Queensland

Parliamentary Debates [Hansard]

Legislative Assembly

TUESDAY, 1 SEPTEMBER 1970

Electronic reproduction of original hardcopy

Address in Reply [1 SEPTEMBER] Questions Without Notice 407

TUESDAY, 1 SEPTEMBER, 1970

Mr. SPEAKER (Hon. D. E. Nicholson, Murrumba) read prayers and took the chair at 11 a.m.

ORDER OF BUSINESS

Mr. SPEAKER: Honourable members, with the introduction of the new format fm questions it will be necessary, as from this morning, to alter the procedure in the House. In order to have in one format answers given to questions on notice, notice of questions and questions without notice, it will be necessary to call ministerial business first and questions afterwards.

PAPERS The following paper was laid on the

table, and ordered to be printed:-Report of the Agent-General for Queens­

land for the year 1969-1970. The following papers were laid on the

table:-Orders in Council under the Racing and

Betting Act 1954-1969. Proposals under the Forestry Act 1959-

1968.

QUESTIONS WITHOUT NOTICE

STATEMENT BY MR. SPEAKER

Mr. SPEAKER: Honourable members, in introducing the new form of question time, I feel that Ministers and members generally may be guided by a few observations by me with respeot to the posing and answering of questions.

A question should not be in effect a short speech and should contain only sufficient information to make the reason for asking the question clear. All questions should be framed to seek and not to impar.t information.

408 Questions Upon Notice [1 SEPTEMBER] Questions Upon Notice

Members who desire to ask questions without notice should not do so on matters known to require lengthy research, such as statistical matters, etc. Questions without notice must of necessity be concise yet still clearly convey their meaning.

Ministers may reserve the right to answer such questions either fully or in part, or to request that notice of any question be given.

Members may ask three questions without or upon notice. One supplementary question is permissible, but it will be regarded as one of the three allowable que&tions.

I must ,repeat, as I have said on so many occasions, that provocative or politically loaded questions invariably encourage similar answers.

I am sure th&t by observing the foregoing, in conjunction with the general rules governing questions, with their usual under­standing and regard for .the good working of the House, hon. members will help a lot towards an orderly shakedown of these new procedures.

Honourable Members: Hear, hear!

QUESTIONS UPON NOTICE

BREAKING AND ENTERING OFFENCES, BALMORAL STATE SCHOOL

(a) Mr. Houston, pursuant to notice, asked The Minister for Works,-

With reference to the seven occasions this year on which breaking and entering has occurred at the Balmoral State High School, when equipment was stolen and acts of vandalism committed-

( 1) What action has been taken by the Police Department?

(2) Have any arrests been made with regard to the teaching aids stolen or the damage to school property?

( 3) What action has been taken to pre­vent further losses in this way?

Answers:-

( 1) "Records of the Police Department show that the Balmoral State High School has been broken and entered on six occasions this year. On three of these occasions property was stolen. The offences have been investigated by the Police Department."

(2) "No."

(3) "Although the premises have always been subject to attention by police on patrol duties, additional patrols are now being made of the school by both uniform and C. I. Branch Police."

(b) Mr. Houston, pursuant to notice, asked The Minister for Education,-

With reference to the seven occasions this year on which breaking and entering has occurred at the Balmoral State High

School, when equipment was stolen and acts of vandalism committed, what action does his Department propose to take to protect this school property from any further losses or damage?

Answer:-"The incidence of vandalism and unlaw­

ful ently to school property, not only at Balmoral State High School, but in other localities, too, is deplored. The matter of improving the security of school buildings has received consideration, but the isolation and scattered nature of these buildings make the problem difficult. My Depart­ment is grateful for the co-operation of the police in this matter. In addition to their investigations, police patrols in the vicinity of schools troubled in this way have provided a definite measure of pro­tection. The possibilities of watching services, security-type fencing and flood­lighting have been studied, but there is no assurance that the effectiveness of such facilities would be commensurate with expenditure involved. However, the matter is still being considered."

GENERAL MEDICAL BOARD, WORKERS' CoMPENSATION

Mr. Hanlon, pursuant to notice, asked The Treasurer,-

( 1) With reference to his advice to me of October 24, 1969, that he was examin­ing a report on the subject of certain matters and submissions concerning the General Medical Board constituted under the Workers' Compensation Acts, raised by me in the appropriation debate and later, on his invitation, supplemented with further direct correspondence, is he in a position yet to indicate any conclusions that he may have drawn from his examination?

(2) Is he aware of an article in the Law Council Newsletter of April, 1970, in which is reproduced a letter from the Commonwealth Minister for Social Ser­vices which states inter alia that in line with the beneficial nature of the Social Services Act any doubt is resolved in favour of the claimant and further refers to "the undesirable consequence of a rigid attitude towards medical eligibility for a pension"?

(3) Whilst the Commonwealth Minister did not in any way link or identify this principle with the Victorian Compensation Act but rather contrasted the two in the particular context of his letter, is it pos­sible for the Treasurer, concerning the Compensation Acts in this State and having due regard to proper underwriting prin­ciples inherent in such system of com­pensation, to indicate as a guide-line to medical boards that there is also inherent in the tradition of compensation in Queens­land at least some significance of a beneficial nature, as in the Social Services

Questions Upon Notice [1 SEPTEMBER] Questions Upon Notice 409

Act and that rigid medical attitudes towards medical eligibility for compensa­tion can also be undesirable?

Answers:-

( 1) "No. I am awaiting the result of a recent hearing by the Industrial Commis­sion which could have an important bearing on the question of appeals."

(2) "No."

(3) "I am assured by the General Manager, State Government Insurance Office, that there is no rigid attitude towards medical eligibility for workers' compensa­tion, and furthermore, in accordance with the spirit and intention of the Workers' Compensation Acts, any benefit of the doubt is extended to the injured worker."

T.A.B. AGENCY FOR CENTRAL CITY AREA

:Wr. Hanlon, pursuant to notice, asked The Treasurer,-

(1) With reference to the city agencies of the T.A.B. at Elizabeth, Adelaide, George and Turbot Streets, is he aware that there is some criticism from T.A.B. patrons located in the central city section of Queen and Adelaide Streets of the absence of an agency in that area?

( 2) Whilst recogmsmg the need to locate additional facilities in George and Adelaide Streets at the outer fringe, have any premises been sought in the central section since the closure of the previous Adelaide Street agency and, if so, with what result?

Answers:-

( 1) "I am informed by the Totalisator Administration Board that they have not received any complaints concerning the location of the present central city agencies."

(2) "When the closure of the agency at the corner of Adelaide Street and Isles Lane was mooted, the Totalisator Adminis­tration Board made a search for other appropriate premises and finally established agencies at Desmond Chambers in Adelaide Street and Turbot House in Turbot Street."

WEIRS ON HAUGHTON RIVER

Mr. Bird, pursuant to notice, asked The Minister for Conservation,-

Have investigations into the feasibility and costs of constructing two weirs on the Haughton River, in the vicinity of Giru, been completed? If so, (a) what are the estimated costs of the weirs and (b) is it anticipated, in view of the serious water position which exists, that construction of at least one of these weirs will be commenced before the onset of the next wet season?

Answer:-"Preliminary designs and estimates of

costs for the weirs have been prepared, but studies to determine feasibility in terms of additional water supply, benefits and costs are still in progress. (a) The estimated cost of the weirs and associated works is of the order of $1· 5 million. (b) When available a report by the Irrigation Commission on the overall scheme will be submitted to Cabinet and, if approved, will then be submitted to the Jandholders and other interested bodies who will be required to meet charges involved. If accepted by them, detailed design and construction can then proceed when funds are available."

TRAINING SCHOOL, QUEENSLAND THEATRE CoMPANY

l\'lr. Dean, pursuant to notice, asked The Minister for Education,-

In view of the report in The Courier­Mail of August 27 headed "Theatre school question mark", which stated that 40 people will attend the Queensland Theatre Company's first training school for theatre techniques-

( 1) Who are the ten persons who will receive $2,000 plus free tuition?

(2) Among the 30 who will pay $2,400, excluding travel and accommodation expenses, how and to what extent will the school subsidy benefit be distributed?

Answer:-

( 1 and 2) "In accordance with clause 5 (e) of the Queensland Theatre Company Act 1970 the company will be conducting a training school in theatre techniques in Brisbane for four weeks from November 2 to November 28, 1970. The school will CJnsist of 40 students of whom 10 will be awarded special scholarships. The total cost of conducting the school is estimated tc) be in the vicinity of $7,100. Because of the importance of the school not only to young professional actors who have been associated with the Queensland Theatre Company, but amateurs interested in widening their experience in drama techniques, speech, movement, mime, improvisation and make-up, the Australian Council for the Arts has generously agreed to subsidise the school from its Special Projects Fund to the extent of $4,000. All students attending the school will benefit directly from this subsidy. The special scholarships will entitle tht. recipients to free tuition and a living a11owance. To be eligible for a scholarship the applicant must have performed at least once in a Queensland Theatre Com­pany production. The fees of the remain­ing 30 students will also be subsidised as the cost per student is estimated at $45 per head per week, whereas the tuition

410 Questions Upon Notice [1 SEPTEMBER] Questions Upon Notice

fee has been fixed at $20 per head per week. It is not possible at this stage to give the names of those who will receive the 10 scholarships. I am informed that within the past week 10 players have been provisionally chosen but in certain cases where the players are on tour their acceptance of the award is still awaited. It is anticipated, however, the names will be released shortly."

REMOVAL OF COLOURED SANDS, COOLOOLA AREA

Mr. Dean, pursuant to notice, asked The Minister for Lands,-

With reference to the recent Govern­ment decision to prohibit mining of the Cooloola Sands Mass-

( 1) Will he take immediate action against the present removal of coloured sand by tourists and certain others who are commercially trading the sand in every city in Australia?

(2) Will he appoint a permanent warden to police the area and recommend to the Government that a heavy penalty be imposed on any person or persons found removing the sand?

Answers:-( 1) "The Conservator of Forests had

already taken action to place two employees on patrol last week-end. These patrols will be continued for the time being. In addition, a number of new signs informing the public of the position have been made and will be erected shortly at key positions. If after a period of warning, offences continue, appropriate action will be taken."

(2) "When the area has been proclaimed a National Park, consideration will be given to the employment of staff subject to the availability of funds."

AusTRALIAN RoAD SAFETY CouNCIL

Mr. Dean, pursuant to notice, asked The Minister for Transport,-

Further to his Answer to my Question on August 26, regarding the Australian Road Safety Council-

( 1) Is the Press report of August 13 the only advice he has received on the matter, or were the States consulted before­hand on the alteration?

(2) What is the present allocation of Commonwealth funds to the Queensland Road Safety Council?

(3) Has any approach been made for an increase in these funds consequent upon disbandment of the Australian Road Safety Council?

( 4) If the alteration does not affect the Queensland Road Safety Council in any way, is it considered that this Council has sufficient staff and funds for the neces­sary or projected activities?

(5) What part does research now play in the Queensland Road Safety Council's activities?

Answers:­( I) "No." (2) "$21,460." (3) "Yes." ( 4) "No. The Council can always use

additional funds to expand its activities and propaganda."

(5) "None. The functions of the Council are purely educational."

DIP-RESISTANT CATTLE DCKS

Mr. Ahern, pursuant to notice, asked The Minis,ter for Primary Industries,-

( 1) Is he aware of the appearance of cattle ticks resistant to the dip "Dursban" in the Mary Valley? If so, how many properties are affected and where are they?

(2) Where else in Queensland have these ticks been detected?

( 3 ) Are the properties concerned being quarantined by his Department and what precautions are being taken to ensure that the ticks do not spread to other properties?

( 4) Is there evidence of "Nexagan" resistance in cattle ticks?

(5) Is the dip-resistant tick problem a very serious one for Queensland's cattle industry?

( 6) What should property owners do to minimise the problem of resistant ticks on their properties?

Answers:-( 1 ) "I am aware of the presence of

Dursban resistant ticks in the Mary Valley. Three properties are involved--one at Kenilworth, one at Mooloo and one at Glastonbury, the latter two properties being near Gympie."

(2) "Dursban resistant ticks have been detected on a further ten properties to date, two properties being at Lamington in the Beaudesert district; three at Mt. Alford in the Boonah district; one at Pimpama; one at Maroochydore and, in the Rock­hampton district, two at Gracemere and one at Malchi."

(3) "Properties with Dursban resistance are not quarantined. They are placed under administrative restriction. All cattle intended for movement are treated under supervision and must be found free from ticks on inspection within 24 hours prior to commencing their journey."

( 4) "No evidence of field resistance to Nexagan has been found."

(5) "Since the Department commenced an intensive testing programme for cattle tick resistance to various acaracides some

Questions Upon Notice [1 SEPTEMBER] Questions Upon Notice 411

2 000 batches of ticks have been tested and of these about half have shown resistance to one chemical or another. If we had to depend entirely on chemicals for con­trolling ticks, the problem would be indeed serious because new chemicals would have to be found regularly to replace those which become ineffective as ticks become resistant to them and it is both extremely costly and becoming increasingly difficult to find new ones. We still have effective chemicals for all presently known types of resistance and new ones with potential are under test. As far as can be foreseen at present it must be anticipated that ticks will become resistant to each succeeding insecticide brought into use. For this reason my Department's policy is to actively encourage other methods of tick control, e.g. the use of tick-resistant cattle and pasture spelling, thereby being less dependent upon chemical control."

( 6) "Two things should be done by owners to minimise the possibility of selecting out any resistant individuals in the tick population on the property to avert a resistance problem. These are­(a) Treat at strategic times and correct intervals to prevent a build-up of tick numbers which will lead to fewer treat­ments being needed. Tick-resistant cattle require fewer treatments than others and they represent the best long-term proposi­tion. (b) When stock are treated aim at killing every tick. This implies that the ow?er should have a knowledge of any resistance present in the ticks on his property. He should ensure that the insecticide is effective against them and the concentration is correct. It is important that cattle are thoroughly treated. If dipping, the fluid should be adequately stirred and care should be taken that the whole body including the head, is totally immersed. If spraying, the owner should ensure that no dry areas remain."

USE OF TALLOW IN MARGARINE

Mr. Ahern, pursuant to notice, asked The Premier,-

With reference to his Answer to my Question on March 11, wherein he indicated that he had knowledge of margarine com­panies purchasing tallow for the manufac­ture of cooking margarine from abattoirs producing a single-grade tallow primarily for industrial purposes and his assurance that new health regulations would be introduced to control this aesthetically unacceptable practice, have regulations been promulgated and, if not, when is it envisaged that they will be?

Answer:-"The matter is still under consideration."

SALES RATIOS, BUTTER AND MARGARINE

Mr. Ahem, pursuant to notice, asked The Minister for Primary Industries,-

( 1) Has he seen a copy of Food Week of July 14, the food industry managemen~s' official newsletter, which shows a trend m the share of the grocery dollar in the last five years of butter down 27 per cent. and margarine up 18 per cent.?

(2) In view of this trend, what is being done to enforce Clause 26 of the Margarine Act of 1958 which prohibits advertising that indicate~ or suggests that cooking margarine is suitable for use for any pur­pose other than cooking?

Answers:-( 1) "No. However, percentages of the

so-called 'grocery dollar' can be quite mis­leading as a guide to consumption trends. Actual per capita consumption figm:es are more meaningful and per caput retail sales of butter in Queensland have shown little overall change over the last five years. For example, in 1966-67 retail sales were assessed at 16·337 lb. per head of popula­tion whilst in 1969-70 they were assessed at 16·375 lb. per head."

(2) "Regular inspections are carried out by inspectors of my Depatiment in order to detect breaches of the provisions of "The Margarine Act of 1958". When sufficient evidence is obtained to sustain a prosecu­tion for a breach of the Act, a prosecution i~ initiated. Nevertheless it must be appreciated that advertising of the type referred to can be quite subtle and policing is accordingly difficult."

NEW CANE AssiGNMENTS, SuGAR INDUSTRY

Mr. F. P. Moore, pursuant to notice, asked The Minister for Primary Industries,-

( 1) As owners of new cane assignments granted in the years 1966 and 1968 ~re concerned with his Answer to my QuestiOn on Au<>ust 26, how did the new assignees benefit "'from the loans mentioned?

(2) What moneys were given .bY his Government to maintain the stability of the industry during a difficult period of low free-market prices?

Answers:-( 1) "The stabilising of industry ret~rns

during the period of low free-market pn~es avoided a major disruption of productiOn on which Australia's present quota under the International Sugar Agreement is based and which Agreement has led to the major improvement in free-market prices."

(2) "The sugar industry has always elected to stand on its own feet. In the circumstances to which the Honourable Member refers the industry sought no assistance from the Government other than

412 Questions Upon Notice [1 SEPTEMBER] Questions Upon Notice

the amendment of legislation to enable the Sugar Board to raise the loans con­cerned and for the Government to guar­antee such loans, which assistance was readily granted."

DERAILMENTS, WATHANA-BOBAWABA RAILWAY SECTION

Mr. Tucker, pursuant to notice, asked The Minister for Tmnspo:rt,-

(1) What was the number of derail­ments which occurred on the main railway line between Wathana and Bobawaba during the past two years?

(2) How many involved express freight trains?

(3) Were any inquiries held into the derailments? If not, to what does the Department attribute the derailments?

( 4) How many deviations have been built as a result of derailments in this area, how many are still in use and what was the cost of construction?

(5) How many bridges have been damaged, what was the estimated loss in each instance and have all bridges been restored? If not, what are the particulars?

( 6) What rolling-stock was lost or damaged during the same period and what was the estimated loss to the Department?

(7) What was the cost of repairing and restoring the permanent way?

( 8) Have restrictions been placed on this section of the line for the protection of passenger trains? If so, what are the particulars?

Answers:-(!) "Five." (2) "Three." (3 ) "All derailments were investigated

by senior railway officers. Each derail­ment was due to a different cause. A load of steel shifted on a wagon in one instance, in another an employee released his grip on the points during shunting whilst on a third occasion a ballast wagon was derailed as a result of the ballast being allowed to run out too quickly. The other two derailments were due respectively to a sinking of the track following heavy rain and movement of the sleepers and rails."

( 4) "Deviations were built in two cases and these deviations have been retained pending reconstruction of two bridges. The cost of building the deviations has not been recorded separately."

(5) "Two bridges slightly damaged have been repaired. A timber bridge is being replaced by a concrete structure and a concrete drain is being substituted for another timber bridge. which had been listed for replacement."

( 6) "25 wagons were damaged, three of which have had to be written off. The capital value of the latter three wagons was $5,500. The cost of repairing the other 22 wagons was $4,929."

(7) "This information is not available."

( 8) "This section is scheduled for re­railing which is expected to commence in November. In the meantime a speed restriction of 35 m.p.h. is in operation."

BRISBANE PARK LANDS

Mr. Newton, pursuant to notice, asked The Minister for Local Government,-

In view of the statement appearing in The Courier-Mail of August 12 in relation to the revised Town Plan-

( 1 ) Will all present and future applica­tions from organisations in the metro­politan area to the Brisbane City Council, to use part of a park for the construction of a building or for other purposes, be subject to Ministerial approval?

(2) What will be the position in regard to the renewal of leases sought from the Brisbane City Council by such organisa­tions which have occupied portions of parks during past years?

(3) What will be the position of other State local authorities which have a town plan scheme in operation?

Answer:-( I to 3) "The subject matter of the

Honourable Member's Question is presently under consideration."

WILLOWBURN, HARRISTOWN AND DRAYTON RAILWAY STATIONS

Mr. Bousen, pursuant to notice, asked The Minister for Transport,-

In view of his Answer to my Question on August 26 wherein he stated that railway stations at Willowburn, Harris­town and Drayton had high priority for attention, when will this work be carried out?

Answer:-"Until now, the Honourable Member

has not made representations for Willow­burn, Harristown and Drayton, but in view of his pressing representations for Doomben and as these station improve­ments have a low priority, he can con­fidently expect any platform improvements to Willowburn, Harristown and Drayton to be at a subsequent date to those which will be ultimately made at Doomben."

Questions Upon Notice [1 SEPTEMBER] Questions Upon Notice 413

OCCUPATIONAL THERAPY BLOCK, BAILLIE HENDERSON HosPITAL

Mr. Bousen, pursuant to notice, asked The Minister for Health,-

(1 ) What was the cost of converting Ward 3, Baillie Henderson Hospital, Toowoomba, into an occupational therapy block?

(2) After spending this money on the conversion, is it now to be demolished so that a cafeteria may be built in its place?

Answers:-(1) "This building is being used tem­

porarily for Occupational Therapy pur­poses and work of a minor nature only is being undertaken. It has been ascer­tained from the Department of Works that expenditure to date has amounted to $828."

(2) "As the site may be required for a new kitchen/ cafeteria, proposed to be erect~d, any work involving major expendi­ture 1s not contemplated."

REPLICA OF "ENDEAVOUR" AT POSSESSION ISLAND CEREMONY

Mr_. Jensen, pursuant to notice, asked The Premier,-

( 1) Did he or the Minister for Tourism make any attempt to have the replica of Captain James Cook's vessel "Endeavour" included in the Bi-centenary ceremony at Possession Island?

(2) If not, was the inclusion of this vessel overlooked when preparations for the cer~mo~y were made and, if not, why was this hwtoric vessel not used on the occasion?

Answer:-

(1 and 2) ''No. As stated in my Answer to the Honourable Member on Wednesday, August 26, 1970 this vessel is not a replica and cons~quently the !!se of the wor?s 'historic vessel' by him 1s not appropnate. As also advised in my previous Answer, this vessel is owned by a private individual and it would have been quite competent for him if he had desired, to be at Possession ' Island for the ceremony as the event was listed in the Official Programme issued many months ago."

TELEPHONE-TAPPING DEVICES

Mr. B. Wood, pursuant to notice asked The Minister for Justice,- '

( 1) Has his attention been drawn to an article in a national newspaper concerning telephone-tapping devices?

(2) Which persons or bodies are engag­ing in this activity?

(3) Does the Special Branch of the Police Force use these devices?

Answer:-( 1 to 3) "The matter of telephone-tap­

ping devices is one entirely within the jurisdiction of the Commonwealth Gov­ernment."

NATIONAL PARK, MOSSMAN AREA

Mr. B. Wood, pursuant to notice, asked The Minister for Lands,-

With reference to his Press statement of June 4, where is the area of 2,330 acres north of Mossman which was declared a national park?

Answer:-"This national park is located along

the Dagmar Range about mid-way between Mossman and the Daintree River."

RANGERS, DEPARTMENT OF ABORIGINAL AND ISLAND AFFAffiS

Mr. Wallis-Smith, pursuant to notice, asked The Minister for Conservation,-

( 1 ) How many rangers are to be em­ployed by the Department of Aboriginal and Island Affairs and when do applica­tions close?

(2) What other positions for Aboriginal people are vacant and have applications been called for the positions?

Answers:-( I ) "As indicated in the advertisement

one ranger will be appointed for the purposes of safeguarding Aboriginal relics within the Carnarvon area, following clos­ing date for receipt of applications at 4 p.m. on Friday, September 18, 1970. The matter of further appointments will receive consideration in the light of future demonstrated requirements, and the finan­cial position."

(2) "Aboriginal people are eligible to apply for appointment to any position within the Public Service; applications gen­erally are invited weekly in the Govern­ment Gazette for all vacant positions. They are also eligible to apply for any publicly advertised position."

GRIDDLE CAR ON "SUNLANDER''

Mr. Wallis-Smith, pursuant to notice, asked The Minister for Transport,-

( 1 ) Has a Griddle car been used on the "Sunlander" and, if so, on what date?

(2) How many passengers will these cars seat on this service?

(3) Will he consider some orderly method similar to that provided on the Brisbane to Sydney Express, so as to obtain the best use of the service?

( 4) Will he have a notice issued to passengers showing times and type of service available on these cars?

414 Questions Upon Notice (1 SEPTEMBER] Questions Upon Notice

Answers:-( 1) "A Griddle Car was attached to

the Sunlander ex Bundaberg this morn­ing."

(2) "Eighteen."

(3) "It will be the Department's aim to ensure that maximum advantage is taken of this service by passengers."

( 4) "It was intended that the service would be appropriately publicised."

AMENITIES FOR FETTLERS, NORMANTON­CROYDON LINE

Mr. Wallis-Smith, pursuant to notice asked The Minister for Transport,- '

As the fettling gang on the N ormanton to Croydon railway section are compelled to camp away from Normanton during the week at Blackbull or Croydon will he consider the provision of refrige~ators and other improvements at these camps?

Answer:-"The Honourable Member's representa­

tions will be considered."

WEEKEND GAOL DETENTION SCHEME

Mr. Bromley, pursuant to notice asked The Minister for Justice,- '

( 1) How many convicted persons are presently serving weekend sentences under the new detention scheme?

(2) What types of occupation are they performing whilst being detained?

(3) How many have defaulted and is it generally considered that the scheme is proving successful?

( 4) Are females subject to the scheme?

Answers:-

( 1) "At present there are six persons, as two have completed their four week­ends. A total of eight have so far been sentenced to week-end detention."

(2) "Full-time laundry work and labour­ing work outside the walls of the prison."

(3) "None has defaulted. The Comp­troller-General of Prisons states he is optimistic as to the value of the scheme."

(4) "Yes."

PRICE CONTROL ON BASIC GOODS AND FOODSTUFFS

Mr. Bromley, pursuant to notice, asked The Premier,-

(1) What price control is maintained on basic goods and foodstuffs at present?

(2) As the budget introduced by the Federal Treasurer will impose further hard­ship upon consumers, particularly those in the lower income group, including pensioners, and will bring misery to both primary and secondary industries in thi~ State, will he favourably consider the reimposition of price control on all item~ affecting the welfare and living standard of these unfortunate people who are endeavouring to eke out a decent liveli­hood under adverse conditions?

Answers:-( 1) "There is no price control in respect

of any goods under the provisions of "The Profiteering Prevention Acts, 1948 to 1959"."

(2) "It is not anticipated that the effects of the Budget introduced by the Federal Treasurer on prices will be any different in Queensland than in South Australia, where price control is exercised over a wide range of goods. If the Honourable Member will furnish me with specific details of items in respect of which he considers excessive profits are being charged, I shall have them investigated."

COMMONWEALTH-STATE OFFICIALS COMMITTEE FOR DECENTRALIZATION

Mr. R. Jones, pursuant to notice, asked The Premier,-

With further reference to my Question of September 18, 1969, concerning the Commonwealth-State Officials Committee for Decentralization-

Cl) Has Queensland submitted a report to this Committee on projects, costs and other facets of decentralization, pertinent to this State?

(2) If so, when were the reports sub­mitted, what subjects or aspects were included and will these submissions be published or made available to members of this Assembly?

(3) Is he aware that both New South Wales and Victoria have completed and forwarded reports, the New South Wales report being published under the title "Report on Industry Location Survey"?

Answers:-(!) "No. Studies which are being co­

ordinated by the Commonwealth-State Committee on Decentralization so far involve, either jointly or separately, the Commonwealth, New South Wales and Victoria. They were undertaken as pilot studies."

(2) "See Answer to (1) ."

(3) "Yes. However, other pilot studies being undertaken by the two States and the Commonwealth are not yet complete."

Questions Without Notice [1 SEPTEMBER] Questions Without Notice 415

AIR PoLLUTION FROM MOTOR VEHICLES

Mr. Hanson, pursuant to notice, asked The Minister for Transport,-

(1) Are there any efficient, reasonably­priced units available for the control of emissions from crankcases and exhausts of motor vehicles?

(2) Have any moves or submissions been made recently in this State or on a national basis for the control of such fumes?

(3) As the poilution problem has become serious in Australian cities, will legisla­tion be introduced shortly concerning this matter?

Answer:-(1 to 3) "Yes."

ORDER IN CHAMBER DURING

QUESTION TIME

Mr. SPEAKER: Order! That completes the questions on the Business Paper.

Having had to call the House to order twice this morning because of noise in the Chamber during question time, and as it is necessary that both questions and answers be heard from now on, I think I should point out that Ministers and members gen­erally are responsible for making themselves heard. Hon. members can assist greatly by observing the general rule relating to loud conversations and interjections during question time. The use of microphones will assist greatly, and I commend their use to all hon. members, including Ministers. If an hon. member intends asking a question and has not a microphone near him, he should request that one be handed to him. An attendant will be looking after the micro­phones in front of the ministerial benches so that, if necessary, Ministers in the back row also can answer through a microphone.

QUESTIONS WITHOUT NOTICE

TOWNSVILLE CHILD MURDERS

Mr. TUCKER: I ask the Minister in charge .of police the following question: With reference to the recent horrifying murder of t\' o Townsville children, have the where­abouts and movements of child murderers and sex offenders released from Stuart gaol over the last few years been checked upon? Further, is there any common factor in the present murder and previous unsolved murders in other States of the Common­wealth, and, if so, has the co-operation of the police in those States been sought to try to run this maniac to earth?

Mr. HODGES: In answer to the hon. member, he can be assured that the com­petency of the Queensland Police Force has not been questioned and that every avenue will be pursued in an effort to track down the barbaric killer of the two Towns­vine children.

FILM, "THE FRIENDLY STRANGER"

Mr. W. D. HEWITT: I direct a question without notice to the Minister for Educa­tion and, by way of a brief preface, I advise the hon. gentleman that the Crime Prevention Bureau in this State has in its possession an excellent film called "The Friendly Stranger" which has already been shown quite extensively in a number of schools in this State. With the violent murders which have saddened and shocked us all in our minds, I ask the hon. gentleman whether he will consider the contents of this film, and if he deems it advisable, add it to the film library of the Education Department so that it can receive much wider distribution.

Mr. FLETCHER: I think it goes without saying that I would be delighted to investi­gate the possibility of using this film in the Education Department.

FEDERAL BUDGET PROTEST RALLY

Mr. AIKENS: I desire to ask the Trea­surer a question without notice. I have some others later on about the horrifying murder in Townsville. In view of the fact that hundreds of Queensland workers lost a considerable sum of money in wages and/ or salaries as a consequence of being intimi­dated and conscripted into remaining away from work on Tuesday last, 25 August, and the fact that this stoppage had the full support and approval of the A.L.P ., will he inform the House if any A.L.P. member of this Parliament authorised the Treasury Department to deduct any portion of his salary payable for that day, and, if so, what are the names of such A.L.P. mem­bers and the amount of deduction author­ised by each?

Mr. CHALK: I know of no A.L.P. member who has applied to have his salary reduced because of the stoppage mentioned. I think it goes without saying­and from my own industrial experience I know-that presidents, secretaries and organisers of unions never apply to have their salaries reduced. It is usually the workers they allegedly represent who lose by this sort of thing happening.

MARIHUANA

Mr. McKECHNIE: I desire to ask the Premier a question without notice. Has he read a recent Press report attributed to the Young Labour Party at its annual confer­ence that thev recommend that marihuana be legalised? - Can I have the Premier's assurance that no moves will be made in this direction.

Mr. BJELKE-PETERSEN: In reply to the hon. member, I did read the article stating that the Young Labour Party had suggested that the use of this drug should be legalised. All I would say is that this subject has not been before our joint parties. I, personally, would oppose such

416 Questions Without Notice [1 SEPTEMBER] Questions Without Notice

an irresponsible move very strongly, because I believe it would only lead to the greater use of drugs in this State.

EMERALD SHIRE BOUNDARIES

Mr. O'DONNELL: I direct a question without notice to the Minister for Local Government and Electricity.

Mr. AIKENS interjected.

Mr. SPEAKER: Order! The hon. member for Townsville South has already heard my r,equest to hon. members to refrain from noisy interjections during question time. If the hon. member persists in interjecting or in noisy conversation, I shall h:we to deal with him under Rule 123A.

Mr. O'DONNELL: Is there any impedi­ment in the Local Government Act to the tabling of the Order in Council relative to the alteration to the Emerald Shire boun­daries? If not, does he intend to table the Order, thus giving this Parliament, if it wishes, the democratic right to move dis­allowance, as is applicable to the vast num­bers of Orders in Council and Regulations, many of which have not the repercussions that this Order in Council has for the citizens concerned?

Mr. RAE: I ask the hon. member to place this question on the Business Paper. It involves such a detailed reply that I would be much more able to give the hon. member an acceptable answer if he would do so.

NIGHT COURSING

l\1r. HINZE: I wish to direct a question without notice to the Treasurer. On 20 March last l asked him if he could give any information to the House concerning the introduction of night coursing to this State. I now ask him if he has any further information to give hon. members, particularly on whether or not it is possible to set up a coursing control board along the lines of the Trotting Control Board.

Mr. CHALK: The question of night cours­ing has exercised the minds of Government m~mbers over a number of months. It is tr:Je that in March I indicated that the subjec! was under consideration. Since then I have been interviewed bv reoreser.tatives and possible promoters of "Lang Park who desire to conduct night coursing there. I h~,:ve had approaches also from the Brisbane Cricket Ground Trust, and in fact I have seen a drawing of a proposed night-coursing track at the Brisbane Cricket Ground. These matt~rs are being considered. I believe that the first thing to be done is the setting up of a board similar to the Trotting Control Board. That matter wiil receive my con­sideration later in the year.

DELFT REPORT

Mr. HEATLEY: I ask the Minister for Local Government the expected date of delivery to hon. members of the Delft Report.

Mr. RAE: I should say that we will not know of any determined date before the end of the year. Perhaps we will have some­thing then. I shall be happy to get details of the matter for the hon. member.

BABY FOODS

Mr. HANSON: Following questions that have been asked by me relative to baby foods, I ask the Minister for Health if he has noted various Press reports emanating from overseas sources on this matter. Has he read reports that in the United States of America a Government scientific panel recommended the exclusion from baby foods of monosodium glutamate and made such exclusion manda­tory upon the manufacturers of baby foods? If so, is the Minister prepared, in the interests of community health, to process these reports and to determine whether it is possible to give protection to our young people in the matter?

Mr. TOOTH: I had noticed references in the Press to the use of monosodium glutamate and also the suggestions that some control should be exercised. However, this parti­cular substance has been in use in the Orient for generations; in recent times it has been used extensively in our own situation; and certain manufacturers of baby foods ha•;e introduced it into their products. It is true that, if ingested in excessive quantities, it can produce certain maladies or dis­comfort. I think it is known as the Chinese restaurant syndrome, and it produces head­aches, which follow the ingestion of con­siderable amounts.

I understand that this matter has been under consideration by the National Health and Medical Research Council and that in the latter part of last year--! am not sure of the exact date-it made a statement which was issued to manufacturers of baby foods, indicating that in the opinion of that august body it would be wise if this substance were withdrawn. At any rate, the statement indicated that in the view of the National Health and Medical Research Council it was an unnecessary additive to baby foods.

CO~fMUNITY H011E-C.\RE SEF.VlCE SCHElE

Mr. R. E. MOORE: I wish to direct a question to the Minister for Health. Will he inform the House what persons are eligible for help under the community home­care service scheme? Will he also state what services can be obtained and whether any c:1arges arc made for these services?

Questions Without Notice (1 SEPTEMBER] Questions Without Notice 417

Mr. TOOTH: The people who are eligible under the community health service scheme are those aged and disabled persons who are finding difficulty in carrying on in their domestic situation. The purpose of the scheme is to ensure, as far as possible, that the elderly and disabled remain in the familiar surroundings of their own homes with their relatives and under the care of their own personal physicians.

The services that are provided include the assistance of a domiciliary nurse, or the health nurse services, the help of social workers in dealing with the type of problem that arises with elderly people in their association with their relatives and friends. Possibly the most important aspect of the work is what is known as the home help service, whereby arrangements can be made to assist people in their homes with domestic work and meals, and putting them in touch with th~ Meals on Wheels service.

The charges are minimal. In the case of social service pensioners it is 20c an hour, with a limit of $2 a week. If my memory serves me aright, in the case of non-social-service pensioners-others who are nevertheless in straitened circumstances-! think it works out at 50c an hour and $5 a week.

RURAL RECONSTRUCTION BOARD

Mr. TOMKINS: I desire to ask the hon. the Premier a question without notice. In view of the statement by the Federal Govern­ment dealing with the Bankruptcy Act, does this decision mean that moneys now held in the Farmers' Debt Adjustment Fund will become available for the use of a rural reconstruction board to be formed in Queensland?

Mr. BJELKE-PETERSEN: In reply to the hon. member, initially when this information came through per medium of the Press I did think that the legislation to be introduced in the Federal House would contain provisions to enable the setting up of a rural recon­struction board and the financing of debt adjustment. However, I received a letter from the Prime Minister yesterday setting out the terms of the proposed legislation. This made it quite clear that initially it was only intended to make provision for the finance held by the State, a sum of $1,500,000 to be utilised, and that at present there would be no funds from the Federal Government to assist in overcoming drought problems.

ARTIFICIAL INSEMINATION CENTRES

Mr. MURRA Y: I desire to ask the Minister for Primary Industries a question without notice. ,Before I ask the question, Mr. Speaker, may I personally congratulate you on the work you have done in bringing about this tremendous improvement.

Mr. SPEAKER: Order! 15

Mr. MURRAY: I desire to ask ,the Minister whether a decision has yet been made on aMowing the establishment of artificial breeding centres for cattle outside the direct control of his department. Is this matter still being considered?

Mr. ROW: The matter is still being considered.

POLICE RESIGNATIONS

Mr. BROMLEY: I direct a question with­out notice to the Minister in charge of the Police Force. I ask the Minister how many notices of resignation from members of the Police Force are presently before the Com­missioner and in the course of processing but not yet finalised.

Mr. SPEAKER: Order! I have already made reference to questions requiring statisti­cal information. However, I shall leave it to the Minister.

Mr. HODGES: As Mr. Speaker has said, it is very difficult to give statistical infor­mation "off the cuff", and I ask that the question be placed on the Business Paper.

DAIRY INDUSTRY RECONSTRUCTION SCHEME

Mr. IDNZE: I wish to direct a question without notice to the Minister for Lands. In view of the long drought in Queensland and the effect it is having on the dairying industry, and the fact that some States, particularly Western Australia and Victoria, have reached agreement with the Common­wealth Government on the dairy industry reconstruction scheme, is it proposed in the present session to introduce legislation to enable Queensland to participate ,in this scheme?

Mr. SULLIVAN: This question obviously emanates from one industry, namely, the dairy industry. The Government has accepted the scheme in principle, and tomorrow I shall be taking the dairy industry recon­struction scheme to the joint party meeting for approval. Queensland is one of the first States to accept the Commonwealth's offer of this scheme, and I hope soon to be in a position, perhaps on Thursday, to give notice of the pending legislation.

REPLICA OF "ENDEAVOUR"

Mr. JENSEN: My question without notice is directed to the Premier. Why does the Premier continue to say that the ship "Endea­vour" is not a replica of Captain Cook's ship when all news media state that it is?

Mr. BJELKE-PETERSEN: The hon. member is evidently determined to persist with this question. I can assure him that very careful inquiries have been made, and the information obtained by my officers is as I have outlined today and previously. I am quite sure that the hon. member realises and appreciates that fact.

418 Questions Without Notice (1 SEPTEMBER] Address in Reply

VAcuuM-OPERATED DooRs IN BusEs

Mr. HUGHES: I should like to ask the Minister for Transport a question without notice. Is the Minister aware of the com­ments of the coroner concerning the recent death of a woman bus passenger, to which I referred in my question of 5 August? In regard to the call for action on the provision of adequate safety in the operation of council buses, does the Minister consider this to be an urgent matter? What progress has been made in investigating the provision of safety measures, and what is the result so far?

Mr. KNOX: The papers relating to the coronial inquest have come before the Com­missioner for Transport, who has written to the Town Clerk bringing to his notice the recommendations and advice of the coroner.

ADDITIONAL HIGH ScHOOL, TOOWOOMBA

Mr. BOUSEN: I desire to ask the Minister for Education a question without notice. Regarding land at Toowoomba held by the Department of Education for a State high school, such land being situated on the Wilsonton Reserve and known as Rl174, County of Aubigny, Parish of Drayton, will he advise if any provision has been made for a State high school to be built during the current financial year? If not, when can it be expected that this high school will be built?

Mr. W. D. HEWnT having given notice of a question-

Mr. BOUSEN: I rise to a point of order. I asked the Minister for Education a question without notice. I still have not received a reply to it.

Mr. SPEAKER: Order! I am glad that the hon. member has drawn my attention to that fact. Once again I ask hon. members to remain quiet while a question is being asked. I cannot be expected to hear, neither can the Minister, if the House is disorderly when a question is being asked.

Mr. FLETCHER: I am sure that the hon. member for Toowoomba West will agree that that is the sort of question which should be put on notice.

Mr. BOUSEN: I rise to a further point of order. I desire to give notice of the question for tomorrow.

Mr. SPEAKER: Order! There is no need for the hon. member to make such a request. Once the Minister asks that it be put on notice, it is done automatically.

STATE SCHOOL SPORTS GRANT

Mr. F. P. MOORE: I direct the following question to the Minister for Education: As the present grant of $2,500 to the Queens­land Sports Council of State Schools is

divided between the primary association and the secondary association, and, in turn, the grant to the primary association is divided into ten $50 association grants and eighteen $30 zone grants and the grant to the second­ary association is divided in a similar manner, will the Minister consider increasing the grant substantially as sport is an integral part of education?

Mr. FLETCHER: It is a matter o-f budget­ing and Government policy. I am not able to give any sort o-f assurance in advance about how much anyone will receive.

At 12 noon, In accordance with the provzswns of

Standing Order No. 17, the House proceeded with Government business.

ADDRESS IN REPLY

RESUMPTION OF DEBATE-SIXTH ALLOTTED DAY

Debate resumed from 27 August (see p. 407) on Mr. Heatley's motion for the adoption of the Address in Reply, on which Mr. Houston had moved the following amendment:-

"Add to the Address the following words:-

'However, it is the opinion of .this Legislature that your advisers have, by their actions, shown themselves unworthy of the high office they now hold and, as a result, they no longer hold the confidence of •the people and: this House.

'For the following, and other,. reasons they show they are unworthy of their high offices:-

Acceptance by some MiniMers of a preferential share offer by Comalco; expressed satisfaction by the Premier of the CommonweaLth's tTeatment of Queensland at the last Loan Council and Premiers' Conference in the face of the fact that there is a ·grave need for more money for housing, d·evelop­ment of electrical power, watei" conser­vation, drought relief, flood mitigation, provision of adequate hospital and dental services, provision of more normal and special schools and kinder­gartens and modern ~eaching aids; their failure to bring industrial harmony to our State; their failure to take active !>teps to halt the sharply rising costs of living and exploitation of consumers; failure of Ministers to obtain for this State a just lfeturn for the State's natural resources and allowing exploita.tion and destruction of many of our natural assets, ·such as the Cooloola Sands Mass and surround­ing areas; their failure to curb rising co&ts and take practical steps to find payable markets for our primary products; their failure to take effective steps to stop poLlution of our air, water and land; their failure to

Address in Reply [1 SEPTEMBER] Address in Reply 419

resolve the question of freight dis­crepancies throughout the State and to implement a system of encouraging decentralised development; failure of your advisers to provide security for alL Aborigines and Torres Strait hlanders and to recognise them as fellow Queenslanders; their failure to deal with the intolerable sHuation which has developed within ~~he Police Force under their administration; their failure to conduct a full public inquiry to allay public disquiet over the operations of the T.A.B. and its investments; failure to legislate to give long service •leave conditions to all workers in industry, irrespective of their employer or calling'."

Mr. NEWBERY (Mirani) (12.1 p.m.): First of all, I should like to reaffirm my allegiance and that of the residents of the electorate of Mirani to Her Most Gracious Majesty, Queen EEzabeth II,. and in doing so I should like to record how pleased the people of the Mackay district were to have her visit the area, with ·the Duke of Edinburgh and Princess Anne, during the Royal tour. I feel that this Royal tour was definitely the best ever in Australia. It proved the great following the Monarchy has throughout this country.

I should like also •to congratulate His Excellency the Governor on his Opening Speech, and to take .the opportunity of thanking His Excellency and Lady Mansfield for the very fine manner in which they are carrying out their duties to the State.

I also congratulate the mover of rthe Address in Reply, the hon. member for Albert, and the seconder thereof, the hon. member for Burdekin, on the fine contribu­tions they made to ~his debate.

At this stage, I offer my sympathy to the Premier in the loss of his mother and to the relatives of Mr. Bill: Johnson, the late Clerk of this Parliament. I think that Mr. Johnson did a tremendous job in the short time he occupied that position.

Before proceeding further, I should like to congratulate our Ministers on the way in which they •took up the challenge and answered questions without notice. I do not wish to single out any of them as I am sure all will agree that <the answers to questions without notice were very ably handled.

I should like to mention many subjects in this debate today--railways, irrigation, hospitals, the sugar industry, strikes, and so on. However, in the short time available to me I will confine my remarks to the Blue Nursing Service, hospitals, and new railways suoh as Goonyella, and will possibly make some mention of the Eton irrigation and water scheme and the export of meat.

Firstly, I shall deal with the very important matter of the Blue Nursing organisation in Queensland.

Mr. Hughes: A very fine organisation.

Mr. NEWBERY: I feel, as does rthe hon. member, that this is a very fine organisation. I am qualified to speak on this subject because I have seen the way in which Blue Nurses operate. They have in Sarina a sub-centre of the Mackay Centre and the people at that sub-centre are doing a tremendous job.

Mr. Davies: Are you not ashamed of your Government?

Mr. NEWBERY: I would not say that, but I will develop my argument for extra assistance.

As I have mentioned, the Blue Nursing Service does excellent work and assists the sick in health and mind. As hon. members know, this service is more or less divided into two branches: one covering intensive care in hospitals for the chronically m and the other giving domiciliary nursing in places such as Sarina and Mackay. Between Coolangatta and Cairns five intensive-care or geriatric hospitals treat approximately 300 patients. In the domiciliary nursing section, 19 full centres and 6 sub-centres opemte. In the Mackay area a full centr,e has been established in the town of Mackay with a sub-centre in Sarina.

I am concerned about the ever-increasing costs that the Blue Nursing Service has to meet. Several months ago wage increases were granted to nurses. I have no objection to those increases. I have a daughter who is a nurse, and I have always believed that nurses are the lowest-paid employees in the State. However, their wages have been increased to somewhere near their correct level. The salary of a trained nurse in her first year has been increased by approxi­mately $12 from $41.14 to $53 a week, retro­spective to 8 June.

For each full-time nurse employed the Blue Nursing Service is paid a subsidy, but it receives no subsidy for part-time nurses. The wage for a part-time nurse has been increased from $1.18 to $1.52 an hour. To the Sarina sub-centre, of which I am a committee member, this means an increase in nursing costs alone of $1,000. In a small centre like Sarina that is a great amount of money. That increased cost, together with the loss of the State subsidy of $1.50 a bed a day, or $10.50 a week, will be disastrous to the Blue Nursing Service if it cannot be given some relief.

For example, for the next 12 months the Nazarene hospital at Redcliffe expects to have a deficit of $31,000 brought about by the loss of the State subsidy. In addition, it has a capital debt of $120,000, and it is very difficult for that centre to carry on.

In January, 1969, the Commonwealth Government, realising that its subsidy was far too low, increased it from $2 a bed a day to $5 a bed a day; but I must point out that that subsidy is paid only when intensive care is given to hospital patients.

420 Address in Reply (1 SEPTEMBER] Address in Reply

To become entitled to the subsidy the Blue Nursing Service must render over six hours' nursing each week to a patient.

By the end of 1969 the very contentious matter of the withdrawing of the State subsidy, or maintenance subsidy, of $1.50 a bed a day arose. I have often wondered why the Government withdrew that subsidy. I believe it was because the Government claimed that the payment of the subsidy was no longer necessary in view of the increased Commonwealth subsidy of $5 a day. To me my Government adopted a short-sighted policy. Although it is my Government, I am not prevented from criticising the action that it took. It is evident that an investigation was not made before action was taken to withdraw the subsidy of $1.50 per bed per day.

The Nazarene hospital, the latest built by the Blue Nursing Service, was opened on 16 October, 1969. From investigations I made I understand that the Blue Nursing Service was more or less led to believe that the daily $1.50 bed subsidy would not be withdrawn or terminated, yet, in January, 1970, only three months after the completion of this beautiful hospital, it was withdrawn.

Mr. Houghton: They have been let down.

Mr. NEWBERY: They have been let down badly. Although I am a member of this Government, I do not feel that I am restricted in levelling this criticism.

A deficit of $8,000 in the funds of the Nazarene hospital has resulted from the cessation of subsidy payments. I come from the country and I realise what the Blue Nursing Service is doing. It should not be thought that only aged people are being looked after; service is provided for the middle-aged and younger people.

Thanks to this service people can remain in their homes and be relieved of great anxiety and suffering. Above all, the State is saved tremendous costs because these people stay in their own homes instead of entering public hospitals. I am led to believe that if patients attended to by the Blue Nursing Service were to go to hospital, the cost to the Government would be $13.50 a day, whereas the cost now is nil, apart from subsidy payments.

As a country man I am most interested in the domiciliary nursing provided by 19 centres, which do a tremendous job in attend­ing to the sick and lonely. Many country people who are old or sick are more or less confined to their homes. Visits by these nurses once a day, or three or four times a week, help tremendously in relieving their loneliness as well as providing treatment for their ailments.

The annual report of the Blue Nursing Service discloses some interesting statistics. Over the last 12 months 400,000 visits were made to sick people. That is a large number

of visits to people who otherwise would be in the public hospitals that are already fairly overcrowded.

Mr. Davies: What is the use of your boost­ing them when the Government is doing everything to knock them?

Mr. NEWBERY: I do not say that the Government is doing everything to knock them. It is making subsidies available, but I am seeking an increase in them.

The 400,000 visits entailed travel of more than 800,000 miles. That is no mean mile­age. As time passes, and the Blue Nursing Service is extended, as I am sure it will be, I have no doubt that the Government will heed my pleas and, after investigating these matters closely, will make an announce­ment in the Budget. That is why I am pleading today on behalf of the Blue Nurs­ing Service for some relief or the reinstate­ment of the $1.50 subsidy.

In 1970-71 the increased salar.ies and wages for nurses will amount <to $106,000. That is a Jot of money. I have estima:ted that this will ·take almost all of the con­tribut:ions to the Door Knock Appeal, which I understand has been held in some parts of the State already and will he held in the Mackay area in the near future.

The organisation must get increased assist­ance to enable it to carry on hospital care and the domiciliary nursing service.

Mr. Bennett interjected.

Mr. NEWBERY: If the hon. member would be quiet, the Government might hear what I am saying. He is trying to "knock" my plea. I .request the Government to increase the State subsidy from $1,100 to $1,500 for a full-time nurse. The salary for a full-time nurse is $2,760. At the moment the Commonwealth Government subsidy is $1,100 for full-time nmses, and if the State Government increased its subsidy for nurses I would expect the Commonwealth Government to follow suit and match our $1,500.

One might say that a subsidy of $1,500 from each Government would give a total of $3,000, compared with the salary of $2,760 for the nurse, but wages of nurses are not the only item of expenditure in an organisation such as this. Possibly the costs are double that amount. There are many other factors involved, including the cost of running and repairing the cars. There are many, many other calls on the funds of the Blue Nursing Service.

The members of the Blue Nursing Service are playing an important role in caring for the sick and aged of our State. They have a personal interest in them, and ·a sense of compassion for them. I appeal to the Treasurer and the Minister for Health to give very serious consideration to increased aid for the Blue Nursing Service in Queens­land.

Address in Reply [1 SEPTEMBER] Address in Reply 421

I now wish to speak about the Mackay Base Hospital. The hon. member for Maclmy will no doubt say, "What has that to do with you?", but I feel that the Mackay Base Hospital possibly has more to do with me than it ha:s with him because Mackay is the centre for my electorate, and in the Mackay Base Hospital there are possibly just as many people from my electorate as there are from the hon. member's elector­ate. At least I am taking a responsible action in t:his regard.

Since becoming a member of this House in 1965 I have interested myself greatly in the Mackay Base Hospital, and on one occasion I arranged for a visit by the Premier so that I could point out the problems at this hospital and urge him to expedite the construction of the new extension. Following the Premier's visit and the visit of the Australian Labour Party's Health Committee we have heard a lot from the Opposition about the shortcomings of that hospital. I wonder what the report would have been like had the same com­mittee visited this hospital in 1957.

. We find s~ortcomings everywhere, and it 1s always Wise to look fo·r the cause in order to avoid repetition. This was not done until 1958, and it has not been a simple matter to correct the shortcomings that developed over many years prior to 1957.

It was not possible to pour millions of pounds immediately into the Mackay Base f!'o~pital to put matters right, and no doubt s1m!lar problems existed at country and provincial public hospitals throughout the State. The most urgent needs at the most neglected hospitals had to be given first preference, of course, and, as the needs were many and great, nothing on a grand scale could be done at any specific centre. There was a need firs! to attack the emergencies, and gradually mtroduce the big schemes. This is now evident throughout the whole State, but it has taken a long time and a lot of money to do what has been done. Mackay has shared, of course, in this move­ment, and has now entered the "grand­scheme" period.

It is worthy of mention that Mackay has been very well catered for with private hospitals. In particular, the Mater Hospital authorities in Mackay have done a mag­nificent job in providing splendid private hospital facilities, and they are, I feel, due for great praise. In making that statement I am sure I would have the support of the hon. member for Mackay. The buildings and facilities of the Mater Hospital leave nothing to be desired. What effect this has had on the development of the base hospital, I am not aware; there may have been an influence.

The Mackay Base Hospital has developed, but more or less on an emergency basis. About three years ago the grand scheme came under consideration; the emergency

scheme had played its part quite well but could not be allowed to go any further. The planning of the big scheme has not been simple, as an unusually large number of factors had to be taken into account. The proximity of the existing hospital to the Pioneer River, in which flooding is frequent and becoming more damaging, had close investigation, as did the need to use comparatively new sections of the hospital in order to get value for money spent and the need to gauge to what extent a new hospital complex would be used in com­petition with an already-existing, efficient private hospital system. The development that could take place in the Mackay region, and many other economic and service features, had to be considered.

The first definite move for a big project came under serious and definite considera­tion about three years ago. Prior to that there had been tentative moves for such a project. What will be the result of the past three years of investigation and planning, I am not certain, but I believe that it will be a scheme of which we will all be proud, and one which over the years of building will provide for the present and for many years in the future. No doubt the planning will be for a multi-storey hospital, gradually centralised to avoid the sprawl of buildings which is so evident today.

However, in case hon. members may be led into believing that the Mackay Base Hospital has been neglected since 1957, and to give the House some idea of the money that has been spent there since that date on major projects, I shall mention some of them. The new Ward F is almost fault­less. It is mainly a surgical ward, one end being for females and the other for males. It is known far and wide as a beautiful ward, and it is conducted very efficiently. I might say in passing that both the Premier and Mrs. Bjelke-Petersen were delighted with what they saw in this ward, and passed favourable comment on it. It was built in 1960 at a cost of $144,390.

Ward A is the women's ward, and it was remodelled in 1967 at a cost of $52,682. We have heard that it has faults in that it has a wide veranda with beds on it. It is true that there are some beds on the veranda. The veranda is well sheltered and the beds are used at times, but my information is that the patients do not object to being moved to the veranda. In fact, they rather prefer being on the veranda to being inside. That, of course, is nothing unusual in hospitals; patients like to be in the open and in the sun.

The kitchen block was remodelled, and is splendidly kept. It is efficiently equipped, and always appears to be neat, tidy and clean. I have never heard any complaints about the kitchen. This work was carried out in 1964 at a cost of $40,320.

422 Address in Reply [1 SEPTEMBER] Address in Reply

The laundry is another new project. It was built in 1963, and cost $78,312. I do not suggest that there cannot be any working improvements in the unit. I believe that fans are to be installed-they certainly are needed-and that discussions are currently being held relative to the provision of a separate working unit for soiled linen. It is very important that such a unit be pro­vided, and for some considerable time I have directed my endeavours to that end. I under­stand that money for its purchase is now available, and I hope that a unit for soiled linen will be installed at a very early date. The heavy work of pushing trolleys about and opening and closing washing machine doors in the laundry is work for a man, yet one sees middle-aged and elderly women endeavouring to do it.

The out-patients department is compara­tively new, being built in 1964 at a cost of $18,679. I know it is realised now that more consulting rooms are needed in that department, and they are to be provided.

The skin therapy department is new. It was built in 1969 at a cost of $8,500. The unit in that department was supplied by the Cancer Trust and is, I believe, meeting an urgent need. The unit cost $6,562 and the subsidy made available by the Cancer Trust was $6,000.

Total expenditure at the Mackay Base Hospital since 1957 has been a little under $500,000, and in addition a hospital has been constructed at Sarina at a cost of $114,000. Information has now been received of approvals for new work to the extent of $2,000,000 at the Mackay Base Hospital, and no doubt that important announcement will be welcomed throughout the Mackay region. I should like to give hon. members informa­tion about the work that is to take place.

Approval has been granted for an exten­sive rebuilding programme at the Mackay Base Hospital.

Mr. Bennett: That is because of Eddie Casey's efforts.

Mr. NEWBERY: The hon. member for Mackay came into the matter very late. He has been in it for only a little over 12 months. This programme was drawn up three years ago.

In stage I, approval has been given for the inclusion of a new maternity ward of 20 beds, a new operating-theatre block pro­viding two theatres, and the provision of a new residence for the medical superintendent.

Stage II provides for a new multi-storey ward block to provide approximately 80 beds and other necessary ancillary services to replace Wards B, C, and D, and also for an extension to the new ward block to connect with the existing out-patients department.

Approval was also granted for preparation of sketch plans for stage I. These plans have been received and are being considered

by the department. Cost of the total rebuild­ing programme will be in the vicinity of $2,000,000.

In regard to improvements to nursing staff quarters at the Mackay Base Hospital, approval was granted on 18 August, 1970, for preparation of sketch plans and estimate of cost for the following:-

!. Installation of fluorescent lights in all bedrooms in the new section;

2. Provision of power points in all bed­rooms in the old section;

3. Provision of access to the laundry from the old section. Mr. Bennett interjected.

Mr. NEWBERY: The hon. member for Mackay probably sent the hon. member a message.

Remodelling deputy matron's fiat: approval was granted on 11 August, 1970, for preparation of a sketch plan and estimate of cost of remodelling the deputy matron's fiat.

Remodelling of toilet facilities, nurses' quarters: approval has been granted for preparation of a sketch plan and estimate of cost for the remodelling of toilet facilities in the older section of the nursing staff quarters.

I believe that Wards B and D are out of use. They are very solid but very old, and difficult and costly to maintain. How­ever they are serving a good pu11pose and the old folk are using them are rather more charitable than is the hon. member for Mackay, who, a few weeks ago, had some unpleasant things to say, particularly about Ward B. I know these wards leave much to be desired, but I think it was unfair of the hon. member for Mackay to attack the staff there. I read that he has been invited by a wardsman to learn the truth about the failure, as he said, to have the floor scrubbed for six months.

Mr. Casey: Are you quoting from a news­paper, or from "Hansard"?

Mr. NEWBERY: A mildew fungus grows rapidly on paint work in parts of our region, and, unless they are frequently washed down or repainted, walls and ceilings quickly become dirty looking and give the appearance of neglect. Wards B and D on the river bank are difficult to keep clean. Only more manpower, of course, can correct this.

I heard an interjection from my right, and I should like to ask the hon. member for Mackay if he has ever had the decency to call on the Mackay Hospitals Board to dis­cuss these matters.

Mr. Casey: Is that a question without notice?

Mr. NEWBERY: He obviously has not called on the Mackay board.

The maternity ward is the one most urgently in need of demolition or renovation. Nobody is happy about it, but it is already being, or has already been, made more

Address in Reply [1 SEPTEMBER] Address in Reply 423

habitable. Under the new scheme a maternity ward takes precedence, and, I feel, rightly so.

The only fault with the operating theatre is its remoteness from the surgical ward. This has been corrected in the new complex.

Nobody denies the fact that the medical staff is overworked. Of course, this is not peculiar to Mackay. Only in recent months has the Mackay Base Hospital been what might be termed fully staffed, yet the hours of work are terrific, particularly when a doctor takes annual leave. What the solution is, I do not know. The fault must be higher up as it is common throughout much of Australia and, in fact, the world.

Similar remarks may be applied to the nursing staff. The best we can hope for is that the Health Department and the various hospital boards do the utmost within their power to meet the needs and wishes of both medical and nursing staffs, who are very devoted people. I feel that with these approvals the complaints of my colleague from Mackay will be met, and I look forward to great benefit from the new complex at the Mackay Base Hospital.

The next subject on which I should like to touch is the Goonyella project. I feel I am qualified to say something about this because it is right in the middle of my electorate. I can clearly remember the outcry from the Opposition benches when the relevant Bill was being debated here. It was said that this would mean nothing to Mackay, that it would do nothing for employment in Mackay, that it was worth only half a tomato. This is completely untrue. The hon. member for Mackay would know the tremendous benefits it is bringing to the Mackay area.

We all know, because it has been fre­quently published, that Utah is to spend approximately $150,000,000 in the Mackay area. The railway, which is well advanced will account for $36,000,000, the port fo; $16,000,000 and the Eungella pipeline, to take water from Eungella to the area, $6,000,000. The balance, of course, is for mine works and the township.

This will give a tremendous uplift to the Mackay area. It has increased business throughout the district tremendously, and I feel that not only in Mackay but also in Sarina, Walkerston, Nebo and no doubt right up the valley, everyone is benefiting exten­sively. This, in turn, is of benefit to the State and the nation generally.

Dealing now with engineering supplies, it was contended that in engineering, this pro­ject would mean nothing to Mackay. I can assure hon. members that the engineerin_g firms in Mackay receive tremendous benefit from it. When any particular job has to be done, the engineering firms in Mackay are consulted first. In spite of what has been said by members of the Opposition, unemployment in Mackay is at its lowest level. More jobs are available than there are workers to fill them.

Mr. Newton: That is only because of the sugar season.

Mr. NEWBERY: That is a lot of rot. Just listen to what I have to say; I will tell the hon. member why it is.

Mr. Casey: Tell us who is going to be the harbour board?

Mr. NEWBERY: For the hon. member's ears I point out that 1,900 people are employed on the line. Possibly the hon. member said that this did nothing towards relieving unemployment in Mackay.

Mr. CASEY: I rise to a point of order. I take offence at the hon. member's com­ments. I desire to know if he is quoting from a speech I have made or my comments. His remark is untruthful, and I desire him to withdraw it.

Mr. NEWBERY: What is the untruthful remark?

Mr. DEPUTY SPEAKER (Mr. Houghton): Order! The hon. member for Mirani is said to have made a remark that is objectionable to the hon. member for Mackay.

Mr. NEWBERY: I am quoting from "Hansard" and the Press. If it is objection­able, I withdraw it.

Mr. CASEY: I did not say it. It is not there.

Mr. NEWBERY: The position is that 1,900 men are working on the line. It is not the sugar industry that is relieving unemployment.

Mr. TUCKER: I rise to a point of order. The hon. member for Mackay has said that the remark made by the hon. member for Mirani was offensive to him and asked that it be withdrawn. I have not heard it with­drawn.

Mr. NEWBERY: I said I would withdraw it.

Mr. TUCKER: I say the remark was offensive to the hon. member for Mackay, and there is only one proc·edure to be followed.

Mr. DEPUTY SPEAKER (Mr. Houghton): Order! The hon. member for Mirani has said that he quoted from "Hansard".

Mr. CASEY: I rise to a further point of order. I ask the hon. member what "Han­sard" issue he is quoting from. I have not made any speech in this House about Goon­yella or the project.

Mr. NEWBERY: I did say that if the remark was offensive to the hon. member I would withdraw it.

424 Address in Reply [1 SEPTEMBER] Address in Reply

The average wage paid to each of the 1,900 employees to whom I referred is $125 a week. This is what the Labour Party tries to "knock". I challenge members of the Opposition to talk to those men and find out what they think the Australian Labour Party has done for them. At present the contractors are paying the men working on the line wages amounting to $250,000 a week. Of course, the A.L.P. opposed the agreement and it tries to "knock" and criticise the project.

Mr. HOUSTON: I rise to a point of order. The hon. member for Mirani is telling delib­erate untruths. At no stage did the Labour Party oppose the agreement. It opposed the lousy 5c a ton that the State is getting for the coal.

Mr. NEWBERY: Anyone can ask the workers and other people in the Mackay region what they think the Government has done for them. I can assure hon. members that they do not think much of the A.L.P.'s attitude to the project. The workers are earni_n15 good money and enjoying good condll!ons. The new town of Moranbah is building up very quickly. Ninety houses are under construction there at the moment, and by the end of April next another 90 will be completed. Of a total of 435 houses half will be built by the Queensland H~using Commission and half by Utah. The town of Moranbah is well designed and will provide sewerage and all the other amenities that people desire. A beautiful hotel-motel has been designed for the town. The town plan possesses all the necessary features to make Moranbah a pleasant town to live in.

(Time expired.)

Mr. WALLIS-SMITH (Tablelands) (12.40 p.m.): I support the amendment to the motion for the adoption of the Address in Reply which was so ably moved by my leader and seconded by the hon. member for Nudgee. The amendment emphasises that the Premier expressed satisfaction with the treatment meted out to Queensland at the last Loan Council meetina and the Premiers' Conference. That is ~mderstand­able, because he was not prepared to fight for Queensland's rights. Yet every hon. member knows full well that when we seek additional services, or the maintenance of existing services, 90 per cent. of answers contain the words, "When funds are avail­able", or, "Owing to inadequate funds ... " We must exert constant pressure for more finance at Loan Council meetings and Premiers' Conferences. By expressing satis­faction after attending these meetings, the Premier was really saying, "We will carry on. and the people of Queensland must be prepared to bear the brunt of our inadequate bargaining at these meetings.''

The list of the Government's shortcomings cited by the Leader of the Opposition in his amendment is quite lengthy, but he could

have extended it considerably. I will deal with some of the shortcomings to which he referred. The first, which is continually hitting the headlines in the Press, relates to lack of water conservation throughout Queensland. To emphasise the lack of planning throughout the Commonwealth relative to this matter, I have here a report which indicates that, in 1965, the tentative estimate of the discharge of all Australian rivers amounted to some 280,000,000 acre­feet. But in 1949 the Nimmo Report cited a figure which was 80,000,000 acre-feet less. The gap between those two figures is dramatic, and exposes the hit-and-run methods adopted in planning, research and investigation. On numerous occasions I have urged an investigation into Queens­land's river systems. I have even asked the Minister in charge of irrigation and water supply to undertake an investigation of river sands. Many of Queensland's rivers, particularly those in the North, are rivers of sand for 80 per cent. of the year, yet this investigation has not been deemed necessary. Some rivers have 80 feet of sand impregnated with water, not subject to evaporation, there for the taking, yet we do not know how much is there. That is another example of a total lack of planning and research.

Mr. Tucker: The Burdekin is a perfect example.

Mr. WALLIS-SMITH: As my deputy le3der has said, the Burdekin is a perfect example.

In 1966 all local authorities attending a conference said, "We support the Burdekin scheme in all its stages." But what happened? Only this morning the member for Burdekin received an answer to a question about a town that is dying, and I have here an article headed, "Water needed, or a town dies", which states-

"For residents of the small North Queensland 'farming community of Giru, water is a commodity more precious than gold.''

That emphasises my statement that there has been a complete lack of planning.

Mr. Tucker: Cane farmers are walking off their land.

Mr. W ALLIS-SMITH: That is so, and it has a snowballing effect. A reduction in country population increases the flow of residents to the cities. How can anyone be expected to live in an area that depends for its water on two bores? They were the source of supply for a long time, but suddenly the flow ceased. There has been no planning, but now the residents are told, "You have the choice of a $125,000 pipe­line, or we will cart water to you at a cost of $1,000 a month.'' This is going back almost to the horse-and-buggy days. The people are told that they have their choice but will have to pay for it whichever

Address in Reply (1 SEPTEMBER] Address in Reply 425

way it goes. Rather than live in areas such as this, these people prefer to sell out and go to other areas where there are more amenities, where they do not have such a complicated way of living and where there is less insecurity in the funda­mental things of life.

Mr. Tucker: Every election-time the Gov­ernment makes promises.

Mr. WALLIS-SMITH: This is the lip service that we are so used to and that we have been hearing for so long. But it is water service that these people want, not lip service from the Government.

Here in Queensland, of the 280,000,000-odd acre-feet referred to, which compares so poorly with the rest of the world, two­thirds occurs in the high rainfall area north of the Tropic of Capricorn, the very area tu which I am referring. We have all this water running away in a reliable rainfall area, and not one attempt has been made to conserve it or even to plan for its use should there be any failure of underground water. This is another type of research that should be undertaken. Underground supplies are known to exist all over Queens­land, from the artesian basin to other sub­terranean waters that have been found. Wherever people have bored for oil or made other investigations, water has been found. This has often been one way of paying a cype of dividend in the search for minerals or for oil, that is, that water is produced.

While I am talking on this subject, a most unusual ~ituation affects my own electorate. I refer to the Karumba water supply. Many vears ago, during drilling operations for minerals in the area, a huge concentra­tion of fluoride and sulphur and other chemicals which pollute water to the extent that it is unusable was found. When Craig Mostyn Pty. Ltd. established the processing base at Karumba and bought the lodge from Ansett, they required a water supply. I asked a question dealing with this matter on 29 July, and was told that up to the present time the Government had spent $153,796 on the Karumba water f'llpply.

The second part of the answer reads-"No process has been discovered to

make the water suitable for general use except desalination, which is an expensive process."

The third part of the answer is-"(a) Water is used for showers,

ablutions and general use such as garden­ing. It is definitely not suitable for drinking.

(b) Consumption over the last nine months exceeded 1 million gallons. Daily output is variable."

Here again is an example of very ill-advised spending of public money. I ask the Minister to look closely at the Karumba situation. and at the questions that I asked. I asked if the Government would consider installing a

desalination plant at Karumba and I was told that it would not because it would be too expensive.

The Government has now found that the $153,796 has gone down the drain-"down the bore", one might as well say-and the people at Karumba are still without a suitable and usable water supply.

Mr. Murray: If you ask a question without notice you might now get the answer "Yes".

Mr. W ALLIS-SMITH: If I asked a question without notice I do not think it would have any further effect. Questions and answers mean nothing to me. What I want is for the people of Karumba to have a water supply that can be used and that is adequate.

I always prefix my talks on water by using the word "adequate". I do this because in many towns in Queensland-and all hon. members know what I am referring to-there is the unfortunate and unpleasant happening that water meters are being installed. Water meters are very unsightly, particularly on properties where the lawns are well kept. The councils say they are necessary to reduce the consumption of water.

As I said in my opening remarks, the area north of the Tropic of Capricorn receives more rainfall than any other part of the Commonwealth, yet people in that northern area are subjected to the installa­tion of water meters. They are unnecessary, and are a constant irritation.

Every council is at some time held to ransom by its decision to introduce water meters. Even in the town of Normanton, which has an abundant supply of water from the Norman River, backed up by a huge retaining wall, water meters are being installed. Whoever heard of anything more ridiculous! Council officers have told me that the installation of water meters will reduce water consumption. How many people would like to live in Normanton during the summer months and have to contend with water meters whilst trving to grow a few vegetables and a little g~een grass to ease the harsh and almost unbear­able conditions that sometimes exist there? Even at the present time temperatures at Normanton are in the 90's.

When water meters are installed, surely councils will give consideration to factors such as geo~raphical situation, temperature and evaporation rate, and so allow double or trehle the water usage permitted in cities ?uch as Brisbane or Toowoomba. The people m northern centres such as Normanton would then have sufficient water to make their Jives bearable.

I have referred to gardens and lawns. Their provision and care constitutes part of a civic pride that we all talk about. But once again, as the hon. member for Townsville North has already said all we do is talk about it. Let us do more than that; .Jet u~ try to make it a reality. Constant mvest1gatwn and planning of

426 Address in Reply [1 SEPTEMBER] Address in Reply

,improved water supplies may ,require more staff and much greater el'penditure. I said at the outset that the Premier expressed satisfaction with the amount of money received from the Commonwealth Govern­ment. Queensland needs more money for water conservation, and more staff engaged in this work. Many more jobs will be created. The conserving of water is a means of declaring war on nature, and, if we have sufficient staff and funds, we have a chance of winning that war. If it is won, not only those in the North but all Aus­tralians as well will benefit.

Almost all members representing outback areas have spoken about the drought. There is a drought every year in some part of Queensland, and the only means of over­coming it is by the provision of water and fodder. Queensland can provide both. This State is ideally situated, and in years to come an adequate supply of water and fodder will probably be a reality. Why not start now by doing something towards that end? The Minister in charge of the Irrigation and Water Supply Commission may say that there are now in use many stream gauges that were not being used previously. I admit that quite a lot has been done to improve water supplies. Only a month ago Croydon, a small outback town, received a reticulated water supply. That is excellent, and I hope I can guard the people of Croydon against the intro­duction of water meters. There are not many people in the town, and the cost would be exorbitant.

Although advances are being made in this sphere, much still remains to be done. Finance is needed to enable research and investigation to be carried out and to ensure that mistakes made in the past are not repeated, I know that a very close watch is being kept on the water supply at Emerald, which is the focal point of irrigation in Queensland at present. An article in the Brisbane "Telegraph" of 4 August this year, under the heading "Stringent watch on dwind­ling water", said-

"A stringent watch is being kept this week over Emerald's dwindling water sup­plies in a bid to conserve them until more rain falls."

I know that the problem will be overcome when the Fairbairn Dam, which is being built close to Emerald, is completed, but not all towns can afford to wait for the construction of a major dam. Many inland towns, for example, would cease to exist if they had to wait for a dam such as that. Therefore, research and investigation must continue so that the planning of water supplies can pro­ceed without undue strain being imposed on the finances of the State.

The next item on which I propose to touch is the reference in the amendment moved by the Leader of the Opposition to the failure

of the Government to give security to Abor­Jgmes and treat them as fellow Queens­landers. That statement is correct, and I speak with a certain amount of knowledge and authority on behalf of the Aborigines.

Four or five months ago the Department of Education took over the responsibility of educating Aborigines, but the Minister is not prepared to appoint teachers till next year. Has any other hon. member a school in his electorate attended by 140 children at which there is one teacher? The Minister says that the remainder of the teachers will not be appointed till next year. The answer to my question is "No", because hon. members would be rising in this House every day and complaining if that were the case. So I say, "Are these fellow Queenslanders, or are they second-class Queenslanders?" I leave it to hon. members to answer that question truth­fully. In "The Cairns Post" of today's date there is a photograph of the hon. member for Mulgrave and the hon. member for Callide at a ball at Y arrabah. It looks very nice, but again it is only lip-service, not the service that these people want. If the Gov­ernment is to take over the education of the Aborigines, it should treat them as people and not make them wait for six, eight or 10 months in this outback area.

Mr. R. E. Moore: You don't know what you are talking about. I was up there recently, and you haven't got a clue.

Mr. WALLIS-SMITH: I have heard so many stories about the hon. member for Windsor when he sailed on the "Melbidir" that it would take the remainder of my time to relate them to the House. However, that would not assist the people to whom I am referring. The hon. member has never been to Mitchell River or Edward River, has he?

Mr. R. E. Moore: I have been to Yarrabah, and you are talking about Yarrabah.

Mr. W ALLIS-SMITH: People visit a place and are shown certain things. But when one goes to a place for a fortnight, lives with the people and walks round and sees what happens, as one does in one's own electorate, one knows what happens.

The health of the Aborigines is also very important. The Department has provided the services of a health officer to cover the whole of Queensland.

[Sitting suspended from 1 to 2.15 p.m.]

Mr. W ALLIS-SMITH: Prior to the luncheon recess I was developing a theme relative to the Aborigines of Queensland and the activities of the Government in bringing their health and education facilities into line with those of the rest of the State. I had just mentioned that the Government had appointed a health officer to cover the whole of Queensland. This, in itself, is very good, but I question whether one person is sufficient for the whole of Queensland. I think it is out of all reason to expect him

Address in Reply [1 SEPTEMBER) Address in Reply 427

to perform such a task, and I can see no reason why an officer should not be appointed for the areas in which Aborigines live so that he could specifically look after their requirements.

I think the time is overdue when these localities should be formed into a type of local authority with their own representatives, their own health inspectors and their own rules. This could be brought about over a transitional period during which they might become aware of the necessity to look at their community as a whole and improve it, to see that the roads in it are made or improved and to establish a certain degree of civic mindedness in the population. If this were done, I should imagine that within five years an Aborigine could represent such an area on a local authority.

Mr. Hughes: You could be charged with segregation.

Mr. W ALLIS-SMITH: I think the hon. member should look up the meaning of the word "segregation".

I think the time is overdue for greatly improving conditions relative to health in these areas. I refer particularly to the new homes that have been built there, with concrete-slab floors, sheeting walls and no protection whatever against the insects that invade northern areas in particular in the wet season.

Only recently I was at Mitchell River and found that one of the residents there, who was a carpenter working with departmental carpenters attached to this community, was able to carry out the screening of his own home. With whatever knowledge I have of carpentry, I examined the work as minutely as I could, and I would say it was an expert job. This is the second time I have brought this matter to notice, and I hope my representations to the present Minister get better results than those I made to his predecessor. All of these homes need to be protected by screens.

Every staff house is screened, from the doors to the smallest window, and if that is good enough for the staff, who are Queens­landers, then it should be good enough for the Aborigines, who are Queenslanders also. Let us give them this facility. They can no longer lie alongside their fires, as they did in early days, to offset the attacks of mosquitoes and other insects. The homes that are being built for them should be suitably screened against insects. That is all I intend to say about Aborigines.

The next item I wish to bring forward is a very important one and concerns the Minister for Transport. It relates to road safety in Queensland. I preface my remarks by referring to the Minister's answers to two questions asked by the hon. member for Sandgate. On being asked what effect, if any, would the disbanding of the Australian Road Safety Council have on the Queensland Road Safety Council, he replied that it would

not have any effect. Today he was asked, "What part does research now play in the Queensland Road Safety Council's activities?", to which he replied, "None, The functions of the council are purely educational." So let us stick to the educa­tional side of road safety in Queensland, and let us start with the roads on which we are required to travel.

The greater number of accidents on country roads compared with those on city roads is due to the structure of the country roads. They are very narrow, extend for long distances, break away at the edges, and are pitted with pot-holes that increase in size under heavy traffic and in wet climates. I would suggest that pot-holes cause many accidents. However, in addition to those dangers, others are created by the people who construct and maintain the roads.

The August, 1970, issue of "The Road Ahead", which is the journal of the R.A.C.Q., has a huge headline "Danger" on the outside, and inside, under the head­ing 'The hazard makers" it has a number of photographs of dangers that are created by those who construct and repair roads. Of course, those dangers are not created intentionally, but no check is made of warning signs to determine whether or not they will be effective. One photograph shows a sign that says "Workmen ahead", but although a motorist would be distracted by it he could not possibly read what is on the sign. Another photograph shows a warning sign erected only 10 feet from an obstruction. Another shows a load of gravel without any warning sign erected near it. These hazards are created by the people who are constructing and main­taining our roads, and the R.A.C.Q. saw fit to publicise the matter in an endeavour to have this dangerous situation corrected.

Many traffic accidents arise from the violation of the simple laws of nature. The Jaws of motion and energy affect both the motor vehicle and the driver. It is necessary to tackle the problem at the very base so that the statistics of persons killed and injured can be reduced. Nature's laws are constant and automatic, and the failure to observe them carries a swift and severe penalty. These laws have such an important effect on driving that it is impossible to drive and walk in traffic intelligently without understanding them. How many times do we see country people who are not used to crossing roads at intersections stranded half way across a busy city street, not knowing which way to go, and causing concern to themselves and to motorists?

No one person has the right to infringe upon or in any way destroy another person's freedom of the road. In other words, all of us are entitled to use the road and enjoy the freedom of the road, provided we carry out the rules.

428 Address in Reply [1 SEPTEMBER} Address in Reply

The other day someone said that road users need a dose of DDT. That does not stand for the chemical, but for "Definite Driver Training".

Mr. Dean: Instead of alcohol.

Mr. W ALLIS-SMITH: I agree with the hon. member for Sandgate.

Stronger efforts should be made to make road users aware of correct traffic pro­cedures. In this vein I bring to hon. mem­bers' attention the fact that, relative to two overpasses officially opened in Brisbane in the last week or fortnight, there has been considerable trouble in arranging detours and other necessary work. Television, radio and the Press should be used to far greater advantage to present the full implications of the right-hand rule, the safe approach t.._ intersections, and obedience to simple rules for controlling the vehicle and not the driver. These matters are difficult enough without any change in traffic procedure, but they are doubly difficult when places suddenly become altogether different from the driver's point of view.

A photograph appeared in today's Press of the Taringa Bypass, and yesterday, in the top corner of a page, the following appeared, "New Bypass Opening by the Minister for Transport." As that was all that was said, why was the photograph printed today? I think the reason was that three 17 -year old Toowong high school students received minor injuries. The Taringa Bypass was illustrated to explain how it should be negotiated.

When the bypass at Turbot Street was opened a similar small article appeared stating that the Minister for Mines and Main Roads opened it, and there were no unneces­sary comments. It should have been photo­graphed from above, showing all the traffic islands, with a demonstration by police cars or l\'lain Roads cars of the flow of traffic.

Mr. Camm: Both these projects are the responsibility of the city council, not the Main Roads Department.

Mr. W ALLIS-SMITH: The Minister is the greatest half-back in Queensland, he gets rid of the ball before it comes out of the scrum. I am talking about the toll of the road, but he deliberately attributes this matter to the city council.

Mr. Camm: You should direct these questions to 'the city council as the con­structing authority.

Mr. W ALLIS-SMITH: If that is the case, did the city council produce this? I hear nothing.

I am concerned about the need for a greater traffic awareness by young people using bicycles on the road. I have here a report by the Australian Road Safety Council showing a boy cyclist making a right-hand turn. Statistics relative to pedal cyclists are alarming, in that pedal cyclists

and motor cyclists are on an equal footing in the number of fatal accidents, and are almost equal relative to serious injuries. It is high time that children gained a greater awareness of traffic difficulties. Their prob­lem can be overcome much easier than that of adults.

I refer now to statistics concerning traffic accidents in Queensland for the quarter ending 31 March, 1970. The statistics of total accidents reported from April, 1969, when the requirements regarding property damage were varied from $50 to $100, are not comparable with those of earlier periods.

Now that we have this complication in the matter of statistics, the Minister will be able to say that there are fewer accidents when in fact some have not been reported. This would be wrong and I hope .that some steps will be taken to overcome the position. If we are going to use statistics, we must be able to compare them. As a result of the alteration in the figure for property damage, some accidents are not reported and are therefore not included in the statistics.

I speak now of the education of children. I have here· a brochure from the Board of Management at the Mt. Lawley school in Western Australia. This is a school where they have most comprehensive training not only in the subject of road safety but also in the subjects of industrial safety, water safety and home safety. It is a wonderful scheme, and I suggest .that any hon. member who visited Perth would be most welcome at that school and that Mr. Bolton would be only too pleased to show him the many features of the scheme.

I could say a lot more on this subject if I had the time, but I will say that I think the Western Australian scheme has a very good basis for training children and motorists, and giving instruction about areas where accidents are likely to occur.

I now wish to make reference to uniformity of gauge in the railway system. I think the time is coming when the Queensland Railways will have to change to a uniform gauge. During World War II we saw long delays and bottle-necks, and we have seen bottle-necks at the boundaries during times of drought. There is a possibility that the 4 ft. St in. gauge will be used at Sabina Point. This will mean that only <two sections of railway line in Queensland wi11 be using the 4 ft. St in. gauge, the line from the border to South Brisbane Station and this new section to Sabina Point.

The introduction of a uniform railway gauge in Queensland is long overdue. If at any time the Minister can press his claim on the Federal Government for an extra grant to have this conversion of the railway gauge made, I should say that the Queensland system would hold its own with any other system. The Indian-Pacific train could then run not , from Perth to Sydney but from Perth to Cairns, on one gauge and without any change at all.

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Lastly, I take the Minister for ~ransport to task for his answer to a question asked by the hon. member for Toowoomba West. I think it was in very poor taste. Our transport committee received a letter from one of his constituents concerning a certain platform. It was a simple question and required a simple answer. Instead of giving it the Minister delved right down to the bottom of the barrel and explained a lot of things, including many that were not raised in the question. That is wrong. He mentioned a gold pass, but that was not part of the question and did not appear in the Ministers answer. I think it should be brought to the notice of the House that this sort of thing should stop.

I am also going to say that his answer today is the very thing that we wanted. We wanted the platform M Doomben raised, and his answer today was that the platform at Doomben would be raised. He used the world "ultimately". Why did he not say in ,the first place that the matter was under consideration, instead of answering as he did in an attempt to downgrade the hon. member for Toowoomba West? From the point of view of practical knowledge and sportsmanship, the hon. member for Toowoomba West would be so far ahead of the Minister for Transport that he would not be noticeable.

I conclude by making a further reference to the toll of the road, which I have already mentioned, and my contention that there should be uniformity in signs and traffic laws in all States.

(Time expired.)

Hon. P. R. DELAMOTHE (Bowen­Minister far Justice) (2.36 p.m.): Much has been written and spoken about the proposed legislation to give the Commonwealth sovereignty over off-shore resources below the low-water mark. As Attorney-General, I have attended all the conferences on this matter with the Commonwealth authmities back to 1963. There is no need for me to tell the House that we are in dispute with the Commonwealth over their proposals. That fact has been well publicised. The Minister for Mines and I have had some harsh things to say about the Common­wealth's proposition. To allow hon. members to be fully informed on all aspects of the controversy, I propose today to outline the history of off-shore control. I believe it necessary to make this statement because the question of sovereignty over off-shore resources below the low-water mark is of the greatest importance to Queensland and, incidentally, the other States.

I begin by stating that Quick and Garran, in their "Commentaries on the Constitution", at p. 569, paragraph 174, recognise State territorial waters as extending to the 3-mile limit.

Before Federation, the colonies-and since Federation, the States-administered the areas of inland waters of the sea and

the territorial sea as if they formed part of the land mass of their adjacent territories. In part.icular, they have legislated on the basis that the territorial sea, though subject to a right of innocent passage of foreign vessels, was an integral part of the territory of the State. Indeed, it has been assumed by both Commonwealth and State legislation that the position in relation to the territorial sea was unchanged by Federation, and that the Australian Constitution did not affect the powers of the States in relation to their territorial seas and their inland waters.

In recent years there has, of course, been ~ development of interest in oil exploration m off-shore areas beyond the territorial waters. The States (Queensland in 1964 by the Mineral Resources (Adjacent Sub­marine Areas) Act of 1964) extended their c_ontrols to operations in the adjacent con­tmental shelf area. This seems appropriate because of the obvious relationship between off-~~ore operations and the land mass. In additiOn, of course, the States and not the CommonW;e~lth were t?~ traditional govern­mental mmmg authontJes, as mining does ~ot <:ppear i~ the Commonwealth Const,itu­twn m the list of enumerated powers.

The pro~lem is one of great complexity and ~onfuswn. There are some who say that It can be solved with the utmost legal ease. b~ the Commonwealth's passing ,the Terntonal Sea and Continental Shelf Act and the States' challenging it in the Hiah Court. b

At this stage, I mention only two views o_n this matter. We have the present situa­~IOn concerning which it has been said m "Current Topics", in the Australian Law Journal of 29 May, 1970, at p. 189-

"It is naive to suppose that a head-on collision between the States and the Commonwealth in the Courts can thus be avoided, for so many legal conundrums arise from the draftsmanship of the Bill that private interests will certainly chal­!enl?e. the _legislation's v.alidity. A long JUdicial senal seems inevitable, and in the process the fundamental principles of Aus­tralian constitutional law will be put in issue . . . The legislation will usher in a period of constitutional struggle, the end result of which is difficult to foresee. This occurs at a time when this country is deplorably deficient in resources of legal research, particularly in the fields of inter­national law."

In addition, the Professor of International Law at Adelaide University, Professor D. P. O'Connell, who is one of the world's authori­ties on international law, said this in "The Australian Law Journal" of May, 1970-

"It now becomes clear that we are con­fronted with a murky legal history, much confused thinking and too much casual research into the antecedents of the problem.

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"The judiciary which is now called upon to make findings of law has not grappled happily with the intertwined strands of precedent, history, political philosophy, local and international issues which make up the problem, and it cannot be expected to do so without better guidance through this labyrinth of source material than has hitherto been provided by legal investiga­tion. There is a serious danger that the litigious issues will now crystalize quickly and that a premature decision may be given in which all the ramifications of the question are not fully examined. If bad history tends to make bad law, in a federal system where vast sociological issues are at stake too much frozen pre­cedent may compound the evil."

To begin with, we should isolate the prob­lem, investigate how it arose, and pose pos­sible solutions.

Simply put, the problem is the declaration -and I emphasise the word "declaration"­by the Commonwealth Government that the sovereignty in respect of the territorial sea, including air space above it and the sea-bed and subsoil beneath it, is vested in and exer­cisable solely by the Crown in the right of the Commonwealth.

The Commonwealth feels impelled to secure this sovereignty before it proclaims the Continental Shelf (Living Natural Resources) Act 1968 and before it proceeds with a further Bill covering the exploration for and exploitation of mineral resources other than petroleum in the submerged lands beneath the territorial sea and of the con­tinental shelf beyond the limits of the terri­torial sea. It is intended that, under that Act, the Commonwealth would have the authority to determine what titles are to be issued and when, the identity of the title­holder, and the conditions, including work requirements and almost every piffiing little thing, to be attached to a title.

How did the question arise? Whether authority to grant mineral-prospecting rights, in particular petroleum-prospecting rights, over the Australian continental shelf lay with the Commonwealth or the individual State to which the continental shelf is contiguous, was first considered by Sir Kenneth Bailey, the then Commonwealth Solicitor-General, in September, 1956, following the grant­hon. members will be interested in this­by the Queensland Government of petroleum­prospecting rights covering 27,600 square miles comprising coastal submarine areas in the region of the Great Barrier Reef north of Maryborough. The hon. member for Maryborough will remember when they were granted. That area extended more than three miles from any islands forming part of Queensland. At that time Sir Kenneth Bailey formed the following views as to the legal position-

( a) The submarine areas contiguous to an individual State and lying within terri­torial limits (that is, to a distance from

the coast coinciding with the limits of territorial waters) are part of that State and subject to its authority in the same way as is the land territory of the State.

(b) The submarine areas beyond terri­torial limits are subject to the exercise of sovereign rights by the Commonwealth, and not by an individual State, for the purpose of the exploration and exploita­tion of the natural resources of the seabed and subsoil.

In September, 1962, the then Attorney­General of the Commonwealth, Sir Garfield Barwick, presenting a paper to a meeting of the Attorneys-General of the Common­wealth, had this to say-

"In the Australian federal system, it is I think clear that this control of the Territorial Sea is exercisable in accord­ance with the constitutional division of powers between the Commonwealth and States, the Territorial Sea being for this purpose treated as part of the territory of the State concerned.

"Accordingly, the control of the oil resources of the sea-bed beneath the Territorial Sea would normally appear to fall wholly within State authority, subject of course to such Commonwealth powers as those with respect to defence and external affairs. But in this field as in all others, it is the Commonwealth and not a State which is internationally responsible for any exercise of power, whether by the Commonwealth or by a State, which affects other countries or their nationals."

In March, 1963, Mr. H. Winneke, Solicitor­General of Victoria, and Mr. Anstey Wynes, Parliamentary Draftsman of South Australia, made a report to the Attorneys-General on Sir Garfield's paper in the following terms:-

"It is conceded that the Territorial Sea, including the sea-bed beneath it is subject to the jurisdiction of the coastal State and that, such jurisdiction or authority being exercisable in accordance with the division of powers under the Common­wealth Constitution."

In reply, on 11 July, 1963, Sir Garfield Barwick commented on this report as follows:-

"! have naturally read your paper with much interest, but I must say at once that I find myself in complete disagreement with the view taken of the extent of Commonwealth power. Indeed, further reflection has led me to doubt the correct­ness of the concession you mention as to the position in respect of the Territorial Sea."

That was a completely different opinion from the one presented by him in December. 1962, and it was the first indication of the Commonwealth's intention to claim sovereignty of the territorial sea as well as the continental shelf.

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In the four years following that to 1966, almost continuous negotiations proceeded between the State and Commonwealth Mines Ministers and Attorneys-General to arrive at a workable legislative procedure which would give security of title to those com­panies desiring to explore off-shore for petroleum.

Before that time geophysical work in off-shore areas had identified geological structures which offered the promise, but not the certainty, of petroleum. Companies were poised ready to proceed.

To have jeopardised this position by recourse to litigation could well have put back the clock on our time-table of off­shore petroleum discoveries by several years. Hon. members will recall that Australia's overseas bill for petroleum products at that time was somewhere in the vicinity of $230,000,000-odd.

I think all members take satisfaction in the fact that, only six or seven years after this decision of the Governments to act in concert, Australia has every prospect of producing between 60 per cent. and 70 per cent. of its crude oil requirements-the great bulk coming from off-shore areas.

World-wide in the off-shore scene, petrol­eum has dominated both exploration and production. There is, however, increasing interest in other mineral resources of the sea-bed. Deposits so far identified include construction materials such as sand, gravel and limestone, detrital minerals such as tin, gold, platinum, diamonds, and the beach­sand minerals magnetite, ilmenite, rutile, zircon, monazite and phosphorite. Deposits of this nature have all been identified on the continental shelves of the world.

In addition, on the abyssal floor of the ocean manganese nodules, which in addition to manganese contain significant quantities of copper, nickel and cobalt, have also been found in widely dispersed areas.

The Federal and State Governments in Australia should have every reason to be pleased that, after several years of negotia­tions, agreement was reached between the Commonwealth and the States on the exploitation of the resources of the sea-bed within territorial waters and the continental shelf.

The Minister for National Development, in his second-reading speech on the Common­wealth legislation relating to off-shore oil (Parliamentary Debates, Commonwealth, 1967, page 1943), said-

"In Australia the Governments of the Commonwealth and States believe that they have overcome these problems (i.e. as to constitutional competence) without recourse to litigation between Govern­ments. To achieve this result they have mutually agreed that without abating any of their constitutional claims and that without derogating from their respective constitutional powers, they would enact

uniform and complementary legislation providing for a Common Code to apply uniformly throughout off-shore areas including both the territorial sea and con­tinental shelf."

To facilitate the close co-operation that had been achieved between the Department of National Development and the State Mines Departments, it was agreed by the Common­wealth and State Governments to establish an Australian Minerals Council. At the first working meeting of that council early in 1969, the States received indication that the Commonwealth Government had decided that the solution arrived at in respect of off­shore oil was acceptable with respect to other minerals.

It appeared that the Commonwealth at that stage was disposed to assert total rights outside the three-mile limit and leave the three-mile limit to the States; but it was also proposed-and this was ridiculous-ilia~ if the Commonwealth should at any tlme extend the area claimed for Australia as territorial sea, the extension of the territorial­sea area would be subject to Commonwealth legislation.

State Ministers expressed shock and sur­prise at these proposals. They requested that no statement be made public in regard to them until State Ministers could consider their position and put their views to their own Governments and Cabinets.

A further meeting was to have been held in May, 1969, but at the request of the Federal Minister the meeting was postponed and could not ultimately be arranged until September, 1969. In fact, it was held on the last day of the Commonwealth parliamentary sittings immediately prior to the last election. At that meeting the State Ministers reaffirmed their view that the solution accepted for off-shore oil had proved to be most success­ful and was suitable to form the basis for a joint regime with respect to other minerals.

It is now history that in April, 1970, the Territorial Sea and Continental Shelf Bill was introduced into the Federal Parliament, with the Commonwealth proposing that this mineral legislation would apply from low­water mark and exclude only land beneath waters that were within the boundaries of the States at Federation. That Bill goes far beyond the resources of the sea-bed and claims supreme Commonwealth power and sovereignty in relation to all matters in the off-shore area from low-water mark, includ­ing waters that have become internal waters after Federation. The Bill appears to claim that these areas are in effect the actual territory of the Commonwealth.

The Federal Minister, in his opening remarks, also referred to other considerations. He referred to the fact that meetings were going on in the United Nations about the sea-bed, and that the Commonwealth must carry the responsibility for Australia in these negotiations. This was never denied. How­ever, it was denied that when these rights

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were acquired in the international forum they accrued to the Commonwealth and not to the States.

Mr. O'Donnell: Wouldn't there be certain responsibilities between the Commonwealth and the States, even in depth of water? The States would have the necessity to go to the full extent off shore, whereas the Common­wealth would, perhaps, only in defence.

Dr. DELAMOTHE: That is so. The Commonwealth has certain enumerated powers which are exclusive of those of the States, such as defence and external affairs. If the hon. member waits a little while I will deal with the continental shelf. A very interesting case has been heard in the World Court covering this matter.

Mr. O'Donnell: Do you think the con­tinental shelf would be the only valid argument? When a country has little or no continental shelf, surely it must have some protection in order to carry out its underwater experiments.

Dr. DELAMOTHE: The hon. member is going beyond the continental shelf. Inter­nationally, and between the States and the Commonwealth, till recent months there was no thought of going beyond the 200-metre depth. The hon. member may have seen reports of recent discussions, both in Aus­tralia and overseas, about what will happen now that the great increase in technology permits exploration at a greater depth. An international conference is now being held on how the abyssal depths are to be controlled, to determine whether they are to be for the common use of the whole world (including countries that have not a sea coast), or whether they will be an extension of the neighbouring coast. This is a com­pletely new area that has to be solved internationally.

Having regard to the fact that, in the preamble to the Commonwealth Petroleum (Submerged Lands) Act, it was recited-

"And whereas the Governments of the Commonwealth and of the States have decided, in the national interest, that, without raising questions concerning, and without derogating from, their respective constitutional powers, they should co­operate for the purpose of ensuring the legal effectiveness of authorities to explore for or to exploit the petroleum resources of those submerged lands:"

I think one is entitled to ask at this stage what has happened in such a short time since 1967 that makes it necessary to shelve the method of joint legislation, which has been conspicuously successful and, in fact, has been regarded and lauded throughout the world as a land-mark in meaningful government co-operation in a Federal system. I wonder could it have been the removal in recent years of the States' second line of defence in an appeal to the Privy Council. The reason surely cannot be to have certainty in the constitutional position resolved by a short test case wholly and solely in the

High Court of Australia. One has only to look at the differing views of the judges in the High Court in the case of Bonser v. Lammaccia to gain a sufficient indication of this, but since then, and very recently­only last year and early this year-there is a decision of the High Court in Worthing's case.

I am sure members of the A.L.P. have studied the Worthing case very carefully. It dealt with one of the only determinations on section 52 of the Constitution. In that case a workman employed at the Richmond aerodrome fell off the scaffolding. He sued his employer for negligence under the New South Wales Scaffolding Act. He won the case in the Magistrates Court but it was taken to the High Court. It will be remem­bered that the High Court judgment was that State laws did not apply to land acquired by the Commonwealth for public purposes.

The Worthing case has pointed up the problem that will arise with the Common­wealth claiming sovereignty below low tide. There has been a flow-on from the Worthing case in Queensland within the last few weeks concerning a couple of trainees at Canungra who were found in possession of drugs. They came before a magistrate, who had to throw the case out. He said the High Court judgment in the Worthing case precluded him from hearing it; that the Queensland drug laws do not cover Commonwealth territory, which Canungra is.

Mr. Hanlon: Has that decision been challenged?

Dr. DELAMOTHE: No. There is no point in challenging it.

Mr. Hanlon: Do you agree with it?

Dr. DELAMOTHE: Yes. In the Bonser case, no evidence regarding

territorial waters and their possible sovereignty was brought before the High Cou11t. In fact, the New South Wales and Common­wealth counsel specifically asked the judges not to deal with this matter, so that the remarks of Their Honours Sir Garfield Barwick and Mr. Justice Windeyer were in the nature of obiter dicta.

If the Commonwealth Bill be proceeded with, it is most unlikely that certainty as to the constitutional provision will be achieved. I again remind hon. members of the flow-on from the Worthing case. It is inevitable that there will be a "long judicial serial", and I cannot think of a better description of what will occur.

I remind hon. members that section 92 of the Commonwealth Constitution was so clearly and simply written, in the view of the founding fathers, that they specifically asked the Imperial Government not ,to alter one jo{ or tittle of it in the Constitution Act. Yet there have been hundreds of challenges to that section of the Constitution; in fact, more than to any other section of it.

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It is submitted that the growth of inter­national law in regard to territorial rights over the maritime bel<t was gradual and by mutual recognition, and the Crown acquired rights over .the territorial sea in relation to •the land which was concerned, namely, that of the Australian colonies.

As was said in the Engineers Case, 1920, 28 C.L.R. 129 at p. 152, in a powerful joint judgment-

"The 'Crown' ... is one and indivisible throughout the Empire . . . the first step in the examination of the situation is to emphasise the primary legal axiom •that the Crown is ubiquitous and indivisible in the King's dominions."

Another case with a bearing on constitutional principle is Minister for Works v. Gulson, 1944, 69 C.L.R. 338, in which case Rich J. at p. 356 drew attention to the unity of the Crown and stated-

"Thus, the prerogatives of the Crown are the prerogativ·es of a single universal Crown, and endure for the benefit of each and every part of the Empire."

In the case of Secretary of State for India v. Chelikani Rama Rao, 1916, 85 L.J.P.C. 222, a case proceeding from India to the Judicial CommiHee of the Privy Council, it was decided that Keyn's case is not of value in regard to questions relating to ownership of the territorial sea. Chelikani's case is an authority of the highest order concluding the question in favour of the States as to the maritime belt.

The point is very tersely stated in the headnote of that case-

"The right of the Crown in the area of sea within 3 miles of the shore is of the same proprietary nature as the right of the Crown in the foreshore."

If this is correct, the territorial sea of Queensland is assimilated to the land mass of Queensland. Just as the Crown with the consent of the Legislative Assembly may legislate in regard ·to the land mass of Queensland, so it may legislate in regard to the territorial sea.

In the letters patent constituting Queensland there is no definition of boundaries by rigid reference ·to the coastline; but even if the maritime belt could not be said to have been specifically included, yet the wording was elastic enough to cover all rights which might be conceded to a land mass by the gradual growth of the body of international recognition of such rights.

Just as the air space above the land was part of the colony, though not mentioned, so was the incident of territorial rights in the maritime belt as recognised in 1859, or from time to time. Any acts of recognition were doubtless by the Crown of the United King­dom (under whom the Commonwealth was constituted) and on behalf of the nation of people; but if this occurred after 1859, the recognition was of a right incidental to the colony of Queensland and not in any way

owned by remote authority. The very nature of the right attached it to the Crown, owning the soil of the littoral land mass.

The Crown was not divided so that owner­ship went to the United Kingdom. The Crown merely recognised rights appertaining to any part of the Queen's dominions-here, the Australian colonies. The Imperial Parlia­ment legislated clearly, though impliedly, to recognise or establish the three-mile maritime belt in favour of the Australian colonies.

This, it is submitted, is a most forceful argument in favour of the States. The Federal Parliament passed the Federal Council of Australasia Act of 1885. By section 15 of that Act the council was given legislative authority in respect of-

"(c) Fisheries in Australasian waters beyond territorial limits;"

In the present situation the Common­wealth advisers would no doubt argue that this, too, referred to waters beyond either the coastline or the maritime belt belonging to England; but history would hardly support such an argument, and Kitto J. and other judges in Bonser's case were definitely opposed to such a view. The Queensland Pearl Shell and Beche-de-mer Fisheries (Extraterritorial) Act of 1888 defined Australasian waters adjacent to Queensland as-

" AI! Australasian waters within the limits described in the Schedule to this Act exclu­sive of waters within the territorial juris­diction of the Colony of Queensland."

I think what clinches the matter in favour of Queensland is that the Imperial Constitution Act, which founded the Federation of Aus­tralia, included in the Federal Constitution State rights to waters within territorial limits. However, apart from that, there is a long series of judicial judgments which support the claims of Queensland and other States. As early as 1805, in the Anna case, the Privy Council rejected a suggestion of juris­diction less than ownership, and they referred to an establishment of a territorial belt.

There were several English decisions from then through to 1916, when the Privy Council had this to say-

"The right of the Crown in the area of sea within three miles of the shore is of the same proprietary nature as the right of the Crown in the foreshore, and there­fore islands \>.hich rise from the sea within that limit are the property of the Crown, and the onus of establishing a title by adverse possession lies upon the person asserting such possession."

In 1867 Alaska, which was then, as now, part of America, had claimed an extensive area of sea as territorial waters. This went to arbitration between England and Alaska. when the three-mile territorial sea was recognised.

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In 1858 Britain passed the Cornwall Sub­marine Mines Act which allows extension of mining under the sea, and this in fact is being done today by New South Wales with some of its coal mines. In 1903 there was a further arbitration on the Alaskan waters, and again territorial waters of three miles were recognised.

The Geneva Convention in 1958 on the continental shelf declares in Article 2 that the coastal State exercises over the con­tinental shelf sovereign rights for the pur­pose of exploring it and exploiting its natural resources. For the purpose of the convention the term "continental shelf" is defined as referring (a) to the sea-bed and subsoil of the submarine areas adjacent to the coast to outside the area of the territorial sea to a depth of 200 metres, or beyond that limit, to where the depth of the superjacent waters admits of the exploitation of the natural resources of the said areas.

The Privy Council, in James v. The Commonwealth, had this to say-

"Thus the powers of the States were left unaffected by the Constitution except in so far as the contrary was expressly pro­vided; subject to that each State remains sovereion within its own sphere. The powers"' of the State within those limits are as plenary as are the powers of the Commonwealth."

Then we come to the decision of the World Court in the North Sea case, which con­cerned an argument between the Federal Republic of Germany and Denmark, on the one side and Holland, on the other. In the cour~e of its judgment, the court said this-

. . that the rights of the coastal State in respect of the area of continental shelf that constitutes a natural prolonga­tion of its land territory into and under the sea exists, ipso facto and ab initiu, by virtue of its sovereignty over the land,"-

in other words, whoever has the sover-eignty of the land also has the sovereignty of the submarine area that projects beyond it-

"and as an extension of it in an exercise of sovereign rights for the purpose of exploring the seabed and exploiting its natural resources. In short, there is here an inherent right.

"In order to exercise it, no special legal process has to be gone through, nor have any special legal acts to be performed."

In our view, primarily Queensland owns the maritime belt to the three-mile limit and has also rights to explore and exploit the whole continental shelf. In doing this, it will be subject to valid Commonwealth laws aimed faithfully at the carrying out of the conventions. If such laws go further than that, they will be invalid.

Recently the High Court handed down the epoch-making judgment in the case Worthing v. Rowell, which has ·the effect of removcing the application of a large part, if not all, of the State law from places acquired for Commonwealth purposes. If the Commonwealth Act is passed, the Com­monwealth will acquire everything below low-tide mark. Under the Commonwealth proposal the right of Queensland fisheries inspectors to police the taking of under­sized fish would be in serious doubt. Would our State police be able to apprehend a murderer who lured his victim into the surf below low-tide mark? Will the Com­monwealth have to draft its own criminal code and recruit its own police to enforce the Act? The imagination boggles at some of the possibilities-floating ·two-up games; call-girl services with dinghies rowing clients out to pleasur·e launches off our bays and beaches.

The Worthing case has established that State workers' compensation laws do not apply on Commonwealth property. Follow­ing the Worthing judgment, it already has been suggested that State police could no~ interfere with an S.P. bookmaker setting up shop in a telephone booth at the Brisbane G.P.O. What about our laws that require tourist launches to meet certain safety standards? Will the State be powerless to enforce these standards.

Mr. O'Donnell: That is rather .interesting, because the Commonwealth Government used to switch off the telephone of an S.P. bookmaker who was convicted.

Dr. DELAMOTHE: That is so. Mr. Porter: Commonwealth Govcernment

buildings will become like foreign embassies.

Dr. DELAMOTHE: That is correct. If my fears are proven, the Commonwealth will have to recruit an army of public servants to enforce the laws that the State traditionally has enforced. That, in .itself, will mean less money for the States.

The Bill seeks to introduce a change of a sweeping and fundamental character. It does not itself deal directly with minemls exploration; it deals with the declaration of sovereignty in every sphere. No doubt realising that such a sweeping provision would bring in its wake some entirely undesired and unforeseen consequences, the draftsman of the Commonwealth Bill ihas inserted a number of saving provisions. Two are worthy of note for present purposes. The first is clause 12, which provides that nothing in the Bill shall be taken to vest in the Commonwealth any wharf, jetty, pier, breakwater, building platform, pipe­line, lighthouse, beacon, navigational and buoy cable or other structure or works. The necessity for these provisions is obvious in that the various States have constructed ports and harbours in areas on the coast which were not internal waters as at 1901.

(Time, on motion of Mr. Rae, extended.)

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Dr. DELAMOTHE: I thank the Minister for Local Government and Electricity and hon. members of the House.

A case in point is Mackay Harbour. It is extremely doubtful whether, under the rules of international law as they existed in 1901, Mackay Harbour could be described as "internal waters". Consequently, if the Bill is passed and is held valid, the State of Queensland will have spent millions of pounds in constructing a harbour on land which it does not own and over which the Commonwealth has sovereignty.

A great many questions arise, but it is suf­ficient to mention only two. First of all, how can clause 12 have any effect? It will not be the Act which vests the harbour in the Commonwealth; it will be the inevitable effect of the Act-namely, that the harbour does not belong to the State but to the Commonwealth. Secondly, clause 12 could be repealed at any time at the will of the Commonwealth. Even if it has some effect in law to preserve State property while it operates, the State property remains State property on Commonwealth territory only at the whim of the Commonwealth.

Mr. O'Donnell: Don't you think that the simple solution would be to secede from the Commonwealth?

Dr. DELAMOTHE: Just wait a while.

Clause 13 of the Bill seeks to preserve the operation of State law except in so far as State law is expressed to vest or make exer­cisable sovereignty otherwise than in accord­ance with the Bill. Presumably the reason for this clause is that as State laws have been treated as operating in the territorial sea it is not desired to affect them if pos­sible. But the question is not capable of a simple solution. State laws operate in the territorial sea as part of the State itself. Once it becomes part of the Commonwealth, or under Commonwealth and not State sovereignty, it is very doubtful whether State laws can have any operation despite the pro­vision of clause 13.

Is it really desired now to create for the very first time a situation in which a different body of law will or may apply to a case, for example, where one person assaults another on the wharf at Mackay, from that which would apply if the assault takes place in the main street of Mackay itself? Is it really desired or desirable that the Queens­land criminal law will not operate beyond low-water mark, or even that, in each case that arises, there will be room for technical legal argument as to whether it does or not?

It has been said on numerous occasions that the main object of the Bill is to enable the Commonwealth and the States to con­duct a test case in the High Court. I think I have covered that in many ways as I have proceeded.

The States, including the Queensland Government, believe that this question has been over-simplified. It is extremely unlikely, on the history of other parts of the Constitution, that the problem can be solved by one test case. The attitude of the States is that they are ready and willing to co-operate with the Commonwealth but not on a master-and-servant basis and not at the expense of having fundamental and deeply rooted principles overturned. It is not a matter of money. The Commonwealth proposals themselves offer to share royalties with the States on a basis that the States found quite acceptable in the case of oil and petroleum.

The Queensland Government believes that the problem of off-shore mineral exploration can be solved satisfactorily by negotiation. It believes that far wider and more far-reach­ing problems of genera: jurisdiction should be the subject of detailed discussions between the States and the Commonwealth.

To sum the matter up, the Queensland Government firmly believes that the Commonwealth Bill to assume sovereignty over territorial waters is a precipitate and ill-judged step. The doubts and difficulties that will be created, it is thought, will be worse than the doubts and difficulties that it tries to resolve. The State Government is perfectly willing to co-operate with the Commonwealth Government in making a thorough investigation with a view to arriv­ing at a sensible and practical solution. The States agree whole-heartedly with this state­ment, which was made recently by Sir Kenneth Bailey to the Senate Select Com­mittee on Off-Shore Petroleum Resources-

"In the Australian Federal system at any rate, a decision to organise, by co-operation between Commonwealth and States, the regulation of the off-shore petroleum resources without settling the disputed question of the constitutional distribution of powers should not be thought, in the then circumstances, inconsistent with the proper constitutional responsibilities of the Commonwealth and the States . .

"The search for what in the mid-1960's was called a 'national solution' for the problem of regulating off-shore petroleum resources therefore seems to me quite con­sistent with a proper discharge of the constitutional responsibilities of the Governments concerned.

"By a 'national solution', the Ministers meant a solution which left entirely unresolved the conflict as to how constitu­tional powers were divided as a strict matter of law, and which used the respec­tive powers of Commonwealth and States in a combination calculated to achieve a practical result that would be satisfactory to all by applying uniformly a common set of rules to off-shore petroleum opera­tions in the off-shore submerged lands all round Australia."

436 Address in Reply [1 SEPTEMBER] Address in Reply

Finally, it must be obvious that it is a political and not a legal decision that must be made.

It is refreshing to me, a confirmed Federalist, to quote to this House a state­ment by Mr. Don Dunstan, Labour Premier of South Au.§tralia, after our last abortive conference with the Commonwealth. Mr. Dunstan supported without reservation the decision of the States to reject the Common­wealth's proposal. He said the States would have accepted similar legislation to the off­shore oil legislation, but that they would not co-operate with the Commonwealth in its proposals and would use all means available to fight them.

Mr. Dunstan said that this regrettable conclusion was reached only after the States had asked the Commonwealth to agree to a joint operation with the States in which the States would fully co-operate in ensuring to the Commonwealth its rights to over-all control in matters of national interest.

In the light of Mr. Dunstan's unequivocal stand, I challenge a responsible spokesman for the Opposition to state its position. Do hon. members opposite support Mr. Dunstan in his fight for State rights, or do they support the centralist policies that would damn the States and their sovereign rights to perdition? It is time some members of the Opposition, who during the whole two years that this argument has been going on have been silent, got off the fence and stated whether their party favours a further erosion of State powers and authority. The people of Queensland, particularly those in North Queensland, want to know where members of the Opposition stand. They know where I stand and where my Government stands. If members of the Opposition do not answer the challenge, the conclusion is obvious. All of us will know then that if the Opposi­tion is ever in power it will neglect the State's interest.

Mr. HARRIS (Wynnum) (3.24 p.m.): It was gratifying to see that in the extension of time granted to the Minister for Justice by the Minister for Local Government and Electricity, the Minister's remarks, although uninteresting, woke up members of the Government so that they can listen while I tell them what their Government has not been doing about safety factors for the workers at the Ampol oil refinery.

Very few members of the public realise how close the Ampol oil refinery was to being destroyed completely by another explosion last Sunday week. I venture to suggest that not more than one or two hon. members are aware of the occurrence. At approximately 9 o'clock on that day, when petrol was being pumped to the products wharf in order to fill one of the tankers with fuel, it was discovered after two hours that the fuel was being pumped not into the tanker but into the retention basin at the refinery. The operators and fitters control this procedure.

When the tankers arrive at the wharf it is customary for them to discharge their ballast into the retention basin at the Ampol refinery so that an attempt can be made to recover the oil that remains clinging to the tanker walls. This procedure had been completed and, two hours after the pumping of fuel started, the security guard at the main gate, which is located approximately 200 yards from this operation, discerned a strong smell of fuel gases. He notified the operators, who, in turn, found that there was a smell of gas throughout the refinery.

In the last four years the company has installed at various points in the refinery an alarm system which is expected to operate on such an occasion. At this point of time no-one knew where the gas was coming from. Those concerned were under the impression -and understandably so-that it was coming from the retention basin and was caused by the water ballast being pumped from the tanker into the basin. On further investiga­tion, the smell was traced along the pipes back to the tanker. The tanker had fulfilled its obligations in accordance with the regula­tions. I think we all appreciate that the water ballast is used as ullage, and is neces­sary for safety reasons. The guard at the main gate decided that it was time some action was taken about the alarm system, which had not been used at that time. When this was suggested, and it was tried, it did not operate.

The Minister in charge of these operations has told me on many occasions that this company has an excellent safety record. Yet this safety system, which is supposed to save the lives of possibly hundreds of men working in the vicinity of the refinery, simply did not operate. It is a terrible state of affairs that, by this time, 700 tons of fuel had been pumped into the retention basin, which was full of water. Hon. members can well imagine the tragedy that could have occurred had the fuel gases ignited in the retention basin,

The alarm system that operates is called a "hot-work" system, and when it operates every vehicle and every person has to cease work irrespective of what he is doing. This includes the office staff. Yet at that time there were vehicles moving round the place and men continued working.

It was only a couple of years ago that an oil refinery down south had an explosion. There is no need for me to tell hon. members what the results were. Furthermore, 12 months ago exactly the same thing happened in America.

People are still under the impression that these explosions are caused by a naked light. I point out to the Minister how these gases ignite. The explosion in America was caused by a vehicle driving past the area where the gases were escaping.

This 700 tons of fuel represented a great loss to the company. From a monetary point of view it was a loss of approximately

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$20,000. Possibly this is not a large amount to such a company, but no-one can afford to waste this amount of money.

But that was not all the damage that was done. The gas had spread throughout the works. One can imagine what would have happened had one of the employees of the company not realised the position and, on discovering the fault, in order to prevent any panic stationed men in certain parts of the area to stop all movement and all work. This man had not only the interests of his company at heart but also the welfare and protection of his own workmates.

On various occasions I have referred to this oil refinery and the conditions under which many of its employees are working. We have been told that the conditions at Ampol are not the best. This is con­trary to the views of the Minister for Labour and Tourism, who has so often pointed out that this company has a wonderful safety record.

I should like to refer to a letter which sets out the conditions under which some employees are working at the oil refinery. It was submitted to the company for approval, and reads-

"In recent weeks the men have refused to work in certain areas because they con­sider them unsafe. This has been brewing over a period of approximately four years, and the recent injury to an Ampol employee has brought it to a head."

The thing I am concerned with and of y;thich I have spoken so often in the House Is t~e alkylation unit. This is the hydrochlonc plant. Over the past few years m'!ny of the men have brought to the attentiOn of the foreman and the supervisor the fact that the alkylation suits, t.he yrot~cti.ve-clothing suits leak that the llghtmg IS madequate, that' the ~ashing and drying facilities are inadequate, and that the onus was put <?n each man to wash and clean~e his smt, otherwise the next man to use It woul~ . be burnt. There is no check or supervisiOn of these things. If any tools were taken from the alkylation tool store they h!ld to be checked out by the operator and Signed, and countersigned by the supervisor.

The men are expected to wear this pro­tective clothing. I think all hon. members appreciate what an acid burn is like. The men made a request to the !llanagement that protective clothing, inc~ud.mg go?~Ies, be improved, and that unh.J:giemc conditions of work be rectified. Qmte a number of things were shown to be wrong.

The following day, in this House,. I as~ed the Minister for Labour and Tounsm:-

"(1) How many hydrofluoric acid pro­taction suits are available to workmen ;orking in the alkylation unit at Ampol oil refinery?"

The Minister answered, "Twenty-seven." I also asked-

"(2) Are all the alkylation suits service-able and in good order? If not, how many leak and where?"

The Minister answered-"Yes. All suits are maintained in accord­

ance with the standard of Phillips Pet­roleum, the licensors of the unit."

Yet the day after I asked those questions two men received burns because their pro­tective clothing was defective. The company then rejected the suits as unserviceable.

What kind of information are we being given in this House? I think many members at present have a nasty taste in the mouth following share disclosures made in this House. I refer to Comalco and the hribes -call them what you like-that were made. What really did happen in the case of Comalco and the sand-mining companies? I am beginning to think that the Govern­ment has something to do with Ampol in regard to its safety provisions. No other company in Queensland would be allowed to treat its employees as this company does. Furthermore, the same type of thing that happened in relation to Comalco, and very obviously happened with sand-mining interests and Cooloola, could be happening in relation to Ampol. Let that be a warning to some Ministers. Whenever the hon. member for Belmont or I ask a question concerning Ampol, a smokescreen is laid as thick as the smokescreen that is discharged from the oil refinery stack when the company is too lousy to break down the cracker plant so that the amount of smoke emitted would be reduced.

Whilst on the subject of pollution, I might mention a few things that not only the people of Wynnum, Belmont and Bulimba, but also those as far out as Sunnybank· if the prevailing wind blows in that direction, have to put up with. I wonder how many members in this House realise that at present there · are two stacks at the Ampol refinery, not one. There is the tall stack a couple of hundred feet high that everyone can see, and there is also the one hidden within the cracker plant. That one, which is referred to as the CO stack, belches out approximately four tons of invisible soot every day of the week, Saturday and Sunday included. It is soot that has no smell, and is dangerous to the human body; it is capable of killing not only animals and plants, hut ihuman beings as well. It is a type of soot unknown to the general public, and it is emitted at the rate of four tons a day for 365 days of the year, provided the plant is working satisfactorily. If the plant is not working satisfactorily, the quantity of four tons is doubled, and never a word does: the Government say about it. How many times has the Government been told about it? They are not prepared, or not game­make your own choice of the word-to

438 Address in Reply [1 SEPTEMBER] Address in Reply

do anything about it. There is something wrong when the Government will not enforce at Ampol the safety regulations that it has laid down. Somebody is getting a rake-off somewhere.

Let me refer again to the smoke that billows 200 to 300 feet above the stack and the flame that belches out with it. On many occasions the flame is over 100 feet long. If we refer to it and ask the com­pany, "Isn't there something you can dl\ about it?", we are told, "We are sorry, but we have to do it to burn off the excess gases." If the Ampol refinery or any other refinery is so badly organised that it produces such an abundance of gas that it has to burn it, I suggest that there is some­thing radically wrong with its system. It would be burning profits, and no private enterprise company-and I remind hon. members that this is supposed to be an all-Australian company-would be prepared to waste large quantities of gas in that way.

The Government has been told on dozens of occasions what damage the pollution of the air from Ampol is doing to the properties of the people in the Wynnum district, and I am speaking now not only on behalf of the people of Wynnum but also on behalf of all people living in the areas that are afflicted, day and night, with this insidious soot and smoke. The problem is worse at night because the organisation concerned is smart enough to realise that most people are in bed at night and do not realise what is going on. From 10 or 11 o'clock each night of the week until virtually daylight, filthy smoke is billowing over the entire area. What happens to the washing on the line, the paintwork on the houses? One has only to look to see that they are covered with soot. The problem is similar to that created by the Queensland Cement and Lime Company Ltd. at Darra, about which hon. members have heard the hon. member for Salisbury speak on a number of occasions, but the Government makes no effort to see that the company fits arrestors to its stack.

The company will say-and I suppose it would be correct in a way-that the smoke can be eliminated if the crackers are closed down entirely. However, that is not in accordance with policy, as it would immediately lose money if it closed the entire plant and its aim is to be profitable. I suggest that, for the benefit of the people generally, it could close half the plant and have only half the problem that it has at present. I would be justified in saying that my comments about Ampol apply equally to the other oil refinery, which probably is causing similar unnecessary problems to people living at the bottom end of the bay.

To get back to the problem of the 700 tons of fuel that went into the retention basin, I wonder just how much oil and liquid from tankers is going into the Brisbane River. One hears a great deal of talk about air pollution and other pollution, and the oil companies should do something about

that. They have taken certain action to prevent water pollution, but they have done that not for the benefit of the people but for their own benefit in an endeavour to retrieve and retain some of the oil that goes out of the tankers. That is their only reason for doing it.

I contend that effluents and other pro­ducts being pumped into the Brisbane River by the oil companies are, contrary to their statement, not pure. It would be very interesting to know just how pure they are and how much further pollution they are causing to the Brisbane River. One has only to listen to the continual complaints of yachtsmen sailing up and down the Brisbane River to realise the problems caused by oil slicks. A boat has only to be taken to the mouth of the river and it will need a complete repaint, as the whole of the hull will be covered with oil.

Much has been said and, I suppose, one could say quite a deal more about the present safety factors for gas and anyone who may be overcome by it. On one occasion a man was overcome by gas and his life was saved only by the efficiency of the Wynnum Ambulance Transport Brigade, which imme­diately rendered first aid. I repeat that the equipment supplied by the company and stationed in its first-aid depot was not avail­able. Even if it had been available, it was not in a satisfactory working condition.

Other oil companies support training schools for their employees in an endeavour to make them more efficient both in their work for the company and in rendering first aid when necessary. Operators are expected to hold a first-aid certificate, and those who are sufficiently interested to take out a certi­ficate receive an increase in wages of $2 a week. If these men are prepared, from a monetary advantage and for the benefit of their fellow workers, to undertake this train­ing, why cannot this company start a refresher course to ensure that, if an occasion such as I have mentioned again arises, fully trained personnel will be able to take control of the situation?

Having spoken of the efficiency of the Wynnum Ambulance Transport Brigade, let me once again draw the attention of hon. members to the importance of establishing a hospital in Wynnum. This ambulance centre is doing yeoman work yet bearers have still to traverse the area, cap in hand, begging for money to carry on. This is because the State Government Insurance Office is not paying centres sufficient to enable them to recoup the cost of carrying workers' compensation cases to and f~om hospitals. I will deal with that matter later on.

As a member of the Parliamentary Labour Party Health Committee I was privileged to visit quite a number of hospitals from Cook­town down the coast to Maryborough. I feel that the chairman of that Committee has made a very comprehensive report on the

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medical side of hospitalisation at these hos­pitals, and has forcefully pointed to their inadequacies. He has pointed out areas in which, in his opinion and that of the com­mittee generally, not sufficient attention has been given by the Health Department to free hospitalisation.

I am concerned about the hospital buildings and the proposed additions to them. The hon. member for Wavell criticised the Health Department by referring to the old and dilapidated buildings, but then flew immedi­ately to its defence by saying that the buildings were built by a Labour Govern­ment and are in the same condition now as when they were handed over by the Labour Government. What a shocking statement to make. If the buildings are in the same condition now as when they were handed over, it is more shame to the Government. It has been talking about what it has done for this State's free-hospitals system, yet on its own admission the hospi.tals are in the same condition as when it took office over 12 years ago.

They are in the same condition, but only in shape. Certainly they are not in the same condition of upkeep. The maintenance of the hospitals has been sadly neglected. The hon. member for Wavell said that a shocking state of affairs existed at the Royal Children's Hospital and that the Labour Party had done nothing about it. More shame to him and his Government. The Government has done nothing at all about advancing free hospitalisation in Queensland.

If the Government is sincere in its attempt to develop this fair State by encouraging people to move into the industrial estates tha.t it has created at Wacol, Lytton and other places, why is it not prepared to provide a hospital in the highly industrialised area of Wynnum, which has a population of 55,000 people and contains many industrial enterprises at which perhaps three or four accidents occur daily? The Minister for Health said that Wynnum would get a hospitaL If he is sincere why does he not do something about it?

In 1956 the then Labour Government purchased land in Wynnum for a hospital. On many occasions since then this Govern­ment has said that if it is returned to power it will build a hospi.tal there. It has not done so yet, and I believe that it has no intention of doing so. The Government has been dilly-dallying along the way. On three or four occasions I have asked the Minister for Health about the purchase of land in Wynnum for the establishment of a hospital, and on each occasion he has Teplied that negotiations are still proceeding and that the South Brisbane Hospitals Board has been advised to acquire land.

I have contacted certain people who own land adjacent to that held by the Govern­ment for hospital purposes. They have agreed to sel! their land to the Government

to provide it with an area greater than 11 acres for the establishment of a hospital. That land is on the pick of the building sites in the district; it is situated away from houses; and no traffic problems will arise near it. The Labour Government, which had plenty of experience in buying land, thought £t was an ideal position, so it should be good enough for this Government.

Two years ago when I approached these people they agreed to sell their land to the Government so it could have 52 acres, but the sale has not eventuated. When I approached them again they said that the Government offered such a ridiculous price that they were not prepared to answer the letter. If these people sold their land privately-and I think they should-they would get a much better price. However, if they are not prepared to sell their land to the Government to be used for the con­struction of a hospital, it will be too bad for the people of Wynnum and, once again, the blame will lie on the shoulders of this inefficient and incompetent Government. I have pointed out on many occasions why this hospital is necessary, but the Minister for Health has done nothing to overcome our problems.

As it was obvious that the Minister for Health would not co-operate and give us a hospital, I paid him the courtesy of asking him to do something for the people by way of providing extra dentists at the dental clinic, but he would not even do that. I pointed out to him that the 55,000 people in the area badly need a full-time dental clinic, but he would not provide one. I pointed out last week to the Minister and members that one of my constituents had to wait 13 months for an appointment. In reply to my question he said that my information was wrong and that the delay entailed would be only 11 months. There is not much difference between 13 months and 11 months when two months are taken out for the school holidays. Why cannot the Government do something about providing extra dentists at the dental clinic? Government members often say that the Labour Party is stood over by outside organisations, but it is obvious that someone is standing over the Minister on free hospitalisation.

The Minister cannot hoodwink me by say­ing that a delay of only 11 months is involved. A delay of three months is two months too long. We have been told that there is a terrific shortage of dentists but I do not give a tinker's cuss about the short­age of dentists; the Government is training these people and surely it has a responsi­bility to make conditions good enough in Queensland to encourage them to stay here instead of leaving the State the day after they are out of their time. The Govern­ment's incompetence in handling such affairs is responsible for the shortage of dentists. If the Government were prepared to do what I have asked there would be no shortage

440 Address in Reply [1 SEPTEMBER] Address in Reply

of dentists. The hon. members for South Coast and Albert try to ram down our throats that this is the best State in the Common­wealth. If that is so, let the Government do something about getting more dentists to stay here. The situation in Wynnum is not good enough for the people.

Although I am loath to raise this matter, I do so because it is of great concern not only to members of this House, but to the people of Queensland generally. I refer to the appointment by the Government of Mr. Whitrod as Commissioner of Police. Mr. Whitrod probably has many qualifications, but apparently the Government decided to disregard the claims of police officers who in my opinion are fully qualified to hold a position such as this. Among former Police Commissioners we have had Carroll, Smith, Paddy Glynn and Bischof. I mention Bischof because the hon. member for South Brisbane is present and no doubt he would like me to give him a mention.

I am sick and tired of the way the Com­missioner-elect has been running around like Goering and stomping around like Goebbels, running to the airport to meet dignatories from overseas. He has been employed by the Queensland Government as the Acting Commissioner of Police; so let him do his job and solve some of Queensland's 6,000 unsolved crimes. We had enough of Bischof when he was in office handing out H.G. shirts to louts after they had been convicted and sent across the border.

Let the present Commissioner do the job that he is expected to do. He has spoken about education and the qualifications neces­sary for police at the present time. How many of the recent commissioners of police, excluding Mr. Bischof, of course, did not have secondary education? Is the Govern­ment going to suggest that fellows like Norm. Bauer, Tom Harrold and the others were not competent police investigators? Did they have to bring the great white master from overseas to look after these police officers? What a shocking state of affairs it is that these fellows spend half of their lives in the Police Force endeavouring to get one "plum" job, just one "plum" job, and then on the eve of their retirement this particular "plum" job is snatched from under their eyes by an impostor coming in from over­seas. This is a shocking state of affairs, and I do not mind if any of the police officers now do only half the job they are expected to do until an anomaly such as this has been cleared up.

In the future let this Government select from among their number capable men who I feel quite sure are fully qualified to occupy the position of Commissioner of Police in Queensland as did Norm. Bauer, Tom Harrold and many other very successful police officers.

Mr. HOUGHTON (Redcliffe) (4.3 p.m.): I should like to extend my heartiest con­gratulations to the mover and seconder of

the motion. I am quite sure every hon. member wiii agree that they did an excellent job and made a fine contribution to this debate, and that we will hear more from them later on. I should also like to join with all other hon. members in congratu­lating His Excellency the Governor on the presentation of his Address, and I join with other hon. members in expressing loyalty on behalf of myself and the electors of Redcliffe whom I have the honour to represent.

I reject the amendment moved by the Opposition, and I am quite sure that every other hon. member on this side of the House would automatically do so. Certain matters have come before our notice at this time, and many of them are exercising the minds of all true Australians. One matter that concerns me as an Australian is the disunity and disloyalty that exist in this country today.

The first paragraph of the motion now being debated rightly expresses loyalty to Her Majesty's person and the Throne, and all that it stands for. Implicit in the oath of office taken by all of us on becoming members is that loyalty, and loyalty to the Queen's subjects, especially those whom we immediately represent. How, then, do members of the Opposition square their consciences with morally supporting, and publicly defending, the traitorous excres­cence which has set up "treason room~" at the Trades Halls in Brisbane, TO\\ nsvil!e and Rockhampton?

Hon. members opposite know full well that these "treason rooms" have been set up expressly for the purpose of subverting this State and country, and demoralising young Australian manhood. They know that they are an abominable insult to every Australian serviceman, present and past, who proudly accepted his responsibility to this land and its people.

Today the Opposition tolerates these traitors. I say to hon. members opposite: haven't you got the guts to shake off the traitors who have attached themselves to your party in a stinking coalition of the Left whioh spells your inevitable political doom, and which extracts every ounce of decency from you in the process? The traitors at the Trades Hall are on all fours with the Victorian rabble who urged Australian boys in Vietnam to throw away their arms and defect. Hon. members opposite know who they are, yet they turn somersaults to act as their apologists, friends and champions. What a distinction-the buddies of traitors!

I know that many members opposite served with the Australian Forces in earlier years, and every decent Australian is thank­ful to them and proud of them for doing so. But whv in the name of heaven must they tarnish ·that estimable record by siding

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with traitorous Communists who they know are enemies of this country and will stop at nothing to harm it?

Many members opposite are justly proud of their membership of a fine fraternity, with the superb fellowship found in the several organisations for ex-service personnel. Some of them even hold high office in those bodies. But how can they wear that badge of distin;;tion with equanimity and at the same time publicly remain silent when they should be speaking out against the traitorous breed that is forcing its relationship upon them? Some of them are even rising in this House in an attempt to defend traitors. There is no defence against treason, and hon. members opposite well know that.

There is no defence for one who, as president of the party of hon. members opposite, elects to give his benediction, encouragement and personal influence to the establishment of this nest of traitors at the Trades Hall. Egerton is so much on side with the Communists that hon. members opposite should insist upon his taking out a ticket in that vile organisation-presuming, of course, that he does not already hold one! Why must the Leader of Her Majesty's Opposition demean and com­promise his high office by apologising for Egerton and his subversive associates? Egerton alleges that there are fewer Corn­m unist officials connected with the Trades Hall now than there have been in past years. Has he access to their membership lists? He does not state the patent fact that he personally is completely in the pocket of the Reds, and that it is Com­munist policy that prevails in the affairs of both the Trades Hall and the political party of hon. members opposite. He person­ally sees to that.

The same Mr. Egerton, their esteemed president, is also a member of the interstate executive of the A.C.T.U. and, true to char­acter, never fails to support the eight or nine Communists on that body. Have hon. members opposite ever tackled him about the unsavoury image he is giving to their party? Why not? They are scared of losing their party endorsement.

It has been most amusing to read that the State Secretary of the A.L.P., Mr. Burns, now the Federal President, is going to Victoria with a big stick to clean up the motley, milling party associates there. Undoubtedly a stick needs wielding in Victoria, but the thing that rates a horse­laugh is the selection of "Lefty" Burns to do the job. He, a key figure in consolidating the coalition of the Left in Queensland, is sent south to put an end to the coalition of the Left there. It could only happen in the A.L.P.! No wonder the Victorian president of the A.L.P., Mr. Crawford, described the Federal A.L.P. Executive meeting at Broken Hill which prescribed this marvellous situa­tion as "a mad hatter's tea party".

While I am touching on the southern A.L.P. shemozzle, it is worth recalling the remarks of two Victorian branch officials, a lawyer and a school teacher, who resigned their posts last week. They said-

"The conflict now raging is between tho supporters of a democratic Parliamentary system and a group the majority of whom would change society by revolution. We have come to the conclusion that the group controlling Victorian Labour . . ."

ideological bed-fellows of those who control it here-

" ... is the principal obstacle to the party fulfilling its destiny in this crucial period of our history."

Labour Senator Kennelly, who has called for a Federal take-over of the Victorian A.L.P. Executive, also had this to say-

"Drastic diseases need drastic measures to cure them, and the position in Victoria is drastic.

"Once I could walk down Bourke Street and be proud that I was a member of the Labour Party."

Exactly the same thing can truthfully be said about the A.L.P. in Queensland.

Hon. members opposite surely appreciate that while they continue to be dictated to by Leftists and Communist outsiders, as they are now, they can only pretend to be upholders of a democratic parliamentary system. There is not a street in Queensland that any hon. member opposite can walk down in pride, because he has absolutely nothing to be proud of. The name has not been changed, for obvious reasons, but any resemblance between the Labour Party that once was and the A.L.P. of today is purely coincidental.

I was pleased to learn that about two­thirds of the affiliated unions refused to have anything to do with the "treason ro<;Jms" and that at least two of the trade umons-the Liquor Trades Union and the Ironworkers' Federation-have formally dissociated them­selves from them. By allowing those rooms to function in buildings specially set aside to look after matters affecting trade unionists, Mr. Egerton and his confreres have delivered a dual attack on workers, very many of whom would also have given service in some branch of the defence forces.

The vast majority of Australian workers -99 per cent. of them, in fact-want no part of Communism and absolutely nothing to do with treason, yet they have had both wished on them by Egerton and his com­missars who have identified the "treason rooms" with the offices of the trade union movement. Such contemptuous treatment of working men and women exposes for all unionists to see the true form of these red and pink opportunitsts who have climbed into positions of influence by pretending to be the workers' friends. Egerton would sell out every Queensland worker-in fact, that

442 Address in Reply [1 SEPTEMBER] Address in Reply

is just what he has done-for an expenses­paid trip to Moscow. His inglorious role in this treason venture is about as wholesome as that of Labour Party Mao-lover, Dr. Cairns, who has invited North Vietnamese and Viet Cong representatives to Australia. In the words of the national president of the R.S.L., Sir Arthur Lee, this is an incredible act of irresponsibility and an insult and an act of disloyalty to our young men on the battlefield.

Mr. Wright interjected. Mr. DEPUTY SPEAKER (Mr. Hooper):

Order! I ask the hon. member for Rock­hampton South to withdraw his remark and apologise to the hon. member for Redcliffe.

Mr. Wright: I do not see how it can affect him. It is true.

Mr. DEPUTY SPEAKER: Order! I appeal to the hon. member for Rockhampton South to withdraw the remark and apologise.

Mr. Wright: I do so.

Mr. HOUGHTON: It is just as well he did. I will deal with him outside-or any­body else.

Might I inquire from R.S.L. members sitting on the other side of the Chamber whether they support the views of the Federal president of the R.S.L., which are ·the views of most ex-servicemen, or would they brand him and them as liars? It is time now for them to get down from the fence and make their way either to the side of Sir Arthur Lee or quick march to the Left with Dr. Cairns. If they choose the latter's company, then let them at least have the decency to hand in their R.S.L. badges. If they prefer to hold onto them, then let them tell Dr. Cairns what a dangerous un-Australian rat-bag he is. F.resh returned from harangueing unshorn, unwashed, and unwanted drop-outs from democracy in ·the United States, he, together with a local A.L.P. disgrace to this State Senator Georges, .is now going about th~ business of organising another moratorium march in Australian cities next month. Senator Georges, the House will recall is the person who, with •the support of 'the Comm!fnists, succeeded in ousting Mr. Ron McAuhffe from an A.L.P. seat in the Senate a few years ago. With Comrade Hamilton he is a leading light in establishing the "treason rooms", and he also calls himself chairman of the Queensland Moratorium Co-ordination Committee. Of course he establishes the direct connection betwee~ the traitorous people organising these moratorium marches, in which a few well-meaning inno­cents .are also caught up, and the Comrade Hamilton clan, who have embarked on subversion on a full-time basis.

Who or what is Senator Georges co­ordinating? As an A.L.P. member he is pre­sumably working for the still .greater integration of his party with the Communist Party, because the latter is the main force

in promoting these street demonstrations. He knows he is on safe ground, for it lis worthy of note that the A.L.P. Federal Executive did not insist on the withdrawal of some of the extremist gmups from the organising panel before committing the party to sup­porting the September moratorium.

There is no chance of the L:abour Party escaping blame for the establishment of the "treason rooms" in Bdsbane and .two pro­vincial centres. They were set up under the aegis of the president of the Queensland branch of the A.L.P. and are supported by the past Federal president, Senator Keeffe. I have here a photostat copy of a letter signed by one E. Sloan, secretary of the steering committee which established the "treason room" in Townsville, which shows that Senator Keeffe has pledged full support for the subversive project. I will show it to any hon. member opposite who is interested in the machinery of treason, but I would be well advised to put it on the record. It reads-

"Townsville Committee in Defiance of the National Service Act

"Dear Sir,

"P.O. Box 564, "Townsville. Q .. 4810

"6th August, 1970.

"I wish to bring to your notice .the formation of the Townsville Committee in Defiance of the National Service Act. The purpose of the Committee is to urge young men to crefuse to be conscripted for the illegal war in Vietnam, together with supporting and helping any young man who either refuses to register, applies for conscientious objector status or refuses to be called up.

"We feel that as human beings and citizens of a Country that is a Signatory to the United Nations Universal Declara­tion of Human Rights which states in Article 18 'that every one has ·the right to freedom of thought, conscience, and religion' every individual should give his full consideration to the inhuman aims of the Society to which we belong.

"We envisage a continuous campaign of leaflets, together with signs erected around the Townsville area. New and varied signs and leaflets will be produced as often as practical. Both Senator Jim Keeffe and the Townsville Trades and Labour Council have pledged full supp ·rt for our Com­mittee.

"As you no doubt realize considerable expense is involved in the running of an organization such as ours. Therefore any donation your Union or Organization or its members care to make will be grate­fully accepted and used to deny the Government its illegitimate right to con­script young men against their will.

"Our next meeting will be held at rthe A.M.I.E.U. Hall in Wickham St., Towns­ville, at 8 p.m. on Wednesday, 19th August, 1970."

Address in Reply [1 SEPTEMBER] Address in Reply 443

Mr. Bennett: How much did you give?

Mr. HOUGHTON: I understand that a collection has been taken up among the Opposition, but at least some hon. members on that side of the House have not sub­scribed to it. I congratulate them on that.

It remains for me now to put the question point-blank to every member of the Opposi­tion. Do they support the treasonable acts that I have shown the Opposition has been made a party to? If not, then for the sake of all that is decent let them rise in this House and publicly denounce those respon­sible. If they support them, then let us know so that we will know how to regard them in future. If we do not get any reply we will know that the Opposition is only what some people have claimed it to be, namely, just another Communist front. Every true Australian must be deeply con­cerned about this front that is being pre­sented. Fortunately, not all members of the Opposition subscribe to it or believe in it, but they are forced into the invidious and unhappy situation of no longer being masters of their own problems and destinies.

Mr. Tucker: Fancy that coming from you.

Mr. HOUGHTON: The hon. member for Townsville North interjects. He was the very person who was on the Communist ticket at Townsville, and he did nothing about it. The Townsville Communist Party opposed the hon. member for Townsville South, Tom Aikens, but it did not oppose the hon. member for Townsville North. Why? He is on the Communist ticket for Towns­ville, and he cannot deny it.

Mr. Tucker: At least I have not switched sides three times, as you have.

Mr. HOUGHTON: The hon. member would be in Moscow tomorrow morning if he could be. I am still proud to be a Tory. I have not switched to the Commas, as the hon. member has done.

Mr. DEPUTY SPEAKER (Mr. Hooper): Order!

Mr. Wright: "Napoleon the pig", they call him, "from Animal Farm".

Mr. DEPUTY SPEAKER: Order! The hon. member for Rockhampton South knows full well that when I am on my feet no words are to be uttered, particularly words such as those that he used. Again I ask him to withdraw and apologise.

Mr. Wright: I apologise to you, Mr. Deputy Speaker.

Mr. DEPUTY SPEAKER: I ask the hon. member to withdraw the words.

Mr. Wright: And I withdraw them. Honourable Members interjected.

Mr. DEPUTY SPEAKER: Order! When the House comes to order I will call the hon. member for Redcliffe.

Mr. Tucker: Get on with your human hate.

Mr. HOUGHTON: The hon. member can­not take it; that is his trouble. He should be ashamed to wear the badge. He should be the first one to hand his in.

Mr. Bennett: Get another rat-hole to run into.

Mr. HOUGHTON: You have been in it for the last week. This is the first time we have seen you here.

Mr. DEPUTY SPEAKER: Order! I ask the hon. member for South Brisbane to be temperate in his remarks. I also ask the hon. member for Redcliffe to address his remarks to the Chair.

Mr. HOUGHTON: The Communist call for violence in the streets is a sinister and dangerous development in industrial rela­tions in Australia. When hon. members opposite make such statements we are forced to wonder, and I think every true Australian must feel disappointed that this situation exists.

I do not care what a man's politics are, but I do say that we cannot tolerate treason in this country. A person who is not prepared to live under our flag should be denied the right to live in our country. Like many members on the opposite side of the House, I firmly believe that it is a lot better to die on one's feet fighting for the things one believes in than to go on living on one's hands and knees for the rest of one's life. There are true Australians on the other side of the House who are bound by the situation that has crept up on them. They are faced with a dilemma by not knowing where to go or what to do. I appeal to every member of the House to object violently to this treason. I do not care what a member's politics are; he is entitled to them--

Mr. P. Wood interjected.

Mr. HOUGHTON: Little Sir Echo! He is too young to know; he was in swaddling clothes.

The time has arrived for every hon. member particularly those in Opposition, to declare where he stands. Every hon. mem­ber should declare if he supports the "treason rooms" and the people who operate and con­trol them. It is entirely in the Opposition's corner from now on. I ask them where they stand in this matter.

Mr. HANSON (Port Curtis) (4.28 p.m.): During my time in this House I have not witnessed such a violent, mid-Victorian, reactionary speech as that uttered by the hon. member for Redcliffe. It is indeed regret­table, in this day and age, that we as parliamentarians, responsible people demo­cratically elected by our constituents to sit in this Assembly, are forced to put up with such old-time, ancient drivel that certainly does not bespeak the truth and is based on very false premises.

444 Address in Reply [1 SEPTEMBER] Address in Reply

It should be apparent to the hon. member, just as it is apparent to many people through­out this country who are politically inclined, that the Australian Labour Party is the only party in Australia that insists on getting from an applicant for membership an attesta­tion to the effect that he is not a member of a Communist or Fascist organisation. If an applicant is proved to be a member of any such organisation, under the constitution and rules of the Australian Labour Party, he immediately forfeits his right to membership.

Mr. Bennett: He is running away.

Mr. DEPUTY SPEAKER (Mr. Hooper): Order! The hon member for South Brisbane is not in his usual place in the Chamber.

Mr. Bennett: I am not far away, Mr. Deputy Speaker.

Mr. HANSON: He is only a hair's breadth from it.

This is the rule for members of the Aus­tralian Labour Party.

It is a matter of history, going back to the days of World War I, when there was great disputation in this country about conscrip­tion, and to the more recent times of World War II, when this country faced peril and looked into the eyes of the enemy, and the people saw their resources and families ready to be pillaged and murdered, that the electors voted the great Australian Labour Party into office in the Federal Parliament to guard and defend our shores.

The Liberal Party of this country under the leadership of Sir Robert Menzies-Mr. Robert Menzies as he was then-shirked the issue, dodged the responsibility, laid down arms, and told the Australian Labour Party to get on with the job. Fortunately, we had loyal men and loyal trade unionists to do this, men who were reared in the days of militant unionism and who fought the suppression and oppression of the bosses to try to get something for their kith and kin. These men came to the fore and rallied to the call to keep our country preserved and for ever free.

I ask all hon. members: Does this sug­gest that the people in the Australian Labour Party as now constituted have suddenly turned traitors and become treasonable towards their heritage? Certainly not; and if similar conditions again prevail members of the Australian Labour 'Party and the great trade union movement of this country will once again come to the fore and help to preserve this great country of ours. Make no mistake about that. We are not tied to greedy profits or to the statutes of the monopolistic institutions that are the darlings of the Liberal Party and of Government members; certainly not. We are there to expound and enunciate a policy for the bene­fit of the majority of Australian people.

I say that within the ambit of the Con­stitution Act of 1867, on which this House balances the legislation enacted through this

Chamber, there is a point which suggests that if any member of this House is guilty of treason he forfeits his seat in this Parlia­ment. That should be known to the hon. member for Redcliffe, to the Premier and to those who sneak around corners and utter the word "treason". If they know of any hon. member who is guilty of treason they have the right to get up and make the charge forthwith. Have they done so? Certainly not-because they cannot prove it.

I sit among these people, and I am cer­tainly divorced from Communism; and I am certainly divorced from the evils which emanate from a rotten capitalistic system. I certainly believe, and honestly believe, that my colleagues here are fine, decent and loyal Australians who are ready to carry out such responsibilities as are demanded of them. The hon. member for Kedron won the Distinguished Flying Cross during the Second World War. The hon. member for Townsville North fought against Japanese atrocities in New Britain. Many of us, including myself, are members of the Returned Soldiers' League, and are proud to be members. We are not going to come in here and have this muck thrown at us by members who should be responsible. As they are elected by constituents fair-mindedly and democratically, they should come in here with a greater idea of their responsibility than they have now.

The hon. member for Redcliffe suggested a few moments ago that the president of our Party, Mr. Egerton, is a member of the Communist Party or a member of a Com­munist-front organisation. I know the gentle­man well, and that is far from the truth. If the hon. member were to delve and investigate he would find that the president at times has been placed in a very invidious position and complex situation and, I have no doubt, has had to deal at times quite. forcibly with the Corns., and he has lived up to his responsibility in this regard.

I would not be a member of a political party which is Communist orientated, and neither would other members of the Opposi­tion. We are decent, loyal Australians ready to carry out the policies of the Aus­tralian Labour Party, and I do not believe that the president or any member of the organisation would be a member of such an organisation as the hon. member has sug­gested. I think the hon. member for Red­cliffe has gone far over the fence and, like other hon. members on the Government side, he is trying to bring in extraneous issues that have been placed upon the Government because of the unhealthy situation in which it finds itself.

Statements cons.tantly ring out on the rights and wrongs of the Vietnam war. Very responsible authorities in this country hav.e spoken on it. Hon. members will remember ,the considerable Press publicity given recently to the advice of the Principal of Newington College to his pupils. The

Address in Reply (1 SEPTEMBER] Address in Reply 445

head of the United Nations Organisation, U Thant, is constantly involved in endeavours to bring about a peaceful settlement. Is he wrong? The president of •the Australian Council of Churches is at all times using every endeavour to see if some peaceful solution can be found to this odious conflict. Is he wrong? Mr. Alan Walker, another noted churchman, constantly echoes senti­ments strictly opposed to the war in Vietnam. Is he wrong? In ·recent yea·rs Mr. Lester Pearson, a former Prime Minister of Canada, and Mr. Michael Stewart, a former Foreign Secretary, have urged the pal'ties to get round the conference table. Ar.e they wrong? CeiCtainly not. His Holiness the Pope has been constantly engaged in attempts to bring the countries engaged in this confrontation to the conference table. Would he be wrong? Certainly not.

The Premier unfortunately named Jimmy Steele, of .the Seamen's Union, as a Communist. Jimmy Steele denied it in the ·Press, and I have been told by many seamen friends that he is not a Communi&t. I have numerous friends in the Seamen's Union, decent blokes many of whom during the wa.r had ships shot from beneath them and some of whom received awards fo·r humane actions. One such award was made only recently, following the sinking of an old "tub" off the New South Wales coast, when about 21 of 25 crew members died. I have a lot of respect for ·the sea and the men who sail in ships. Jimmy Steele served on merchant ships during the war. I have met him on a few occasions, and I say that he is a good family man to whom a great injustice has been done by having his name mentioned adversely in this House. Quite possibly that has caused much conoern to his wife and family. I hope the Premier will make some form of apology to Jimmy Steele, because a gr.eat wrong has been done to him, and to his family and friends.

Moving now to another issue, I must say that I .think it is very sad indeed that many people in Australia have recently become very vocal in the Press and elsewhere about weaknesses in the arbitration system. There is con&tant objection to many of .the legalisms that have entered the system, and there is considerable objection ·to its increased cost. There is an ever-present objection to the long delays that workers have to face in obtaining some fo.rm of wage justice. Only in recent months it was reported in the Press that the General Secretary of the Australian \¥orkers' Union had made a very vehement attack, at one of his union's conferences, upon the arbitration system. He warned that it was in the course of self-destruction, and he said that commissioners were being over impressed by employers' legal advcoca.tes who were wasting time to gain high fees which are tax deductible to the employers.

Mr. Bennett: He was not being altogether fair.

Mr. HANSON: So far as the hon. member for South Brisbane is concerned, it would not be fair.

The General Secretary of the A.W.U. said that migrants in the trade unions !have been led to the belief that arbitration is useless in this country. Unfortunately, many of the migrants come from Great Britain, where there is not the adequate arbitration system that we know in this country.

I admit that many industrial disputes do not come before the courts. They are settled around the conference table. A dispute within an industry could relate to a matter of safety; it could be a question of the travelling time applicable to a p.aPticular job; it could be concerned with past practices and customs of employment; or it could relate to the status or conditions applicable to a trade or to some facet of commerce. Matters such as these usually are settled at the conference table, and in a considerable number of major disputes the real solution has been laid down at the conference table before those participating enter the court.

The Government is the authority that sets the economic main on which the country proceeds, and many of the disputes that occur in industry today can be traced to economic relationships and to decisions by Governments. A former Prime Minister. Mr. Chifiey, said years ago that the most sensitive part of the human anatomy is the hip-pocket nerve, and I suggest that the unnerving of the hip pocket is the cause of many of the industrial disputes occurring throughout the country. If the Government decides to scuttle price control, as this Gov­ernment has, and if the Federal Government intervenes, as it has in recent years, in the escalation and de-escalation of the economy, the people who get the worst end of the stick are the workers. In order to get out of the economic plight with which they are faced, they have to seek higher wages, and in some instances they have to seek them by direct action. No working man love<; going on strike, but he has to meet his responsibilities. He does not want to be shackled with the burden of ever-increasing debt, a debt that will never end. To right his position, he has to take some action to ease the stresses in industrial relations and to see that he gets some form of justice.

A lot of rot is talked about Communists being responsible for everything. I haye never met a member of the Commumst Party organisation who denies that he is a Communist. Many of them are only too happy, if one meets them in the street and engages in political argument with them, to advance the fact that they are Communists. I certainly talk with them in an endeavour to find out when they joined the organisation. why they joined it, and everything, else I can to get at the crux of the prob1ern. I have never met one of them who wanted to deny that he was a Communist. The talk about the "Corns" being at the root of every strike in the country is so much bosh.

446 Address in Reply (1 SEPTEMBER] Address in Reply

Today one sees professional men-airline pilots and bank officials-and even jockeys going on strike to get a better crack of the whip. That is part and parcel of the Australian way of life.

The great party to which I belong was formed before the turn of the century and had two courses open to it. In the early stages of its development, it could have taken direct action and overthrown the constitutional government of this country. But the originators of the Australian Labour Party decided otherwise. They decided that the more peaceful and best course for the Party to follow in its political development in this country was to seek electoral represent­ation. That is how the Australian Labour Party was formed. It was formed on an electoral basis by the trade union movement to fight oppression and suppression and to get some justice for fellow human beings and their representatives in the work force.

There is a more satisfactory way of dealing with most disputes. It is to provide an arbitration system that will give the maximum benefit to the workers and unionists of this country. If I may make a comparison, I think everybody finds it odious that the workers in Australia have to involve them­se! ves in high costs and lengthy legal argu­ments to try to settle their wage claims and achieve justice when manufacturers and commercial interests "up the ante" every time they want to do so at a directors' meeting or by a decision of management. This is causing serious concern indeed to many people. As I said earlier, I maintain that two of the main bases of every industrial dispute in this country are increased prices and the bad economic policies of govern­ment.

This morning, the Premier, in reply to the hon. member for Rockhampton North, implied that there was no need for strict price control within this State. When this Government assumed office, the Minister charged with administration of the Prices Office said that competition would bring stability to prices and that the working people would not have to suffer because of increased prices. That has not been the case. This year in "The Courier-Mail", various whole­salers have expressed concern about the number of grocery items that have risen in price. One wholesaler, prominent in this State, said that it was a first-class headache trying to keep tab of price rises. He continued-

"It would be easier to tell you what has not gone up rather than what has gone up. There used to be competition among manufacturers but big organisations now appear to work on a concerted basis and put up prices by agreement."

Another manufacturer said-"The way things are going I would like

to see price control again if only to keep prices on a reasonable, stable basis. Nearly all manufacturers putting up prices pay back a rebate to wholesalers and

retailers. What is wrong with the manu­facturer reducing this price and enabling the public to get the benefit?"

Another wholesaler said-"I doubt if any food or grocery manu­

facturer has not increased his prices since March 1st. Many price rises are sneaked onto the market by a price rise in one product by a manufacturer and later a rise in another by the same manufacturer."

These are people who 12 years ago would have supported the Government in its policy of complete abolition of price control. It is very regrettable indeed to find that today we are experiencing one of the greatest upsurges in prices in this country since the end of World War 11. It is a frightening and disastrous state of affairs to see manufacturers taking unfair advantage of workers and unionists in this State and seriously adding to the increasing spiral of inflation through price increases.

Employees are concerned that the self­same manufacturers can increase their prices at will, without going to any authority, while both white-collar and blue-collar workers in this country are forced to obtain justice by long, drawn-out legal argument in the courts.

Sometimes, the first one hears of a price rise is when housewives attend the super­market. Hon. members opposite may deride my remarks and the humble submissions I am making, but let us examine a statement recently made by one of the "tall poppies" in the Government, the Deputy Leader of the Liberal Party. In a very pious bedside manner he was addressing the Queensland Housewives' Association's annual conference. He is reported in these words-

"Dr. Delamothe said housewives should demand that Governments provide legis­lation to provide for honest advertising and packaging."

He is inciting the housewives and telling them, in a very pious, bedside fashion to demand this action from the Government. He told the Queensland Housewives' Asso­ciation's conference that producers and retailers were foolish if they thought women were gullible. He said-

"If that is the case they should change their thinking and realise that women are often more discerning than men. Women who hold the family purse-strings are in a position to demand honesty in advertising and packaging. I urge you to use this power to your mutual advantage."

Had he been at the Chamber of Manu­factures annual conference the following week, it would have been interesting to see how the bedside manner changed. I have no doubt that, in that very submissive and quiet voice, the Minister would have risen to the occasion-getting the Press just as he will get it tomorrow-and told the Chamber of Manufactures that he would be their champion in this Chamber.

Address in Reply [1 SEPTEMBER] Address in Reply 447

There is a need for the Government to carry out its election promise to introduce a consumers' protection Bill, which is long overdue. I sincerely hope that when it is placed on the Statute Book it will not be merely a half-hearted attempt to offer pro­tection to housewives and the working class but will provide them with adequate pro­tection. I hope, too, that after it is introduced we will not be crying over spilt milk, because there is enough water in it already.

Despite the most solemn platitudes of the manufacturers and advertising geniuses, the housewives have been blatantly robbed. Daily they are cheated. They are a long way from being the massive influence in the community that the promoters of mass production and marketing techniques claim they will be in what they call "the age of the consumer". They say that the house­wives hold the purse-strings and know what they are getting. Unfortunately, however, owing to the type of packaging that is adopted, many products are judged only on taste, appearance and superficiality instead of on quality. So a sound, well thought-out consumers' protection Bill is a necessity. I sincerely hope that it will not be very long before such a Bill is introduced in this House. The Government has failed the people by not introducing one, and if it does so now it will save a good deal of industrial disputation and create a little more industrial harmony in the State.

The Governnrent niight clain1 LHaL its policies are orientated towards decentralisa­tion, so on this matter of :prices let me refer to some of the Government's highest hopes and espousals. For nearly two years the Government has told hon. members and the public through the mass media of the Press and television that it is conducting a com­prehensive inquiry into rail-freight anomalies in the State. Many statements have been made on the matter, but so far no success­ful solution has been arrived at, and no sound findings have been announced to assist the Government. The hon. member for Townsville North could tell us how the rail-freight anomalies, particularly on fabri­cated and manufactured steel, react to the detriment of people in North Queensland.

Is the Premier interested in the work and submissions of the provincial rail-freight study group wherein they state that rail-freight anomalies are of vital import­ance to all decentralised industries, whole­salers and retailers, and residenrts in provincial areas-? Is the Premier interested in the submission of the committee in which it says that a continuance of the Railway Department's policy of giving secret freight concessions ex-Brisbane would serve only to centralise manufacturers and retain the pro­vincial areas as the customers of the metro­polis? Is he interested in seeing that organi­sations with capital investment in country areas are permitted to serve chosen markets and to grow with them? And what does

the Premier think of the Treasurer's recent performance at Dalby, when he dashed the hopes of the grain-growers by refusing their pleas for immediate reductions in rail freights in this time of great emergency for our primary industries?

If attractive rail freights can be given to many mining concerns in this State, why cannot some of the cream be handed out to the primary producers, who face depressed markets and a continuing drought?

What do members of the Country Party think of this? When will they get off the fence and stop being bullied by the over­lords of the liberal Party and the big business interests of the State? Are they prepared to see that their adherents, those who vote for them-the 19 per cent. of the people in the State that keep them on the Government benches-get a fair go? Will they "0 onto the hustings next election and tell them that they stoutly defend their interests in this House? If they are not prepared to do so, why don't they tell the people that they have J:leen here f?r years, virtually allowing the Liberals to kick them to death because they have not the guts-­the intestinal fortitude-to stand up and fight for people in the rural areas?

That is in line with the action of the Treasurer the leader of the Liberal Party, in going 'to one of the grain-growing areas and telling the primary producers that as far as he was concerned they could j~mp in ~he lake. No doubt on the way back, hke Pontms Pilate he washed his hands of 'them very quickiy.

Members of the Country Party sitting on the ministerial benches allow these !h.ings to go on unchecked. What does the Mimster for Primary Industries think of his dear friend in Ingham, Billy Garbutt, who 'Yas recently reported in .the Press. as rder:mg to a "snub" given by the Premier on freig~t anomalies. An approach had been made m an effort to get some form of justice for the people of North Queensl~nd. When Co~n­cillor Black moved a motwn at the meeting of the North Queensland Local Government Association, he said he believed that the Premier had slighted him, and tha~ ~he Premier be advised of what the associatiOn thought. The motion was seconde_d by Billy Garbutt who is 'a great personal fnend of the Ministe; for Primary Industries. Does the Minister suppor-t his friend, or does ~e favour the Premier's insulting constituents m North Queensland.

Mr. Row interjected. Mr. HANSON: I thought the Minister had

a little bit of courage. Mr. Row: You have quoted that out of

context. You are twisting it to suit yourself.

Mr. HANSON: As the Minister grows older, he gets very weak.

A few months ago a matter of great con­cern arose concerning the central district. The chairman of directors of Carlton and

448 Address in Reply [1 SEPTEMBER] Address in Reply

United Breweries, Sir Edward Cohen-I do not think he is a member of the A.L.P., or an A.L.P. supporter-delivered a nice back­hand slap to the members of this Govern­ment relative to the treatment accorded to his company. He said that he would go ahead with the establishment of a $2,000,000 industry in Central Queensland, despite the Government, and despite the advice that was given. He said that a senior politician told him that the company would do better to follow a policy of centralised production. He did not make that statement because of some inflammatory evidence or friendship given or extended to him by the Labour Party. He maintained that as he viewed the economics of the venture he was only too happy to try to do something about the industrial development of Central Queens­land. Yet the Government tried to persuade him to adopt another course. The senior Government member concerned is believed to be a Cabinet Minister. It is a pity that he did not reveal his true identity in this House. Sir Edward Cohen is reported as follows:-

"In a stinging attack on what he termed 'previous State Government policies in decentralisation,' Sir Edward said that Carlton United had found itself in a peculiarly mixed position in its Queensland operations which involves breweries at ...

"He said that in Rockhampton, and more particularly in Cairns, the company had found that despite higher production costs, the Railways Department gave one-way freight advantages ex-Brisbane that jeopardised the provincial operation."

That is a shocking disgrace, but do we find Country Party members from North Queens­land willing to do anything about it? No. They are not willing to do one single, solitary thing. They adopted the same pro­cedure when the leader of the Liberal Party made a stinging attack on grain-growers at Dalby. They remain seated and "cop" it all the time. They are not willing to get up on their hind legs and defend their rights. As was witnessed in this House, a member of the Country Party who is also a member of Cabinet actually threatened a fellow member with physical violence during the debate on the Bill dealing with co-operatives. A Cabinet Minister actually tried to drag another hon. member through the window because he was going to speak on this important measure. That was a disgraceful state of affairs, something that should be disclosed on the hustings for everyone in the country areas to hear.

Mr. Row: Tell us all about it.

Mr. HANSON: The Minister for Primary Industries knows quite well what his attitude was on that occasion. He should hang his head in shame.

I now wish to deal with the matter of pol­lution in this State. The Clean Air Act was passed in this Parliament in 1963. Recently

I have asked questions of the Minister for Health pertaining to this matter. I asked him-

"(1) What are the declared areas of the State under 'The Clean Air Act of 1963'?

"(2) When were the areas declared?" I also asked him about the possibility of getting other areas throughout the State declared. I asked him a similar question in September last year. I have on numerous occasions referred this matter to him by way of either correspondence or questions in the House.

When The Clean Air Act of 1963 was debated in this Chamber it was lauded by the Press and by those in Government administration as something very desirable for our State. I have noted the submissions made on that occasion by members of the Opposition who spoke of the desirability of declaring the various areas very quickly. With regard to my own town, I urged upon the Minister of the day that a declaration should be made very soon because we were to witness the building of an industrial com­plex in which pollution no doubt would be very much in evidence. To overcome the problem and the disadvantages that would accrue to the local population in this matter, I made that submission. Unfortunately, since the Clean Air Act was passed only two areas in this State have been declared, namely, Brisbane and Ipswich.

In September last year the Minister stated that the Air Pollution Council of Queens­land had recommended an extension of the Act to other areas pending the appointment of at least one engineer to the staff. He also said that applications had been called and that it was hoped to make an appointment very shortly. Nearly 12 months later to the day, I submitted a similar question and he said that it was expected that an additional engineer viould take up duty in ·the near future. He was 12 months getting there.

At the last meeting of the Air Pollution Council, on 29 July, it was resolved that the necessary action be taken to proclaim the remaining local authority areas in Queens­land as areas under the Clean Air Act. It is as broad as it is long.

We passed this legislation in an effort to do something about pollution in this State; but unfortunately areas like Townsville, parts of Mackay, Gladstone and other centres, which have had industrial development in recent years, were not declared very early, and the people in those areas are facing a considerable amount of worry, anxiety and trouble at the present time from the pollution that has occurred. In my own town this does not come in great degree from the industrial complex established there, because certain measures have been taken, at con­siderable cost, by the company concerned to decrease this problem. But there is the prob­lem of increased pollution because of exhaust fumes and other factors which are necessarily involved.

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What has happened since the Clean Air Act came into effect? A director, a secret­ary and an engineer were appointed; the office has obtained a heap of pencils and notebooks; but not much else has happened. There is something that goes on with wind to which reference is not allowed in this House. That is what action under the Clean Air Act has amounted to-nothing but a lot of wind and foul smells. So bad have the smells become that the Minister for Local Government and Electricity recently commented in the Press on pollution of the Brisbane River.

I firmly believe that action should be taken quickly to deal with pollution. It is a problem facing America, the United Kingdom and many other countries, and it poses a great hazard to the health of the people. London, we are told, was once referred to as "dear old foggy London". But a little daylight is now creeping in there because of rigid controls and restrictions introduced by Labour Governments in a real attempt to do something about pollution.

Similar action can be taken here, too. Queensland is on the threshold of tremend­ous development, and now is the time to strike at pollution. It is useless merely sitting down and enjoying the comforts of ministerial office, as the Minister for Primary Industries is doing. I think it is possible that he worked harder on the Townsville Regional Electricity Board, although, from what I have heard from the hon. member for Townsville South, that is doubtful. If he has any semblance of responsibility, surely he should try to get his colleagues in caucus or Cabinet to do something in this matter. The health of the young is particularly important. Some Ministers are getting on in years and possibly it will not be long before they leave the House to enter peaceful and contented retirement, but they have a responsibility to see that those who are younger than they are not subjected to pollution.

(Time expired.)

Mr. TOMKINS (Roma) (5.7 p.m.): The hon. member who has just resumed his seat made a very entertaining speech. One of his references was to primary industry and the troubles that it is in, and he asked why Country Party members do not do this, that and the other thing. I should like to inform him that we try to do our best at all times. We do not make light-hearted com­ments; we make sincere efforts to do the right thing. I shall be devoting most of my speech to the problems of primary industry.

Before dealing with that subject, however, I should like to express, on behalf of the people of the Roma electorate and myself, complete loyalty to Her Majesty the Queen. I should like also to congratulate His Excellency the Governor, Sir Alan Mansfield, and Lady Mansfield, on the extremely good job they are doing in this State, and the

16

way in which they travel and see for them­selves the problems that arise in the various areas. I think His Excellency's Opening Speech was extremely good.

I also wish to refer to the visit paid us a short while ago by Her Majesty and the Duke of Edinburgh. It was very pleasing to see them in this State, and it made us all feel very proud to belong to the British Commonwealth of Nations.

I also wish to congratulate the hon. mem­ber for Albert and the hon. member for Burdekin, respectively, on moving and seconding the motion for the adoption of the Address in Reply. Each did a particularly good job. Obviously, they both devoted a lot of time to preparing their contributions, and they presented worth-while arguments.

Mr. Lee interjected.

Mr. TOMKINS: In reply to the hon. member for Yeronga, I, too, am strongly against the amendment moved by the Opposition, for reasons that I shall indicate as I proceed. I reject the amendment entirely because I believe that this is a very good Government and that it is doing the right thing.

I wish to deal particularly with primary industries and matters which, on the basis of area, concern about 75 to 80 per cent. of the State. I refer, of course, to the drought conditions that still exist. They have been in existence to a greater or lesser extent for seven or eight years, and there is no doubt that they are slowly but surely wearing primary producers down.

There is a noticeable lack of confidence in the future, principally because, in addition to the drought, wool prices are depressed, in many cases grain-growers have had no income for two or three years, and the future looks fairly bleak.

The drought is a fact of life. It is very easy to say, "Why don't you do something about it?", but one must face the fact that it requires a great deal of effort to take action that will be worth while. The position is so grave in many areas that even third-generation wool-growers have reached the stage that they will sell their properties for virtually what they owe on them. That is a sad state of affairs for people who have paid a substantial amount of income tax, rates, land rentals, and so on, over the years.

The situation has arisen substantially because primary producers operate on export markets over which this country has very little control. The price of their product is, and always will be, outside their control. Consequently, I believe that Governments in Australia have a responsibility to try to contain costs, and efforts along those lines will meet with my full approval. How­ever, many of the problems are beyond the control of this Government.

450 Address in Reply [1 SEPTEMBER} Address in Reply

As the situation develops, one sees the need for the present policy of the Govern­ment in giving freight concessions, conces­sions on land rentals such as those announced by the Minister for Lands recently, and other forms of assistance to try to keep people on the land. There is another scheme-admittedly it is only a small one -to provide carry-on finance and also some restocking loans through the Agricultural Bank, but no-one will restock while the present drought persists. In my opinion, that is about all that can reasonably be done at present. What does concern me, and has for a very long time, is that when a break comes-and it must come before long-we should be in a position to make funds available to deserving primary pro­ducers. At this point of time, I am not satisfied that there is an organisation that can do just that. I believe that the time has come to really study the problem and investiga~e what is done in other States, and perhaps m other areas.

I, for one, was delighted to read in the newspapers recently that the Federal Government proposes to amend the Bank­ruptcy Act, which I understand is all that is necessary to enable the setting up in Queensland of a rural reconstruction board. I believe that the proposed amendment gives the green light to that, and that is why this morning I asked the Premier a question along those lines. I wanted to know what money would be made available if such an amending Bill is brought down. I think he said it would be $1,500 000 which, of course, would not be a w~rth: while contribution in the present situation.

It is fairly obvious that, to get a rural recol!struction b.oard going in Queensland, a fa~rly substantial type of committee would be needed to make recommendations to the Premier, the Minister for Primary Indus­tries, the Minister for Lands, or the Cabinet generally. In my opinion, such a committee should have on it representatives of the trading banks and the pastoral firms and also representatives of major hire-pu;chase companies, which obviously have a fairly strong vested interest in not only the wool and grain-growing industries but also all primary industries. It is also obvious that the top people in the Treasury Department the Department of Primary Industries and the Lands Department should be on the committee.

Such a committee should make a quick assessment, if one has not already been made -and I would not know that-and submit it to the Cabinet, pointing out the type of body required, and more particularly, the amount of finance required to handle this problem. I have never yet heard any industry leader put a figure on the amount of finance that would be required to get the pastoral industry back on its feet. I believe that we must have a committee that can say, "We want $50,000,000 or $75,000,000 or $100,000,000", or, "In the first year we

can only use $10,000,000." These are the ligures it has to come up with. Once this is done, then it is our responsibility to convince the Federal Government that we require long-term, low-interest money. I have no doubt that this is the only way the scheme can be made to work.

I believe that, in negotiating along these lines, we have to follow the precedents set elsewhere. I will come to that in a moment. The point I want to make now is that pastoral firms, trading banks and hire­purchase companies have a vested interest in most people on the land who are in quite a bad way today, and I believe that these people have to be got together to see if some scheme or arrangement for the compounding of debts can be drawn up. If substantial sums of money are outstanding by various clients, it could be in the interest of a pastoral firm, or a bank, or a hire purchase company to say, "All right, if the Government makes some long-term, low­interest money available, that will take some of the pressure off us, and we will agree to the compounding of debts, or perhaps to the writing-off of some of them." In my view this is preferable to a straight-out moratorium which would have the tendency to immediately cut off the person with whom the primary producer is doing business.

I made it my business to investigate what goes on in New South Wales and I found that, as far back as 1932, just after the days when Jack Lang was Premier, Mr. Spooner who was assistant Treasurer in the Stevens New South Wales Government, introduced a Bill called the Farmers' Relief Bill. It is interesting to recall some of the remarks he made because they are so applicable to our present case. They also show that history sometimes repeats itself. He said the aims of the Bill were-

1. To help farmers by consolidating the farmers' liabilities.

2. By granting extension of time to pay and by spreading the time to make pay­ments.

3. To make funds available to the farmer in consultation with his creditors.

4. Basically to adopt the English pro­cedure where legislation is provided for deeds of arrangement between debtors and creditors.

He said that, in effect, it was a Bill to avoid the bankruptcy of farmers and to give to farmers and their creditors a chance of recovery under systematised conditions. That was Mr. Spooner's statement and it seems to me that this would be the type of set-up needed in Queensland at the present time.

It is interesting also to note that this body has been a tremendous help to New South Wales. Subsequently the Rural Reconstruction Board was set up under this Farmers' Relief Bill and it is the Rural Reconstruction Board that is still in operation today. Therefore, it has been in operation for 28 years, and over this period it has done a particularly aood job for the farmers in New South Wales.

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Hon. members should bear in mind that in New South Wales it was set up mainly to assist the farming community because in those days, whilst farmers might have been in a certain amount of strife, there is no doubt that wool growers who in 1932 were getting Sd. to 9d. a lb. for wool were in quite a good situation. Of course, today, the position is the reverse.

I wish to read from the report of the Rural Reconstruction Board of New South Wales for the year ended 30 June, 1969, because I believe that if any of our Ministers was a member of a similar board he would say the same thing. The board has set a pattern that this State could copy.

It said-'The Board has continued its activity

over the past year as the instrument of the Government in keeping on the land deserving farmers who, in the opinion of the Board, would have reasonable pros­pect of carrying on successfully if assisted but who would otherwise be forced out of the industry.

"In doing this, it has not only pre­vented the personal loss and tragedy associated with forced sale of the farmers' assets but has helped to build a healthy rural economy through maintenance of property values and full productivity.

"Since the inception of the Act, the work of the Board in both nature and volume has varied from time to time in accordance with the changing conditions and the degree of prosperity of the rural industries. The last few years, con­sequent upon the long period of drought, have been demanding on both the Board's funds and its staff.

"It is significant to note the effect of the drought on the Board's advances.

"Since the Government scheme of assist­ance for drought relief was introduced in December, 1965, the Board has made advances from its own funds totalling approximately $7-!- million, some half of which was for adjustment of debts and half for living and working expenses­including capital requirements, such as re­stocking. These advances exceed by some $5! million the amount which would have been required if the rate of lending just prior to the drought had continued. The Board is, in fact, currently lending six to seven times the amount loaned in pre­drought years."

That covers the situation in Queensland. The final paragraph says-

"The Board's most serious problem is the increasing amount of money needed to reconstruct cases today. This is so notwithstanding the fact that the Board refuses to grant assistance beyond the reasonable needs of a one family unit. Where the applicant can help himself by realization of assets held over and above the needs of a single family unit, this

is required. However, the capital estab­lishment of farmers in general today is much greater than in the past and this is reflected in the cost of both debt adjust­ment and re-establishment. This is parti­cularly evident where re-establishment involves Debt Adjustment and restocking in the Western Division. The average advance for restocking in this area has been approximately $23,000 and the aver­age total advance, including Debt Adjust­ment, has been approximately $53,000."

The situation there, too, is similar to ours. It is interesting to note that nine members

constitute the board. Mr. Gates is the chair­man and the members represent a wide rang~ of primary industry, so it could be said that the board caters for the needs of the community. I certainly hope that in this State a similar board will be set up in the near future. If that is not done many people in country areas will be forced to walk off their properties.

In New South Wales the Rural Bank works in close co-operation with the Rural Recon­struction Board. It is obvious from the board's report that it relies fairly heavily on the Rural Bank for help in facing its prob­lems. That fact shows the advantage to be gained from setting up a State-owned bank.

The crux of the matter is nothing more or less than the need to convince the Federal Government that long-term loans on low interest rates are vital. I can understand the reluctance of the State Government to set up a board before it has sufficient funds avail­able, but once funds are available a board could be set up within a very short time. However, we need to convince the Common­wealth Government that funds must be made available and we need to inform the Common­wealth Government of the amount required.

Mr. Ahern: The New South Wales board has been operating on State funds for years.

Mr. TOMKINS: That is so. In recent years the board has had Commonwealth funds too. I understand that recently the New 'south Wales Government made appli­cation for approximately $100,000,000 for rural rehabilitation in that State, made up of a grant of $50,000,000 and a loan of $50,000,000. Their problem can be under­stood, but I am sure that, whatever problem they have, Queensland's is equally severe.

In the same context, I refer to the plight of business people in country a,reas. It is not much use talking about the pHght of primary producers unless we also talk about the plight of business people. A survey I made discloses that some businesses in country areas manage quite well if they aJre not too close to those in primary industry. Businesses close to primary industry are ,the ones in most trouble, and by far the worst affected are machinery dealers.

Recently I held a conference with quite a few of these people in my electorate. I was staggered to learn the extent of their

452 Address in Reply (2 SEPTEMBER]

debts, and how hopeless the position looked from their point of view. In 1968, one firm sold machinery and motor-trucks valued at $186,000. In 1969 sales dropped to $144,000, and, in the 12 months to 30 June, 1970, to $96,000. Since July, business has fallen alarmingly. I have seen figures which prove that as time has gone by the amounts owing by sundry debtors have increased substantially. When this company got into trouble, the owner, who is a popular man, canvassed all debtors and got the "grand" sum of $400 out of about $7,500. That was from people who were really trying to do the right thing.

One of the wor&t aspects is that in a business that is carrying on, as conditions worsen no-one knows whether to retrench staff and hope to star.t afresh when the drought breaks. Nmmally, firms do not do that and I commend them for their policy. This sma1! business formerly employed seven people. There are now only four employees, and very shorHy ·the number will be reduced to one. Firms .try to keep their staff because when the drought breaks the more staff they have, the sooner they can get back into business.

Recently a similar business reduced its staff from 29 to 21. It is engaged in selling heavy machinery, but the proprietor finds that the only work he can get is on the coast, where the economy is quite different from that in country areas. It is sad to think that although a person has a very good busi­ness in the bush he cannot get work there because nobody can afford to engage him. His figures show that from actual sales of $40,000 in January his July sal·es dropped to $4,238, and he told me that he doubts that the August sales will exceed $1,000. He has a substantial number of employees and is hoping to retain them. And it is important that he should.

While referring to these firms I cannot but think that they are in much the same posi­tion as the primary producers themselves. If it is right to assist primary producers with long-term money, businesses of this type should be considered in the same light because they are very helpful to those in primary industry. If they fail, primary pro­ducers will lose. I should like to think that under the proposed rural reconstruction scheme these people will be catered for. If we can save them, as well as the primary producers, we will be virtually helping to save our western towns. It is a fact that many of these people get mixed up with hire-purchase. Obviously the finance houses are becoming all too powerful, and in my opinion they are bleeding the country in favour of huge city investments. I cannot but think that unless we can get a scheme or ar.rangement whereby we can help these people the position will get even worse.

Under the provisions of Standing Order No. 17, the debate was adjourned.

The House adjourned at 5.31 p.m.

Ministerial Statement