women improve with age, science says so [episode 7] wired for success tv

7/29/2019 Women Improve With Age, Science Says So [Episode 7] Wired For Success TV

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~ Wired for Success TV ~Mastering the 7 Areas of Life

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Presented by

Melanie Gabriel & Beryl Thomas

[Episode 7]

Women Improve with Age, Science

says So
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Women Improve With Age_ Science Says So - Wired For Success[Episode 7]

[0:00:13]

Beryl: Hello and welcome to another episode of http://www.wiredforsuccess.tv. I am Beryl Thomas and Im joined by mycolleague, Melanie Gabriel. Say hi, Melanie.

Melanie: Hello, everyone.

Beryl: Wired for Success is here to help you to master the seven areas oflife to create a life that is everything that you want it to be. And for which,you are already innately wired. For more information of what those sevenareas are, then just head over to our introductory blog atWiredforSuccess.TV.

Today, our very special guest is psychologist and neuroscientist, Dr. LyndaShaw. Let me first just say that Lynda makes science fun and fascinating.She also makes it relevant to our everyday lives, in relationships, inbusiness, and in the workplace. Lynda has an extremely varying

background that includes being a researcher, a lecturer, an entrepreneur,and even an author of childrens books.

Fascinated by brain function, Lyndas research has focused on brainimpairment and aging. And her interest in spirituality lends itself to herresearch into consciousness and emotion. Today, Lynda is going toenlighten us on the new role for women as they past the child-rearing yearsand extremely powerful impact that they are right to have on society.

So hello and welcome, Lynda.

Lynda: Hello. Thank you.

Beryl: Lovely to have you with us. So Lynda, can I just start by asking youwhat is it that makes Western women who are past their baby-makingyears seemingly invisible to the rest of society?

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Lynda: I think what youve just said about past their baby-making years isthe prejudice that women now faced with in the West. If you look at theindigenous societies, they have women who are older who are goingthrough the menopause, they look after their grandchildren. Of course, inour society, thats what we used to do. My grandmother was an integralpart of my upbringing whilst my mother went to work.

But these days, that no longer happens. So therefore, women as they getolder seem to have lost their role in life. But what were underestimating iswe got more and more and more and more and more people are gettingolder and older. So therefore, we are not aware of their usefulness beyondlooking after children or in fact, for women looking after children which isnonsense because actually, women are hormonally geared up to be in their

best possible place after the menopause to embrace business, to embracecharities, to embrace self-development, and to really grow and inspireothers.

Beryl: So, what is it that makes them really powerful at this point? What isit that thats going on that makes them gives them this ability to be sopowerful in society?

Lynda: OK. Well, we are our behavior is based on our hormones. Forinstance, at 6 to 12 weeks gestation when a fetus is 6 to 12 weeks indevelopment, we get to be depending on the genetic code whether thebaby is male or female, we get a surge of hormones, estrogen,progesterone, and testosterone, so on and so forth. And of course aswomen, we get the lion share of the estrogen. So then we start to see atthat point in development, we see the laying down of the genitalia, what wecalled into which gender we are. And also, there are some structuredifferences going on in the brain.

Now, these structure differences are quite controversial because there are

many scientists who say one thing and others will say the opposite. Sowere still investigating this very much. But we do believe that we lay downa larger communication system when were female and a larger limiting[0:03:47] [Phonetic] system which is all to do with emotions. So we aremore emotionally in tuned with people.



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So there are structures of different systems that we believe happen. Andthen if you fast forward it a little bit, when that child is born and then theyreached puberty, theres another big surge of hormone going on dependingon which gender the child is. So for a female, we get another big dump ofestrogen. Were all over the place and we very badly need to communicate.We very badly need to talk to our girlfriends.

I can remember when I was at school, I had a best friend of course, and mybest friend and I would talk all day long and then be on the phone allevening. It was vital that I spoke to my friend in the evening. And my fatherused to be beside himself saying, Why are you on the phone all eveningwhen youre with her all day? But thats how we are. Were geared up tocommunicate. We have to communicate and it all goes back to when wewere in at the cave mouth and we needed our sisters to help us look after

our young in case of danger.

So we have to belong to these female communities and to be accepted bythem. And I dont know about you guys but I can remember sometimesbeing ostracized by a group of girls in the playground at school and it wasphysically painful. Its physically painful not to actually belong to the group,your peer group because we are hardwired for this stuff.

And then of course, another big surge of hormones happens when we haveour babies and we make babies. Some women choose not to, which istotally fine. But we still have these hormones going on. So structurally, ourbrains are geared up to be better communicators and better at assessingout emotions if you like, understanding people very quickly by looking atthem.

And then we have our babies and were cuddling up little ones and werenurturing them and we are stimulating things like oxytocin. Oxytocin is afantastic chemical that makes us want to cuddle more. And the more wecuddled the more oxytocin we produce. And so, we get this wonderful

feedback going on which is a feedback thats constant in the brain and thisis whats going on with the chemicals.

And then the little treasures grow up and they stop wanting to cuddle us somuch, which hurts a little bit but we get used to it. What that means is, westill need our cuddles but theyre less. So were having less of this surge ofoxytocin going on.



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So do you know what? We then start to look at our young and we go, Well,youre OK. I dont need to be clocking after you so much. I still love youunconditionally but now you can go off and do what you do. Im going to bebusy somewhere else now. So because were still hardwired to be thisnurturing, emotional, communicative person, we then look somewhere elseto direct our energies.

So then we start to look at charities or environmental things or businessand we reinvent ourselves or were starting a business or we develop thebusiness that we were in before we had our children or whilst we werebringing up our children. So were growing. And then at the same time oraround about then, the menopause is happening. And remember that themenopause [0:06:48] [indiscernible]is a very slow shift over time.

So its not instant. Its not overnight. Its a very slow shift. And we have themenopause so we stop our menstrual cycle which means that we no longerhave the peaks of our hormones and setting us crazy each month.

So we become amazing women who have been [inaudible]a few timeswho really get it, who really understand what life is about. They have theenergy now and their focus to look outside of their family. And theyre nolonger structured to the hormonal cycle. We are so great post menopause.Were fantastic creatures.

Beryl: I can see what youre seeing here particularly this business. Itseems like we become more emotionally balanced so we can be a little bitmore objective in situations which would be very helpful in a businesssituation. In fact, in any situation of course.

Lynda: Absolutely. And especially these days when there is more colorfulwomen in business. My personal belief is that one has to be careful of thisin that we are not just relaboring the group of people who are supposed to

be more powerful in business, shall we say. I think whats happened andparticularly in the 80s, we had a very masculine way of running a business.But that didnt and it was mainly run by men granted but it was amasculine way which is I mean its different to men. The masculine way ismore spreadsheets, redundancies, bottom line cut, cut, cut, all that weredoing things.



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But the female way of doing business is far more nurturing and developing.The person who may not be performing properly or something so that inactual that theyre growing a business in terms of development asopposed to cutting and being a little bit austere.

So for me, more women in business means actually more of a feminineway of doing business which I know a lot of men are very capable of doingas well. But that doesnt mean to say that Im mindful because I like theidea or Im passionate about the idea that we dont emasculate our youngmen. We need to involve. And both genders can be the nurtures bothgenders can develop business. Both genders can do all these things butthere is a masculine or feminine way of doing things. Does that makesense?

Beryl: It makes a huge amount of sense. Did you want to come in there,Melanie?

Melanie: Well, there is a question thats in the back of my mind. So bearingin mind what you were saying here, the women who for whatever reason,perhaps decide not to have babies or certainly, delay babies for a couple ofdecades and perhaps focus on their careers, are they channeling thatnurturing that natural nurturing spirit into the business or are we sayingthat if they follow the natural course of things where they have babies andthen the babies leave and then they have a bigger picture and start to takethat background skill out into the world, that theyre more effective later onrather than earlier on in the cycle?

Lynda: I think there is a pattern. One of the universities that Ive beenlecturing, the undergraduates, there is a definite pattern of the 20 roads,approximately 20 roads. The females who are far more energized andprogressive and are wanting to move forward at a great speed in theircareer, theyre on a path. Theyre absolutely on the path. The guys tend tobe a bit more relaxed about it.

Now, one can interpret this in many ways. But one of the things I thinkmaybe going on is the chaps know that in their early 20s, theyre probablygoing to be doing the same job until for the 40 years because thats whattheir fathers done or their grandfathers done. So they said, OK. Another40 years. I can chill [0:10:46] [Phonetic] about this. Whereas women whoare now able to grow and develop in business, they feel as if they are in a



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hurry because of the hormone fairy. The hormone fairy, she doesnt takeprisoners.

A lot of women dont want to have children at all. I think thats cool. Butthere is something that happens that I have noticed and especially with thePhD students who around about 30 years, that mark, when the female getsto about 30, even if she doesnt want children or thought she doesnt wantchildren, there is some hormonal shift that go, Whoa! Hang on a minute.Whats happening here? I need to make babies now. And Im only sayingthis out of experience and what I have observed. This isnt out of myresearch.

But there is a sense of urgency in the young woman to embrace her careerand make a stand in the workplace so that when she can have some

maternity leave and get back to the work part-time or full-time dependingon her wishes or go back to it after when the baby is a little bit bigger andtake up the position as a stronger contributor for somebody on the firstround of the ladder.

So I think there is a bit of a time issue going on for a woman. And I havediscussed this a lot especially with the students who want to becomeclinical psychologist. Its a long road to study clinical psychology and by thetime they finished and are qualified, they can be closed to that 30-year-oldage. So, its an interesting one.

So I think in terms of this nurturing thing, we are still hardwired andhormonally at the mercy of whats going on with our reproductive cycle. Butas I say, that doesnt mean to say were imprisoned by it because somewomen choose not to have children at all.

Beryl: I can really relate to that, Lynda. And I had a career until I was 30and then at 30, I knew I needed to have a baby. And now, when thosebabies are over 6-foot tall, I know that I want to do something else. In fact,

Ive always known that. In all these years, Ive been privileged to be mainlyat home with them but Ive always known there was something in me thatmy time was coming. Ive been biding my time for this moment. So, I canabsolutely relate to that.

Lynda: Yeah.



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Melanie: Its funny

Lynda: Go on.

Melanie: No, carry on. Carry on.

Lynda: I was just going to say, I mean I chose my hormone fairy startedgoing, Hello, Im here. when I was about 27. But I wasnt blessed withbecoming pregnant for about two and a half years. In fact, I had my firstbaby when I was 30 as well. Its strange. You just creep up to be this age.One could say its society has make that happened but I dont know so. Ithink our behavior has to do hugely with our hormones.

Melanie: Well, I was going to say that I have a pretty similar story because

I was very focused on my career and determined to make my mark. In fact,the last thing on my mind were babies. I would have been quite happy notto have any. And when an unplanned baby happened at 32, I shockedmyself how partial I was towards him. And even the thought of havingmore.

And of course, when he reached a certain age, I had no problems kickinghim out of the nest although one or two people including my mother thoughtI was a bit harsh but I now understand from what you were saying.

Lynda: Yeah. We do I mean our children are very good at allowing us tokick them out of the nest because we have to go through the teenage yearsfirst. And lets face it, they can be a tad pestering. So even the mostbeautifully behaved teenager still can be rather testing which isunderstandable because theyre growing, theyre developing, they aretrying to make their mark and trying to cut the umbilical cord once and forall. And so, they do a good job of conditioning us to kick them out.

Beryl: Its perfect, isnt it? Nature has organized it perfectly.

Lynda: Yes. Yeah, absolutely, absolutely. And now, weve got thesewonderful opportunities when a woman in her 50s. Now, she can do somuch more. And of course, youve got the other side of the coin wherebecause longevity is now something that were all getting used to the idea,we are getting old and there are more and more people reaching a 100.That means that from the university or apprenticeship or whatever one



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chooses to do, so approximately early 20s to their 60s, thats 40 yearsproducing work or contributing to the economy.

And then theyve got more 40 years of not working. Youre thinking, Hangon a minute. This isnt right. You cant work for 40 years and expect not towork for the next 40 years. And so, have food in your belly and a roof overyour head and have fun in life. So I think we are now were having torethink that actually weve all got to keep working regardless of our genderand feel healthy enough.

Beryl: Indeed.

Lynda: But to actually enjoy the work that were doing and try not to bedrudgery. And I think thats highly important and a very topical issue

topical subject at the moment.

Melanie: Shall I quickly just get this one in?

Beryl: Yeah, go on Melanie.

Melanie: Because this is so thinking about today how men are becominga lot more nurturing, theres a lot of overlap between the male and thefemale roles now. And so, Im wondering, bearing in mind how malleableand flexible the brain is, does this mean that there are some adjustmentstaking place in the male brain as they begin to embrace more of whattraditionally seen as the female roles?

Lynda: No, because for the brain to change, it takes many, many, many,many thousands of years. So it wont happen instantly. But we maybethey see as nurturing things inside men are always being there. Theyve

just never been allowed to show it because theyve always been taught tobe the breadwinner. And maybe theyve been nurturing. Maybe they shewould rather spend more time with their children but they leave the house

at six in the morning and theyre back at 8:00 oclock at night and dont seethem.

So maybe that actually, thats not how men always want to be. Maybe theyfelt as if its all a huge burden to fill this big breadwinner and they onlyrespond or the person who is responsible for their family. So there wont



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be a change in way that our brains are in the immediate future. We have avery slow process.

But I think there is another side that women are not necessarily facing up toand that is that I was speaking to some women recently who wereprofessing to have it all. I think thats a tough one. To have it all, I stillbelieve there is a compromise. And the women are very, very protective oftheir young. Thats how we are. Thats how we have to be.

So for us to give over the major role of bringing our children up to ourpartners, maybe we dont actually want to do that but maybe we do. Butsomehow, if we are going to have this professed have it all, someone isgoing to be there looking after the children so that we have if we cantmake it to sports day or were not there when theyre bullied, thats the time

when a woman is like, My baby wants me. Im the mother.

So we do get quite possessive about these things. So theres a lot ofbalancing up going on and theres a lot of a woman needs to look in themirror and very honestly say, What are my priorities? And whatever ourpriorities, theres no right or wrong. But the priorities are what she needs toconsider and then work towards that.

Beryl: And what Im hearing from what youre saying today Lynda isactually, in a sense, we can have it all. Its just that its sectioned up giventhat we are so powerful when we get to this past child-rearing ages. If wecan be patient and know that that time is coming, when were free of ourduties at home as it were, maybe women who have got young childrencould be find it a little bit easier to put aside their career knowing thatactually, with the power of the internet, career options or business options,choices are very much more than they ever were.

Lynda: Yeah.

Beryl: For someone for my age, at 30, I could have been doing this kind ofbusiness because all this wasnt available but the internet has changedthings so much that it actually gives women a huge amount more choice tocreate a business.

Lynda: Absolutely. I think weve got to be very careful because there areso many young women out there who have got fantastic energy and



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incredibly innovative and creative. And the last thing I want to do is eversquashed. If thats where youre going, youre going to go there and dowhat you do and maybe have a compromise when it comes to a point, atleast get home have helping out or whatever.

But equally, for the women who feel thats a huge pressure that societyexpects that of her then perhaps shed feel quite relieved to think, Youknow what, I actually would rather stay at home and have my babies andmaybe have an internet business. Maybe do something multilevelmarketing. There are plenty of companies out there where she can dosomething to keep the pot boiling, to keep her confidence up becausethats another thing when a woman is at home, it diminishes herconfidence. So thats not a good thing either.

So you see what I mean? A woman needs to be honest with herself. Thatthere is another thing that I found when Ive been talking to women is thatIve been speaking to the women who have been the major breadwinner intheir family and the husband is being more of the house husband lookingafter the family, which is great. And it suited the couple very, very well. AndIm speaking about several people here who I have spoken to.

And then they would come to a separation and the fathers are going forcustody and because the women at work. Now, thats the thing that werenot actually speaking about very much in our major moment. And what dowe do when the men want custody of the children? And actually, they haveevery right. They are the one being there. They are the nurturists. They arethe one whos been there all the time. What can a woman cope with that?

Beryl: Thats interesting.

Lynda: Isnt it interesting? Again, it depends a lot on the woman that weretalking to. And it depends a lot on the individual or hugely on the individualof course. But its something else to put in the pot to consider.

Beryl: But youre coming back to that something innate in us that says, weneed to be the number one carers maybe for some people some womenwould feel that. I think I would. I would have felt that strongly.

Lynda: Yeah. I mean for me personally, I love my work and I want to workuntil the day I drop. I have no intention of retiring. I want to work and work



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and work because Im having such a good time doing it. But if I had a familyor my children were small and my husband had a chance of havingconstantly with the children, I would hate it.

Beryl: Yeah.

Lynda: Thats my personal belief.

Beryl: Yeah.

Lynda: For some women, that might be simple.

Melanie: Actually, I have seen situations where the woman has been themajor breadwinner. She starts to produce babies. He continues to look

after them. And then suddenly something kicks in. She now wants to be athome with her babies and wants him to go out to work. And hes notinterested.

Lynda: Wow! See, another one that goes on the pot that they both want tostay at home. Yeah. So it is quite a complicated mix. And I think now, wevegot so many choices. We do the thing is to be as honest as we can withourselves and our own circumstances and not feel pressurized to doanything we dont want to do. Thats probably for the privileged in theWestern world, there are obviously very many countries who dont havethose options.

Beryl: And it is a culture thing too, isnt it? This changes with differentcultures would you say?

Lynda: Yeah, yeah, there is a change in culture. Definitely. We can seethat very clearly. But we have to be careful because there is no right orwrong. Again, everyone is doing the right thing for themselves.

Beryl: And thats what it boils down to, doesnt it? Essentially, that beingOK with your own choice.

Lynda: Yeah. If youre blessed with choice and we certainly are in thiscountry. Were blessed with choice. And sometimes as I say, thats typicalthat some women dont want the choice. It would be easier actually if we



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just went back to doing our typical roles. I think were hideous. But somepeople think that way.

And again, Im only speaking because of my research and I talk to a hugeamount of people on these topics and people got some very strong viewsand very different. So, we have to just as I say, look in the mirror and bevery honest with ourselves.

Beryl: And that takes a lot of confidence, doesnt it? Some womenbecause theyre out of the workplace dont find it easy to then start to thinkabout going back in. They dont necessarily see the skill set as somethingthat is valuable. That they can contribute. It can be quite scary especiallywith technology if they havent kept up to date with some kind oftechnology.

Lynda: Absolutely right. I think for a woman, her confidence can besquashed very easily. And I know some women who have a couple ofchildren and then theres a big gap and theyre so afraid of going backworkplace. I have another couple, if they started their baby-making earlyenough. So like the cream too and then too later. Obviously, she did havea work all the way through. But a lot of women do reproduce again to stayout of the workplace because its scary.

But I think thats something that we have to think about and this goes formen and women is that as we get older, we are slightly slower at learningbut the healthy brain no matter what its age actually enjoys learning. Itenjoys developing. It enjoys embracing new things. And we are all capableof learning and taking on new technology. We just might need to bechurned a little bit more than younger people as we get older.

Beryl: OK. So I notice that with my sons. They pick up this technologyreally, really quickly and its blah, blah, blah, blah, and its done where Imight take quite a lot longer. But once Ive got it, then Ive got it. So thats

what youre really saying, isnt it? All skills are learnable. Its just that somemight take a little longer than others.

Lynda: Absolutely. And the other thing to consider is that from now on,really, really from now on, all of us no matter how young or old we are,were going to have to learn and learn and relearn because technology ismoving so fast. I mean when I first started using the computer, those skills I



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learned maybe redundant now. I mean I touch a screen and I toucheverything. I forget Im supposed to use a mouse sometimes when Im inan old computer.

Beryl: Yes. I know. Ive done that too.

Lynda:And its very much like that. So I think with technology, we are or allof us are going to have to keep relearning.

Beryl: Its interesting. Just a couple of days ago, I met an old lady. Shes90. Shes very shortly 90 and she was out at this philosophical eveningtaking part in the discussion. And I went and sit talk to her and I said,Whats your secret? Youre so vibrant. Youre so effervescent. Youre justfiring all cylinders. She said, Well, I keep busy and active. And she said,

It would be a bit of a shame when I cant read anymore or do my emails.And I said, Do your what? And she said, Well, Ive got family all over theworld. Ive got to look at my emails everyday and keep in touch with them.

Lynda: Excellent.

Beryl: Thats a case in point, isnt it?

Lynda: I love it. I mean my mother is 83 and shes on Facebook andemailing. I just love it. Its absolutely superb. And so, we can. We canrelearn all the time. But youre talking about 90-year-olds. I was speakingwith a group of women who are very elderly and I was talking about theempty nest syndrome and when our children leave us.

And one of the ladies said, she was in her early 90s, she said, You know,it happens twice. And I said, What do you mean? She said, When yourgrandchildren leave the nest. I thought whoa! I havent even thought aboutthat because she was really close to her grandchildren bringing them upand then they stop the cuddles and they stop they move off and its like,

yes, shes had to go through it twice. And thats an interesting one, isnt it?

And shes just wonderful. Shes into everything. Shes into philosophy asthe person you just spoke talked to. She goes to groups. Shed forget thebingo and the coached tours and all that stuff. She ran this bingo on herpost. Shes doing some really, really good stuff. Shes a fantastic lady.Thats what Im thinking.



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Beryl: Gosh.

Melanie: So reading between the lines with what youre saying, theimplication here is that we need to reverse the institutional perception thatolder women dont have a lot of value. We need to change peoplesperception. We need to do a kind of a mindset reeducation here of theexpectation that older women cease to be valuable. And also, we need tobe alert to the not underestimate the importance of hormonal shifts andthe impact that they have on us. What other things do we need to be awareof?

Lynda: I think because we are hardwired to be these wonderfulcommunicators and also to work out emotionally whats going on with

people. Were very women are very, very quick to work out if there isproblem. Theyre almost spooky. I mean you could see what we were bornto the stake because really, we have so many [0:29:14] [indiscernible]and we seem so intuitive in the way we see OK. Ill give you an instance.

What if youre going to a party with a man and youre in the same party inthe same room talking to people in the same room talking to people in theroom, walking in the room. And then youre going home in the car and youknow what women love to do? They love to sit in the car and have apostmortem. They want to dissect the whole evening, right? Thats what wedo.

We love saying, Well, what did you think about this? What did you thinkabout that? And hes driving. So its his turn to drive that evening. Hesdriving. She sits in there and goes, Did you see John and Sara had a rile?

And he goes, Really? She said, Didnt you notice? They went oh, OK.Leave that one. Then you might move on and say something like, Did yousee that chap in the corner who was trying to avoid the woman on the otherside of the room? Its so obvious theyre having an affair. What you are

talking about woman? And in the end, by the time you get home, you think,we must have been at different party.

Melanie: Exactly.

Lynda: Isnt it true?



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Melanie: Yeah, all the time.

Lynda: Yeah. So the guys dont say this stuff. The guys are very quick atsaying things that involve fear. They make a lot its [0:30:24][indiscernible]. It will very much alert to fear and he will rise to thechallenge and fight to a fly. But for a woman, she sees so much more. Andthats incredibly valuable thing in business. Thats incredible when yourewith clients or corporates or associates or employees or employers, all of it,and just working out if theres a problem.

And by talking it through straight away or drawing them out, the problem isgone. Whereas a chap would probably not see a problem until its come toa head or there is some real big issue there and then hide behind emailing.Where a woman will actually go up to the person and say, Hey, I can feel

there is something going on here. Give me a clue. And we talk it throughand its nipped in the bud.

Thats brilliant in business. Thats brilliant. Men go, Oh my God! Its the Eword. Emotion. But there isnt a single thing, not a single decision wemake that isnt an emotionally-based decision ever and then we justify itwith logic afterwards. So for women, were just fantastic with this emotionalchondron that is so valuable and we communicate it properly.

Beryl:And thats what many would call womens intuition.

Lynda: Yeah. Yeah, thats right. Thats what we call it. But were justhardwired to be more efficient with that sort of thing. And thats the truth.We really are and you can see it. So for us in business, were great. Wereally are a valuable contributor.

Beryl: And everything in life really boils down to relationships, doesnt it?And relationship is boiled down to communication. So and women in aconversation I had with you before, you were saying what good connectors

women are.

Lynda:Absolutely. I mean theres been a plethora of networking groups inthe UK in the last ten years or so. I think its to do with a lot of people redundancies. A lot of people are working at portfolio now so they neededto network for their businesses because there are so much many moreSMEs out there. So networking is vital. And that doesnt come from social



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media. And social media is great. It has its place. And I do it all, LinkedIn,Facebook, Twitter, I do do all of that stuff.

But the most value comes from actually having a relationship, an eye toeye contact with people. Again, eye to eye contact, we stimulate oxytocin inthe system and well, we stimulate trust because of instinct of woman, right?So, you actually you will trust suppliers or associates or businesscolleagues if you are actually having a proper relationship with them interms of eye to eye contact, shaking hands, talking to them face to faceand making time for them.

Beryl: How interesting.

Melanie: So its really important to be yourself as a woman in your

relationships rather than just reflecting how its done in the male typeenvironment.

Lynda: To make the mistake of trying to do it the masculine way is thebiggest mistake a woman can make. Again, Im using this masculine-feminine label, Im shifting from one to the other here. We can do thespreadsheets. We can do the redundancy. We can do the cutting as well.But its not the feminine way of doing things.

But for us in business, we dont have to be fluffy or girly but we dont haveto look like a man either. We can do it we can be women but be efficient.

And I think that thats why probably the days of Margaret Thatcher. I meanlove her or hate her, whatever your politics but she is formidable. And shewas masculine in the way she do things because she was pioneering, thefirst woman to be our Prime Minister. She fixed the problem in a verymasculine manner which is understandable. We dont have to do that now.Weve moved on from that.

Melanie: So, what would you say to men who think that were trying to start

a rebellion?

Lynda: How are we going to start a rebellion if were trying to embraceboth men and women in business? I mean lets face it. I mean wereblessed that we dont know what a war is like anymore in this in ourcountry really. And weve had generations whove been brought up aboutunderstanding what famine is, what hardship is, what bloodshed is, and



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that which were so lucky and lets please that it may last forever. But so we havent needed the men to go out there and be heroes althoughthere were plenty of women in war time who are heroines.

So again, men dont have to rise to this Neanderthal beating people in thehead and stuff. So there shouldnt need to have a revolution.

Melanie: So basically, men dont really need to feel threatened by womenwaking up because there are some men who still get a sense of theirpurpose from being the hunter gatherer.

Lynda: Yeah.

Melanie:And again, were back to mindset shifts again, arent we?

Lynda: Yeah, we are. I mean there is still also there is a very there is acertain section of a male society where they do still they use sarcasm thatcan be quite derogatory to women which is very old fashion. Its really oldfashion. Get with the program. And weve all moved on from that now. Sothey got to learn that there are certain things that we wont accept anymoreand we dont have to accept anymore.

But as I say, Im certainly not emasculating men at all. I will both men andwomen can contribute equally. I think when it comes to the workplace, weshould not be judged on our gender or our race or our age, it should bepurely of what we can contribute that is of value.

Melanie: Exactly.

Beryl: OK. So, can I just take you in to the field of personal relationshipsfor a moment because I remember reading maybe a couple of years ago, amagazine article that highlighted the fact that most divorces over the age of50 were initiated by women?

Lynda: Yeah.

Beryl: Would you like to expound on that point?

Lynda: I think there is some statistical evidence that demonstrate that thatwomen I think again, women have gone through the nurturing, the oxytocin,



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the hormones, absolutely everything is settling down and theyre lookingaround for a bigger picture and where they can be of use because theywant to be of use. They want to contribute and be valuable and valid, feelvalid.

So they actually, probably they dont feel very valuable sometimes if theirrelationship with their husband or partner is no longer as it used to be. Andso, they will not be that apologetic about wanting to change and leave. So Ithink yes, I can see why more women instigate divorce. I mean it used tobe the thought that it was men wanting to go off with younger women. Letsreproduce again and all that stuff.

But I actually dont think it was. There is certainly that amount there arepeople in society who do that but I think there are more women who are

discontent who will end a relationship now than the men who would go offand have a very younger woman. I think actually a lot of men preferred tobe married and have that comfort whereas a woman isnt afraid maybe asmuch to go off and do their own thing in todays society.

Melanie: I was going to say, its interesting how many women who wake upand want to do this and the man cant fathom what shes all about. Whyshe wants to go off? Its just like he hasnt been aware at all.

Lynda:I think also, women are geared up very much to reinvent. We

reinvent male and female reinvent at puberty. They changed. And thenfor a woman, she constantly reinvents from them on because of hormones,because of like if she goes and has babies, she reinvents.

I mean even in the school year, you can reinvent yourself to know that yourchild is like 9 and 7 so September, theyre going to be going to school thatyear and that year. And then the following year, its all changed. Theyre 10and 8 and then theyre going to senior school before theyre even 13 and11. And change every year, we reinvent. We change constantly.

So I think we have been brought up to being used to reinvention. When aman leaves university or apprenticeship or whatever, starts his job andhistorically, has gone through very stereotypically until retirement. Andthats it. And the next change is actually, he wants his pipe and slippers. Sofor a woman its like, we say your face Beryl, its no good, isnt it? [0:39:15][Inaudible].



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Beryl: Im off.

Lynda: Let me learn something new. Let me get involved. And I thinkhistorically again, we have been creatures, females have been creaturesthat reinvent. Men dont as much. That is changing because men are beingmade redundant. The workplace is changing. Men are having to relearn,retrain as technology moves on. So there are men who are reinventing a lotmore than they used to. But thats just me in the tongue in cheekstereotypical way.

Beryl: So in a worst case scenario where a woman felt like she had thiscalling in her to reinvent as you call it, to go out and do something to bemore to get more involved in society because shes a connector and

needs her girlfriends and thats what youve been suggesting. If shedoesnt, if she holds back, if fear because there only going to be fear thatholds her back, whats the worst case scenario that happens there?

Lynda: Well, with fear of course, there are basically two emotions somesay, not everybody but some say. There are two emotions, our love of fear.

And were in either one or the other at any one time. So if a woman isfeeling isolated and alone because lets face it, if she isnt home and iswanting to reinvent herself but is afraid to, she will become more isolatedand hideaway.

Now, depression is the second biggest problem worldwide now and its theepitome of that isolation, low self-esteem and low self-worth. Its a very,very big topic and one that I feel very, very strongly about because itssomething that we should all be taking responsibility for.

Lets say, youve got a friend who is low or down then text them, Hey, whatyou did the other day was really good. Lets be kind to one another. Letsstart being a community again and not isolating people. And whats

absolutely devastating is that our children and teenagers suffered fromdepression as well. And that is just weve all got to do something aboutthis.

But to go back to your question, women who are afraid of reinventingthemselves and theyre afraid of actually reaching out and telling anybodythats what they want to do. I really strongly suggest one of the greatest



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things they can do is join some kind of working group or something and justget out there and exercise because any kind cardiovascular exercise likewalking will help us both mentally and physically for our health to start with.

But if we work in a group, we will then start to communicate and we willhave a small community that we begin to relate to. And then we can start togrow. And then we can start to feel less frightened. And its those babysteps and you dont have to take ginormous steps. Its that little baby stepsto actually evolve and just feel better about yourself and who knows? Andshe starts talking to people and you might have this light bulb momentwhere somebody says something and you go, Thats it! Thats what I wantto do. Im going to do that. And by talking it through, we gain moreconfidence to do that.

So Im very strong on us being a part of a community that isolation killspeople and kills peoples slowly in its agony. So we need to get out theremore. And I know thats easier said than done for some people but justeven walking to the shops and talking to the same person in a store everyday, just start to get people outside and get out of the house. Does thatmake sense?

Beryl: It makes perfect sense. And Im really glad you touched on theexercise because I noticed for myself going to a gym and going to a classwhen Im interacting with other people in a class and we have a laugh anda joke, it makes it it seems to take the pain of the weight lifting away fromme when were all having a bit of fun. And of course, those feel goodhormones are pumping out like mad, dont they? Dopamine and serotonin?

Lynda:Absolutely, absolutely. And the other thing with laughter and havingfun is that we start looking outwards. So we are not looking within intoourselves. We are not being introvert because when we are isolated orwere feeling low or depressed and I dont use the word lightly but a lot ofpeople are getting depressed, were looking inwards. Always looking within.

So if we can get out there and have some fun, we have a respite.

Now, some people are low because of some very big issues, bereavementor divorce. There are some very big stuff going on but so its not a fix butits a respite. So if you can get outside and have a little bit of fun andlaughter, it just keeps you a little a moment to refocus and get things in a



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better priority so that you might start climbing way back up again to ahealthier mentality.

Beryl:And as you say, start to build confidence in yourself because youremaking connections.

Lynda: Thats right. Thats right. Its absolutely essential. Its essential thatwe are we belong to a small group.

Beryl: And Melanie and I are great believers in if you take the first stepthen somehow the universe just starts to join with you and helps you withthe next step and who knows who you might meet and where you might gofrom that.

Im mindful of the time, Lynda. Were eating up your time and its beenabsolutely fascinating. I know that you have other interesting topics that wewant to come back to with and have a chat with you about because youre

just a rich source of information.

Is there anything you would like to finally ask, Melanie?

Melanie: No, Im fine.

Lynda:Sorry, go on.

Beryl: Something else you want to say, Lynda?

Lynda: I was just going to say we are as a society, tend to take ourselvestoo seriously. So just lighten up. Its fun. Life goes very quickly. Clich, oldclich but its true. It goes very quickly. And I just wanted to say that Ivespent a lot of my life trying to be very good at whatever I do and Ivedecided, you know what, Im just going to have fun now. So Ive joined aukulele band. I love music. I sing like a cat. I was awful. But hey, Im having

fun.

Beryl: Have you got it there with you now? Have got it there with you now,Lynda or do you want to come back and do a special musical spot anothertime?

Lynda: You so dont mean that.



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Beryl: Well, well audition you first I think before well unleash you on ouraudience, Lynda. OK. Lynda, where can people find you?

Lynda: Where can they find me? Im drlyndashaw.com sowww.drlyndashaw.com or [email protected]. So remember, itsLynda with a Y.

Beryl:And youre on Facebook, youre on Twitter?

Lynda: Yeah, Im on Facebook. Im on Twitter. Just Lynda Shaw and youllfind me.

Beryl: Fantastic.

Melanie: So can we take the liberty of telling the audience that you will beback to answer their questions or their comments from time to time?

Lynda: I would love to. I would love to.

Melanie: OK. So Lynda, this has been a very inspiring conversation. Thankyou so much for providing us with such a juicy subject of women maturingand aging beautifully.

Lynda: Thank you.

Beryl: If youre watching this on any kind of social media, then please feel

free to share it with all of your friends. Were Wired for Success TV at

Facebook and on Twitter.

https://www.facebook.com/WiredForSuccesstv

https://twitter.com/WiredSuccessTV

Lastly, wherever youre listening to this episode from, if you havent done

so already, please just shoot over to our main site

http://www.wiredforsuccess.tvand join our newsletter for updates and

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If you head over there, there will be a transcript of this episode too. We

reply to all comments and suggestions and we would love to hear from you.

So thank you for tuning in. Remember to tune in for the next episode of

Wired for Success where we help you to master the seven areas of life.

So from me Beryl and my co-host Melanie and from our interviewee Lynda

we bid you farewell and next time. So, if you would like to say good-bye.

Copyright: Wired For Success TV 2013

All rights reserved. No part of this transcript may be reproduced, stored in

a retrieval system, or transmitted in any form or by any means, electronic,mechanical, photocopying, recording, scanning, or otherwise, unless full

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All the material contained in this transcript is provided for educational and

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or outcomes resulting from the use of this material.

Whilst every attempt has been made to provide information that is both

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