the following transcript of maurice dennie’s interview on · · 2017-01-27the following...
TRANSCRIPT
The following transcript of
Maurice Dennie’s interview
on
Memories and Music (broadcast March 29, 1981)
was created by the Sudbury Public Library as part of a
Summer Canada Project
in 1982.
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••• 1
SUDBURY PUBLIC LIBRARY "MEMORIES & MUSIC II
INCO LTD. CIGM
ORAL HISTORY PROGRAM
INTERVIEWEE: Maurice Dennie POSITION:
TRANSCRIBER: TAPE NUMBER:
Bonnie Savage 121
DATE: 1981 DATE OF TRAN: June 1982 SUMMER CANADA PROJECT INTERVIEWER: Gary Peck
THEME:
G.P.
G.P.
M.D.
G.P.
:H.D.
Frank Dennie; villages of Hanmer and Capreol
Welcome to Memories and Music. Our guest today is Maurice Dennie. Maurice Dennie is a son of Frank Dennie, a well-known personality in the Sudbury, and in particular the Hanmer area and in just a few moments we'll be talking with Maurice, a retired pensioner from International Nickel. vle'll be talking to Maurice about his dad and the early years in Sudbury and Hanmer. However, first we'll turn our program back to the music host for the day.
(MUSIC)
Welcome to the program Mr. Dennie.
Yes, Gary.
Can we start off by sharing with us some biographical information. For example you were born on March twentyone, 1913, I think you mentioned?
I was born on March the twenty-first, 1913, here in the old Hanmer Hotel.
G.P. In the Hanmer Hotel? Hanmer Hotel would be located where today?
M.D. Where the Caisse Populaire is now situated.
G.P. Along Notre Dame?
M.D. Right next to, the next house to mine here.
G.P. Adjacent to you on Notre Dame?
M.D. Yeah.
G.P. Alright, could you tell us about your career? You worked for International Nickel I understand?
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DENNIE ••• 2
M.D.
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I started off as a teacher. army and after five years in went to work for Burwash for Inco in 1951.
From teaching I joined the the army, I came back and six years. Then I went to
Worked at Burwash Correctional Camp?
Burwash Industrial Farm in those days.
Industrial Farm?
Yeah, and in 1951 I ·went to work for Inco and worked until 1973 when I retired.
Were you an elementary or secondary school teacher?
I was an elementary right here.
In Hanmer?
Yes old l'ecole St. Jacques here in Hanmer.
mmhh.
It's now an old senior citizeBs' gathering ••••
mmhh •
•••• place.
mmhh.
Yeah.
Alright, you started with Inco in the, was it the '50s?
I started with Inco in the time office at Creighton Mine, until 1967 and then I transferred ·to Frood because I was living in Hanmer, in Sudbury then •••••
G.P. mmhh.
M.D. • ••• and it was a lot better for me to travel to Frood than travelling to Creighton Mine.
G.P.
M.D.
G.P.
M.D.
What would be the nature of your work with Inco? Working in the time office?
There was timeKeeping, balancing distribution, hiring ••••
mmhh.
•••• letting people go, not directly but do the paper work.
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DENNIE ••• 3
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mmhh.
I used to do a lot of typing also. I was a typist. Time office work is not hard work but it's time consuming ••••
mmhh •
•••• and in the end it was getting the better of me.
mmhh.
In the end I was beginning ••••
Long for your retirement.
Yes, yes. My doctor had been telling me to change jobs for three years.
To slow down?
So I was glad to see sixty come.
mmhh. I imagi ne , during that period of time, quite a few changes with International Nickel as well? Quite a few changes with the company?
Not really, not in the mining, but the computers came in ••••
mmhh.
Yes, we had gone from manual payrolls to computer payrolls.
mmhh.
But as far as mining, well you can't computerize mining. The men have to do the work ••••
mmhh •
•••• and I often hear now, you know, people criticizing the mines, the safety record, and all that. In twenty-two years that I worked at Creighton Mine, nobody ever got killed ••••
G.P. mmhh.
M.D. • ••• unless it was his own fault.
G.P. mmhh.
M.D. Either they don't scale or they're 'working over a ledge and don 't tie their safety belt on ••••
G.P. mmhh.
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DENNIE ••• 4
M.D. • ••• and most, all the accidents that I can recall, the fatal accidents ••••
G.P. mmhh.
M.D. • ••• was caused by the men themselves.
G.P. Through negligence.
M.D. I remember going into a heading one time, and with the underground super, and the first thing he did was ask if they had scaled.
G.P.
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mmhh.
Oh yes, they had scaled.
What do you mean by that term by the way?
A bar, a great big steel bar and they hit the ceiling ••••
To see if there's anything loose.
• ••• the work place ••••
Yes •
• • • • so the underground super asked if they had scaled •. They had scaled. It was a contract plant.
mmhh.
Well they had not scaled because he grabbed the bar and he scaled and about five "hundred pounds of rock come down in one crack so you know. They can say whatever they like about Inco being negligent. They are not negligent. The men themselves are negligent. Now anyway that was not my kind of work ••••
G.P. No, but this was your observation anyhow?
M.D. Yes. Well I'd like to make this observation about whoever, in a fatal accident being invariably ••••
G.P. mmhh.
M.D. • ••• the men's fault, and the miner's fault.
G.P. Alright, the purpose of the program today, is to focus on your dad Frank Dennie ••••
11 .D. mmhh.
G.P. • ••• a name that many people in the area recognize. People
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DENNIE ••• 5
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in the Hanmer area and also in the Sudbury area. Frank Dennie came to Sudbury prior to 1900 I believe.
Oh yes.
Give us some background information ••••
Well ••••
• ••• about the family itself and his early arrival.
• ••• dad was born in the town of Perth in Lanark County ••••
Yes.
• ••• in South-eastern Ontario and in 1972, '71 or '72 ••••
1800's?
• ••• in those days, yes it was difficult to get records you know. The churches burnt and records burnt.
Early 1870's?
Yes, well, yeah in the third quarter ••••
Yes •
•••• of 1870.
Right.
He came to the first, when he first came up to Northern Ontario, he stopped at Cache Bay and J. R. Gordon of Gordon Lumber Company ••••
G.P. Yes.
M.D. • ••• were then building a burner you know, a very high thing ••••
G.P. mmhh.
M.D. • ••• and that was the first job he ever worked on. I have no idea how long he was around there. I don't think it was very long before he came to Sudbury.
G.P. How old was he when he went to Cache Bay?
N.D. Well when he went to Cache Bay he was fifteen years old, but in those days fourteen and fifteen -year olds used to work in the bush. They were lumbermen.
G.P. Yes.
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DENNIE ••• 6
M.D. Yeah.
G.P. His parents, did they come over from Scotland?
M.D. Not my grandfather. MY great grandfather came from the Clydebank in Scotland and he was a cooper and carriage maker ••••
G.P. Yes.
M.D. • ••• when he came here in Perth ••••
G.P. mmhh.
M.D. • ••• and I have the old tools.
G.P. Right. Did Frank Dennie have any skills along that line?
M.D. Not along that line, no ••••
G.P. No.
M.D. • ••• he was, outside of t he hotel business, he was a mining man. He was a mining man for years and years.
G.P. Maybe we can get to that a little later on.
rll .D. Yes.
G.P. Alright, we have him moving from Cache Bay into Sudbury in the 1890s I assume?
M.D. Yes, that would be in the 1890s there. That would be in the early ••••
G.P. Yes.
M.D. • •• 1890s. He came to the Montreal House, and at that time a Mrs. Ross owned the ftlontreal House.
G.p. Do you recall her first name?
M.D. No.
G.P. No.
M.D. No, no, I, you know ••••
G.P. I've always seen her referred to as rvIrs. Ross.
M.D. rvIrs. Ross ••••
G.P. Yes.
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DENNIE ••• 7
M.D. • ••• yeah, you know, there are no more old-timers like that around ••••
G.P. mmhh.
M.D. • ••• but there may still be some, there are some of the seventy, eighty year olds who remember.
G.P. Right. For those who do not recall the Montreal House, that was located along Elm, approximately where the City Centre is today I believe, is that correct?
M.D.
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M.D.
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yes ••••
The shopping centre.
• ••• it was located about two hundred feet east of the Mackey Building.
Two hundred feet east of the Mackey Building?
East of the Mackey Building, yes.
O.K., I think what we'll do is we'll leave the program at this point. Turn the program back to the music host and when we return, we'll talk about the early hotel business ••••
M.D. Right.
G.P. • ••• in the community.
(MUSIC)
G.P. Our guest today on Memories and Music is Maurice Dennie, the son of Frank Dennie, a well-known personality in the Sudbury and Hanmer area during the early history of this area. Mr. Dennie, we were talking about your dad and the fa.ct that he came to Sudbury in the early 18908 and actually became associated with the Montreal House.
M.D. He came to the Montreal House which at that time was owned by Mrs. Ross and she sort of took him under her wing ••••
G.P. mmhh.
M.D. • ••• he was just a young fellow, and he worked for her as a bellboy to begin with ••••
G.P. mmhh.
M.D. • ••• and as he got older he worked behind the bar and he became manager ••••
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DENNIE ••• 8
G.P. mmhh.
M.D. • ••• for her, and after the turn of the century ••••
G.P. Yes.
M.D. • ••• he bought the hotel from Mrs. Ross and he got married to Cecilia Brisebois.
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mmhh. Do you recall the year?
Yeah, they had three children when they lived in Sudbury • •••
mmhh.
• ••• and he built himself a house on Young Street ••••
mmhh.
• ••• forty-two Yeung Street.
What were the names of the children and secondly do you recall the year that they were married?
First, yeah ••••
The year in which Frank Dennie and his wife were married?
About 1901 ••••
mmhh.
• ••• 1902 perhaps because Lloyd was born in 1904, the eldest ••••
Yes •
•••• and then Rand was born in 1906 ••••
R - A - N - D?
R Randolph.
Randolph'l
Randolph wa~ born in 1906. Epiphany was born in 1908. Frank was born in 1911.
mmhh.
Those were the first. Frank was born here in Hanmer.
Born in Hanmer in 1911?
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DENNIE ••• 9
M.D. Yeah, yeah, yeah, and that's when dad's first wife died. She died from that child.
G.P. From childbirth?
M.D. Yes.
G.P. As a result of childbirth?
M.D. Yes.
G.P. Alright back to your parents just being married, did you say they built a house on Young Street ••••
r'l .D. Yeah.
G.P. • ••• or did they purchase one?
M.D. No, no, he had built a great big three-storey house there on Young Street. They lived in there ••••
G.P. Do you know the location approximately?
M.D. Forty-two Young Street.
G.P. What would be there today?
M.D. Ah, the church. They wouldn't be far from the church, the St. Mary's Church there.
G.P. mmhh, alright.
M.D. Young Street, the police station, Young Street had a curve in it.
G.P. mmhh.
M.D. They would, they probably •••• near where St. Mary's Church is.
G.P. I see.
M.D. Yeah.
G.P. That was around 1902, or '03?
M.D. They built the house around 1906 or sometime around there.
G.P. Around there?
M.D. Yeah. 'They didn't live in it very long anyway. He sold the hotel in Sudbury ••••
G.P. mmhh.
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DENNIE ••• 10
M.D. • ••• and he bought the Hanmer hotel here.
G.P. Alright staying in Sudbury for a moment, what did he ever say about the Montreal House? He must have had some interesting stories to tell.
M.D.
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Oh yes.
Well, some perhaps we want on tape, some we don't, ha ha ha ha.
In those days, you may not know, lumberjacks prov1ded the boxing or the fighting.
mmhh.
You know, if one heard of a better man he would come and fight.
mmhh. By word of mouth.
That was, you know, it was unorganized boxing and the lumberjacks would be the, you know, the boxers of the day.
Provide the entertainment?
Well, it wasn't so much to provide entertainment ••••
mmhh •
•••• as "Is there a man who can beat me" ••••
Yes.
• ••• and there were many fights there. My dad was involved in a couple of fights. One time they came to rob the hotel and he was knifed, he was knifed in quite a few places and he was in hospital ••••
G.P. mmhh.
M.D. • ••• and he always carried the knife mark ••••
G.P. Yes.
M.D. • ••• on his face and his body ••••
G.P. Right.
M.D. • ••• but one of the guys that knifed him ended up with a broken jaw in the hospital ••••
G.P. mmhh.
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DENNIE
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•••• and my dad paid for his hospital.
Paid for his hospital bill?
Yes. Yeah, he was a funny fellow that lad ••••
mmhh.
••• 11
M.D. • ••• although I don't think he was a womanizer. If a woman was in trouble, he never ••••
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mmhh •
•••• he never left her ••••
mmhh.
• ••• without helping.
mmhh.
Those were things that he told us ••••
Yes •
•••• much later in life you know.
Right. Did he enjoy his experience at the Montreal House?
Yes, yes, oh yes, it was an eventful or adventurous time.
mmhh.
Sudbury was, you know, a-growing up. He would talk about the policeman, Le grand Gagne, the great big tall six four policeman and ••••
G.P. G - A - G - N - E?
M.D. G -, yeah.
G.P. He had some stories about him?
M.D. Yeah, oh I can't remember ••••
G.P. No.
M.D. • ••• you know, the name ••••
G.P. No.
M.D. • ••• because we never wrote anything down ••••
G.P. No.
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DENNIE ••• 12
M.D. • ••• and to this day, we regret not having made notes of ••••
G.P. Sure.
M.D. • ••• you know, the stories that dad would tell us ••••
G.P. mmhh.
M.D. • ••• but he ••••
G.P. Did he live in the Montreal House to begin with before he built his house?
M.D. Oh yes, oh yeah, yeah, yeah, they were living in the Montreal House. I know now. He built his house when he got married.
G.P. mmhh, I see.
M.D. So that would be ••••
(J.P. So ••••
M.D. • ••• sometime around 1901 or 1902 or ••••
G.P. Yes.
M.D. • ••• or even 1903.
G.P. Right.
M.D. Yes, that's when he built t he house, but he had always lived in the Montreal House himself before he got married.
G.P. mmhh.
M.D. Yeah.
G.P. And in the Montreal House there were a number of rooms for ·--rent ••••
M.D. Oh yes.
G.P. • ••• and one could purchase meals there.
M.D. Yeah, it was the same when they tore down, it was the same as, well you have a picture.
G.P. Yes.
M.D. It was the same as •••• they rented rooms and until 1914 they were selling liquor by the glass eh ••••
G.P. Yes.
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DENNIE ••• 1,3
M.D.
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••• • or by the cup ••••
Yes •
•••• and a beer I guess ••••
mmhh •
•••• then the prohibition.
1916 when it went dry I think.
Was it 1916?
For about ten years I think it was.
19 •••• , that should be 191~, because I tell you why. I was born in 191,3 and Dad sold the hotel the next year and well I'll come to that later.
mmhh. ···
So I'm pretty sure.
O.K. He sold the Montreal House ••••
Yeah •
•••• in what, 191~?
No no, no ••••
No that was the hotel out here •
•••• 1908.
O.K.
Yeah.
They sold the Montreal House and came to Hanmer.
Came to Hanmer.
What prompted them to move out here? Did he see it as a business opportunity?
Yes yes, they were opening up here. Then he had heard about the transcontinental coming in, would come to Capreol. The engineers had stayed at the hotel and they were talking and he heard, so he came here and he bought the land in Capreol ••••
G.P. mmhh.
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DENNIE ••• 14
M.D. • ••• from another chap ••••
G.P. mmhh.
M.D. • ••• who owned it.
G.P. Right.
M.D. He bought it and that, you know, that brought him here because here and Cyril T. Young who was minister at large for the Transcontinental Railway ••••
G.P. mmhh.
M.D. • ••• developed Capreol to a certain extent.
G.P. When he came here, what was the extent of Hanmer? There wouldn't be many homes I shouldn't think?
M.D. No, as I say, there were eleven houses on Notre Dame, on the west side of Notre ~ame, there were eleven houses and the hotel.
G.P.
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Was there a house where you are at the moment?
Yeah, the old homestead was right back here on the next block.
On the next lot north of ••••
Just north of here on the same parcel of land actually.
Yes.
Parcel twenty-five.
mmhh.
There was a jail right next door.
Just south of your house?
Yeah there was a two-cell jail ••••
Two-cell jail?
Yes, south of my house and the policeman was a Mr. Joe Rose.
G.P. R o s E?
M.D. R 0 s hop.
S - E, yes, and the next house there was a barber
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DENNIE ••• 15
G.P. Was this the main street?
M.D. This was the main street.
G.P. The main street.
M.D. At one time the village of Hanmer consisted of the eleven houses and the hotel on this side, then one, three stores and one house on the east side.
G.P. mmhh.
M.D. Then of course a few houses on Cote Boulevard ••••
G.P. mmhh.
M.D. • ••• which was the Capreol Road, and that's all there was. The_ population when I was teaching school here, the population was about a hundred and twenty.
G.P. When were you teaching? When would that be?
M.D. 1933 to 1940.
G.P. About a hundred. What were most of the people doing? Was there farming? Is that a major (unintelligible)?
M.D. Yes, yes, all farming and lumbering, you know lumber camps, not in Hanmer because they had lumber here back in the 1800s ••••
G.P. mmhh.
M.D. • ••• but they were mostly farmers and peopl e in the village would go to camp in the winter or work on the roads or -other, you know, jus t casual labour.
G.P. mmhh.
M.D. There were no steady jobs to be had here.
G.P. mmhh.
M.D. Some, there were, we got quite a few people who were called jobbers.
G.P. mmhh.
M.D. Mr. Labelle, Mr. Lalonde, Mr. Ross, Mr. Doni.
G.P. What was one of the early general stores out here? There must have been ••••
M.D. Early general stores, there were three of them.
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DENNIE ••• 16
G.P. mmhh.
M.D. The Robert General Store, Lavallee General Store, and the other one was St. Germain but he built the store but he never, he never really ••••
G.P. Really operated it.
M.D. • ••• Qperated it.
G.P. Was there a blacksmith shop as well?
M.D. Yes there was quite a big, where the Esso station is today, that was Armand Dubois the blacksmith.
G.P. Dubois?
M.D. Dubois.
G.P. mmhh.
M.D. D - U - B - 0 - I - S, yeah.
G.P. mmhh. Was your dad ever involved in politics out here?
M.D. Oh ••••
G.P. Was he an alderman?
M.D. • ••• my dad was the patronage man ••••
G.P. mmhh.
M.D. • ••• for the district of Sudbury.
G.P. Alright, I think we'll break right now, and then we'll come back and we'll talk about that.
M.D. Yeah.
G.P. First we'll turn the program back to our music host.
(MUSIC)
G.P. Welcome back to Memories and Music. Today we've been talking with Maurice Dennie, son of Frank Dennie. Mr. Dennie could you share with us what you recall about your dad's involvement in Hanmer. I understand he began by purchasing a hotel. The Hanmer Hotel?
M.D. He purchased tfie old Hanmer Hotel which was torn down some years ago.
G.P. Who did he purchase it from?
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DENNIE ••• 17
M.D.
G.P.
M.D.
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f-1.D.
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M.D.
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M.D.
Purchased it from a Mr. Danis, D - A - N - I - S.
And that would be around 1908?
Around 1908 yes. About the same time as he bought the farm in Capreol, well where the town sit e of Capreol is.
mmhh.
Not the northern section, but the Capreol section.
What prompted him to purchase land in Capreol?
Well he had heard the engineers talking when they were surveying, when they were bringing the Transcontinental through.
Yes • .
He heard the engineers talking about where the Capreol divisional point would be ••••
mmhh.
• ••• so he, the land was already owned by someone, but I don't remember who it was ••••
No •
•••• and he bought it. Then ••••
Partly on speculation then.
With a definite idea in mind ••••
Yes alright.
• ••• and after he bought it of course, Donald Fleming?
Maan?
Donald Smith.
Oh.
Donald Smith, Lord Strathcona ••••
mmhh •
•••• was building the C. N. R. at that time, or the Transcontinental and he called them to Toronto, and at that time the old King Edward Hotel was the main hotel in Toronto.
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DENNIE ••• 18
G.P. Yes.
M.D. He called them to Toronto and he bawled them out for, you know for having bought that land, and Dad just walked out. He said if you want to talk to me decently then call me back.
G.P. mmhh.
M.D. So he called him back a couple of hours after and they made the deal where he gave all the land there that the C.N.R. owned for the sum of one dollar ••••
G.P. mmhh.
M.D. • ••• just the legal fee for transfer, on the condition that they never move theCapreol divisional point away from Capreol ••••
G.P. mmhh.
M.D. • ••• and it's still there as you can see.
G.P. Yes.
M.D. It will be there.
G.P. Yes.
M.D. He also gave the land, land for all the churches. The Catholic as well as the Protestant churches. ~he land for the schools.
G.P. He gave it to them gratis, no charge?
M.D. Gratis, oh yes, yes.
G.P. mmhh.
M.D. The fire hall, and to many ••••
G.P. Right.
M.D. • ••• citizens of ••••
G.P. Right.
M.D. • ••• Capreol. I remember old Matt Nesbitt telling me before he died last year, that he had got his lot from Dad for six bucks ••••
G.P. mmhh.
M.D. • ••• just the legal fee transfer.
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DENNIE ••• 19
G.P. Just a token?
M.D. Yeah.
G.P. Token ree.
M.D. Yeah.
G.P. So your dad plays quite a pr ominent "role in the early history of Capreol on a sound basis.
M.D. Yes, and also in the politics or the. of not only or Hanmer and Capreol, but of the whole district ••••
G.P. mmhh.
M.D. • •• • beuause at that time the, you know, the member represented rrom Mattawa to Hornepayne and way up north.
G.P. One can well imagine ••••
M.D. Yes.
G.P. • ••• the problems of campaigning ••••
M.D. Yes.
G.P. • ••• then.
M.D. So, and he was one or the top organizers of the Conservative party ••••
G.P. mmhh.
M.D. • ••• all his life ••••
G.P. mmhh.
M.D. • ••• until, as long as he was able to.
G.P. Right.
M.D. And pat ronage man. If you wanted a job ••••
G.P. mmhh.
M.D. • ••• around here you went to my dad.
G.P. mmhh.
M.D. You know ir you wanted money to dig drainage ••••
G.P. Yes.
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DENNIE • • • 20
M.D.
G.P.
M.D.
G.P.
M.D.
G.P.
M.D.
G.P.
M.D.
G.P.
M.D.
G.P.
M.D.
•••• you went to him and he'd contact Toronto.
mmhh.
Big appointments, he was responsible for appointing the old crown attorney, Ed Wilkins ••••
mmhh •
•••• while Dad was building the road in Chapleau.
mmhh.
Ed was a lawyer there, and Charlie McCrea was the minister, was the representative here as well as Minister of Mines.
Yes.
So he just wired Charlie to appoint Ed Wilkins* and half an hour l ater he was appointed.
mmhh.
Also, appointed the, or had the Sheriff Manley** appointed.
Right.
In 19 •••• he worked for the government then in the bush scaling in the winter, cruising timber (unintelligible), dam sites ••••
G.P. mmhh.
M.D. • ••• road sites, built roads.
G.P. Yes. Back to politics for a moment, sometimes those political appointments were only good for as long as the party was in power.
M.D. Yes, because, well not the crown attorney ••••
G.P. No, but certain positions.
M.D. • ••• the crown attorney remained ••••
G.P. Yes.
M.D. • ••• but Sheriff Manley was fired when Hepburn came in 1934 •• ••
*E. D. Wilkins appointed crown attorney August, 1930. **A. J. Manley
c
DENNIE •• • 21
G.P. mmhh.
M.D. • ••• so was my dad. He was the first man fired in Ontario. He was fired at ten thirty on the night of the election.
G.P. Your dad was?
M.D. Yes.
G.P. Why would he be the first (unintelligible).
M.D. (unintelligible). The Liberal Association here, had made it a condition ••••
G.P. mmhh.
M.D. • ••• you know, for working for old Lapierre that my dad be fired.
G.P. Lapierre the MPP?
M.D. Yes, Lapierre beat Charlie McCrea that year.
G.P. So your dad was fired at ten thirty that evening?
M.D. Oh yes, first man fired in Ontario.
G.P. How was he notified?
M.D. By telegram, from Hepburn. Direct from Hepburn.
G.P. Right from Hepburn.
M.D. Yeah, yeah. We should have kept that telegram.
G.P. Yes, I think that would have been ••••
M.D. We never thought of those t hings.
G.P. No. That's part of life.
H.D. Who thinks of posterity.
G.P. And when Hepburn was defeated in the '40's?
M.D. Yeah when Hepburn was defeated, ·well of course Ed Wilkins was still there, crown attorney ••••
G.P. mmhh.
M.D. • ••• and Mr. Hanley got his sheriff's job back.
G.P. And your dad was ••••
e
DENNIE ••• 22
fvI .D.
G.P.
IIIl .D.
G.P.
M.D.
G.P.
M.D.
G.P.
t1.D.
G.P.
M.D.
G.P.
l'-1 .D.
G.P.
M.D.
G.P.
M.D.
G.P.
M.D.
G.P.
M.D.
G.P.
M.D.
G.P.
M.D.
And my dad still kept, you know, fighting politics.
Your dad was involved with roads you said?
Yes.
Road going out to Garson?
He built the road from Hanmer that goes by the Radar Road ••••
Yes •
•••• that's what they called it. He built that.
He oversaw the work on it?
Yeah, well he was, yes, he was, the government was putting in the money ••••
Yeah •
•••• and he was, he was the, you know, the superintendant. Sure, yes.
He also ••••
He also built the road to Capreol ••••
mmhh •
•••• and the road from Capreol to Milnet, eight miles, the first eight miles of r oad out of Chapleau.
mmhh.
He worked, he also built a section of the Coniston road ••••
mmhh •
•••• there.
So we're talking '20s and '30s ••••
Ah ••••
• ••• that period of time?
•••• we're tall~ing prior, the decade from 1910 to 1920, and from 1920 to 1930.
During that period of time?
Yes, yes, in '26 I think or '27, '26 was when his last road job was in Chapleau.
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DENNIE ••• 23
G.P. For, at that particular period of time it was difficult to remain in this area and not be associated with mining and I understand your dad had some involvement with mining?
M.D.
-G.P.
M.D.
G.P.
M.D.
G.P.
M.D.
G.P.
M.D.
G.P.
M.D.
G.P.
M.D.
G.P.
M.D.
G.P.
M.D.
G.P.
M.D.
Yes, in 1927 he, Cyril T. Young and George Glendinning* the engineer ••••
mmhh •
•••• became owners after purchasing and staking some lot in Foy township about eighteen miles north of Chelmsford.
What township?
Foy, F - 0 - Y.
F - 0 - y, Yes.
Eighteen miles north of Chelmsford?
Yes. They operated the mine there from 1927 to 1931.
What was the name of the mine in the ••••
Sudbury Offsets,Limited, which later reopened -under the Nickel Offsets, Limited and another financing.
mmhh. Was it a producing mine when your dad was involved?
Not, no it was all development.
Yes.
Strictly development and diamond drilling -which is part of the development to locate the ore body.
mmhh.
It was an offset actually. It was, the nickel had overflowed beyond the borders of the basin ••••
mmhh.
• ••• and when they closed her down they had run out of, they had run out of ore.
G.P. There's no operation out there now?
*Ont. Bureau of Mines: Annual report. 1930. Vol. XXXIX, pt. 1, p. 147
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DENNIE ••• 24-
M.D. No, no.
G.P. Have you ever been out to the site?
M.D. Oh yes I spent t wo wonderful summer holidays there when I was fifteen and sixteen running the fire pump. You know the Department of Lands and Forests' fire pump.
G.P.
M.D.
G.P.
M.D.
G.P.
M.D.
G.P.
M.D.
G.P.
M.D.
G.P.
M.D.
G.P.
M.D.
G.P.
M.D.
G.P.
M.D.
mmhh.
There'd -be about, sometimes as many as a hundred men working ••••
When ••••
•••• but it was mostly stripping, diamond drilling, no shaft work at all.
A hundred men when your dad was associated with it?
Yes, yes.
Is that right?
Yes. It was a fair size ••••
mmhh •
•••• fair size.
It ceased operating during the Depression?
Well the 1930s, '31.
Your father's association with it ended?
It ended up sometime in the summer of '31 ••••
mmhh •
•••• and, by the way, when he opened the mine in 1928 he repurchased the house that he had built in 1902.
The one in Sudbury.
In Sudbury yes, and we lived there for four years and then when things really went flat we came back here to Hanmer ••••
G.P. mmhh.
M.D. • ••• in the old house, and we f armed.
G.P. He farmed?
DENNIE
( M.D.
G.P.
:r.1 .D.
G.P.
M.D.
G.P.
M.D.
G.P.
M.D.
G.P.
M.D. (
G.P.
M.D.
G.P.
M.D.
G.P.
M.D.
G.P.
M.D. -
G. P.
M.D.
G.P.
( M.D.
G.P.
••• 25
Not him no, dad never laid a hand on a plough.
No. He was involved in the hotel business or working with the government out here.
Yes.
Those were his two main involvements~
And we sold milk to Palm Dairies here for twenty years.
To Palm Dairies?
My dad never milked a cow or anything.
No"l
Oh no no no, he wasn't a farmer. He was working, you know, he worked for Falconbridge. He was from 1935 until 1957 he was foreman for Falconbridge on all their staking, and ••••
mmhh.
• ••• assessment work , every summer. He was eighty-one years old the last year he worked for Falconbridge.
Did he ever work for Inco?
No.
No?
No, but he did beat Inco to the Hardy Mine property.
I see.
Yeah, Inco were going to stake that at six o'clock in the morning, and when it came open, next to their property in Levack there ••••
Yes.
•••• and dad was there at about twelve o'clock at night.
When was this?
That was, oh, way back in 1940 •••• some ••••
Was he representing?
• ••• or the end of ••••
Was he working on behalf of anyone?
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DENNIE ••• 26
M.D. Oh yes, he was working for Falconbridge.
G.P. For Falconbridge, working on behalf of Falconbridge?
r1.D. Yes, oh yeah, when I say, he \'fiS their staker and development worker ••••
G.P. He was up a little earlier?
M.D. • ••• foreman, yes, oh yeah, oh he was involved in mining.
G.P. mmhh.
M.D. When, t hat's in the papers, when Edison came here ••••
G.P. Yes.
M.D. • ••• what the first time he had invented the dip needle. My dad took him to Falconbridge where he dipped for nickel.
G.P. Your dad was involved with that wasn't he?
M.D. Yes, not as owner, but ••••
G.P. No, no.
M.D. • ••• he ••••
G.P. He accompanied them.
M.D. • ••• he was in the Montreal House then and he drove, you know, the team of horses ••••
G.P. mmhh.
M.D. • ••• to where the Falconbridge Mine is and that's where Edison put his dip needle ••••
G.P. mmhh.
M.D. • ••• and you know.
G.P. Did he ever talk about Edison? Did he ever say anything?
M.D. Well, no, he didn't have too much association ••••
G.P. No.
M.D. • ••• with him except at that time ••••
G.P. mmhh.
M.D. • ••• but he used to talk about, later he had a dip needle. My brother Rand had the dip needle here ••••
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DENNIE ••• 27
G.P. mmhh.
M.D. • ••• and Rand, Randolph was a prospector for thirty years himself.
G.P. mmhh. Alright, I think what we'll do is we'll break at that point. When we return I'd like to, I'd like you to share with us some of your observations about your dad's character. His personality. Just what -kind of a man he was like, but first we'll turn the program back to our music host.
(BUSIC)
G.P. Maurice Dennie has been our guest today and Mr. Dennie the bulk of our program has been pertaining to Frank Dennie and his involvement in the community. Earlier you said that Mr. Dennie had been married twice. Could you tell us, I know you wouldn't remember your first, or his first wife, but I think ••••
M.D. No, I don't remember his fir st wife becaus e she died when my older brother -Frank was born, and then my dad remarried in, a year later. He married a girl by the name of Emerance Menard.
G.P. His first wife you mentioned was outstanding beautiful?
M.D. Oh, his first wife was by far the most beautiful picture of any woman I've ever seen on a picture.
G.P. Right.
M.D. His second wife, my mother, was a beautiful woman also, but not as stunningly. Not as stunning and beautiful.
G.P. What was the personality like of your mother?
M.D. Oh, my mother was a very quiet woman. She married when she was only seventeen and she was rather subservient in a way to my father. She looked after his every little want ••••
G.P. Right.
M.D. • ••• and I believe that's probably why my dad became so pernickety.
G.p· Before we get into that, there were eight children ••••
M.D. Yes.
G.P. • ••• in the family?
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DENNIE
M.D.
G.P.
M.D.
G.P.
M.D.
••• 28
Well ••••
We mentioned the first bunch.
• ••• oh, yes well there were four, also four children from his second marriage to my own mother.
Ri ght.
I was the eldest, then I was followed by Glen, then Clyde, then a sister Cecilia who lives, been living in the States since 1940. She's an Amer ican citizen.
G.P. What was the dominent personality of your father?
M.D. Ah, I would say that it was, everything in its place, and a place for everything, always wanted the same thing done at the same time. He was the old time. For instance he didn't want a radio or a gramophone in the house, but we had all kinds of musical instruments •••• the violin, the piano, the guitar, the banjo, you name it.
G.P. Why wouldn't he want that kind of music in the house?
M.D. He always maintained, that if we wanted music we had to maintain it, we had to make it ourselves, and he was by far the finest old-time fiddler in the world but he never wanted to compete, you know, in those things.
G.P. Was he self-taught?
M.D. Yes, self-taught, yes, but I've never heard, I've heard, you know, television allover, I've never heard anyone play like my father. He was strict as the dickens with us children. For instance, he would never order us to do something twice. If we didn't do it, and it was found not to be done, we'd have to pay for it, and he would say to us, for instance, now I want those fifty-four cords of wood piled in the woodshed. I 'm going to be away for a month, and the next day we would do it. We'd start doing it. We wouldn't wait until he came back. We had learned to obey him.
G.P. You knew what would happen ••••
M.D. yes ••••
G.P. • ••• if you didn't have it done.
M.D. • ••• yes. At the table for instance, we couldn't, we couldn't talk except to ask for what we wanted. He had to have his own butter plate, sugar plate, milk jug, his own, you know, glass of water, his own serviette on the
DENNIE ••• 29
C back of his chair, and if he didn't have that, if anything was missing, he'd kick the chair back and go sit in the parlour. He wouldn' t eat. Ha ha ha, he was a funny old fellow.
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G.P. Very particular.
M.D. Yes, and ••••
G.P. Did he have a sense of humour?
M.D. Yes, he had a good sense of humour, but you couldn't, you couldn't tell him a story, you know, the story I'm talking about, and he never told either a story or a joke in his life that I ever heard of, or anybody heard of.
G.P. Nor would he hear jokes probably.
M.D. No, no jokes. My mother loved jokes though. She' d pretend that she didn't want to hear them and she'd blus h and you could even tell her a dirty story and ha ha ha , it was comical to see her, yeah. Well ••••
G.P. Judging by what you said about Capreol, I assume he was a very generous man?
M.D. They gave and gave and gave. I don't know anyone as charitable as my father and mother, and people in Hanmer who remembered him, still talk about their charity. Capreol, as I said earlier, he gave a lot of, you know, building~ lots to the people, he sold a few but you know just for a few dollars. Here many poor people were the recipients of huge food orders, my families, that you know, real poor families. They ga~e them milk for all the time that they were selling milk to the Palm Dairies which was probably twenty years. So they were generous to a folly actually, and I wouldn't want to name any particular ••••
G.P. No.
M.D. • ••• charity, but ••••
G .• P. But, however, considering his background for example when he came to Sudbury at an early age he was really on his own wasn't he?
M.D. yes ••••
G.P. He was fifteen, or sixteen years of age.
M.D. Yes.
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DENNIE ••• 30
G.P. Maybe he remembered that and realized it was important to try and help people.
M.D. Oh he, he told us stories and stories and stories of his early life, but you know, in those days you didn't have the types, and often now when the boys get together for a due or something we regret that we didn't write them down to remember them because they were colourful stories
G.P.
M.D.
G.P.
M.D.
G.P.
M.D.
G.P.
M.D.
G.P.
M.D.
G.P.
M.D.
and ••••
Would you refer to ~'our dad as a character in his own right?
Yes.
A very colourful individual in various ways.
A very colourful person.
Very serious, very down-to-earth ••••
Yes •
•••• a family man you mentioned.
Yeah, and ••••
When he came home, he was home to stay except to go to church?
He ~rould not leave the house except to go to work.
mmhh.
That man would not leave the house. I believe for all his old-time fiddling, he played at two weddings. Outside of that, he never attended another dance nor my mother. They just stayed at home and looked after us ••••
G.P. mmhh.
M.D. • ••• and we were well looked after. We never suffered for anything. We always had the food. Dad always managed to have money, not a great deal of money, he didn't care for money. If he had cared for money, when he owned the mine he had five hundred thousand shares and he could have sold them, you know, and ended up with a lot of money.
G.P. Sure.
M.D. He didn't bother, and he ended up with nothing. So, but, he was happy that way.
G.P. mmhh.
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DENNIE ••• 31
M.D. Money never meant, money as an accumulation never meant anything to him.
G.P.
M.D.
G.P.
M.D.
G.P.
M.D.
No?
No.
Did he hunt at all?
Ah ••••
Hunt or fish? No time for it?
When I was a young boy he hunted because they would. go in the fall and get two or three moose and deer, but he was not a hunter as such. He hunted sometimes for food.
G.P. mmhh.
M.D. Otherwise he never hunted, he never hunted for sport, never.
G.P. No.
M.D. Not even birds or rabbits or anything like that, no.
G.P. Did he read?
M.D. Yes, he read good books, history books, and his paper. He'd read his paper every day.
G.P. Read the newspaper every day?
M.D. yeah ••••
G.P. The Sudbury ••••
M.D. • ••• when he was here, yes, Sudbury Star.
G.P. • • • • Sudbury Star.
M.D. He would read history books. BOQk on mining, but mostly history or geography.
G.P. mmhh.
M.D. He was interested in that alone. He never read, he never read a novel or a romance, or anything of that stuff.
G.P. No.
M.D. Never.
G.P. Very serious~
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DENNIE ••• 32
i1. D.
G.P.
M.D.
G.P.
M.D.
G.P.
H.D.
G.P.
M.D.
G.P.
M.D.
G.P.
M.D.
G.P.
M.D.
G.P.
M.D.
G.P.
M.D.
G.P.
M.D.
Yes, all serious reading.
His serious nature ••••
Yes.
• ••• followed through in a number of areas ••••
Yeah.
• ••• then I assume.
He was a fine, you know, we remember him as when we were young we were scared of him ••••
Yes •
•••• but as we got older and he mellowed ••••
mmhh •
•••• we loved him. He was, he was a loveable man, and well so was fJIother. r10ther was a, mother was the soul of honesty ••••
mmhh.
•••• and charity, and ••••
Both -\'1ere members of the Catholic Church out here?
Well, she supplied the priest with chicken, meat, milk ••••
mmhh •
••• • as long as she vias here ••••
mmhh.
• ••• and, you know, farming and selling milk ••••
mmhh •
•••• but she was not really, she once told us that if, you know, if she had a choice of religion she would have chosen the Jewish or Hebrew religion • .
G.P. She had actually thought about it that much ••••
M.D. Yes, she had thought about it that much. She wasn't overly impressed by the laws of the church as such.
G.P. No.
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DENNIE ••• 33
M.D. No. She was perhaps the finest Christian I've ever run across ••••
G.P.
M.D.
G.P.
M.D.
G.P.
M.D.
G.P.
M.D.
G.P.
M.D.
G.P.
~1 .D.
G.P.
M.D.
G.P.
M.D.
G.P.
M.D.
G.P.
M.D.
G.P.
M.D.
G.P.
M.D.
G.P.
mmhh.
• ••• but as for religion, per se ••••
No •
•••• Catholic religion per se ••••
No •
•••• she was a Catholic that, you know, by birth ••••
Right.
• ••• and practiced ••••
mmhh.
• ••• but I don't think that her whole soul was in the, was in the Catholic Church.
In the established church as ••••
No.
No.
No.
When did your dad die?
My dad died on the twenty-third of September, 1963.
At age?
At age ninety-four ••••
Ninety-four?
• ••• and he just died of old age. The machine was worn out • •••
mmhh.
• ••• and Mother died on the twelfth of March, 1968.
mmhh. People today in Hanmer, do they remember ••••
Oh yes they still talk about ~lother and Father ••••
• ••• would there be ••••
DENNIE ••• 34
f1.D. • •• • and how she used to give them milk, give them food. She sold doughnuts, Mother sold doughnuts for years as well, after she quit the dairy business and she'd give doughnuts to the children, and, you know, sell them at the same time, and the kids, still talk (unintelligible) kids now, some of them are thirty years old ••••
G.P. mmhh.
M.D. • ••• you know, but they still talk about mother's doughnuts ••••
G.P. Is tha.t right? \ve talk about people being close to their roots, and as I drove here, I noticed you're just beside Dennie Street ••••
M.D. Yeah.
G.P. • ••• and you're living ve»y adjacent to where your parents lived ••••
M.D. Yeah.
G.P. • ••• and the hotel.
M.D. Right next to it, there is Dennie Street ••••
G.P. You haven't moved too far?
M.D. No, Maurice Street, Randolph Street, Clyde Street, Glen Street, the names of the ••••
G.P. Of the sons?
M.D. • ••• of the, of part of the village of Hanmer, are named after us ••••
G.P. mmhh. ,
M.D. • ••• and the same in Capreol.
G.P. mmhh. In Capreol as well?
M.D. One of the main streets in Capreol is Dennie Street also.
G.P. I see.
M.D. Yes. And -in Norman Township, eventually dad woned a lot of land in Norman Township also, and when they subdivided t he streets are named after our family again.
G.P. What's the community there?
M.D. Capreol.
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DENNIE ••• 35
G.P. Capreol, that part of Capreol.
M.D. I t's all Capreol, the town of Capreol 'but part of the town of Capreol is in Norman Township ••••
G.P. I see.
M.D. • ••• and part in Capreol Township.
G.P. mmhh.
M.D. Yeah.
G.P. Your' dad had a preference for Hanmer I suspect? He didn't move back to Sudbury. He must have ••••
M.D. Ah, no, Hanmer was ••••
G.P. Was home.
M,.D. • •• • yeah, well we had the f arm here, and you know ••••
G.P. Ties with Hanmer and Capreol.
M.B. • ••• and all the children were around here at one time or another. Not too far away.
G.P. No.
M.D. There's only one now, well ~y sister lives in Dayton, Ohio, and brother Lloyd recently 1n the past ten, fif teen years, he moved to Ottawa, but pr ior to that when Dad 'lIas living , we were all around, you know, very close to Hanmer and except for my sister who was away.
G.P. mmhh.
M.D. So he never ••••
G.P. We're running short. We' re going to be out of tape very soon, but ~hank you Mr. Dennie for sharing with us your reminiscences about Frank Dennie.
IVI .D. Well thaiik you very much for letting me, for allowing me to do so.
G.P. It's certainly appreciated . I'm sure everyone enjoyed the program today. Again thank you.
r.1 .D. You're welcome.