folder 9/20: [lawrence] o’brien

8/3/2019 Folder 9/20: [Lawrence] OBrien

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N i x o n Testimony on O' Brien

I n f o ~ m Nixon of the scope of o u ~ inquiry - - nn in vestiqution to determine to what extent l'I"hite I!ouseaf f i l in ted persons attempted to inf luence the IRSto audi t or otherwise harass Lawrence F. O' Brien , Sr .and an investiqation to determine to \Jhat extent theI'lhito House atten:pted to secure confident ia l tax in -format ion or other f inancia l n f o r ~ a t i o n as to O' Brienfor purposes of public disseminat ion. The invest igat ionprimarily is fo cused upon the period of July throughl ate September , 1972, but some of the evidence re la tesla te Fal l , 1972, and the Winter and Spring of 1973 . Il1 l , l t ~ ....+ U ~ c ; ...,.,..Jr 1-.. L..sw.~ , ~ - .". "'fh'"' ... - I - I " " ~ ' '1.1- ..'" ",'/I rot, .... t t . . - l L J : J ~ L I d , . ~ . f : J

of 0 ' Brien sHughes from ' ~ ' " " \ r _ ' ; iyslol A ~ 4 a ' -

Did you a t tha t anytime in1971 have : T I ~ ~ ~ ~ ; 0 ' Brien sinvo l vement have resul tedin criminal o'r ' .xDid tha t time - - oror have

I DUringIRS inves t igat ion of Howardthere deve loped information and twoc ia tes of his - - Joseph Nap"li,C"" and Claude Desautelshad received considerable sums from Huqhes in 1969 and\'lhen did you f i r s t becolne\'Ihat did you unaerstand the I RS ' s in te res t in? the relat ionship to be?Who f i r s t informed you of th i s IRS information?- .. 1I1.Did you receive or did you ask for writ ten in -formation concerning th i s matter?l


4/47

2.

From tho:! documents we huve it is apparent that youdiscussed t h i s !nat ter with othe r s a l the Wli te /lousea t l eas t as early as August 3, 1972.

You then ha d a meeting with E h ~ l i c h m a n andHaldeman and there i s th e noti.N.. - - regard ingthe IRS and Just ice that you would or should"U!lC our p o w e r s ~ and that this Should be doneas to the "contributors" Clnd as to ~ O ' B r i e n " ? Also, t he r e i s the nota t ion - - with obvious "I'f,r e f e r ence to O' Brien - - Mbetter'CIT0p him -now because;" was there discuss10n aboutta lk ing to McGovern about this and scar ingthem off O' Brien because of the possibletax problems he faced? Was anyone approachedabout th i s , i . c . did yo u di rec t tha t anyonebe contacted to serve as the courier or l ia isonfor this message?Later in the same meeting there is another note - which seems to re la te to Shultz that :

"must be pol i t ica l"give him an external t ip , e.g. Larry O' Brien ""check his returns n

Nas Ehrlichman to contact Shultz and give himsome anonymous message? ~ ~ a t was meant by an"external t ip"? 'ii/3/)ol _ S ' ~ ~ M l ike- R ~ , J ..lit" .T'\ """""" .oI#'IHl" 11&111~ ' 4 61T"..-J/IW I"q/r.,w6-Two other matters crysta l l iz ing or occurring at about r ~ ' - r this same time. 7 " " " ' ~

Firs t , in the course of th e IRS inquiry theyhad scheduled an interview with O' Brien and

80>P.Jc

he had not shown up . There was some suggestiontha t IRS was not pursuing i t? \ ~ a s there adiscussion of this? Any direction that they dothis iPmediately? That they be forced to repor tback to you on i t? I f you were told about this ,by whom? And did you J-.now that Mr . Roger Barth- ])It';';;'wa s providing such information?

Also, turning back to this reference in the August 3, 1972,meeting to "contr ibutors," evidence establ ishes that onth is very day Mr. Chotincr and E h r l i c ~ ~ a n s tar ted apro ject of col lecting the names of major Democraticcontr ibutors and th e names of ~ ~ , ~ v e r n s ta f f peoplet--t f (e/u"u # e,."" ,..11 ,..s,{.r ~ . 1 If- f ,/J.rtl"JJItj rtll , .. rJMrJ- ." O ' B ( ~ ; . f I " IH -f ?~ I ( ' ~ I .


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Now on August 9, 1912, yo u ~ p p e n r to have a conVGrsat ion with former Secretary Connally. and as a resul tof thaI;. apparent ly prepa r ed tw o r.lemOrandll fo r l!a l dcJl1sn.Do you rememberconversations? a prec i se conver sa t ion?I f 50, where , ~ ' h e n . with

remember the conversat ion l e t mef you d o n ' tshow YOU) . . . .about them. ". . . I I l a and ask yo u some ques t ions I

(-J O:dj ..JAhr N.9{) "PH'Pf'O cJpAJ lld m O yN . rFi r s t , on e i s di r ec t ly concerned with O ' B r i e ~ an d there ..sWl Z

a re se v e r a l r e f e r ences to ~ g e t t i n 9 o u t informat ion ft onO' Brien; thus the m e m o r a n d ~ s t a t es :Connally feels velY strongly tha t any informationwe qet in this ~ a t t e r should not be held, butshould pop out ju s t as quickly as possible"Connally ' s very strong conviction i s thatdropping something on O' Brien wil l have fa rmore ef f ec t now than a t a l a te r t i m e-Be sure to e ~ h a s i t e to John . . . that weare not t rying to develop a legal case thati s a ir t ight . The very fact that O' Brienan d Associates received any money a t a l l fromHughes, when it i s firmly estab l i shed , itohould be put out . "

Now do you recal l th is aspect of convllrsation withConnally?ltlith whom alae did you discuss the in te res t in"put t ing out" IRS information as to O' Brien?When?Were any ef for ts made to "put out" such infor mation? By whom? Was anything a c c o ~ l i s h e d ? Now , a l so from th is Connally memorandum, it notesthat Connally s po ke Aboyt soree ve ry specif icfigures , e .g . I k ha d you giventhese f igures to Connally? I f so, f r o ~ whereh ~ d you received them? I f they were not f r o ~ youwhere did Connally


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4.

kno'''' t h a t , in th e normal course , th e I RS hadaudited Mr . O' Brien 's re turns?I f you d id not d i r e c t an a u d i t h o ' ~ ' d id youbelieve tha t the audi t ha d been star ted? Whohad to ld you t h a t th e IR S had s t a r t e d an aud i t ?What had yo u been to ld as to the basis forany audi t?

onn ver. ::n:elroan..

11ow, going on in t ine , shor t ly af te r your conversat i onswith Cgnn a l lY - - actual ly the next day - - the IRS hadar r anged an interview, but not with O' Br i en , r a ther with r ' .h i s son ; a !!i"morandum r e f le c t i ng th i s \ ' l aS prepared an d _ .5kIW. . .1 copy _ L to you . Had you ever seen tha t or anythi ngl ike i t ?Did you find out t ha t the I RS hnd arranged a meetingwith the so n rath e r than the father?

On August 11, 1972, according to Ehrlichman's notes of 1.1meeting between yoursel f , Ehrlichman and Haldeman whichtook place a t 9,40 a.m., evidently a t Camp David, there i sa notat ion tha t the " I R S - O B r i e n ~ was discussed , ant'! there ference - - apparen t ly to you speaking - - "Shal l I ca l lG e o r g c ~ Shultz to get I R ~ ? " - - Was th i s , then, conversat ion I - ~ ..Jc.,about s t ra ightening ou t I RS? lihet was the resolut ion as I .. .... 'far as insuring t ha t O' Br ien , Sr . , ra ther than J r . be r-/Hf:in terviewed ? Did you discuss \ 'lith othe r s the in t e r e s t o r l ' .ibo r t ~ n c e of interviewing him before the P.epublican -I-econvent ion ? (."Jf-.

Now, in an y conversa tions regarding O' Br i en and th e IRS ,did you know of the IRS of f i c i a l posi t ion which was todelay in te rviews or other ac t ion in volv ing pol i t ica l lykn own ind iv idua l s unt i l a f t ~ J the elec t ion?*- :tf.. 7':...f;!tf / } , f ....... i f?- J . t ~ w.r I t l l ~ ",,,..,1",,, .


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5 .

Now, on A U 9 u ~ t 17th Mr. O'nr ien was ir :tervh:wed; wereyou br ie fed on th in by anyone? Ehrlichll'tiln? Shul t2?This Roger Darth (did you ever discuss the O' Brienmatter direct ly with Barth?)?

There wero a number of reports prepared of the O'Brieni n te r v iew; . l'ttl'l8: l i l i p !;, II C1lZ O f dlosc La )od Lhzo (\!II1:llii 11 ' ) ) r Bnd 1 wl l l show bhel:ifto you It O . el La e y 8 "8 ;1id you ever receive one of these? Did you ever readone? Do you know o f an y o ther s a t the White House ,,,hore ceived nny of these reports or substuntially similarreports? DO you know of any effor ts to release anyi nformation coming from 0 ' Brien in h is interviews to the l in ipreSa? By whom were such ef for ts made?

- I H-.f, t C " ) S ~ ~ 1 ....':__ " " - = " ~ " ' ' ' ' , ...,Now, the Republican Convention took place froc August 21t o August 21 ; were there discussions then - - to which yowere a party - - concerning O' Brien ' s tax situation? AS , 0Or discussions of which you were aware? ~ _ l .-!t ,..cto'l'oAJ- " . f ( ~ , / ~ . . . r . . . ; . . .

Accordin9 to Ehr1ichrnan ' s notes of a meeting between youand him on August 26 , 1972 , a t 11 : 20 a.m . , appar entlya t San Clemente (this would be the day af te r the conventione nded) there i s the not a t ion as to O' Brien that the "press...., inve':mr tx ret.,n,;" ~ $ E t ' ::::;; ::.r : : ; " ' , , ~ ; ' : ; : : : .. ..;.,


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' fQIA(b)6FOIA(b)7 - (e )

NW#: 36514-

6.1if - / ~ d1PD1lrlkJ!"':Now, there are Ehr1ichman notes of what appears to havebeen a conversation between the two of you, aboard AirForce One on September 5, 1972, where there i s ther eference : ftAnonymous, to Hart re Hughes and B r i e n ~ warn Senator M c G o v e r n I take it that was a referenceto Mr. Gary Hart and a discussion about indicat ing toMcGovern tha t O'Brien had problems. I

Did you discuss using th is route? /Ias anything done in that connection?There is a lso the reference in thes e same notes as to 1/"Mrs. Westwood." \,/as sh e referred to i n the sllJrIe context?Did anything happen?Then there is the reference in thes e same nota s to ~ G e t someone in Las Vegas do i t ~ and "Ask how much heWas Ehrlichman indicating to you tha t he ha d a channelthrough Las Vegas to get information on O' Brien? )}Did you know anything about having secured i n f o r ~ t i o n fromLas Vegas?

", ' S I l l S ,,j, )Now what appear t o ~ ~ the notes of a meeting between youand Ehrlichman on ,septcrn1>er . lO, 1972, also note referencesto O'Brien, of the following nature,' L a r r y 0 ' Brien worry him, ft K a l m b a c h , Brien willworry, " "Goss.l,t-p1ant," "Bobby Baker blowing whist leon L a ~ r y O'Br ten and othe r s , ~ G e t it to O'er ien -_don ' t publish."t pese a l l appear to re la te to conversations to in one wayor another usa the IRS information? Can you explain howyou intended to "worryft O' Brien? Why W8S Bobby Baker

' I ~ ' ~ ' " ' " ' , : ! ' w ~ . ~ < ~ e : , ' ~ h ~ e l < e ~ ' l ' o : : ' : :' : " , ' ~ O : O : ~ ~ ! ! O " : " , : W ~ O . ! : , - e ~ ! : . . ~ - ; , - _ \ onTh ere LS a so 6 oug a you wou d not publishthe material on O'Brien but get it to him in some pr ivateway? h ~ a t discussions were there about th is? In th isregard i t appears that Dean was to handle the matter? ., .That Dean was to contact O'Brien throu']h Duane Andreas? - #,'#


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1..i., . 1-t 1 . .fL,r;. ")' .......

S " 0/ . l . ~ , ( { J J. .,,,11.') 0 ar ",to.. j. J... .> - !I r

Now, by September . , 1972, i t appei1rcd tha t 1:RS mightnot do anything on O' Brien. But therc is evidence tha ta t about thiG Game time there ,,'cre discu!],'ions abouttha t l i s t of Democratic c o n t r i b u t o r ~ . Thus , on Septomber 15,1972, you discuss with Haldeman the fact that Dean was ,according to Haldeman - - "moving ruthlessly on the illvestiyo.tion of l,lcGovern people, t and iJaldeMan adds, "Chuck,Chuck has gone through, you know has ~ I o r k e d on the l i s t ,and Dean ' s working the, the thing throughNow were the ef for ts regarding O'Brien linked in any Ilayto these ef for t s?

For example, was there any ef for t to use the IRS ' s inac t ionon one matter to force action on another? - 11 f 0 / _- p,; 7 ..... K , J ~ , ''''.:::?I:'''t I ' r ~ J?Now , in September. there was some IRS inquiry into :i2 . I"z.O' Brien's t ax t reatment of some stock he had owned in abrokerage company for which he had taken an ordinary 10s9.--Did you know anything about th i s issue? Any discussionabout the fact tha t O'Brien would not face a criminall i ab i l i ty but probably would face a civ i l l iab i l i ty?Infact , in ~ p r i l , 1973, an audi t was star ted of O'Brienon th i s issue . t'ihat did you know about this? Did youhave any conversat ions about i t?


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r N N W0 W 0WC0>

" " WC>:O::-l'DAY TUESDAY 11:EDNESOAY THURSDAY FR!DJ\Y I S ; ; : ; ; R : l . ~ . Y ,, 10 11 12 13 14 ISDNC Convention IRS Status Report ONC Conventions ta r t s in ~ I i o . m i refers to Rcbozo ends in Miamiadvising ~ m h e u no tto be interviewed 3:00 - -Shultz meetsl ialters rc AC fo

Inspection

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17/47

lJeLY 19 72

s u ~ o , ; ; : ~ : O : ' ; D A Y T\.I"ESDAY " ' E D ~ E S D A Y THuRSDAY FR!DAY I ! : ; : ; t . : : l . lI16 17 ' 18 19 20 21 22

Beginning of agents 12 : 00 - - 11 : 30 - - IRS Status Reportatte::-.pts to se t in - Shultz neets Barth Shu l tz meets Kal- tha t agents i n t e ~ d terview with O'Brie ters & Geibel to interview O'Bri3 ! 32 - -Shultz cal led Walte ,3 : 40 - -Shultz pls . ca l l De

l . - - 1


18/47

lJuLY 1972

S t . : ~ ; D A Y ~ : O : - : D , W I 1 IuESDAY I NEDXESDAY TIiURSDAY FRID,W SA:::?J,""'"I i" " 25 " 27 2B 29IRS Status Report O' Brien fails to \Qalters learns th a Napolitanthat O'Brien i s to appear fo r in te r- 0' Brien did not intervie ....edbe intervie"'ed in view in NYC show and apparent

NYC 7/25/72 agreement that in -terview " ' i l l no tbe pursuedHanlon suggestsinterview of RabenHumphrey

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19/47

1SUNDAY !'.ONDAY TUESOAY

30 31 14: 00Shul tz secs Barthelln ca l l s Bar t h

~ l A ( b , 3 - 26 USC 6103 . Tax InfQrmation

NW#: 36514 Dbcld:31443853

AUGUST 1912

m : O ~ E S O A Y ,St a tu s Report on10'Brien' . fa i lu reappear , info . fro:Nf-politan l . ~ n t e \on dividev/O ' Srien anDesilutelsEhr . notes2: 20Chotiner

THURSOAYJ

Walters writes-keep trying-Eh r .... Ptes . &Halde .9:451l.m.-lO:4Sa.m."SJusticeInvestig. of uswhen we were ou tEd Nixon-OCeanographic FundUse ou r powerContributorsLarry 0'8rienbetter they drophim now because

Ck. McGovernIRS FUesJo s . Colemancx . him

l t ~ Mus t be pOlitealGive him an ex te rnal t ip. 9 . Larry O'Sr iCk. hill re turn ,

PRIDAY I " "'"A'-..." .Shultz ca l l s E9: 5 6 - - "

11,15 - - 9,30Shultz sees Ehr.a t ""hite Rouse2 :24 ( l e t t word);Ehr . calls Shultre PI:. Ryland2 :30 - -Walter. ca l l s 5h'( l e f t word)

Shultz spellk5w/Walters7)10:15-Shultz call s(two times)

"

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20/47

1SUNDAY

6

NWN: 36514

1f.o);OAY

7ll-1:15tnr. .../Nixon1:42 - -Shultz cal l s Walter1:47 - -Shultz calls Eht.2: 00Ehr. wjConnally

iocld :31443853

TlJESDAY

84,30S h u l t ~ ",{Pre .Cabinet a t CampDavid

AUGUST 1972

I-r'l:DNCSOAY,Status Report ~ n t ions summon O'Sri2:30 - -Shultr a t IRS(re ceives ca l l froMitchell)

THURSDAY10

Status report onn atte=pts to seeO'Brien , "I app t .Ir.foral2 :2 5Eh t .... 0001'1Shult: . Note:3 : 30 - - E h r . ca l l to "bug

Walters to airpor See 'y about pr09l"eNixon memos to H repor t he i s workin0."Connally c o n f ~ d e n m ate rh l i n J;1= ~ : 1 0 - man f i l e . (Mite. Sh\ll tzsaid f i le in Int, DOJ') 15:00G et f i l e s within En r . . . . Nixon24 hrs .See i f derogatorinfo. could beput out' s r ien ' s name in

FRIDAY st.'!\ino,w11 129: 20Shult: talks Eh r:4 0 - -:hr ..../Nixon (note

12 :0 5 - -S h ~ l t t talks Walkbr12 : 09 -- t.Shultt ca l ls Henkflh"Af ter 2 00 -S h ~ l t : t t"aTks TodHullin (Ehr .....Pres. Camp David)Ehr. notes w/Pre

IRS-D'BrienShall Pres. ca l lShultt to get IRS

inve.t ig. of H'Jto O'B , AS50.to NapolitanFOI1\(b)3 - 26 USC 6103. Ta x I n ! o ~ . a t l o n

onnally teels infoh o ~ l g be put outr . say. O'B wil lsubpoenaed i f noappear

Follow en Napel.and O' B" re t . fe r1968$9M debt bu t Napol .b i l l s paidO'B claim using a iNat. C h a i r ~ n l .! ~ . a u g i ~ ~ g ~ 1 2 e : ; ~ I I ' : ' _ A _ ..


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1AUGUST 1912

SUXOA'i I{O:-l'DAY TUESDAY ~ I E D N E S D A Y THURSDAY FRIDAY I A':URDAY,14 15 16 17 10:50 - -O' B in t ,1 8 I 19: J Shultz r e t . fr o Hi Desautels in t o9 : 25 - - Shul tz sees Harle_ 7: 18 - - 4 : 52 , 5:44 - - Nemo of in ter -Shultz ca l l s WaIte (? ) Shultz cal l s Halde Shultz talks Halde view P1epared &in SF (talks Higby) (2 t imes) su=a r es11 : 15 - - (? ) Walker Shultz to HiamiNossen told by Han 6: 10 - - Walters to LasIon to have Sr . ou Shultz leaves wo rd Veqas3 : 30 - - Olzsecki Ehr.meets Shultz4 : 52 - - O' Brien intervie ..Harless cal l6 : 35 - -Shula ~ a l k s ~ c ~ 3 ( t r ~ c t reac : ,11: 36)Perlot inquiry toBonomi re O' B.& NapolitanShultz leaves forMiami

, - - - I -


22/47

1AUGUST 1972

~ : - : D A Y ~ : O : ' ; O A I Tt:ESDAY m : : O ~ E S D A Y THURSDAY FRIDAY I S ; " : t : ; : . : - i . ~ 20 21 22 23 " 25 '"Shultz in Miami Nossyn sta tus Nossen dictate suery - - Shultz re turns to Shultz in Miami on 0 B. no t Ava . Harless requestsm ~ e n does Dean D. C. wi elect ion Nossen r::c/:'.o Bvcrviey ....s peak t o Shultz on (?}Barth reviews Agnew nominated (? ) i f secure re t . ee aute I; 1 ..l ounge chairs 10 : 55 - - a'B. returns \ ~ I 2 : 15 - - Shultz reminder t Ehr.notes ".;Shultz ca l l s Iqalte Rankin Nixon accepts Ehr. cal l s Shultz cal l Ehr . Il l te Pres . ( l l : 30)Walters cal l s (Ehr . in t r ans i t ) afternoon i f no t11:25 - - \ ~ a l k e r a t home talkee Larry O'Brien-l ~ a l t e r s ca l l s Shul Shultz leaves Miami press i n v e s t ~ ,-

Nixon nominated 9 : 30 - - ticI''; ta x re t .Walter s cal ls S h u l t z W a l t e r ~ afNalker in Miami s taf f meeting12:15 - -Shultz leaves fo r Ehr. conf . ca l lMiami w/Halde . , Hi t cheJ.:Connally2 : 05 - -Ehr . calls Shultz

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23/47

1SU:-:OA"i

27

\

110:iiOAY

";1alters rece ives,verviews 10,'/3 exh.:25 - -

Tt"r:SDAY

290 : 00'a1 t e rs , Barth .hul';z-Ehr.' a l ters ins t ruct .

At.:Gt.:::'T 19 2

io;EONESDAY

301??Undtd. Notes

1/30/72GAO

THURSDAY

31Walters reqcestsf i r s t revisionDelete extraneousinfo.hultz cal l s \ ';alterslto McGowan Larry O'Brien~ ' o n : y himK.almbach TlIX re turnsby National rec 'd .Office:55 -

, a l t e r s c G o v e r n 0 : 30 - ; ~ a l t e r s - B a r t h

: 30 - -:hr. ca l l s Shultzfrom San Clemente(Tall'; 2:15)5 : 00 - Walters - McGovernHalters ca l l s ~ ! a rI d i ~'Ehr. tape w/B.uth iSa n Clemente\';a1 ters l earned ofinquiryGuy in Las Vegasnoted to pick uprecord sWalters p u ~ f r c e z e Not send guy backto San Francisco

2,48 - 2:10 - :hr . I Rebozoissin


24/47

1" ' ' : ' ' ' - ~ ' ' ' ! " J . D L ' ' ' 1972

SU:.;oA'i !10NOt\'i '!UESDA'i WED:-


25/47

1SLtND,\Y

l

~ : O : : ' < D A Y

1111 :3 0 - -S h u l t ~ meets Barth2:30 - -Dean !:'.eets WaltersEOB (500 l is t )See note 9/11

EPTEY..BER 1972TUESDAY t;'CDNCSDAY

112 1134 : 00 S h u l t ~ t o mectl9 : 45 - -\'Ialters (cancelled) walters tells Shultof 500:,ote: Walters needsto se c Shultz(unabl ')12 : 00\qa l tcrn meets Bart:

~ i a l t e r s cal ls DeanHullin calls WaIteSee note 9/114 : 30Enr . w/Connally

1 THURSDAY14

4: 00 - P r e s , S h u l t ~ , C o n n a l Stein, Burns . Ehr.Ehr. notes w/Pres ,R i ~ ~ o , C o l e , af ter th e election

sSee his ta x rots .Shultz withdrawfe d . fur.dsNo banker ca n befo r MeG . wlo s o thing being wrong

I FRID,W s.;::


26/47

1S E ? : , ; . ' ~ Z R hI : ' :I 1U:>lO!,Y XO:WAY TUESDAY WEDNESDAY 'l'HUPSOAY .::' ." 25 26 27 2B5 : 40 - - 2 : 2 B --Dean cal ls Welters Dean and Nalters

See note 9/25 by See note 9/26 by" la l te rs ~ l a l t e r s

L .

FRIDAY29 2:JO - -Ei)r.meets C h o t ~ n e r 4: S5 - -\ ia l ters call!!Shultz -TalkedSee note 9/29 byWaltersHarless receivesFlynn memo(Coversheets ha s Jerryl lilbank in WaItehandwri t iog)

,ISA':"L"::;;':,

I 30UNDATED Eh r?1/30/72GAOLarry 0 I Bri,worry hillK a ~ m b a c h Q'B:."ienwi l l worryGossip .plan!Uack AndersBobby B a ~ e r li 'histle on& othersGet it to 0don 't publiv ia A!'I


27/47

1OCTOBER 19 72

Sl.iNO; .! 1 : O ~ D i \ Y '!UESDAY l'iEDNESDAY THURSDAY FRIDAY S;I:r:; ::


28/47

1OCTUli&N J . ~ j J .

SU::\OAY ~ : O ~ D r l Y TUESDAY w " E D ~ E S D A Y 1 THURSDAY FRIDAY I A':"t:;>.;),'\Y15 16 11 18 19 20 212:20 3:00 - - 10:00 10:30Colson cal ls Shultz Shultz sees Walter Shultz talked Ehr. Shultz w/Pres .

2:29 - - 4 : 32 - - prior to press confSee note 10/17 of n taxesShultz ca l l s ~ ; c G r e g I'>alters Walters calls Shul7alked 5 : 08 - -2 : 30 - - Shultz talked Cole(cal led Ehr . )Shultz cal ls Colson 5: 30 - -Left word Henkel cal ls Shult:2: 30 - - please cal lShultz cal ls Haldc. 5: SO --Cal l Cancel led lIalde. ca l l s Shul t -:2: 31 - - TalkedShultz cal ls Ehr.- 5: 55 - -Cancelled Shultz calls Walte ,-:2: 32 - - TalksShultz cal ls Cole-Talked5 : 00 - -Shultz sees BarthNote on calendarWalters needs 15 mi[ (? ) ~ : c G o v e r n tal{program]

1


29/47

0'&(,,,"- 0 c ~ , ~ J ~ -- ,/." /();r (.>re.'"

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-- - -

,

- - ----

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1 --, (If - "",.... J f Jh.,,1h

b ~ J - ",,1 / _ rP O./'""_.


30/47

Nixon's Testimony on O'Brien

Inform Nixon of the scope of our inquiry - - an invest igat ion to determine to what extent White Houseaf f i l i a ted persons attempted to influence the IRSto audi t or otherwise harass Lawrence F. O'Brien, Sr.and an invest igat ion to determine to what extent theWhite House attempted to secure confident ial tax information or other f inancial information as to O'Brienfor purposes of public dissemination. The invest igat ionprimarily is focused upon the period of July throughlate September, 1972, but some of the evidence re la testo la te Fal l , 1972, and the Winter and Spring of 1973 .

Knowledge of O' Brien-Hughes relat ionship in general.You were aware of O' Brien's contractualrelat ionship with Hughes from as early asJanuary, 1971, were you not?Did you at that time - - or a t anytime in1971 have reason to believe that O'Brien ' sinvolvement in this regard might have resul tedin criminal or tax violat ions?Did you at that time - - or a t anytime in 1971communicate or have someone else communicatewith anyone a t Treasury or a t IRS regardingthis matter?

General knowledge of O' Brien-Hughes relat ionship inthe Summer of 1972. During the course of an extensiveIRS investigation of Howard Hughes and related associa testhere developed information that O'Brien and two associates of h is - - Joseph Napolitan and Claude Desautelshad received considerable sums from Hughes in 1969 and 1970 .When did you f i r s t become aware of th i s knowledge?What did you understand the IRS's in teres t inthe relat ionship to be?Who f i r s t informed you of this IRS information?Did you receive or did you ask for writ ten in -formation concerning this matter?What, i t anything, did you request that theIRS do in fur ther developing information inthis regard?


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2. c

From the documents we have it is apparent tha t youdiscussed th is matter with others a t the White Housea t l e a s t as ea r l y as August 3, 1972.You then had a meeting with Ehrlichman andHaldeman and there i s the notion - - regardingthe IRS and Jus t ice that you would or should"use our powers and that th i s should be doneas to the contr ibutors" and as to O'Brien"?Also, there i s the notation - - with obviousreference to O'Brien - - "bet ter drop himnow because;" was there discussion aboutta lking to McGovern about th i s and scaringthem off O' Brien because of the possibletax problems he faced? Was anyone approachedabout t h i s , i . e . did you di r ec t that anyonebe contacted to serve as the courier or l iaisonfo r t h i s message?Later in the same meeting there i s another note - which seems to re la te to Shultz tha t :

~ m u s t be pol i t i ca l~ g i v e him an external t ip , e .g . Larry O'Brien"check his re turns

Was Ehrlichman to contact Shultz and give himsome anonymous message? What was meant by an-external t ip-?

TWO other matters crys ta l l iz ing or occurring a t aboutth is same time.Firs t , in the course of the IRS inquiry theyhad scheduled an interview with O'Brien andhe had not shown up . There was some suggestiontha t IRS was not pursuing i t? Was there adiscussion of this? Any di rec t ion that they doth i s immediately? That they be forced to reportback to you on i t ? I f you were told about t h i s ,by whom? And did you know tha t Mr. Roger Barthwas providing such information?

Also, turning back to th is reference in the August 3, 1972,meeting to "contr ibutors, evidence establ ishes tha t onth is very day Mr . Chotiner and Mr . Ehrlichman star ted aproject of col lect ing the names of major Democraticcontributors and the names of McGovern s t a f f people?


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3.

Now on Auqust 9, 1972, you appear to hay. h a d . conversat ion with f o ~ r Secretary COnnally, and a resu l tof tha t apparently prepared tw o memoranda for Haldeman Do you remombereonver ions7 precise conversation?I f so, where, when, withI f you don ' t r e ~ m b e r the convers . t ion l e t meshow yo u the trlemoranda an d a .k yo u SOllie ques t ionsabout them.

Fira t , one i . direct ly concerned with O'Brien and thereare several references to "qettinq out information" onO'Brien, thus the memorandum ata tes:Connally t ee l s very strong-ly t ha t an y informationwe qat in th is matter should not be held, butshould pop out just . s quickly 8 . possible"Connally ' . very stronq conviction i, thatdropping something on O'Srien will have tarmore ef fec t now than a t l a te r time""Be aure to emphasize to John tha t weare not t ryinq to develop a legal case tha tia a ir t igh t . The very fact tha t O'Brienand ~ a o c i a t e a received any monGy a t a l l fromHughea, when it i s firmly established, itshould be put out ."Now do you recal l th is aspec t of conversation withConnally?With who. else did you discus s the in tere$t in"putt ing out" IRS information aa to O' Brien?When?Wore anymation? ef fo r t s made to "put out" au ch infor By whom? Was anything accomplished?Now, alao from this Connally m e m o r a n d ~ it notestha t Connally Spoke about sOme very specif icf igures, e .q. I had you giventhe se f igures to Connally? I f so, from wherehad you received them? I f they were not from youwhere did Connally qet them?Final ly . from this memorandum , on the bottom l ineof the f i r s t page you indicate that - the IRS audi tof O'Brien, begin Thursday - - tha t meana tomorrowa t the very ear l i e . t J " had you ear l i e r directedtha t an audi t be c ~ n c e d ? I f ao, what was thebasia for tha t direct ion? In other worda, Whatfacta were known which jua t i f ied an audit? Did you

E'OIA(bI6fOIA(bi? - (CI

: 36514 Docld:31443853


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4.

know tha t , in the normal course, the IRS hadaudited Mr. O'Brien's re turns?

I f you did Dot di rec t an audi t how did yoube l ieve t h a t the audi t had been s t a r t ed? Whohad to ld you t h a t the IRS had s ta r t ed an audi t ?What had you been told as to the basis fo rany audi t ?

As to the other memorandum to Haldeman following upon theConnally conversation, the di rec t reference there is to aMr. Kimmelman bu t the i n t e r e s t i s in ~ g e t t i n g informationout ;" th is meant put t ing information out in the press?Now, did you have personal conversations with Haldeman aboutthese matters - - on or about the same day as these memoranda?

Did Haldeman get back to you? I f he did send memorandaback to you where would they be f i led? As fa r as yourf i l ing system was concerned was there any basis forkeeping t rack of these requests of Haldeman?

NoW, going on in t ime, short ly a f t e r your conversationswith Connally actual ly the next day - - the IRS hadarranged an interview, but not with O' Brien, ra ther withhis son; a memorandum ref lec t ing th is was prepared and wehad a copy shown to you. Had you ever seen tha t or anythingl ike i t?

Did you find out tha t the IRS had arranged a meetingwith the son rather than the fa ther?

On August 11, 1972, according to Ehrlichman's notes of ameeting between yourself , Ehrlichman and Haldeman whichtook place at 9:40 a.m., evidently a t Camp David , there isa notation t ha t the -IRS-O'Brien- was discussed , and thereference - - apparently to you speaking - - MShal l I ca l lGeorge Shultz to get IRS?- - - Was t h i s , then, conversationabout st raightening out IRS? What was the resolut ion asfar as insuring t ha t O'Brien, Sr . , ra ther than J r . , beinterviewed? Did you discuss with others the i n t e res t orimportance of interviewing him before the RepublicanConvention?

Now , in any conversations regarding O' Brien and the IRS,did you know of the IRS o f f i c i a l posi t ion which was todelay interviews or other action invo l ving pol i t ical lyknown individuals unt i l a f t e r the elect ion?


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J

5.

Now, on August 17th Mr . O'Brien was interviewed; wereyou br ie fed on t h i s by anyone? Ehrlichman? Shultz?This Roger Barth (did you ever discuss the O'Brienmatter direct ly with Barth?)?

There were a number of reports prepared of the O' Brieninterview; ve have sent some of these to you throughMr. Miller and I wil l show them to you now on e by one;did you ever receive one of these? Did you ever readone? Do you know of any others a t the White House whoreceived any of these reports or subs tant ia l ly s imi larreports? Do you know of any effor ts to release anyinformation coming from O' Brien in h is interviews to thepress? By whom were such e f fo r t s made?

Now, the Republican Convention took place from August 21to August 25; were there discussions then - - to which youwere a party - - concerning O'Brien ' s tax s i tuat ion?Or discussions of which you were aware?

According to Ehrlichman ' s notes of a meeting between youan d him on August 26 , 1972, a t 11:20 a.m. , apparentlya t San Clemente ( this would be the day a f t e r the conventionended) there i s the notation as to O'Brien tha t the ~ p r e s s (is) invest igat ing tax re turns ." Had e f for t s been made tonotify the press about O' Brien ' s s i tuat ion? Were you thenmaking such ef for ts? Who from the press?

Now, a f t e r O'Brien 's interview the IRS was requested toreview his tax returns and prepare reports; and they didtha t . We have supplied Mil ler with several of thesean d I show them to yo u s ingly.Did you ever receive one? Did you ever read one?Know whether anyone else a t the White House did?Discuss th is information with Ehrlichrnan, Shultz ,Barth? Did yo u ever receive a memorandum fromEhrlichman digest ing or summarizing this? Anyeffor ts to "put out" th is information?

In the course of th is period Ehrlichman - - probably whilehe was a t San Clemente - - had a telephone conversationwith Shultz, Walters and Barth, which conversation con-cerned O' Brien and became acrimonious?

At the same time Ehrlichman was dealing direct ly withBarth - - unknown to Walters; were you aware of this?Aware of who the off ic ia l s were a t IRS with whom Barthwas dealing?


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6.

Now, there are Ehrlichman notes of what appears to havebeen a conversation between the two of you, aboard AirForce One on September 5, 1972, where there i s thereference: "Anonymous: to Hart re Hughes and O'Brien,warn Senator McGovern." I take it tha t was a referenceto Mr. Gary Hart and a discussion about indicat ing toMcGovern that O' Brien had problems.

Did you discuss using th i s route?WAS anything done in that connection?

There i s also the reference in these same notes as to"Mrs. Westwood . " Was she referred to in the same context?Did anything happen?

Then there i s the reference in these same notes to "Getsomeone in LAS Vegas do i t" and "Ask how much he 9 0 ~ " Was Ehrlichroan indicat ing to you that he had a channelthrough Las Vegas to ge t information on O' Brien?Did you know anything about having secured information fromLas Vegas?

Now what appear to be the notes of a meeting between youand Ehrlichman on September 10, 1972, also note referencesto O'Brien, of the following nature :

-Larry O'Br ien worry him,- "Kalmbach, "O'Brien wil lworry," G o s s p l a n t , - "Bobby Baker blowing whistleon Larry O' Brien and o thers , "Get it to O'Brien - don ' t publ ish."These a l l appear to re l ate to conversations to in one wayor another use the IRS information? Can you explain howyou intended to "worry O' Brien? Why was Bobby Bakerto ass is t? Were there effo r t s to communicate with Baker - or actual communications?

There i s also the thought that you would not publishthe material on O'Brien but ge t it to him in some privateway? What discussions were there about this? In th i sregard it appears that Dean was to handle the matter?That Dean was to contact O'Brien through Duane Andreas?What actual ly happened here? Why Andreas?

Were there discuss i ons of te l l ing O'Brien about the taxproblem and gett ing him to dr op the Watergate c iv i l su i tin return for your not going ahead with h is c iv i l taxproblems?


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7 .

Now, by September 10, 1972, it appeared tha t IRS mightnot do anything on O' Brien. But there i s evidence tha ta t about th is same time there were discussions abouttha t l i s t of Democratic contr ibutors . Thus, on September 15,1972, you discuss with Haldeman the fac t tha t Dean was,according to Haldeman - - "moving ruthless ly on the in vest igat ion of McGovern people," an d Haldeman adds, "Chuck,Chuck has gone th rough , you know has worked on th e list,and Dean's working the , the thing through IRS.-Now were the effor ts regarding O'Brien l inked in any wayto t hese e f f o r t s ?

For example, was there any effo r t to use the IRS's inactionon on e matter to force action on another?Now , in September, there was some IRS inquiry intoO' Brien 's tax treatment of some stock he had owned in abrokerage company for which he had taken an ordinary loss .Did you know anything about th is issue? Any discussionabout the fact t ha t O'Brien would not face a criminall i ab i l i ty but probably would face a c iv i l l i ab i l i ty?

Infact , in April , 1973, an audi t was s tar ted of O'Brienon th is i ssue. What did you know about th is? Did youhave an y conversations about i t ?

In summary, you t r ied to get information from the IRS aboutO' Brien to use against him for pol i t i ca l purposes?

You believed t ha t IRS had been used against you - - but youknew tha t was wrong an d yet fe l t tha t it was legi t imateto do it against O'Brien?


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JaytheJ addi to-cprepared

fact memos for your


38/47

O' Brien - - AndreasAccording to Dean , Hi t che l l "las to approach Andreas who\'j'as a personal fr iend of l1itchell ' s

Mitchell \'1as to of fer the IRS dropping i t s intendedact ions i f O'Brien dropped the DNC su i t (sui tin i t i a ted by DNC and O' Brien 6/20/72)This story i s corroborated by Paul O'Brien .But

Andreas . through h is at torney, Edward Bennett "l i l l iams,has s ta ted t ha t he was never approached (al thoughMitchel l ' s logs show ca l l s to Andreas in October, 1972)Larry O'Brien s ta ted t ha t he was never approached onsuch a matter

This incident might be remembered in l i gh t of a counteract ionproposals in a Dean/Haldeman memo of 9/12/72CRP an d FCRP top f i le complaint for malicious abuseof process agains t O' Brien (or counterclaim to amendedDNC complaing)Stans to sue O' Brien for l ibe l for s ta tement to thepress tha t Stans funded the Watergate break-in with$114 , 000 in checks t ransmit ted to BarkerOther par t ies as pla in t i f f s were consideredComplaint to the Fair Campaign Prac t ices CommitteeComplaint re NcGovern fundraising through a DC corp.Note: No mention of O'Brien ' s personal a f fa i r s


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\'Ih i te House Knowledge re 0 ' Brien in 1/71

O' Brien formed NYC-PR firm in 1969O' Brien negot i a ted ,..-ith Maheu fo r $100 , 000 fee , b u t d idno t mate r i a l i zeDesaute ls formed DC-PR firmHandled Hughes i n t e r e s t sCaul f i e ld expresses concern re counter scandal andi ndica tes fo l l owing:

(1) Maheu d ea l t with Nixon f undr a i s e r , Vic Johnson(now deceased)(2 ) Na heu re ta ined former Congressman Pat H il l i nge r ,a f r iend o f Murray Chot i ner ' s( 3 ) l4aheu h i r ed former FBI agent Dick Danner , a nas soc ia t e o f former Sena t o r Smathers and professed

f r iend o f Rebozo(4) Clark Cl i f f o r d ' s f irm has r epresented h igheri n t e r e s t s i n DC

Rebozo repor ted t h a t Maheu had to l d him o f r e t a in ing O' Br i enBob Benne t t , son o f Senator Benn e t t , and head of t-Iu llen PR ,conf i rms O' Brien re ta inedHa l deman suggests a f t e r f ina l r epo r t from Bennet t t h a tDean and Colson meet r e l eaking appropr ia te informat ion


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-fOIA(b)3 - 26 usc 6103, Tax Information

NW#:36514

O'Brien - - McDonnell & Co., Inc .President McDonnell & Co., Inc. , a brokerage firmCondition of becoming PresidentPurchased 1000 sharesValued a t purchase - - $78,000December, 1969, surrendered shares - - no market value

Note:Mardian's calendar for Sept. 21 , 1972

JNM - l1ilbaok. Arthur J . Murray - O"Brien*** Harless was in NYC th e next day interviewing MurrayMardian's Calendar for Oct. 3, 1972Johnnie Yalters - JNM Discussion

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