his but were the Father's. If Christthought it important to think of himself as a MAN and not

God he is our EXAMPLE! Who are WE to not follow it? I'mfollowing Christ's example, therefore and the example of theApostles when I speak of Christ as a man (as someoneOTHER THAN God Himself) and by focusing, not on hisalleged GODHOOD but Christ "the man." That was theexample set, and we know this for certain if Christ is God, he


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most definitely did NOT want to be treated as God, nor didhe want us to think of him as God, he went out of his waymake sure we didn't, even making himself a "servant" andwashing the feet of the Apostles! Why do YOU not HONOR

his wishes (not to be thought of as God)why do you notfollow that example? Are you not a follower of Christ?

The scriptures say that Christ "made himself of noreputation" and "became a servant." If he was God, hecertainly did not CLAIM his rightful place as GOD on Earth,but instead became a "servant." So by your teaching Godbecame a mere man, a mortal (who actually died by the way

hard to do for an ETERNAL GOD) according to you "GOD"became a "SERVANT," (a man). Why do you fault me forspeaking of him as a man and as a servant?

The question therefore is not "why do you believe Jesus isn'tGod," the question becomes why do trinitarians NOT believethat Jesus was a man? Do you DENY that Jesus was a manand a servant? Do you deny the testimony of the Apostlesthemselves? If you don't deny that Jesus was a man, WHY

do you fault me for saying so?

Trinitarians notoriously say that I am "diminishing Christ."NOTHING COULD BE FURTHER FROM THE TRUTH!Jesus said that "they are gods to whom the word of Godcame." (John 10:35) So, is Jesus Divine? Most definitely!He's the Son of the DIVINE GOD, made in God's very image,how could he NOT be Divine? He's a Divine MAN but that

does not make him the God of Heaven, the Creator, Elohim!There is NO PROOF of trinity whatsoever! Trinity ispolytheistic in nature (though they deny this and say they aremonotheists). They say there is ONE GOD but that one Godis made up of THREE separate, equal, distinct persons!(Like the old doublemint gum commercials, Three, Three,


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Three Gods in one). They use semantics to hide the fact thatthey believe in THREE SEPARATE GODS (whom they SAYare the SAME GOD) but when you read the scriptures Christmakes it clear that even though he and the Father are "one"

they are NOT the same person, their words, their works areNOT the same, and their WILL is not the same. I amjumping ahead here.

I am neither a mormon nor a Jehovah's witness. I don'tunderstand why Christians think that if you reject trinity youmust be either a Mormon or a Jehovah's Witness. Arius (andhundreds of others) taught that God is not a trinity and that

Christ was a human being LONG BEFORE The word"trinity" was even invented. Many of the early ChurchFather's believed and taught that Christ was a "man" andwould NEVER EVEN HAVE CONSIDERED that he was"God come down to Earth in fleshly form" (including ALL ofthe Apostles I might add who referred to him as "a man" and"that man Jesus" more than once). The fact that you think Ihave to be a Mormon or a Jehovah's Witness shows that youare not knowledgeable in Church History (whch is okay) but

it makes you unaware that trinity was NOT taught until theSECOND CENTURY and was a NEW TEACHING at the timeit was introduced.

I was once a staunch trinitarian and I was a GREAT defenderof this teaching. As I grew older, though, I began to noticemore and more scriptures that clearly make absolutely NOsense (and shouldn't exist at all) if Jesus is God. Those

scriptures began to become increasingly harder to ignore andto write off as part of the "mystery not to be understood."Some of the scriptures were pivotal teachings. For example,Christ said "the works that I do shall ye also do and evengreater works because I go to the Father." (John 14:12) If heIS the "Father" why does he have to "go to the Father" at all?


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Furthermore, if Christ is the creator of the universe HOW INTHE WORLD can we EVER DO his works, much lessGREATER works?

These are simple questions that cannot be ignored.

You asked about Isaiah's proclamation. We shall look at thatnow:

Isaiah 9: 6-7

6 For unto us a child is born, unto us ason is given: and the government shall beupon his shoulder: and his name shall becalled Wonderful, Counsellor, The mightyGod, The everlasting Father, The Princeof Peace.

7 Of the increase of his government andpeace there shall be no end, upon the

throne of David, and upon his kingdom,to order it, and to establish it withjudgment and with justice fromhenceforth even for ever. The zeal of theLord of hosts will perform this.

Isaiah lists five specific names that he predicts would beattributed to the Son of God. Two of them include "The

mighty God," and "The everlasting Father." The first thingwe notice is that Isaiah says "his name shall be called..."Notice it doesn't say that GOD shall call him the five nameslisted here! It doesn't say "God shall call his name..." neitherdoes it say "and he shall be called by God..." or "he shall becalled of God..." it simply says "he shall be called the


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following names."

That the world has CALLS the Son of God "The Mighty God"and "The Everlasting Father" cannot be disputed. 1800

years of TRINITY religion has proved Isaiah to be a TRUEPROPHET. Indeed, the predictions that they would CALLChrist God have come true! End of response on that issue.What does it prove that Isaiah predicted they would callChrist "God" and say that he IS the FATHER? Does hisprediction that they would CALL him that prove that they arecorrect in doing so? Not at all!

There are several other things that should be said. First,many believe that the phrase "The mighty God" SHOULD BE"The mighty OF God" and the phrase "The everlastingFather" should be "The everlasting OF the Father." Why?Notice the words "mighty" and "everlasting" are notcapitalized! They are LOWER CASE! That's all I need topoint out really!

Finally, the word Father in Isaiah 9: 6 is actually the word

"RABBI" and indeed, Christ is the Jewish "everlastingRabbi." It doesn't mean he's the Father in Heaven comedown to earth in fleshly form.

That Christ is "Lord" is never in dispute! He is indeed "Kingof Kings" and he is "Lord of Lords" and he also is HEIR tothe THRONE OF GOD! (I will show you those scriptures in amoment). Everything the Father has belongs to Christ

(including God's Throne). (John 16:15) Does thisnecessarily mean that Christ is "God Incarnate?" Does itmean that God came down to Earth and dwelled in a humanbody and called himself HIS OWN SON? No, it does not!

You have sent me many scriptures that proport to claim


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Christ is God. I can tell you now, they DO NOT and the onlyreason they seem to is because you already BELIEVE Christis God. It's like an optical illusion. Take for example yourfirst offering.

Hebrews 1: 8

"But unto the Son (he saith), Thy Throne,O God, is for ever and ever, is a scepre ofrighteousness, the sceptre of thykingdom."

First of all, you should know that the particular translationyou used is a MISTRANSLATION with a phrase ADDED bythe translators. How do I know? Because I own a standardKing James (with the letter of King James to the translators).The translators told King James that all of the words theyADDED, that did not exist in the original text are inITALICS! We find this confession also in the introduction.They added words (but they were honest enough to put them

in italics so that we would know).

In Hebrews 1:8 the phrase "he saith" is ADDED and is initalics. It was not there when Hebrews was written. Also theword "is" was added in that verse (being in italics). As youwill soon see adding to the text they changed the entiremeaning of the verse and is the ONLY reason you believeHebrews 1:8 declares Christ to be God (which was the reasonthey added the phrase). Here's what Hebrews 1:8 said

originally (before it was tampered with by the translators).

"But unto the Son , Thy Throne, O God,for ever and ever, a scepre ofrighteousness is the sceptre of thy


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kingdom."

Now, you might think this still declares Christ to be God,probably because you are not considering context (the versesbefore and after)

5 For unto which of the angels said he atany time, Thou art my Son, this day haveI begotten thee? And again, I will be tohim a Father, and he shall be to me aSon?

6 And again, when he bringeth in thefirstbegotten into the world, he saith,And let all the angels of God worship him.

7 And of the angels he saith, Who makethhis angels spirits, and his ministers aflame of fire.

8 But unto the Son he saith, Thy throne, OGod, is for ever and ever: a sceptre ofrighteousness is the sceptre of thykingdom.

9 Thou hast loved righteousness, and

hated iniquity; therefore God, even thyGod, hath anointed thee with the oil ofgladness above thy fellows.

Notice in verse 9 it says of Christ "you have lovedrighteousness and hated iniquity therefore God, EVEN


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YOUR GOD, has anointed thee with oil of gladness aboveyour fellows." It clearly says that God is Christ's God! Howcan God be Christ's God if Christ IS God. He's his own God?Also, who are the "fellows" it's talking about here and how

can God be "anointed" above his fellows? God has no"fellows" He has no EQUALS in Heaven or Earth and even ifhe did, he would NOT need to be anointed above them!Simply put, if Hebrews 1:8 is saying the Christ is God, therest of Hebrews chapter 1 makes NO sense at all. Let's lookat a few verses in Hebrews 1 that are nonsensical if thatchapter is trying to prove trinity and divinity of Christ!

Hebrews 1: 5 says "this day have I begotten thee." If Christis God, he's not truly "begotten" for he has always existedand always shall exist. Furthermore it says "I will be to him aFather and shall be to me a son." So, God has a "splitpersonality disorder?" The relationship between Jesus andGod, according to you is that they are ONE IN THE SAMESOUL, they cannot POSSIBLY have a father and sonrelationship!

In verse 6 it declares that all the angels should worshipChrist. If Christ is actually God would not the angels knowthis? Why would God have to order them to worship him?They would worship him automatically (for the righteousangels worship God). You have to THINK about what youare reading (name withheld). Some think the fact that theangels worship Christ at all is proof he is God. NO, andthat's the point of Hebrews 1 to show WHY the angels

worship Christ! It's also to show why WE worship Christ!It's not idolatry to worship Christ AS KING OF KINGS,otherwise it's idolatry when wordly subjects go before theirearthly kings and prostrate themselves. Some point out thatThomas prostrated himself before (worshipped) the risenChrist and declared "my Lord and My God," and this they


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offer as proof that Thomas believed Christ was God. Not so,for the words Thomas spoke are "My kurios and my Theos"and are properly translated "My Supreme Master (Masterteacher or guide) and My Supreme Godly (Master Guide)

Leader!"

BACK TO HEBREWS CHAPTER 1

In verse 4 it says this:

4 Being made so much better than theangels, as he hath by inheritance

obtained a more excellent name thanthey.

Verse 4 clearly states the Christ was "made" or created andwhen he was created he was created "better than the angels."If Christ is God this makes NO SENSE at all! Christ couldnot have been created if he's God, much less "made betterthan the angels" (incidentally the angels are the fellows thatHebrews 1: 9 talks about when it says Christ was anointed

above his fellows). Hebrews 1: 4 clearly says that Christ wascreated "better than the angels" (at the time he was created),then it says that he has "obtained BY INHERITANCE a moreexcellent name" than the angels! If Christ IS God, heALWAYS HAD a more excellent name than the Angels anddoes NOT NEED to INHERIT a better name than the angels,and if he's God from whom did he inherit this name? (To saythat Christ is God Incarnate therefore insinuates that the

writer of Hebrews was a gnostic and believed there wereGREATER GODS than our God from whom God couldinherit a name)!

Noticeverse 3 of Hebrews 1 says that Christ "sat down atthe right hand of the Majesty on high" (we are told this over


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and over again by the Apostles). If Christ is God, he IS THEMAJESTY on HIGH! That is common sense. He does not sit"at the right hand" of the Majesty, he "takes his place on theMajesty." Yet Christ does NOT sit on the Throne, this is ALL

the proof we need that he is not the God of Heaven, for theGod of Heaven occupies his throne! In Revelation we findChrist "amidst the 24 elders" and he approaches the throneof God and takes from "he that sits on the throne" the littlebook! Christ is not "he that sits on the throne" (God) or elsethe Apostle John was mistaken so just throw out the book ofRevelation completely.

In verse 2 it says that God has "appointed" Christ "heir ofall things." If Christ is God he is not the heir of all things heis the CREATOR of all things and all things belong to himfrom the very moment they were created! This is commonsense.

Verse 13 says:

13 But to which of the angels said he at

any time, Sit on my right hand, until Imake thine enemies thy footstool?

Why would Christ "sit at the right hand of God" if he IS God?Why would God say to HIMSELF "sit at my right hand?"Why would God SAY anything to Christ at all? Is he talkingto himself? (There is that split personality God idea oftrinity). According to trinity God talks to himself, and doesthings for himself like "I will make your enemies your

footstool." If Christ is God verse 13 makes NO SENSEwhatsoever.

But let's look at verse 8 again, that is the one you had thequestion about.


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The writer of Hebrews is QUOTING A PROPHET from theOld Testament here. It's God, speaking through a prophetCONCERNING the Son of God! We know this by threethings. Verse 1 of Hebrews 1:

1 God, who at sundry times and in diversmanners spake in time past unto thefathers by the prophets,

The second thing that tells us this is a quote from the OldTestament prophet is, we can FIND this scripture IN the OldTestament.

Psalm 45:6

6 Thy throne, O God, is for ever and ever:the sceptre of thy kingdom is a rightsceptre.

What trinitarians REFUSE to understand (because it wouldmean abandoning your religious preconceptions) is thatChrist is the HEIR to the THRONE OF GOD! It clearly saysthat in verse Hebrews 1: 2! The throne of God BELONGS toChrist (he being the heir). Go ask any WORDLY PRINCE ifhe considers his Father's throne HIS throne. If he is theHEIR to the THRONE he will say, "yes!" Hebrews 1:8 quotesDavid in psalms (it is not quoting God, who is saying to hisSon "Thy Throne O God"). It is a quote from David, who issaying to the GOD OF HEAVEN "Thy throne O God."

What about the statement "unto the Son (he saith)." (Ofcourse "he saith" was added by the translators) yet the partthat was being said "to the son" through the prophet David(in psalms) is found in verses 9 through 12. You make thecommon error that ALL trinitarians do when reading


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scripture. You forget that it was NOT BROKEN INTOVERSES when it was WRITTEN! The verses were ADDEDby the TRANSLATORS who were all trinitarians and madeDARNED SURE that when they broke up the texts into

verses it would be in the BEST WAY possible to support theirteachings.

Let's look at how the text REALLY reads.

But unto the Son, Thy throne, O God, forever and ever: a sceptre of righteousnessis the sceptre of thy kingdom. Thou hast

loved righteousness, and hated iniquity;therefore God, even thy God, hathanointed thee with the oil of gladnessabove thy fellows. And, Thou, Lord, inthe beginning hast laid the foundation ofthe earth; and the heavens are the worksof thine hands: They shall perish; but

thou remainest; and they all shall wax oldas doth a garment; And as a vesture shaltthou fold them up, and they shall bechanged: but thou art the same, and thyyears shall not fail.

The writer of Hebrews wants to show what God said to (andabout) his Son (and compare that with what God says to andabout the angels) so that he (the writer of Hebrews) canprove that Christ is GREATER THAN THE ANGELS. Theentire chapter and it's premise then makes NO SENSE if thewriter of Hebrews and everyone to whom he was writingALREADY BELIEVED that Christ is God, for, God is greaterthan the angels and it's a WASTE OF TIME to show evidencethat he is! The writer of Hebrews says "and of the angels he


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said, who maketh his angels spirits, and his ministers aflame of fire," THEN the writer contrasts this with what issaid in reference to the Son of God (in the scriptures). Hebegins to QUOTE Psalms 45: 6 which just HAPPENS to

begin "Thy Throne O God lasts forever" but in this Psalm allthe things that God has to say to his son are all found inverses 9 through 12.

The translators broke the message into verses in such a wayas to make it LOOK like God was saying to his Son(HIMSELF) Thy Throne O God! And even if God WASsaying to the Son "thy throne" Christ is the "heir" of all that

the Father has (including the throne) so technically God'sthrone IS Christ's throne! Yet, I don't believe God was sayingto his son "thy Throne O God," David was saying "thy throneO God" and verse 8 is just a direct quote from psalms. Yet,the translators, eager to invent scriptures that prove trinity,ADDED the words "he saith" just so they could ENSURE thatis how the reader takes it!

The next scriptures you offer up as "proof" that Christ is God

are a series of verses in the Gospel of John. We'll look atthem one by one.

John 1:1-14

1 In the beginning was the Word, andthe Word was with God, and the Word

was God.2 The same was in the beginning withGod.3 All things were made by him; andwithout him was not any thing made thatwas made.


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The subject of the 1st chapter of John is GOD, that is "thecontext" of the writing. Your first mistake is that youASSUME "the Word" here in this verse is a third PERSON in

a trinity. (That's called building a teaching on a falsepremise). FIRST trinitarians have to PROVE that the"Word" here in this verse is the third person of a trinity. Infact these verses don't say the Word is a person at all. Youhave to ALREADY believe in trinity for these verses to saythat. That God's word was with God in the beginning is selfevident. Also, God "said" let there be light and there was.God "said" let the waters come forth" and they did. So, yes,

the entire world was CREATED with the WORD of God, forwhatever God said, that is what happened! That God and hisown words are one in the same is also self evident. My fatherused to say "a man's word is his bond."

John 1:10

10 He was in the world, and the world

was made by him, and the world knewhim not.

Here, again, you are using preconceived notions to make theverse say something it does not say. You are using thepreconceived idea that Christ was "God come to Earth" andmake the verse a "proof" of that. Yet, who is the "He" beingspoken of here in this verse? This is called "leaving the verse

in context." The "he" the verse is talking about is GOD! Thatwas the only "he" (person) mentioned in the entire chapterso far (unless of course you believe the unproved premise oftrinity).

John 1: 1 starts out talking about God and mentions that


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God's WORD (not proved to be a person yet) is God. God ishis word and the word of God IS God.

Verse 2 is still talking about God!

Verse 3, still talking about God and yes all things were madeby him.

Verse 4 says that in GOD was LIGHT and that is the Light ofmen. God created the LIGHT at the beginning of the book ofGenesis, so yes "in God" was Light for he is the creator of it.Jesus said "I am the Light of the World." Thus, the light here

mentioned COULD be speaking of Christ and it says that inGod was the light. Yes, Christ was IN GOD from the verybeginning (for Christ is the SON of God). Yet, notice if Christis the Light, the LIGHT is CREATED according to Genesis.Christ, therefore, being the light, was CREATED.

In verse 5 it says that the light shined in darkness and thedarkness comprehended it not (this is exactly what it says ofthe LIGHT in Genesis). Trinitarians try to say that the

LIGHT is a person also, (and wouldn't that make God aQUADRINITY then? If God is one person in the Godhead,and the Word is another person in the Godhead, and theLight is another person in the Godhead, and the Son isanother person, you have FOUR persons not three). Thelight is not a person here, not without establishing aQuadrinity. That "the light shining in a dark place" is areference to Christ (the person of light) coming to the earth

and preaching. That is NOT NECESSARILY the contexthowever. Verse 5 merely speaks of how God shined his lightupon men and men could not comprehend it. (The context isstill God yet one COULD assume that the "light" is Jesushere spoken of).


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Verse 6 speaks of the man, the prophet John, so the writerhas created a "subtext" now, this is the first time any other"person" is talked about in John 1 other than God. Until thisverse the writer was talking about God only now he's going to

talk about someone else who was "sent" from God, John theProphet.

Verse 7 Says that John came to bear witness of that Light.This could EITHER be a statement that John came to bearwitness of God's LIGHT which had been shining butremained uncomprehended from the very beginning of man,OR it could be talking about God's LIGHT in reference to the

SON OF GOD! John indeed came to bear witness of theMessiah, so the LIGHT being spoken of here could be theSon of God. Yes, Jesus is the Light of the world but SO AREWE!

Matthew 5: 14

14 Ye are the light of the world. A city

that is set on an hill cannot be hid.

If WE are the light of the world(and Christ is not a liar) thenJohn the Baptist came to bear witness, not just of Christ butof them that would FOLLOW him! We being the light of theworld that shines into the darkness but is not comprehendedDOES NOT MAKE US GOD INCARNATE and does notPROVE TRINITY. The same can be said of Christ. Justbecause he's the LIGHT of the WORLD does not make himGod Incarnate anymore than us being the light of the worldmakes US God Incarnate! If you say that Jesus is Godbecause the Bible calls him the "Light of the world" then youare saying WE are God as well.


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John 1:14

14 And the Word was made flesh, and

dwelt among us, (and we beheld hisglory, the glory as of the only begotten ofthe Father,) full of grace and truth.Col1:15-17

This does not say that the Word is a person and that personis God and God came down to earth and was made "flesh."We ALSO are the "Word made flesh" and are "sent" from

God in the SAME WAY that Christ was sent! (2Corinthians 3:2 calls us "living epistles" or "livingword"). Christ was the walking, talking, living, fleshlyexample of the WORD of God. Every word that came out ofhis mouth came from God (according to him). So, yes, theWORD of God was made flesh and dwelled among us, for hewho saw Christ saw the Word! This does not make him God(because the word was God). If it does, then we are CHRIST.Behold the parable of the sheep and the goats!

Matthew 25:31-46

31 When the Son of man shall come in hisglory, and all the holy angels with him,then shall he sit upon the throne of hisglory:

32 And before him shall be gathered allnations: and he shall separate them onefrom another, as a shepherd divideth hissheep from the goats:


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33 And he shall set the sheep on his righthand, but the goats on the left.

34 Then shall the King say unto them onhis right hand, Come, ye blessed of myFather, inherit the kingdom prepared foryou from the foundation of the world:

35 For I was an hungred, and ye gave memeat: I was thirsty, and ye gave medrink: I was a stranger, and ye took mein:

36 Naked, and ye clothed me: I was sick,and ye visited me: I was in prison, and yecame unto me.

37 Then shall the righteous answer him,saying, Lord, when saw we thee anhungred, and fed thee? or thirsty, andgave thee drink?

38 When saw we thee a stranger, andtook thee in? or naked, and clothed thee?

39 Or when saw we thee sick, or inprison, and came unto thee?

40 And the King shall answer and say


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unto them, Verily I say unto you,Inasmuch as ye have done it unto one ofthe least of these my brethren, ye have

done it unto me.

41 Then shall he say also unto them onthe left hand, Depart from me, ye cursed,into everlasting fire, prepared for thedevil and his angels:

42 For I was an hungred, and ye gave meno meat: I was thirsty, and ye gave me nodrink:

43 I was a stranger, and ye took me notin: naked, and ye clothed me not: sick,and in prison, and ye visited me not.

44 Then shall they also answer him,saying, Lord, when saw we thee anhungred, or athirst, or a stranger, ornaked, or sick, or in prison, and did notminister unto thee?

45 Then shall he answer them, saying,

Verily I say unto you, Inasmuch as ye didit not to one of the least of these, ye didit not to me.

46 And these shall go away into


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everlasting punishment: but therighteous into life eternal.

He who sees US has seen Jesus according to the ABOVETEXT! Does that mean we are "Jesus" come down to earthin fleshly form? Ridiculous. Yet, trinitarians say that whenJesus said "he who has seen me has seen the Father" it was aclaim that he actually WAS the Father! If it were, then,indeed, he who has seen me has seen Jesus (according to theparable of the sheep and the goats), thus, I am JesusIncarnate! Do you see how poor is the logic of thetrinitarian?

He who has seen Jesus has seen "the Word of God" andindeed has seen "God" so, yes, the Word was "made flesh" tous, something we could see, feel, touch and see, but thatDOES NOT MEAN that Jesus is God himself come down toearth in fleshly form.

Colossians 1: 15-17

15 Who is the image of the invisible God,the firstborn of every creature:16 For by him were all things created,that are in heaven, and that are in earth,visible and invisible, whether they bethrones, or dominions, or principalities,or powers: all things were created byhim, and for him:

The context of this verse starts out talking about the invisibleGod. Christ is indeed "the image" of the invisible God. Weshall also be made into God's image (and into the image of


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Christ) by the Holy Spirit. (There are at least 30 scripturesthat say this). If we also are destined to be the image of Godand you say being the image of God makes you God himselfand part of a trinity of God, well, then we shall be God

Himself someday by your logic. Being "in the image of God"does not make Christ God himself anymore than US beingremade into the image of God makes US God Incarnate!(For that matter Adam was created "in the image of God"does this make Adam God Incarnate? When it says "by himwere all things created" it's talking about the "invisible God"for that is the CONTEXT. Christ is the image of the invisibleGod (who created the whole world) that is all this verse is

saying.

17 And he is before all things, and by himall things consist.

Again, the context is STILL the invisible God. He is beforeall things and by him all things consist. It does not say ineither of these verses that Jesus IS God. It says that Jesus is

the "image of" God (the God who created all things, is beforeall things, and by whom all things consist).

MORE ABOUT JOHN 1

I always am astonished how trinitarians love to quote thefirst chapter of the Gospel of John to try and prove that Jesusis God, but they ALWAYS ignore one crucial verse and leaveit off. I will show it to you.

John 1:18

18 No man hath seen God at any time,the only begotten Son, which is in the


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bosom of the Father, he hath declaredhim.

When John wrote this verse he had already followed Christall around Jerusalem. Christ had been crucified, risen, andhad ascended to Heaven. If Christ IS God, and John believedthat he had actually SEEN GOD (because he saw Christ) whywould John say "no man has seen God at ANY time" thenwhy would he say that Christ has "declared" the Father to us,if John believed that Christ IS the Father and IS God hewould not say these things!

Some other scriptures you offered up as proof Jesus is God:

John 10:30-33

30 I and my Father are one.31 Then the Jews took up stones again tostone him.32 Jesus answered them, Many goodworks have I shewed you from my Father;for which of those works do ye stone me?33 The Jews answered him, saying, For agood work we stone thee not; but forblasphemy; and because that thou, beinga man, makest thyself God.

We are ALSO ONE WITH THE FATHER. Christ made thisclear. Being "one with the Father" does not make ChristIncarnate anymore than OUR being one with the Fathermakes US God Incarnate! Here is just ONE section ofscripture that says we shall be "one with the Father"


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John 17: 21-23

21 That they all may be one; as thou,

Father, art in me, and I in thee, that theyalso may be one in us: that the world maybelieve that thou hast sent me.

22 And the glory which thou gavest me Ihave given them; that they may be one,even as we are one:

23 I in them, and thou in me, that theymay be made perfect in one; and that theworld may know that thou hast sent me,and hast loved them, as thou hast lovedme.

I noticed you included verse 33 of John Chapter 10. I

assume you are trying to show the Jew's reaction and theirstatement "thou being a man makest thyself God" somehowproves trinity? The Jews indeed though that when Christsaid "I and the Father are one" he was making a claim that heIS God. The Jews didn't have the spirit, were hypocrites andmurderers, snakes and vipers and Christ said that "themysteries of the Kingdom" were BEYOND the Jews. (Luke8:10) It's not a GLOWING ENDORSEMENT for yourreligion that the JEWS of Christ day (who tried to stone

Christ) AGREE with their trinity teaching! The Jews thoughtJesus was claiming to be God so the trinitarians areCORRECT in assuming that Jesus did claim to be God? Areyou serious? Because the Jews make the same mistake asthe trinitarians when interpreting Christ's words does NOTmean the trinitarians are right, it means they are WRONG!


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If the Pharisees who KILLED CHRIST agree with yourreligious teaching, you BETTER re-evaluate it. That isCOMMON SENSE!

You offered up John 12:45 "And he that seeth me seeth himthat sent me." and John 14:7-9 "he that hath seen me hathseen the Father; and how sayest thou then, Shew us theFather?" I have already thoroughly answered these. We areONE with the Father and according to Christ he that sees ussees "Jesus" (sheep and the goats parable). He that sees ussees Christ but this does not make us Christ, any more thanit makes Christ God because he that sees Christ sees God!

Your logic is flawed!

Romans 9:5

Whose are the fathers, and of whom asconcerning the flesh Christ came, who isover all, God blessed for ever. Amen.

I think you are misunderstanding this verse completely.Romans 9:5 doesn't even come close to supporting trinity orJesus as God. It just says that the Messiah (Christ) is theJewish Messiah. Christ came for the Jew first, then theGentiles were added through the unbelief of the Jew. Thissays nothing to support Jesus is God. Sorry.

Colossians 2:9

For in him dwelleth all the fulness of theGodhead bodily.

The fulness of God dwells in US bodily as well! Did you not


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know that? God dwells in us (according to EVERYAPOSTLE) by his Holy Spirit. Christ is the HEAD of theBody, and WE are the Body. If God dwells in Christ fullythen God dwells in us (for the head is a part of the body).

The fulness of the Godhead dwells in US bodily throughChrist! Having the fulness of the Godhead dwelling in youdoes NOT make you God. Otherwise, we are God too!Common sense my friend.

1 Tim 3:16

And without controversy great is the

mystery of godliness: God wasmanifest in the flesh, justified in theSpirit, seen of angels, preached untothe Gentiles, believed on in the world,received up into glory.

Again, God is manifest in OUR FLESH as well as in Christ's.You never realized that? John said "greater is he that is inyou than he that is in the world." God DWELLS IN US, andis manifest in our flesh by our RIGHTEOUSNESS we dothrough the Holy Spirit. Our story is the same story asChrist's (if we follow him that is). God is manifest in ourflesh (by our words and our deeds) we are "justified by theSpirit", we shall be seen of angels (in fact we shall judgeangels according to the Apostle), and we shall be received up

into glory to be with Christ "where he is." None of thismakes us GOD and it didn't make Christ God either! Whenwe are tranformed into the very image of Christ (I couldshow you numerous scriptures that promise that) we will be"in the image of the Father" (for Christ is in the image of theFather). When that happens he who sees us will see the


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Father also. It doesn't make us God come to earth in fleshlyform. (Well, it does but only analogically).

Look, either you believe God dwells in you through Christ in

you don't! If you do, then having God dwelling in you fullyand bodily does NOT MAKE YOU GOD! Why do trinitariansnot get this?

Notice 1 Timothy 3: 16 says "great is the mystery ofgodliness." What is the mystery of Godliness?

Colossians 1: 25-27

25 Whereof I am made a minister,according to the dispensation of Godwhich is given to me for you, to fulfil theword of God;

26 Even the mystery which hath been hid

from ages and from generations, but nowis made manifest to his saints:

27 To whom God would make known whatis the riches of the glory of this mysteryamong the Gentiles; which is Christ inyou, the hope of glory:

28 Whom we preach, warning every man,and teaching every man in all wisdom;that we may present every man perfect inChrist Jesus:


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29 Whereunto I also labour, strivingaccording to his working, which workethin me mightily.

The mystery of godliness is Christ IN US! Because Christ isin us, God is in us and God is manifested through us(through our flesh) as we conform to the image of Christ.When we are in the image of Christ we are in the image ofGod! None of these things make us God HIMSELF andneither did they make Christ God Himself either!

Titus 2:13Looking for that blessed hope, and theglorious appearing of the great God andour Saviour Jesus Christ;

The blessed hope is that we shall be LIKE CHRIST, and Godshall manifest himself THROUGH US! When Christ

appears, so shall God appear. We are waiting for theappearing of the great God AND our Savior Jesus Christ andwhen he appears we the saints will APPEAR WITH HIM inthe clouds of Glory. None of this makes US God and it didn'tmake Christ God either! Christ in you THE HOPE of glory.That is the blessed hope.

Philippians 3:12

12 Not as though I had already attained,either were already perfect: but I followafter, if that I may apprehend that forwhich also I am apprehended of ChristJesus.


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Galatians 5: 5

5 For we through the Spirit wait for thehope of righteousness by faith.

1 John 1: 2-3

2 Beloved, now are we the sons of God,and it doth not yet appear what we shallbe: but we know that, when he shall

appear, we shall be like him; for we shallsee him as he is.

3 And every man that hath this hope inhim purifieth himself, even as he is pure.

I have an assignment for you. Get a Strong's ExhaustiveConcordance and look up everywhere the word "hope"

appears in the New Testament. It might just change your lifebecause clearly you have not realized what is the "hope" forwhich we earnestly and expectantly wait! We await theONENESS of Christ, whereby we are one with Christ, onewith God, and one with each other. (We don't just wait for itactually, we WORK toward it). This will manifest itself inCHRISTLIKE PERFECTION. At that time our words andour works will not be our own but will be our Father's in

Heaven. We will be transformed into the "image of God."All of the things that trinitarians try to say are EXCLUSIVETO CHRIST are NOW BEING OFFERED TO US! Christ said"all that my Father has is mine" he then said "I shall take andgive it to you."


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If Christ is God because he was "one with the Father" thatmeans God offering to turn us into HIMSELF because Godoffers us the SAME THINGS CHRIST HAD if we would butbelieve!

I hope this clears things up for you dear, dear brother.

May the Holy Spirit BLESS your search for KNOWLEDGEand TRUTH!

Amen.

Watchman Dean(Jeffrey D. Dean, Sr.)

so you dont believe jesus is god

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