blue mountains public inquiry - transcript -13 march 2020€¦ · transcript produced by epiq 1328...

.13/03/2020 (14) Transcript produced by Epiq

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INQUIRY UNDER SECTION 438U OF THE LOCAL GOVERNMENT ACT

BLUE MOUNTAINS CITY COUNCIL

Public Hearing

Held at Blue Mountains Cultural Centre

30-32 Parke Street, Katoomba, NSW

On Friday, 13 March 2020 at 10.00am(Day 14)

Before Mr Richard Beasley SC, Commissioner

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.13/03/2020 (14) T W ANDERSON x (Mr Glover)Transcript produced by Epiq

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THE COMMISSIONER: Mr Anderson, just come forward, thank you.

<TREVOR WILLIAM ANDERSON, sworn:

<EXAMINATION BY MR GLOVER:

MR GLOVER: Q. Would you state your full name, please?A. Trevor William Anderson.

Q. You were formerly employed by the council?A. Yes, I was.

Q. When did you commence that employment?A. 13 July 1998.

Q. When did you finish with the council?A. I was forced redundancy on 7 July 2019.

Q. I'm going to frame my questions in the period from about 2012 onwards, okay?A. Yes.

Q. What was your position within the council from 2012 going forward?A. By then I was a program leader, safety and risk.

Q. What was your day-to-day function in that role?A. I looked after the WHS programs, policies, procedures, provided advice to managers and staff; I looked after the workers compensation and the rehabilitation for council; and I was assisted in 2012 for a while by Michael Keyes, I think he was the risk management officer then at the time.

Q. In that answer you mentioned looking after WHS policies?A. Workplace health and safety policy and procedures, yes.

Q. When you say "looking after", what did that involve?A. Development where they were required, in consultation with staff and managers and updating existing policies, procedures and programs.

Q. When you say "developing", you were writing policy documents, were you?

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A. Yes.

Q. How would those policies develop? What would the process be? A. I'll just go back a little bit. I was brought on to council to provide systems and policies and procedures, document them in 1998, and we set about and we did it through consultation with the OH&S committees at the time, and with managers and staff. So they were broadly consulted with. I developed the policies. Unfortunately we had no operational control, so all we did was develop the policies and then put them out.

Q. You drew attention to not having operational control. What do you mean by that?A. Yes. Well, I had next to no budget for anything. I had to get permission from various managers to put anything in place. Most other places I've worked at, the safety team - we had operational control if it was a safety thing. We said, "This needs to be done", and it was done. It wasn't always the case.

Q. It wasn't always the case?A. No.

Q. As at 2012, can you recall whether there was a written policy dealing with asbestos in the council?A. We had a policy dealing with asbestos in the council from about 2000 and there was a rudimentary one before I arrived in 1998.

Q. I'm going to have Mr Broad show you volume 1 of the general chronological bundle. Just open up the front page there, you'll see "BMCC-SPP-15.4"? A. Yes.

Q. In the top right-hand corner it has a date on it, July 2000?A. Yes.

Q. Does that look like the document you were referring to in your answer a moment ago?A. Yes.

Q. Just to be clear, I think if you turn ahead to page 2, there's a heading, "4. References and Related Documents". There's a reference there to model asbestos policy for New

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South Wales councils. Are you aware of when that document was first published?A. It wasn't in 2000.

Q. Correct.A. So I don't know who put that in there.

Q. What I'm drawing your attention to is this is a document that looks like it's been around from 2000, but maybe a later version of it?A. Someone has put that, I haven't, but at that stage the policy wasn't in place. I don't think it came in until 2012-2013 maybe.

Q. We'll come to it in a moment. I just wanted to draw your attention to the fact that this appears to be a later version of the policy?A. That's right.

Q. This is the document from about 2000 that you were referring to in your answer?A. Yes.

Q. Apart from this one did you have in mind any other policy documents in your answer a moment ago?A. There were a number of operational policies. The way the system was set up was these were safety program procedures, that's what they were originally called, and they were corporate documents. Then there were safety procedures relevant to the different groups within council, and they were developed by the groups and they were maintained by the groups. So they were actually, I suppose, operational policies and procedures, standard operating procedures. So there were a number of them developed. The first time that we had any of those was probably in about 2000. There was an issue and rangers were called in to remove asbestos from tracks and things like that. Then it was decided that we'd ask some of the groups from waste to do that instead, so the idea was to set up a trailer with all the plastic to wrap it, the gloves, the masks, disposable overalls, face shields or goggles, and that was provided to the teams, and they've all been in the store since then.

Q. Just going back, this document at page 1 headed "Safety Program Procedure", I understand that to be a higher level document?

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A. Yes.

Q. Beneath that there would be individual operational documents? A. Yes.

Q. Would those operational documents be created by the various areas in council that may require them?A. In consultation with myself and the local teams, the supervisors, managers and the safety committees.

Q. If you turn ahead in that same bundle, please, to page 38.A. There should be plenty of other documents that we've had. We develop documents for doing - there was a park in Lawson where asbestos was coming up. Once they made it into a park, asbestos was coming up. They were what we called emu-bobs, and they were put in place for the teams to go and check them on a regular basis. Any number of times we've found asbestos in the buildings before and it's all followed general procedures.

Q. So the first example you gave of a park, that was a procedure document created to deal with an issue as it arose?A. That was developed by the teams. I had input into that. We developed the park sort of between Bullaburra and Lawson, and when it was put in place, asbestos was found to come up through the ground. In the Blue Mountains, as in an awful lot of other Local Government areas, in days gone by, places were just bulldozed and then run over, so that's why --

Q. So that's an example of when an issue arose, a procedure document was created to deal with it?A. Yes, for that specific one, but it was based on these procedures.

THE COMMISSIONER: Q. When you started at council, was there already in existence an asbestos register?A. There was a register. I actually saw a register in around about 1999-2000.

Q. That was maintained throughout the --A. Well, it disappeared, apparently, but it was maintained. It used to be maintained by the property section.

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Q. Right.A. Which was - I'll use their names, I don't remember their titles. The property officers were Brian Ross, Jim - it will come to me --

Q. Because the legislation before the WH&S Act came in 2001, the old Occupational Health & Safety Act, that also required in the regs that a register was kept?A. Sorry, there was a register and it was rudimentary, just what you actually needed. It was where the asbestos had been found or known to be located, when it was inspected and documented evidence of what we were going to do about fixing it. That was maintained by property, who later went on and were absorbed into the assets branch, but they used to be in assets and corporate services, just around the corner from me. So there was one there, but it disappeared, or whatever, because we asked for it later, probably around about 2012, and --

Q. When you say it disappeared, it wasn't kept on a computer system?A. In those days we didn't really have too much of a computer system.

Q. So it was a hard copy thing, was it?A. It was a hard copy, but I'm pretty sure that Jim had been moving it on to an Excel spreadsheet.

Q. I should complete that. Whose job was that in that period up until --A. Property.

Q. It was property's responsibility?A. It was actually Brian Ross, he was in property. Steve Kezler was there, he was the sort of junior officer and Jim - his name will come to me, I can see him. They looked after property and organised all the work, so they needed to know where our halls and bits and pieces were and where the asbestos was. We used to have little signs on various buildings from public toilets to the halls themselves, "No work" and "Could contain asbestos", and to contact BMCC.

MR GLOVER: Q. When you were giving some evidence earlier about the park example, you also referred to asbestos found in buildings following "these procedures".

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I just wanted to be clear about the procedures you were talking about?A. It's part of the normal inspections. It was identified that there was asbestos in some of the picnic huts up above, particularly above Lawson pool, and in a lot of other areas around. We had an incident of asbestos in the IT area. A part of the roof gave way. Again, that was investigated by property, but the roof came down, it was raised that it could be asbestos. It was tested, the area was cleared. It was tested and found to be asbestos, so it was sealed up, what they couldn't remove, and the rest was removed and replaced.

Q. Was that done in accordance with a council policy document or --A. That was part of their normal procedures.

Q. One of those lower-level procedure documents?A. Yes, yes. Basically, all of them were the same. Asbestos is identified either through an inspection or an incident, then it's to be - well, we call it quarantined, isolated, and then you seal it up. We used to use the old PVA glue, or whatever, or if it was on the ground we'd cover it with a tarp and wet it down. Then it is to be sampled, tested and removed. If it was found to be asbestos it was removed. Quite often we'd just take it away more to be on the safe side.

Q. Do you have page 38 there?A. Yes, I do.

Q. This is a "Work Health and Safety Harmonisation Gap Analysis" report by Willis in April 2012? A. Yes.

Q. If you turn to page 39, you'll see that you are one of the people listed as having been conferred with in relation to this process?A. Yes, that's right.

Q. Do you recall that?A. I do.

Q. How did it come about?A. This one was - I think we asked Willis to come in. We had a couple of things done through what we used to call Westpool - I think it's United Pools now - where we were

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benchmarked within southern councils and within Westpool, 14 councils, so that was done and then we asked Willis to come in and do this as part of the burning costs, so we could continue to improve, and Willis found these things. Now, we had some concerns and we'd also asked them to come in and address those concerns.

Q. On page 41, you'll see this is part of the executive summary, the top of the page:

BMCC has a list of protocols however no policies are in place.

A little further down:

There were a number of high risks identified on the day of the inspection.

And the high risk relating to the first dot point is management of asbestos. Do you recall that being an issue at the time?A. I do.

Q. Did you agree with that assessment at the time?A. Yes, we asked them to look into it, because, as I say, we'd been asking for the asbestos register, to see a copy of it because it had been identified - again, I'm just going off my memory, I think it was identified in one of the risk management audits we had for our insurance through Westpool, and they asked to see a copy of it. We said yeah, we'll get a copy. We tried to get that copy and we couldn't locate it, it wasn't provided to us because we had no maintenance of it, and it was somewhere in the property section.

Q. And, then, the next paragraph under the four bullet points refers to an asbestos survey having not been conducted in the last five years?A. That's right.

Q. The last sentence:

This represents a significant risk to BMCC and it is recommended ...

Et cetera. A. Yes.

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Q. Do you recall what was done with recommendations in this report?A. Yes. If you look through the report, you'll see there's a number - they were all prioritised and actions added to them. We cleaned them up as best we could, the safety team, what we were responsible for and on to other areas, but in relation to the asbestos register, like I say, we had no access to it. We took it to - this report and the original to what was then, I think I'm right in saying the governance and risk committee, and at that governance and risk committee it was raised that we were in default, we were actually against the legislation. I'd made the point on a number of occasions that we had one, so there was one around, it wasn't as big a job. The manager in charge of that particular branch at that time was a bloke called Alan Cattermole. Alan was called in, he was at the risk management meeting. Alan said they were engaging contractors to redo an asbestos register taken in all the council buildings and what we had. We couldn't provide any evidence of the old one because we didn't have it, we couldn't get access to it, so Alan then advised, after a number of meetings - advised that they had actually engaged a consultant and the consultant had come in and done an asbestos register and like --

Q. Do you recall about when that conversation with Mr Cattermole was?A. I think we were still chasing it up in 2013 when we were trying to get information, but we were never given access to that. It was an assets document.

Q. If you turn to page 69, this is part of the table that's in the same report. I think you were referring to this in an answer a moment ago?A. Yes.

Q. You'll see a heading "asbestos"? A. Yes.

Q. And the first red box refers to the asbestos survey?A. Yes.

Q. If you turn the page to page 70 there's reference to an asbestos management plan as being a requirement. Do you see that?A. Yes.

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Q. Do you recall being aware of the requirement for asbestos management plans at about that time?A. Yes, I was aware of it, I'd advised my managers. It would have been not too long after that I spoke - I was a member of what they call the council safe advisory network, which was a gathering of all safety officers across the State. It had been established probably 2001 by then WorkCover and the Local Government and Shires Association and at one of those meetings, and I'm not sure if it was at this time, but local government and shires had just engaged someone to come in and do the asbestos, and it might have been after this, but I was aware of it and I'd been advised that we needed it. That's why we'd been pushing to get it. As I said, we weren't given any access to it. My managers - by that stage I was reporting to different managers, yeah, so ...

Q. When you say you weren't given any access to it, you're referring to the register document in that answer?A. To the register document and also to the asbestos management plan. It was my view that we should have an overview of it and be involved in it, but, no, we weren't.

Q. If you look along the columns there under "recommendations", the same line:

Once this asbestos survey has been undertaken the AMP will be developed.

Do you see that?A. Yes.

Q. Then it says, "Assets should be the custodian of the AMP"?A. That's right.

Q. Do I understand by your last answer you thought your area should be custodian?A. No, my opinion was that we should have been involved with it, we should have known when it was so that we could make sure that the different areas in council had information that was relevant to them - I think that's in the legislation, but it wasn't ours, it was an assets document and we couldn't get control of it. We kept asking about it for quite a while, but we just couldn't get control of it.

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Q. When you say "asking about it", are you referring there to a management plan or the register?A. I wanted to see both, and like I say, by that stage we'd had a manager brought in to look over it, to look after a safety report with that manager and there was no headway on it.

Q. What time period are you talking about when you say "at that stage"?A. Probably 2013/14, we kept asking for it.

Q. Who were you asking for it?A. We'd raised it at governance and risk again, and said that we needed to see it. We were assured that it was there and we decided that's it, it was taken off, because the committee was advised that it was all there, it was in place, it was underway and it would be finalised in the next month or so, it was then taken off the agenda.

Q. When you say "it" in that answer, is that a reference to the register?A. To the register. Again, I'd been asking for the management plan to be done as part of the register, because I thought they should go together.

Q. Now, if you turn ahead to page 96 there you should have the model asbestos policy for New South Wales councils of November 2012?A. Yes.

Q. Do you recall becoming aware of this document being released?A. Yes.

Q. How did you become aware of it?A. Again, it was part of the circulars that were sent out. I used to get all circulars from WorkCover at the time and also through my membership of the council safe advisory network I was aware of it. So I'd taken that back to my managers and said, "This is the thing, we need to make sure that our policy is in line with this." I didn't consider it would be too big a deal. We had council insert full name of council blah, blah, blah. My understanding is we put our name in it and our particular policies and things that lined in with us, but that was again left to assets was my advice, that they were in charge of it.

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Q. You gave advice that it should be left to assets? A. No, I was told it would be left to assets, it was an assets issue, not ours.

Q. When you say "assets", was there anyone in particular at the time that you were aware of that had carriage of it?A. I took that to be Alan Cattermole. He was the manager and he was organising it all.

Q. Did you become aware of what work was being done thereafter to develop the policy?A. No, I wasn't told anything from there.

Q. Were you asked for your input into it?A. No.

Q. Turn to page 248, please. This is a memorandum from a Mr Kitching dated 23 August 2013?A. Yes.

Q. I know you're not - have you seen this document before?A. Not that I can remember.

Q. That's all right. I just want to ask you about some of the content under the heading "Background". Do you see the third paragraph in the document commencing, "Following the release" on page 248?A. Third paragraph.

Q. I want up to read from that paragraph and then stop at the heading "The process" on page 249, please, just to yourself and let me know when you've finished.A. Yep.

Q. Just taking the bullet points first, are they the sort of documents you were referring to in your answer earlier where you referred to procedure documents?A. Yes, we'd concentrated a lot on the waste because that's where a lot of the areas were. The contact centre procedure was a general one, if anyone needed information they went to the contact centre, so, yeah, work method statement was a model standard work method statement which was to be adapted to the particular areas, and the SafeWork procedures for open space and recreational team was what I was referring to before.

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Q. You'll see Mr Kitching in the paragraph before the bullet points start expresses a view that:

The review showed that council departments have independently made every endeavour to identify and manage the risk of asbestos exposure. However these systems/procedures, documents are not managed by an overarching plan and full short of best practice.

A. That's right. Do you want a background on that? Do you know how that happened? When it was decided that we'd go into purchase provider, our organisation was set up as separate entities, and they all worked or were supposed to work independently of each other. So we lost any corporate approach to anything and that's when it was developed for the independent arms of the organisation. We had different - the same procedures across two or three things and that, so that was part of the purchase provider and that never went away. That's where we and HR, when I say "we", OH&S branch, which was me for 15 years, we lost any control of it because if the particular manager didn't want to do it, that was their prerogative. So that's why it was like very much a little sort of silo system and that's why these things fall into disrepair. That's the big job to try and recover them all back to corporate documents.

Q. Did you agree with Mr Kitching that the council departments have independently made every endeavour to manage the risk?A. Yes. In some of those areas we were consulted, in other areas they went outside and got external consultants or tried to work through it themselves, so the safety team wasn't always involved in it.

Q. Your point is because of that lack of involvement there wasn't a consistent approach through council; is that right?A. I don't think it was just because of the lack of involvement from the safety team. I think it was the way that we'd been set up at the time, the purchase provider model itself, where everyone worked independently. That's my opinion.

Q. If you turn ahead to page 461, this is another memo

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from Mr Kitching dated 27 March 2014. I just want you to have a look at the heading "The process". Do you see that towards the foot of the page and there are seven steps set out there. If you have a read from "The process" to the end of those steps and stop there, please.A. Yes, seven steps.

Q. Were you aware of this work being done at the time?A. I was aware of it, yes.

Q. Were you involved?A. We weren't involved in it, no.

Q. You weren't asked for your input?A. No.

Q. Close that one up and Mr Broad will bring you folder number 2. If you just turn to page 1001, safety management system review of October 2015, do you remember this one?A. Yes, I do, the hatchet job.

Q. You gave some evidence last time about that, but what I want to take you to is some conclusions at page 1013 under the heading "Conclusion". If you just read that first paragraph to yourself and let me know when you've finished.

THE COMMISSIONER: On my copy it says "Client discussion draft". Is that the final version?

MR GLOVER: There is another version I've seen with a different watermark which I'll check over the weekend. A. Yes.

Q. Just back on page 1013, you'll see about halfway down there is a statement:

The management of safety is largely left to individual departments and branches.

A. Yes.

Q. Did you agree with that?A. By this stage, no, we were trying to bring it all back into a corporate thing by then, but it had been.

Q. And about two lines down there is a view expressed

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that the council manages safety in a reactive manner. Did you agree with that?A. No, I don't.

Q. And why?A. We had a lot of proactive things in place, but they weren't - organisationally we had a lot of proactive, we had training schedules, we had a lot of things we wanted to do but they weren't taken up by managers for one reason or another and we didn't have any clout in the organisation to get them to have it done. We'd been trying to rebuild the system back into a centralised system and have some control of it. That's what we were working to.

So you're aware, when they say - I'll tell you these documents we fell behind, we had a lot of that, but for those 16 years, workers comp, safety and rehabilitation were looked after by one person in a council of 800, 900 employees, and that was myself. We had safety committees and that was great. When we had supportive managers, that was great. When we had managers who weren't so supportive, that wasn't good. When we split purchase provider, that's when things started to go astray. As well as that, I was required to do HR, relief HR work as well. It probably wasn't until 2012, 2013, that we actually got somebody else in to help with the risk management stuff. We had a risk management officer, but the admin and that was done by a risk management officer.

Q. The issues you're raising there are resourcing issues in that period? A. Resourcing issues, which we raised on a number of occasions and we continued to raise for the next six or seven years. I'll note now, if I can, that council now have I think four or five people doing what I did by myself for 16, 17 years, so hopefully they will get things done.

Q. Page 1601, please.

THE COMMISSIONER: Q. With this review conducted by Willis by Mr Kenafacke, did he speak to you for the purposes of the review?A. Again, I'll answer that - actually he spoke to us for less than an hour. In the first 10 minutes he sat there and told me that you don't even have a system. I said, "We do have a system." "No, you don't." He already made up his mind. He spent I think three or four days previous

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talking to managers that weren't as involved in different aspects of the thing because it wasn't in their area. I'm on record as calling it a hatchet job. It was put in place for one reason and one reason only and that was to justify bringing in consultants and people to do it, which I supported. I'm quite happy they've done it, I think it's long overdue.

But this report itself - I'll give you an example, they said, "You haven't got them", I said, "There, we printed you off all the documents" - "It's not in TRIM, therefore it doesn't exist". I'm sorry, but we did have these documents.

Q. When you say "he spoke to us", you and?A. He spoke to us individually, he spoke to myself and Michael Keyes individually. I don't think he spoke to Mick for any more than an hour, and he'd spoken to a number of managers through the organisation.

Q. Just remind me, Mr Keyes was in the safety team, but what particular responsibility did he have?A. At that stage Mick - I think they'd made John Odgers redundant, he was our risk management coordinator. John had been made redundant and Michael had then moved into doing the operational sides of risk management as well as helping me where he could with the --

Q. Workers comp?A. Beg your pardon?

Q. With workers comp?A. With the administration of workers comp, not the actual management.

Q. I had better complete this, sorry. This is a client discussion draft. Were you shown a draft and given an opportunity to make comment?A. I was shown a draft after it was done.

Q. After it was final?A. Yes. I was shown virtually that. There was a page in there that said we didn't have the experience or expertise to do it, which I took exception to.

Q. Who did you discuss the draft with?A. Grant McKay. He was the one that had the plan

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organised. We weren't involved in any other discussions with the person that did the audit. It wasn't an audit.

Q. Were they oral discussions or was anything put in writing?A. No. We were told it was an audit. So I said, "That's fine, can you teal me what it is we are being audited - the parameters, and we can get the documents you need" - "No, it's not an audit, it's just a review". Then they were asked to provide --

Q. Who told you it was an audit - Mr McKay?A. Originally it was put to us that it was a safety audit.

Q. Yes.A. Then it changed to, no, it was a safety review.

Q. We were asked to provide all of the safety documentation, so we advised Yasoda Wickramasekera that they were all on the T drive. She had access to the T drive.

Q. What does "T drive" mean, TRIM?A. No, no. T drive is the drive where we keep our corporate documents before TRIM came in, and where we used to work on. Then if they were finalised, they'd be put into TRIM. So I asked if there were any specific documents and I was happy to print them off. I printed off a pile of about 20 or 30 that we provided in hard copy for them to read before the audit/review. As I said, we had them there in the room. He said, "You've got no systems". I said, "Well, that's them there". He said, "They don't count, they are not in TRIM".

Q. Getting back to what I asked, when you discussed this report with Mr McKay, that was a face-to-face meeting, there were no documents created about it?A. No. Grant wasn't big on documents.

MR GLOVER: Q. I said 1601, but I will take you first to 1303.A. Yes.

Q. There you should have --A. An asbestos policy model.

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Q. Model asbestos policy from November 2015. Do you recall this being released?A. I do, actually.

Q. How did you become aware of it?A. Again, through the council safe advisory network and through advice from WorkCover. I actually had spoken about it with Grant, told him we're doing all this, we should look at this, make sure that whatever we do sits with this, because this is developed specifically for Local Government.

There was also a fellow by the name of Daniel Adler who was engaged by the Local Government Association, specifically for asbestos. I'd spoken with Daniel at one of the council safe meetings and it might have been after this that I had his card and I'd spoken to him about it. I said, "Listen, we are having a few difficulties, would you be happy to come and talk to our managers?" Daniel said yes, he was more than happy. I took that information back to Grant, gave him the contact details, et cetera, and said to leave it with him and I never heard any more from him.

Q. After drawing this to Mr McKay's attention, did you have any other involvement in the progression of the policy at this time?A. No. At the end, later on, I was shown a document that had this, the model asbestos, the program and the like, because I kept saying, "No, we haven't got one, I'm telling you we haven't got one, no-one will show it to us. Until we can see it we can't say from a safety point of view that we've got one". Eventually I was shown a copy of a document that had "Blue Mountains City Council" put in appropriate places for this organisation. I got quite irate about it, and I pointed out to Mr McKay and other people that were there at the desk, "You don't have a management program; you've got a menu". So when you go to a restaurant, you get a list to say what the food is, not how they'll cook it or what they'll do with it. I said, "That's what you've got here, a menu of what needs to be done but there's no actual detail".

Q. Page 1601, please.A. Yes.

Q. There's a document dated January 2017, "Work Health

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and Safety Workplace Asbestos Procedure"?A. Yes. That's a draft document.

Q. You'll see what follows is a draft watermark. Have you seen this document before?A. Yes, I believe this is the one that I wrote to give to the PSSG. I'd have to read it all. A lot of it is just an executive - this would be the second draft. The first draft I wrote was in broader terms, where it says "Managers were responsible for". The body stayed the same. The management at the PSSG weren't happy with that, because they thought "management" was too broad a term. So I then put in the directors group, managers and branch managers, and specified who would be responsible for what until what level. This document was never endorsed. It remained as draft because the first document was sent back for redrafting, so I redrafted it, and then before we could put this one up to be endorsed by PSSG, they decided that they were going to bring in - I think it was Centium, they were going to bring in an external organisation to rewrite it. But this virtually just mirrors what we'd had for many, many years.

Q. This document, although dated January 2017, it may be a later version of the document that was first created at that time?A. I think the original one was in January and I think I might have taken it to the - because we didn't meet in January or February.

Q. I'll come to some minutes of the PSSG in a moment.A. I think it may be March or April.

Q. If you turn to page 1604 there's a reading "References and Related Documents"?A. Yes.

Q. There you refer to the council's asbestos register, the council's asbestos management plan and the council's asbestos policy? A. Yes.

Q. When the references are made to the council's asbestos management plan, what's being referred to?A. The asbestos management plan that we'd been told was in place in assets.

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Q. But you hadn't seen it?A. No.

Q. The council's asbestos policy, what's being referred to there?A. That would have been the - it should have been based on the model asbestos policy.

Q. But you hadn't seen the final version of that?A. I hadn't seen a final version of that either.

Q. Had you been told that there was one in place?A. I was told that they were in place and under way and assets were in charge of them.

Q. When you say "in place and under way", by "under way", do you mean they were being worked on?A. They were being worked on and I think they were going to take them to council itself. I didn't know if they needed to go to council because it was an operational policy, not necessarily a council-based policy.

Q. So the references are there to documents that --A. They are there, what we should have been following, and what I was led to believe we had in place, they would have finalised.

Q. You were told that those had been finalised; is that right?A. No, no, I was told they were being worked on. I'd never seen the final copies, but that's consistent with what we do to any other related documents that we are aware of that might be in other areas as well.

Q. When you've noted them in that policy, you're not noting final documents; you're noting documents that you understood were being developed.A. We should be fine. It was also a bit of a prompt if we haven't got them, then we better get them.

Q. When you were pulling this policy together, or this draft together, I should say --A. The procedure.

Q. The procedure, thank you - did you draw the need to have those things in place to anyone's attention?A. Yes, we've been drawing it to their attention since

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2013 and we've been told that they were there, and they'd been done by consultants.

Q. This is January 2017? A. 2017, yes.

Q. So who were you raising those matters with?A. We'd raised them originally with the governance and risk and then we'd raised them with PSSG, and I raised them through my manager. When they brought in a safety manager, I had to report everything to the safety manager. I no longer had access to anyone.

Q. Who was the safety manager in January 2017?A. Grant McKay.

Q. If you could turn ahead, please, to page 1625. This is an email chain. The first email is from Mr McKay to you of 22 February?A. Yes.

Q. Just read that chain, and it finishes over the page on 1626.A. Jim Cameron, that's it. Yes.

Q. Your advice is being sought in relation to the issue of labelling in this chain?A. Yes. They had an asbestos team, a management team. I'd asked to be put on it. I wasn't allowed to go on it, but I was told I'd be there for an advisory capacity.

THE COMMISSIONER: Q. Why weren't you allowed to go on it?A. I have no idea. I'm fairly experienced with asbestos, I worked on it --

Q. Did you apply to go on it?A. It wasn't an application, it was nominations from management.

Q. I see. Did you raise a query about it?A. I raised a number of queries about why I wasn't allowed to be involved in any of it.

Q. Who did you raise the queries with?A. With Grant McKay.

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Q. What did you say to him, as best you can recall?A. Well, I asked him, I said, "Am I going to be involved in it?". "No". "Well, what about Mick? We should be involved in it, the safety team". "No, we are bringing in other people to do it". I was told that we had too much work to do, so it was business as usual, but I would be there in an advisory capacity. I think I was asked two questions. One was in relation to insurances, and this one - there might have been another one, but they were all low-level things.

I was fairly - I didn't understand why, because I'd had quite a lot of dealings with asbestos in my time in the railways and different supervisory capacities throughout the industry. I'd been involved in the dismantling of workshops and the testing that was required in the Airsafe monitoring. I'd done it in one of my university subjects, in toxicology. I'd worked with it a fair bit through the years, and I --

Q. In the railways?A. In the railways, within Goninans.

Q. How long had you worked for the railways for?A. In the railways I started as an apprentice blacksmith in 1977. I was there probably until about 2014/2015. I then went across to Goninans, a company called Maintrain that took over the site there.

Q. It can't be 2014. You were at the council then?A. No, it must have been 2004, sorry.

Q. I thought you started at the council in 1998?A. I did.

Q. Did I get that wrong?A. Must be 1994. Sorry about that. It's been a long time. I've been working for a long time, until recently.

Q. You ended up in safety, did you, or work health and safety for the railways?A. I was an apprentice training instructor. So I was a training instructor. In that we did - part of my role was to do training, welding, blacksmithing, general metal working, asbestos, all the safety stuff. Then when I went back to the railways, I was back as a supervisor. We worked in a lot of old buildings and that, so we had

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asbestos marked everywhere when Goninans were taking over the site at Clyde, we had to take down some of the large workshops. They were 200m-250m long asbestos clad workshops, so I was familiar with the parameters and the testing and things like that. I'd actually been tested while I was in the railways because we used to work with a lot of asbestos in the boiler shops, et cetera. So, yeah, I was fairly familiar with it.

Q. When you say tested, you mean X-rayed --A. Not in those days, they had the old spirometer, and you were marked. So somewhere in a box down wherever the archives are, there is a little line that says "Trevor Anderson worked with asbestos". So I was fairly familiar with it.

MR GLOVER: Q. I think in an answer you said this was one of the occasions on which your advice was sought in that advisory capacity?A. Yes, this was, yes.

Q. Do you remember discussion around labelling about this time?A. I provided the advice, as per the email, that we had labelling - we used to have labelling when I first arrived. I was taken through it again by Brian and Jim Cameron, and Steve Kezler, and in the skirting boards and on some of the buildings where we had asbestos in our public halls, we had "No Work" - I don't know if it was "Dangerous Asbestos" or "May Contain Asbestos", but no work was to be done on this building and you had to contact Blue Mountains City Council Trades. That put you through to trades. Brian and Jim had come from trades before they'd put them into the properties. So trades had always traditionally looked after and engaged anyone to do the asbestos work, or had organised themselves.

Q. So aside from this email exchange, were you involved in any discussion about how the council would approach its labelling practices?A. I was involved in a discussion. There with some labels that were put up that I was shown. I think, from memory, they would have served the purpose, but I'm fairly sure there were some guidelines, either in the WorkCover sites, or whatever.

Q. The discussions you had about it were at a general

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level, were they?A. Yes, very general.

Q. I'm just going to head to page 1633. This is a WH&S safety committee minutes from 16 March at Springwood depot? A. Yes.

Q. You were a member of that committee?A. Yes, I was.

Q. If you turn the page to 1634, item 4, there's a heading, "Asbestos Register"?A. Yes.

Q. Do you recall that issue being raised? A. Yes, I do.

Q. Were you involved in resolving that issue?A. I was. My advice to Rhett Hahn - who is listed on there, he was the manager operations at the time, or responsible for those areas - was that trades used to have a full thing at the depot, otherwise it was to go to assets, because they were working on one. I think Gary Johnston was also aware of that and I'd given him similar advice. Well, the legislation, my view was that we should be doing what the legislation says in that each individual workplace needs to have an asbestos register for that particular issue. Council has to have a whole, and that can be maintained by assets and should be maintained by assets, but the depot needed one of its own.

In the place I worked before, we used to actually have a copy of that that we'd leave out the front for emergency services that might come into the area, but that should have been at the depot. So staff had asked about that, and it was a reasonable question, so that was the answer I gave, "We didn't actually have it, but you should seek them to get it and make the copies up".

In my opinion, it wasn't enough to have somewhere on a register, on a computer screen. My interpretation of the legislation was that you actually had to have one available.

Q. And you gave that advice at the time?A. Yes.

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Q. Do you recall whether that issue was resolved following your advice?A. I have seen one there after that. I know that Rhett Hahn - Rhett Hahn was pretty good. He'd take things like that on board and he'd do them. I think they ended up - I think towards the end they had them on all of the sites.

Q. Were you involved in that process of --A. In the process of the register?

Q. Yes, at all the sites that you just mentioned?A. Only to give advice of what it should be. I mean, there were different opinions of what should be in the register and things like that. My advice was just to follow what's in the legislation, where it is, where it's located, what kind of asbestos it is, what condition it's in, when it will be inspected again and any plans that were in place to have it removed.


Q. These are some minutes of a meeting of the peak safety steer group of 2 May. Do you see the date at the top?A. Yes.

Q. Then if you turn to page 1697, you'll see item 6.A. Yes.

Q. "Document submitted for review", "Asbestos Procedures"?A. That's right.

Q. The record is:

The two procedures presented for endorsement were discussed and not endorsed in their current form.

Just read that box to yourself and let me know when you've finished.A. Yes.

Q. That was the issue you were discussing earlier in your evidence about things being --A. The first one we took up, and they wanted

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clarification on it.

Q. Then you'll see two-thirds of the way down that box there's a reference to:

Safety Team is available to supply assistance or advice to the Groups or Directorates.

A. That was part of our role, that was normal.

Q. Advice in relation to policy development, was that part of the role?A. Part of my role was to provide advice and assistance in anything to do with WHS to any managers, employees. At times I was called in to discuss things with contractors. That's always been part of my role and that's always what we did.


Q. This is an email chain commencing with an email from Mr McKay to you of 8 May. It's in small print, but if you have a look at the beginning of the email chain, which starts over on page 1710, at the foot there is an email from Mr Kitching to Mr Kane-White. You're not looped in at this stage. A. That's right, yes.

Q. Raising the issue of asbestos notices?A. Yep.

Q. At page 1710 there's an image?A. Yes.

Q. And on page 1709 Mr Johnston responds and that's when you get joined in?A. Yes.

Q. You give some advice in the email commencing at the foot of page 1708. Do you see that?A. Yes.

Q. Are these the general discussions you were referring to earlier about the types of labels to be used?A. Yes, I only became involved in this, as I say, after

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Gary Johnston brought it to my attention. It would have came through in the OH&S committees anyway. One of the procedures with the OH&S committees, we didn't like to leave things until the monthly meetings, so if anyone was aware of anything, send it to the safety team. Our thought was always to have it resolved before the next committee meeting so it could be reported on to the committee and if it hadn't been resolved --

Q. Are you aware whether the issue of which label was to be used was resolved?A. No, I'm not sure what they ended up with.

Q. Were you involved in having work done to place labels around council facilities?A. No, that was assets. We were prohibited from doing anything like that.

Q. When you say "prohibited"?A. I was told by Grant McKay at one stage that they were never going to learn to do things themselves if I kept mollycoddling them.

Q. In what context did he make that comment?A. I used to go down to the depots quite a lot, I was in the depots fairly frequently, had good contact, good rapport with most of the workers, the managers. He questioned why I was in the depots all the time. I said that's what we'd been set up for, we were an advisory body, we weren't expected to do the whole sort of with one person and he said, "It's the managers' responsibility, you need to talk to them and they are never going to learn to do it if you keep mollycoddling them." I remember that specifically, because it was just against everything we'd ever done before.

Q. The next document I want to show you is page 1716, please. A. Yes.

Q. This is another lengthy email chain. A. From Gary Johnston, they normally are.

Q. And you'll see here Mr Johnston is drawing attention to particular parts of the WHS legislation and regulations. Do you see that?A. Yes.

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Q. In particular, the requirement for an asbestos management plan?A. Yes.

Q. Do you recall having discussions about those requirements in about May 2017?A. Yes, I do.

Q. And who was involved in that discussion?A. This particular discussion, the one that I became involved in, arose from a couple of issues. A couple of people had been to see me, but this one in particular Gary came to see me about it. I said, "Mate, all I can do is tell you what I have been told. An asset management plan is being developed or has been developed, it's being looked after by assets. All I can do is tell you to go and see assets. We can't get access to it, maybe you can, or go to your managers."

Q. You said in your answer an "asset management plan", did you mean an "asbestos management plan"?A. Sorry, an asbestos management plan which should have formed part of the asset management.

Q. Mr Johnston raised this issue with you and you directed him to assets? A. A couple of times he raised it with me verbally. I explained to him what was happening, and in the end he put it in writing.

Q. Beyond that discussion with Mr Johnston, that was the limit of your involvement about discussing these matters at the time?A. I discussed it with Grant and we discussed it in committee meetings and with committee members and at one stage we talked to different union people, but it was always the same, "Sorry, I can't help you. We don't have anything to do with it. I've asked and I've asked." I was quite unpopular for asking all the time. So that's part - that's probably why I'm sitting here from Queensland.

Q. If you turn to page 1725, this is a consultation register prepared by Centium. Do you remember Centium being engaged?A. Yes, I remember Aaron.

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Q. You and Mr Keyes were consulted; do you remember that?A. Yes.

Q. Do you remember what types of matters you were consulted about?A. From memory, he asked us some historical information, if we had any historical documentation, which we gave him what we could and had. We referred him to where our understanding of where things should be and my advice to him would have been just if you're doing this, follow the legislation, that's where we're getting in trouble, no-one's following the legislation.

THE COMMISSIONER: Q. When you say no-one is following the legislation, do you mean no-one is just getting on with making sure we've got an asbestos management plan, making sure we've got all the registers?A. I'm on record and I will say it again, I don't believe we had an asbestos crisis as such. We had a management crisis. The people that were supposed to be looking after council's interests knew nothing about the asbestos and weren't following the legislation and just wouldn't take any advice.

MR GLOVER: Q. If you turn to page 1783, please, WHS committee minutes from Springwood on 15 June, do you see that?A. Yes.

Q. And there is a lengthy item 2, "asbestos update"?A. Yes.

Q. I want to go to page 1785, in particular, there's an issue raised by you in the fourth dot point on that page?A. Yes.

Q. Just read that dot point to yourself.A. Yes.

Q. The issue you're raising is one of communication; do you recall that?A. Yes. Sorry, this is a combined meeting - we had representatives from the headquarters in South Street committee there as well, so Aaron could talk to everyone and give them the one message rather than across two or three sessions.

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Q. Do you recall what your concern was about the lack of communication in the context of the asbestos update?A. Yeah, there are a number of things there. There was an incident in IT that we weren't aware of. Part of our procedures had always been that anything to do with asbestos exposure, et cetera, had always been reported as an injury, because it had the potential to be counted as an injury. Those parameters were changed to they were to report it as incidents only, which I disagreed with, but it stayed that way, and I was concerned it hadn't been reported, because I was the person that was supposedly keeping the incident injury registers, so I was naturally concerned that there had been another exposure incident and we hadn't heard of it. Yvonne, who is mentioned here, the HSR for headquarters, so she hadn't heard of it either, and headquarters is in her area. We were naturally concerned about it and asked that anything that came that way, instead of setting up another system, it comes through us. What we did was raised them still on an incident injury register, we'd always had an incident injury register, it was to be nominated as an incident and then I put them on to incident registers and reported them to PSSG as incidents rather than injuries.

Q. The particular issue you were raising here is that potential exposure not having been reported?A. And the fact that it was against our procedures. It should have been reported to us in the safety team.

Q. Did you have a concern about communication generally?A. Yes, across the organisation - terrible communication.

Q. And anything in particular in relation to the management of asbestos?A. It was very secretive and it was handled by a few people. As I've said, in my opinion, I'm not quite sure they had the experience and knowledge that was required at that time. They were relying on consultants or people that didn't know a real lot about the organisation, and that was the thing. All they had to do was ask people who had been involved in it, myself, Gary Johnston was actually on the committee for a short time, but he left after a couple of weeks I think. Damien Taylor, who had been looking after our asbestos and our asbestos issues for a number of years in his role in operations, and Damien was on it for a short while, but he didn't stay on it for very long. So my concern was that these things, in my opinion, should have

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gone through the safety committees - had safety committee reps there. In fairness, Jason was on there.

Q. Jason Adams?A. Yes. He was at the time I think the chair of the South Street committee, but there was just an air of secrecy. We weren't given any information. You'd ask questions and "That's got nought to do with you, just go on about your business", so yeah.

Q. 1879, please. This is a file note of a group headed the AM working group?A. Yes.

Q. 17 August 2017. You'll see in the first line your name is recorded as having been at this meeting?A. Yes.

Q. Now, halfway down the page there is a heading "Safety team"?A. Yep.

Q. And then there is a reference to "health surveillance"?A. Yes.

Q. Was that something that your team was responsible for?A. Yes, the health surveillance register was always intended to be and we had actually set one up at that stage and that was to take in asbestos testing on staff, noise testing, hep B and heps A and C, all the hepatitis, so all the testing, medical testing that was required of staff was all to be put on that register.

Q. You mentioned asbestos testing?A. Yes.

Q. How long had your team been looking after asbestos testing?A. We hadn't actually done any I think at that stage.

Q. Do you remember when that began to be introduced?A. Again, it was started off probably in 2018, it was organised through I think Alan Harris's area organised it originally. We weren't involved in that. Then there was a first round of testing where we had the buses come up and then we received some improvement notices and we identified

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other people through a - we sort of used a risk assessment process to identify other people in council that may have been exposed to asbestos in their employment rather than just the staff that were there then. So we had a list and I think we categorised them maybe 1, 2, 3 and 4 were the categories.

So we then addressed the category 2s, which were people that were frequently in and out of the waste management, because the waste management depot by then had been put down as an asbestos area, there were improvement notices around the place. We organised for testing for them and then we went for testing for people who recently left the organisation and for contractors that were there working still, and then I think the last one was going to be long-term employees.

So I was asked to bring in some supplementary testing. We couldn't get the bus until June or July, so organised through - there were some people who were actually done through the dust and registers disease board down in Sydney but organised a company, their name escapes me but we got them to come up and they actually did testing on site for us. They did about five or six rounds of testing of 10 people each.

Q. Were you involved in making offers of testing to those staff in those various categories, or was that handled by someone else?A. No, the decision had been made by our senior managers when they found that there was asbestos in one of the stockpile sites, that everyone in council would be tested, so there was no who might have been exposed, it was just everyone, so it was offered to everyone. From there we extended it to people who had worked at council in those areas in the last seven or eight years we put as the parameters. We worked through them. We wanted to get to people who were there on council at the time and then others included that hadn't been caught up in the first round.

I spoke with Alan about that and so we set that in place and I was responsible for - I can't remember the name of them - they will be somewhere in the files. We brought them in and they did the testing for us.

Q. To your observation, was that something that was well

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taken up by staff?A. I think the initial round we might have had 110 people. I think our final numbers were about 200-odd. We did promote it heavily. Some people didn't go in the first round. We promoted it quite heavily and said: look, council's doing it, come and get it done. So we got everyone - we made it available to everyone, we put out a number of emails that everyone was available to do it, specifically contractors and I'll just - Danny Corny, they came and did it because they worked for council for a long period of time and other contractors that had worked with council and council buildings that we knew of, we got them to come in and gave them the offer. Some of them took it up, some didn't.

Q. The next heading on that page is "Training". Was that a discussion about training in particular about asbestos?A. Yes. Maintain the training register, we never really maintained that. HR have a system where they keep all records of all the training.

Q. What about the first point:

Describe training types required and suggest best options to ...

A. "Business units based upon staff members function and risk assessment".

Q. Were you involved in making recommendations as to training?A. We said what we think should be required, yes.

Q. How was that recommendation given?A. Some of it by that stage we'd gone through Alan, but I think mostly Centium set up the training. We had people that we'd used previously, but Centium - I think it was Centium - someone had organised training to come in and do it.

Q. That was not something ultimately organised by your team?A. No. We suggested what should have been done, what we think needed doing.

Q. Now, you've mentioned in your answers improvement notices issued by SafeWork. You're aware of those

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happening about that time?A. Yes, I am.

Q. Were you involved in liaising with SafeWork?A. No, that had been my role up until about at the beginning of the asbestos thing - my role was - I liaised with WorkCover, later became SafeWork. Improvement notices could be issued by SafeWork to any manager, but normally I was the contact person and I was contacted to go when we knew there was a WorkCover inspector on site and there was a likelihood so there was either myself and/or safety committee members there, or HSR's work group officers.

The first one we had for asbestos was to do with an inspector had come to the tip at Blaxland and had raised questions giving an improvement notice about the type of filters that were in some of the machines and the availability of equipment. I met with Ken Phillips, who at that stage was the manager of waste and services, about those improvement notices. I was going off on holidays about a week or so, a couple of days after they were issued, told Ken - we discussed what we needed. We'd already had the procedures in place, so I was a bit surprised we had been issued with them. They were getting a heap of filters and stuff like that. They were already fitted was my understanding. Ken got all the information that was required to give to the inspector and show that, yeah, we had had these filters, we put in a couple of extra things that they asked for, and I think we redid some of the training and advised people.

So that was all set up before I went and Ken Phillips, who is quite knowledgeable on these things as well and handled them for many years, so we left it at that. The day after I got back was the day the WorkCover inspector was coming up. I spoke to Grant and said, "I'll go down to this." He said, "No, I'll go to it." I'm not sure whether he went with Mick, but he went down to it. They were all done, so it was a fairly simple matter of saying, yeah, this is what it was, this is what we had, you hadn't been shown this at the time, bang, bang, and the improvement notices were listed. From then on dealing with WorkCover became Grant's issue, he decided he'd be taking all the WorkCover things.

Q. Do you recall at the end of 2017 there was the asbestos response team established; do you remember that?

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A. Yes.

Q. And there had been the asbestos project team as well; do you remember that?A. That was the project management team, was it?

Q. I'm going to show you a diagram which may help, exhibit 11, page 16. Do you have there page 16 in the top corner?A. Page 1.

Q. No, if you keep turning through until you get to page 16. That's the one. You'll see a diagram.A. Yes.

Q. And there's a box in the middle of the page "asbestos management task force"; do you have that?A. Yes.

Q. There's the response team, to the right of that the project team, and down the bottom the safety team?A. Yes.

Q. Have you seen this diagram before?A. I'm not familiar with this actual diagram.

Q. Just take a moment to have a look at the diagram and the descriptors in the boxes and let me know when you've done that?A. It's a procedure that was put in place. I'm aware of it.

Q. You'll see there's the arrow between the safety team and the asbestos response team?A. Yes.

Q. So is it the case that your team from then on worked with the response team on these issues?A. I'm not exactly sure who the response team was. It may have been Alan.

Q. If you turn back to page 1, you'll see at the bottom of the page the asbestos response team, and then there's a table?A. Yeah, the asbestos response team.

Q. That's the people who are part of that team?

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A. Yeah, that was the asbestos team.

Q. Led by Mr Harris, Mr Adams?A. Yes.

Q. Mr Green, et cetera?A. Yes.

Q. In this diagram it records that the safety team will refer asbestos related incident form to the asbestos response team?A. Yes.

Q. So those forms were the ones you referred to earlier?A. Yes.

Q. So if your team had a notification of an asbestos issue, you would refer it to the response team. A. We referred them to Alison and/or to Jason. We discussed them I think on a weekly basis at our meetings.

Q. The next dot point is assess, investigate reports of potential asbestos exposure; do you see that?A. Conduct safety investigation of potential - yes, but we didn't - we weren't actually doing that. That was done by the local managers or local supervisors, and then we'd go and speak to them about what happened. We were aware, but we weren't always on site when they happened because some of them could have been - it was classed as asbestos exposure if someone found an inch of asbestos on the ground in a bush track.

Q. Have you got page 16 in front of you? I'm directing your attention to the safety team box at the foot of the diagram. A. Yes.

Q. Third dot point "Health monitoring" you've given some evidence about that process already?A. Yes.

Q. Over to the right, "arrange asbestos related training", do you see that?A. Yes.

Q. What was involved in that?A. Again, at that stage, Centium organised the training.

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We had previously had external trainers come in to do training on asbestos. From memory, I would have either contacted them through someone from the council safe advisory network would have either had them somewhere in the State or local government had --

Q. But there was a period from about late 2017 when Centium conducted training?A. Yes, we didn't arrange training.

Q. The last dot point is "oversight of asbestos management plan compliance"?A. Yes.

Q. What was involved in that?A. Once we got the asbestos management plan, we have to make sure that it complied with the regulations and the legislation.

Q. How did you do that?A. We reviewed it against the regulations.

Q. Did you have suggestions of changes?A. I don't think there were too many changes in regards to the regulations, but, yeah, with the asbestos management plan, I wasn't convinced that it was being fully communicated to everyone or that everyone understood it. I thought that some of the training that was given was a bit broader level than it needed in some areas. That's just my opinion.

Q. Part of your compliance role was to draw those matters to attention?A. Yes.

Q. Finally, you gave some evidence by phone last time. Towards the end of your evidence I think you raised with the Commissioner whether the inquiry would be looking at I think your word was "bullying"?A. Yep.

Q. And the Commissioner indicated in the context of asbestos management issues, if there were matters to raise, that you would have the opportunity to do so. Can you just tell us what you were referring to when you raised that issue?A. There were a number of incidents that I thought in my

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time there that were bullying in relation to some of the asbestos issues, people being asked why they were reporting certain things. There was a manager that in the opinion of some other managers was fanning the flames and not doing, in my opinion - and I've been working for 40-odd years - doing what a manager should do, which is when staff raise issues, investigate them fully and then advise the staff of the outcomes of those investigations. I know that he was under a fair bit of pressure. There was pressure applied to various people that had reported things when questions were raised.

THE COMMISSIONER: I think we're being a bit general.

MR GLOVER: Yes, I was going to come back. A. Sorry, the biggest one about the asbestos, which I think is specific, is that there were requests to have one of the last meetings that I was involved in, to have the minutes changed, because questions had been asked in relation to asbestos.

Q. What meeting was that?A. That was one of the safety committee meetings down at Springwood.

Q. What was the request to have the minutes changed?A. There were some things said in the minutes that probably shouldn't be recorded as they were said, so I was asked then - the people doing the minutes and the people who had been running the meeting were advised to change the meeting minutes. So they rang me and I said "Well, you can't actually change minutes. Some of the wording that you might be putting in there may not be appropriate, so be careful how you put it, as long as you put across the actual content, that should be fine but don't change the outcomes of the meeting or what was said - clean up the language".

Q. When was this meeting?A. From memory, it would have been around November 2018.

MR GLOVER: Q. What was the topic that was being discussed A. It was about asbestos and the discovery of some asbestos and how it had been treated in the garage at Springwood depot.

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Q. Were you responsible for taking the minutes?A. No, I wasn't.

Q. Who rang you about changing the minutes?A. One was the chair of the meeting.

Q. Who was that?A. Brent.

Q. Sorry?A. Brent.

Q. Brent?A. Brent Hill-Murray, and Zofi Johnston, who was the minute-taker had asked me as well. I said, "No, you can't change the minutes . You can clean up the language, but you can't change what was said in the meeting or what was asked".

THE COMMISSIONER: Q. What was said and then what did they want to be --A. I wasn't there when they were asked. I was there in the meeting, and it was quite heated. There were accusations made about people's qualifications and experience and what was done. I thought that, yeah, you can't really say things like that, you've got no foundation for that, but you can question other people relevantly trained, et cetera. That was my advice. You can put those questions, just word them differently to get across the meaning. I wasn't there. I didn't witness the minutes being asked to be changed, but I was told about it by a number of people that were there, and they were very irate. It wasn't long after that that they had a change to the complete committee system.

THE COMMISSIONER: Q. Are there any other specific examples of bullying you would like to draw to the inquiry's attention?A. Look, again, it's sort of anecdotal. People don't generally bully people when I'm around. I don't like it, it's not part of my role and I'm supposed to stop it, but I'm aware that certain people have feelings that they'd been bullied about some of the instances arising, and they raised issues with me. I told them at the time there was nothing I could do about it unless they were willing to put their name --

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Q. Who raised issues with you?A. Well, Gary Johnston was particularly upset.

Q. Because?A. Because he didn't think that he was being listened to and he thought that he was being treated --

Q. Not listened to in relation to saying, "We need an asbestos management plan and a register"?A. In relation to some of the things he'd raised about asbestos and then in later dealings, he thought that his managers were treating him differently since he'd raised it.

Q. Who was his manager?A. I know he had an incident with when Dan Long took over the management of him. Again, from what I knew of those incidents --

Q. These are reported to you?A. Yeah, and I told him I'd have it investigated. My understanding is they were investigated by HR and Dan was cleared any wrongdoing, but that still doesn't sit very well with Dan.

MR GLOVER: Q. Are they the only issues you wanted to raise?A. I could tell you about the number of times I've been told to just keep quiet.

Q. In relation to asbestos? A. Yes, "If we want your opinion, we'll ask for it, you have business to do, you do your business as usual".

THE COMMISSIONER: Q. Give some examples of that?A. Grant McKay.

Q. What sort of things were you trying to raise, though?A. I was trying to raise the lack of compliance.

Q. I see. With the law?A. And, in my opinion, we were being told - and I also believe in - it's not a real popular opinion, I don't think, but I don't believe that Stuart Liddell or Robert Greenwood were fully aware of everything that was going on, but by that stage we didn't have access to them.

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Q. When you say not aware of everything that was going on, not aware of --A. I don't think they were given the full story of what was happening. I don't think they were involved probably as closely as they should be in what was happening with the plan. They were told, "This is what we are going to do and that's fine".

Q. Not as fully involved or aware of what was happening in relation to preparation of asbestos?A. In relation to the whole asbestos issue. I believe that information was watered down by the time it got to them. Whilst I didn't always see eye to eye with Stuart on a lot of things, if Stuart was aware that there was an issue, he would have acted on it and he would have acted on it appropriately. That's one thing to be said for him; if he thought it was illegal or going to get council in trouble, he would have put a stop to it, or would have investigated it further. That's what I base that on.

MR GLOVER: That's all I have for Mr Anderson.

THE COMMISSIONER: That might be a convenient time to take a break. We'll adjourn until 11.50.

SHORT ADJOURNMENT

THE COMMISSIONER: Are you ready to resume?

MR GLOVER: Yes, Commissioner. I'd concluded my questions.

THE COMMISSIONER: Councillor Brown, do you have any questions you would like to ask?

COUNCILLOR BROWN: Yes.

<EXAMINATION BY COUNCILLOR BROWN:

COUNCILLOR BROWN: Q. I'm Kerry brown, one of the councillors?A. I'm familiar with who you are.

Q. I should know this, but I just want to get the structure clear. Which directorate were you in?A. We were in people and systems.

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Q. So you were under Stuart Liddell? A. Under Stuart Liddell as our director. Then in about 2013 maybe, Grant McKay was brought on as a manager, governance and risk, and safety was put in there for some reason.

Q. So that position, that governance and risk manager, was a new position?A. It was a new position, yes.

Q. You said that Grant McKay then became - was he the safety officer? You were still the safety officer?A. I was still the program leader, safety and risk.

THE COMMISSIONER: Q. He was governance?A. Yes, he was the manager, governance and risk. I was the program leader safety, and then I was program leader, safety and risk, and then safety and whatever.

COUNCILLOR BROWN: Q. He was your direct --A. Yes, he was my manager.

Q. Direct manager, thank you. I just wanted to get a picture on that. Just on that, too, Alan Cattermole, he was buildings and assets, so he's in C&CO?A. Alan at the time we are talking about was in C&CO, assets, I think it is. He reported - I think at that time he was reporting to --

Q. Steve Corbett?A. It was before Luke Nicholls. Steve Corbett, yes.

Q. And he was the predecessor to Luke Nicholls?A. Yes.

Q. So when Luke came on, I don't know whether Alan Cattermole was still there, or did Andy Turner replace him? I'm just trying to understand.A. I'm not sure, I think that Alan may have left. I can't really remember those dates, but Alan didn't stay around too long after.

Q. So the point here, I guess, that I'm trying to understand, is that Alan had the asbestos management plan, that was his responsibility?A. Yes.

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Q. And that came from the Willis report, because the Willis report had assigned it to C&CO?A. No, no, it became his responsibility in the restructuring, when we went to purchase provider and the assets branch was moved in. That was always the responsibility within buildings and built assets. Prior to that, Tan Vo had been the manager and Brian had looked after it - Brian, Steve Kezler, Kay and Jim - and they'd been in assets and corporate services, which was the branch I was in, HR. That was 18 years ago. That's how I knew so much about it, because I worked quite closely with them.

Q. So in around 2013, or so, it moved to --A. Probably before 2013.

Q. Before that?A. I think it was the purchase provider - I should know the dates better, but I think it was about 2001, Michael Willis.

Q. At the time that Luke Nicholls was there, the asbestos management plan was always in his directorate?A. It had always been, and it had been in that directorate for a number of years.

Q. Thank you. Just on the purchase provider, that model, in your opinion, this is, do you think there was an issue with compliance almost by the nature of that, if they were saying that --A. Yeah. Look, I've worked for a number of organisations, State Government, State Government entities, private industry, and I think the idea of a purchase provider was that we operate in a business-like manner, so we'd be more accountable. I thought that was a good idea, but the way, for some reason, we set it up, we were different business entities and, therefore, this branch didn't talk to that branch, didn't talk to this branch, and that set up the whole silo system. So we actually had, in my opinion, a fairly robust safety system, and I'll back that up by saying that we'd been through at that stage the WorkCover premium discount scheme where we received $150,000 over a two or three-year period for having systems that were in place.

A lot of our procedures were used by other councils as models, and even in 2010, we were accepted into the WorkCover burning cost. So to be in the burning cost

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originally, when we went into it, you had to have all the procedures in place and everything was done. As I said, we were audited against the 12 or 14 other councils across Westpool, three or four of them were self-insurers, and we ranked third at the time. So when people say we didn't have a safety system, I refute that, and I've been a safety officer for 30-odd years, so I am familiar with it. It was a thing that was in place to develop certain jobs and to get certain things done and that was the story that they ran with.

Q. You said 30 years as a safety officer, but you mentioned toxicology?A. I did toxicology as one of my subjects at the University of Newcastle.

Q. What was your degree?A. I was doing a post-graduate diploma in WHS. Unfortunately I had one subject to go and I fell and fractured my skull, which sort of put an end to the reading and that for a while, so I didn't finish that.

Q. You still studied - you studied quite a lot of it?A. I've done the toxicology, I've done a lot of it. I'm familiar with it all. As I say, I was brought up in the railways with it. We had asbestos everywhere, so we were very well aware of it and what it was. I'm a blacksmith, we had asbestos lagging all through the place. I knew the risks and I knew the control methods and I knew why we used to damp things down, why we used to keep it encased, and I knew from the testing when we tore down the workshops, the parameters and testing, air monitoring, testing of people in the areas and that. So, yes, but it didn't seem to matter because I was internal. There was a view taken, and I think it was fairly well across all of the council, that you don't listen to people that are in council, you get external people to tell you.

Q. I'll come back to that. Did you ever see the Airsafe register in the end? Did you at some point see it, the register?A. I didn't actually see the Airsafe register. I was told that when they found it - when they could produce it, and I think Gary Johnston actually got a copy of it and Gary was putting it into a spreadsheet that we would be able to access, but it had been written in such a way, and I don't know exactly what it was, but our system wouldn't

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pick up on it and there was some discrepancy as to whether we'd actually paid to have that in there. I couldn't go into the details but, no, to answer your question, I never saw it. I saw a final version at the end that I was told is what we were working on.

Q. That means that the register, obviously, you hadn't seen it, it was not yet available to all the people, and the people that I would understand would need to have access to it would include hall committee volunteers, contractors, staff --A. Contractors would have access to it when they came on to one of our sites. Like, if we were to hold this hearing at, say, Springwood depot or Katoomba depot, and even here, we should have access to the asbestos register, the emergency evacuation register and things like that. That's there if we wanted to have a look at it.

Q. But it wasn't there yet, because you hadn't seen it?A. It hadn't been there.

MR SINGLETON: I object to that question. That needs a time.

THE COMMISSIONER: Can you put a time to it?

THE WITNESS: I know that the register was in place before I left, because it was at Springwood depot after this business came out. That's why I say I hadn't seen the full register but I'd seen excerpts from it and they were at the depots.

COUNCILLOR BROWN: Q. By 20 --A. Probably by early 2018m. You could go to Springwood and ask for a copy there.

Q. I was talking about earlier, though. A. I hadn't see it.

Q. When you were asking for it, it obviously wasn't available?A. It wasn't available to me, no.

Q. The point, I guess, is they were working on it and that was the reason, was it?A. That's what we were told.

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Q. This is a bit open, but do you have an idea why the managers were so resistant to you seeing or being part of the process --

MR SINGLETON: I object to that. That really needs to be made more precise, even if it were admissible in the first place.

THE COMMISSIONER: The Rules of Evidence don't apply here.

MR SINGLETON: No, that's why I have made the objection that way.

THE COMMISSIONER: What is your complaint about the question? It assumes a premise, for a start.

MR SINGLETON: It assumes a premise. It is hearsay and all of that, but the real objection, given the informality of the inquiry, is that it needs to be pinned down to a particular manager, one at a time. There's no point in saying that all managers have the same answer.

THE COMMISSIONER: Yes. I guess one way you could ask it, Councillor Brown, is to say, "Was there a particular manager that was seen to be very resistant to you having an involvement in asbestos management", or something like that.

COUNCILLOR BROWN: Q. Was there a manager, for instance?A. There was.

Q. Who was that?A. It was Grant McKay.

Q. Do you understand why?A. Again, I can only give you my opinion, having lived through it. I can be a forceful person if I think things aren't being done right. I'm not opposed to saying, "That's not right, that's not right". In my experience, people think, "No, that is right". Well, it's not, if it's not to legislation.

In workers comp and safety, I have a bit of leeway that you can go, but you can't break the law and that's always been the way that I've been brought up to do things. When we are not complying, then that's a definite. When you tell people, "We are not complying and you need to do

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something, you're the manager, you need to do something about this", they don't like it.

THE COMMISSIONER: Q. Rightly or wrongly, Mr McKay ended up making a decision that he wanted to bring in a new employee to take overall charge of what ended up being called the safety improvement project; correct?A. Yes, he brought in Mark Mulligan.

Q. He had Mr Shellshear before, I think?A. Mr Shellshear left.

Q. He only lasted a few months?A. He was only there for a couple of months.

Q. Whether it was necessary or not, in your own view --A. I think it was necessary to bring Mark in, yes.

Q. That might be right, but in the end, Mr McKay decided to do this?A. Yes.

Q. That was his decision to make and that's what he did?A. He's the manager, yes.

COUNCILLOR BROWN: Q. I understand what you have said is that you now have four or five people doing what you were more or less doing?A. That was the last structure I saw, yes.

Q. In your view, they certainly needed more resourcing?A. Yes, I put in proposals to Grant to that effect. I wanted there to be at least four positions to look after the workers comp, the rehab and the safety.

Q. What was his reply?A. I put a program in to him. He asked me to document what I wanted. I put it in there. I think he did the same with Mick. He asked Mick to do the same, how we saw the restructuring of the team, the positions, where they'd fit, what they'd do, and names to them. We did that, presented that and never heard any more about it. It's not too far from what we've got in place now.

Q. Just on that, this resourcing issue, you said that if the documents weren't in TRIM, they didn't exist?A. That's what we were told.

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Q. And that you had some on T drive, so they weren't on the TRIM. Was that a resourcing issue?A. It was a resourcing issue. As I said, I was the only person doing safety, workers comp and rehabilitation. I had assistance with the administrative side of it, and we had a risk management person who actually used to look after risk management. I did all of it by myself for virtually 16 years, 17 years, and then when they made John Odgers redundant, they brought in Yasoda Wickramasekera, who didn't do the risk management, Mick went over to do the day-to-day risk management stuff, so more fell to me.

If you've ever seen the suite of documents we got, you can't, and that's why I kept raising the issue. We can't do what we needed to do, what they call business as usual, plus keep on top of all of the legislative changes. In that time we'd had a number of legislative changes. We'd had the updated Act in 1981, and then again in 2000, in 2001 the regulations. So we needed all those documents. If you look at some of the documents, they refer to things that are out of date to the legislation. Still 95 per cent of them is still all right, but it's that 5.

I will back that up. Again, I was told firstly Michael Shellshear, who said he didn't know why he'd been brought in because the documents that he'd seen were all 90 per cent correct anyway. Then Mark Mulligan made a similar statement to us to say, "Look, it just needs tidying up", which is what he'd said. We weren't opposed to Mark or anyone coming in who could bring the systems up to date, but the core of the systems were there.

Q. So you expected him to continue in that role?A. I spoke to Mark Mulligan Christmas Eve 2017, I think it was.

Q. 2016/2017?

THE COMMISSIONER: Q. When he was consultant. A. He was there at that stage. We sat opposite each other, so I said, "Mark, see you when you get back in January". He said, "I won't be back in January, they haven't renewed my contract, so I've told them I've taken another contract, so the earliest I'll be back is February". So I expected him to be back in February and he

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never came back.

Q. This is the last question. This is just a little bit on the bullying. When you were, I suppose, by Mr McKay - I'm paraphrasing - you were told to mind your own business, or your opinion would be asked for if it was wanted -- A. "If we want your opinion, we'll ask for it", and the mollycoddling.

Q. The mollycoddling. Did you feel your job was at risk? If you persisted, did you feel that you --A. I have to say I never felt my job was at risk until I came back from holidays and was made redundant. I'd been there nearly 21 years. No blemish on my record. I was quite well-respected throughout the industry and through the organisation, I thought. No, I wasn't worried about my job. My job is to do the safety and the workers comp and to do all of that. I did that diligently. I didn't always agree. I didn't agree with some of the managers. Some took it better than others. Sometimes you have to do it. At the end of the day, I'm there to advise. If the manager wants to do what a manager wants to do, then that's their role, that's their managements that's what they are supposed to. As long as I've done my part and I've advised them, I can't influence that. I used to have influence, but that was all taken away.

COUNCILLOR BROWN: Thank you.

THE COMMISSIONER: Thank you, Mr Singleton?

MR SINGLETON: If I may, thank you, Commissioner.

<EXAMINATION BY MR SINGLETON:

MR SINGLETON: Q. Just to follow up on that, "all taken away", at least broadly speaking that's when Mr McKay comes along, is that the essence of the matter? A. Prior to Mr McKay arriving, I used to meet with the general manager weekly - monthly definitely - and weekly if there were issues that he wanted to discuss, or if there was anything that had arisen. I went to those meetings with Stuart Liddell. I met with Stuart weekly and we discussed the issues as they were. Once Grant arrived, you couldn't get in to see anyone.

Q. Back to the details, apart from that, I want to start

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with some general propositions and get a bit of a framework.A. Yes.

Q. Under various titles, you were the safety officer for many years?A. Yes.

Q. You started at the council in, I think, 1998?A. 1998, yes.

Q. Were you the safety officer then or was that a later development?A. I was brought on as the safety coordinator and I was brought on - the manager at the time was Bob Bentley. I was told by Bob and the then general manager, Ted Withers, that they wanted to put systems in place, because council didn't have any recognised systems. My background was I'd been in safety in private industry and in the railways. We'd put in safety systems. I'd actually been a member of a team that put safety systems in to - first was Lloyds Accredited, and then to AS801, I think it was at the time. I'd written policies and procedures. I'd been a training instructor, as apprentice training instructor. I'd done rehabilitation, I'd done programs when I was at Goninans, Maintrain, to put in systems of work that were safer, risk management, re-engineering were things we did. Instead of climbing around under trains, we built jigs and things like that. So that was my background.

I was brought in, given the job to do that, to bring systems into place, which is what I did. I was there also because of a general HR background. I've been in HR for a long time. In fact, I was the acting manager HR within the organisation up until Stuart arrived. Then he got somebody else to do it. So I filled a number of HR positions as well as the safety. We were a bit short on HR. Back in those days we didn't have huge amounts of money. It was sort of a thing with Michael Willis, you didn't bring in a contractor if you could do it yourself, and we did it.

Q. Your original title was coordinator. When did you get the designation "program leader"?A. There was a stage, and it's a rough guess, but there was a stage in the purchase provider where it was decided that coordinator wasn't a lofty enough title for people inside that were looking after more serious things, because

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we had coordinators looking after the workers. So it was decided that everyone would become a program leader. My new title then became program leader safety.

Q. Was that within a year or two of commencing at the council?A. Sorry?

Q. Was that in the first couple of years of you being in the council or much later?A. No, it was about six/seven years after. Somewhere in my file there's a letter that says what my new grading is. It meant no differences. I picked up workers comp and I got $15 a week more.

Q. There's four folders there. Pick up volume 1 of the big set. This is exhibit 82, page 1. Is that the asbestos program procedure for asbestos?A. Yes, that's a program procedure for asbestos.

Q. Just a few lines down from the heading there is "Approved by WHS program leader". Who was that?A. That was me. These were done and then they were reviewed on a regular basis. I approved them. So I reviewed them, I had a look at them against the current legislation, put whatever changes that we thought we needed, spoke with the safety committees and the managers and any changes that the managers might have wanted or considered to be put in, we'd review them, discuss them, then we put it up in there.

Q. Thank you for that.A. At that stage, in 2000, I think I was still just the safety officer, safety coordinator.

Q. Was there anyone else, even in those early days, who had safety in their title?A. No.

Q. In a practical sense, and leaving aside titles and grades and things like that, from pretty much the very beginning you were the chief safety officer at the council. Is that a fair summary?A. Yes.

Q. Without being precise at this stage, somewhere in the last decade you ceased being the chief safety officer?

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A. That's right.

Q. We'll come to that later, but throughout the first decade, you were the chief safety officer and you were, before Mr Mulligan turned up as a consultant, would that be a fair --A. Mark was never the chief safety officer.

Q. No, no, I'm just using that as a time.A. Do you want to know what we achieved in those ten years?

Q. No, there is documentation. Speaking of documentation, would you agree it's important to document safety issues?A. Yes, it is important.

Q. It's not good enough just to mention a problem in the corridor?A. That's right.

Q. You have to write it down?A. Yes.

Q. Email is these days a pretty good method?A. Yes.

Q. When you have told us that you've raised a number of concerns on a repeated basis, to the extent that they were at least important issues, we can check the record by looking at the emails and memos?A. You'd have to have a look to see what Grant put in. He kept the minutes for our weekly meetings. He sent anything that he wanted clarified.

Q. That's true, but when you had concerns, particularly when Grant - it is Grant McKay, isn't it?A. Yes.

Q. When he wasn't responding appropriately, when you raised those concerns, we can look in the emails to find out to whom you addressed your concerns and what you said?A. Yes. Normally I - well, I'd write to Grant, sometimes I'd write to Stuart. We had a lot of meetings. We were always having meetings, so, yeah, I probably didn't document. In hindsight, I didn't document as well as, say, I would have when I was working in the railways, and I

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didn't document as well as I would have when I was working in Goninans.

Q. To some extent they were documented?A. Yes.

Q. Broadly speaking, at least, the most important points will be documented and maybe some of the less important points will not have been documented?A. Yes.

Q. Maybe some of those important points were documented but also raised orally?A. Yes.

Q. We can get a sense, or at least an indication, of the points you are raising with Grant and Stuart and others by going to the record?A. Yes.

Q. Was there - and this is not I a memory test, so tell us if you cannot remember things from the 20th century - back then a model policy for councils?A. When we very first started there wasn't. If you have a look at the --

Q. We've seen the 2012 and the 2015 version.A. There wasn't because there wasn't anything done by the Local Government. Both those came from the Local Government Association.

Q. Actually, they came from the Office of Local Government. A. Sorry, Office of Local Government. Prior to that we did have some guidelines from, as I mentioned before, Westpool, which is now Metro Pool, or United, someone will have to remind me.

Q. We'll work it out. A. We always knew it as Westpool. They are our insurer. It's a cooperative. We had guidelines from them and, as I said, I was also - before council safe advisory network, I was also one of the founding members of the - we had a council safety net. Council officers from all around Sydney, we met once a month. Back in those days, in 2000, we were just starting. Everyone was just starting to get systems and that developed. As I say, I'd been brought on

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because I was familiar with systems and setting them up. We have SPP --

Q. What does SPP stand for?A. This is safety program procedure, but I think - it was either SPP or SCP, they were a consultation firm, a consultant firm that we got in, to help us put some of the pro formas in place and the layout of the procedures. I tried to keep them to the procedures that we'd had successfully that we'd got through with the audits and the safety accreditation, et cetera. So that's very much what it was, that's what we brought in, and that's where it's at.

Q. You made the comment - I'm not trying to be picky but I'm seeking to clarify a few things - in respect of the asbestos register there had been one released in 1999. A. Yes.

Q. Then had you said it disappeared, apparently. Can I clarify that? Whilst it was your understanding it ceased to be available, at least to you and maybe others, you don't actually assert that it was destroyed or thrown away?A. No.

Q. Accessibility ceased for you?A. I'd say it was probably 2002, assets and corporate services branch were split up and the assets branch, which is the people I've mentioned before, Brian Ross, et cetera, they'd gone into assets, or corporate services they might have been called - no, that was a later entity, but they'd gone into the assets branch. They had taken all that with them. That was their responsibility. They'd come from trades where it was originally was kept. Then kept in there and they liaised with trades to do all repairs on all our buildings, et cetera. That's when I lost track of it and I lost any access to it, because it was no longer in my work group. I could have got it at any time. All I had to do was ask Brian or Jim. I know it was there, because again the dates - I'm not sure but there will be a record in there somewhere, we actually had - we'd asked for a review of our buildings in relation to the electrical suppliers I think it was, and they'd done quite a large audit, and Jim was responsible for that, and he had the register.

That was the last time I saw it, because he'd used

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that register to give to the consultants that were going around and checking every building for compliance with the electrical boards, there was an issue with the electrical boards and I'm pretty sure the asbestos was in that as well. I know the asbestos - because there were issues raised about first-aid kits and things like that in our buildings.

Q. When did it come to your attention that the register was in an Excel spreadsheet form?A. It had always been an Excel that I've seen it in Excel.

Q. Sorry, it had always been there but you hadn't seen it?A. The first one that I saw was kept on an Excel spreadsheet, and I don't know when it changed from that. I was told that when Alan Cattermole had got the consultants in that he'd got in to do it, that they'd put it in a different format and for some reason we couldn't make any changes to it, which was pretty useless to us. As an organisation, you should have it and be able to update it and review it.

Q. But at that time there was a change from being able to access it and amend it to you could access it and look at it but not amend it?A. Again, I could never access it.

Q. You could never access it?A. After it left from assets and corporate services, I could access it then because I was in that branch. If I wanted to ask a question about that building, I went to Brian Ross and Jim Cameron and they provided the information. They had it then and, to my knowledge, it was in an Excel sheet form then. Then, the next time I ever heard about us actually having one, it was no longer in Excel.

Q. So the change was as a result of a corporate shift from one division to another, or one branch or directorate to another, the change was from you having access yourself and --A. I couldn't access it myself.

Q. At no time in your entire --A. No, I had to go to Brian, but because they were in my

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branch it was easy enough to do.

Q. Afterwards, you'd have to go to a particular person if you wanted to see it. A. The same people but in a different area.

Q. I just invite you to turn up page 1604, which probably is the next volume. I'll just put on the record while you're turning it up, this is a page within a document "Work health and safety workplace asbestos procedure in January 2017".A. Yes.

Q. Which I think you've testified you drafted?A. Yes.

Q. You've got it open?A. Yes.

Q. Now we'll find the right place. If you look at the bottom there's "References and related documents", the first is a State-wide asbestos plan. What document did you have in mind there?A. That was in relation to the local government plan that they put out, to refer to that - Office of Local Government.

Q. OLG and, before that, it was in the Premier's Department. Two documents have been shown to you today, the 2012 document called "Model asbestos policy" and the 2015 version of the same title. Is that what you're referring to there?A. They were for - yeah, that was for the policy. That would have been put into the policy.

Q. Sorry, that first line, the "NSW State-wide asbestos plan" --A. That was the document that was put out by the Office of Local Government, not LGSA - Office of Local Government if that's who you say who put it out, that's the one that's in referral to here.

Q. We looked at it today?A. Yes.

Q. 2015?A. Yes.

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Q. The council's asbestos register is self-explanatory but it's this document I asked you a few questions about and it's had various history. A. Various entities.

Q. The council's asbestos management plan, what did you have in mind there?A. Local government also had an asbestos management plan, a model, that we were supposed to have customised for our particular needs and our buildings and our assets, and that's what that should have been. We were told that was in place as well.

Q. So you say not only was there the documents we have seen today, the 2015 model asbestos policy, there was another document, which was a model asbestos plan?A. Yes.

Q. And you say you've seen that document - not today --A. I've seen - it was given to me, this is it, and as I told you, that's a draft that's not it, that's a menu, that just follows what needs to be in there, but our manager or senior people have been told this will fill the bill. In my opinion it wouldn't fill the bill because it didn't have the details of what we required as an organisation and that's why I used the analogy that you've got a menu there that tells you what should be available but not what actually is.

Q. Today you have been shown a model asbestos policy dated 2012?A. Yes.

Q. And another one dated 2015. You're saying you've also seen a model asbestos plan document?A. Yes.

Q. Who gave it to you?A. Grant McKay.

Q. And when you reviewed that model plan, you saw that it needed to be updated?A. It didn't have the detail that was required under the legislation.

Q. So your opinion was that what the State government put

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out was inadequate?A. Not the State government. Someone in our organisation had taken that model policy and they'd put Blue Mountains City Council and where it said "insert your name here" and put that up, that was in (indistinct), not the New South Wales government one.

Q. The rest of that is fairly self-explanatory. I'll just check the next page we want to look at. Could you go to page 1625?A. Yes.

Q. And if you look, it's the first of two pages in an email chain?A. Yes.

Q. 1626. Mr Long sends you an email seeking advice?A. Yes.

Q. You've replied?A. Yes.

Q. And you copied Mr McKay in?A. Yes.

Q. I think Mr Long copied him in, but you did. Mr McKay asked you to actually provide the advice that was requested. Did you provide that advice?A. Yes, I did.

Q. By what method?A. I spoke to Dan, I met with Dan, and I spoke to him about the examples that were available in either standards or whatever and if you have a look, Steve Kitching has put one where there are samples on there. It was a face-to-face meeting. I didn't provide it in writing. I met with Dan and we discussed the issue. I said, "This is what we used to have and if you talk to trades they may still have them."

Q. You write to him in your 22 February email. In the first line after "Hi Dan", you say:

There should be a register of all our buildings.

A. Yes.

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Q. Your understanding was that there should be a register that covered every building?A. Yes.

Q. Then you say the last time you saw that thing it was held by assets. That's in the next line?A. Yes.

Q. Did you regard the proposition that there should be a single register covering all buildings to be a matter of best practice, a matter of council policy, a matter of law, or some other?A. Dan was asked about it. I told him there should be one, it's legislation, and you have one for the whole organisation and it actually extends, if you want to go down to it, to any workplaces. By rights, we should have all our roads listed on it, all our public parks listed on it - anywhere a council worker is likely to be engaged, or a volunteer. So that should be on the register.

Q. All these things should be on the one register?A. Yes. At that stage they had just the buildings.

Q. That was your understanding of what the law required?A. At that stage. Now, that's what I told Dan, we need to have one register, a council-wide register that fits with the legislation and then from that we can extract. So if we need it in operations, operations could go and say: right, these are the areas under my control, the operations director or manager, and then print off that particular piece and have them in the depots.

Q. You understand that to be a new and changed situation since then?A. No. That's what we always should have had.

Q. You've always had it, even before it was legally required?A. As I said, anyone that needed it before contacted Brian Ross or Jim Cameron and they would get the parts.

Q. Just to clarify, you understand that, at least in the 20 years you were at the council, there was always one big register and separate registers for everything?A. There was one register - my understanding, just to clarify, there was one register and I knew that it was in

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existence for a number of years. Then it disappeared. Then we were asking questions about it, it came back, but, yes, the legislation by then required us to have it for all workplaces. So my advice was, yes, all our workplaces. Once we got all of our buildings, all our halls, all our major static workplaces, then we could look at all the others. We could do a blanket about the roads. Yes, our roads may contain asbestos, so be careful when you're working on them. But at that stage we were just going after the major things to make sure they were in place. We always had had it for all our buildings. As I said before, I gave you examples, we had them for some of our picnic sheds, because they were in the parks and they were - we knew it, so everything that was in there. That was set in place long before I came and that's why the register was there. That had been maintained originally by trades and then by assets when Jim and Brian --

Q. I want to be clear about it. When you refer to the picnic sheds, are you saying even before you came they were included in the one global register?A. Yes.

Q. You're not suggesting there was a register for each picnic shed before you came, an individual one for the sheds?A. Those sheds were listed in the original one.

Q. I'm talking about a separate register for the sheds. A. No, it's just the one register.

Q. And that was the situation, as you understood it, when you wrote this email to Dan Long?A. Yes.

Q. You were shown exhibit 11, page 16. It is the one with that flow chart, organisational chart. My understanding of your evidence was that you hadn't seen it before but you were aware of the substance, is that --A. I can't remember seeing that actual one. What page was it - page 11.

Q. Exhibit 11, page 16?A. Yeah, I wasn't aware of that actual flow chart, but I was aware of just a follow-up of what our procedures were. I think they were developed actually by Centium.

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Q. The flow chart or the procedures?A. The flow chart and the procedures. They'd taken over all of that.

Q. What I want to suggest to you is that the flow chart was emailed to all staff on 10 December 2017 to update all staff. You don't disagree that it was emailed to you. You just --A. No, I don't disagree with it. As I say, this was the Centium documentation. I was familiar with the things - I didn't go through every page of it.

Q. Who told you that Centium drew up this --A. I imagine Centium did it, because they were doing the project.

Q. Would you agree that December 2017 marked a significant change in the arrangements of the council with respect to asbestos management and safety management?A. I don't know it marked a significant change in the business management.

Q. Safety - the management of safety and asbestos took a significant step in December 2017, would you not agree?A. Yes.

Q. And it was a step that has improved things since then, to your observation?A. Yeah, I'd have to say yeah. I don't know what they're like in the last 12 months, but yeah. But I would also add, just to counter that, they were things that we'd been chasing for four or five years and it wasn't until I think the improvement notices starting coming in that we started to get somewhere with them. I think it's about the time that Alan came in as a chief safety officer we started to get some headway as well.

Q. Just have a look at that chart if you've still got it. You were taken to a box within a box headed "Safety team"?A. Yes.

Q. And the second column has two dot points. You were taken to the last dot point "oversight of asbestos management plan compliance"?A. Yes.

Q. Should that not be interpreted as a duty of checking

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that the council and its staff were complying with the management plan?A. That wasn't our responsibility and, I'm sorry, one person can't do that, so that would be ridiculous to put it in there. The asbestos management plan became our oversight to make sure that the stuff was in there, but it was still the responsibility of the local managers, was my understanding, that they would make sure that all the policy and procedures that were required were spread through their teams and followed.

Q. And for the record I'm not suggesting they didn't have that responsibility. As the de facto chief safety officer - I'll call it at that, and I'm only saying that because it wasn't the official title - for many years, you kept yourself aware of who else in the organisation had particular safety responsibilities?A. I tried to as far as I could, yep.

Q. If you saw someone who had a particular responsibility and wasn't doing it, you did what you could to fix it, warn about it or whatever?A. In the early days we had meetings and I'd speak directly to the managers or sometimes it was a team leader, sometimes it was a coordinator, sometimes it was a manager. So you'd speak to them appropriately at the time that it was happening and say, "This is what you're required to do. If you need anything, here's where we've got the procedures" and I would provide them with the documentation we had.

Q. Another dimension to the role was, was it not, to keep abreast of safety developments, changes in the law?A. Yes.

Q. And, as such, you would have been aware that in the years 2008 to 2010, 2011, that sort of time frame, there was a national effort to come up with a harmonised effort?A. The harmonisation scheme, yeah.

Q. You're aware of that scheme that eventually legislation was drawn up?A. Yes.

Q. And you were aware at the time that that was happening?A. Yes.

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Q. And in 2011 that legislation was actually passed?A. Yep.

Q. What steps did you take to get the council ready to be compliant from day 1?A. In 2011?

Q. And 2010 and 2009?A. We'd had training in what the harmonisation, we said this is a harmonisation, this is what's happening. We couldn't give too many details because things weren't settled, but we tried to get across to everyone that things would change, some things that we saw as constants in our legislation would be watered down, some things would be increased, but we would come into line with the rest of the States. So everyone was aware that was happening, kept updates, we provided training in the harmonisation. I'm pretty sure that Mick coordinated it. Around that time I was in hospital for about seven weeks, so I was out for a couple of months, but we'd organised harmonisation training for both the managers and the staff, so there were two different levels, and we called it the harmonisation training so that we could say this is what's happening. There was a lot of confusion, especially with our outside workforce because of the changes in some of the legislative requirements for operating earth-moving equipment, et cetera.

MR SINGLETON: Thank you, Commissioner. Thank you, Mr Anderson.


MR GLOVER: Q. Mr Broad is going to bring you a screen. If you have volume 2 there and go back to page 1604. Mr Broad is going to show you a document on the screen and we'll print some copies.

THE COMMISSIONER: So I don't have this either?

MR GLOVER: No.

Q. The big volume, Mr Anderson, volume 2. Mr Broad will help you. A. I'm a blacksmith by trade. Yes.

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Q. And you'll see there "References and related documents" and Mr Singleton asked you some questions and he took your attention to the first one, the New South Wales State-wide asbestos plan; do you remember that?A. Yes.

Q. I think Mr Singleton asked you whether that was a reference to the model asbestos policy and you thought it was. Do you remember that evidence?A. Yes.

Q. Look at the document on the screen that Mr Broad is showing you, and feel free to scroll through it if you need to?A. That's a WorkCover document.

Q. State-wide asbestos plan, implementation plan, July 1, 2013?A. Yes.

Q. Is that the document you're referring to in the first of that list on page 1604?A. At that stage, it would have been. We just referred to those documents.

MR GLOVER: Thank you, Commissioner.

THE COMMISSIONER: Thank you very much, Mr Anderson, for coming. You're excused.

<THE WITNESS WITHDREW

THE COMMISSIONER: Mr Carter?

<STEVEN CARTER, sworn: [12.48pm]


MR GLOVER: Q. Mr Carter, could you state your full name, please?A. Steven Carter.

Q. You're currently employed by the council?A. Yes.

Q. What's your current role?A. Environmental ranger.

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Q. When did you commence your employment with the council?A. December 2013.

Q. What was your position then?A. Team leader, roads maintenance.

Q. What were your day-to-day responsibilities?A. Day-to-day duties were obviously maintenance jobs associated in the LGA from repairing drainage to anything that's in the public area.

Q. You made a short submission to the inquiry; is that right?A. I did, yes. Just to note, too, obviously --

Q. Just wait a minute. I'm going to ask you - that's your email?A. It is.

Q. You'll see there it's dated 4 September 2018.A. Yes.

Q. Before I ask you some questions about what you've stated in here, is there anything in this submission you'd like to update as of today?A. Obviously this submission was put in during the investigations, so obviously, until today, obviously the conclusions have all been done. Council obviously have a different point of view now, they've adopted a lot of new procedures and policies. Obviously the council has investigated this issue, SafeWork has also investigated it, as well as the EPA.

So, in saying that, I'm satisfied with the investigations that happened and the conclusions.

Q. I'm still going to ask you some questions about the incident you refer to here.A. You sure can.

Q. You refer in particular to the stockpile site, Park Street, Lawson. Do you see that?A. Yes.

Q. This is in July 2017; correct?

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A. Correct.

Q. Can you just describe the work that you were doing in that period?A. In the periods that I specified?

Q. Yes.A. There were two teams, both on separate jobs. We were at the stockpile site to retrieve large sandstone rocks for two different easements that we were working on. So we were working in collaboration to help out. I had a machine on my job which I transferred on to the site, and then there was also another machine on another site to unload the rocks. So there was, yeah, two different teams. Obviously while we were there I had notified my supervisor to ask if we could use the materials, the stockpiles of materials there, to assist my trainees with training on the excavator that was there at the site.

Q. Who was your supervisor?A. At the time, it was Scott Sandford, but I believe he may have been off at the time, so it may have been Trevor Smith.

Q. And you were given that permission?A. Yes.

Q. Then what sort of work were you doing?A. Obviously in between the - in between removing the rocks from the site on to the trucks, in between the transportation, I was staying on the site with my team and I was basically - we had another vehicle there, another truck, so we were simulating removing the soil, putting it on the trucks, loading it up, unloading it, moving it around to basically train them up for similar circumstances when they do come up.

Q. You say in your submission that at the time you didn't know that the materials contained asbestos?A. That's correct.

Q. When did you find out about the prospect that the material contained asbestos?A. It would have been late September 2017.

Q. Is that the conversation with Mr Moore and you say here Mr Crewman - is that Mr Creelman?

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A. Mr Creelman, yes. We were advised after lunch that a team leaders meeting was going to take place. In that meeting, there was a few team leaders in that meeting - only team leaders - and in that meeting we were advised that the materials at the stockpile site were contaminated.

Q. After you were informed of that, you lodged a grievance with the USU?A. Correct.

Q. Was that grievance resolved?A. Yes.

Q. Was it resolved to your satisfaction?A. Yes.

Q. Further down on that page, you say in the third-last paragraph, the one commencing, "A lot of staff" - do you have that?A. Third paragraph down, did you say?

Q. From the bottom, working your way up, the one immediately above your contact phone number. You say here that you have had no support from the council?A. At the time, that's correct. Look, obviously there was a lot going on at that time. We had a lot of problems at the depot where there was a lot of miscommunication between management and staff. We were basically at the lower end of it, so obviously we were told at the last point. There was a lot of concerns with obviously our health and that, and our vehicles, because obviously dust transferred from us to the vehicles, but we raised a lot of questions. A lot of those questions went on deaf ears. I think in retrospect to what was going on, I think the council were basically - it was a difficult situation for them to be in, so in seeing what had happened, look, it took a long time for them to get back to us with a lot of problems.

Q. You mentioned there raising some issues about dust and vehicles.A. Yes.

Q. Other than in the context of the work at the stockpile site, was it?A. It was, yes. So obviously after this had happened, it was - I'm not too sure whose decision it was, but basically

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all the vehicles at that depot, and I believe maybe Katoomba depot, all the vehicles were shut down to commence testing on all them vehicles.

Q. You say at the time you felt you didn't have any support. Is that still your view today?A. No.

Q. What's changed?A. What's changed is obviously council adopted a lot of policies and procedures so this does not happen again.

Q. Have you received any training since that time?A. Definitely. In between the incident that was reported, I'd been through two different training processes, or days which were to do with asbestos, obviously identifying basically how to remove it.

Q. Had you had that sort of training before?A. No.

Q. Have you been offered health monitoring?A. Yes.

Q. Have you taken it up?A. Yes, I've done two tests so far.

Q. What's involved in that?A. Lung X-ray and a breathing capacity test, I think it is.

Q. Do you know how regular is that testing? A. I believe it's like every two years, from my understanding.

Q. There is one last paragraph I want to ask you about. The paragraph commencing:

The council Has been very vague in tell us the staff about any further information about anything ...

Do you have that line?A. Yes.

Q. What were you referring to there?A. Obviously, at the time of all of this we obviously

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raised a problem that we had with the area, but we were basically - we weren't informed, basically, with what was going on with us, with the stockpile site, everything. Basically everything that related to the depot, to the staff, we were basically kept in the dark at the time.

Q. When you say "kept in the dark", do you mean it was taking a long time for information to come down?A. Correct. Yes, it was.

Q. Did you eventually get the information you were looking for?A. Eventually, yes. I think without the help of the USU, we resolved a lot of the problems. Without the USU, the union, it would have taken a lot more time. I think with their help with our problems, it resolved a lot. I think out of that, a lot of the meetings were put in play as well, so it did take time for a lot of the problems to be resolved, but I think eventually it was resolved. Again, you know, you have to understand, too, that this was a very delicate and different situation that the council had been in. I understand that. When I was there at the time, in the deep of it, obviously everyone was very concerned with the safety and the health and their families and that. Now, obviously, look, it's a lot better now.

MR GLOVER: Thank you, Commissioner, that's all I have for Mr Carter.

THE COMMISSIONER: Q. Can I just ask you, Mr Carter, at the time you gave this submission to the inquiry, on 4 September 2018, you were off work?A. Yes.

Q. When approximately did you return to work, did you say?A. I had been off for a little bit. I'm not too sure when I came back.

Q. Was it in late 2018 or was it 2019?A. I'm not sure, to be honest.

Q. Can you give us your best guesstimate as to how many months you were off work?A. Four months, maybe five months.

Q. Can I ask if you have recovered from the PTSD?

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1397

A. Yes.

Q. When did you start your current position as a ranger?A. Probably about a year ago.

Q. That was a career path you wanted to go into?A. Definitely, yes.

Q. Unrelated to --A. Completely unrelated, yes.

Q. Can I just ask, the impression I have gained from your evidence is that at the time you put the submission in, in September 2018, there were still some unresolved issues.A. Correct.

Q. But the impression I gained is that they have largely been resolved satisfactorily from your point of view?A. Correct.

Q. You have mentioned 11 workers, I think, in this submission?A. Yes.

Q. And they are people you obviously know?A. Correct.

Q. Based on your knowledge of those people and any discussions you may have had with them, are they of a similar view to you, that they were distressed in the immediate aftermath of this, and for a while afterwards, but they now also have the same view as you that things have been resolved now to a general satisfaction, or others are still angry?A. Look, there is a lot of staff that are still currently at the depots which have a different point of view than I do. That's their point of view.

Q. You obviously can't talk for them.A. Exactly.

Q. But there is a mix of emotions and views still; is that right?A. Yes. Look, a lot of people expected a lot more from the outcomes of the investigations.

Q. When you say "investigations", are you talking more

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.13/03/2020 (14) S CARTER x (Councillor Brown)Transcript produced by Epiq

1398

out of, for example, safety?A. Correct. SafeWork and EPA. I think they expected a lot more, but obviously because I'm in the position I'm in, I understand the penalties that are associated to what was pointed out in regards to the issues that were raised.

Q. Please don't let me put words in your mouth, so don't have any hesitation in disagreeing with what I'm about to suggest to you, but when you say you've got the impression, or people have told you that they are unhappy with either the SafeWork or the EPA investigations, was the expectation that it was a surprise that ultimately, for example, the SafeWork matter was dealt with as an enforceable undertaking as distinct from other penalties?A. I think so, definitely, and I think the fact that - I don't think the EPA dealt with it the way that SafeWork did, as in, like, the enforcement. I think in consideration of what has been put through the evidence, I think they were disappointed with that.

Q. Are some people disappointed that there weren't some issues examined more closely?A. I think so, definitely - one hundred per cent.

Q. Particularly --A. Look, I think most of the problems were in management, which - I think most of the managers that were in question are no longer here, which has fixed a little bit of that problem. From my point of view, and some of the staff's point of view, definitely the culture changed from what was and what now has definitely changed.

THE COMMISSIONER: Councillor Brown, would you like to ask Mr Carter anything.

<EXAMINATION BY COUNCILLOR BROWN:

COUNCILLOR BROWN: Q. Mr Carter, I think there were 11 grievances, were there? Just on that, you're happy with how that was resolved?A. Yes.

Q. It is slightly different from the issue of the investigations. Were they happy with the resolution in terms of the grievance?A. To be honest, I can't answer that. It's their points of view. They may or may not be. I know they may not be,

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.13/03/2020 (14) S CARTER x (Mr Singleton)Transcript produced by Epiq

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but that's their point.

COUNCILLOR BROWN: Okay, thank you.

<EXAMINATION BY MR SINGLETON:

MR SINGLETON: Q. Just a couple of questions, Mr Carter. In the period that's the subject of your evidence today and your submission, I think you said Mr Sandford might have been the supervisor that you spoke to? A. Correct.

Q. But you weren't completely sure?A. I believe it was Trevor Smith that was there at the time. I believe Scott Sandford was off at that time.

Q. Leaving aside who is off and on, the general structure at that time throughout that period, Mr Sandford was the team coordinator over a few teams and the person above you?A. That's right. Scott Sandford, he basically looked after the Springwood depot. He looked over the R&T crews. I think there were one or two other crews he was looking over as well.

Q. His supervisor was the operations engineer, Mr Creelman?A. Correct.

Q. The manager for the branch was Mr Hahn?A. Correct.

Q. At that time it was called transport assets and civil operations? A. That is correct.

THE COMMISSIONER: Q. Is there are Mr Crewman and a Mr Creelman? A. I may have been incorrect in the spelling of his name.

MR SINGLETON: We think it is Mr Creelman, but if the Commission has found a Crewman --

THE COMMISSIONER: I haven't found a crewmen, I'm just wondering whether there is two people or one.

MR SINGLETON: We think there is one and it's Mr Creelman.

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.13/03/2020 (14) S CARTER x (Mr Singleton)Transcript produced by Epiq

1400

THE COMMISSIONER: Q. Is that possible, Mr Carter?A. It's Paul, just to clarify.

MR SINGLETON: Q. At the time of the briefing on 29 September, Mr Tony Moore was involved?A. That's correct.

Q. He's one of the other program leaders under Mr Hahn?A. I'm not too sure of that structure there, but you could be correct.

Q. Would it surprise you to learn that he was probably acting up in Mr Hahn's job at that time?A. It could have been so, yes.

MR SINGLETON: Thank you, Commissioner.

THE COMMISSIONER: Anything arising?

MR GLOVER: No, Commissioner.

THE COMMISSIONER: Q. Given you lodged a submission, I would just like to give you the opportunity, is there anything else you would like to tell the inquiry that you don't think we've covered from your perspective that's relevant?A. No, definitely not, thank you.

Q. Thank you very much for coming.A. Thank you.

THE COMMISSIONER: Sorry you had to wait so long to give your evidence. You're excused.

<THE WITNESS WITHDREW

THE COMMISSIONER: There are no further witnesses today?

MR GLOVER: That's right.

THE COMMISSIONER: We just have to have an early mark, then.

MR GLOVER: That's right. I have some documents I can --

THE COMMISSIONER: You need to tender Mr Carter's exhibit.

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1401

MR SINGLETON: May I respectfully draw attention to the --

THE COMMISSIONER: I will take off the phone number and the email address. Is that what you wanted to raise with me, Mr Singleton?

MR SINGLETON: That was the point.

THE COMMISSIONER: The exhibit will be subject to redacting Mr Carter's email address and his phone number.

EXHIBIT #101 EMAIL FROM STEVE CARTER TO BLUE MOUNTAINS PUBLIC INQUIRY DATED 4 SEPTEMBER 2018 SENT AT 9.38AM

THE COMMISSIONER: Is there anything else that needs to be tendered?

MR SINGLETON: Just on that, there is medical information about him. This is two paragraphs above the phone number. It is the fact that he's seeing certain professionals. It is out of date, it appears.

THE COMMISSIONER: I think you are right. Thank you for bringing that to my attention. I will make a non-publication order in relation to the paragraph that commences, "As a result". Thank you. That non-publication order is made under section 12 of the Royal Commissions Act.

MR GLOVER: There are two other documents to tender. You may recall I took Mr Nicholls to some reports to council about funding of asbestos remediation.

MR GLOVER: Sorry, Mr Broad, that should be redacted as well, that paragraph, "As a result", thank you. It is the email address, the phone number and the paragraph, "As a result I have been diagnosed", can be redacted.

MR GLOVER: Yesterday I took Mr Nicholls through some memos to the governing body about funding of asbestos remediation, and these are just the minutes dealing with those issues. There is an extract of the minutes on 12 December 2017.

EXHIBIT #102 MINUTES OF ORDINARY MEETING OF COUNCIL DATED 12 DECEMBER 2017

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1402

EXHIBIT #103 MINUTES OF ORDINARY MEETING OF COUNCIL DATED 27 FEBRUARY 2018

THE COMMISSIONER: Mr Singleton or Councillor Brown, is there anything you need to raise with me before Monday?

COUNCILLOR BROWN: No.

MR SINGLETON: No.

THE COMMISSIONER: In those circumstances, we will adjourn to 10am on Monday. Have a good weekend, everyone.

AT 1.09PM THE INQUIRY WAS ADJOURNED TO MONDAY, 16 MARCH 2020 AT 10AM

#

#101 [1] - 1401:12#102 [1] - 1401:45#103 [1] - 1402:1

$

$15 [1] - 1378:14$150,000 [1] - 1370:42

1

1 [9] - 1330:32, 1331:45, 1359:5, 1362:10, 1362:42, 1378:16, 1378:17, 1390:6, 1391:17

1.09PM [1] - 1402:1410 [3] - 1342:44,

1359:24, 1388:610.00am [1] - 1328:401001 [1] - 1341:181013 [2] - 1341:23,

1341:3510am [1] - 1402:1210AM [1] - 1402:1511 [6] - 1362:8,

1387:36, 1387:41, 1387:43, 1397:21, 1398:38

11.50 [1] - 1368:24110 [1] - 1360:212 [5] - 1371:3,

1388:30, 1401:27, 1401:43, 1401:46

12.48pm [1] - 1391:3513 [2] - 1328:40,

1329:151303 [1] - 1344:4214 [3] - 1328:41,

1335:2, 1371:315 [2] - 1340:23,

1356:2616 [11] - 1342:17,

1342:36, 1351:5, 1362:8, 1362:13, 1363:33, 1375:9, 1387:36, 1387:43, 1402:15

1601 [3] - 1342:38, 1344:41, 1345:44

1604 [4] - 1346:34, 1383:7, 1390:36, 1391:22

1625 [2] - 1348:17, 1385:10

1626 [2] - 1348:23, 1385:17

1633 [1] - 1351:41634 [1] - 1351:11

1696 [1] - 1352:211697 [1] - 1352:2817 [3] - 1342:36,

1358:15, 1375:91708 [2] - 1353:20,

1353:421709 [1] - 1353:371710 [2] - 1353:26,

1353:341716 [1] - 1354:371725 [1] - 1355:431783 [1] - 1356:251785 [1] - 1356:3318 [1] - 1370:101879 [1] - 1358:111977 [1] - 1349:261981 [1] - 1375:201994 [1] - 1349:371998 [6] - 1329:15,

1330:7, 1330:30, 1349:33, 1377:9, 1377:10

1999 [1] - 1381:171999-2000 [1] -

1332:42

2

2 [7] - 1330:45, 1341:18, 1352:25, 1356:30, 1359:5, 1390:36, 1390:44

20 [3] - 1344:30, 1372:33, 1386:44

200-odd [1] - 1360:32000 [9] - 1330:29,

1330:38, 1331:3, 1331:9, 1331:20, 1331:36, 1375:20, 1378:33, 1380:45

2001 [4] - 1333:8, 1337:8, 1370:18, 1375:21

2002 [1] - 1381:272004 [1] - 1349:312008 [1] - 1389:372009 [1] - 1390:9200m-250m [1] -

1350:32010 [3] - 1370:46,

1389:37, 1390:92011 [3] - 1389:37,

1390:2, 1390:72012 [11] - 1329:21,

1329:25, 1329:32, 1330:26, 1333:19, 1334:33, 1338:29, 1342:25, 1380:27, 1383:30, 1384:32

2012-2013 [1] -

1331:132013 [9] - 1336:29,

1339:19, 1342:25, 1348:1, 1369:3, 1370:13, 1370:14, 1391:18, 1392:4

2013/14 [1] - 1338:112014 [2] - 1341:1,

1349:302014/2015 [1] -

1349:262015 [7] - 1341:19,

1345:1, 1380:27, 1383:31, 1383:46, 1384:16, 1384:35

2016/2017 [1] - 1375:39

2017 [17] - 1345:47, 1346:24, 1348:4, 1348:5, 1348:14, 1355:7, 1358:15, 1361:46, 1364:7, 1375:36, 1388:6, 1388:17, 1388:24, 1392:47, 1393:44, 1401:43, 1401:46

2017" [1] - 1383:112018 [8] - 1358:43,

1365:40, 1392:22, 1396:32, 1396:40, 1397:14, 1401:13, 1402:2

2018m [1] - 1372:342019 [2] - 1329:18,

1396:402020 [2] - 1328:40,

1402:1520th [1] - 1380:2221 [1] - 1376:1422 [2] - 1348:19,

1385:4123 [1] - 1339:19248 [2] - 1339:18,

1339:29249 [1] - 1339:3327 [2] - 1341:1, 1402:229 [1] - 1400:52s [1] - 1359:8

3

3 [1] - 1359:530 [2] - 1344:30,

1371:1230-32 [1] - 1328:3630-odd [1] - 1371:738 [2] - 1332:13,

1334:2939 [1] - 1334:36

4

4 [6] - 1330:46, 1351:11, 1359:5, 1392:22, 1396:32, 1401:13

40-odd [1] - 1365:541 [1] - 1335:8438U [1] - 1328:23461 [1] - 1340:47

5

5 [1] - 1375:24

6

6 [1] - 1352:2869 [1] - 1336:33

7

7 [1] - 1329:1870 [1] - 1336:44

8

8 [1] - 1353:24800 [1] - 1342:1882 [1] - 1378:17

9

9.38AM [1] - 1401:1390 [1] - 1375:28900 [1] - 1342:1895 [1] - 1375:2396 [1] - 1338:27

A

Aaron [2] - 1355:46, 1356:44

able [3] - 1371:46, 1382:22, 1382:25

abreast [1] - 1389:33absorbed [1] -

1333:15accepted [1] - 1370:46access [21] - 1336:9,

1336:22, 1336:31, 1337:15, 1337:19, 1344:21, 1348:12, 1355:18, 1367:46, 1371:46, 1372:10, 1372:12, 1372:15, 1381:37, 1382:26, 1382:28, 1382:30, 1382:32, 1382:42, 1382:44

accessibility [1] - 1381:26


1

accordance [1] - 1334:14

accountable [1] - 1370:34

accreditation [1] - 1381:11

Accredited [1] - 1377:22

accusations [1] - 1366:24

achieved [1] - 1379:10Act [4] - 1333:7,

1333:8, 1375:20, 1401:28

ACT [1] - 1328:23acted [2] - 1368:15acting [2] - 1377:34,

1400:13actions [1] - 1336:5actual [6] - 1343:34,

1345:42, 1362:25, 1365:35, 1387:40, 1387:44

Adams [2] - 1358:4, 1363:3

adapted [1] - 1339:45add [1] - 1388:31added [1] - 1336:6address [4] - 1335:6,

1401:4, 1401:10, 1401:36

addressed [2] - 1359:8, 1379:42

adjourn [2] - 1368:24, 1402:11

ADJOURNED [1] - 1402:14

ADJOURNMENT [1] - 1368:26

Adler [1] - 1345:13admin [1] - 1342:27administration [1] -

1343:33administrative [1] -

1375:6admissible [1] -

1373:6adopted [2] - 1392:31,

1395:10advice [24] - 1329:30,

1338:47, 1339:2, 1345:7, 1348:26, 1350:18, 1350:24, 1351:19, 1351:25, 1351:45, 1352:2, 1352:13, 1352:15, 1353:7, 1353:12, 1353:14, 1353:41, 1356:9, 1356:23, 1366:28, 1385:17,

1385:27, 1385:28, 1387:4

advise [2] - 1365:7, 1376:21

advised [11] - 1336:22, 1336:23, 1337:4, 1337:13, 1338:17, 1344:20, 1361:30, 1365:30, 1376:24, 1394:1, 1394:4

advisory [9] - 1337:6, 1338:40, 1345:6, 1348:30, 1349:7, 1350:19, 1354:29, 1364:4, 1380:42

aftermath [1] - 1397:31

afterwards [2] - 1383:3, 1397:31

agenda [1] - 1338:19ago [5] - 1330:42,

1331:25, 1336:35, 1370:10, 1397:4

agree [9] - 1335:24, 1340:30, 1341:43, 1342:2, 1376:19, 1379:14, 1388:17, 1388:24

ahead [5] - 1330:45, 1332:12, 1338:27, 1340:47, 1348:17

aid [1] - 1382:6air [2] - 1358:6,

1371:32Airsafe [3] - 1349:16,

1371:39, 1371:42Alan [17] - 1336:17,

1336:18, 1336:22, 1339:8, 1358:44, 1359:42, 1360:35, 1362:40, 1369:24, 1369:26, 1369:37, 1369:39, 1369:40, 1369:44, 1382:18, 1388:35

Alison [1] - 1363:19allowed [3] - 1348:29,

1348:32, 1348:43almost [1] - 1370:28AM [1] - 1358:12amend [2] - 1382:26,

1382:27amounts [1] - 1377:38AMP [2] - 1337:29,

1337:35analogy [1] - 1384:27Analysis [1] - 1334:33Anderson [7] -

1329:1, 1329:9,

1350:14, 1368:21, 1390:31, 1390:44, 1391:28

ANDERSON [1] - 1329:4

Andy [1] - 1369:37anecdotal [1] -

1366:39angry [1] - 1397:34answer [16] - 1329:36,

1330:42, 1331:21, 1331:25, 1336:35, 1337:20, 1337:38, 1338:21, 1339:38, 1342:43, 1350:17, 1351:36, 1355:21, 1372:3, 1373:21, 1398:46

answers [1] - 1360:46anyway [2] - 1354:2,

1375:29apart [2] - 1331:24,

1376:47application [1] -

1348:38applied [1] - 1365:9apply [2] - 1348:37,

1373:9apprentice [3] -

1349:25, 1349:42, 1377:24

approach [3] - 1340:18, 1340:39, 1350:39

appropriate [2] - 1345:35, 1365:33

appropriately [3] - 1368:16, 1379:40, 1389:26

Approved [1] - 1378:22

approved [1] - 1378:24

April [2] - 1334:33, 1346:32

archives [1] - 1350:13area [11] - 1334:7,

1334:9, 1337:39, 1343:2, 1351:34, 1357:16, 1358:44, 1359:11, 1383:5, 1392:12, 1396:1

areas [15] - 1332:8, 1332:30, 1334:6, 1336:8, 1337:42, 1339:41, 1339:45, 1340:33, 1340:34, 1347:33, 1351:21, 1359:36, 1364:29, 1371:33, 1386:30

arisen [1] - 1376:42arising [2] - 1366:43,

1400:18arms [1] - 1340:19arose [3] - 1332:25,

1332:34, 1355:12arrange [2] - 1363:42,

1364:9arrangements [1] -

1388:18arrived [4] - 1330:30,

1350:25, 1376:44, 1377:35

arriving [1] - 1376:39arrow [1] - 1362:33AS801 [1] - 1377:22asbestos [143] -

1330:27, 1330:28, 1330:47, 1331:37, 1332:16, 1332:17, 1332:20, 1332:28, 1332:40, 1333:11, 1333:40, 1333:42, 1333:47, 1334:4, 1334:6, 1334:9, 1334:10, 1334:20, 1334:26, 1335:20, 1335:26, 1335:37, 1336:8, 1336:19, 1336:25, 1336:38, 1336:41, 1336:45, 1337:3, 1337:12, 1337:21, 1337:28, 1338:28, 1340:7, 1344:46, 1345:1, 1345:15, 1345:29, 1346:38, 1346:39, 1346:40, 1346:43, 1346:45, 1347:4, 1347:7, 1348:28, 1348:34, 1349:13, 1349:45, 1350:1, 1350:3, 1350:7, 1350:28, 1350:35, 1351:27, 1352:17, 1353:31, 1355:2, 1355:22, 1355:23, 1356:16, 1356:19, 1356:21, 1356:30, 1357:2, 1357:6, 1357:34, 1357:44, 1358:30, 1358:35, 1358:38, 1359:3, 1359:11, 1359:31, 1360:17, 1361:6, 1361:14, 1361:47, 1362:3, 1362:16, 1362:34, 1362:43, 1362:45, 1363:1, 1363:10, 1363:17,

1363:23, 1363:29, 1363:30, 1363:42, 1364:2, 1364:11, 1364:16, 1364:25, 1364:43, 1365:2, 1365:16, 1365:20, 1365:44, 1365:45, 1367:9, 1367:11, 1367:31, 1368:10, 1368:11, 1369:44, 1370:21, 1371:26, 1371:28, 1372:15, 1373:26, 1378:17, 1378:18, 1378:19, 1381:17, 1382:4, 1382:5, 1383:10, 1383:22, 1383:30, 1383:36, 1384:2, 1384:7, 1384:9, 1384:16, 1384:17, 1384:31, 1384:36, 1387:8, 1388:19, 1388:23, 1388:43, 1389:5, 1391:4, 1391:8, 1391:17, 1393:39, 1393:43, 1395:16, 1401:32, 1401:40

Asbestos [5] - 1346:1, 1350:29, 1350:30, 1351:12, 1352:31

asbestos" [1] - 1350:14

aside [3] - 1350:38, 1378:40, 1399:17

asked" [1] - 1366:18aspects [1] - 1343:2assert [1] - 1381:23assess [1] - 1363:22assessment [2] -

1335:24, 1359:1assessment" [1] -

1360:28asset [3] - 1355:15,

1355:21, 1355:24assets [33] - 1333:15,

1333:16, 1336:31, 1337:34, 1337:44, 1338:47, 1339:2, 1339:3, 1339:4, 1339:6, 1346:46, 1347:14, 1351:23, 1351:29, 1351:30, 1354:16, 1355:17, 1355:18, 1355:27, 1369:25, 1369:27, 1370:5, 1370:6, 1370:9, 1381:27, 1381:28, 1381:30, 1381:32, 1382:31,


2

1384:11, 1386:7, 1387:17, 1399:32

assigned [1] - 1370:2assist [1] - 1393:17assistance [3] -

1353:7, 1353:14, 1375:6

assisted [1] - 1329:32associated [2] -

1392:11, 1398:4Association [3] -

1337:9, 1345:14, 1380:30

assumes [2] - 1373:15, 1373:17

assured [1] - 1338:15astray [1] - 1342:23AT [3] - 1401:13,

1402:14, 1402:15attention [15] -

1330:14, 1331:8, 1331:16, 1345:25, 1347:46, 1347:47, 1354:1, 1354:44, 1363:34, 1364:33, 1366:38, 1382:9, 1391:3, 1401:1, 1401:24

audit [7] - 1344:2, 1344:6, 1344:9, 1344:12, 1344:14, 1381:44

audit/review [1] - 1344:31

audited [2] - 1344:7, 1371:3

audits [2] - 1335:29, 1381:10

August [2] - 1339:19, 1358:15

availability [1] - 1361:18

available [10] - 1351:43, 1353:6, 1360:7, 1360:8, 1372:8, 1372:41, 1372:42, 1381:22, 1384:28, 1385:33

aware [36] - 1331:1, 1337:2, 1337:4, 1337:13, 1338:32, 1338:36, 1338:40, 1339:7, 1339:11, 1341:8, 1341:9, 1342:15, 1345:5, 1347:32, 1351:24, 1354:5, 1354:10, 1357:4, 1360:47, 1362:30, 1363:27, 1366:42, 1367:45,

1368:1, 1368:2, 1368:9, 1368:14, 1371:27, 1387:39, 1387:44, 1387:45, 1389:16, 1389:36, 1389:41, 1389:45, 1390:17

awful [1] - 1332:30

B

background [4] - 1340:13, 1377:18, 1377:29, 1377:33

background" [1] - 1339:27

bang [2] - 1361:41base [1] - 1368:19based [5] - 1332:36,

1347:6, 1347:21, 1360:27, 1397:28

basis [4] - 1332:19, 1363:20, 1378:24, 1379:29

Beasley [1] - 1328:45became [8] - 1353:47,

1355:11, 1361:7, 1361:43, 1369:11, 1370:3, 1378:3, 1389:5

become [4] - 1338:36, 1339:11, 1345:5, 1378:2

becoming [1] - 1338:32

beg [1] - 1343:30began [1] - 1358:42beginning [3] -

1353:25, 1361:6, 1378:42

behind [1] - 1342:16benchmarked [1] -

1335:1beneath [1] - 1332:3Bentley [1] - 1377:15best [6] - 1336:6,

1340:11, 1349:1, 1360:25, 1386:12, 1396:43

better [5] - 1343:36, 1347:39, 1370:18, 1376:20, 1396:25

between [7] - 1332:27, 1362:33, 1393:29, 1393:30, 1394:28, 1395:14

beyond [1] - 1355:32big [7] - 1336:15,

1338:43, 1340:27, 1344:39, 1378:17,

1386:44, 1390:44biggest [1] - 1365:16bill [2] - 1384:25bit [14] - 1330:5,

1347:38, 1349:18, 1361:23, 1364:29, 1365:9, 1365:13, 1373:1, 1373:43, 1376:3, 1377:1, 1377:37, 1396:37, 1398:28

bits [1] - 1333:39blacksmith [3] -

1349:25, 1371:27, 1390:46

blacksmithing [1] - 1349:44

blah [3] - 1338:44blanket [1] - 1387:7Blaxland [1] - 1361:15blemish [1] - 1376:14bloke [1] - 1336:17BLUE [2] - 1328:27,

1401:12Blue [5] - 1328:35,

1332:29, 1345:34, 1350:31, 1385:3

BMCC [3] - 1333:43, 1335:11, 1335:43

BMCC-SPP-15.4 [1] - 1330:34

board [2] - 1352:5, 1359:21

boards [3] - 1350:27, 1382:3, 1382:4

Bob [2] - 1377:15, 1377:16

bobs [1] - 1332:18body [3] - 1346:10,

1354:29, 1401:40boiler [1] - 1350:7bottom [4] - 1362:21,

1362:42, 1383:21, 1394:22

box [8] - 1336:41, 1350:12, 1352:41, 1353:3, 1362:16, 1363:34, 1388:39

boxes [1] - 1362:28branch [16] - 1333:15,

1336:16, 1340:23, 1346:13, 1370:5, 1370:9, 1370:36, 1370:37, 1381:28, 1381:32, 1382:32, 1382:41, 1383:1, 1399:29

branches [1] - 1341:39

break [2] - 1368:24,

1373:44breathing [1] -

1395:29Brent [4] - 1366:8,

1366:11, 1366:13, 1366:14

Brian [12] - 1333:4, 1333:35, 1350:26, 1350:32, 1370:7, 1370:8, 1381:29, 1381:39, 1382:34, 1382:47, 1386:41, 1387:17

briefing [1] - 1400:4bring [11] - 1341:17,

1341:44, 1346:19, 1346:20, 1359:18, 1374:5, 1374:17, 1375:32, 1377:31, 1377:39, 1390:35

bringing [3] - 1343:5, 1349:4, 1401:24

broad [8] - 1330:32, 1341:17, 1346:12, 1390:35, 1390:37, 1390:44, 1391:12, 1401:34

broader [2] - 1346:9, 1364:29

broadly [3] - 1330:9, 1376:37, 1380:7

brought [16] - 1330:5, 1338:5, 1348:10, 1354:1, 1359:44, 1369:3, 1371:25, 1373:45, 1374:8, 1375:10, 1375:28, 1377:14, 1377:15, 1377:31, 1380:47, 1381:12

Brown [4] - 1368:33, 1373:24, 1398:33, 1402:4

BROWN [12] - 1368:36, 1368:38, 1368:40, 1369:20, 1372:33, 1373:29, 1374:26, 1376:28, 1398:36, 1398:38, 1399:3, 1402:7

brown [1] - 1368:40budget [1] - 1330:16building [4] - 1350:31,

1382:2, 1382:33, 1386:3

buildings [18] - 1332:20, 1333:41, 1333:47, 1336:20, 1349:47, 1350:28, 1360:12, 1369:25,

1370:6, 1381:36, 1381:42, 1382:7, 1384:11, 1385:45, 1386:11, 1386:23, 1387:5, 1387:11

built [2] - 1370:6, 1377:28

Bullaburra [1] - 1332:27

bulldozed [1] - 1332:31

bullet [3] - 1335:37, 1339:37, 1340:3

bullied [1] - 1366:43bully [1] - 1366:40bullying [4] - 1364:39,

1365:1, 1366:37, 1376:4

bundle [2] - 1330:33, 1332:12

burning [3] - 1335:3, 1370:47

bus [1] - 1359:19buses [1] - 1358:46bush [1] - 1363:31business [11] -

1349:6, 1358:9, 1360:27, 1367:33, 1370:33, 1370:36, 1372:29, 1375:17, 1376:5, 1388:21

business-like [1] - 1370:33

BY [7] - 1329:6, 1368:38, 1376:34, 1390:33, 1391:37, 1398:36, 1399:5

C

C&CO [3] - 1369:25, 1369:26, 1370:2

Cameron [4] - 1348:24, 1350:26, 1382:34, 1386:41

cannot [1] - 1380:22capacities [1] -

1349:14capacity [4] - 1348:30,

1349:7, 1350:19, 1395:29

card [1] - 1345:17career [1] - 1397:6careful [2] - 1365:34,

1387:8carriage [1] - 1339:7carter [6] - 1396:28,

1396:30, 1398:34, 1398:38, 1399:7, 1400:1


3

Carter [3] - 1391:33, 1391:39, 1391:41

CARTER [2] - 1391:35, 1401:12

carter's [2] - 1400:46, 1401:10

case [3] - 1330:21, 1330:23, 1362:37

categories [2] - 1359:6, 1359:28

categorised [1] - 1359:5

category [1] - 1359:8Cattermole [6] -

1336:17, 1336:28, 1339:8, 1369:24, 1369:37, 1382:18

caught [1] - 1359:39ceased [3] - 1378:47,

1381:21, 1381:26cent [3] - 1375:23,

1375:29, 1398:23Centium [12] -

1346:19, 1355:44, 1360:36, 1360:37, 1360:38, 1363:47, 1364:8, 1387:46, 1388:10, 1388:13, 1388:14

centralised [1] - 1342:12

Centre [1] - 1328:35centre [2] - 1339:41,

1339:43century [1] - 1380:22certain [5] - 1365:3,

1366:42, 1371:8, 1371:9, 1401:20

certainly [1] - 1374:31cetera [10] - 1335:46,

1345:21, 1350:7, 1357:6, 1363:6, 1366:28, 1381:11, 1381:29, 1381:36, 1390:28

chain [7] - 1348:18, 1348:22, 1348:27, 1353:23, 1353:25, 1354:41, 1385:14

chair [2] - 1358:5, 1366:5

change [12] - 1365:30, 1365:32, 1365:35, 1366:16, 1366:17, 1366:33, 1382:25, 1382:40, 1382:42, 1388:18, 1388:20, 1390:14

changed [11] - 1344:17, 1357:8,

1365:19, 1365:26, 1366:31, 1382:17, 1386:34, 1395:9, 1395:10, 1398:30, 1398:31

changes [9] - 1364:23, 1364:24, 1375:18, 1375:19, 1378:26, 1378:28, 1382:21, 1389:33, 1390:26

changing [1] - 1366:4charge [4] - 1336:16,

1338:47, 1347:14, 1374:6

chart [7] - 1387:37, 1387:44, 1388:1, 1388:2, 1388:5, 1388:38

chasing [2] - 1336:29, 1388:32

check [4] - 1332:19, 1341:32, 1379:30, 1385:9

checking [2] - 1382:2, 1388:47

chief [6] - 1378:42, 1378:47, 1379:4, 1379:7, 1388:35, 1389:13

Christmas [1] - 1375:36

chronological [1] - 1330:33

circulars [2] - 1338:37, 1338:38

circumstances [2] - 1393:35, 1402:11

CITY [1] - 1328:27City [3] - 1345:34,

1350:31, 1385:4civil [1] - 1399:32clad [1] - 1350:3clarification [1] -

1353:1clarified [1] - 1379:34clarify [5] - 1381:16,

1381:21, 1386:43, 1386:47, 1400:2

classed [1] - 1363:29clean [2] - 1365:36,

1366:16cleaned [1] - 1336:6clear [4] - 1330:45,

1334:1, 1368:45, 1387:19

cleared [2] - 1334:10, 1367:23

client [2] - 1341:28, 1343:36

climbing [1] - 1377:28close [1] - 1341:17closely [3] - 1368:5,

1370:11, 1398:22clout [1] - 1342:10Clyde [1] - 1350:2collaboration [1] -

1393:11column [1] - 1388:42columns [1] - 1337:25combined [1] -

1356:42coming [7] - 1332:16,

1332:17, 1361:36, 1375:32, 1388:33, 1391:29, 1400:29

commence [3] - 1329:14, 1392:2, 1395:2

commences [1] - 1401:26

commencing [6] - 1339:28, 1353:23, 1353:41, 1378:5, 1394:18, 1395:37

comment [3] - 1343:38, 1354:24, 1381:15

Commission [1] - 1399:41

Commissioner [10] - 1328:45, 1364:38, 1364:42, 1368:30, 1376:32, 1390:30, 1391:26, 1396:27, 1400:16, 1400:20

COMMISSIONER [41] - 1329:1, 1332:39, 1341:28, 1342:40, 1348:32, 1356:14, 1365:13, 1366:20, 1366:36, 1367:35, 1368:23, 1368:28, 1368:33, 1369:15, 1372:25, 1373:9, 1373:14, 1373:23, 1374:4, 1375:41, 1376:30, 1390:40, 1391:28, 1391:33, 1396:30, 1398:33, 1399:36, 1399:43, 1400:1, 1400:18, 1400:22, 1400:32, 1400:37, 1400:41, 1400:46, 1401:3, 1401:9, 1401:15, 1401:23, 1402:4, 1402:11

Commissions [1] - 1401:27

committee [18] - 1336:11, 1336:12, 1338:17, 1351:5, 1351:8, 1354:6, 1354:7, 1355:36, 1356:26, 1356:44, 1357:42, 1358:1, 1358:6, 1361:12, 1365:23, 1366:34, 1372:10

committees [7] - 1330:8, 1332:10, 1342:19, 1354:2, 1354:3, 1358:1, 1378:27

communicated [1] - 1364:27

communication [4] - 1356:40, 1357:2, 1357:30, 1357:31

comp [9] - 1342:17, 1343:29, 1343:32, 1343:33, 1373:43, 1374:34, 1375:5, 1376:17, 1378:13

company [2] - 1349:27, 1359:22

compensation [1] - 1329:31

complaint [1] - 1373:14

complete [3] - 1333:30, 1343:36, 1366:34

completely [2] - 1397:10, 1399:13

compliance [6] - 1364:12, 1364:32, 1367:39, 1370:28, 1382:2, 1388:44

compliant [1] - 1390:6complied [1] -

1364:17complying [3] -

1373:46, 1373:47, 1389:1

computer [3] - 1333:22, 1333:24, 1351:41

concentrated [1] - 1339:40

concern [3] - 1357:1, 1357:30, 1357:47

concerned [4] - 1357:10, 1357:13, 1357:16, 1396:23

concerns [7] - 1335:5, 1335:6, 1379:29, 1379:36, 1379:41, 1379:42, 1394:30

concluded [1] - 1368:30

conclusion" [1] - 1341:24

conclusions [3] - 1341:23, 1392:30, 1392:37

condition [1] - 1352:17

conduct [1] - 1363:24conducted [3] -

1335:38, 1342:40, 1364:8

conferred [1] - 1334:37

confusion [1] - 1390:25

consider [1] - 1338:43consideration [1] -

1398:18considered [1] -

1378:29consistent [2] -

1340:39, 1347:31constants [1] -

1390:14consultant [5] -

1336:24, 1375:41, 1379:5, 1381:7

consultants [6] - 1340:34, 1343:5, 1348:2, 1357:38, 1382:1, 1382:19

consultation [5] - 1329:42, 1330:8, 1332:9, 1355:43, 1381:6

consulted [4] - 1330:10, 1340:33, 1356:1, 1356:5

contact [8] - 1333:43, 1339:41, 1339:43, 1345:21, 1350:31, 1354:26, 1361:9, 1394:23

contacted [3] - 1361:9, 1364:3, 1386:40

contain [2] - 1333:42, 1387:8

Contain [1] - 1350:30contained [2] -

1393:39, 1393:43contaminated [1] -

1394:5content [2] - 1339:27,

1365:35context [4] - 1354:24,

1357:2, 1364:42, 1394:44


4

continue [2] - 1335:4, 1375:35

continued [1] - 1342:33

contract [2] - 1375:45, 1375:46

contractor [1] - 1377:40

contractors [7] - 1336:19, 1353:16, 1359:14, 1360:9, 1360:11, 1372:11, 1372:12

control [9] - 1330:11, 1330:14, 1330:19, 1337:45, 1337:47, 1340:24, 1342:12, 1371:29, 1386:30

convenient [1] - 1368:23

conversation [2] - 1336:27, 1393:46

convinced [1] - 1364:26

cook [1] - 1345:40cooperative [1] -

1380:41coordinated [1] -

1390:19coordinator [7] -

1343:24, 1377:14, 1377:42, 1377:46, 1378:34, 1389:25, 1399:19

coordinators [1] - 1378:1

copied [2] - 1385:23, 1385:26

copies [3] - 1347:31, 1351:38, 1390:38

copy [12] - 1333:26, 1333:27, 1335:26, 1335:30, 1335:31, 1341:28, 1344:30, 1345:33, 1351:33, 1371:44, 1372:35

Corbett [2] - 1369:30, 1369:31

core [1] - 1375:33corner [3] - 1330:37,

1333:17, 1362:9corny [1] - 1360:9corporate [11] -

1331:29, 1333:16, 1340:17, 1340:28, 1341:45, 1344:26, 1370:9, 1381:27, 1381:30, 1382:31, 1382:40

correct [19] - 1331:5,

1374:7, 1375:29, 1392:47, 1393:1, 1393:40, 1394:9, 1394:25, 1396:9, 1397:15, 1397:19, 1397:26, 1398:2, 1399:11, 1399:27, 1399:30, 1399:34, 1400:6, 1400:10

corridor [1] - 1379:19cost [2] - 1370:47costs [1] - 1335:3Council [3] - 1345:34,

1350:31, 1385:4COUNCIL [3] -

1328:27, 1401:45, 1402:1

council [69] - 1329:11, 1329:17, 1329:24, 1329:31, 1330:6, 1330:27, 1330:28, 1331:30, 1332:8, 1332:39, 1334:14, 1336:20, 1337:6, 1337:42, 1338:39, 1338:43, 1338:44, 1340:5, 1340:30, 1340:39, 1342:1, 1342:18, 1342:34, 1345:6, 1345:16, 1347:19, 1347:20, 1347:21, 1349:30, 1349:33, 1350:39, 1351:28, 1354:15, 1359:2, 1359:32, 1359:35, 1359:38, 1360:10, 1360:12, 1364:3, 1368:17, 1371:35, 1371:36, 1377:9, 1377:17, 1378:6, 1378:10, 1378:42, 1380:42, 1380:44, 1386:12, 1386:19, 1386:27, 1386:44, 1388:18, 1389:1, 1390:5, 1391:43, 1392:3, 1392:30, 1392:32, 1394:24, 1394:35, 1395:10, 1395:39, 1396:21, 1401:31

council's [9] - 1346:38, 1346:39, 1346:43, 1347:4, 1356:21, 1360:6, 1384:2, 1384:7

council-based [1] - 1347:21

council-wide [1] - 1386:27

Councillor [4] - 1368:33, 1373:24, 1398:33, 1402:4

COUNCILLOR [12] - 1368:36, 1368:38, 1368:40, 1369:20, 1372:33, 1373:29, 1374:26, 1376:28, 1398:36, 1398:38, 1399:3, 1402:7

councillors [1] - 1368:41

councils [7] - 1331:1, 1335:1, 1335:2, 1338:28, 1370:45, 1371:3, 1380:23

count [1] - 1344:33counted [1] - 1357:7counter [1] - 1388:31couple [11] - 1334:46,

1355:12, 1355:28, 1357:42, 1361:21, 1361:28, 1374:14, 1378:9, 1390:21, 1399:7

cover [1] - 1334:24covered [2] - 1386:3,

1400:25covering [1] - 1386:11created [5] - 1332:7,

1332:24, 1332:35, 1344:38, 1346:25

Creelman [6] - 1393:47, 1394:1, 1399:26, 1399:37, 1399:40, 1399:46

Crewman [3] - 1393:47, 1399:36, 1399:41

crewmen [1] - 1399:43crews [2] - 1399:21,

1399:22crisis [2] - 1356:19,

1356:20Cultural [1] - 1328:35culture [1] - 1398:30current [4] - 1352:39,

1378:25, 1391:46, 1397:3

custodian [2] - 1337:34, 1337:39

customised [1] - 1384:10

D

Damien [2] - 1357:43, 1357:45

damp [1] - 1371:30Dan [10] - 1367:16,

1367:22, 1367:24, 1385:32, 1385:37, 1385:42, 1386:14, 1386:26, 1387:33

Dangerous [1] - 1350:29

Daniel [3] - 1345:13, 1345:15, 1345:19

Danny [1] - 1360:9dark [2] - 1396:5,

1396:7date [5] - 1330:37,

1352:25, 1375:23, 1375:32, 1401:21

DATED [3] - 1401:13, 1401:45, 1402:1

dated [7] - 1339:19, 1341:1, 1345:47, 1346:24, 1384:32, 1384:35, 1392:22

dates [3] - 1369:40, 1370:18, 1381:40

day-to-day [4] - 1329:28, 1375:12, 1392:9, 1392:10

days [11] - 1332:30, 1333:23, 1342:47, 1350:11, 1361:21, 1377:38, 1378:36, 1379:25, 1380:45, 1389:23, 1395:16

de [1] - 1389:13deaf [1] - 1394:33deal [3] - 1332:24,

1332:35, 1338:43dealing [4] - 1330:27,

1330:28, 1361:42, 1401:41

dealings [2] - 1349:13, 1367:11

dealt [2] - 1398:13, 1398:16

decade [2] - 1378:47, 1379:4

December [5] - 1388:6, 1388:17, 1388:24, 1392:4, 1401:43

DECEMBER [1] - 1401:46

decided [8] - 1331:38, 1338:16, 1340:14, 1346:18, 1361:43, 1374:19, 1377:45, 1378:2

decision [4] - 1359:30, 1374:5, 1374:23, 1394:47

deep [1] - 1396:23default [1] - 1336:13

definite [1] - 1373:46definitely [8] -

1376:40, 1395:14, 1397:7, 1398:15, 1398:23, 1398:30, 1398:31, 1400:27

degree [1] - 1371:17delicate [1] - 1396:21department [1] -

1383:29departments [3] -

1340:5, 1340:31, 1341:39

depot [14] - 1351:5, 1351:22, 1351:30, 1351:35, 1359:10, 1365:46, 1372:14, 1372:28, 1394:27, 1395:1, 1395:2, 1396:4, 1399:21

depots [6] - 1354:25, 1354:26, 1354:28, 1372:31, 1386:32, 1397:36

describe [2] - 1360:24, 1393:3

descriptors [1] - 1362:28

designation [1] - 1377:43

desk [1] - 1345:37destroyed [1] -

1381:23detail [1] - 1384:44detail" [1] - 1345:42details [5] - 1345:21,

1372:3, 1376:47, 1384:26, 1390:12

develop [5] - 1330:3, 1330:11, 1332:15, 1339:12, 1371:8

developed [13] - 1330:10, 1331:31, 1331:35, 1332:26, 1332:27, 1337:29, 1340:18, 1345:10, 1347:37, 1355:16, 1380:47, 1387:46

developing [1] - 1329:46

development [3] - 1329:42, 1353:12, 1377:13

developments [1] - 1389:33

diagnosed [1] - 1401:37

diagram [7] - 1362:7, 1362:13, 1362:24, 1362:25, 1362:27,


5

1363:9, 1363:35differences [1] -

1378:13different [20] -

1331:30, 1337:16, 1337:42, 1340:20, 1341:32, 1343:1, 1349:14, 1352:14, 1355:37, 1370:36, 1382:20, 1383:5, 1390:23, 1392:31, 1393:10, 1393:14, 1395:15, 1396:21, 1397:36, 1398:43

differently [2] - 1366:29, 1367:12

difficult [1] - 1394:35difficulties [1] -

1345:18diligently [1] -

1376:18dimension [1] -

1389:32diploma [1] - 1371:18direct [2] - 1369:20,

1369:23directed [1] - 1355:27directing [1] - 1363:33directly [1] - 1389:24director [2] - 1369:2,

1386:31directorate [4] -

1368:45, 1370:22, 1370:24, 1382:41

directorates [1] - 1353:8

directors [1] - 1346:13disagree [2] - 1388:7,

1388:9disagreed [1] - 1357:9disagreeing [1] -

1398:8disappeared [5] -

1332:45, 1333:18, 1333:21, 1381:20, 1387:1

disappointed [2] - 1398:19, 1398:21

discount [1] - 1370:41discovery [1] -

1365:44discrepancy [1] -

1372:1discuss [4] - 1343:46,

1353:16, 1376:41, 1378:29

discussed [9] - 1344:36, 1352:38, 1355:35, 1361:22, 1363:20, 1365:43,

1376:44, 1385:37discussing [2] -

1352:45, 1355:33discussion [9] -

1341:28, 1343:37, 1350:22, 1350:39, 1350:41, 1355:10, 1355:11, 1355:32, 1360:17

discussions [6] - 1344:1, 1344:4, 1350:47, 1353:45, 1355:6, 1397:29

disease [1] - 1359:21dismantling [1] -

1349:15disposable [1] -

1331:41disrepair [1] - 1340:27distinct [1] - 1398:14distressed [1] -

1397:30division [1] - 1382:41document [45] -

1330:7, 1330:41, 1331:1, 1331:9, 1331:20, 1331:45, 1331:47, 1332:24, 1332:35, 1334:15, 1336:31, 1337:20, 1337:21, 1337:45, 1338:32, 1339:22, 1339:28, 1345:28, 1345:34, 1345:47, 1346:2, 1346:5, 1346:15, 1346:16, 1346:24, 1346:25, 1352:31, 1354:37, 1374:37, 1379:14, 1379:46, 1380:1, 1383:9, 1383:22, 1383:30, 1383:38, 1384:3, 1384:17, 1384:20, 1384:36, 1390:37, 1391:12, 1391:15, 1391:21

documentation [6] - 1344:20, 1356:7, 1379:13, 1379:14, 1388:10, 1389:29

documented [5] - 1333:13, 1380:4, 1380:8, 1380:9, 1380:12

documents [36] - 1329:47, 1331:25, 1331:29, 1332:4, 1332:7, 1332:14, 1332:15, 1334:18, 1339:38, 1339:39,

1340:9, 1340:28, 1342:16, 1343:11, 1343:13, 1344:8, 1344:26, 1344:28, 1344:38, 1344:39, 1347:23, 1347:32, 1347:36, 1374:46, 1375:15, 1375:21, 1375:22, 1375:28, 1383:21, 1383:29, 1384:15, 1391:2, 1391:24, 1400:44, 1401:30

Documents [1] - 1346:35

Documents" [1] - 1330:46

done [42] - 1330:20, 1334:14, 1334:46, 1335:2, 1336:2, 1336:25, 1338:24, 1339:11, 1341:8, 1342:11, 1342:27, 1342:36, 1343:6, 1343:39, 1345:42, 1348:2, 1349:17, 1350:30, 1354:14, 1354:35, 1358:40, 1359:20, 1360:6, 1360:43, 1361:39, 1362:29, 1363:25, 1366:25, 1371:2, 1371:9, 1371:24, 1373:38, 1376:24, 1377:24, 1377:25, 1378:23, 1380:28, 1381:43, 1392:30, 1395:26

dot [8] - 1335:19, 1356:34, 1356:37, 1363:22, 1363:38, 1364:11, 1388:42, 1388:43

down [28] - 1334:8, 1334:24, 1335:14, 1341:35, 1341:47, 1350:2, 1350:12, 1353:3, 1354:25, 1358:19, 1359:11, 1359:21, 1361:36, 1361:38, 1362:21, 1365:23, 1368:12, 1371:30, 1371:31, 1373:19, 1378:21, 1379:22, 1386:17, 1390:15, 1394:17, 1394:20, 1395:2, 1396:8

draft [11] - 1343:37, 1343:39, 1343:46,

1346:2, 1346:4, 1346:8, 1346:9, 1346:16, 1347:42, 1384:22

draft" [1] - 1341:29drafted [1] - 1383:14drainage [1] - 1392:11draw [5] - 1331:15,

1347:45, 1364:32, 1366:37, 1401:1

drawing [4] - 1331:8, 1345:25, 1347:47, 1354:44

drawn [1] - 1389:42drew [2] - 1330:14,

1388:13drive [6] - 1344:21,

1344:22, 1344:24, 1344:25, 1375:2

during [1] - 1392:28dust [3] - 1359:21,

1394:31, 1394:40duties [1] - 1392:10duty [1] - 1388:47

E

earliest [1] - 1375:46early [4] - 1372:34,

1378:36, 1389:23, 1400:41

ears [1] - 1394:33earth [1] - 1390:27earth-moving [1] -

1390:27easements [1] -

1393:10easy [1] - 1383:1effect [1] - 1374:32effort [2] - 1389:38eight [1] - 1359:36either [11] - 1334:20,

1347:10, 1350:44, 1357:15, 1361:11, 1364:2, 1364:4, 1381:6, 1385:33, 1390:40, 1398:10

electrical [3] - 1381:42, 1382:3

EMAIL [1] - 1401:12email [19] - 1348:18,

1350:24, 1350:38, 1353:23, 1353:25, 1353:26, 1353:41, 1354:41, 1379:25, 1385:14, 1385:17, 1385:41, 1387:33, 1392:19, 1401:4, 1401:10, 1401:36

emailed [2] - 1388:6,

1388:7emails [3] - 1360:8,

1379:31, 1379:41emergency [2] -

1351:33, 1372:16emotions [1] -

1397:42employed [2] -

1329:11, 1391:43employee [1] - 1374:6employees [3] -

1342:19, 1353:15, 1359:16

employment [3] - 1329:14, 1359:3, 1392:2

emu [1] - 1332:18emu-bobs [1] -

1332:18encased [1] - 1371:30end [12] - 1341:5,

1345:28, 1352:6, 1355:29, 1361:46, 1364:37, 1371:20, 1371:40, 1372:4, 1374:19, 1376:21, 1394:29

endeavour [2] - 1340:6, 1340:31

ended [5] - 1349:40, 1352:5, 1354:12, 1374:4, 1374:6

endorsed [3] - 1346:15, 1346:18, 1352:38

endorsement [1] - 1352:38

enforceable [1] - 1398:13

enforcement [1] - 1398:17

engaged [6] - 1336:24, 1337:11, 1345:14, 1350:35, 1355:45, 1386:19

engaging [1] - 1336:19

engineer [1] - 1399:25engineering [1] -

1377:27entire [1] - 1382:46entities [4] - 1340:16,

1370:31, 1370:36, 1384:5

entity [1] - 1381:31environmental [1] -

1391:47EPA [4] - 1392:34,

1398:2, 1398:11, 1398:16


6

equipment [2] - 1361:18, 1390:27

escapes [1] - 1359:22especially [1] -

1390:25essence [1] - 1376:38established [2] -

1337:8, 1361:47et [10] - 1335:46,

1345:21, 1350:7, 1357:6, 1363:6, 1366:28, 1381:11, 1381:29, 1381:36, 1390:28

evacuation [1] - 1372:16

Eve [1] - 1375:36eventually [5] -

1345:33, 1389:41, 1396:11, 1396:13, 1396:19

everywhere [2] - 1350:1, 1371:26

evidence [14] - 1333:13, 1333:45, 1336:21, 1341:22, 1352:46, 1363:39, 1364:36, 1364:37, 1387:38, 1391:9, 1397:13, 1398:18, 1399:8, 1400:33

Evidence [1] - 1373:9exactly [3] - 1362:39,

1371:47, 1397:40EXAMINATION [7] -

1329:6, 1368:38, 1376:34, 1390:33, 1391:37, 1398:36, 1399:5

examined [1] - 1398:22

example [6] - 1332:23, 1332:34, 1333:46, 1343:9, 1398:1, 1398:12

examples [4] - 1366:37, 1367:35, 1385:33, 1387:12

excavator [1] - 1393:18

Excel [7] - 1333:28, 1382:10, 1382:11, 1382:12, 1382:16, 1382:36, 1382:38

exception [1] - 1343:44

excerpts [1] - 1372:30exchange [1] -

1350:38excused [2] - 1391:29,

1400:33executive [2] - 1335:8,

1346:8EXHIBIT [3] - 1401:12,

1401:45, 1402:1exhibit [6] - 1362:8,

1378:17, 1387:36, 1387:43, 1400:46, 1401:9

exist [1] - 1374:46exist" [1] - 1343:12existence [2] -

1332:40, 1387:1existing [1] - 1329:43expectation [1] -

1398:11expected [5] -

1354:30, 1375:35, 1375:47, 1397:44, 1398:2

experience [4] - 1343:43, 1357:37, 1366:25, 1373:39

experienced [1] - 1348:34

expertise [1] - 1343:43

explained [1] - 1355:29

explanatory [2] - 1384:2, 1385:8

exposed [2] - 1359:3, 1359:33

exposure [6] - 1340:8, 1357:6, 1357:13, 1357:26, 1363:23, 1363:30

expressed [1] - 1341:47

expresses [1] - 1340:3extended [1] -

1359:35extends [1] - 1386:16extent [2] - 1379:29,

1380:4external [4] - 1340:34,

1346:20, 1364:1, 1371:37

extra [1] - 1361:28extract [2] - 1386:28,

1401:42eye [2] - 1368:13

F

face [5] - 1331:41, 1344:37, 1385:36

face-to-face [2] - 1344:37, 1385:36

facilities [1] - 1354:15

fact [5] - 1331:16, 1357:27, 1377:34, 1398:15, 1401:20

facto [1] - 1389:13fair [4] - 1349:18,

1365:9, 1378:43, 1379:6

fairly [10] - 1348:34, 1349:12, 1350:8, 1350:14, 1350:43, 1354:26, 1361:39, 1370:39, 1371:35, 1385:8

fairness [1] - 1358:2fall [1] - 1340:27familiar [9] - 1350:4,

1350:8, 1350:14, 1362:25, 1368:42, 1371:7, 1371:25, 1381:1, 1388:10

families [1] - 1396:24fanning [1] - 1365:4far [3] - 1374:42,

1389:18, 1395:26February [4] -

1346:29, 1348:19, 1375:47, 1385:41

FEBRUARY [1] - 1402:2

February" [1] - 1375:47

feelings [1] - 1366:42fell [3] - 1342:16,

1371:19, 1375:13fellow [1] - 1345:13felt [2] - 1376:12,

1395:5few [8] - 1345:18,

1357:35, 1374:13, 1378:21, 1381:16, 1384:3, 1394:3, 1399:19

file [2] - 1358:11, 1378:12

files [1] - 1359:44fill [2] - 1384:24,

1384:25filled [1] - 1377:36filters [3] - 1361:17,

1361:25, 1361:28final [8] - 1341:29,

1343:41, 1347:9, 1347:10, 1347:31, 1347:36, 1360:3, 1372:4

finalised [4] - 1338:18, 1344:27, 1347:26, 1347:28

finally [1] - 1364:36fine [3] - 1344:7,

1347:38, 1365:35fine" [1] - 1368:7finish [2] - 1329:17,

1371:21finished [3] - 1339:34,

1341:26, 1352:42finishes [1] - 1348:22firm [2] - 1381:6,

1381:7first [34] - 1331:2,

1331:35, 1332:23, 1335:19, 1336:41, 1339:37, 1341:25, 1342:44, 1344:41, 1346:8, 1346:16, 1346:25, 1348:18, 1350:25, 1352:47, 1358:15, 1358:46, 1359:39, 1360:4, 1360:22, 1361:14, 1373:6, 1377:21, 1378:9, 1379:3, 1380:24, 1382:6, 1382:16, 1383:22, 1383:36, 1385:13, 1385:42, 1391:3, 1391:21

first-aid [1] - 1382:6firstly [1] - 1375:26fit [1] - 1374:40fits [1] - 1386:27fitted [1] - 1361:26five [6] - 1335:38,

1342:35, 1359:24, 1374:27, 1388:32, 1396:45

fix [1] - 1389:21fixed [1] - 1398:28fixing [1] - 1333:14flames [1] - 1365:4flow [5] - 1387:37,

1387:44, 1388:1, 1388:2, 1388:5

folder [1] - 1341:17folders [1] - 1378:16follow [4] - 1352:16,

1356:10, 1376:36, 1387:45

follow-up [1] - 1387:45

followed [2] - 1332:21, 1389:10

following [7] - 1333:47, 1339:28, 1347:24, 1352:2, 1356:12, 1356:14, 1356:22

follows [2] - 1346:4, 1384:23

food [1] - 1345:39

foot [4] - 1341:3, 1353:26, 1353:42, 1363:34

for" [1] - 1346:10force [1] - 1362:17forced [1] - 1329:18forceful [1] - 1373:37form [4] - 1352:39,

1363:10, 1382:10, 1382:36

formas [1] - 1381:8format [1] - 1382:20formed [1] - 1355:24formerly [1] - 1329:11forms [1] - 1363:14forward [2] - 1329:1,

1329:25foundation [1] -

1366:26founding [1] - 1380:43four [9] - 1335:36,

1342:35, 1342:47, 1371:4, 1374:27, 1374:33, 1378:16, 1388:32, 1396:45

fourth [1] - 1356:34fractured [1] - 1371:20frame [2] - 1329:20,

1389:37framework [1] -

1377:2free [1] - 1391:13frequently [2] -

1354:26, 1359:9Friday [1] - 1328:40FROM [1] - 1401:12front [3] - 1330:33,

1351:33, 1363:33full [7] - 1329:8,

1338:44, 1340:10, 1351:22, 1368:3, 1372:29, 1391:39

fully [4] - 1364:26, 1365:7, 1367:45, 1368:9

function [2] - 1329:28, 1360:27

funding [2] - 1401:32, 1401:40

G

gained [2] - 1397:12, 1397:17

Gap [1] - 1334:32garage [1] - 1365:45Gary [8] - 1351:24,

1354:1, 1354:42, 1355:13, 1357:41, 1367:2, 1371:44,


7

1371:45gathering [1] - 1337:7general [14] - 1330:33,

1332:21, 1339:42, 1349:44, 1350:47, 1351:2, 1353:45, 1365:13, 1376:40, 1377:1, 1377:16, 1377:33, 1397:33, 1399:17

generally [2] - 1357:30, 1366:40

given [15] - 1336:30, 1337:15, 1337:19, 1343:37, 1351:24, 1358:7, 1360:34, 1363:38, 1364:28, 1368:3, 1373:18, 1377:31, 1384:21, 1393:25, 1400:22

global [1] - 1387:21GLOVER [25] -

1329:6, 1329:8, 1333:45, 1341:31, 1344:41, 1350:17, 1356:25, 1365:15, 1365:42, 1367:26, 1368:21, 1368:30, 1390:33, 1390:35, 1390:42, 1391:26, 1391:37, 1391:39, 1396:27, 1400:20, 1400:39, 1400:44, 1401:30, 1401:34, 1401:39

gloves [1] - 1331:41glue [1] - 1334:23goggles [1] - 1331:42Goninans [5] -

1349:22, 1349:27, 1350:1, 1377:25, 1380:2

governance [8] - 1336:11, 1336:12, 1338:14, 1348:8, 1369:4, 1369:7, 1369:15, 1369:16

governing [1] - 1401:40

GOVERNMENT [1] - 1328:23

government [8] - 1337:11, 1364:5, 1383:24, 1383:39, 1384:9, 1384:47, 1385:2, 1385:6

Government [12] - 1332:30, 1337:9, 1345:11, 1345:14, 1370:31, 1380:29,

1380:30, 1380:33, 1380:34, 1383:26, 1383:39

grades [1] - 1378:41grading [1] - 1378:12graduate [1] - 1371:18Grant [21] - 1343:47,

1344:39, 1345:8, 1345:21, 1348:15, 1348:46, 1354:20, 1355:35, 1361:36, 1367:36, 1369:3, 1369:11, 1373:33, 1374:32, 1376:44, 1379:32, 1379:37, 1379:43, 1380:17, 1384:40

Grant's [1] - 1361:43great [2] - 1342:20,

1342:21green [1] - 1363:6Greenwood [1] -

1367:45grievance [3] -

1394:8, 1394:11, 1398:45

grievances [1] - 1398:39

ground [3] - 1332:29, 1334:23, 1363:30

group [6] - 1346:13, 1352:25, 1358:11, 1358:12, 1361:12, 1381:38

groups [5] - 1331:30, 1331:31, 1331:32, 1331:39, 1353:7

guess [4] - 1369:43, 1372:44, 1373:23, 1377:44

guesstimate [1] - 1396:43

guidelines [3] - 1350:44, 1380:35, 1380:41

H

Hahn [5] - 1351:19, 1352:4, 1399:29, 1400:8

Hahn's [1] - 1400:13halfway [2] - 1341:35,

1358:19hall [1] - 1372:10halls [4] - 1333:39,

1333:41, 1350:28, 1387:5

hand [1] - 1330:37handled [3] - 1357:35,

1359:28, 1361:34happy [7] - 1343:6,

1344:29, 1345:19, 1345:20, 1346:11, 1398:39, 1398:44

hard [3] - 1333:26, 1333:27, 1344:30

Harmonisation [1] - 1334:32

harmonisation [6] - 1389:39, 1390:10, 1390:11, 1390:18, 1390:21, 1390:23

harmonised [1] - 1389:38

Harris [1] - 1363:3Harris's [1] - 1358:44hatchet [2] - 1341:20,

1343:3head [1] - 1351:4headed [3] - 1331:45,

1358:11, 1388:39heading [10] -

1330:46, 1336:38, 1339:27, 1339:33, 1341:2, 1341:24, 1351:12, 1358:19, 1360:16, 1378:21

headquarters [3] - 1356:43, 1357:15, 1357:16

headway [2] - 1338:7, 1388:36

health [9] - 1329:38, 1349:40, 1358:23, 1358:28, 1363:38, 1383:10, 1394:31, 1395:22, 1396:24

Health [3] - 1333:8, 1334:32, 1345:47

heap [1] - 1361:25heard [5] - 1345:22,

1357:14, 1357:15, 1374:42, 1382:37

hearing [1] - 1372:13Hearing [1] - 1328:31hearsay [1] - 1373:17heated [1] - 1366:23heavily [2] - 1360:4,

1360:5held [1] - 1386:7Held [1] - 1328:34help [8] - 1342:26,

1355:38, 1362:7, 1381:7, 1390:45, 1393:11, 1396:13, 1396:16

helping [1] - 1343:27hep [1] - 1358:31hepatitis [1] - 1358:31

heps [1] - 1358:31hesitation [1] - 1398:8hi [1] - 1385:42high [2] - 1335:16,

1335:19higher [1] - 1331:47Hill [1] - 1366:14Hill-Murray [1] -

1366:14hindsight [1] -

1379:46historical [2] - 1356:6,

1356:7history [1] - 1384:4hold [1] - 1372:13holidays [2] - 1361:20,

1376:13honest [2] - 1396:41,

1398:46hopefully [1] -

1342:36hospital [1] - 1390:20hour [2] - 1342:44,

1343:18HR [11] - 1340:22,

1342:24, 1360:19, 1367:22, 1370:10, 1377:33, 1377:34, 1377:36, 1377:37

HSR [1] - 1357:15HSR's [1] - 1361:12huge [1] - 1377:38hundred [1] - 1398:23huts [1] - 1334:5

I

idea [5] - 1331:39, 1348:34, 1370:32, 1370:34, 1373:1

identified [6] - 1334:4, 1334:20, 1335:17, 1335:27, 1335:28, 1358:47

identify [2] - 1340:7, 1359:2

identifying [1] - 1395:17

illegal [1] - 1368:17image [1] - 1353:34imagine [1] - 1388:14immediate [1] -

1397:31immediately [1] -

1394:23implementation [1] -

1391:17important [6] -

1379:14, 1379:16, 1379:30, 1380:7,

1380:8, 1380:12impression [3] -

1397:12, 1397:17, 1398:9

improve [1] - 1335:4improved [1] -

1388:27improvement [9] -

1358:47, 1359:11, 1360:46, 1361:7, 1361:16, 1361:20, 1361:41, 1374:7, 1388:33

inadequate [1] - 1385:1

inch [1] - 1363:30incident [13] - 1334:6,

1334:21, 1357:4, 1357:12, 1357:13, 1357:19, 1357:20, 1357:21, 1357:22, 1363:10, 1367:16, 1392:40, 1395:14

incidents [4] - 1357:9, 1357:23, 1364:47, 1367:18

include [1] - 1372:10included [2] -

1359:39, 1387:21incorrect [1] - 1399:38increased [1] -

1390:16independent [1] -

1340:19independently [4] -

1340:6, 1340:17, 1340:31, 1340:44

indicated [1] - 1364:42

indication [1] - 1380:16

indistinct [1] - 1385:5individual [4] -

1332:3, 1341:39, 1351:27, 1387:25

individually [2] - 1343:16, 1343:17

industry [4] - 1349:15, 1370:32, 1376:15, 1377:19

influence [2] - 1376:25

informality [1] - 1373:18

information [13] - 1336:30, 1337:43, 1339:42, 1345:20, 1356:6, 1358:7, 1361:26, 1368:12, 1382:35, 1395:40,


8

1396:8, 1396:11, 1401:18

informed [2] - 1394:7, 1396:2

initial [1] - 1360:2injuries [1] - 1357:23injury [5] - 1357:7,

1357:8, 1357:12, 1357:19, 1357:20

input [3] - 1332:26, 1339:15, 1341:14

inquiry [5] - 1364:38, 1373:19, 1392:14, 1396:31, 1400:24

INQUIRY [3] - 1328:23, 1401:13, 1402:14

inquiry's [1] - 1366:38insert [2] - 1338:43,

1385:4inside [1] - 1377:47inspected [2] -

1333:13, 1352:18inspection [2] -

1334:20, 1335:17inspections [1] -

1334:3inspector [4] -

1361:10, 1361:15, 1361:27, 1361:35

instance [1] - 1373:29instances [1] -

1366:43instead [3] - 1331:39,

1357:18, 1377:27instructor [4] -

1349:42, 1349:43, 1377:24

insurance [1] - 1335:29

insurances [1] - 1349:8

insurer [1] - 1380:40insurers [1] - 1371:4intended [1] - 1358:29interests [1] - 1356:21internal [1] - 1371:34interpretation [1] -

1351:41interpreted [1] -

1388:47introduced [1] -

1358:42investigate [2] -

1363:22, 1365:7investigated [6] -

1334:8, 1367:21, 1367:22, 1368:19, 1392:33

investigation [1] -

1363:24investigations [7] -

1365:8, 1392:29, 1392:37, 1397:45, 1397:47, 1398:11, 1398:44

invite [1] - 1383:7involve [1] - 1329:41involved [31] -

1337:23, 1337:40, 1340:36, 1341:11, 1341:12, 1343:1, 1344:1, 1348:43, 1349:2, 1349:4, 1349:15, 1350:38, 1350:41, 1351:18, 1352:9, 1353:47, 1354:14, 1355:10, 1355:12, 1357:41, 1358:45, 1359:27, 1360:30, 1361:4, 1363:46, 1364:15, 1365:18, 1368:4, 1368:9, 1395:28, 1400:5

involvement [5] - 1340:38, 1340:42, 1345:26, 1355:33, 1373:26

irate [2] - 1345:36, 1366:32

isolated [1] - 1334:22issue [31] - 1331:36,

1332:24, 1332:34, 1335:20, 1339:4, 1348:26, 1351:15, 1351:18, 1351:28, 1352:1, 1352:45, 1353:31, 1354:10, 1355:26, 1356:34, 1356:40, 1357:25, 1361:43, 1363:18, 1364:46, 1368:11, 1368:15, 1370:27, 1374:45, 1375:3, 1375:4, 1375:16, 1382:3, 1385:37, 1392:33, 1398:43

issued [4] - 1360:47, 1361:8, 1361:22, 1361:24

issues [22] - 1342:30, 1342:32, 1355:12, 1357:44, 1362:38, 1364:43, 1365:2, 1365:7, 1366:44, 1367:1, 1367:26, 1376:41, 1376:44, 1379:15, 1379:30, 1382:5, 1394:40,

1397:14, 1398:5, 1398:22, 1401:42

IT [2] - 1334:7, 1357:4it" [1] - 1349:5it?" [1] - 1349:3item [3] - 1351:11,

1352:28, 1356:30itself [3] - 1340:44,

1343:9, 1347:19

J

January [8] - 1345:47, 1346:24, 1346:27, 1346:29, 1348:4, 1348:14, 1375:44, 1383:11

January" [1] - 1375:44Jason [3] - 1358:2,

1358:4, 1363:19jigs [1] - 1377:28Jim [12] - 1333:4,

1333:27, 1333:37, 1348:24, 1350:26, 1350:32, 1370:8, 1381:39, 1381:44, 1382:34, 1386:41, 1387:17

job [12] - 1333:30, 1336:15, 1340:27, 1341:20, 1343:3, 1376:10, 1376:12, 1376:17, 1377:31, 1393:12, 1400:13

jobs [3] - 1371:8, 1392:10, 1393:8

John [3] - 1343:23, 1343:25, 1375:10

Johnston [11] - 1351:24, 1353:37, 1354:1, 1354:42, 1354:44, 1355:26, 1355:32, 1357:41, 1366:14, 1367:2, 1371:44

joined [1] - 1353:38July [6] - 1329:15,

1329:18, 1330:38, 1359:19, 1391:17, 1392:47

June [2] - 1356:26, 1359:19

junior [1] - 1333:36justify [1] - 1343:4

K

Kane [1] - 1353:27Kane-White [1] -

1353:27Katoomba [3] -

1328:36, 1372:14, 1395:2

Kay [1] - 1370:8keep [9] - 1344:25,

1354:33, 1360:19, 1362:12, 1367:29, 1371:30, 1375:18, 1381:9, 1389:32

keeping [1] - 1357:12Ken [4] - 1361:18,

1361:22, 1361:26, 1361:32

Kenafacke [1] - 1342:41

kept [15] - 1333:9, 1333:21, 1337:45, 1338:11, 1345:30, 1354:21, 1375:16, 1379:33, 1381:34, 1382:16, 1389:15, 1390:17, 1396:5, 1396:7

Kerry [1] - 1368:40Keyes [4] - 1329:32,

1343:17, 1343:21, 1356:1

Kezler [3] - 1333:36, 1350:27, 1370:8

kind [1] - 1352:17Kitching [6] - 1339:19,

1340:2, 1340:30, 1341:1, 1353:27, 1385:34

kits [1] - 1382:6knowledge [3] -

1357:37, 1382:35, 1397:28

knowledgeable [1] - 1361:33

known [2] - 1333:12, 1337:41

L

label [1] - 1354:10labelling [5] -

1348:27, 1350:22, 1350:25, 1350:40

labels [3] - 1350:42, 1353:46, 1354:14

lack [4] - 1340:38, 1340:41, 1357:1, 1367:39

lagging [1] - 1371:28language [1] -

1366:16language" [1] -

1365:37large [3] - 1350:2,

1381:43, 1393:9

largely [2] - 1341:38, 1397:17

last [19] - 1335:38, 1335:41, 1337:38, 1341:22, 1359:15, 1359:36, 1364:11, 1364:36, 1365:18, 1374:29, 1376:3, 1378:47, 1381:47, 1386:6, 1388:30, 1388:43, 1394:17, 1394:29, 1395:36

lasted [1] - 1374:13late [3] - 1364:7,

1393:44, 1396:40law [5] - 1367:41,

1373:44, 1386:12, 1386:25, 1389:33

Lawson [4] - 1332:16, 1332:28, 1334:5, 1392:44

layout [1] - 1381:8leader [9] - 1329:26,

1369:13, 1369:17, 1377:43, 1378:2, 1378:3, 1389:24, 1392:7

leader" [1] - 1378:22leaders [4] - 1394:2,

1394:3, 1394:4, 1400:8

learn [3] - 1354:21, 1354:32, 1400:12

least [7] - 1374:33, 1376:37, 1379:30, 1380:7, 1380:16, 1381:22, 1386:43

leave [3] - 1345:22, 1351:33, 1354:4

leaving [2] - 1378:40, 1399:17

led [2] - 1347:25, 1363:3

leeway [1] - 1373:43left [11] - 1338:46,

1339:2, 1339:3, 1341:38, 1357:42, 1359:14, 1361:34, 1369:39, 1372:28, 1374:11, 1382:31

legally [1] - 1386:38legislation [23] -

1333:7, 1336:13, 1337:44, 1351:25, 1351:26, 1351:42, 1352:16, 1354:45, 1356:11, 1356:12, 1356:15, 1356:22, 1364:18, 1373:41, 1375:23, 1378:26,


9

1384:45, 1386:15, 1386:28, 1387:3, 1389:42, 1390:2, 1390:15

legislative [3] - 1375:18, 1375:19, 1390:26

lengthy [2] - 1354:41, 1356:30

less [3] - 1342:44, 1374:28, 1380:8

letter [1] - 1378:12level [6] - 1331:47,

1334:18, 1346:15, 1349:10, 1351:1, 1364:29

levels [1] - 1390:23LGA [1] - 1392:11LGSA [1] - 1383:39liaised [2] - 1361:6,

1381:35liaising [1] - 1361:4Liddell [4] - 1367:44,

1369:1, 1369:2, 1376:43

likelihood [1] - 1361:11

likely [1] - 1386:19limit [1] - 1355:33line [9] - 1337:26,

1338:42, 1350:13, 1358:15, 1383:36, 1385:42, 1386:7, 1390:16, 1395:43

lined [1] - 1338:46lines [2] - 1341:47,

1378:21list [4] - 1335:11,

1345:39, 1359:4, 1391:22

listed [6] - 1334:37, 1351:19, 1361:42, 1386:18, 1387:27

listen [1] - 1371:36Listen [1] - 1345:18listened [2] - 1367:5,

1367:8lived [1] - 1373:36Lloyds [1] - 1377:21loading [1] - 1393:34Local [10] - 1332:30,

1337:9, 1345:10, 1345:14, 1380:29, 1380:32, 1380:34, 1383:25, 1383:39

LOCAL [1] - 1328:23local [9] - 1332:9,

1337:11, 1363:26, 1364:5, 1383:24, 1383:39, 1384:9,

1389:7locate [1] - 1335:32located [2] - 1333:12,

1352:17lodged [2] - 1394:7,

1400:22lofty [1] - 1377:46long-term [1] -

1359:16look [36] - 1330:41,

1335:25, 1336:4, 1337:25, 1338:5, 1341:2, 1345:9, 1353:25, 1360:5, 1362:27, 1366:39, 1370:30, 1372:17, 1374:33, 1375:7, 1375:22, 1375:30, 1378:25, 1379:32, 1379:41, 1380:25, 1382:26, 1383:20, 1385:9, 1385:13, 1385:34, 1387:6, 1388:38, 1391:12, 1394:25, 1394:36, 1396:25, 1397:35, 1397:44, 1398:26

looked [10] - 1329:29, 1329:30, 1333:38, 1342:18, 1350:34, 1355:16, 1370:7, 1383:43, 1399:20, 1399:21

looking [11] - 1329:36, 1329:41, 1356:20, 1357:43, 1358:38, 1364:38, 1377:47, 1378:1, 1379:31, 1396:12, 1399:22

looks [1] - 1331:9looped [1] - 1353:27lost [4] - 1340:17,

1340:23, 1381:36, 1381:37

low [1] - 1349:10low-level [1] - 1349:10lower [2] - 1334:18,

1394:29lower-level [1] -

1334:18Luke [4] - 1369:31,

1369:33, 1369:36, 1370:21

lunch [1] - 1394:1lung [1] - 1395:29

M

machine [2] - 1393:11, 1393:13

machines [1] - 1361:17

maintain [1] - 1360:18maintained [9] -

1331:32, 1332:44, 1332:46, 1333:14, 1351:29, 1360:19, 1387:16

maintenance [3] - 1335:33, 1392:7, 1392:10

Maintrain [2] - 1349:28, 1377:26

major [2] - 1387:6, 1387:10

manage [2] - 1340:7, 1340:32

managed [1] - 1340:10

management [63] - 1329:33, 1335:20, 1335:29, 1336:18, 1336:45, 1337:3, 1337:22, 1338:3, 1338:24, 1341:18, 1341:38, 1342:26, 1342:27, 1342:28, 1343:24, 1343:26, 1343:34, 1345:38, 1346:11, 1346:12, 1346:39, 1346:44, 1346:45, 1348:28, 1348:39, 1355:3, 1355:15, 1355:21, 1355:22, 1355:23, 1355:24, 1356:16, 1356:19, 1357:34, 1359:10, 1362:5, 1362:17, 1364:12, 1364:16, 1364:25, 1364:43, 1367:9, 1367:17, 1369:44, 1370:22, 1373:26, 1375:7, 1375:8, 1375:11, 1375:12, 1377:27, 1384:7, 1384:9, 1388:19, 1388:21, 1388:23, 1388:44, 1389:2, 1389:5, 1394:28, 1398:26

managements [1] - 1376:23

manager [36] - 1336:15, 1338:5, 1338:6, 1339:8, 1340:24, 1348:10, 1348:11, 1348:14, 1351:20, 1361:8, 1361:19, 1365:3,

1365:6, 1367:15, 1369:3, 1369:7, 1369:16, 1369:21, 1369:23, 1370:7, 1373:20, 1373:25, 1373:29, 1374:1, 1374:24, 1376:21, 1376:22, 1376:40, 1377:15, 1377:16, 1377:34, 1384:24, 1386:31, 1389:25, 1399:29

Managers [1] - 1346:9managers [33] -

1329:30, 1329:43, 1330:9, 1330:17, 1332:10, 1337:4, 1337:16, 1337:17, 1338:41, 1342:9, 1342:20, 1342:21, 1343:1, 1343:19, 1345:19, 1346:13, 1353:15, 1354:27, 1355:19, 1359:30, 1363:26, 1365:4, 1367:12, 1373:2, 1373:21, 1376:19, 1378:27, 1378:28, 1389:7, 1389:24, 1390:22, 1398:27

managers' [1] - 1354:31

manages [1] - 1342:1manner [2] - 1342:1,

1370:33MARCH [1] - 1402:15March [4] - 1328:40,

1341:1, 1346:32, 1351:5

Mark [7] - 1374:8, 1374:17, 1375:29, 1375:31, 1375:36, 1375:43, 1379:7

mark [1] - 1400:41marked [4] - 1350:1,

1350:12, 1388:17, 1388:20

masks [1] - 1331:41mate [1] - 1355:14material [1] - 1393:43materials [4] -

1393:16, 1393:17, 1393:39, 1394:5

matter [7] - 1361:39, 1371:34, 1376:38, 1386:11, 1386:12, 1398:13

matters [5] - 1348:7, 1355:33, 1356:4, 1364:32, 1364:43

McKay [22] - 1343:47, 1344:12, 1344:37, 1345:36, 1348:15, 1348:18, 1348:46, 1353:24, 1354:20, 1367:36, 1369:3, 1369:11, 1373:33, 1374:4, 1374:19, 1376:4, 1376:37, 1376:39, 1379:37, 1384:40, 1385:23, 1385:26

McKay's [1] - 1345:25mean [8] - 1330:15,

1344:24, 1347:17, 1350:10, 1352:13, 1355:22, 1356:15, 1396:7

meaning [1] - 1366:30means [1] - 1372:7meant [1] - 1378:13medical [2] - 1358:32,

1401:18meet [2] - 1346:28,

1376:39MEETING [2] -

1401:45, 1402:1meeting [19] -

1336:18, 1344:37, 1352:24, 1354:7, 1356:42, 1358:16, 1365:22, 1365:30, 1365:31, 1365:36, 1365:39, 1366:5, 1366:17, 1366:23, 1385:36, 1394:2, 1394:3, 1394:4

meetings [14] - 1336:23, 1337:10, 1345:16, 1354:4, 1355:36, 1363:20, 1365:18, 1365:23, 1376:42, 1379:33, 1379:44, 1379:45, 1389:23, 1396:17

member [3] - 1337:6, 1351:8, 1377:20

members [4] - 1355:36, 1360:27, 1361:12, 1380:43

membership [1] - 1338:39

memo [1] - 1340:47memorandum [1] -

1339:18memory [6] - 1335:28,

1350:43, 1356:6, 1364:2, 1365:40, 1380:21

memos [2] - 1379:31,


10

1401:40mention [1] - 1379:18mentioned [10] -

1329:36, 1352:12, 1357:14, 1358:35, 1360:46, 1371:13, 1380:35, 1381:29, 1394:40, 1397:21

menu [3] - 1345:41, 1384:22, 1384:28

menu" [1] - 1345:38message [1] - 1356:45met [5] - 1361:18,

1376:43, 1380:45, 1385:32, 1385:37

metal [1] - 1349:44method [4] - 1339:43,

1339:44, 1379:25, 1385:31

methods [1] - 1371:29Metro [1] - 1380:36Michael [6] - 1329:32,

1343:17, 1343:25, 1370:19, 1375:27, 1377:39

Mick [8] - 1343:18, 1343:23, 1349:3, 1361:38, 1374:39, 1375:11, 1390:19

middle [1] - 1362:16might [14] - 1337:12,

1345:16, 1346:28, 1347:33, 1349:9, 1351:34, 1359:33, 1360:2, 1365:33, 1368:23, 1374:19, 1378:28, 1381:30, 1399:9

mind [5] - 1331:24, 1342:47, 1376:5, 1383:23, 1384:8

minute [2] - 1366:15, 1392:18

minute-taker [1] - 1366:15

MINUTES [2] - 1401:45, 1402:1

minutes [18] - 1342:44, 1346:31, 1351:5, 1352:24, 1356:26, 1365:19, 1365:26, 1365:27, 1365:29, 1365:31, 1365:32, 1366:1, 1366:4, 1366:16, 1366:30, 1379:33, 1401:41, 1401:42

mirrors [1] - 1346:21miscommunication

[1] - 1394:27

mix [1] - 1397:42model [19] - 1330:47,

1338:28, 1339:44, 1340:44, 1344:46, 1345:1, 1345:29, 1347:7, 1370:26, 1380:23, 1383:30, 1384:10, 1384:16, 1384:17, 1384:31, 1384:36, 1384:42, 1385:3, 1391:8

models [1] - 1370:46mollycoddling [4] -

1354:22, 1354:33, 1376:8, 1376:10

moment [6] - 1330:42, 1331:15, 1331:25, 1336:35, 1346:31, 1362:27

Monday [2] - 1402:5, 1402:12

MONDAY [1] - 1402:15

money [1] - 1377:38monitoring [4] -

1349:17, 1363:38, 1371:32, 1395:22

month [2] - 1338:19, 1380:45

monthly [2] - 1354:4, 1376:40

months [7] - 1374:13, 1374:14, 1388:30, 1390:21, 1396:44, 1396:45

Moore [1] - 1400:5moore [1] - 1393:46most [5] - 1330:18,

1354:27, 1380:7, 1398:26, 1398:27

mostly [1] - 1360:36MOUNTAINS [2] -

1328:27, 1401:12Mountains [5] -

1328:35, 1332:29, 1345:34, 1350:31, 1385:3

mouth [1] - 1398:7moved [3] - 1343:25,

1370:5, 1370:13moving [3] - 1333:28,

1390:27, 1393:34MR [43] - 1329:6,

1329:8, 1333:45, 1341:31, 1344:41, 1350:17, 1356:25, 1365:15, 1365:42, 1367:26, 1368:21, 1368:30, 1372:22, 1373:5, 1373:11,

1373:17, 1376:32, 1376:34, 1376:36, 1390:30, 1390:33, 1390:35, 1390:42, 1391:26, 1391:37, 1391:39, 1396:27, 1399:5, 1399:7, 1399:40, 1399:46, 1400:4, 1400:16, 1400:20, 1400:39, 1400:44, 1401:1, 1401:7, 1401:18, 1401:30, 1401:34, 1401:39, 1402:9

Mulligan [4] - 1374:8, 1375:29, 1375:36, 1379:5

Murray [1] - 1366:14must [2] - 1349:31,

1349:37

N

name [12] - 1329:8, 1333:37, 1338:44, 1338:45, 1345:13, 1358:16, 1359:22, 1359:43, 1366:46, 1385:4, 1391:39, 1399:38

names [2] - 1333:3, 1374:41

national [1] - 1389:38naturally [2] -

1357:12, 1357:16nature [1] - 1370:28nearly [1] - 1376:14necessarily [1] -

1347:21necessary [2] -

1374:16, 1374:17need [14] - 1338:41,

1344:8, 1347:45, 1354:31, 1367:8, 1372:9, 1373:47, 1374:1, 1386:26, 1386:29, 1389:28, 1391:13, 1400:46, 1402:5

needed [16] - 1333:11, 1333:39, 1337:14, 1338:15, 1339:42, 1347:20, 1351:30, 1360:44, 1361:22, 1364:29, 1374:31, 1375:17, 1375:21, 1378:27, 1384:43, 1386:40

needs [10] - 1330:20, 1345:41, 1351:27, 1372:22, 1373:5,

1373:19, 1375:30, 1384:11, 1384:23, 1401:15

net [1] - 1380:44network [5] - 1337:6,

1338:40, 1345:6, 1364:4, 1380:42

never [15] - 1336:30, 1340:22, 1345:22, 1346:15, 1347:31, 1354:21, 1354:32, 1360:18, 1372:3, 1374:42, 1376:1, 1376:12, 1379:7, 1382:28, 1382:30

new [7] - 1369:8, 1369:9, 1374:5, 1378:3, 1378:12, 1386:34, 1392:31

New [4] - 1330:47, 1338:28, 1385:5, 1391:3

Newcastle [1] - 1371:15

next [12] - 1330:16, 1335:36, 1338:19, 1342:33, 1354:6, 1354:37, 1360:16, 1363:22, 1382:36, 1383:8, 1385:9, 1386:7

Nicholls [5] - 1369:31, 1369:33, 1370:21, 1401:31, 1401:39

no" [1] - 1349:3no-one [3] - 1345:31,

1356:14, 1356:15no-one's [1] - 1356:12noise [1] - 1358:30nominated [1] -

1357:21nominations [1] -

1348:38non [2] - 1401:25,

1401:26non-publication [2] -

1401:25, 1401:26normal [3] - 1334:3,

1334:16, 1353:10normally [3] -

1354:42, 1361:8, 1379:43

note [3] - 1342:34, 1358:11, 1392:16

noted [1] - 1347:35nothing [2] - 1356:21,

1366:45notice [1] - 1361:16notices [8] - 1353:31,

1358:47, 1359:12,

1360:47, 1361:7, 1361:20, 1361:42, 1388:33

notification [1] - 1363:17

notified [1] - 1393:15noting [2] - 1347:36nought [1] - 1358:8November [3] -

1338:29, 1345:1, 1365:40

NSW [2] - 1328:36, 1383:36

number [28] - 1331:26, 1331:34, 1332:19, 1335:16, 1336:5, 1336:14, 1336:23, 1341:18, 1342:32, 1343:18, 1348:42, 1357:3, 1357:44, 1360:8, 1364:47, 1366:32, 1367:28, 1370:24, 1370:30, 1375:19, 1377:36, 1379:28, 1387:1, 1394:23, 1401:3, 1401:10, 1401:19, 1401:36

numbers [1] - 1360:3

O

object [2] - 1372:22, 1373:5

objection [2] - 1373:11, 1373:18

observation [2] - 1359:47, 1388:28

obviously [25] - 1372:7, 1372:40, 1392:10, 1392:16, 1392:28, 1392:29, 1392:30, 1392:32, 1393:15, 1393:29, 1394:25, 1394:29, 1394:30, 1394:31, 1394:46, 1395:10, 1395:17, 1395:47, 1396:23, 1396:25, 1397:25, 1397:39, 1398:3

occasions [3] - 1336:14, 1342:33, 1350:18

Occupational [1] - 1333:8

October [1] - 1341:19Odgers [2] - 1343:23,

1375:10OF [5] - 1328:23,

1401:45, 1402:1


11

offer [1] - 1360:13offered [2] - 1359:34,

1395:22offers [1] - 1359:27office [1] - 1383:39Office [4] - 1380:32,

1380:34, 1383:25, 1383:38

officer [17] - 1329:33, 1333:36, 1342:27, 1342:28, 1369:12, 1371:7, 1371:12, 1377:5, 1377:12, 1378:34, 1378:42, 1378:47, 1379:4, 1379:7, 1388:35, 1389:13

officers [4] - 1333:4, 1337:7, 1361:12, 1380:44

official [1] - 1389:15often [1] - 1334:26OH&S [4] - 1330:8,

1340:23, 1354:2, 1354:3

old [5] - 1333:8, 1334:22, 1336:21, 1349:47, 1350:11

OLG [1] - 1383:28once [6] - 1332:16,

1337:28, 1364:16, 1376:44, 1380:45, 1387:5

one [97] - 1330:29, 1331:24, 1332:36, 1333:17, 1334:18, 1334:36, 1334:45, 1335:28, 1336:14, 1336:15, 1336:21, 1337:10, 1339:42, 1341:17, 1341:19, 1342:9, 1342:18, 1343:4, 1343:47, 1345:15, 1345:30, 1345:31, 1346:6, 1346:18, 1346:27, 1347:12, 1349:8, 1349:9, 1349:17, 1350:18, 1351:23, 1351:30, 1351:42, 1352:3, 1352:47, 1354:2, 1354:20, 1354:30, 1355:11, 1355:13, 1355:36, 1356:14, 1356:15, 1356:40, 1356:45, 1358:29, 1359:15, 1359:31, 1361:14, 1362:13, 1365:16, 1365:18, 1365:23,

1366:5, 1368:16, 1368:40, 1371:14, 1371:19, 1372:13, 1373:20, 1373:23, 1380:43, 1381:17, 1382:16, 1382:37, 1382:41, 1383:40, 1384:35, 1385:6, 1385:35, 1386:15, 1386:22, 1386:27, 1386:44, 1386:46, 1386:47, 1387:21, 1387:25, 1387:27, 1387:30, 1387:36, 1387:40, 1389:3, 1391:3, 1394:18, 1394:22, 1395:36, 1398:23, 1399:22, 1399:44, 1399:46, 1400:8

one" [1] - 1345:33one's [1] - 1356:12ones [1] - 1363:14onwards [1] - 1329:21open [4] - 1330:33,

1339:46, 1373:1, 1383:17

operate [1] - 1370:33operating [2] -

1331:34, 1390:27operational [9] -

1330:11, 1330:14, 1330:19, 1331:26, 1331:33, 1332:3, 1332:7, 1343:26, 1347:20

operations [7] - 1351:20, 1357:45, 1386:29, 1386:30, 1399:25, 1399:33

opinion [18] - 1337:40, 1340:45, 1351:40, 1357:36, 1357:47, 1364:30, 1365:3, 1365:5, 1367:32, 1367:42, 1367:43, 1370:27, 1370:39, 1373:36, 1376:6, 1376:7, 1384:25, 1384:47

opinions [1] - 1352:14opportunity [3] -

1343:38, 1364:44, 1400:23

opposed [2] - 1373:38, 1375:31

opposite [1] - 1375:42options [1] - 1360:25oral [1] - 1344:4orally [1] - 1380:13

order [2] - 1401:25, 1401:27

ORDINARY [2] - 1401:45, 1402:1

organisation [16] - 1340:15, 1340:19, 1342:10, 1343:19, 1345:35, 1346:20, 1357:31, 1357:39, 1359:14, 1376:16, 1377:35, 1382:22, 1384:27, 1385:2, 1386:16, 1389:16

organisational [1] - 1387:37

organisationally [1] - 1342:7

organisations [1] - 1370:31

organised [12] - 1333:38, 1344:1, 1350:36, 1358:44, 1359:12, 1359:19, 1359:22, 1360:38, 1360:41, 1363:47, 1390:21

organising [1] - 1339:9

original [4] - 1336:10, 1346:27, 1377:42, 1387:27

originally [7] - 1331:28, 1344:13, 1348:8, 1358:45, 1371:1, 1381:34, 1387:16

otherwise [1] - 1351:22

outcomes [3] - 1365:8, 1365:36, 1397:45

outside [2] - 1340:34, 1390:25

overall [1] - 1374:6overalls [1] - 1331:41overarching [1] -

1340:10overdue [1] - 1343:7oversight [3] -

1364:11, 1388:43, 1389:6

overview [1] - 1337:23own [3] - 1351:30,

1374:16, 1376:5

P

page [63] - 1330:34, 1330:45, 1331:45, 1332:13, 1334:29,

1334:36, 1335:8, 1335:9, 1336:33, 1336:44, 1338:27, 1339:18, 1339:29, 1339:33, 1340:47, 1341:3, 1341:18, 1341:23, 1341:35, 1342:38, 1343:42, 1345:44, 1346:34, 1348:17, 1348:22, 1351:4, 1351:11, 1352:21, 1352:28, 1353:20, 1353:26, 1353:34, 1353:37, 1353:42, 1354:37, 1355:43, 1356:25, 1356:33, 1356:34, 1358:19, 1360:16, 1362:8, 1362:10, 1362:13, 1362:16, 1362:42, 1362:43, 1363:33, 1378:17, 1383:7, 1383:9, 1385:9, 1385:10, 1387:36, 1387:41, 1387:43, 1388:11, 1390:36, 1391:22, 1394:17

pages [1] - 1385:13paid [1] - 1372:2paragraph [13] -

1335:36, 1339:28, 1339:30, 1339:32, 1340:2, 1341:25, 1394:18, 1394:20, 1395:36, 1395:37, 1401:25, 1401:35, 1401:36

paragraphs [1] - 1401:19

parameters [5] - 1344:8, 1350:4, 1357:8, 1359:37, 1371:32

paraphrasing [1] - 1376:5

pardon [1] - 1343:30Park [1] - 1392:44park [5] - 1332:15,

1332:17, 1332:23, 1332:27, 1333:46

Parke [1] - 1328:36parks [2] - 1386:18,

1387:13part [22] - 1334:3,

1334:7, 1334:16, 1335:3, 1335:8, 1336:33, 1338:24, 1338:37, 1340:21, 1349:43, 1353:10,

1353:13, 1353:14, 1353:17, 1355:24, 1355:40, 1357:4, 1362:47, 1364:32, 1366:41, 1373:2, 1376:24

particular [23] - 1336:16, 1338:45, 1339:6, 1339:45, 1340:24, 1343:22, 1351:28, 1354:45, 1355:2, 1355:11, 1355:13, 1356:33, 1357:25, 1357:33, 1360:17, 1373:20, 1373:24, 1383:3, 1384:11, 1386:31, 1389:17, 1389:20, 1392:43

particularly [4] - 1334:5, 1367:2, 1379:36, 1398:25

parts [2] - 1354:45, 1386:41

passed [1] - 1390:2path [1] - 1397:6Paul [1] - 1400:2peak [1] - 1352:24penalties [2] - 1398:4,

1398:14people [53] - 1334:37,

1342:35, 1343:5, 1345:37, 1349:5, 1355:13, 1355:37, 1356:20, 1357:36, 1357:38, 1357:40, 1359:1, 1359:2, 1359:9, 1359:13, 1359:20, 1359:25, 1359:35, 1359:38, 1360:3, 1360:4, 1360:36, 1361:30, 1362:47, 1365:2, 1365:10, 1365:29, 1366:27, 1366:32, 1366:39, 1366:40, 1366:42, 1368:46, 1371:5, 1371:32, 1371:36, 1371:37, 1372:8, 1372:9, 1373:40, 1373:47, 1374:27, 1377:46, 1381:29, 1383:5, 1384:24, 1397:25, 1397:28, 1397:44, 1398:10, 1398:21, 1399:44

people's [1] - 1366:24per [4] - 1350:24,

1375:23, 1375:29,


12

1398:23period [10] - 1329:20,

1333:31, 1338:9, 1342:31, 1360:11, 1364:7, 1370:42, 1393:4, 1399:8, 1399:18

periods [1] - 1393:5permission [2] -

1330:17, 1393:25persisted [1] -

1376:11person [11] - 1342:18,

1344:2, 1354:30, 1357:11, 1361:9, 1373:37, 1375:5, 1375:7, 1383:3, 1389:4, 1399:19

perspective [1] - 1400:25

Phillips [2] - 1361:18, 1361:32

phone [6] - 1364:36, 1394:23, 1401:3, 1401:10, 1401:19, 1401:36

pick [2] - 1372:1, 1378:16

picked [1] - 1378:13picky [1] - 1381:15picnic [4] - 1334:4,

1387:12, 1387:20, 1387:25

picture [1] - 1369:24piece [1] - 1386:32pieces [1] - 1333:39pile [1] - 1344:29pinned [1] - 1373:19place [36] - 1330:18,

1331:12, 1332:18, 1332:28, 1335:12, 1338:18, 1342:6, 1343:3, 1346:46, 1347:12, 1347:13, 1347:16, 1347:25, 1347:46, 1351:32, 1352:19, 1354:14, 1359:12, 1359:43, 1361:23, 1362:30, 1370:43, 1371:2, 1371:8, 1371:28, 1372:27, 1373:7, 1374:43, 1377:17, 1377:32, 1381:8, 1383:20, 1384:13, 1387:10, 1387:15, 1394:2

places [3] - 1330:18, 1332:31, 1345:35

plan [36] - 1336:45,

1337:22, 1338:3, 1338:24, 1340:10, 1343:47, 1346:39, 1346:44, 1346:45, 1355:3, 1355:15, 1355:21, 1355:22, 1355:23, 1356:16, 1364:12, 1364:16, 1364:26, 1367:9, 1368:6, 1369:44, 1370:22, 1383:22, 1383:24, 1383:37, 1384:7, 1384:9, 1384:17, 1384:36, 1384:42, 1388:44, 1389:2, 1389:5, 1391:4, 1391:17

plans [2] - 1337:3, 1352:18

plastic [1] - 1331:40play [1] - 1396:17plenty [1] - 1332:14plus [1] - 1375:18point [24] - 1335:19,

1336:14, 1340:38, 1345:32, 1356:34, 1356:37, 1360:22, 1363:22, 1363:38, 1364:11, 1369:43, 1371:40, 1372:44, 1373:20, 1388:43, 1392:31, 1394:30, 1397:18, 1397:36, 1397:37, 1398:29, 1398:30, 1399:1, 1401:7

pointed [2] - 1345:36, 1398:5

points [9] - 1335:37, 1339:37, 1340:3, 1380:7, 1380:9, 1380:12, 1380:17, 1388:42, 1398:46

policies [14] - 1329:29, 1329:37, 1329:43, 1330:3, 1330:6, 1330:10, 1330:12, 1331:26, 1331:33, 1335:12, 1338:45, 1377:23, 1392:32, 1395:11

policy [33] - 1329:38, 1329:46, 1330:27, 1330:28, 1330:47, 1331:12, 1331:17, 1331:25, 1334:14, 1338:28, 1338:42, 1339:12, 1344:46, 1345:1, 1345:26, 1346:40, 1347:4,

1347:7, 1347:21, 1347:35, 1347:41, 1353:12, 1380:23, 1383:30, 1383:33, 1383:34, 1384:16, 1384:31, 1385:3, 1386:12, 1389:9, 1391:8

Pool [1] - 1380:36pool [1] - 1334:5Pools [1] - 1334:47popular [1] - 1367:43position [7] - 1329:24,

1369:7, 1369:8, 1369:9, 1392:6, 1397:3, 1398:3

positions [3] - 1374:33, 1374:40, 1377:36

possible [1] - 1400:1post [1] - 1371:18post-graduate [1] -

1371:18potential [4] - 1357:7,

1357:26, 1363:23, 1363:24

practical [1] - 1378:40practice [2] - 1340:11,

1386:12practices [1] -

1350:40precise [2] - 1373:6,

1378:46predecessor [1] -

1369:33Premier's [1] -

1383:28premise [2] - 1373:15,

1373:17premium [1] - 1370:41preparation [1] -

1368:10prepared [1] - 1355:44prerogative [1] -

1340:25presented [2] -

1352:37, 1374:41pressure [2] - 1365:9pretty [7] - 1333:27,

1352:4, 1378:41, 1379:25, 1382:4, 1382:21, 1390:19

previous [1] - 1342:47previously [2] -

1360:37, 1364:1print [4] - 1344:29,

1353:24, 1386:31, 1390:38

printed [2] - 1343:11, 1344:29

prioritised [1] - 1336:5

private [2] - 1370:32, 1377:19

pro [1] - 1381:8proactive [2] - 1342:6,

1342:7problem [3] - 1379:18,

1396:1, 1398:29problems [6] -

1394:26, 1394:38, 1396:14, 1396:16, 1396:18, 1398:26

Procedure [2] - 1331:46, 1346:1

procedure [12] - 1332:24, 1332:35, 1334:18, 1339:39, 1339:42, 1347:43, 1347:45, 1362:30, 1378:18, 1378:19, 1381:5, 1383:10

Procedures [1] - 1352:32

procedures [31] - 1329:29, 1329:38, 1329:44, 1330:6, 1331:28, 1331:30, 1331:33, 1331:34, 1332:21, 1332:37, 1334:1, 1334:16, 1339:46, 1340:20, 1352:37, 1354:3, 1357:5, 1357:27, 1361:23, 1370:45, 1371:2, 1377:23, 1381:8, 1381:9, 1387:45, 1388:1, 1388:2, 1389:9, 1389:29, 1392:32, 1395:11

procedures" [1] - 1333:47

process [9] - 1330:4, 1334:38, 1339:33, 1341:4, 1352:9, 1352:10, 1359:2, 1363:39, 1373:3

process" [1] - 1341:2processes [1] -

1395:16produce [1] - 1371:43professionals [1] -

1401:20program [16] -

1329:26, 1331:27, 1345:29, 1345:38, 1369:13, 1369:17, 1374:37, 1377:43, 1378:2, 1378:3,

1378:18, 1378:19, 1378:22, 1381:5, 1400:8

Program [1] - 1331:46programs [3] -

1329:29, 1329:44, 1377:25

progression [1] - 1345:26

prohibited [2] - 1354:16, 1354:19

project [5] - 1362:3, 1362:5, 1362:21, 1374:7, 1388:15

promote [1] - 1360:4promoted [1] - 1360:5prompt [1] - 1347:38properties [1] -

1350:34property [8] - 1332:46,

1333:4, 1333:14, 1333:32, 1333:35, 1333:38, 1334:8, 1335:33

property's [1] - 1333:34

proposals [1] - 1374:32

proposition [1] - 1386:10

propositions [1] - 1377:1

prospect [1] - 1393:42protocols [1] -

1335:11provide [9] - 1330:6,

1336:21, 1344:10, 1344:19, 1353:14, 1385:27, 1385:28, 1385:36, 1389:29

provided [7] - 1329:30, 1331:42, 1335:32, 1344:30, 1350:24, 1382:34, 1390:18

provider [9] - 1340:15, 1340:21, 1340:43, 1342:22, 1370:4, 1370:17, 1370:26, 1370:33, 1377:45

PSSG [6] - 1346:7, 1346:11, 1346:18, 1346:31, 1348:9, 1357:22

PTSD [1] - 1396:47PUBLIC [1] - 1401:13public [5] - 1328:31,

1333:41, 1350:28, 1386:18, 1392:12

publication [2] -


13

1401:25, 1401:26published [1] - 1331:2pulling [1] - 1347:41purchase [9] -

1340:15, 1340:21, 1340:43, 1342:22, 1370:4, 1370:17, 1370:26, 1370:32, 1377:45

purpose [1] - 1350:43purposes [1] -

1342:42pushing [1] - 1337:14put [62] - 1330:12,

1330:17, 1331:6, 1331:11, 1332:18, 1332:28, 1338:45, 1343:3, 1344:4, 1344:13, 1344:27, 1345:34, 1346:13, 1346:17, 1348:29, 1350:32, 1350:33, 1350:42, 1355:30, 1357:21, 1358:33, 1359:11, 1359:36, 1360:7, 1361:28, 1362:30, 1365:34, 1366:28, 1366:45, 1368:18, 1369:4, 1371:20, 1372:25, 1374:32, 1374:37, 1374:38, 1377:17, 1377:20, 1377:21, 1377:26, 1378:26, 1378:29, 1378:30, 1379:32, 1381:7, 1382:19, 1383:8, 1383:25, 1383:34, 1383:38, 1383:40, 1384:47, 1385:3, 1385:5, 1385:34, 1389:4, 1392:28, 1396:17, 1397:13, 1398:7, 1398:18

putting [3] - 1365:33, 1371:45, 1393:33

PVA [1] - 1334:23

Q

qualifications [1] - 1366:24

quarantined [1] - 1334:21

Queensland [1] - 1355:41

queries [2] - 1348:42, 1348:45

query [1] - 1348:41questioned [1] -

1354:28

questions [17] - 1329:20, 1349:8, 1358:8, 1361:16, 1365:10, 1365:19, 1366:29, 1368:31, 1368:34, 1384:3, 1387:2, 1391:2, 1392:25, 1392:39, 1394:33, 1399:7

quiet [1] - 1367:29quite [15] - 1334:26,

1337:46, 1343:6, 1345:35, 1349:13, 1354:25, 1355:40, 1357:36, 1360:5, 1361:33, 1366:23, 1370:11, 1371:23, 1376:15, 1381:43

R

R&T [1] - 1399:21railways [11] -

1349:14, 1349:21, 1349:22, 1349:24, 1349:25, 1349:41, 1349:46, 1350:6, 1371:26, 1377:19, 1379:47

raise [10] - 1342:33, 1348:41, 1348:45, 1364:43, 1365:6, 1367:27, 1367:38, 1367:39, 1401:4, 1402:5

raised [28] - 1334:9, 1336:12, 1338:14, 1342:32, 1348:8, 1348:9, 1348:42, 1351:15, 1355:26, 1355:28, 1356:34, 1357:19, 1361:15, 1364:37, 1364:45, 1365:11, 1366:44, 1367:1, 1367:10, 1367:12, 1379:28, 1379:41, 1380:13, 1382:6, 1394:32, 1396:1, 1398:5

raising [8] - 1342:30, 1348:7, 1353:31, 1356:40, 1357:25, 1375:16, 1380:17, 1394:40

ran [1] - 1371:10rang [2] - 1365:31,

1366:4ranger [2] - 1391:47,

1397:3rangers [1] - 1331:36ranked [1] - 1371:5

rapport [1] - 1354:27rather [3] - 1356:45,

1357:23, 1359:3ray [1] - 1395:29rayed [1] - 1350:10re [1] - 1377:27re-engineering [1] -

1377:27reactive [1] - 1342:1read [8] - 1339:32,

1341:4, 1341:24, 1344:31, 1346:7, 1348:22, 1352:41, 1356:37

reading [2] - 1346:34, 1371:20

ready [2] - 1368:28, 1390:5

real [3] - 1357:39, 1367:43, 1373:18

really [5] - 1333:23, 1360:18, 1366:26, 1369:40, 1373:5

reason [7] - 1342:9, 1343:4, 1369:5, 1370:35, 1372:45, 1382:20

reasonable [1] - 1351:36

rebuild [1] - 1342:11received [3] - 1358:47,

1370:41, 1395:13recently [2] - 1349:38,

1359:13recognised [1] -

1377:18recommendation [1] -

1360:34recommendations [3]

- 1336:2, 1337:26, 1360:30

recommended [1] - 1335:44

record [9] - 1343:3, 1352:35, 1356:18, 1376:14, 1379:30, 1380:18, 1381:40, 1383:8, 1389:12

recorded [2] - 1358:16, 1365:28

records [2] - 1360:20, 1363:9

recover [1] - 1340:28recovered [1] -

1396:47recreational [1] -

1339:46red [1] - 1336:41redacted [2] -

1401:34, 1401:37

redacting [1] - 1401:10

redid [1] - 1361:29redo [1] - 1336:19redrafted [1] - 1346:17redrafting [1] -

1346:17redundancy [1] -

1329:18redundant [4] -

1343:24, 1343:25, 1375:10, 1376:13

refer [8] - 1346:38, 1363:10, 1363:18, 1375:22, 1383:25, 1387:19, 1392:40, 1392:43

reference [6] - 1330:47, 1336:44, 1338:21, 1353:4, 1358:23, 1391:8

References [1] - 1346:34

references [5] - 1330:46, 1346:43, 1347:23, 1383:21, 1391:1

referral [1] - 1383:41referred [8] - 1333:46,

1339:39, 1346:44, 1347:4, 1356:8, 1363:14, 1363:19, 1391:23

referring [12] - 1330:41, 1331:21, 1336:34, 1337:20, 1338:2, 1339:38, 1339:47, 1353:45, 1364:45, 1383:32, 1391:21, 1395:46

refers [2] - 1335:37, 1336:41

refute [1] - 1371:6regard [1] - 1386:10regards [2] - 1364:24,

1398:5Register [1] - 1351:12register [55] -

1332:40, 1332:41, 1333:9, 1333:10, 1335:26, 1336:8, 1336:19, 1336:25, 1337:20, 1337:21, 1338:3, 1338:22, 1338:23, 1338:24, 1346:38, 1351:27, 1351:41, 1352:10, 1352:15, 1355:44, 1357:20, 1358:28, 1358:33, 1360:18,

1367:9, 1371:40, 1371:41, 1371:42, 1372:7, 1372:15, 1372:16, 1372:27, 1372:30, 1381:17, 1381:45, 1382:1, 1382:9, 1384:2, 1385:44, 1386:2, 1386:11, 1386:20, 1386:22, 1386:27, 1386:45, 1386:46, 1386:47, 1387:15, 1387:21, 1387:24, 1387:29, 1387:30

registers [5] - 1356:17, 1357:12, 1357:22, 1359:21, 1386:45

regs [1] - 1333:9regular [3] - 1332:19,

1378:24, 1395:32regulations [5] -

1354:45, 1364:17, 1364:21, 1364:25, 1375:21

rehab [1] - 1374:34rehabilitation [4] -

1329:31, 1342:17, 1375:5, 1377:25

related [6] - 1347:32, 1363:10, 1363:42, 1383:21, 1391:1, 1396:4

Related [2] - 1330:46, 1346:35

relating [1] - 1335:19relation [16] - 1334:37,

1336:8, 1348:26, 1349:8, 1353:12, 1357:33, 1365:1, 1365:20, 1367:8, 1367:10, 1367:31, 1368:10, 1368:11, 1381:42, 1383:24, 1401:25

release [1] - 1339:29released [3] - 1338:33,

1345:2, 1381:17relevant [3] - 1331:30,

1337:43, 1400:26relevantly [1] -

1366:27relief [1] - 1342:24relying [1] - 1357:38remained [1] -

1346:15remediation [2] -

1401:32, 1401:41remember [18] -

1333:3, 1339:24,


14

1341:19, 1350:22, 1354:33, 1355:44, 1355:46, 1356:1, 1356:4, 1358:42, 1359:43, 1361:47, 1362:4, 1369:40, 1380:22, 1387:40, 1391:4, 1391:9

remind [2] - 1343:21, 1380:37

remove [3] - 1331:37, 1334:11, 1395:17

removed [4] - 1334:12, 1334:25, 1334:26, 1352:19

removing [2] - 1393:29, 1393:33

renewed [1] - 1375:45repairing [1] - 1392:11repairs [1] - 1381:35repeated [1] - 1379:29replace [1] - 1369:37replaced [1] - 1334:12replied [1] - 1385:20reply [1] - 1374:36report [12] - 1334:33,

1336:3, 1336:4, 1336:9, 1336:34, 1338:6, 1343:9, 1344:37, 1348:11, 1357:9, 1370:1, 1370:2

reported [10] - 1354:7, 1357:6, 1357:11, 1357:22, 1357:26, 1357:28, 1365:10, 1367:20, 1369:27, 1395:15

reporting [3] - 1337:16, 1365:2, 1369:28

reports [2] - 1363:22, 1401:31

representatives [1] - 1356:43

represents [1] - 1335:43

reps [1] - 1358:2request [1] - 1365:26requested [1] -

1385:28requests [1] - 1365:17require [1] - 1332:8required [16] -

1329:42, 1333:9, 1342:24, 1349:16, 1357:37, 1358:32, 1360:24, 1360:32, 1361:27, 1384:26, 1384:44, 1386:25,

1386:39, 1387:3, 1389:9, 1389:27

requirement [3] - 1336:45, 1337:2, 1355:2

requirements [2] - 1355:7, 1390:27

resistant [2] - 1373:2, 1373:25

resolution [1] - 1398:44

resolved [13] - 1352:1, 1354:6, 1354:8, 1354:11, 1394:11, 1394:14, 1396:14, 1396:16, 1396:19, 1397:18, 1397:33, 1398:40

resolving [1] - 1351:18

resourcing [5] - 1342:30, 1374:31, 1374:45, 1375:3, 1375:4

Resourcing [1] - 1342:32

respect [2] - 1381:16, 1388:19

respected [1] - 1376:15

respectfully [1] - 1401:1

responding [1] - 1379:40

responds [1] - 1353:37

response [9] - 1361:47, 1362:20, 1362:34, 1362:38, 1362:39, 1362:43, 1362:45, 1363:11, 1363:18

responsibilities [2] - 1389:17, 1392:9

responsibility [11] - 1333:34, 1343:22, 1354:31, 1369:45, 1370:3, 1370:6, 1381:33, 1389:3, 1389:7, 1389:13, 1389:20

responsible [8] - 1336:7, 1346:10, 1346:14, 1351:21, 1358:27, 1359:43, 1366:1, 1381:44

rest [3] - 1334:11, 1385:8, 1390:16

restaurant [1] - 1345:39

restructuring [2] - 1370:4, 1374:40

result [3] - 1382:40, 1401:35, 1401:37

result" [1] - 1401:26resume [1] - 1368:28retrieve [1] - 1393:9retrospect [1] -

1394:34return [1] - 1396:35review [9] - 1340:5,

1341:19, 1342:40, 1342:42, 1344:17, 1352:31, 1378:29, 1381:42, 1382:23

review" [1] - 1344:9reviewed [4] -

1364:21, 1378:24, 1378:25, 1384:42

rewrite [1] - 1346:20Rhett [3] - 1351:19,

1352:4Richard [1] - 1328:45ridiculous [1] - 1389:4right" [2] - 1373:39,

1373:40right-hand [1] -

1330:37rightly [1] - 1374:4rights [1] - 1386:17risk [31] - 1329:26,

1329:33, 1335:19, 1335:29, 1335:43, 1336:11, 1336:12, 1336:18, 1338:14, 1340:7, 1340:32, 1342:26, 1342:28, 1343:24, 1343:26, 1348:9, 1359:1, 1360:28, 1369:4, 1369:7, 1369:13, 1369:16, 1369:18, 1375:7, 1375:8, 1375:11, 1375:12, 1376:10, 1376:12, 1377:26

risks [2] - 1335:16, 1371:29

roads [4] - 1386:18, 1387:7, 1387:8, 1392:7

Robert [1] - 1367:45robust [1] - 1370:39rocks [3] - 1393:9,

1393:14, 1393:30role [15] - 1329:28,

1349:43, 1353:10, 1353:13, 1353:14, 1353:17, 1357:45, 1361:5, 1361:6,

1364:32, 1366:41, 1375:35, 1376:23, 1389:32, 1391:46

roof [2] - 1334:7, 1334:8

room [1] - 1344:32Ross [5] - 1333:4,

1333:35, 1381:29, 1382:34, 1386:41

rough [1] - 1377:44round [4] - 1358:46,

1359:40, 1360:2, 1360:5

rounds [1] - 1359:24Royal [1] - 1401:27rudimentary [2] -

1330:29, 1333:10Rules [1] - 1373:9run [1] - 1332:31running [1] - 1365:30

S

safe [7] - 1334:27, 1337:6, 1338:39, 1345:6, 1345:16, 1364:3, 1380:42

safer [1] - 1377:26Safety [5] - 1331:46,

1333:8, 1334:32, 1346:1, 1353:6

safety [90] - 1329:26, 1329:38, 1330:19, 1331:27, 1331:29, 1332:10, 1336:7, 1337:7, 1338:6, 1340:35, 1340:42, 1341:18, 1341:38, 1342:1, 1342:17, 1342:19, 1343:21, 1344:13, 1344:17, 1344:19, 1345:32, 1348:10, 1348:11, 1348:14, 1349:4, 1349:40, 1349:41, 1349:45, 1351:5, 1352:24, 1354:5, 1357:28, 1358:1, 1358:19, 1361:11, 1362:21, 1362:33, 1363:9, 1363:24, 1363:34, 1365:23, 1369:4, 1369:12, 1369:13, 1369:17, 1369:18, 1370:39, 1371:6, 1371:12, 1373:43, 1374:7, 1374:34, 1375:5, 1376:17, 1377:5, 1377:12, 1377:14, 1377:19, 1377:20,

1377:21, 1377:37, 1378:3, 1378:27, 1378:34, 1378:37, 1378:42, 1378:47, 1379:4, 1379:7, 1379:15, 1380:44, 1381:5, 1381:11, 1383:10, 1388:19, 1388:23, 1388:35, 1388:39, 1389:13, 1389:17, 1389:33, 1396:24, 1398:1

SafeWork [10] - 1339:45, 1360:47, 1361:4, 1361:7, 1361:8, 1392:33, 1398:2, 1398:11, 1398:13, 1398:16

sampled [1] - 1334:25samples [1] - 1385:35Sandford [5] -

1393:21, 1399:9, 1399:15, 1399:18, 1399:20

sandstone [1] - 1393:9

sat [2] - 1342:44, 1375:42

satisfaction [2] - 1394:14, 1397:33

satisfactorily [1] - 1397:18

satisfied [1] - 1392:36saw [11] - 1332:41,

1372:4, 1374:29, 1374:39, 1381:47, 1382:16, 1384:42, 1386:6, 1389:20, 1390:14

SC [1] - 1328:45schedules [1] -

1342:8scheme [3] - 1370:41,

1389:39, 1389:41Scott [3] - 1393:21,

1399:15, 1399:20SCP [1] - 1381:6screen [4] - 1351:41,

1390:35, 1390:37, 1391:12

scroll [1] - 1391:13seal [1] - 1334:22sealed [1] - 1334:11second [2] - 1346:8,

1388:42secrecy [1] - 1358:7secretive [1] - 1357:35section [3] - 1332:47,

1335:34, 1401:27SECTION [1] -


15

1328:23see [48] - 1330:34,

1333:37, 1334:36, 1335:8, 1335:26, 1335:30, 1336:4, 1336:38, 1336:46, 1337:31, 1338:4, 1338:15, 1339:27, 1340:2, 1341:2, 1341:35, 1345:32, 1346:4, 1348:41, 1352:25, 1352:28, 1353:3, 1353:42, 1354:44, 1354:46, 1355:13, 1355:14, 1355:17, 1356:26, 1358:15, 1362:13, 1362:33, 1362:42, 1363:23, 1363:43, 1367:41, 1368:13, 1371:39, 1371:40, 1371:42, 1372:38, 1375:43, 1376:45, 1379:32, 1383:4, 1391:1, 1392:22, 1392:44

seeing [4] - 1373:2, 1387:40, 1394:36, 1401:20

seek [1] - 1351:37seeking [2] - 1381:16,

1385:17seem [1] - 1371:33self [3] - 1371:4,

1384:2, 1385:8self-explanatory [2] -

1384:2, 1385:8self-insurers [1] -

1371:4send [1] - 1354:5sends [1] - 1385:17senior [2] - 1359:30,

1384:24sense [2] - 1378:40,

1380:16sent [3] - 1338:37,

1346:16, 1379:33SENT [1] - 1401:13sentence [1] - 1335:41separate [4] -

1340:16, 1386:45, 1387:29, 1393:8

SEPTEMBER [1] - 1401:13

September [5] - 1392:22, 1393:44, 1396:32, 1397:14, 1400:5

serious [1] - 1377:47served [1] - 1350:43

services [7] - 1333:16, 1351:34, 1361:19, 1370:9, 1381:28, 1381:30, 1382:31

sessions [1] - 1356:46set [15] - 1330:7,

1331:27, 1331:40, 1340:15, 1340:43, 1341:3, 1354:29, 1358:29, 1359:42, 1360:36, 1361:32, 1370:35, 1370:38, 1378:17, 1387:14

setting [2] - 1357:18, 1381:1

settled [1] - 1390:13seven [5] - 1341:3,

1341:6, 1342:34, 1359:36, 1390:20

shed [1] - 1387:25sheds [5] - 1387:13,

1387:20, 1387:26, 1387:27, 1387:29

sheet [1] - 1382:36Shellshear [3] -

1374:10, 1374:11, 1375:27

shields [1] - 1331:41shift [1] - 1382:40Shires [1] - 1337:9shires [1] - 1337:11shops [1] - 1350:7short [5] - 1340:11,

1357:42, 1357:45, 1377:37, 1392:14

SHORT [1] - 1368:26show [6] - 1330:32,

1345:31, 1354:37, 1361:27, 1362:7, 1390:37

showed [1] - 1340:5showing [1] - 1391:13shown [10] - 1343:37,

1343:39, 1343:42, 1345:28, 1345:33, 1350:42, 1361:41, 1383:29, 1384:31, 1387:36

shut [1] - 1395:2side [2] - 1334:27,

1375:6sides [1] - 1343:26significant [4] -

1335:43, 1388:18, 1388:20, 1388:24

signs [1] - 1333:40silo [2] - 1340:26,

1370:38similar [4] - 1351:25,

1375:29, 1393:35,

1397:30simple [1] - 1361:39simulating [1] -

1393:33single [1] - 1386:11Singleton [5] -

1376:30, 1391:2, 1391:7, 1401:5, 1402:4

SINGLETON [18] - 1372:22, 1373:5, 1373:11, 1373:17, 1376:32, 1376:34, 1376:36, 1390:30, 1399:5, 1399:7, 1399:40, 1399:46, 1400:4, 1400:16, 1401:1, 1401:7, 1401:18, 1402:9

sit [1] - 1367:23site [15] - 1349:28,

1350:2, 1359:23, 1361:10, 1363:28, 1392:43, 1393:9, 1393:12, 1393:13, 1393:18, 1393:30, 1393:31, 1394:5, 1394:45, 1396:3

sites [5] - 1350:45, 1352:7, 1352:12, 1359:32, 1372:13

sits [1] - 1345:9sitting [1] - 1355:41situation [4] -

1386:34, 1387:32, 1394:35, 1396:21

six [2] - 1342:33, 1359:24

six/seven [1] - 1378:11

skirting [1] - 1350:27skull [1] - 1371:20slightly [1] - 1398:43small [1] - 1353:24Smith [2] - 1393:23,

1399:14soil [1] - 1393:33someone [9] -

1331:11, 1337:12, 1359:29, 1360:38, 1363:30, 1364:3, 1380:36, 1385:2, 1389:20

sometimes [5] - 1376:20, 1379:43, 1389:24, 1389:25

somewhere [9] - 1335:33, 1350:12, 1351:40, 1359:44, 1364:4, 1378:11,

1378:46, 1381:41, 1388:34

sorry [17] - 1333:10, 1343:12, 1343:36, 1349:31, 1349:37, 1355:23, 1355:38, 1356:42, 1365:16, 1366:10, 1378:7, 1380:34, 1382:14, 1383:36, 1389:3, 1400:32, 1401:34

sort [13] - 1332:27, 1333:36, 1339:37, 1340:26, 1354:30, 1359:1, 1366:39, 1367:38, 1371:20, 1377:39, 1389:37, 1393:28, 1395:19

sought [2] - 1348:26, 1350:18

South [6] - 1331:1, 1338:28, 1356:43, 1358:6, 1385:5, 1391:3

southern [1] - 1335:1space [1] - 1339:46speaking [3] -

1376:37, 1379:13, 1380:7

specific [4] - 1332:36, 1344:28, 1365:17, 1366:36

specifically [4] - 1345:10, 1345:15, 1354:34, 1360:9

specified [2] - 1346:14, 1393:5

spelling [1] - 1399:38spent [1] - 1342:47spirometer [1] -

1350:11split [2] - 1342:22,

1381:28spoken [4] - 1343:18,

1345:7, 1345:15, 1345:17

SPP [3] - 1381:2, 1381:4, 1381:6

spread [1] - 1389:9spreadsheet [4] -

1333:28, 1371:45, 1382:10, 1382:17

Springwood [8] - 1351:5, 1356:26, 1365:24, 1365:46, 1372:14, 1372:28, 1372:34, 1399:21

staff [22] - 1329:30, 1329:43, 1330:9, 1351:35, 1358:30,

1358:32, 1359:4, 1359:28, 1360:1, 1360:27, 1365:6, 1365:7, 1372:11, 1388:6, 1388:7, 1389:1, 1390:22, 1394:18, 1394:28, 1395:40, 1396:5, 1397:35

staff's [1] - 1398:29stage [25] - 1331:11,

1337:16, 1338:4, 1338:10, 1341:44, 1343:23, 1353:28, 1354:20, 1355:37, 1358:29, 1358:40, 1360:35, 1361:19, 1363:47, 1367:46, 1370:40, 1375:42, 1377:44, 1377:45, 1378:33, 1378:46, 1386:23, 1386:26, 1387:9, 1391:23

stand [1] - 1381:4standard [2] -

1331:33, 1339:44standards [1] -

1385:33start [4] - 1340:3,

1373:15, 1376:47, 1397:3

started [9] - 1332:39, 1342:23, 1349:25, 1349:33, 1358:43, 1377:9, 1380:24, 1388:33, 1388:35

starting [3] - 1380:46, 1388:33

starts [1] - 1353:26state [3] - 1329:8,

1383:36, 1391:39State [9] - 1337:8,

1364:5, 1370:31, 1383:22, 1384:47, 1385:2, 1391:4, 1391:17

state-wide [1] - 1383:36

State-wide [3] - 1383:22, 1391:4, 1391:17

statement [4] - 1339:44, 1341:36, 1375:30

States [1] - 1390:17static [1] - 1387:6stay [2] - 1357:46,

1369:40stayed [2] - 1346:10,

1357:10


16

staying [1] - 1393:31steer [1] - 1352:25step [2] - 1388:24,

1388:27steps [4] - 1341:3,

1341:5, 1341:6, 1390:5

Steve [6] - 1333:36, 1350:27, 1369:30, 1369:31, 1370:8, 1385:34

STEVE [1] - 1401:12STEVEN [1] - 1391:35Steven [1] - 1391:41still [20] - 1336:29,

1357:19, 1359:15, 1367:23, 1369:12, 1369:13, 1369:37, 1371:23, 1375:23, 1375:24, 1378:33, 1385:39, 1388:38, 1389:7, 1392:39, 1395:6, 1397:14, 1397:34, 1397:35, 1397:42

stockpile [6] - 1359:32, 1392:43, 1393:9, 1394:5, 1394:44, 1396:3

stockpiles [1] - 1393:16

stop [4] - 1339:32, 1341:5, 1366:41, 1368:18

store [1] - 1331:43story [2] - 1368:3,

1371:9Street [4] - 1328:36,

1356:43, 1358:6, 1392:44

structure [4] - 1368:45, 1374:29, 1399:17, 1400:9

Stuart [10] - 1367:44, 1368:13, 1368:14, 1369:1, 1369:2, 1376:43, 1377:35, 1379:44, 1380:17

studied [2] - 1371:23stuff [5] - 1342:26,

1349:45, 1361:25, 1375:12, 1389:6

subject [3] - 1371:19, 1399:8, 1401:9

subjects [2] - 1349:17, 1371:14

submission [9] - 1392:14, 1392:26, 1392:28, 1393:38, 1396:31, 1397:13,

1397:22, 1399:9, 1400:22

submitted [1] - 1352:31

substance [1] - 1387:39

successfully [1] - 1381:10

suggest [3] - 1360:25, 1388:5, 1398:9

suggested [1] - 1360:43

suggesting [2] - 1387:24, 1389:12

suggestions [1] - 1364:23

suite [1] - 1375:15summary [2] - 1335:9,

1378:43supervisor [5] -

1349:46, 1393:15, 1393:20, 1399:10, 1399:25

supervisors [2] - 1332:10, 1363:26

supervisory [1] - 1349:14

supplementary [1] - 1359:18

suppliers [1] - 1381:43

supply [1] - 1353:6support [2] - 1394:24,

1395:6supported [1] -

1343:6supportive [2] -

1342:20, 1342:21suppose [2] -

1331:33, 1376:4supposed [5] -

1340:16, 1356:20, 1366:41, 1376:24, 1384:10

supposedly [1] - 1357:11

surprise [2] - 1398:12, 1400:12

surprised [1] - 1361:24

surveillance [2] - 1358:24, 1358:28

survey [3] - 1335:37, 1336:41, 1337:28

sworn [2] - 1329:4, 1391:35

Sydney [2] - 1359:21, 1380:45

system [16] - 1331:27, 1333:22, 1333:24,

1340:26, 1341:19, 1342:12, 1342:45, 1342:46, 1357:18, 1360:19, 1366:34, 1370:38, 1370:39, 1371:6, 1371:47

systems [13] - 1330:6, 1368:46, 1370:42, 1375:32, 1375:33, 1377:17, 1377:18, 1377:20, 1377:21, 1377:26, 1377:32, 1380:47, 1381:1

systems" [1] - 1344:32

systems/procedures

[1] - 1340:9

T

table [2] - 1336:33, 1362:44

taker [1] - 1366:15Tan [1] - 1370:7tarp [1] - 1334:24task [1] - 1362:17Taylor [1] - 1357:43teal [1] - 1344:7Team [1] - 1353:6team [44] - 1330:19,

1336:7, 1339:46, 1340:35, 1340:42, 1343:21, 1348:28, 1354:5, 1357:28, 1358:20, 1358:27, 1358:38, 1360:42, 1361:47, 1362:3, 1362:5, 1362:20, 1362:21, 1362:33, 1362:34, 1362:37, 1362:38, 1362:39, 1362:43, 1362:45, 1362:47, 1363:1, 1363:9, 1363:11, 1363:17, 1363:18, 1363:34, 1374:40, 1377:21, 1388:39, 1389:24, 1392:7, 1393:31, 1394:2, 1394:3, 1394:4, 1399:19

team" [1] - 1349:4teams [8] - 1331:42,

1332:9, 1332:18, 1332:26, 1389:10, 1393:8, 1393:14, 1399:19

Ted [1] - 1377:16ten [1] - 1379:10tender [2] - 1400:46,

1401:30

tendered [1] - 1401:16term [2] - 1346:12,

1359:16terms [2] - 1346:9,

1398:45terrible [1] - 1357:31test [2] - 1380:21,

1395:29tested [6] - 1334:9,

1334:10, 1334:25, 1350:5, 1350:10, 1359:32

testified [1] - 1383:14testing [21] - 1349:16,

1350:5, 1358:30, 1358:31, 1358:32, 1358:35, 1358:39, 1358:46, 1359:12, 1359:13, 1359:18, 1359:23, 1359:24, 1359:27, 1359:45, 1371:31, 1371:32, 1395:3, 1395:32

tests [1] - 1395:26THE [46] - 1328:23,

1329:1, 1332:39, 1341:28, 1342:40, 1348:32, 1356:14, 1365:13, 1366:20, 1366:36, 1367:35, 1368:23, 1368:28, 1368:33, 1369:15, 1372:25, 1372:27, 1373:9, 1373:14, 1373:23, 1374:4, 1375:41, 1376:30, 1390:40, 1391:28, 1391:31, 1391:33, 1396:30, 1398:33, 1399:36, 1399:43, 1400:1, 1400:18, 1400:22, 1400:32, 1400:35, 1400:37, 1400:41, 1400:46, 1401:3, 1401:9, 1401:15, 1401:23, 1402:4, 1402:11, 1402:14

themselves [4] - 1333:42, 1340:35, 1350:36, 1354:21

there" [1] - 1344:33thereafter [1] -

1339:12therefore [2] -

1343:12, 1370:36they've [3] - 1331:42,

1343:6, 1392:31third [6] - 1339:28,

1339:30, 1363:38,

1371:5, 1394:17, 1394:20

third-last [1] - 1394:17thirds [1] - 1353:3three [5] - 1340:20,

1342:47, 1356:46, 1370:42, 1371:4

three-year [1] - 1370:42

throughout [5] - 1332:44, 1349:14, 1376:15, 1379:3, 1399:18

thrown [1] - 1381:23tidying [1] - 1375:30tip [1] - 1361:15title [6] - 1377:42,

1377:46, 1378:3, 1378:37, 1383:31, 1389:15

titles [3] - 1333:4, 1377:5, 1378:40

TO [2] - 1401:12, 1402:14

today [10] - 1383:29, 1383:43, 1384:16, 1384:20, 1384:31, 1392:27, 1392:29, 1395:6, 1399:8, 1400:37

together [3] - 1338:25, 1347:41, 1347:42

toilets [1] - 1333:41Tony [1] - 1400:5took [14] - 1336:9,

1339:8, 1343:44, 1345:20, 1349:28, 1352:47, 1360:13, 1367:16, 1376:20, 1388:23, 1391:3, 1394:37, 1401:31, 1401:39

top [5] - 1330:37, 1335:9, 1352:25, 1362:8, 1375:18

topic [1] - 1365:42tore [1] - 1371:31towards [3] - 1341:3,

1352:6, 1364:37toxicology [4] -

1349:18, 1371:13, 1371:14, 1371:24

track [2] - 1363:31, 1381:36

tracks [1] - 1331:37trade [1] - 1390:46Trades [1] - 1350:32trades [8] - 1350:32,

1350:33, 1350:34, 1351:21, 1381:34,


17

1381:35, 1385:38, 1387:16

traditionally [1] - 1350:34

trailer [1] - 1331:40train [1] - 1393:35trained [1] - 1366:28trainees [1] - 1393:17trainers [1] - 1364:1training [28] - 1342:8,

1349:42, 1349:43, 1349:44, 1360:17, 1360:18, 1360:20, 1360:24, 1360:31, 1360:36, 1360:38, 1361:30, 1363:43, 1363:47, 1364:2, 1364:8, 1364:9, 1364:28, 1377:23, 1377:24, 1390:10, 1390:18, 1390:21, 1390:24, 1393:17, 1395:13, 1395:15, 1395:19

training" [1] - 1360:16trains [1] - 1377:28transferred [2] -

1393:12, 1394:32transport [1] -

1399:32transportation [1] -

1393:31treated [2] - 1365:45,

1367:6treating [1] - 1367:12TREVOR [1] - 1329:4Trevor [4] - 1329:9,

1350:13, 1393:22, 1399:14

tried [5] - 1335:31, 1340:35, 1381:9, 1389:18, 1390:13

TRIM [6] - 1343:11, 1344:24, 1344:26, 1344:28, 1374:46, 1375:3

TRIM" [1] - 1344:34trouble [2] - 1356:11,

1368:18truck [1] - 1393:33trucks [2] - 1393:30,

1393:34true [1] - 1379:36try [1] - 1340:28trying [8] - 1336:30,

1341:44, 1342:11, 1367:38, 1367:39, 1369:38, 1369:43, 1381:15

turn [17] - 1330:45,

1332:12, 1334:36, 1336:33, 1336:44, 1338:27, 1339:18, 1340:47, 1341:18, 1346:34, 1348:17, 1351:11, 1352:28, 1355:43, 1356:25, 1362:42, 1383:7

turned [1] - 1379:5Turner [1] - 1369:37turning [2] - 1362:12,

1383:9two [22] - 1340:20,

1341:47, 1349:7, 1352:37, 1353:3, 1356:45, 1370:42, 1378:5, 1383:29, 1385:13, 1388:42, 1390:22, 1393:8, 1393:10, 1393:14, 1395:15, 1395:26, 1395:33, 1399:22, 1399:44, 1401:19, 1401:30

two-thirds [1] - 1353:3type [1] - 1361:16types [3] - 1353:46,

1356:4, 1360:24

U

ultimately [2] - 1360:41, 1398:12

under [16] - 1335:36, 1337:25, 1339:27, 1341:24, 1347:13, 1347:16, 1365:9, 1369:1, 1369:2, 1377:5, 1377:28, 1384:44, 1386:30, 1400:8, 1401:27

UNDER [1] - 1328:23understood [3] -

1347:37, 1364:27, 1387:32

undertaken [1] - 1337:29

undertaking [1] - 1398:14

underway [1] - 1338:18

unfortunately [2] - 1330:10, 1371:19

unhappy [1] - 1398:10union [2] - 1355:37,

1396:15United [2] - 1334:47,

1380:36units [1] - 1360:27University [1] -

1371:15university [1] -

1349:17unless [1] - 1366:45unload [1] - 1393:13unloading [1] -

1393:34unpopular [1] -

1355:40unrelated [2] - 1397:9,

1397:10unresolved [1] -

1397:14up [70] - 1330:33,

1331:27, 1331:40, 1332:16, 1332:17, 1332:29, 1333:31, 1334:5, 1334:11, 1334:22, 1336:6, 1336:29, 1339:32, 1340:15, 1340:43, 1341:17, 1342:9, 1342:46, 1346:18, 1349:40, 1350:42, 1352:6, 1352:47, 1354:12, 1354:29, 1357:18, 1358:29, 1358:46, 1359:23, 1359:39, 1360:1, 1360:14, 1360:36, 1361:5, 1361:32, 1361:36, 1365:36, 1366:16, 1370:35, 1370:38, 1370:40, 1371:25, 1372:1, 1373:45, 1374:5, 1374:6, 1375:26, 1375:30, 1375:32, 1376:36, 1377:35, 1378:13, 1378:16, 1378:30, 1379:5, 1381:1, 1381:28, 1383:7, 1383:9, 1385:5, 1387:45, 1388:13, 1389:38, 1389:42, 1393:34, 1393:35, 1393:36, 1394:22, 1395:25, 1400:13

up" [1] - 1351:38update [5] - 1356:30,

1357:2, 1382:22, 1388:6, 1392:27

updated [2] - 1375:20, 1384:43

updates [1] - 1390:18updating [1] - 1329:43upset [1] - 1367:2useless [1] - 1382:21USU [3] - 1394:8,

1396:13, 1396:14usual [2] - 1349:6,

1375:17usual" [1] - 1367:33

V

vague [1] - 1395:39various [8] - 1330:17,

1332:8, 1333:41, 1359:28, 1365:10, 1377:5, 1384:4, 1384:5

vehicle [1] - 1393:32vehicles [6] - 1394:31,

1394:32, 1394:41, 1395:1, 1395:2, 1395:3

verbally [1] - 1355:28version [10] - 1331:10,

1331:17, 1341:29, 1341:31, 1346:25, 1347:9, 1347:10, 1372:4, 1380:27, 1383:31

view [18] - 1337:22, 1340:3, 1341:47, 1345:32, 1351:25, 1371:34, 1374:16, 1374:31, 1392:31, 1395:6, 1397:18, 1397:30, 1397:32, 1397:36, 1397:37, 1398:29, 1398:30, 1398:47

views [1] - 1397:42virtually [3] - 1343:42,

1346:21, 1375:9Vo [1] - 1370:7volume [6] - 1330:32,

1378:16, 1383:8, 1390:36, 1390:44

volunteer [1] - 1386:20

volunteers [1] - 1372:10

W

wait [2] - 1392:18, 1400:32

Wales [4] - 1331:1, 1338:28, 1385:6, 1391:3

wants [2] - 1376:22warn [1] - 1389:21WAS [1] - 1402:14waste [5] - 1331:39,

1339:40, 1359:9, 1359:10, 1361:19

watered [2] - 1368:12,

1390:15watermark [2] -

1341:32, 1346:4week [2] - 1361:21,

1378:14weekend [2] -

1341:32, 1402:12weekly [5] - 1363:20,

1376:40, 1376:43, 1379:33

weeks [2] - 1357:43, 1390:20

welding [1] - 1349:44well-respected [1] -

1376:15Westpool [6] -

1334:47, 1335:1, 1335:30, 1371:4, 1380:36, 1380:40

wet [1] - 1334:24WH&S [2] - 1333:7,

1351:4whilst [2] - 1368:13,

1381:21White [1] - 1353:27whole [5] - 1351:28,

1354:30, 1368:11, 1370:38, 1386:15

WHS [7] - 1329:29, 1329:37, 1353:15, 1354:45, 1356:25, 1371:18, 1378:22

Wickramasekera [2] - 1344:20, 1375:11

wide [5] - 1383:22, 1383:36, 1386:27, 1391:4, 1391:17

WILLIAM [1] - 1329:4William [1] - 1329:9willing [1] - 1366:45Willis [9] - 1334:33,

1334:45, 1335:2, 1335:4, 1342:41, 1370:1, 1370:2, 1370:19, 1377:39

WITHDREW [2] - 1391:31, 1400:35

Withers [1] - 1377:16witness [1] - 1366:30WITNESS [3] -

1372:27, 1391:31, 1400:35

witnesses [1] - 1400:37

wondering [1] - 1399:44

word [2] - 1364:39, 1366:29

wording [1] - 1365:32words [1] - 1398:7


18

WorkCover [12] - 1337:9, 1338:38, 1345:7, 1350:44, 1361:7, 1361:10, 1361:35, 1361:42, 1361:44, 1370:41, 1370:47, 1391:15

worker [1] - 1386:19workers [13] -

1329:31, 1342:17, 1343:29, 1343:32, 1343:33, 1354:27, 1373:43, 1374:34, 1375:5, 1376:17, 1378:1, 1378:13, 1397:21

workforce [1] - 1390:26

Workplace [1] - 1346:1

workplace [3] - 1329:38, 1351:27, 1383:10

workplaces [4] - 1386:17, 1387:4, 1387:6

workshops [4] - 1349:16, 1350:3, 1350:4, 1371:31

worried [1] - 1376:16wrap [1] - 1331:40write [4] - 1379:22,

1379:43, 1379:44, 1385:41

writing [4] - 1329:46, 1344:5, 1355:30, 1385:36

written [3] - 1330:26, 1371:46, 1377:23

wrongdoing [1] - 1367:23

wrongly [1] - 1374:4wrote [3] - 1346:6,

1346:9, 1387:33

X

X-ray [1] - 1395:29X-rayed [1] - 1350:10

Y

Yasoda [2] - 1344:20, 1375:10

year [3] - 1370:42, 1378:5, 1397:4

years [28] - 1335:38, 1340:23, 1342:17, 1342:34, 1342:36, 1346:22, 1349:19, 1357:44, 1359:36,


19

1361:34, 1365:5, 1370:10, 1370:24, 1371:7, 1371:12, 1375:9, 1376:14, 1377:6, 1378:9, 1378:11, 1379:11, 1386:44, 1387:1, 1388:32, 1389:15, 1389:37, 1395:33

yesterday [1] - 1401:39

yourself [7] - 1339:34, 1341:25, 1352:41, 1356:37, 1377:40, 1382:42, 1389:16

Yvonne [1] - 1357:14

Z

Zofi [1] - 1366:14