Queensland

Parliamentary Debates [Hansard]

Legislative Assembly

WEDNESDAY, 12 SEPTEMBER 1973

Electronic reproduction of original hardcopy

484 Questions Upon Notice [12 SEPTEMBER 1973] Questions Upon Notice

WEDNESDAY, 12 SEPTEMBER 1973

Mr. SPEAKER (Hon. W. H. Lonergan, Flinders) read prayers and took the chair at 11 a.m.

ADDRESS IN REPLY

PRESENTATION

Mr. SPEAKER: I have to inform the House that I propose to present to His Excellency the Governor, at Government House, on Thursday morning at 9.45 o'clock, the Address in Reply to His Excellency's Opening Speech agreed to on 11 September, and I shall be glad to be accompanied by the mover and the seconder and such other honourable members as care to be present.

PAPERS

The following paper was laid on the table, and ordered to be printed:-

Report of the Manager, Golden Casket Art Union, for the year 1972-73.

The following paper was laid on the table:-

Regulation under the Valuers Registration Act 1965-1971.

QUESTIONS UPON NOTICE

CO~MMONWEALTH ASSISTANCE FOR STATE HOSPITALS

1\<lr. Houston, pursuant to notice, asked The Minister for Health,-

In relation to the recent controversy concerning assistance to Queensland hospitals, as outlined in the Common­wealth Budget, on what day was the sub­mission sent from the State Health Depart­ment to the Commonwealth Department of Health?

Answer:-

''The first communication on file in my Department regarding assistance to Queens­land Hopsitals in the Commonwealth Budget is a private letter from Dr. Sax, the Chairman of the Commonwealth Hospital and Health Service Planning Interim Committee, directed to the Under Secretary on July 23 this year. In this, there was an indication of Commonwealth intentions to make limited moneys available to Queensland towards hospital construc­tion. Subsequent to the receipt of this private letter, Dr. Sax visited Que-ensland on August 1, when formal discussions were held regarding the areas which it is anticipated will come under Dr. Sax's supervision. Amongst these were listed approved major projects for Queensland

Public Hospitals. A letter confirming the matters listed was forwarded on August 28 to Dr. Sax, containing details of major hospital projects in the metropolitan and country areas, estimated to cost in excess of $83 million. If the Commonwealth Government is prepared, as reported in a statement in the local Press and attributed to the Honourable the Minister for Social Security, to make $3 mi!Iion to $4 million available, there is more than ample scope in the programme discussed with Dr. Sax, to utilise this finance on projects which have reached an advanced planning stage."

FIBRE-GLASS CoATING oF HousEs; FESTA

CoNSTRUCTIONs PTY. LTD.

Mr . .Jensen, pursuant to notice, asked The Minister for Justice,-

In view of previous misrepresentations by firms engaged in fibre-glass coating pro­tection for houses with a 20-year guarantee and as Festa Constructions Pty. Ltd., Wickham Street, Fortitude Valley, has salesmen canvassing in Bundaberg and other country cities and towns to seal homes with their product, which also carries a 20-year guarantee-

( 1) How long has this firm been in the fibre-glass house protective business?

(2) What is the paid-up capital of this firm?

( 3) Will he again warn the people of Queensland to beware of such guarantees for this type of coating?

Answers:-

( 1) "Festa Constructions Pty. Ltd. was incorporated on February 1, 1972. The Memorandum of Association authorised it to carry on any trade associated with the erection and/or renovation of industrial, commercial or residential premises."

(2) "According to records held at the office of the Commissioner for Corporate Affairs the paid up capital of the company is $2."

(3) "Homeowners are again warned of the need to exercise extreme care before entering into contracts to have their homes texture coated, in the expectation that the work will remain in good condition for 20 years. In considering the merits of any guarantee it ,is necessary to take into account not only the financial capacity of the firm offering the guarantee to meet the cost of any rectification work which might be required, but also the question of whether it can reasonably be expected that the firm will still be in business to honour its guarantees in 20 years' time."

Questions Upon Notice [12 SEPTEMBER 1973] Questions Upon Notice 485

BACKLOG OF DISTRICT COURT CIVIL CAsEs, MT. IsA

Mr. Armstrong, pursuant to notice, asked The Minister for Justice,-

( 1) Is he aware of a report of a serious backlog of civil cases awaiting hearing in the District Court at Mt. Isa?

(2) What action will be taken to sub­stantially reduce the backlog?

Answer:-( 1 and 2) "The statistics quoted in the

North West Star newspaper are more apparent than real as when it comes to setting down matters for trial in Mount Isa the settlement rate is high and past history shows that the apparent number of cases awaiting hearing is not the number which would be ready for trial. To meet the apparent backlog in Mount Isa an additional two weeks for civil work only has been arranged, with a possibility of a further week in the Sittings commencing on October 2 next. This Sittings was originally for one week from October 16, but has been changed to two weeks from October 2. Between now and the end of the year provision has been made for District Courts Sittings in Mount Isa for six weeks. The Chairman of District Courts agrees that Sittings beyond those provided in this year's calendar are warranted and necessary provision will be made in next year's calendar."

TRAFFIC LIGHTS, BOUNDARY ROAD-RAILWAY AVENUE INTERSECTION, TOWNSVILLE

!Vir. Aikens, pursuant to notice, asked The Minister for Mines,-

Are Boundary Road and Railway A venue, Townsville, main roads and, if so, will consideration be urgently given to the installation of traffic lights at their inter­section?

Answer:-"Railway Avenue is a main road but

Boundary Road is not. The proximity to the railway level crossing complicates this intersection. Following the Townsville Transportation Study, reconstruction has been programmed and consideration will be given to provision of traffic lights in the redesign of this intersection and the rail­way crossing approaches."

HoUSING COMMISSION UNITS FOR AGED PERSONS AT GARBUTT, TOWNSV!LLE

!Hr. Aikens, pursuant to notice, asked The Minister for Works,-

( 1) Has his attention been drawn to an :::rticle in The Townsville Daily Bulletin of September 8, wherein Senator J. Keeffe is

reported as saying, in effect, that }he Com­monwealth Minister for Housing JS respon­sible, following his representations, for the decision to build a total of 30 aged persons' units in the Townsville suburb of Garbutt?

(2) In view of his Answer to my Ques­tion some time ago regarding the same matter, will he inform the House as fully ns possible on the typical limelighting tactics of Senator Keeffe and the role that the State Government played in this important matter?

Answer:-( 1 and 2) "I have not seen the article

to which the Honourable Member refers. While representations from the Senator, or any other Member or responsible person or organisation, in the interests of aged persons would receive every consideration, I am not aware that Senator Keeffe played any part in relation to these units. The decision to build units in Townsville was taken by myself when I visited ,that city on the Christmas Day immediately after Cyclone Althea when I found that two old wartime buildings on Housing Commission land were not worth repair. The third site was also available. The provision of aged persons units in our current five-year plan is a partnership arrangement between the State and the Commonwealth and I am appreciative of the financial contribution being given by the Commonwealth Government. In the case of the 30 units being constructed at Townsville the State has found finance for 11 units and the Commonwealth has financed the other 19."

UNION BLACK BANS ON FRENCH GooDS AND SERVICES; \!IS!T BY AUSTRALIAN

RUGBY LEAGUE TEAM TO FRANCE Mr. Aikens, pursuant to notice, asked The

Premier,-( 1) Has he been informed that the

Australian Labor Party, in all sections, has placed "black" bans on all things French because of that country's explosion of nuclear devices in the South Pacific?

(2) Is he aware that an Australian Rugby League team is scheduled to play in France in the near future and that many prominent members of Rugby League clubs are also prominent members of the A.L.P.?

( 3) Will he ascertain whether, in con­sistency, these people will extend the anti­French ban to the games scheduled to be played in France?

Answers:-( 1) "It has come to our notice that the

A.C.T.U. has applied certain industrial bans to French shipping and in other

486 Questions Upon Notice [12 SEPTEMBER 1973] Questions Upon Notice

directions because the French Government has conducted atmospheric tests of nuclear weapons in the South Pacific. I had some personal experience of these bans when I was last in Paris and found myself com­pletely isolated from Australia where communications were concerned. It is clear the same attitude has not been adopted by the A.C.T.U. in regard to the Government of China. We join with all other Australians in deploring the actions of both Governments in this regard. Nevertheless, in the event, these actions of the A.C.T.U. have proved as futile as Dr. Cairns telling the Chinese Government that he disapproved of their exploding nuclear bombs in the atmosphere."

(2 and 3) "Yes. I point out that the A.C.T.U. has had the support of the Commonwealth Government in its ineffectual exercise, but, as far as the visit of the Rugby League team to France is concerned, it would appear that members of the A.L.P. can, when it suits them, sub­scribe to the belief that sport and politics do not mix. The A.L.P. will have to follow its own conscience-or lack of conscience-in this matter and I do not propose to make enquiries as suggested by the Honourable Member. However, I feel sure the prominent Rugby League mem­bers mentioned by him will not endeavour to have the Australian Rugby League drop its proposals for its team to play in France."

MARYBOROUGH RAILWAY WORKSHOPS

Mr. Alison, pursuant to notice, asked The Minister for Transport,-

( 1) With reference to the recent reduc­tion in staff at the Maryborough railway workshops, will he give an assurance that (a) in future all vacancies will be promptly filled, (b) an immediate survey will be made of the buildings, plant and equipment and other facilities of the workshops with a view to implementing a policy in this financial year to replace worn-out and anti­quated plant and facilities and improve the working conditions generally, (c) senior departmental officers will meet the respec­tive union representatives in Maryborough in the immediate future to discuss the several problems in relation to working conditions and inadequate staffing and working conditions generally, with a view to rectifying these serious problems promptly, (d) if the capacity at the three other major rolling-stock repair centres is exceeded, the Maryborough workshops will be expanded to handle this extra work and (e) as many apprentices as possible will be engaged each year at the Maryborough railway workshops?

(2) How does the cost of repairing wagons, both wood and metal, at Mary­borough compare with the costs at Rock­hampton, Townsville and Ipswich, and what overtime was worked during June at these centres?

Answer:-( 1 and 2) "The Honourable Member is

aware of his considerable representations and submissions made to me, both oral and written, on this subject, and the detailed replies which have been for­warded to him. Now that the workshops at Maryborough have been working for some weeks with the adjusted staff, it is proposed that a senior engineering officer will visit Maryborough in the near future to make an assessment of the position, after which the survey sought by the Honourable Member will be carried out."

PUBLICITY FOR TRAFFIC REGULATIONS ON RIGHT OF WAY

Mr. Dean, pursuant to notice, asked The Minister for Transport,-

In view of the report in the Sunday Sun of September 2 on the publication of inaccurate guidance on the right-of-way traffic regulation by commercial interests, is it proposed to arrange for television or other visual advertisements stressing the correct procedures?

Answer:-"The Honourable Member would be

aware that a Department of Transport booklet entitled the Queensland Traffic Code sets out clearly in pictorial form the give-way traffic rules. Over 200,000 free copies have already been di&tributed. This booklet has from time to time been widely publicised but I will examine the need for any further publicity."

SPEED LIMITS AND ACCIDENT STATISTICS, HEAVY COMMERCIAL VEHICLES

Dr. Crawford, pursuant to notice, asked The Minister for Transport,-

( 1) What is the speed limit for semi­trailers and heavy commercial vehicles and is there more control over the speed limits of these classes of vehicles in other States than there is in Queensland?

(2) Will he dissect the accident statistics to ascertain if these vehicles are associated with an undue preponderance of (a) serious and (b) fatal accidents?

(3) Is there any need for alterations to be made to either the legislation or the regulations governing the use of heavy vehicles?

Questions Upon Notice [12 SEPTEMBER 1973] Questions Upon Notice 487

AnsH·ers:-

( 1) "In Queensland the absolute speed limit at the present time, except otherwise signed, for all vehicles including semi­trailers and heavy commercial vehicles, is 60 miles (approximately 96·5 kilometres) per hour outside a built-up area. In other States lower speed limits for heavy com­mercial vehicles presently apply. The National Road Traffic Code, which has recently been converted to metric, provides for 70 kilometres per hour for vehicles in excess of 4 tonnes, 80 kilometres per hour for vehicles towing trailers over 15 cwt., and 80 kilometres per hour for buses."

(2) "No. Official published accident statistics do not purport to assign responsi­bility for road accidents. Studies which have been made appear to indicate that heavy commercial vehicles are over­represented in accidents. A study by Dr. T onge in 1971 surveyed accidents involv­ing semi-trailers over the period 1965 to 1967 and he came to this conclusion although he indicated that further study was necessary before true comparisons could be made."

(3) "This is presently under considera­tion at a national level by the Australian Transport Advisory Council in order to achieve some uniformity between the States in this area."

CONTROLLED HARVESTING OF KANGAROOS

Dr. Crawford, pursuant to notice, asked The Minister for Primary Industries,-

( 1) What is the current situation regard­ing the conservation of kangaroos?

(2) Is the kangaroo population increas­ing rapidly and has the Commonwealth Government's ban on the export of skins been wholly or partly responsible for a gross population increase in Western Queensland?

( 3) What measures, Commonwealth or State, are necessary to maintain a balanced kangaroo population in this area, to ensure that the species is preserved and grazing properties are protected for stock use?

Answers:-(1) "All species of kangaroos are secure

in Queensland and the Government's con­servation programme is satisfying the needs of the kangaroos, the landholders and the genuine conservationists."

(2) "The kangaroo population is increasing rapidly in some areas largely due to good seasonal conditions and also due to the export ban. When drought conditions again prevail in the west and central west, kangaroos will become visibly evident and they will present a 'pest' problem to some landholders."

(3) "The State measures necessary to ensure a balanced conservation programme and which are being implemented at

present are as follows :-(a) Protection of the species under Queensland legisla­tion; (b) A system of controlled harvest­ing by means of open seasons, licensing of shooters and dealers, and a system for recording the numbers taken; (c) A scientific system for monitoring the kan­garoo population in the wild. No addi­tional measures need to be implemented by the Commonwealth."

CAPITAL WORKS, GLADSTONE AND OTHER COUNTRY HoSPITALS

Dr. Crawford, pursuant to notice, asked The Minister for Health,-

( 1) What is the current development situation regarding the Gladstone Hospital?

(2) Have any decisions been made for capital works at that hospital and has the Commonwealth financial equity in financ­ing capital expenditure been determined?

(3) What Commonwealth moneys are to be provided for hospital capital works outside the Brisbane metropolitan area?

( 4) What effect will the present Com­monwealth Budget have on providing new hospital buildings in country centres?

Answers:-

( 1) "At the present time there are no major developments proposed for the Gladstone Hospital. Over recent times however, expenditure totalling $600,000 has been incurred in hospital development and remodelling, at Gladstone, including $450,000 on a new Outpatients and Administration Block opened on January 31, 1973. The Honourable the Member for Port Cmiis has been kept informed of these matters."

(2) "Investigations are being undertaken by the Department's Health Services Planning and Development Unit as to the long-range requirements for Gladstone. At an appropriate time approaches would be made to the Commonwealth Govern­ment for financial assistance in respect of any major development."

(3) "A formal submission has been forwarded to the chairman of the Com­monwealth Hospital and Health Services Planning Interim Committee advising of major country hospital projects estimated to cost in excess of $39,000,000. The Queensland Government would be only too happy to accept any contribution which the Commonwealth Government cares to offer in respect of these developments."

( 4) "The policy of the Commonwealth Government in respect of contributions to hospital development in this State is

488 Questions Upon Notice (12 SEPTEMBER 1973] Questions Upon Notice

not known and certainly no offer has been received in respect of the major projects envisaged for country areas."

DISPOSABLE MEDICAL SYRINGES

Mrs. Jordan, pursuant to notice, asked The Minister for Health,-

( 1) Is he aware of the alarm expressed by some parents at the practice by doctors of leaving disposable syringes at patients' homes after treating the patients?

(2) Is there any danger to children as a result of this practice and can any action be taken to ensure that the practice ceases?

Answer:-(1 and 2) "As the Honourable Mem­

ber should realise the doctors involved belong to the private sector of the pro­fession and do not come within the responsibility of my Depa1iment. I understand that the Australian Medical Association has recommended to its mem­bers that after use disposable syringes be rendered unusable. The Director­General will take up the matter with the association again. I think it is fair to add that as in all potential risks in the home, the parents must accept some responsibility."

CoT DEATHS

Mrs. Jordan, pursuant to notice, asked The Minister for Health,-

( 1) How many children have died in 1973 as a result of what are commonly called "cot deaths"?

(2) How many babies died from this cause in 1972 and 1971?

(3) Is there any connection between these deaths and the feeding of babies with cows' milk or by breast feeding?

Answer:-( 1 to 3) "The international classifica­

tion of diseases, published by the World Health Organisation, does _not provide any category for 'cot deaths' and therefore no figures are available from the Com­monwealth Bureau of Census and Statistics. However, the Institute of Forensic Medi­cine, which is making a special study of this syndrome, reports as follows:­Deaths in the Brisbane Area-1973 (to date), 24; 1972, 32; 1971, 29. Some studies suggest that the incidence of this type of death is somewhat lower in breast fed babies than in babies fed on cows milk. Although this problem has been the subject of world-wide investigation, no firm conclusions have yet been reached. All aspects are however still under examin­ation and further results are awaited."

ALLEGATION OF WORK REQUIRED OF PREGNANT PRISONER

Mr. Ahem, pursuant to notice, asked The Minister for Tourism,-

(1 ) Has his attention been drawn to an article in the Sunday Sun of September 2 in which an ex-prisoner, Julie Ann Davies, alleged that she had been forced, while eight months pregnant, to get down on her hands and knees to scrub the chapel floor in the Brisbane Women's Prison and, as a result, had suffered a massive haemorrhage?

(2) If so, did he call for a report on the allegations?

(3) If the allegations are not true, what are the facts of the case?

Answers:­(1) "Yes." (2) "Yes." ( 3) "As is often the case in matters

of this nature, the allegations are com­pletely untrue and I was shocked, although not surprised, to find that no-one from Sunday Sun had the decency to contact my Department in an effort to get the other side of the story. This, to me. is contrary to all ethics of responsible journalism. The prisoner, Miss Julie Ann Davies, was received at the Female Division of Brisbane Prison on April 25, 1973, after having been sentenced to one month's imprisonment on each of two charges, the sentences to be served con­currently. On reception, she claimed that she was seven months' pregnant and certified to this in writing. On May 11, 1973, on the instructions of the visiting medical officer, she was transferred to Ward 14 at the Royal Brisbane Hospital for admission. Inquiries reveal that she remained in Ward 14 until noon on May 23, 1973, when she was discharged. The inquiries also revealed that she was not under any specialised treatment while in Ward 14. Further advice has been received that she gave birth to a 5 !b. 5 oz. baby at the Women's Hospital on July 24, 1973. The medical record at the prison shows that she was taken to an Ante Natal Clinic on April 27 and May 3 this year. She was seen by the visiting psychiatrist at the prison on May 3 and 10 this year and also received other medical treatment during her Hi,..day stay at the prison. In addition, the Comp­troller-General and the Acting Matron have reported that prisoners who are pregnant are not expected to work but they may elect to do so voluntarily. If they elect to work, they are not required to perform any tasks that involve strenuous physical effort. In any case, the duties in the chapel are very light and certainly not as heavy as the housework normally under­taken by a housewife. I am advised that the floor in the chapel hasn't been scrubbed since being treated with estapol some years ago. It can be seen from the above

Questions Upon Notice [12 SEPTEMBER 1973] Questions Upon Notice 489

facts that the Sunday Sun article and the former prisoner's claims are a pack of deliberate untruths. As Miss Davies' baby was born at least two months after her release, she was not eight months' preg­nant when doing light duties in the gaol and she didn't have anything like a massive haemorrhage. The doctor's report showed that she had a mild p.v. bleed which had ceased by the time she was transferred to hospital. She was treated with rest in bed."

PERSISTENCE OF WEEDICIDES 2,4-D AND 2,4,5-T IN GROUND WATER

Mr. Ahern, pursuant to notice, asked The Minister for Primary Industries,-

Has any research been carried out into the likely persistence of the hormone weedicides 2,4-D and 2,4,5-T in ground water which might be subsequently used by crop growers for irrigation purposes? If so, what is the result?

Answer:-

" Research carried out overseas, par­ticularly in the United States of America, shows that hormone weedicides are removed from water percolating through the soil and that they are decomposed in the soil to inactive compounds. Some work has been done in Queensland on the persistence of 2,4-D in water. This work indicated low persistence even in still water in a tank. In the presence of soil the process of decomposition is very rapid and complete."

ROYALTIES ON LAND SALES, KAWANA SUBDIVISION

Mr. Ahern, pursuant to notice, asked The Minister for Lands,-

What total royalties have been paid to date to the Crown on land sales as a result of the subdivision known as Kawana, on the Sunshine Coast and how much has been paid each year since the commencement of the project?

Answer:-"In respect of Development Lease No.

2 held by Kawana Estates Pty. Ltd., payments totalling $453,276.35 have been made to the Crown on account of sales of allotments by the lessee company since the commencement of the lease on July 1, 1960. The amounts paid each year are not readily available but I will advise the Honourable Member of those figures as soon as possible."

AusTRALIAN FooD SALES PTY LTD. Mr. Bousen, pursuant to notice, asked The

Minister for Justice,-Who are (a) the directors and (b)

the principal shareholders of Australian Food Sales Pty. Ltd., Brisbane?

Answer:-"Records at the Office of the Commis­

sioner for Corporate Affairs indicate that the directors of Australasian Food Sales Pty. Ltd. are:-Frank Adler (Jnr), 245 Wellington Road, East Brisbane, and Arthur Dene West, Flat 2, 9 Castlebar Street, East Brisbane and that the share­holders are:-Frank Adler, 245 Welling­ton Road, East Brisbane, 1 'A' class share; Adler Holdings Pty. Ltd., 26-28 Ipswich Road, Woolloongabba, 1 'C' class share; Frank Adler's Investments Pty. Ltd., 26-28 Ipswich Road, Woolloon­gabba, 1 'B' class share; and Contract Investments Pty. Ltd., 26-28 Ipswich Road, Woolloongabba, 1 'D' class share."

ADDITIONAL LAND FOR PALM BEACH­CURRUMBIN STATE HIGH ScHOOL

Mr. Bousen, pursuant to notice, asked The Minister for Education,-

( I) Has the land available for use by the Palm Beach-Currumbin State High School been specifically defined?

(2) If not, will he have this matter expedited and ensure that the future requirement of the school for playing the area required and allocated, with fields is given highest priority and that facilities provided, takes due cognisance of the ecological limitations of the immediate environment?

Answers:-( I) "The area of land for the Palm

Beach-Currumbin State High School has, as yet, not been specifically defined. Deter­mination of the area for school use is under negotiation between the Land Administration Commission and the Gold Coast City Council."

( 2) "All steps possible have been taken by my Department to have the matter finalised. Once finalised, the provision of sporting fields will he given a high priority. In the overall planning of the school site. an area has been left in its natural state.·'

PUBLIC DEFENCE, CRIMINAL COURT TRIALS AND APPEALS

Mr. R. E. Moore, pursuant to notice, asked The Minister for Justice,-

( 1) How many persons have been granted public defence in (a) the Supreme Court and (b) the District Court criminal sittings this year to August 31?

(2) How many persons have been granted public defence for appeal against conviction and sentence in the Court of Criminal Appeal?

Answers:-(1) "(a) including Circuit Courts, 143.

(h) 126."

(2) "45 in the same period."

490 Questions Upon Notice [12 SEPTEMBER 1973] Questions Upon Notice

POLICE PATROLS, NEWMARKET STATE HIGH ScHOOL

Mr. R. E. Moore, pursuant to notice, asked The Minister for Works,-

(1) Is he aware that the Newmarket State High School has been broken into almost every week-end during the last month?

(2) Will he consider having this area patrolled by police at irregular intervals, to prevent a rep~tition of breaking and entering and to apprehend the offenders?

Answer:-

( 1 and 2) "I am aware that offences have occurred at the Newmarket State High School recently. This school has been and will continue to be patrolled at irregular intervals by police."

DISTINCTIVE MARKING OF STATE SCHOOL PROPERTY

Mr. R. E. Moore, pursuant to notice, asked The Minister for Education,-

Will he consider a better form of marking school property, such as engraving, embossing or fretwork on cabinets of tape recorders, TV sets, etc., to make the origin of these articles obvious when they are being disposed of by thieves?

AliSJ\'er:-

"After a considerable amount of experi­mentation, my Department has developed a kit containing equipment for the marking of valuable items in schools. Such mark­ing can be carried out by means of burn­branding, engraving and stencilling, using the equipment contained in each kit, which also has a fu 11 set of instructions. The kits are now in circulation among schools in Brisbane. Others have been sent to regional offices for circulation among country schools. The purpose of the marking is, of course, to deter would-be thieves, who will realise that it will be extremely difficult to dispose of the stolen articles. If the Honourable Member so wishes, I will arrange for him, and any other Members interested, to view a demonstration of the marking of equip­ment, using the kits."

UPGRADING OF SOUTHERN APPROACH, NORTH JoHNSTONE RIVER BRIDGE

Mr. F. P. !Vi:oore, pursuant to notice, asked The Minister for Mines,-

( 1) Is he aware of the number of accidents and a fatality last week-end which have occurred because of the poor visibility at the southern end of the North Johnstone River bridge on the Bruce Highway?

(2) Will he take immediate action to have the right-hand cutting on the approach levelled to improve visibility?

Answers:­

(!) '"Yes."

(2) "Arrangements have been made already for the district engineer at Cairns to investigate the site and report on possible improvements."

RoAD ACCIDENTS INVOLVING RIGHT-OF­WAY RULE; APPORTIONMENT OF BLAME

BY INSURANCE COMPANIES

!VIr. F. P. Moore, pursuant to notice, asked The Treasurer,-

Is the innocent person involved in a vehicular accident, where right of way was not exercised, held by the S.G.I.O. and other insurance companies to be 20 per cent. in blame and thus asked to pay that percentage of the damage?

AnsJ\.·cr:-

''Not necessarily. Every vehicular accident has its own set of circumstances and each case is given individual consider­ation. In any intersection accident it is not necessarily correct that the person with the right of way was innocent. It is rare for investigations to reveal that any one party involved in a collision at an intersection is completely blameless and contribution is sought by insurers on a variable percentage basis depending on the circumstances and not on a flat 20 per cent. basis."

ELIGIBILITY FOR TREATMENT, MUNDUB­BERA DENTAL CLINIC

Mr. Melloy, pursuant to notice, asked The Minister for Health,-

( 1) Is he aware of the concern of Mundubbera residents at an apparent change in the conditions of eligibility for dental treatment at the Mundubbera Dental Clinic?

(2) Is this part of a pattern to reduce the availability of dental treatment to country residents and, if not, what is the purpose of the change?

AIISll'CIT-

( 1) "Representations have been made to me requesting th<1t there should be unrestricted access by all persons to the services of the dental clinic at Mun­dubbera."

(2) "The Hoo1ourable Member should be aware that the dental clinic service is provided primarily for those persons who are least able to afford private dental treatment, namely, those on pensions, small incomes or with large families. The

Questions Upon Notice (12 SEPTEMBER 1973] Questions Upon Notice 491

Mundubbera Dental Clinic is now oper­ating on the basis that only those persons who are eligible in accordance with the Means Test are accepted for treatment. This ensures the fulfilment of the primary purpose for which the dental clinic was established at Mundubbera. It is the prac­tice in the dental clinic service that emer­gency treatment for the relief of pain is carried out regardless of eligibility under ·,he Means Test. I am advised that this practice is in operation at the Mundubbera Dental Clinic."

DOCUMENT LODGMENTS, TITLES OFFICE

Mr. Cl!inchen, pursuant to notice, asked The Minister for Justice,-

( 1) How many documents lodged at the Titles Office, Brisbane, are in abeyance or are borrowed-out for correction as a result of significant errors in their prepara­tion?

(2) Can action be taken to reduce the incidence of errors in documents lodged at the Titles Office, as these delay all documents?

( 3) Will action be taken to process documents more expeditiously when they are in order?

Answers:-(1) "Approximately 25,000."

(2) "Reduction of errors in documents is solely in the hands of the parties pre­paring and lodging same."

(3) "Additional staff are being appointed for training, and maximum over­time is being worked to deal with the increasing numbers of lodgments. A study is being made to improve the present office systems, methods and procedures where necessary."

RECRUITMENT OF ABORIGINES, ELECTION OF ABORIGINAL ADVISORY COUNCIL

Mr. Row, pursuant to notice, asked The Minister for Conservation,-

( 1) Is he aware that Aborigines are being recruited by the Commonwealth Government to carry out certain duties with respect to the enrolment of Abori­gines for the purpose of conducting a poll to elect an Aboriginal Advisory Council?

(2) Are the persons being appointed to carry out this survey receiving remuneration at the rate of $280 per week?

Answer:-

( 1 and 2) "Plans for the establishment of a NaJtional Aboriginal Consultative Committee are being developed by the Commonwealth Government and I table

for information of Members, copy of a document I have received setting out some particulars of the proposals. I do not have details of recruitment or emolu­ments for personnel associated with the programme."

Whereupon the Minister laid upon the Table of the House a copy of the document referred to.

FIRE PRECAUTIONS, STATE SCHOOL BUILDINGS

Mr. N. F • .Jones, pursuant to notice, asked The Premier,-

Further to my Question of August 30 in regard to the fire-proofing of State schools and his Answer that these schools are not constructed under B.C.C. by-laws covering the fire-proofing of the lower floors of multi-storey buildings, what regulations or special requirements are laid down by his Government to be carried out by the Works Department during the con­struction of the buildings, not only in science rooms, but also in standard class­rooms?

Answer:-"My Government has always been

aware of the dangers associated with fire and, more particularly, asphyxiation as a result of smoke caused by fire. Therefore the Works Department is constantly aware of the need for speedy evacuation and, in this regard, ensures adequate means of escape. Further, the Department of Education ensures that all principals con­duct evacuation procedures at regular intervals to ensure the safety of the children. No building can be regarded as fire proof, but where buildings exceed two floors construction is of fire resisting materials such as concrete floors and brick walls. The Department of Works takes into account evacuation and materials selection at the design stage for each particular school."

USE OF FIRE-RESISTANT MATERIALS, STATE SCHOOL BUILDINGS

Mr. N. F. Jones, pursuant to notice, asked The Premier,-

Further to my Question of August 30 regarding the latest highly fire-resistant materials incorporated in current construc­tion of State school classrooms, what are (a) the names of such materials, par­ticularly internal materials, (b) the details of any fire-resistant tests carried out on the materials and (c) the names of any schools in the metropolitan area where the materials are now being used in construction?

492 Questions Upon Notice [12 SEPTEMBER 1973] Questions Upon Notice

Answer:-"(a) The following materials are

used:-Brickwork; concrete and concrete block; brickwork plastered and plaster­board. (b) Available from C.S.I.R.O. (c) Mansfield State High School and Coorparoo State High School."

REVIEW OF FmE PRECAUTIONS, STATE ScHOOL BUILDINGS

Mr. N. F. Jones, pursuant to notice, asked The Minister for Works,-

In relation to the special review of schools carried out by his Department in regard to possible fire risk, (a) who carried out the review and wha:t are their qualifications, (b) what was the date of commencement of the review and what was the date of its completion and (c) at what number of schools was appropriate action taken to minimise the existing fire risk?

Answer:-"(a) Qualified architectural, engineering

and construction officers of the Depart­ment of Works. (b) The review com­menced in July, 1968 and the then neces­sary works were subsequently completed progressively. (c) Statistical information of this nature is not readily available."

STADIUM FOR AMATEUR BASKETBALL ASSOCIATION, TOOWONG MEMORIAL

PARK

Mr. Miller, pursuant to notice, asked The Minister for Local Government,-

(!) Has his attention been drawn to a statement in The Courier-Mail of August 30 wherein Mr. Kelly claimed that the Queensland Amateur Basketball Associa­tion's $18,000 stadium in the Toowong Memorial Park was almost completed before objections closed on August 8?

(2) Has the Brisbane City Council the right to grant approval for work to com­mence prior to objections being heard?

(3) Is the area involved, seven and a half acres of hitherto park land? If not, what is the area involved?

( 4) How many acres are now available to the general public for use as a park?

(5) What action can the Government take in this matter and what action will be taken?

Answers:-

(1) "I am aware of the Press report referred to in the Honourable Member's Question."

(2) "The question of the power of the Brisbane City Council to grant approval of the work in question prior to the

closing date for the lodgement of objec­tions to the lease subdivision of the land concerned involves a legal interpretation and, in the event of dispute, would be a matter for determination by the Courts."

(3) "The total area of land designated on the Town Plan as Toowong Park comprises 22 acres 0 roods 19·95 perches."

( 4) "I understa:nd that the area subject to lease to the Queensland Amateur Basketball Association is 1 acre 0 roods 6·4 perches."

(5) "Since no rezoning of the land in Question is involved no approval by the Governor in Council is required to be obtained in respect of the development and the matter is one entirely for the Council."

ALIENATION OF PARK LAND FOR SPORTING PURPOSES

Mr. Miller, pursuant to notice, asked The Treasurer,-

( 1) Has his attention been drawn to a statement in The Courier-Mail of August 30 wherein Alderman Coutts clearly implied that the Treasurer was aware of and approved in writing of what, on the facts currently disclosed, was an illegal alienation of park lands for particular sporting purposes?

(2) What are the circumstances of the alleged approval?

Answer:-(1 and 2) "On Februa1-y 18, 1972, being

Patron of the Queensland Amateur Basketball Association, I wrote to the Lord Mayor in support of an application that had been made by the association for permission to erect a stadium. The pro­posal at that t;me was that the stadium be built in Sedgley Park or some other suitable park land. The next correspond­ence with the city council on this subject was on September 13, 1972, when the town clerk wrote to advise that various sites had been investigated and discussed with representatives of the association and that it seemed the most suitable location would be in part of the Memorial Park at Toowong. The selection of the site was therefore a matter decided upon by the Brisbane City Council. In fact the cor­respondence shows I was unaware of the location until advised by the town clerk. Hence Alderman Coutts' statement is a complete falsehood."

ADDITIONAL HOUSING COMMISSION LAND, INALA

Mr. K. J. Hooper, pursuant to notice, asked The Minister for Works,-

(1) Has he instructed the Queensland Housing Commission to enter into the purchase of additional land in the Inala ;l!"ea?

Questions Upon Notice [12 SEPTEMBER 1973] Questions Upon Notice 493

(2) If so, what is the description and area of the land and what was its cost?

Answer:-( 1 and 2) "The only land purchases

by the Commission at Inala in the past I 2 months have been two building sites described as subdivisions 564 and 565 of portion 361, parish of Oxley, with a total area of 59· 6 perches and a total price of $3,900."

SENTENCE IMPOSED ON G. D. CovENEY FOR ARMED ROBBERIES

Mr. K. J. Hooper, pursuant to notice, asked The Minister for Justice,-

(!) Is he aware that on August 27, Graham Douglas Coveney was sentenced in the Supreme Court to a total of four and a half years' imprisonment for two armed robberies and three offences of car stealing, two of the cars being used in the hold-ups?

(2) Did the first hold-up occur at the Adams Apple fruit shop at Slacks Creek, where the sum of $600 was stolen and four people were locked in the cold-room?

( 3) Did Coveney five days later, in corn~ pany with Harold Charles Donaldson and a third man who has absconded while on bail, hold up the Sunnybank Hotel bottle department at gunpoint, steal $1,110 and fire a shot?

( 4) As the sentence appears to be mani­festly inadequate and would not act as a deterrent to violent crime, does he intend to appeal against the leniency of this sentence?

Answers:­

(1) "Yes." (2) "Yes." (3) "Yes." ( 4) "This has been considered."

PRL\fE MINISTER'S DINNER WITH STATE PREMIERS DURING CONSTITUTIONAL

CoNVENTION

Dr. Scott-Young, pursuant to notice, asked The Premier,-

In view of the misconception generated by the media, what matters were dealt with at the dinner in Sydney, to which certain State Premiers were invited, that could not have been dealt with at the Constitutional Convention then sitting in Sydney, which was attended by over 100 delegates for the States and other administrative bodies?

Answer:-"The Prime Minister had intimated to

me that at his dinner he would like to discuss the roles of the Commonwealth

and States in price-control measures gener­ally. I was interested when, the next day, September 6, the Prime Minister stated that 'agreement' had been reached by the Heads of Delegations present at the dinner on the principle of references of power either way, to the Commonwealth by the States in terms of Section 51 (xxxvii) of the Constitution, and by a new section to be drafted which would enable the Commonwealth to refer certain matters to the States. I point out that Section 51 (xxxvii) had been listed on the Conven­tion Agenda and discussion on it had concluded on the first day of the Con­vention. Similarly, on the afternoon of September 6 the Prime Minister mentioned a similar 'agreement' with some Premiers as to an amendment of the Financial Agreement to give Local Government direct representation on the Loan Council. Apparently this is to be the subject of a Premiers' Conference discussion within the next few weeks and this is exactly what I had suggested to the Prime Minister as the correct procedure when he first approached me on these issues in Sydney. Quite frankly, the Prime Minister showed little respect for the whole concept and spirit of the Convention as originally envisaged, and his attitude on this occasion does not inspire much confidence for the Commonwealth co-operation which will be necessary if the eventual recommendations of the Convention are to be put to the people of Australia in the proper way."

CoMPLAINTS TO CONSUMER AFFAIRS BUREAU REGARDING HOME-CLADDING FIRMS; "PERMALUM" ADVERTISEMENT

Mr. Wright, pursuant to notice, asked The Minister for Justice,-

( 1) How many complaints regarding home-cladding firms have been received by the Consumer Affairs Bureau since its inception?

(2) Will he have his officers investigate the "Permalum" advertisement, as it is apparent that to achieve the "before" and "after" comparisons of the house photo­graphed it must have undergone major and expensive structural operations?

(3) What is the estimated value of the watches which are supposed to be free bonuses?

Answers:-

( 1) "Complaints received by the Con­sumer Affairs Bureau which have involved home-cladding firms have not necessarily all been indexed under one heading, since some have been concerned with advertising and sales methods, some with the product used and others with the execution of the cladding work. It is therefore not possible, in the time available, to indicate the total number of complaints about home-cladding

494 Questions Upon Notice (12 SEPTEMBER 1973] Questions Upon Notice

firms which have been received since the bureau commenced operations in January, 1971. Furthermore, there are several firms engaged in this field marketing a variety of products based on various materials, and all complaints received are not necessarily fully justified. It is thus not practicable to give a meaningful figure in answer to the Honourable Member's Question."

(2) "It is not considered that an investi­gation of the advertisement referred to by the Honourable Member is warranted, since it is patently obvious that major structural alterations have been made to the property in addition to the cladding."

(3) "The Consumer Affairs Bureau is not able to provide an estimate of the value of the watches referred to."

ALLEGATIONS OF GRAFT AND CORRUPTION AMONG MEMBERS OF PARLIAMENT

Mr. Wright, pursuant to notice, asked The Minister for Justice,-

( 1) In view of the serious but as yet unsubstantiated allegations made by the Member for Townsville South that Mem­bers of this Assembly were guilty of practices bordering on graft and corruption, what evidence has been made available to him by the Honourable Member?

(2) As a cloud of doubt and suspicion now hangs over all Members because of the accusations, will he investigate this matter?

Answers:-(1) "None." (2) "No."

MAGISTRATES COURTS COMPLEX, SOUTH BRISBANE; DEMOLITION OF FORMER

COURTS AND WATCHHOUSE

Mr. Ahern for Mr. Lane, pursuant to notice, asked The Minister for Justice,-

( 1) From when and with what frequency are the Magistrates Courts located in the new watchhouse-court complex in South Brisbane to be used?

l2) When does the Government expect to demolish the old City Watchhouse and the Magistrates Courts building to allow for the extension of Adelaide Street to North Quay?

Answers:-( 1) "These court rooms were used for

the first time on Monday, September 10, 1973, and will be in daily use from Mon­days to Saturdays."

(2) "No firm date can be given for the demolition of the old watchhouse and Magistrates Courts buildings as the old

District Courts building in the same area cannot be 'acated until the new District Courts and Magistrates Courts building at 179 North Quay is ready for occupation. This is at present anticipated to be towards the end of 1974."

COMMONWEALTH PROPOSAL FOR CoN­

STITUTIONAL POWER OVER ELECTORAL

DIVISIONS

Mr. Ahern for Mr. Lane, pursuant to notice, asked The Minister for Justice,-

In view of the announcement by the Prime Minister, at the opening session of the Constitutional Convention on September 3, that he intends to seek constitutional amendment by way of referendum to give the Commonwealth Government complete overriding powers in respect of electoral divisions for all the Parliaments of Aus­tralia, will this action represent a major incursion into a very basic area of State rights, the right to conduct its own elec­toral affairs?

Answer:-

"In view of the urgent national problems requiring Commonwealth Government positive aotion, and the need for a proper re-assessment of the Australian Constitu­tion in the Federal system, the Prime Minister has a curious sense of priorities if he regards state electoral laws as being a matter requiring urgent reference to the people at a referendum. If the Prime Minister would display pos~tive national leadership, and cease indulging in antics designed to please and pacify the power­hungry A.L.P. heirarchy, Australia would be a better place in which to live-and the Australian people and business would have more confidence in the Canberra Govern­ment than they have at present. The pro­posal referred to by the Honourable Mem­ber is yet another unwarranted and deliberate infringement on the rights of this Parliament, and every other State Parliament. Canberra control of state eleotoral laws would allow the A.L.P. to perpetuate itself in office in every State­particularly in West Australia and Tas­mania where state Labor Governments are at present on the brink of electoral decimation. It would also enable the A. LP. to force 'first past the post' voting on all Parliaments and would effectively silence the growing number of minority groups in the community who are being harrassed and oppressed by the Whitlam Government. The Prime Minister's plan is a monstrous but typical, proposal of a centralist government that has no regard for States or State Governments. The Queensland Government will therefore resist it by every means at its disposal."

Questions Upon Notice [12 SEPTEMBER 1973) Questions Upon Notice 495

RURAL LAND SALES

Mr. Aiken, pursuant to notice, asked The Premier,-

( 1) When was the peak period of rural land sales in Queensland, what number of properties changed hands during that period and \Vhat was the gross cash outlay?

(2) Was the highest average peak price per acre during this period and, if not, what year did the highest average occur and what \1 as the price per acre?

(3) What number of rural properties changed ownership during 1970-71 and 1971-72 and what was the gross cash outlay and the average price per acre in each year?

Answers:-

( 1) "Lands Department records of the number and the value of leasehold pro­perty transfers do not include separate figures for rural lands but relate in total to both rural and town lands and are available in that particular form back to the financial year 1962-63 only. Within that period, the peak number of sales was in the financial year 1963-64, when 4,860 transfers of leasehold tenures, with a total sale price of $41,083,250, were registered while the peak period in respect of value of transactions was the year 1969-70 when 3,829 transfers were registered for a total considemtion of $55,887,725. The Lands Department has no record of freehold transactions. Doubtless the Honourable Member will be interested to know what the relevant figures will be in the future, as rural industries in his area feel more and more the devastating effeots of the present A.L.P. Commonwealth Govern­ment's policies."

(2) "Information on a 'per acre' basis is not available."

(3) "As previously mentioned, com­bined figures for both rural and urban leasehold properties only are available and in those categories during the year 1970-71, 3,246 property transfers were registered for a total consideration of $42,482,722 and during the year 1971-72, 3,121 property transfers were registered for a total consideration of $42,411,303. The price per acre is not available."

OVERSEAS FOOD PARCELS AND PRE­CAUTIONS AGAINST FOOT AND

MOUTH DISEASE

Mr. Aiken, pursuant to notice, asked The Premier,-

( 1) Have food parcels from overseas countries known to be associated with foot and mouth disease been detected in

Queensland and have overseas travellers been apprehended in Queensland ports with various types of food, including quail, pheasant or other exotic eggs, from con­taminated countries?

(2) Are penalties severe in detected instances and are the cases considered numerous?

(3) Is it possible that mosquitoes, flies or bugs could enter this State per passenger luggage, either by plane or ship, and trigger off disease epidemics, or is it con­sidered that the maximum security at present employed is adequate?

Answers:-

(1) "Yes. Risk types of food have been found from time to time, both in parcels sent through the post and in passengers' luggage. Eggs of various species of birds, including those of quail, have been de,tected occasionally."

(2) "Yes, on both counts."

(3) "Present preventive measures em­ployed are considered to be as effective as practicable."

PEDESTRIAN UNDERPASS, MITCHELL RAILWAY STATION

Mr. Aiken, pursuant to notice, asked The Minister for Transport,-

(!) Is he aware that the Railway Depart­ment has erected two notices near the railway station at Mitchell stating that people can cross the line at their own risk and that gates are open for use by the public?

( 2) Because this crossing is an entice­ment as a short-cut to school and is used by many children, some too young to read or to understand the implications and because the Department by erecting the notices obviously admits the danger, will he again give earnest consideration to providing an underpass at this highly dangerous railway crossing?

Answer:-

(! and 2) "There are two notices erected at this crossing, warning pedes­trians that they cross over the railway tracks at their own risk. There is no obligation on the Commissioner to retain this crossing and in view of the Honour­able Member's representations, arrange­ments will be made to permanently fence it off. I advised the Honourable Member on June 29, 1973, that it would be possible to arrange for the construction of an underpass, but it would be necessary for the cost to be borne by an authority other than the Railway Department."

496 Questions Upon Notice [12 SEPTEMBER 1973] Questions Upon Notice

STATE PRE-SCHOOL CENTRES

Mr. Inch, pursuant to notice, asked The Minister for Education,-

( 1) How many State-run pre-school centres are at present operating in Queens­land?

(2) Where are the centres located and what is the total number of children attending them?

(3) How many centres are (a) under construction and (b) planned for this financial year?

( 4) What is the estimated number of children who would be immediately eligible to attend pre-school centres if the required accommodation was available?

Answers:-(! and 2) "There are 29 State pre­

school centres comprising 32 units presently in operation. I table a list of these centres as requested by the Honour­able Member. These centres provide places for some 1,600 children."

(3) "33 additional centres comprising 52 units aa-e presently under construc­tion. Planning is being regarded as an on-going process to facilitate implementa­tion of the scheme as quickly as is practicable. It is anticipated ,that within the present financial year construction work will have been commenced on at least a further 40 units."

( 4) "At present some 36,000 places would be required to provide a year's pre-school education prior to admission to grade 1 for all eligible in Queensland." Paper.-Whereupon Sir Alan Fletcher laid

upon the Table of the House the list referred to.

STUDENTS, KINDERGARTEN TEACHERS' COLLEGE

Mr. Inch, pursuant to notice, asked The Minister for Education,-

t 1) What is the present number of students attending the Creche and Kinder­garten Teachers' College?

(2) How many students are expected to graduate this year?

(3) How many (a) first-year, (b) second-year and (c) third-year students are holders of State scholarships?

( 4) How many scholarships will be offered in 197 4?

Answers:·-The Principal of the Brisbane Kinder­

garten Teachers' College has provided the following information with respect to items 1, 2, and 3:-

( 1) "There is a total of 349 students currently enrolled at the College."

(2) "There are 80 students currently completing the final year of the course."

(3) "There are 22 State scholarship holders in the first year and none in the second or third year of the course. It should be noted that State scholarships offered to students in the second and third year under an earlier scheme were discon­tinued with the introduction of the new Commonwealth pre-school teaching awards in January, 1973."

( 4) "The Department of Education offered 100 scholarships to students enter­ing first year at the Kindergarten Teachers' College in 1973. Subsequently the Com­monwealth Government introduced a new scheme of pre-school teaching scholar­ships which had a higher value in first year than the State scholarship. None-the­less the initiative of the Queensland Government resulted in 100 additional places being provided in the first year at the college. In 1974 it is planned to again offer a similar number to 1973. Also because the Commonwealth scholar­ships for the second year are of less value than the State awards it is planned to offer the balance of 78 awards remaining from 1973 to students entering the second year of the kindergarten teachers' course."

SWABBING OF RACEHORSES

Mr. Hanlon, pursuant to notice, asked The Treasurer,-

( 1) As routine swabbing is confined to winners and other runners are swabbed only by special direction, and as two of the positive swabs returned in recent months were from the rare number of specially­swabbed unplaced horses, does this suggest that there may well be more horses doped to go backwards than to go forwards, with a comparative minimal risk of detection?

(2) How many winners have been swabbed within Queensland Turf Club jurisdiction since January 1, and how many gave a positive result?

(3) How many swabs of horses other than winners were ordered in the same period and how many were positive?

( 4) Is there a reluctance by stewards to order swabs as neither they, the Q.T.C. nor anyone else seem to know what should or can be done when they find a positive return?

Answers:-( 1) "I do not agree that there are more

horses doped to go backwards instead of forwards. The stewards are responsible for the number of horses swabbed in any one race and such decision to swab is the result of their observation both of performance in the particular race and also performances on previous occasions."

Questions Upon Notice [12 SEPTEMBER 1973] Questions Upon Notice 497

(2) "767 swabs have been taken from winners within the Q.T.C. jurisdiction since January 1, 1973. Seven proved positive."

( 3) "During the same period four swabs have been taken from unplaced horses of which two have been positive."

(4) "There is absolutely no reluctance by the stewards at any time to order swabs of unplaced horses. A decision to order such swab is again dependent on the observations of the stewards."

DOPING AT BRISBANE RACECOURSES

:Mr. Hanlon, pursuant to notice, asked The Treasurer,-

With reference to previous Questions which I have directed to him in March and August regarding positive swabs returned in Brisbane galloping events, what further action is contemplated in the light of the short statement on September 10 by the Queensland Turf Club stewards, in effect exonerating trainers concerned in the posi­tive swabs in July and leaving open the conclusion that these and other positive swabs over a period of some time may have derived from persons unassociated with the horses involved and may have occurred notwithstanding maximum practic­able security precautions by trainers?

Answer:-"The matter raised by the Honourable

Member is one entirely under the juris­diction of the stewards of the Q.T.C. Having heard all the evidence submitted in the cases and from their own observa­tions, they have come to the conclusion that there are no grounds to take further action. The stewards concerned are regarded as very reputable citizens and fully experienced in the duties involved in their stewardship, and I therefore accept their decisions and do not consider any further action necessary by me as Minister in charge of racing in this State."

CRECHE AND KINDERGARTEN ASSOCIATION CENTRES

Mr. P. Wood, pursuant to notice, asked The Minister for Education,-

What does the Government see as the role to be played by the Creche and Kindergarten Association in the future and what is the role of the approximately 270 centres affiliated with the association?

Answer:-"The Government believes the Creche

and Kindergarten Association will con­tinue to play an important role in the early education and child care fields in this State. Increasingly as the Govern­ment implements its policy of ca>tering far

the older children in the pre-school age range the association will be freed to direct its attention to the development of appropriate day care facilities. With regard to the future roles of particular kindergartens these are matters which must be determined locally. Members of com­mittees have had discussions with officers of my Department and feel confident that there is important work for them to do which will complement the facilities being provided by the Government. As a matter of information, however, I should po1nt out that there were at August 30, 1973, 144 centres affiliated to the Creche and Kindergarten Association comprising some 183 units. A considerable number of centres, called 'centres in contact' do not meet the standards laid down by the association for affiliation."

CRITERIA FOR STATE PRE-SCHOOL CENTRES

Mr. P. Wood, pursuant to notice, asked The Minister for Education,-

( 1) On what criteria does his Depart­ment erect a State pre-school centre, whether by conversion of existing facilities or by the construction of a new building?

(2) What are the guidelines established as to the method of liaison and areas of responsibility between the principals of primary schools and the directors of pre­school centres, whether established in or out of primary school grounds?

Answers:-(1) "The criteria used by the Depart­

ment of Education for erecting State pre­school centres are set out in broad terms in my Answer to a Question from the Honourable Member for Salisbury on October 12, 1972."

(2) "The nature of the liaison between the responsibilities of the principals of primary schools and the teachers-in­charge of pre-school centres was dealt with in an Answer I gave a Question fwm the Honourable Member for Pine Rivers on October 25, 1972. I believe my reply at that time covers this matter."

SENIOR CERTIFICATES AND ORDER OF MERIT LIST, BOARD OF SECONDARY

SCHOOL STUDIES

Mr. P. Wood, pursuant to notice asked The Minister for Education,- '

( 1) What is the purpose of issuing an interim certificate from the Board of Secondary School Studies for Grade 12 students?

(2) When will the certificate be issued? ( 3) When will the order of merit Ii<t

~ompiled by the board be completed and m what way and in what detail will th"" list be published? -

498 Questions Upon Notice (12 SEPTEMBER 1973] Questions Upon Notice

Answers:-( 1) "The purpose of issuing an Interim

Statement of Results, with which is incnr­porated a Tertiary Entrance Statement, is to provide the student wrth an official statement of his achievement in grades 11 and 12 which he may use for employment or tertiary entrance purposes, pending the issue of a formal Senior Cer·tificate. Although Senior Certificates will be pre­pared by the Board of Secondary School Studies, they are based on school assess­ment. In recognition of this the certificates are counter-signed by the principal of the school and issued by the school. If teaching is to continue throughout Novem­ber, and it is desirable that it does, it is not possible to have the processing of results and the printing of certificates com­pleted before the end of the school year. It will not be possible therefore to have certificates counter-signed by principals and issued to students by December 21. The interim statement will be available by December 21."

(2) ''The Senior Certificates will be sent to schools in January, be counter­signed by the principal at the earliest opportunity and then posted by the school to the student."

(3) "The Order of Merit list compiled by the Board of Secondary School Studies will be completed early in December. The list will not be published. It will be avail­able to appropriate authorities on a confidential basis only."

EKROL'\fENTS, CAIRNS, TOWNSVILLE AND \1.\CKAY OPPORTUNITY SCHOOLS

Mr. R. Jones, pursuant to notice, asked The Minister for Education,-

( 1) What percentage of the primary school population usually requires educa­tion at an opportunity school?

(2) Is the Cairns Opportunity School big enough at present to cater for this percentage of children from the area that it serves?

(3) Would a comparison of the services in Cairns with those of Townsville and Mackay show that these centres are equal?

( 4) If not, has the Government any plans to rectify any anomalies that may exist?

Answers:-( 1) "Two to three per cent. of the

primary school population usually require education at an opportunity school."

(2) "No." ( 3) "The primary school enrolment in

the Cairns area is approximately 3,400, at Townsville 10,700 and at Mackay 3,300. The services at Townsvil!e are more than double those at Cairns and Mackay for obvious reasons."

( 4) "Plans are completed for an addi­>tional teaching area and a craft room to be built during this financial year at the Cairns Opportunity School. In addition accommodation will be provided for two guidance officers, a clerk typist and a staff room. Modifications will also be made to existing classrooms."

TRAINING Of TEACHERS FOR PRE-SCHOOL CENTRES

:Mr. R. Jones, pursuant to notice, asked The Minister for Education,-

(!) What conditions are applied to (a) primary school teachers and (b) others within or presently outside the service, for training and transfer to pre-school education?

(2) Has any consideration been given to teachers from independent schools who have previously been trained by the Educa­tion Department and who wish to avail themselves of pre-school teacher training (a) for transfer and inclusion in the exist­ing scheme and (b) to remain within the independent school system?

Answers:-( 1) "Teachers wishing to undertake

special training to qualify them for work in State pre-school centres are selected on the basis of their general suitability for work with young children. (a) In the case of primary teachers presently em­ployed in schools careful consideration is given to whether such teachers can be spared from the schools. Care is taken to ensure that there is no depletion of the primary branch of the teaching service. (b) In case of other teachers presently employed in other fields of teaching seek­ing to qualify for pre-school work the same conditions apply as for primary teachers. Teachers not employed by the Depar,tment are accepted on the basis of suitability and providing they are willing to enter the State Teaching Service and work in State pre-school centres."

(2) "The Department of Education is responsible for provision of suitable teachers for only State pre-school centres and therefore, it has not been seen as the responsibility of my Department to pre­pare pre-school teachers for independent schools. I should point out that since teachers' colleges have become autono­mous the special 'extension' courses for pre-school teachers have been conducted on a contract basis. Therefore, (a) teachers presently working in independent schools who wished to work in State pre­schools, if suitable, would be accepted for training; (b) teachers wishing to remain within independent schools could not, how­ever, individual teachers' colleges migM be willing to accept such teachers into courses

Matters of Public Interest [12 SEPTEMBER 1973] Matters of Public Interest 499

as fee-paying students. This would be a matter for individual teachers' colleges to decide."

MATTERS OF PUBLIC INTEREST

AUSTRALIAN CONSTITUTIONAL CoNVENTION; PRIME MINISTER'S DINNER

Mr. HOUSTON (Bulimba-Leader of the Opposition) {12.2 p.m.): I want to take a few minutes to put the record straight on an issue that is now known as "The man who wouldn't go to dinner". After all, when representatives of this Parliament attend a conference or gathering, it is expected that they will carry out their full obligations. I believe that one of those obligations is to show due regard for those in office in other States and other places who extend courtesy to our representatives.

Let me say, first of all, that at the Constitutional Convention members of the Queensland delegation were invited by the Premier of New South Wales to attend a State function, and this I believe all delegates did attend. We were also invited by the Governor-General to attend a function, and this, too, I believe all delegates attended. The Speaker of the Lower House of the Parlia­ment of New South Wales invited the leader of the Queensland delegation, together with the Deputy Premier and the Leader of the Opposition, to a luncheon and, so far as I am aware, all those invited from Queensland attended.

The Prime Minister of Australia also invited the various State Premiers to a dinner party on Wednesday evening, 5 September. All who were invited attended that dinner-with the exception of the leader of the Queensland delegation. The Press reported that the Deputy Premier, too, would boycott the dinner. To the best of my knowledge and belief, it was not the intention to invite the Deputy Premiers or Opposition Leaders from any of the States. It was essentiaily a dinner party for the State Premiers.

I say without fear of contradiction that, so far as the great majority of Queens­landers are concerned, the Premier was downright rude to the Prime Minister, to say the least.

Government Members interjected.

Mr. HOUSTON: The Premier's actions were not in accordance with the best traditions. What is wrong with meeting other Premiers and the Prime Minister? Why didn't the Premier want to go to the dinner? He was advised by the Deputy Premier not to go because the Deputy Premier was fear­ful of what the Premier might say.

Let us consider the purpose of the Con­stitutional Convention. First, it was a con­vention for talking over matters of con­stitutional concern to the States and the

Commonwealth-a convention for "talking matters over". What is wrong with having a dinner? At the luncheon given by the Speaker of the Lower House in New South Wales that I attended, matters of general interest were discussed. I there spoke to the Premier and other delegation leaders about matters of common interest to members of this Parliament. There was nothing wrong with that. The dinner given by the Prime Minister was certainly only an extension of the convention.

Up till the Wednesday afternoon, the main matter discussed at the convention was para­graph 37 of section 51 of the existing Con­stitution, which says-

"Matters referred to the Parliament of the Commonwealth by the Parliament or Parliaments of any State or States, but so that the law shall extend only to States by whose Parliaments the matter is referred, or which afterwards adopt the law:".

That was the section referred to the con­vention by the Premiers of New South Wales and Victoria, and, according to Mr. Whitlam's statement, that is the matter that was discussed. Mr. Whitlam said-

"New South Wales and Victoria have proposed that the reference power should be amended to remove doubts both as to power to refer for a limited term and as to power to revoke a reference. New South Wales also has suggested that the Com­monwealth should be authorised to refer powers to the States. Victoria wishes to ensure that a reference may be made subject to terms and conditions."

He then said-"I am pleased, therefore, to be able to

inform the Convention that after the adjournment yesterday evening heads of delegations met and were able to agree on the principle of references either way. We propose that our Parliamentary Draftsmen should promptly confer on the terms of an amendment to L'le present paragraph which already permits matters to be referred by the State parliaments to the Commonwealth Parliament and on the terms of a new paragraph which would permit matters to be referred by the Com­monwealth Parliament to the State parliaments."

That was a new concept. The Prime Minister and all the Premiers other than the Premier of Queensland agreed to a new concept­a concept that is needed by this nation­that is, the right of the Commonwealth to refer matters to the States, which has not existed until now. That was a milestone at the convention.

Let us now look at what the Prime Minister later said. He said-

"We intend that the terms of both paragraphs should make identical pro­visions concerning terms and conditions, duration or revocation. We hope that the

500 Matters of Public Interest [12 SEPTEMBER 1973] Matters of Public Interest

Commonwealth Parliament will pass a Bill for a referendum on the companion paragraphs to be held at the time of the next federal poll."

Let me turn now to what Sir Robert Askin said. He said-

"1 believe that it is a step in the right direction. If carried, it will place the Commonwealth in the position where it will be able, when and where deemed expedient, to refer certain powers to the States on terms and conditions."

Mr. Hamer, another Liberal Premier, said-"I merely indicate very briefly that the

Victorian delegation as a whole would agree in principle to this proposal which was hammered out last night. Indeed, I think it represents a modest achievement by the Convention if it comes about because it does clarify some of the obscurities in the present power to refer matters to the Commonwealth."

That is what Mr. Hamer said, and he was at the dinner.

Mr. Wilcox, another Liberal, although he was not at the dinner knew the score. He said-

" I think there is some good sense in this approach, and subject to seeing how the proposed amendment is drafted, it seems likely that in that respect alone we could achieve something."

What did our Premier say? He was not at the dinner. Because of that he stalled and dithered, so much so that the Queensland delegation and the Queensland attitude became a laughing-stock in the eyes of other delegates. Look at what the New South Wales news media said about Queensland! As a matter of fact, I felt ashamed to hear and read some of the jokes that were circu­lated as a result of our Premier's attitude. This all happened because he refused to go to dinner with the Prime Minister. He refused to go there and learn something. This is what he said at the convention-

"Of course, this is a matter of great interest to all the States. There are aspects of the suggestion made by the Prime Minister with which we in Queensland cer­tainly agree. We have always said that we wanted to co-operate with the Common­wealth and the other States for the good of the nation."

Has anyone ever heard such nonsense! The Premier's actions certainly belied his words. He went on to say-

"The Prime Minister's proposal might relate to the transfer of price-control powers and to some other matters in regard to the Commonwealth Government's broad responsibility to combat inflation."

He said "might", but he was not at the dinner and therefore was not in a position to know. As Premier of this State his responsibility was to be there so that he would know what was happening. If he had been at the dinner and had ~aid afterwards, "I don't go along with

it; I don't agree with it", that would have been all right. I say he had a responsibility to this Parliament to attend the dinner. He had a responsibility to go anywhere at all where he could help this great State of ours.

Let me read a little more of what the Premier said-

"It is suggested now that we should attempt to clarify the position with regard to the transfer of powers on a temporary or short-term basis.

"I repeat, Queensland will be interested to know some of the objectives of the Commonwealth in making the suggestions."

Because he was not at the dinner, he was asking what it was all about. Where do we go from here? He continued-

"However, we do appreciate the fact that the Prime Minister made the proposal--"

He says, at the end of his speech, that he is happy the Prime Minister made the proposal. He continued-

"And we look forward to being able to make a closer examination of it."

Some time later that day, we heard Queens­land's attitude in a statement by the Minister for Justice (Mr. Knox). At the end of his speech on another issue he said-

"I remember referring to this matter in our own Parliament."

This was the matter he was talking about. The Premier was not there, but Mr. Knox said-

"Where there is goodwill and mutual agreement on both sides towards, all things are possible in the parliaments of this country."

Mr. Knox cleared the air---or tried to. At least he tried to retrieve something out of the shocking situation we found ourselves in. That is the situation of the man who did not go to dinner.

I say to the Premier that if ever again the Prime Minister of this nation wants a meeting of that nature and the Premier and his Min­isters are not prepared to attend it, the Opposition is certainly prepared to play its part in promoting Queensland and its progress.

(Time expired). Mr. Wright interjected.

Mr. DEPUTY SPEAKER (Mr. Lickiss): Order! The honourable member for Rock­hampton knows very well how to refer to other members in this place. What he has just said is becoming a pattern of his approach. If it happens again, I will deal with him.

AUSTRALIAN CONSTITUTIONAL CONVENTION; PRIME MINISTER'S DINNER

Hon. Sir GORDON CHALK (Lockyer­Treasurer) (12.14 p.m.): I regret the fact that this morning the Leader of the Opposition has seen fit to bring into this Chamber what he describes as the incident of the man who

Matters of Public Interest [12 SEPTEMBER 1973] Matters of Public Interest 501

.did not go to dinner. Let me, first of all, say to the Chamber that I associate myself fully v.ith the decision that was taken by the Premier of Queensland. I do so for this reason: when we received the invitation to attend the Constitutional Convention, we also received invitations to attend certain other functions. The first was from the Governor­General, who invited both the Premier and the Deputy Premier of each State of Aus­tralia to a dinner at Admiralty House on the Monday night. As well, we were invited to a function at Admiralty House at 8.30 p.m. on the Wednesday evening, again a function arranged by the Governor-General. We also received an invitation to a function arranged bv the Premier of New South Wales and we attended it. Those invitations were issued and we made our arrangements accordingly.

During the Wednesday, the Honourable the Prime Minister made an approach to the Premiers of the various States on the basis that, if we could meet at Kirribilli House, it would be an opportunity to discuss matters that were being raised at the convention. My advice to the Premier was that we wanted a record of proceedings such as is made of Premiers' Conferences. We had sought a Premiers' Conference. Such a conference had been held in May and the details and facts that had been discussed at that con­ference were recorded. To go along to a function without any written invitation and only on the advice tendered to us in hap­hazard fashion by the Prime Minister would, in my view, be a complete negation of the purposes for which the convention was being held.

Now let us see what happened. There were discussions at that particular dinner and the Prime Minister came into the Convention chamber the following morning and indicated that certain things had been agreed upon. One of the first reactions to that, as it was reported to me, was that Mr. Hamer said, "That was not what we discussed last night at all."

Mr. HOUSTON: I rise to a point of order. The official document does not show that at all.

Mr. DEPUTY SPEAKER (Mr. Lickiss): Order! The honourable member has no valid point of order.

Sir GORDON CHALK: I am referring to a statement by Mr. Hamer. I do not say it is in the official document, but that was the advice tendered to the Premier and me.

Mr. Houston: You were not there.

Sir GORDON CHALK: I was not there that afternoon, but the advice tendered to my Premier, and later to me, was that that was not the basis of the discussion. The whole convention was side-tracked by Mr. Whitlam for one particular purpose-to give him an opportunity to raise certain issues.

I want to pay tribute to the delegation. We had done our homework before attending the convention and we were prepared to discuss certain constitutional matters. Did we dis­cuss them? The morning the conference opened the Prime Minister of Australia took the opportunity to raise the prices issue. He was prepared to trade with 'the States and hand over to us the right to impose retail sales tax, which would have cost the tax­payers of this State alone something like $20,000,000, if we would give him certain rights in relation to prices.

He was told by the Premiers of New South Wales and Victoria that we were pre­pared to consider this if he would give an undertaking that he would also control wages. After making his speech, the Prime Minister of Australia went from the Constitutional Convention to the A.C.T.U. and there he told the unionists, "I will follow the policy which you dictate to me." This illustrates the Dr. Jekyll and Mr. Hyde attitude of the man.

1\lr. HOUSTON: I rise to a point of order. I do not deny the Treasurer the right to make his speech, but I think it is completely wrong for him to deliberately mislead the House. No such statement was made by the Prime Minister to the A.C.T.U. Congress.

Mr. SPEAKER: Order! There is no valid point of order.

Sir GORDON CHALK: The Leader of the Opposition has claimed that I am mis­leading the House. Although some of the statements he made during his speech were not quite accurate, I did not accuse him of misleading the House.

Mr. Houston: What wasn't accurate?

Sir GORDON CHALK: What you read from the document is accurate; but what about the pieces you put in between?

Mr. SPEAKER: Order! Sir GORDON CHALK: The Premier's

reason for not attending the dinner has been explained and, I think, accepted by the people of Queensland.

Did the Prime Minister make his approach to both the Premier and myself? The answer is "No". The Prime Minister spoke to Sir Robert Askin and Mr. Hamer, and he watched the situation when the Premier and I were speaking. When I rose to speak, the Prime Minister deliberately walked in front of me and went over and sat next to the Premier to talk with him. This incident did not escape my notice, and subsequently I made a comment to the Prime Minister about it.

Be that as it may, the situation is this: the Premier and I will attend any duly con­stituted conference that may be called by the Prime Minister at which a record is to be taken of any indication from the Com­monwealth as to what it is prepared to do as well as any intimation from Queensland

502 Matters of Public Interest [12 SEPTEMBER 1973] Matters of Public Interest

as to what it is prepared to do. However, we certainly will not attend a tea party, upon the conclusion of which anything can be insinuated because at the function no record is kept of broad and loose discussion that occurs. Unfortunately the Prime Minister has attempted to use comments passed during such broad and loose dis­cussion for the purposes of indicating what he claims was the outcome of the dinner. Finally, l say to the Leader of the Opposi­tion as well as to all honourable members that I stand beside the Premier in the action that he took.

AusTRALII\N CoNSTITUTIONAL CoNVENTION; ATTENDANCE OF QUEENSLAND DELEGATES

Mr. MARGINSON (Wolston) (12.22 p.m.): I was one of the Queensland dele­gates to the Constitutional Convention. The first observation I wish to make is that, like all other States, Queensland was represented by 12 delegates. However, whereas with the exception of only one State-l have not been able to ascertain which one-the other States divided the number of delegates to give equal representation to the Government and the Opposition, the Queensland delega­tion comprised seven Government and five Opposition members. Further, of the seven Queensland Government delegates, four were Ministers, only one of whom was prepared to attend the convention until its conclusion. Of the other three Ministers, one left on the Thursday morning to attend a picnic race-meeting in Cairns, the Minister for Justice was absent on the Thursday and Friday, and the Premier left before midday on the Friday. That illustrates just what those three Ministers, who represented Queensland with the object of giving the State a say at the Constitutional Convention, thought about State rights. By contrast, I can confidently claim that not one Labor representative was absent at any time from the convention.

The Premier appeared on a television programme in Sydney and, in a lying manner, attempted--

Mr. B.JELKE-PETERSEN: I rise to a point of order.

Mr. MARGINSON: The Premier does not know what I am about to say.

Mr. SPEAKER: Order! Overnight I gave some thought to the use of the word "lying" as well as to the expression "the honourable member is lying". Although yesterday I ruled that it is in order for an honourable member to claim that another is lying, I have since decided that to claim that an honourable member is lying or is telling a lie is unparliamentary. An honourable member can say that another member is being untruthful. It will no longer be per­missible for an honourable member to use the term "lying". In the light of those comments, I ask the honourable member for Wolston to withdraw his remark.

Mr. MARGINSON: I withdraw it and say that, in my opinion, the Premier was quite untruthful.

Mr. BJELKE-PETERSEN: I rise to a point of order. It is very interesting to hear the comments of ,the honourable member for Wolston. I left the convention a few hours before its conclusion for a particular reason.

Mr. SPEAKER: What is the bonourable gentleman's point of order?

Mr. B.JELKE-PETERSEN: The honour­able member for Wolston alleged that I appeared on television and was untruthful in what I said. I appeared on television quite a number of times and acquainted the people of Australia with the exact position.

Opposition Members interjected.

Mr. SPEAKER: Order! A few moments ago I said that for any honourable member to refer to another member as being un­truthful is not unparliamentary. Anyone who cares to refer to "May" will find that my ruling is borne out there. However, to say that a person is lying, or is telling a lie, is quite unparliamentary.

Mr. B.JELKE-PETERSEN: The remark of the honourable member for Wolston that I was untruthful on television is offensive to me, and I ask him to withdraw it.

Mr. MARGINSON: I withdrew it long ago. The Premier does not know what is going on in the House.

On an evening television programme in Sydney, when the Premier was asked how it was that he, as the leader of a party that received only 18 per cent of the votes, was Premier of the State, he said deliberately that he was the leader of the largest party in this Assembly-the largest party, not the larger. He said it was the largest party on a number of occasions, and his interviewer eventually pointed out that, in respect of the coalition parties, he might be the leader of the larger party. On that occasion the Premier attempted to convey to the people of Sydney the impression that he was the leader of the largest party in this Assembly.

Mr. B.JELKE-PETERSEN: I rise on a point of order to put the record straight on this insinuation by the honourable mem­ber for Wolston. My reply to the inter­viewer's question was that, of the two parties, ours had the larger number of rnembers. In reply to the statement by the interviewer that we were here with only 18 per cent of the votes, I pointed out that 51 per cent of the people in Queensland voted against Labor.

Mr. MARGINSON: Perhaps the Premier did not know the correct use of the word "largest" as opposed to "larger". However, in my opinion his statement was deliberate.

1\1atters of Public Interest [12 SEPTEMBER 1973] Matters of Public Interest 503

I feel that the Premier has reached the stage where he wants us to say-he should know where this quotation comes from­"What manner of man is this?" This is the position we are placed in with the Premier today-"What manner of man is this?" There are plenty of people who would like an opportunity to answer that question.

I was very disappointed in the Premier's attitude in Sydney last week. Today we are faced with vicious inflation, which is affecting very grievously the people of Queensland. It is something that was brought on by the former Federal Government, but no attempt whatever is being made in Queensland to do something about controlling prices in an effort to protect consumers. Last week, when the opportunity arose to do something about inflation, every State Premier was present­Mr. Everett attended as Deputy Premier of Tasmania-and was prepared to co-operate with the Federal Government in tackling the very vicious inflationary situation affecting Australia today-with the exception of the Premier of Queensland. He was an embarrassment to me. Not once did he take us into his confidence. I was a member of a delegation representing this State, yet not once did the Premier speak to me during the whole of the time I was there. I expected that at least we would get together occasionally.

I know that the Treasurer advised the Prem­ier not to attend the Prime Minister's dinner. And that was only because the Treasurer did not himself receive an invitation. He knew quite well that the Premier was not capable of handling the position among the other Premiers of this Commonwealth. The Premier wanted to get aw.1y and the Treasurer advised him not to £!0. Of course, the Treasurer left the next day. Do you realise, Mr. Speaker, that the Premier allowed the Treasurer-! give the Treasurer a bouquet in this regard -to carry on, with the Leader of the Oppos­ition, in the machinery work associated with the convention? I give the Treasurer full marks, because I believe he knew his subject.

We were asked in this Parliament House, before we went to Sydney, not to leave the convention and that if we could not attend to ensure that our alternate delegates were p1·esent so that Queensland could be repre­sented to the maximum. But what did we find? The Government delegates left us.

Getting back to the Treasurer, when we got there the steering committee, of which he was a member, was disbanded. An exec­utive was formed to control the affairs of convention and to decide what would be discussed, who would be the speakers, and so on. But what happened? The Premier took over from the Treasurer. He said, "I will be the representative now."

Sir GORDON CHALK: I rise to a point of order. The honourable member is not correct. The position is that three delegates were representing Queensland previously and,

when the executive committee was appointed, it was decided there would be only two Queensland representatives. The Premier decided that he, as Leader of the Govern­ment, and the Leader of the Opposition should be the delegates involved.

Mr. SPEAKER: Order! I ask the honour­able member for Wolston to accept the denial of the Treasurer.

Mr. MARGINSON: I accept it. The only thing is that the Premier is still on t~e executive committee and the Treasurer IS

not. And I am not one to disclose personal conversations in this respect.

(Time expired.)

AUSTR\LIAN CONSTITUTIONAL CONVENTION; STATE ELECTORAL RIGHTS

[\'1r. LANE (Merthyr) (12.33 p.m.): We have just witnessed a disgusting exhibition by the honourable member for Wolston which seemed to hang on the single theme that the Premier did not say "Good-day" to him in Svdney. Apparently this hurt his feelings and provoked him into speaking spontaneously this morning, and so taking up the time of some other speaker. The honourable member for Wolston has taken very little interest in the politics and the day-to-day struggles that go on in this place.

Sir Gordon Chalk: He did not speak at the convention at all.

Mr. LANE: Not at all, but he chose to speak this morning and work o~ th~ salt he had on him because the Premter d1d not speak to him in Sydney.

As we know, this convention held in Sydney was the first since 1897. It was a convention of representatives of all States of Australia and of the Commonwealth Government to consider whether or not it is desirable that changes should be made to the Common­wealth Constitution.

It was a historic event arranged at the instigation of the State Governments after motions on the desirability of holding such a convention were passed in all Parliaments, in,:luding the Federal Parliament.

Each Parliament appointed an all-party delegation, and local government was also represented. The Parliament of Victoria, act­ing responsibly, initiated the move, and secured the co-operation of all States. It was only then that the Commonwealth was invited to participate. The convention was convened against a background of good will and in an earnest endeavour to look critically at the Commonwealth Constitution in its application to the Australian society in the 1970's. ·

The steering committee, again representa­tive of all States, attended to the machinery arrangements such as venue, standing orders, and proposals reducing the agenda to simple terms. That, in itself, was a monumental job

504 Matters of Public Interest [12 SEPTEMBER 1973] Matters of Public Interest

in view of the diversity of opinion and var­iations of attitude. All of this was done, not without some expense to the Australian people, and I am sure we all hoped that something productive would flow from this gathering. I know that many Liberals hoped that party differences at least would be sub­merged in the national interest.

The Commonwealth Constitution, like those of most Western democracies, holds a cher­ished place in the hearts and minds of all Australians. It is quite properly recognised as the final safeguard of the people against ruthless, centralised control reposing in Can­berra, remote from the real Australia. The Commonwealth Government is always so impersonal in its approach to individuals, particularly those in the outlying States, that it is sometimes harsh and cruel in its dealings and decisions. Unfortunately, this has long been the case. It has been even more so since 2 December last, and the Government, by virtue of its socialist and therefore central­is! philosophy, has made many attempts to gather further powers to itself.

As I said, we on this side of the House had hoped that, in the national interest, the political differences of the parties would have been submerged in this historic confer­ence. Unfortunately, we were to be sadly disappointed. This was immediately evident at the opening of the convention. Even whilst the opening speech of the Governor-General (Sir Paul Hasluck) was still ringing in the ears of delegates, the new Prime Minister, preening himself like a peacock, began the "politicalisation'" of the convention. He torpedoed it on the first day. He completely ignored the inspiring words of the Governor­General and, reading from a prepared 3tate­ment, announced three proposals that he intended to put to the Australian people by way of referendum at the earliest oppor­tunity.

The first proposal was to call on the people to give power to alter the Constitution so that the Commonwealth Government in Can­berra would have power to control prices in all States of Australia. This issue has already been well canvassed, and, of course, there are strong and valid arguments against it.

The second proposal was to seek an alter­ation to the Constitution to allow elections for the House of Representatives and the Senate to be synchronised. There are good reasons for and against this proposal. I do not intend to canvass this issue today, because in point of fact it was only window dressing for the third proposal, which was put to the convention at the direct request, made several months ago, of the Queensland Cen­tral Executive of the Australian Labor Party. The Q.C.E., of course, includes the Leader of the Opposition in this House. This is the main point that I want to deal with.

This third proposal clearly seeks to take from the States the basic right to conduct their own electoral affairs. No doubt the Commonwealth legislation proposed by Mr.

Whitlam would be in line with that already defeated twice by a hostile Senate, which allows for a disparity of only 10 per cent between the number of voters in the various electorates. It is the third proposal that has the most serious implications for the outlying States, and we would be well advised to examine the real reasons behind it.

The truth is that the initiative in this move was first taken in Brisbane several months ago-in the month of March, in fact. It was taken not at a conference open to the public and convened for this purpose and not at a private dinner arranged by the Prime Min­ister in Sydney, where no agenda was laid down, no record was kept, and no formalities or Standing Orders were observed. It was taken at a private dinner attended by A.L.P. Party bosses and held in Brisbane in March of this year. This secret dinner, held in a private room at the Terrace Motel in Bris­bane, was attended by the Leader of the Opposition, and the only other persons pres­ent were the Prime Minister and the Inner Executive of the Q.C.E. I am abou.t to tell the House· what took place at this dinner.

An Opposition Member: How do you know this?

Mr. LANE: The honourable member might very well be interested in how I come to know the details of this dinner. I suggest that the honourable member who interjeots and the Leader of the Opposition know, as I know, that there is at least one loud­mouthed drunk on the Inner Executive of the Q.C.E. who shoots his mouth off in hotels.

Mr. HOUSTON: I rise to a point of order. I am a member of the Inner Executive, and I take strong exception to the words and insinuations of the honourable member.

Mr. SPEAKER: Order! There is no valid point of order.

Mr. LANE: I was not referring to the Leader of the Opposition when speaking of a drunk who shoots his mouth off in hotels, but the Leader of the Opposition knows very well who fits that de5cription in the seven­member Inner Executive of the Q.C.E.

Mr. HOUSTON: I rise to a point of order. Again the honourable member's statement is completely untrue. There are no drunks on the Inner Executive of the Q.C.E.

Mr. SPEAKER: Order! There is no valid point of order. What any honourable mem­ber says about any person outside the House, unless he or she is a relative of a member of this Assembly, I will disregard. If I were to allow the honourable gentleman's point of order and carry the ruling through to extremes, debate in this Chamber would be stifled. I repeat that there is no valid point of order.

Matters of Public Interest [12 SEPTEMBER 1973] Matters of Public Interest 505

Mr. LANE: The dinner to which I refer was attended by the Prime Minister and the seven-man Inner Executive of the Queens­land Central Executive of the A.L.P., five of whom are full-time union officials from the Brisbane Trades Hall.

(Time expired.)

EDUCATION OF HANDICAPPED CHILDREN

Mr. P. WOOD (Toowoomba South) (12.42 p.m.): l wish to refer today to areas of education in which grave injustices are being done under the present system. I believe that the Department of Education must accept responsibility for the education of all children. These include categories of children being catered for by voluntary organisations such as the Queensland Sub­normal Children's Welfare Association and the Autistic Children's Association of Queensland, spastic children, and children with multiple handicaps. In my opinion, the present education policies in this State are dis.:riminatory in respect of these children.

It has been said in the House by Govern­ment spokesmen that it is the policy to provide education for children who are "able to benefit from schools provided by the department". That may sound good. But, of course, if the Department of Education does not in fact provide schools for certain categories of children who are unable to benefit from the present schools, there is a clear case of discrimination.

In my opinion, experience over a number of years has shown that great numbers of children who are able to benefit from educa­tion programmes are not provided for in the State system. That applies particularly to the largest group involved-the subnormal children with moderate mental handicaps. For many years it was considered that education programmes for these children were not of any value. That proposition has long since been discredited, and so much good work has been done in the field of education of these children that the time is now long overdue for their education to be a Government responsibility, not the respon­sibility of a voluntary organisation.

Of course, one should not assume that the education provided in any system for subnormal children will be along the lines that are usual in ordinary schools. A special type of education is needed for them; they have special talents or skills that need to be developed. I think that the Sub-normal Children's Welfare Association has done magnificent work over many years, under great difficulties, and tremendous strains have been placed-and continue to be placed--on parents. The financial strain is the least of these, but it is still a great strain.

Parents would welcome government pro­vision of schools for the moderately men­tally handicapped. I have discussed this

proposition with many people, and I am confident that such a move would be welcomed. Parents who work in the organi­sation in either a voluntary or a full-time capacity and committee members, adminis­trators, and so on, are not by any means unanimous that government responsibility is the answer. I believe that it is. How can we say to one group of parents with normal children that we will provide schools for their children and then say to another group of parents with subnormal children that we will assist them only with subsidies?

The Government provides substantial sub­sidies to the Sub-Normal Children's Welfare Association and other associations by paying the salaries of three-year-trained teachers in the first year of teaching, but that is nowhere near 1the cost of salaries of more experienced and better qualified teachers. Ignored are all the other recurrent costs of operating schools, and the capital cost is a great burden to the voluntary association. A tremendous strain is placed on the financial and other resources of voluntary associations in providing these schools. One of the greatest problems lies in the training of teachers for special schools, and there is a tremendous void in this area. I hope that the Karmel Report, which makes provision for some work in the training of special teachers, will prove of value in this area. I believe that we should establish the principle of equal rights for handicapped children, and they should include the right to free education.

There is an important, continuing role for the voluntary associations. I am now referring particularly to the Sub-Normal Children's Welfare Association. It has scarcely begun its work in interests outside the school. There is much to be done in the area of day care for the severely mentally handi­capped. There is much to be done in the provision of group family homes for sub­normal children attending special schools or for older subnormal persons attending sheltered workshops. There is a tremendous amount of work to be done in the provision and expansion of sheltered workshop facili­ties throughout the State. In this regard the association has much to do, and I hope that it will receive generous Government assistance in all of these areas.

There should be a continuing involvement between the associations I have mentioned and the schools which I hope to see estab­lished. All associations, particularly the Sub­Normal Children's Welfare Association, have a vast amount of experience and expertise, as well as desirable attitudes. These should be continued. I can point to the school at the Spastic Centre in Brisbane as a model of what might be done in this regard. There would undoubtedly be many problems of detail in the State Government providing the schools and the association, with Gov­ernment assistance, continuing to make avail­able those other facilities I have mentioned.

506 Matters of Public Interest [12 SEPTEMBER 1973] Matters of Public Interest

The school at the Spastic Centre is right in the middle of a wide range of medical and other facilities provided by 1he Spastic League. I have seen the school there as, I think, have many other honourable members. Although it is a State school, it is functioning right in the centre of a wide range of accommodation and medical facilities for spastic children. One of the strangest things about the spastic school in Brisbane is that it caters only for some spastic children. That is the point of my comments today. Unless the spastic child has a certain level of mental abili:ty, he is excluded from the school at the Spastic Centre. The school caters only for children of certain intellectual ability.

Even within that area, because of Govern­ment policy established for many years, there is this form of discrimination. It is clear that all 1he associations-the Spastic League, the people caring for autistic children, and others caring for multi-handicapped and sub­normal children, and so on-should be relieved of the burden of the education of these children. This is a burden which does and should belong to the Government. I urge that this matter be considered and the present policy changed so that we will eliminate areas of discrimination which exist because a child happens to have certain intellectual handicaps.

LOCAL AUTHORITY BOUNDARIES

Mr. CASEY (Mackay) (12.50 p.m.): The matter of public interest that I wish to raise today could perhaps be considered to be a hardy annual. It has to do with the distrib­ution and size of local authority areas in Queensland and the necessity to amalgamate some shire areas and amend or vary the boundaries of others. In 1896 a royal com­miSSIOn was set up to inquire into this subject, and 32 years later-in 1928-a further royal commission held an investiga­tion into the entire system of local authority boundaries in this State.

Since 1928, nothing further has been done. A span of 45 years-two generations of Queenslanders-has come and gone under the existing shire boundaries in Queensland, and there is an urgent need for another full inquiry into these boundaries. I therefore call upon the Government to take some immediate action to appoint a royal com­mission to inquire into local authority sizes and the distribution of local authority areas in this State.

Surely this has become an urgent need when, in the period since 1928, we have had four redistributions of Federal electoral boundaries in Queensland and five complete redistributions of State boundaries. The boundaries of the Brisbane City Council wards have been amended on at least six occasions, but the remaining local authorities in Queens­land have remained static and nothing has been done in regard to them. Surely there

is equal justification for bringing up to date the boundaries of this third arm of govern­ment.

In 1915 there were 184 shire areas in Queensland. In 1928 these had been reduced to 152, and in the ensuing 40 years since then the number has only been reduced by a further 21, that is, to 131. Most of the movements in the period after 1915 occurred because of amalgamations of some areas following the 1928 royal commission and the setting up of the Greater Brisbane area. The 1928 royal commission recommended the reducing of local authority areas in Queens­land to 86, to bring them down to what was then considered to be the viable area within which a local authority could operate.

I draw attention to the fact that more recently, in the period between the last two censuses-that is, 1966 and 1971-70 local authority areas in Queensland showed decreases in population. Virtually two-thirds of the local authority areas in Queensland hav,e had fairly extensive movements in population in that time. No new local authority areas have been created since 1915. Despite this, we have seen tremendous increases in population in certain parts of the State.

During my first session in Parliament, I raised this matter by way of a question to the then Minister for Local Government (Mr. Rae), who is now present in the Chamber. In 1969 I questioned him on the setting up of an independent tribunal on local authority boundaries, and his answer then was, "The matters raised are presently under consider­ation." Four years later, I presume they are still under consideration because nothing has been done.

Most towns and shires in this State came into existence only because of the stock routes and the old traffic routes followed by the original pioneers. Since that time, the position has changed to a great extent. Even since the 1928 royal commission the whole complexion of State transport has changed. New roads have been constructed; new areas have been opened up. As you would be aware in your own area, Mr. Speaker, the beef roads scheme has altered tremendously 1he traffic pattern and living habits of people in western areas of the State. In many cases, railway lines have been torn up and are no longer available to the areas they formerly serv~ed. Port facilities, too, have changed completely. Many of the smaller ports in the State are no longer being used. Previously they were outlets for adjacent communities, of which they were an integral part. They no longer exist because port facilities and patterns have also changed. Even air routes have a bearing on the movement of people within and outside local authority areas. Old mining towns have faded and new ones have been born.

In many areas local government exists in name only, as there is no government as such. After meeting administrative commit­ments, members of local authorities, no

Matters of Public Interest [13 SEPTEMBER 1973] Address in Reply 507

matter how well meaning they might be, are rendered virtually ineffectual. They rely in the main for their finance on contributions by the Main Roads Depa11tment towards the construction of roads. In fact, the valuations in some local authority areas are insufficient to provide the wherewithal from rating. In some instances this leads to exceptionally high rating. This, coupled with inflation, which has made tremendous inroads into administra­tive and maintenance funds, means that, even in the more affluent areas, management expenses represent an undue proportion of rating revenue.

On top of this is the continual demand for improved facilities, the establishment of libraries and health services as well as the improvement of building standards. Some counciis do not even have sufficient money to keep their road-maintenance gangs employed all the year round. I know that the Minister for Lands and Forestry would be aware of this problem in his electorate.

A large number of local authorities are reaching the stage where, under the existing distribution and size, they will no longer be able to operate as efficient forms of local government. Therefore, the creation of larger and wealthier units is required. By "larger" I do not necessarily mean larger in area; they could be larger in terms of population.

The areas within a local authority's boundaries should be similar both commer­cially and industrially, as well as socially, so that common policies can be implemented ;to the benefit of all the local inhabitants. The creation of stronger areas with an aggre­gation of resources must result in sounder economy and greater efficiency, with added satisfaction to the ratepayers, who, after all, are called upon to meet the cost.

The problems to which I have referred can be observed in the Moreton district, around Ipswich. I should imagine that some of the worst -affected local authority areas are those on the Darling Downs, as well as others in the Brisbane, Mary and Burnett Valleys. I am aware of the concern of the honourable member for Bundaberg in this matter, because Bundaberg, where the Queens­land Local Government Conference is to be held nat week, is one area that calls urgently for a redistribution of local authority boundaries.

Further, tremendous development has occurred on the Near North Coast, in places such as Noosa. Local authority areas in the Central West, the North West and the Gulf country have undergone changing pat­terns of living as a result of the construction of beef roads. The extension of cities into adjacent shires has brought problems to Cairns, T ownsville, Gladstone, Bundaberg, Maryborough, Gympie, Ipswich, and Mackay, the latter of which has spilled over into the Pioneer Shire. When the residents of North Mackay were included in my electorate they were told, "Under the legislation, that's it; you have no choice."

Many problems are being highlighted by the creation of regions within the State. They will deprive local government of some of its rightful roles. Local government repre­sentatives need to do all they can to fight for the retention of their rights. It is useless for local authority representatives to look to these regions to overcome their problems. They may take positive action to amalgamate their shire areas, and thus save them from being swallowed up by regional councils on matters that can still be decided by local government.

Such positive action can be taken by the setting up of a royal commission, which will overcome the petty jealousies that arise in the distribution of local authority boundaries. The best interests of the people would be served by an independent authority such as a royal commission.

The redistribution of local authority boundaries is of great concern to the State and calls for urgent consideration by the Government.

The House adjourned at 1 p.m.